1 2010-11-20 00:09:53 <Diablo-D3> wow
2 2010-11-20 00:09:56 <Diablo-D3> 2.1 is faster on the cpu too
3 2010-11-20 00:10:02 <Diablo-D3> ~2.5mhash
4 2010-11-20 00:10:19 <Diablo-D3> my cpu with the bitcoin client does ~2.9
5 2010-11-20 00:10:28 <Diablo-D3> 2.2 was ~2.1
6 2010-11-20 00:25:53 <CIA-106> DiabloMiner: Patrick McFarland master * r5c3f80e / (2 files in 2 dirs):
7 2010-11-20 00:25:53 <CIA-106> DiabloMiner: Updated to work on Nvidia and AMD Stream SDK 2.1 properly, streamlined
8 2010-11-20 00:25:53 <CIA-106> DiabloMiner: host-side block checking, allow fractions of an FPS to be used with -f,
9 2010-11-20 00:25:53 <CIA-106> DiabloMiner: and removed the event callback code in exchange for a blocking thread
10 2010-11-20 00:25:53 <CIA-106> DiabloMiner: per queue; now above 95% theoretical performance for a Radeon - http://bit.ly/d6D5Wc
11 2010-11-20 00:26:01 <Diablo-D3> bam
12 2010-11-20 00:34:22 <jgarzik> SVN r185: require some minimal priority for free transactions to slow down transaction spam
13 2010-11-20 00:35:11 <Diablo-D3> hey, whats the svn repo address for bitcoin?
14 2010-11-20 00:40:41 <Diablo-D3> nm found it
15 2010-11-20 00:40:49 <ArtForz> jgarzik: PD
16 2010-11-20 00:40:54 <Diablo-D3> art!
17 2010-11-20 00:41:07 <Diablo-D3> [06:31:40] <Diablo-D3> 50 attempts + 10 found in 40 minutes
18 2010-11-20 00:41:13 <ArtForz> nice
19 2010-11-20 00:41:43 <Diablo-D3> approx what is that?
20 2010-11-20 00:42:02 <ArtForz> 89Mh
21 2010-11-20 00:42:18 <Diablo-D3> wait, seriously?
22 2010-11-20 00:42:23 <ArtForz> yea
23 2010-11-20 00:42:30 <Diablo-D3> thats 50 total attempts, not 60
24 2010-11-20 00:42:47 <Diablo-D3> are you sure its 89?
25 2010-11-20 00:42:54 <ArtForz> yea
26 2010-11-20 00:43:08 <Diablo-D3> I think my mhash meter is .... too low >_>
27 2010-11-20 00:43:26 <ArtForz> 50 * 2**32 / 40(min) / 60(s) = 89.4Mh/s
28 2010-11-20 00:43:34 <ArtForz> nah, just the usual randomness
29 2010-11-20 00:43:55 <Diablo-D3> well, its >74
30 2010-11-20 00:43:56 <Diablo-D3> so
31 2010-11-20 00:43:58 <Diablo-D3> wee
32 2010-11-20 00:45:37 <Diablo-D3> I don't think I can get any more performance out of it
33 2010-11-20 00:45:48 <ArtForz> yea, unlikely
34 2010-11-20 00:46:23 <Diablo-D3> rounding up, its 74.7
35 2010-11-20 00:48:29 anomnom has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
36 2010-11-20 00:48:34 anomnom has joined
37 2010-11-20 00:51:08 baxter has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
38 2010-11-20 00:52:12 <Diablo-D3> which
39 2010-11-20 00:52:14 <Diablo-D3> if my math is right
40 2010-11-20 00:52:19 <Diablo-D3> thats above 95% efficiency
41 2010-11-20 01:01:59 * Diablo-D3 reboots to do a pure test of 10.10
42 2010-11-20 01:05:25 <ArtForz> merged my miner changes with r185, building
43 2010-11-20 01:05:50 <Diablo-D3> okay, its moving at 74.6 or so steady
44 2010-11-20 01:05:53 <Diablo-D3> closer to 74.7
45 2010-11-20 01:06:11 <ArtForz> nice
46 2010-11-20 01:06:28 <Diablo-D3> well, rebooting didnt help =P
47 2010-11-20 01:07:19 <Diablo-D3> -v 2 still screws it up
48 2010-11-20 01:08:36 <Diablo-D3> lets try downgrading to 10.9
49 2010-11-20 01:14:21 <brocktice> back
50 2010-11-20 01:14:28 <brocktice> WTF is up with average block rate?
51 2010-11-20 01:14:30 <brocktice> or down, rather
52 2010-11-20 01:14:37 <brocktice> is it teh flood?
53 2010-11-20 01:14:39 xelister has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
54 2010-11-20 01:16:46 <ArtForz> why? whats wrong with it?
55 2010-11-20 01:17:05 <brocktice> it's... lowish, compared to what it's been
56 2010-11-20 01:17:07 <brocktice> could just be noise
57 2010-11-20 01:17:21 xelister has joined
58 2010-11-20 01:17:26 <brocktice> 6.42
59 2010-11-20 01:17:48 <ArtForz> it's been hopping around in the 50-60Gh/s range from pretty much 2/3 of 4536
60 2010-11-20 01:18:40 <ArtForz> *for pretty much
61 2010-11-20 01:18:54 <brocktice> ;;bc,stats
62 2010-11-20 01:18:56 <gribble> Current Blocks: 92932 | Current Difficulty: 6866.89864897 | Next Difficulty At Block: 94752 | Next Difficulty In: 1820 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 4 days, 15 hours, 4 minutes, and 27 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 7463.81436093
63 2010-11-20 01:19:32 <brocktice> difficulty may finally be catching up
64 2010-11-20 01:19:53 <ArtForz> so far we've been averaging ~ 54Gh/s for 6867
65 2010-11-20 01:19:59 <xelister> hm. usage bitcoind cpu jumps from 0% to 100% cpu (one core) each X second where X is the -a ask rate of mom's generator. 4core fast i7, in generate [true,0] is that expected?
66 2010-11-20 01:20:16 * brocktice checks
67 2010-11-20 01:20:24 <ArtForz> xelister: latest m0 getwork patch vs. r181?
68 2010-11-20 01:20:26 <brocktice> I don't see that
69 2010-11-20 01:20:31 <brocktice> But I have the update
70 2010-11-20 01:20:48 <brocktice> I've got gkrellmd hooked up and the CPU graph is flat
71 2010-11-20 01:20:57 <brocktice> at 0-1%
72 2010-11-20 01:21:02 <ArtForz> because the old getwork rebuilt the block on every call = lots of CPU
73 2010-11-20 01:21:06 <brocktice> yeah
74 2010-11-20 01:21:13 <ArtForz> new one does it once every 60 sec at most
75 2010-11-20 01:21:13 <brocktice> xelister: did you build a newer one?
76 2010-11-20 01:22:12 <xelister> ArtForz: yes, the most recent version brocktice
77 2010-11-20 01:22:24 <xelister> wait. no, wait
78 2010-11-20 01:22:25 <ArtForz> weird
79 2010-11-20 01:23:15 <xelister> indeed, I was using older
80 2010-11-20 01:23:47 * xelister updates
81 2010-11-20 01:24:14 <Diablo-D3> hey brocktice
82 2010-11-20 01:24:15 <Diablo-D3> hey brocktice
83 2010-11-20 01:24:16 <Diablo-D3> hey brocktice
84 2010-11-20 01:24:19 <Diablo-D3> hey brocktice
85 2010-11-20 01:24:22 <Diablo-D3> hey brocktice
86 2010-11-20 01:25:48 <Diablo-D3> :<
87 2010-11-20 01:31:07 <brocktice> Diablo-D3: oh hey
88 2010-11-20 01:31:11 <brocktice> sorry I was in another screen
89 2010-11-20 01:31:13 <Diablo-D3> brocktice: grab newest normal build
90 2010-11-20 01:31:18 <brocktice> ok
91 2010-11-20 01:33:06 <brocktice> CU = compute unit?
92 2010-11-20 01:33:13 <Diablo-D3> yes
93 2010-11-20 01:33:21 <Diablo-D3> ArtForz: 10.9 seems to have no effect on 2.1
94 2010-11-20 01:33:24 <brocktice> heh it's coming out slowish on testnet
95 2010-11-20 01:33:31 <brocktice> I think getwork can't keep up
96 2010-11-20 01:33:40 <brocktice> oh wait
97 2010-11-20 01:33:44 <brocktice> it didn't find all of my GPUs hm
98 2010-11-20 01:33:55 <Diablo-D3> forget to turn crossfire off?
99 2010-11-20 01:33:58 <brocktice> or did it...
100 2010-11-20 01:34:07 <brocktice> hmm
101 2010-11-20 01:34:17 <brocktice> I think the output got partly overwritten
102 2010-11-20 01:34:32 <brocktice> What's with all the 'attempt's?
103 2010-11-20 01:34:37 <Diablo-D3> erp
104 2010-11-20 01:34:44 <Diablo-D3> I seem to have forgotten to remove something in that build
105 2010-11-20 01:35:09 <brocktice> congrats though, it seems to be finding more than one block
106 2010-11-20 01:35:15 <brocktice> I'll try it on regular network now and check the hashrate
107 2010-11-20 01:35:25 <Diablo-D3> the hashrate is correct on the testnet
108 2010-11-20 01:35:36 <brocktice> well...
109 2010-11-20 01:35:40 <brocktice> I don't think getwork was keeping up
110 2010-11-20 01:35:46 <brocktice> it was too low
111 2010-11-20 01:35:47 <Diablo-D3> theres no issue with getwork
112 2010-11-20 01:35:55 <brocktice> far, far too low
113 2010-11-20 01:36:00 <brocktice> I should be getting at least 1.6 now
114 2010-11-20 01:36:35 <brocktice> there we go, but it's dropping again :(
115 2010-11-20 01:36:58 <brocktice> like a rock
116 2010-11-20 01:37:00 <brocktice> 1222
117 2010-11-20 01:37:07 <brocktice> 1200
118 2010-11-20 01:37:13 <brocktice> 1190
119 2010-11-20 01:37:17 <Diablo-D3> and you're on 2.1?
120 2010-11-20 01:37:20 <brocktice> always
121 2010-11-20 01:37:31 <brocktice> 2 5970s and a 5770
122 2010-11-20 01:37:37 <brocktice> 1160
123 2010-11-20 01:37:51 <brocktice> cpu load is negligible
124 2010-11-20 01:37:56 <brocktice> 0-3%
125 2010-11-20 01:38:15 <brocktice> maybe it's all the prints
126 2010-11-20 01:38:28 <Diablo-D3> yeah just a sec
127 2010-11-20 01:38:57 <Diablo-D3> exactly how fast is it printing attempts?
128 2010-11-20 01:39:13 <brocktice> every 0-11 seconds or so
129 2010-11-20 01:39:20 <Diablo-D3> jesus your setup is fast
130 2010-11-20 01:39:28 <Diablo-D3> thats debug code to print when H == 0
131 2010-11-20 01:39:34 <brocktice> It ought to be for that amount of money
132 2010-11-20 01:40:48 <CIA-106> DiabloMiner: Patrick McFarland master * rf9f8650 / src/main/java/com/diablominer/DiabloMiner/DiabloMiner.java : Forgot to remove debug code - http://bit.ly/9GrvZG
133 2010-11-20 01:40:48 <brocktice> At least I know if I give up mining I can play SCII with all the options on
134 2010-11-20 01:40:58 <brocktice> What is CIA-106?
135 2010-11-20 01:42:15 <Diablo-D3> a cia bot
136 2010-11-20 01:42:22 <brocktice> OK, what's cia?
137 2010-11-20 01:42:37 <Diablo-D3> something that you've had about 7 years to find out about
138 2010-11-20 01:42:59 <brocktice> Not something I've had occasion to learn about
139 2010-11-20 01:43:10 <brocktice> clearly it's somehow linked to RCS commits.
140 2010-11-20 01:43:12 kermit has quit (Quit: Leaving.)
141 2010-11-20 01:43:12 <Diablo-D3> cia tracks subversion
142 2010-11-20 01:43:20 <brocktice> ok :) thanks
143 2010-11-20 01:43:28 kermit has joined
144 2010-11-20 01:43:28 <Diablo-D3> the name is a pun
145 2010-11-20 01:43:34 <Diablo-D3> of course now, it tracks everything else to
146 2010-11-20 01:43:50 <Diablo-D3> brocktice: download the zip again
147 2010-11-20 01:43:54 <brocktice> k
148 2010-11-20 01:43:56 <ArtForz> CIA == 6526
149 2010-11-20 01:44:27 <brocktice> got my dryer duct at the hardware store this afternoon
150 2010-11-20 01:44:32 <brocktice> I'll hook it up to warm my toes later.
151 2010-11-20 01:44:39 <jrabbit> omfg
152 2010-11-20 01:44:42 <jrabbit> http://news.cnet.com/8301-27080_3-20023341-245.html
153 2010-11-20 01:44:45 <brocktice> Incidentially they have fittings that fit my water cooling setup at the hardware store
154 2010-11-20 01:45:37 <brocktice> Aaand this is why I started running Tor on a dedicated VPS full time
155 2010-11-20 01:45:45 <brocktice> Fuck those assholes, we need a little sunlight
156 2010-11-20 01:46:56 * brocktice starts up DiabloMiner again
157 2010-11-20 01:47:11 <brocktice> argh
158 2010-11-20 01:47:13 <brocktice> same thing
159 2010-11-20 01:47:20 <brocktice> started where it should be at 1600
160 2010-11-20 01:47:23 <brocktice> then started dropping
161 2010-11-20 01:47:26 <brocktice> already at 1250
162 2010-11-20 01:47:34 <brocktice> what else changed since before?
163 2010-11-20 01:48:08 <Diablo-D3> a fair bit of stuff.
164 2010-11-20 01:48:16 <Diablo-D3> for one, its confirmed to actually work
165 2010-11-20 01:48:21 <ArtForz> wow, 1h since last block?
166 2010-11-20 01:48:23 <brocktice> well, that's certainly a plus
167 2010-11-20 01:48:40 <brocktice> ArtForz: what, did your house get too warm?
168 2010-11-20 01:48:50 <ArtForz> nope
169 2010-11-20 01:49:01 <kermit> brocktice: do you have the VPS registered to yourself?
170 2010-11-20 01:49:06 <brocktice> kermit: yep
171 2010-11-20 01:49:09 <ArtForz> now that temps have dropped again, I'm back on 12 5970s
172 2010-11-20 01:49:30 <brocktice> I went looking, there aren't a lot of cases with 8 slots actually
173 2010-11-20 01:49:40 <brocktice> 10x more with 7
174 2010-11-20 01:49:42 <Diablo-D3> brocktice: does it detect all 5 devices?
175 2010-11-20 01:49:43 <ArtForz> yep
176 2010-11-20 01:49:46 <brocktice> Diablo-D3: yep
177 2010-11-20 01:49:55 <brocktice> And none in the rackmount form factor
178 2010-11-20 01:50:00 <ArtForz> yep
179 2010-11-20 01:50:01 <brocktice> on newegg anyway
180 2010-11-20 01:50:08 <Diablo-D3> orly?
181 2010-11-20 01:50:10 <Diablo-D3> lemme go look
182 2010-11-20 01:50:20 <brocktice> ArtForz: You know, if you really want to rackmount, you should probably do a shelf of towers.
183 2010-11-20 01:50:50 <Diablo-D3> woah
184 2010-11-20 01:50:52 <Diablo-D3> you're right]
185 2010-11-20 01:51:00 <Diablo-D3> probably because the rack isnt wide enough
186 2010-11-20 01:51:14 <ArtForz> actually I'm heading more towards fully custom case
187 2010-11-20 01:51:15 <brocktice> ATX height + PSU height = rack width
188 2010-11-20 01:51:22 <brocktice> more or less
189 2010-11-20 01:51:56 <brocktice> Diablo-D3: you may think I'm a moron, but I know how to use advanced search on newegg, yo.
190 2010-11-20 01:52:00 <Diablo-D3> heh
191 2010-11-20 01:52:02 <Diablo-D3> anyhow
192 2010-11-20 01:52:09 <Diablo-D3> brocktice: what does top say?
193 2010-11-20 01:52:19 <ArtForz> my current design is 15" x 15" x 12" for 4 5970s
194 2010-11-20 01:52:22 <brocktice> I wasn't watching top but gkrellm said 1-3% usage
195 2010-11-20 01:52:24 <brocktice> (out of 4 cores)
196 2010-11-20 01:52:38 <brocktice> so, 4-12%
197 2010-11-20 01:56:15 <Diablo-D3> which version of cat? 10.10?
198 2010-11-20 01:56:20 <brocktice> yep
199 2010-11-20 01:56:29 <Diablo-D3> and you're sure you have crossfire off?
200 2010-11-20 01:56:48 <xelister> m0m's patch seems incompatibel with bitcoind 185
201 2010-11-20 01:57:02 <Diablo-D3> xelister: its compatible with the revision it says it is
202 2010-11-20 01:57:36 <brocktice> [brock@sandtrout][Linux]-(~/DiabloMiner)-> aticonfig --lsch
203 2010-11-20 01:57:37 <brocktice> No CrossFire chains defined
204 2010-11-20 01:58:59 <xelister> Diablo-D3: I know, well too bad 185 had some security upgrades
205 2010-11-20 01:59:23 <Diablo-D3> well it works with 183
206 2010-11-20 01:59:40 <brocktice> xelister: they're not a huge issue
207 2010-11-20 01:59:42 <Diablo-D3> brocktice: well, I'm getting almost 75 mhash with it
208 2010-11-20 01:59:44 <brocktice> fix it or wait for m0
209 2010-11-20 01:59:51 <brocktice> Diablo-D3: That's good
210 2010-11-20 02:00:02 <Diablo-D3> brocktice: so what is it saying now?
211 2010-11-20 02:00:03 <brocktice> Diablo-D3: I'd like if it worked with my setup but you won't get pressure from me
212 2010-11-20 02:00:12 <brocktice> Diablo-D3: nothing, I'm running m0's now
213 2010-11-20 02:00:18 <Diablo-D3> what does m0's say?
214 2010-11-20 02:00:18 <brocktice> This miner has to pay itself off yet
215 2010-11-20 02:00:30 <brocktice> hang on lemme get a calculator
216 2010-11-20 02:01:03 <brocktice> 1607.2
217 2010-11-20 02:01:41 <theymos> http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/news/2010/11/manhunt-limewire-riaa-both-search-for-pirate-edition-creator.ars "Good luck, I'm behind seven proxies" LOL
218 2010-11-20 02:02:02 <Diablo-D3> s/proxies/boxxies/
219 2010-11-20 02:02:34 <brocktice> I love it
220 2010-11-20 02:02:46 <brocktice> "Speaking for myself, the motivation is to make RIAA lawyers cry into their breakfast cereal,"
221 2010-11-20 02:02:48 warner has quit (Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs))
222 2010-11-20 02:02:55 <xelister> lol
223 2010-11-20 02:04:35 <Diablo-D3> brocktice: yeah but like
224 2010-11-20 02:04:49 <Diablo-D3> brocktice: above 95% efficiency based on art's theoretical maximum
225 2010-11-20 02:04:53 <Diablo-D3> uh
226 2010-11-20 02:04:54 <Diablo-D3> brock
227 2010-11-20 02:05:05 <Diablo-D3> brocktice: did you forget to edit DiabloMiner.cl?
228 2010-11-20 02:05:15 <brocktice> oh
229 2010-11-20 02:05:19 <brocktice> it's missing that magical trick?
230 2010-11-20 02:05:34 <Diablo-D3> yeah, I havent written code to autodetect 5xxx on 2.1 yet
231 2010-11-20 02:05:46 <Diablo-D3> comment the first, uncomment the next two
232 2010-11-20 02:05:56 * brocktice looks
233 2010-11-20 02:06:14 <brocktice> erm
234 2010-11-20 02:06:25 <brocktice> [brock@sandtrout][Linux]-(~/DiabloMiner)-> find . -name '*.cl'
235 2010-11-20 02:06:26 <brocktice> [brock@sandtrout][Linux]-(~/DiabloMiner)->
236 2010-11-20 02:06:33 <brocktice> I need to build from source then?
237 2010-11-20 02:06:38 <Diablo-D3> its in the jar
238 2010-11-20 02:06:58 <brocktice> can I just unzip->edit->zip?
239 2010-11-20 02:07:02 <Diablo-D3> yes
240 2010-11-20 02:07:11 xelister has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
241 2010-11-20 02:08:47 <ArtForz> holy fuck, talk about hard to kill
242 2010-11-20 02:08:49 <brocktice> grar I must have fucked it up
243 2010-11-20 02:08:53 <brocktice> ?
244 2010-11-20 02:08:58 <brocktice> LimeWire?
245 2010-11-20 02:09:01 <ArtForz> remember that PSU where I misloaded the rails?
246 2010-11-20 02:09:17 <ArtForz> it still kinda works, but shuts down beyond 200W load or so
247 2010-11-20 02:09:25 <ArtForz> finally figured out why
248 2010-11-20 02:09:46 <ArtForz> 2 out of 3 of the 12V rectifiers were open-circuit
249 2010-11-20 02:10:19 <Kiba> RESISTANCE IS FUTILE
250 2010-11-20 02:10:35 <Diablo-D3> ArtForz: NICE
251 2010-11-20 02:10:35 <Kiba> ALL THAT EXISTS WILL BE SHARED
252 2010-11-20 02:10:46 <ArtForz> It's a small miracle is the damn thing still ran
253 2010-11-20 02:11:17 <ArtForz> so looks like all it needs is 3 new diodes for about $0.40 a pop
254 2010-11-20 02:11:17 <brocktice> Diablo-D3: Sorry, I'm probably doing something dumb
255 2010-11-20 02:11:20 <brocktice> mkdir tmp
256 2010-11-20 02:11:22 <brocktice> cd tmp
257 2010-11-20 02:11:28 <brocktice> unzip ../(jarfile)
258 2010-11-20 02:11:29 <brocktice> edit
259 2010-11-20 02:11:38 <brocktice> zip ../(jarfile) *
260 2010-11-20 02:11:43 <brocktice> but then it fails to run
261 2010-11-20 02:13:03 <Diablo-D3> I suspect you are
262 2010-11-20 02:13:25 <Diablo-D3> git the repo, edit the file, run mvn package
263 2010-11-20 02:13:51 <brocktice> ok gimme a few
264 2010-11-20 02:14:02 <brocktice> I'm paralyzed by hopelessly funny blog things someone sent me
265 2010-11-20 02:15:51 <Diablo-D3> brocktice: well
266 2010-11-20 02:15:55 <Diablo-D3> run the miner you have now
267 2010-11-20 02:16:04 <Diablo-D3> you think you should be getting 1600 right?
268 2010-11-20 02:16:17 <Diablo-D3> it shouldnt be below 1000 then
269 2010-11-20 02:16:37 <brocktice> yeah it looked like it was heading for 1100 or so
270 2010-11-20 02:16:42 <brocktice> so probabably I just need that fix
271 2010-11-20 02:16:46 <brocktice> I'll get to it in 5 min
272 2010-11-20 02:22:26 <brocktice> how do I build it?
273 2010-11-20 02:22:38 <Diablo-D3> mvn package
274 2010-11-20 02:22:54 <brocktice> == maven2?
275 2010-11-20 02:22:56 <Diablo-D3> you obviously need maven installed
276 2010-11-20 02:23:19 <brocktice> wow, that has... a lot of dependencies
277 2010-11-20 02:24:12 <Diablo-D3> not as many as you think
278 2010-11-20 02:24:18 <Diablo-D3> java deps are just more finely grained
279 2010-11-20 02:24:34 <brocktice> 0 packages upgraded, 113 newly installed, 0 to remove and 16 not upgraded.
280 2010-11-20 02:24:39 <brocktice> 113 packages are a lot
281 2010-11-20 02:26:33 * Diablo-D3 shrugs
282 2010-11-20 02:30:17 anomnom has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
283 2010-11-20 02:31:05 <kermit> brocktice: i'd like to donate bandwidth to tor, but i've been at this for like 20 minutes and i'm not getting very far, i guess they dont need bandwidth that bad?
284 2010-11-20 02:31:31 <theymos> It takes a while to get listed by a directory server.
285 2010-11-20 02:31:34 <brocktice> kermit: yeah I don't know they need it all that bad
286 2010-11-20 02:31:46 <brocktice> kermit: I just wanted to support it again
287 2010-11-20 02:31:50 <brocktice> I had run a node for a while
288 2010-11-20 02:32:02 <brocktice> I actually have one of the 'these aren't the nodes you're looking for' shirts
289 2010-11-20 02:32:12 <brocktice> free for server operators, at least years ago they were
290 2010-11-20 02:33:38 <theymos> I run a 24/7 bridge at theymos.ath.cx:443. I'm too much of a coward to run even a transit node.
291 2010-11-20 02:33:56 <brocktice> theymos: Tor nodes are protected by common carrier status
292 2010-11-20 02:34:08 <brocktice> theymos: And if you follow recommendations you probably won't even get DMCA takedowns
293 2010-11-20 02:34:20 <brocktice> Linode used to be better about that, now they get annoyed when they have to handle them
294 2010-11-20 02:34:35 <brocktice> Not like I really think bittorrent should be run over Tor anyway
295 2010-11-20 02:34:39 <brocktice> so I blocked its normal ports
296 2010-11-20 02:35:55 <theymos> I would never run an exit node, anyway. I have a static IP, and I don't want to get banned from every site in the Universe.
297 2010-11-20 02:36:31 <brocktice> that's why I'm using a dedicated Tor VPS :)
298 2010-11-20 02:36:36 <brocktice> among other things
299 2010-11-20 02:39:34 <brocktice> maven appears to be downloading the whole internets to my miner
300 2010-11-20 02:41:37 <Diablo-D3> linode is shit anyhow
301 2010-11-20 02:41:45 <Diablo-D3> brocktice: be happy, it happens once
302 2010-11-20 02:41:55 <Diablo-D3> real men have their vpses at rapidxen
303 2010-11-20 02:43:20 <brocktice> Linode's been pretty good for me for a long time
304 2010-11-20 02:43:24 <brocktice> since they were using UML
305 2010-11-20 02:43:43 <Diablo-D3> rapidxen.
306 2010-11-20 02:43:44 <Diablo-D3> use it.
307 2010-11-20 02:44:25 <brocktice> their plans aren't very competitive
308 2010-11-20 02:45:34 <brocktice> building done
309 2010-11-20 02:45:36 <brocktice> running
310 2010-11-20 02:46:27 <brocktice> Diablo-D3: why does your miner start out so incorrectly fast?
311 2010-11-20 02:46:59 <brocktice> (things are looking better now, though)
312 2010-11-20 02:47:33 <brocktice> Currently 1830 and dropping rapidly
313 2010-11-20 02:48:06 redengin has quit (Quit: Ex-Chat)
314 2010-11-20 02:49:06 <brocktice> 1729 and dropping at a medium pace\
315 2010-11-20 02:51:38 <brocktice> 1676 and settling
316 2010-11-20 02:55:52 <brocktice> 1651 and dropping slowly after 10 minutes
317 2010-11-20 02:56:22 <Diablo-D3> brocktice: yeah it starts out faster than it should due to awesomeness
318 2010-11-20 02:56:42 <Diablo-D3> brocktice: so what does m0's say?
319 2010-11-20 02:56:44 <brocktice> Diablo-D3: "Incorrect calculations" != "awesomeness" as far as I am concerned
320 2010-11-20 02:56:51 <brocktice> Diablo-D3: 1607 or thereabouts
321 2010-11-20 02:56:57 <brocktice> yours is still dropping a little
322 2010-11-20 02:57:02 <Diablo-D3> its not incorrect
323 2010-11-20 02:57:04 <Diablo-D3> its an average
324 2010-11-20 02:57:16 <brocktice> *yours* is actually more of an average
325 2010-11-20 02:57:23 <brocktice> if I understand your method correctly
326 2010-11-20 02:57:24 <Diablo-D3> yes mine is
327 2010-11-20 02:57:28 <brocktice> you take total hashes/total time
328 2010-11-20 02:57:37 <Diablo-D3> m0's is just random numbers
329 2010-11-20 02:57:47 <brocktice> no, it's just averaged over a shorter interval
330 2010-11-20 02:57:56 <brocktice> it's a lot easier to get feedback on clock adjustments that way, btw
331 2010-11-20 02:58:21 <brocktice> brb
332 2010-11-20 03:04:30 <brocktice> back, 1634
333 2010-11-20 03:04:48 <Diablo-D3> hurray
334 2010-11-20 03:05:01 <brocktice> so far we're down to a 2% improvement
335 2010-11-20 03:05:23 <brocktice> 27 mhash/s is not nothing, it's about 2.5x what my CPU does
336 2010-11-20 03:06:32 <brocktice> power usage is almost 10W higher than m0's too
337 2010-11-20 03:06:44 <brocktice> a little more actually
338 2010-11-20 03:06:47 <brocktice> (at the plug)
339 2010-11-20 03:06:54 <Diablo-D3> whats the basis here?
340 2010-11-20 03:07:06 <brocktice> 27/1607
341 2010-11-20 03:07:48 <brocktice> now we're down to 1632
342 2010-11-20 03:08:11 <Diablo-D3> no I meant
343 2010-11-20 03:08:13 <Diablo-D3> watts
344 2010-11-20 03:08:33 <brocktice> m0's is about 1010 at th eplug
345 2010-11-20 03:08:41 <brocktice> yours is around 1025
346 2010-11-20 03:08:47 <Diablo-D3> ha ha I win
347 2010-11-20 03:08:54 <ArtForz> whoa
348 2010-11-20 03:09:01 <ArtForz> for 2 5970s?
349 2010-11-20 03:09:10 <brocktice> nono I have a stock 5770 in there now too
350 2010-11-20 03:09:20 <ArtForz> still soudns kinda high
351 2010-11-20 03:09:22 <Diablo-D3> brocktice: did you try optimizing mine for -w?
352 2010-11-20 03:09:22 <brocktice> I'd OC it but I'm running out of juice
353 2010-11-20 03:09:26 <brocktice> Diablo-D3: no
354 2010-11-20 03:09:35 <ArtForz> stock 5770 is ~130W at the plug
355 2010-11-20 03:09:41 <brocktice> ArtForz: plus 3 Ultra Kaze 3000
356 2010-11-20 03:09:44 <brocktice> and a pump
357 2010-11-20 03:09:48 <brocktice> and 2 exhaust fans
358 2010-11-20 03:09:54 <Diablo-D3> ArtForz: what are you using for local group size?
359 2010-11-20 03:10:00 <ArtForz> 64
360 2010-11-20 03:10:06 <Diablo-D3> hmm 64 does seem to be the optimal
361 2010-11-20 03:10:09 <brocktice> now at 1630
362 2010-11-20 03:10:11 <Diablo-D3> brocktice: start mine with -w 64
363 2010-11-20 03:10:14 <brocktice> k
364 2010-11-20 03:10:35 <brocktice> Diablo-D3: but really, why does it start out too high?
365 2010-11-20 03:10:48 <brocktice> Your miner is not exceeding the theoretical limits of the cards, I'm pretty sure.
366 2010-11-20 03:10:54 <brocktice> timing inaccuracy?
367 2010-11-20 03:11:01 <Diablo-D3> brocktice: because it pushes all the executors at the start before any time has elapsed
368 2010-11-20 03:11:25 <Diablo-D3> so before you can even see it, its 3x too high
369 2010-11-20 03:11:46 <ArtForz> btw, first few kernel runs are all over the place, start counting after a few executions
370 2010-11-20 03:12:04 <brocktice> now I have to wait 20 minutes for it to adjust
371 2010-11-20 03:12:12 <brocktice> I'll let you know how it comes out
372 2010-11-20 03:12:21 <Diablo-D3> yeah I probably should reset it
373 2010-11-20 03:12:49 <brocktice> ArtForz: I'm also running all four cores now
374 2010-11-20 03:12:55 <brocktice> on the cpu
375 2010-11-20 03:12:58 <Diablo-D3> those four cores wont help you
376 2010-11-20 03:13:01 <brocktice> yay free core
377 2010-11-20 03:13:03 <Diablo-D3> since it now uses 1% cpu
378 2010-11-20 03:13:05 <brocktice> Diablo-D3: yeah I know
379 2010-11-20 03:13:24 <brocktice> Diablo-D3: I may set up SGE or Torque across my workstation and the compute node later
380 2010-11-20 03:13:33 <ArtForz> I'd watch the GPU hashrate, CPU load seems to affect it negatively
381 2010-11-20 03:13:34 <brocktice> Diablo-D3: I have yet to OC the CPU to 3 GHz to match my workstation
382 2010-11-20 03:14:01 <brocktice> ArtForz: I turned on cpu mining earlier and didn't see a noticeable hit
383 2010-11-20 03:14:04 <brocktice> but that was with m0's
384 2010-11-20 03:14:13 <Diablo-D3> ArtForz: oh get this
385 2010-11-20 03:14:15 <brocktice> but, it wasn't worth the extra 50W of power consumption
386 2010-11-20 03:14:18 <Diablo-D3> ArtForz: with bitcoin, I get 2.9 mhash
387 2010-11-20 03:14:31 <Diablo-D3> ArtForz: with 2.2 on cpu, I get 2.1
388 2010-11-20 03:14:39 <Diablo-D3> ArtForz: with 2.1 on cpu, I get 2.5
389 2010-11-20 03:14:51 <brocktice> OpenCL is maybe not optimal on the CPU?
390 2010-11-20 03:14:55 <brocktice> That's a c2d?
391 2010-11-20 03:14:57 <ArtForz> with mine it's <1%, but thats more than enough here to offset the gain I'd get from CPU mining
392 2010-11-20 03:14:58 <Diablo-D3> that isnt it
393 2010-11-20 03:15:06 <Diablo-D3> 2.1 is more optimal on cpu than 2.2 is
394 2010-11-20 03:15:14 <brocktice> 2.2 = teh suck
395 2010-11-20 03:15:22 <Diablo-D3> its almost as fast as the code in bitcoin
396 2010-11-20 03:15:24 <Diablo-D3> thats lol
397 2010-11-20 03:15:48 <brocktice> 1685 and dropping
398 2010-11-20 03:15:59 <ArtForz> AMD drivers+sdk = all over the place
399 2010-11-20 03:16:11 <brocktice> Nvidia has that going for them
400 2010-11-20 03:16:14 <brocktice> they're consistently slow
401 2010-11-20 03:16:19 <Diablo-D3> lol
402 2010-11-20 03:16:35 <ArtForz> well, there was that little incident with a driver bug frying cards
403 2010-11-20 03:16:44 <brocktice> for nVidia?
404 2010-11-20 03:16:46 <ArtForz> yep
405 2010-11-20 03:16:55 <brocktice> ouch
406 2010-11-20 03:17:24 <ArtForz> I think it was back when 2xx cards were current
407 2010-11-20 03:17:45 <ArtForz> broken software fan control + load = dead card
408 2010-11-20 03:18:33 <brocktice> 1660 and dropping
409 2010-11-20 03:19:38 <brocktice> wow, 34 minutes between blocks earlier
410 2010-11-20 03:19:48 <brocktice> Is this the "friday night drop" again?
411 2010-11-20 03:19:58 <brocktice> I seem to remember last Friday hashrate was way down
412 2010-11-20 03:20:10 <ArtForz> check 92932 - 92933
413 2010-11-20 03:20:23 <brocktice> whoa
414 2010-11-20 03:20:35 <brocktice> ~1.5 hrs?
415 2010-11-20 03:20:37 <brocktice> nuts
416 2010-11-20 03:20:49 <brocktice> we're almost back down to 6
417 2010-11-20 03:20:51 <brocktice> ;;bc,stats
418 2010-11-20 03:20:54 <gribble> Current Blocks: 92937 | Current Difficulty: 6866.89864897 | Next Difficulty At Block: 94752 | Next Difficulty In: 1815 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 5 days, 6 hours, and 5 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 7065.39425489
419 2010-11-20 03:21:02 <brocktice> estimate is dropping
420 2010-11-20 03:21:10 <brocktice> 1649 and dropping
421 2010-11-20 03:21:33 <brocktice> I wonder if we're getting attrition?
422 2010-11-20 03:21:41 <brocktice> Is the tx flooding still going on?
423 2010-11-20 03:21:43 <Diablo-D3> brocktice: so I think I win, btw
424 2010-11-20 03:21:48 <Diablo-D3> its faster than m0's
425 2010-11-20 03:22:02 <brocktice> Diablo-D3: well, it's stilld dropping, but it does appear somewhat faster, yes
426 2010-11-20 03:22:07 <brocktice> sorry, vodka
427 2010-11-20 03:22:08 * ArtForz hands Diablo-D3 a internets
428 2010-11-20 03:22:47 <brocktice> ArtForz: are you still seeing tx flooding?
429 2010-11-20 03:22:57 <brocktice> I realized earlier, it could be a *miner* tx flooding
430 2010-11-20 03:23:01 <brocktice> to get the diff down
431 2010-11-20 03:23:06 <Diablo-D3> I said that earlier
432 2010-11-20 03:23:11 <brocktice> oh, I was probably not here
433 2010-11-20 03:23:14 <ArtForz> yep, still going on
434 2010-11-20 03:23:25 <brocktice> that's probably the reason for the drop
435 2010-11-20 03:23:26 <Diablo-D3> lol!
436 2010-11-20 03:23:30 <Diablo-D3> I now have testnet balance!
437 2010-11-20 03:23:51 <brocktice> Does anyone use that for anything?
438 2010-11-20 03:23:57 <Diablo-D3> yes, testing
439 2010-11-20 03:24:05 <brocktice> no, I mean, the balance
440 2010-11-20 03:24:07 <Diablo-D3> nope
441 2010-11-20 03:24:14 <brocktice> damn
442 2010-11-20 03:24:19 <brocktice> cuz I have around 1600
443 2010-11-20 03:24:24 <brocktice> ArtForz probably has a lot more
444 2010-11-20 03:24:25 <Diablo-D3> I have 250 now
445 2010-11-20 03:24:41 <ArtForz> 23732.28
446 2010-11-20 03:24:52 <ArtForz> sent ~150k to the test faucet
447 2010-11-20 03:25:03 <brocktice> ah yes I see all these 0.01 transactions from self to self
448 2010-11-20 03:25:11 <brocktice> last block didn't have any though
449 2010-11-20 03:25:37 <brocktice> 1639
450 2010-11-20 03:25:40 <brocktice> still dropping
451 2010-11-20 03:25:51 <ArtForz> I think the network lost a bunch of the flood tx
452 2010-11-20 03:26:44 <ArtForz> = I'm seeing plenty of mapTransactions prev not found
453 2010-11-20 03:28:40 <brocktice> 1620 and dropping
454 2010-11-20 03:28:56 <brocktice> we're almost down to m0's speeds here
455 2010-11-20 03:29:16 <brocktice> I think your initial inaccurate speed boost gives you an apparent advantage
456 2010-11-20 03:29:23 <brocktice> but if it runs long enough it looks like that goes away
457 2010-11-20 03:29:38 <Diablo-D3> theres an easy way to fix that
458 2010-11-20 03:29:44 <brocktice> you were talking 6% or more speed boosts before
459 2010-11-20 03:29:47 <brocktice> we're below 2% now
460 2010-11-20 03:29:57 <Diablo-D3> for me it was
461 2010-11-20 03:30:02 <Diablo-D3> 2.1 took away a lot of that advantage
462 2010-11-20 03:30:09 <brocktice> ah
463 2010-11-20 03:31:43 <brocktice> 1608
464 2010-11-20 03:31:47 <brocktice> and dropping
465 2010-11-20 03:31:52 <brocktice> basically it's the same speed as m0's
466 2010-11-20 03:32:01 <brocktice> at least on 2.1
467 2010-11-20 03:33:32 <Diablo-D3> well Im testing m0's on mine
468 2010-11-20 03:33:40 <Diablo-D3> ~73 mhash
469 2010-11-20 03:33:49 <Diablo-D3> balances out around 73.0
470 2010-11-20 03:33:54 <Diablo-D3> give or take
471 2010-11-20 03:33:57 <brocktice> ooh shit
472 2010-11-20 03:33:59 <brocktice> 1599
473 2010-11-20 03:34:01 <brocktice> now it's slower
474 2010-11-20 03:34:14 <Diablo-D3> mine stops at around 74.5
475 2010-11-20 03:34:35 <brocktice> seems maybe yours is better for 4000 series
476 2010-11-20 03:34:44 <Diablo-D3> but its the same kernel, remember?
477 2010-11-20 03:35:11 <brocktice> yes, and?
478 2010-11-20 03:35:40 <Diablo-D3> why should anything else matter then?
479 2010-11-20 03:36:19 <brocktice> ...
480 2010-11-20 03:36:27 <brocktice> why did you bother to write a whole new miner then?
481 2010-11-20 03:36:37 <Diablo-D3> now I'm not sure
482 2010-11-20 03:36:41 * brocktice headdesks
483 2010-11-20 03:36:47 <Diablo-D3> since 2.2 is a pile of shit and 2.1 cant use events
484 2010-11-20 03:36:55 <Diablo-D3> well, it cant use the callbacks anyways
485 2010-11-20 03:36:57 <brocktice> maybe 2.3 will have the features of 2.2
486 2010-11-20 03:37:00 <brocktice> but with less crappiness
487 2010-11-20 03:37:05 <brocktice> and then it will be more helpful
488 2010-11-20 03:37:12 <Diablo-D3> doesnt matter now
489 2010-11-20 03:37:18 <Diablo-D3> since now I'm very efficiently blocking
490 2010-11-20 03:38:12 <brocktice> well, at least now I can build it from source
491 2010-11-20 03:38:17 <brocktice> so future updates will be easier to test
492 2010-11-20 03:38:20 <brocktice> time for sleep
493 2010-11-20 03:38:21 <brocktice> g'night guys
494 2010-11-20 03:38:46 <Diablo-D3> brocktice: btw
495 2010-11-20 03:39:12 <CIA-106> DiabloMiner: Patrick McFarland master * r0c19b8d / src/main/java/com/diablominer/DiabloMiner/DiabloMiner.java : Improve hash meter - http://bit.ly/cNADg5
496 2010-11-20 03:39:14 <Diablo-D3> this should fix the meter
497 2010-11-20 03:48:37 <Diablo-D3> ;;bc.blocks
498 2010-11-20 03:48:38 <gribble> Error: "bc.blocks" is not a valid command.
499 2010-11-20 03:48:41 <Diablo-D3> ;;bc
500 2010-11-20 03:48:41 <gribble> Error: "bc" is not a valid command.
501 2010-11-20 03:48:44 <Diablo-D3> ;;help
502 2010-11-20 03:48:45 <gribble> The bot responds when you start a line with the ! character. A good starting point for exploring the bot is the !facts command. You can also visit the bot's website for a list of help topics and documentation: http://gribble.sourceforge.net/
503 2010-11-20 03:48:48 <theymos> ;;bc,blocks
504 2010-11-20 03:48:48 <gribble> 92939
505 2010-11-20 03:48:52 <Diablo-D3> ahh
506 2010-11-20 03:54:27 <CIA-106> DiabloMiner: Patrick McFarland master * r6db085f / src/main/java/com/diablominer/DiabloMiner/DiabloMiner.java : Accidently left executions set to 1 instead of 3 - http://bit.ly/9obSZu
507 2010-11-20 04:07:39 <CIA-106> DiabloMiner: Patrick McFarland master * r431108f / src/main/java/com/diablominer/DiabloMiner/DiabloMiner.java : Adjusted hash meter behavior again - http://bit.ly/alTuCc
508 2010-11-20 04:18:19 <CIA-106> DiabloMiner: Patrick McFarland master * r1332a67 / src/main/java/com/diablominer/DiabloMiner/DiabloMiner.java : Really fix the hash meter this time - http://bit.ly/bpuN0L
509 2010-11-20 04:53:53 * jgarzik wakes up from a short nap to find... more TX spam
510 2010-11-20 05:02:08 <Kiba> he never stop...does he?
511 2010-11-20 05:02:44 <nameless> !~root@weowntheinter.net|...
512 2010-11-20 05:02:50 <ArtForz> just wait till most miners are on r185
513 2010-11-20 05:03:50 <theymos> Are you using the r185 changes now?
514 2010-11-20 05:03:55 <ArtForz> yup
515 2010-11-20 05:04:29 <theymos> Cool. The Bitcoin community shows once again that it adapts with lighting speed.
516 2010-11-20 05:05:08 <Kiba> and they're not conceited like the federal reserve PHDs and congresscritters
517 2010-11-20 05:05:29 <jgarzik> [jgarzik@burst ~]$ grep -c 'accepted orphan tx' /garz/bitcoin/data/debug.log
518 2010-11-20 05:05:29 <jgarzik> 2183
519 2010-11-20 05:05:35 <jgarzik> bigger number than I'd thought
520 2010-11-20 05:06:11 <theymos> That happens whenever you get a transaction out of order.
521 2010-11-20 05:10:18 <ArtForz> whoops, botched integrating my miner with r185
522 2010-11-20 05:10:48 <ArtForz> should be fixed now
523 2010-11-20 05:10:58 <ArtForz> it never included any TX
524 2010-11-20 05:13:38 <jgarzik> r186 is out "small bugfix"
525 2010-11-20 05:14:06 <ArtForz> eargh
526 2010-11-20 05:15:45 <ArtForz> recompiling... again
527 2010-11-20 05:16:38 <jgarzik> average blocks/hour, past 24h: 5.62. Finally under 6 :)
528 2010-11-20 05:18:35 <ArtForz> nice
529 2010-11-20 05:19:07 <ArtForz> total avg dropped to 6.11
530 2010-11-20 05:27:33 <ArtForz> r186 looks good so far
531 2010-11-20 05:36:14 redengin has joined
532 2010-11-20 05:47:41 <OneFixt> ;;bc,stats
533 2010-11-20 05:47:43 <gribble> Current Blocks: 92946 | Current Difficulty: 6866.89864897 | Next Difficulty At Block: 94752 | Next Difficulty In: 1806 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 5 days, 12 hours, 36 minutes, and 19 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 6875.91446098
534 2010-11-20 05:49:01 <Kiba> interesting
535 2010-11-20 05:49:11 <Kiba> a guy say he doesn't like bitcoin because he tought it was worthless
536 2010-11-20 05:49:24 <Kiba> simply because it wasn't back by a central authority
537 2010-11-20 05:49:30 <Kiba> and is not gold
538 2010-11-20 05:49:44 <ArtForz> lol
539 2010-11-20 05:50:23 <Kiba> he says as a customer he doesn't like the idea of an irreversable transaction
540 2010-11-20 05:50:43 <Kiba> I am sure grocery shopping count as irreversible transaction..yet he have a different standard for the internet
541 2010-11-20 05:51:04 <ArtForz> actually thats mostly a USian thing
542 2010-11-20 05:51:34 <Kiba> he considers "you don't have to trust the federal reserve" as a political statement
543 2010-11-20 05:51:38 <Kiba> I am like "WTF?"
544 2010-11-20 05:52:00 <Kiba> it's based on the fact that you have to trust them.
545 2010-11-20 05:52:07 <Kiba> it's a fact.
546 2010-11-20 05:52:49 <Kiba> but logically derives that you don't have to trust humans who can potentially lie to you.
547 2010-11-20 05:53:26 <ArtForz> wtf?
548 2010-11-20 05:53:28 <Kiba> ArtForz: the reversible stuff
549 2010-11-20 05:53:39 <ArtForz> yea?
550 2010-11-20 05:53:47 <Kiba> USian thing?
551 2010-11-20 05:54:00 <ArtForz> usual payment online around continental europe is wire in advance or COD
552 2010-11-20 05:54:35 <ArtForz> and yes, dealing with merchant scam is a bit more of a hassle
553 2010-11-20 05:54:37 <Kiba> but a political statement " you don't have to trust..."
554 2010-11-20 05:54:40 <Kiba> is ODD
555 2010-11-20 05:55:01 <Kiba> that what he believes
556 2010-11-20 05:55:03 <ArtForz> but not really THAT much of a hassle actually
557 2010-11-20 05:56:48 <ArtForz> thats... weird
558 2010-11-20 05:57:21 <Kiba> a comment from partisan economist, supposely
559 2010-11-20 05:57:34 <ArtForz> I dont really get the "you dont have to trust the fed is a political statement" part
560 2010-11-20 05:58:35 <Kiba> or partisan business people
561 2010-11-20 05:59:24 <ArtForz> well, it sorta is a political statement
562 2010-11-20 06:00:06 <Kiba> why trust anybody?
563 2010-11-20 06:00:10 <Kiba> when you don't have to trust
564 2010-11-20 06:00:13 <ArtForz> exactly
565 2010-11-20 06:02:24 <Kiba> I supposes he really doesn't trust the bitcoin network
566 2010-11-20 06:02:35 <Kiba> it's new.
567 2010-11-20 06:02:37 <Kiba> but that's about it
568 2010-11-20 06:02:49 <ArtForz> the problem is, understanding the concepts behind bitcoin is not really that easy
569 2010-11-20 06:02:50 <Kiba> and there's no incentives for miners to print bitcoins like no tommorow.
570 2010-11-20 06:03:06 <Kiba> oh yeah
571 2010-11-20 06:03:08 <Kiba> I agree
572 2010-11-20 06:03:24 <Kiba> it's very difficult to grasp the economic consequences and how the protocol works
573 2010-11-20 06:03:34 <ArtForz> not to mention most people distrust anything new and/or unproven
574 2010-11-20 06:03:42 <Kiba> like cryonics
575 2010-11-20 06:04:14 <Kiba> I didn't even distrust bitcoins
576 2010-11-20 06:04:17 xelister has joined
577 2010-11-20 06:04:18 <Kiba> I was like "HELL YA"
578 2010-11-20 06:04:48 <Kiba> within 10 to 15 minutes
579 2010-11-20 06:04:51 <xelister> m0m's mine newest version with bitcoin rev183+newest getwork.. hangs. damn.
580 2010-11-20 06:05:00 <xelister> ArtForz Diablo-D3 --^
581 2010-11-20 06:05:08 <jgarzik> wow, 850 transactions in one block
582 2010-11-20 06:05:11 <ArtForz> current is r186, getwork needs updating
583 2010-11-20 06:05:17 <ArtForz> wtf
584 2010-11-20 06:05:24 <xelister> each time it tries to send getwork, it either slows down a lot, or hangs
585 2010-11-20 06:05:38 <xelister> ArtForz: yeah, something is wrong here :[
586 2010-11-20 06:05:53 <ArtForz> btw, getwork needs updating
587 2010-11-20 06:05:55 <jgarzik> I guess some miner permitted 850 free TX's
588 2010-11-20 06:05:59 <jgarzik> in one block
589 2010-11-20 06:06:03 <ArtForz> yep
590 2010-11-20 06:06:17 <ArtForz> someone still running the oold block size/fee limits?
591 2010-11-20 06:06:24 <xelister> with current poclbm + bitcoind-181 all works, it does not hang
592 2010-11-20 06:06:46 <ArtForz> afair we allowed 50k+ free a while back
593 2010-11-20 06:07:02 <xelister> any idea about the hanging miner?
594 2010-11-20 06:07:21 <ArtForz> nope
595 2010-11-20 06:07:24 <Kiba> ArtForz: well for us, we don't understand everything too at the beginning
596 2010-11-20 06:07:28 <ArtForz> latest block is interesting
597 2010-11-20 06:07:33 <Kiba> we have these series of debates that shape our economic understanding
598 2010-11-20 06:07:52 <ArtForz> looks like a new spammer popped up
599 2010-11-20 06:08:00 <theymos> The old rules allowed free transactions up to 200kB.
600 2010-11-20 06:08:28 <ArtForz> now someone is sending 100btc transactions
601 2010-11-20 06:08:43 <Kiba> ArtForz: what rule was implemented?
602 2010-11-20 06:08:59 <ArtForz> Kiba: what?
603 2010-11-20 06:09:41 <Kiba> in the newest revision to combat the transaction spamming
604 2010-11-20 06:09:50 <theymos> Kiba: http://www.bitcoin.org/wiki/doku.php?do=show&id=transaction_fee is updated for the newest SVN.
605 2010-11-20 06:10:47 <ArtForz> anyways, a spammer is now sending 100btc back and forth
606 2010-11-20 06:11:02 <theymos> Latest rule change was: "If the blocksize is over 4kB, free transactions in the above rules are only allowed if the transaction's priority is above a certain level."
607 2010-11-20 06:11:18 <ArtForz> wonder how long it'll take him to realize if those spam TX queue up too much it'll take AGES for the network to confirm them
608 2010-11-20 06:11:50 <jgarzik> 100BTC is me
609 2010-11-20 06:11:54 <jgarzik> just one run
610 2010-11-20 06:11:55 <kermit> whats the benefit of sending 100btc back and forth?
611 2010-11-20 06:11:55 * Kiba lols at the last sentence
612 2010-11-20 06:12:28 <jgarzik> kermit: just watching network behavior
613 2010-11-20 06:12:40 <xelister> anyone successfully running m0m's with a bitcoind newer then rev181 ?
614 2010-11-20 06:12:41 <kermit> oh, ArtForz called it spamming
615 2010-11-20 06:12:59 <jgarzik> it's not the same coins nor sending to same address, like the earlier spam. wanted to see how things would behave.
616 2010-11-20 06:13:27 <Kiba> then it's watching time to see what kind of unintended consequences it might have
617 2010-11-20 06:13:33 <ArtForz> "weirdly"
618 2010-11-20 06:13:48 <ArtForz> notice how 100btc tx and 0.01btc tx are intermingled?
619 2010-11-20 06:14:00 <jgarzik> first batch was 13 x 1000 BTC, second batch was 130 x 100 BTC
620 2010-11-20 06:14:19 <ArtForz> = client generating that block was not running tx-prioritizing
621 2010-11-20 06:14:24 <jgarzik> yeah
622 2010-11-20 06:14:59 <ArtForz> tx prioritizing seems to put TXes in a block nice and ordered :P
623 2010-11-20 06:17:27 <ArtForz> I dont quite get why we keep orphan TX in memory for longer than a few hours
624 2010-11-20 06:17:48 <Kiba> so MrBurns will run out of btc in short order?
625 2010-11-20 06:17:58 <ArtForz> I mean, if someone is still trying to send that TX he'll resend it after 1 block + 30-60 min anyways
626 2010-11-20 06:19:45 <jgarzik> (recalling from earlier) some miners don't even bother to include -any- TX's, they just mine empty blocks? I never knew that. Makes perfect sense that someone would do that, but it had never occurred to me.
627 2010-11-20 06:19:53 <ArtForz> yep
628 2010-11-20 06:20:07 <ArtForz> they just produce blocks with a coinbase
629 2010-11-20 06:20:21 <Kiba> please enlighten me
630 2010-11-20 06:20:28 <ArtForz> my botched r185 would've done the same thing
631 2010-11-20 06:20:43 <Kiba> 50 BTC without tx fees?
632 2010-11-20 06:20:45 <jgarzik> yeah. seems like miners have an incentive to produce empty blocks too -- less "work."
633 2010-11-20 06:21:00 <ArtForz> = it just refused to include any transactions at all
634 2010-11-20 06:21:22 <Kiba> hmm?
635 2010-11-20 06:21:33 <Kiba> people just produce 50 BTC without computing the transactions?
636 2010-11-20 06:21:43 <jgarzik> Kiba: sure. it's a valid block, after all...
637 2010-11-20 06:21:54 <Kiba> in time, they'll process the fees too
638 2010-11-20 06:21:55 <theymos> jgarzik: That's the case now, but doing that will be extremely undesirable after a few subsidy reductions.
639 2010-11-20 06:22:06 <ArtForz> I wonder when the first miner will start getting REALLY lazy and produce to-btc-addr coinbases :P
640 2010-11-20 06:22:23 <Kiba> to-btc-addr coinbases?
641 2010-11-20 06:22:32 <ArtForz> instead of to-pubkey
642 2010-11-20 06:23:04 <ArtForz> = instead of going to a randomly generated fresh keypair, the coinbase goes directly to a addr
643 2010-11-20 06:23:28 <Diablo-D3> heh
644 2010-11-20 06:23:47 <ArtForz> = no need for send-if-nonzero-balance scripts and other muckery if you run a bunch of mining nodes
645 2010-11-20 06:23:52 <Diablo-D3> I wonder if m0 will add that to getwork
646 2010-11-20 06:24:33 <ArtForz> just put some randomness in the coinbase txin and you still have unique hashes
647 2010-11-20 06:25:10 <Kiba> I need to learn cryptography someday
648 2010-11-20 06:25:12 <ArtForz> = mining-only nodes wouldnt even need a wallet
649 2010-11-20 06:25:28 <Kiba> and this is my first time hearing of coinbase
650 2010-11-20 06:25:52 <ArtForz> coinbase is the first Tx in the block, the 50+fees-to-miner one
651 2010-11-20 06:26:34 <ArtForz> its output script is like for any other tx, but it's input script is ignored
652 2010-11-20 06:26:51 xelister has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
653 2010-11-20 06:27:46 <OneFixt> Is anyone here running a 3+ 5970 system?
654 2010-11-20 06:27:50 <ArtForz> yes
655 2010-11-20 06:28:00 <OneFixt> how are you managing to cool it?
656 2010-11-20 06:28:22 <OneFixt> if 2 5970s are next to each other, it seems like a nightmare without liquid
657 2010-11-20 06:28:26 <ArtForz> 2 scythe ultra kaze 3000 fans for the GPUs, one for the rest of the system
658 2010-11-20 06:28:35 <ArtForz> flexible PCIe extenders
659 2010-11-20 06:28:46 <ArtForz> to raise cards #2 and #4 about 4" up
660 2010-11-20 06:28:59 <OneFixt> oh that is brilliant
661 2010-11-20 06:29:01 <OneFixt> thank you
662 2010-11-20 06:29:03 <ArtForz> won't fit in a normal case, but it works fine
663 2010-11-20 06:30:01 <Kiba> ArtForz: how many does a box contain?
664 2010-11-20 06:30:03 <OneFixt> do you need just a larger case, or a custom one?
665 2010-11-20 06:30:05 <ArtForz> 4
666 2010-11-20 06:30:16 <Kiba> so you have five PC, essentially
667 2010-11-20 06:30:25 <ArtForz> yep
668 2010-11-20 06:30:37 <Kiba> all of them headless?
669 2010-11-20 06:30:41 <ArtForz> yep
670 2010-11-20 06:31:04 <Kiba> what CPU does each ahve?
671 2010-11-20 06:31:18 <ArtForz> most are 2.9 or 3GHz A2-X2s
672 2010-11-20 06:31:26 <Kiba> dual core?
673 2010-11-20 06:31:29 <ArtForz> yep
674 2010-11-20 06:31:41 <ArtForz> boxes are 4*5970, 4*5970, 2*5970+2*5770, 5970+5770, 5970+6870
675 2010-11-20 06:31:58 <Kiba> so, um...what chipset we're talking about?
676 2010-11-20 06:32:05 <Kiba> do you use these CPU to do bitcoin mining too?
677 2010-11-20 06:32:08 <ArtForz> nope
678 2010-11-20 06:32:11 <ArtForz> 790FX or 890FX
679 2010-11-20 06:32:52 <ArtForz> my personal fav. is the MSI 790FX-GD70
680 2010-11-20 06:32:52 <Kiba> so they're all mostly unused
681 2010-11-20 06:32:55 <ArtForz> http://images.bit-tech.net/content_images/2009/05/overclocking-amd-s-phenom-ii-x3-720-be/msi1.jpg
682 2010-11-20 06:33:40 <Kiba> yeah, I see that
683 2010-11-20 06:34:11 <Kiba> maybe you could get more out of your cluster if you make use of these CPUs
684 2010-11-20 06:34:16 <ArtForz> nope
685 2010-11-20 06:34:53 <ArtForz> even a 6-core phenom is only ~12Mh/s
686 2010-11-20 06:35:16 <ArtForz> one of my 5970s is 684Mh/s
687 2010-11-20 06:35:27 <Kiba> not for mining
688 2010-11-20 06:35:31 <Kiba> but for something else maybe?
689 2010-11-20 06:35:34 <Kiba> protein folding?
690 2010-11-20 06:36:06 <ArtForz> the 5970 needs 400W for that, the CPU 100W
691 2010-11-20 06:36:26 <ArtForz> 4x the power and 57x the speed ...
692 2010-11-20 06:36:32 <Kiba> so the use of CPU use more electricity
693 2010-11-20 06:36:43 <ArtForz> yep
694 2010-11-20 06:37:24 <Kiba> are there pictures of your rig?
695 2010-11-20 06:37:41 <ArtForz> nope
696 2010-11-20 06:37:54 <ArtForz> well, there are pics of my 2x5970+2x5770 rig
697 2010-11-20 06:40:24 <ArtForz> http://bayimg.com/PaAflaADC
698 2010-11-20 06:40:54 * Kiba imagine police storming into ArtForz looking for marunina plants
699 2010-11-20 06:41:19 <Kiba> LOL, cardboard improvision
700 2010-11-20 06:41:25 <ArtForz> yep
701 2010-11-20 06:41:37 <Kiba> I see your harddrive
702 2010-11-20 06:41:46 <ArtForz> at that point it was also not running the 2nd 5970
703 2010-11-20 06:41:50 <Kiba> what storage does it have?
704 2010-11-20 06:41:55 <ArtForz> the HD?
705 2010-11-20 06:41:59 <Kiba> yeah...
706 2010-11-20 06:42:04 <ArtForz> I think it's a 40GB maxtor from my parts pile
707 2010-11-20 06:42:10 <Kiba> oh
708 2010-11-20 06:42:27 <Kiba> I guess you'll use something with even less space and speeder access in the future
709 2010-11-20 06:42:34 <ArtForz> the 1kW PSU died so I ran it as 1x5970+2x5770 on a 850W for a while
710 2010-11-20 06:42:47 <ArtForz> I'll prolly convert all of em to netboot sooner or later
711 2010-11-20 06:43:00 <ArtForz> no need for local storage at all
712 2010-11-20 06:43:27 <ArtForz> btw, that 850W PSU is also "special"
713 2010-11-20 06:44:03 <ArtForz> notice that the 5V of the molexes going to the adapters to the 5770s just end in mid-air
714 2010-11-20 06:44:11 * Kiba sees like 3 fans...
715 2010-11-20 06:45:18 <ArtForz> bbl
716 2010-11-20 06:50:16 <theymos> Does this page give a good overview of the topic? http://www.bitcoin.org/wiki/doku.php?id=transaction_fee RHorning on the forum seems to think that it is incomplete, but I believe all important points are covered.
717 2010-11-20 06:52:03 <Kiba> it's the only overview of the topic, theymos
718 2010-11-20 06:52:22 Zenchess has quit ()
719 2010-11-20 06:53:35 <theymos> That doesn't necessarily mean it's complete, though.
720 2010-11-20 06:55:46 <Kiba> to date, only the Russians got their own special forum.
721 2010-11-20 06:55:49 <Kiba> The Russians are special.
722 2010-11-20 06:59:38 <OneFixt> ArtForz: what do you use to power the 4x5970 cases?
723 2010-11-20 07:04:03 * jgarzik wonders what is the oldest, cheapest motherboard that will run a 5870
724 2010-11-20 07:04:06 <jgarzik> or 5770
725 2010-11-20 07:04:42 FreeMoney has joined
726 2010-11-20 07:27:52 theymos has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
727 2010-11-20 07:51:20 <OneFixt> ;;bc,stats
728 2010-11-20 07:51:23 <gribble> Current Blocks: 92952 | Current Difficulty: 6866.89864897 | Next Difficulty At Block: 94752 | Next Difficulty In: 1800 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 5 days, 18 hours, 21 minutes, and 50 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 6724.25357693
729 2010-11-20 08:12:20 FreeMoney has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
730 2010-11-20 08:13:21 <OneFixt> ;;bc,stats
731 2010-11-20 08:13:24 <gribble> Current Blocks: 92954 | Current Difficulty: 6866.89864897 | Next Difficulty At Block: 94752 | Next Difficulty In: 1798 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 5 days, 19 hours, 13 minutes, and 52 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 6697.82197105
732 2010-11-20 08:14:07 <Diablo-D3> LOL
733 2010-11-20 08:14:08 <Diablo-D3> its gone down!
734 2010-11-20 08:15:50 <MT`AwAy> Diablo-D3: it's too early to say that
735 2010-11-20 08:32:16 <OneFixt> ;;bc,stats
736 2010-11-20 08:32:18 <gribble> Current Blocks: 92955 | Current Difficulty: 6866.89864897 | Next Difficulty At Block: 94752 | Next Difficulty In: 1797 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 5 days, 20 hours, 28 minutes, and 57 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 6666.94092825
737 2010-11-20 08:41:07 <Diablo-D3> 6666!
738 2010-11-20 08:41:10 <Diablo-D3> THE SIGN OF....
739 2010-11-20 08:41:13 <Diablo-D3> something
740 2010-11-20 08:47:51 <Diablo-D3> Average 4 days, 14 hours, 42 minutes
741 2010-11-20 08:47:52 <Diablo-D3> fuck
742 2010-11-20 08:53:36 * nathan7 hops around
743 2010-11-20 08:53:41 <Kiba> there are bounty...worth hacking on.
744 2010-11-20 08:53:56 <wumpus> with all the people complaining that bitcoins are not 'chargebackable', I wonder if they realize that other underlying cash currencies are also not 'chargebackable'... you can't give someone a stack of dollars or euros and claim it back
745 2010-11-20 08:54:16 <wumpus> it isn't dependent on the currency, start a bitcoin bank and you can charge back transactions
746 2010-11-20 08:54:18 <nathan7> O RLY?
747 2010-11-20 08:54:28 <wumpus> yeah it annoys me
748 2010-11-20 08:54:34 <Kiba> merchants hate things that are chargebackable
749 2010-11-20 08:54:42 <nathan7> =p
750 2010-11-20 08:54:46 <wumpus> yes but customers like them
751 2010-11-20 08:54:48 <Kiba> especially by assholes who doesn't consider emailing them for refund
752 2010-11-20 08:55:00 <wumpus> but that doesn't mean anything for bitcoin, which is comparable to cash
753 2010-11-20 08:55:54 <wumpus> so yeah I guess there is a niche for a bitcoin-based service that allows chargebacks in case of fraud
754 2010-11-20 08:56:07 <Kiba> not neccesary
755 2010-11-20 08:56:19 <Kiba> the two party have to consent
756 2010-11-20 08:56:52 <Kiba> also, as a merchant, I would probably be willing to fund 99%
757 2010-11-20 08:56:56 <wumpus> yeah
758 2010-11-20 08:57:00 <Diablo-D3> so
759 2010-11-20 08:57:14 <Kiba> refund..
760 2010-11-20 08:57:15 <Diablo-D3> I think I wasted my time writing this miner
761 2010-11-20 08:57:17 <wumpus> i'm not saying it is neccesary, but i'm sure it's an oppertunity and such things will appear eventually
762 2010-11-20 08:57:32 <Kiba> cash versus chargebacks
763 2010-11-20 08:57:56 <Kiba> the thing is, customers can already smear the merchant after being cheated upon.
764 2010-11-20 08:58:25 <Kiba> night
765 2010-11-20 09:01:27 <wumpus> yes they can, but international fraudsters couldn't care less about that
766 2010-11-20 09:01:43 <wumpus> they will just find someone else to fuck around with
767 2010-11-20 09:01:56 <wumpus> then again, it wasn't my point that it is neccesary to have chargebacks
768 2010-11-20 09:02:11 <wumpus> just that 'chargebackability' isn't a property of the currency
769 2010-11-20 09:03:23 <Kiba> would be a bad default property, wumpus
770 2010-11-20 09:03:41 <Kiba> just imagine somebody chargebacking you 30 days after
771 2010-11-20 09:03:53 <Kiba> or having to deal with a crappy court
772 2010-11-20 09:04:03 <wumpus> indeed.. that's the point with it, it required a third party authority that manages the transactions
773 2010-11-20 09:04:16 <wumpus> which everyone has to trust
774 2010-11-20 09:04:44 <Kiba> competition for abritation has not even started yet
775 2010-11-20 09:22:37 Kiba has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
776 2010-11-20 10:18:05 <MT`AwAy> I really want to see bitcoins merged with electric money
777 2010-11-20 10:22:31 <MT`AwAy> that could be rather easy :o
778 2010-11-20 10:24:46 <MT`AwAy> less secure than normal bitcoin however :(
779 2010-11-20 10:32:55 * MT`AwAy imagines an IC card with a private EC key inside that could generate bitcoin transactions to make contactless payments
780 2010-11-20 10:33:31 <MT`AwAy> anyone knowing the card public key could however track the card and see when it is used :(
781 2010-11-20 10:33:58 maqr has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
782 2010-11-20 10:35:10 <MT`AwAy> (but generating new EC keys on the card wouldn't be possible, signing alone is hard)
783 2010-11-20 10:35:40 <bd_> MT`AwAy: You could load it up with a set of pre-generated keys, and periodically hook it up to a trusted key generator to add a new set
784 2010-11-20 10:36:22 <MT`AwAy> bd_: what makes those card "handy" is the fact you don't need to periodically do any maintenance (and a typical card lifetime is ~10 years)
785 2010-11-20 10:36:34 <MT`AwAy> (here in Japan we have tons of them)
786 2010-11-20 10:36:49 <bd_> MT`AwAy: Well, one option is to let the payment terminal act as a communication path to the key generator
787 2010-11-20 10:37:06 <MT`AwAy> yep, I was thinking of that
788 2010-11-20 10:37:50 <bd_> And, I know, I have a suica card myself ;)
789 2010-11-20 10:37:53 <MT`AwAy> but then it'd mean the card will need a central authority managing it and giving it keys, and we lose the basic advantage of bitcoin
790 2010-11-20 10:38:15 <MT`AwAy> bd_: I got a felica mobile ;)
791 2010-11-20 10:38:22 <bd_> it doesn't need to be a _central_ authority - anyone can use whatever authority they trust
792 2010-11-20 10:38:38 <bd_> heh, I'm only here for a year, didn't want to pay for a cell phone with a felica chip :)
793 2010-11-20 10:38:44 <MT`AwAy> :p
794 2010-11-20 10:38:59 <MT`AwAy> I'm here for more than one year, and I kinda like this whole thing
795 2010-11-20 10:39:10 <MT`AwAy> also it's the only way to have a suica you can charge by credit card
796 2010-11-20 10:39:23 <MT`AwAy> (well, in fact there are other ways)
797 2010-11-20 10:39:32 <bd_> I just wish I could get train kaisuuken on my suica card
798 2010-11-20 10:39:53 <MT`AwAy> hokkaido?
799 2010-11-20 10:40:00 <bd_> nah, tsukuba express
800 2010-11-20 10:40:17 <bd_> the discount is worth it for me, but it's a pain carrying around all those tickets :|
801 2010-11-20 10:41:01 <MT`AwAy> Metropolitan Intercity Railway Company... they don't accept suica?
802 2010-11-20 10:41:20 <bd_> they accept suica, sure
803 2010-11-20 10:41:31 <bd_> but at regular fare
804 2010-11-20 10:41:34 <MT`AwAy> oh, I see
805 2010-11-20 10:41:54 <bd_> there's also some kind of commuter variant, but that's only worth it if you use it almost every day
806 2010-11-20 10:42:15 <MT`AwAy> yep, often the case for commuter cards
807 2010-11-20 10:42:30 <MT`AwAy> I noticed this on my own line too (inokashira line)
808 2010-11-20 10:42:41 <bd_> kaisuuken on the other hand is worth if if you make at least six round-trips in a three month period :)
809 2010-11-20 10:46:31 <MT`AwAy> I see
810 2010-11-20 10:46:44 <MT`AwAy> well, I don't use metro that much so I'm usually fine with my mobile suica
811 2010-11-20 10:46:45 <MT`AwAy> :p
812 2010-11-20 10:47:27 <bd_> :)
813 2010-11-20 10:48:04 <MT`AwAy> [19:30:47] <bd_> it doesn't need to be a _central_ authority - anyone can use whatever authority they trust <- back to that subject, it's a really big problem of trust (the authority could use the private keys they generate to steal money)
814 2010-11-20 10:48:43 <bd_> MT`AwAy: Well, you could generate keys yourself, upload them as an encrypted package to a holding authority, then have them transmitted to your card
815 2010-11-20 10:49:16 <bd_> Alternately if using a cell phone rather than an IC _card_ is acceptable, well, there's enough computing power for key generation there
816 2010-11-20 10:49:21 <MT`AwAy> bd_: that would add hassle on the card owner
817 2010-11-20 10:49:34 <MT`AwAy> (yep, about the phone I was thinking about it)
818 2010-11-20 10:50:23 <bd_> Or you could also have a card holder with key generation hardware on it
819 2010-11-20 10:50:33 <MT`AwAy> anyway it's not compatible with felica system, felica implies the money is stored on the card, and the card chip can either allow unencrypted operation (can only take money from the card) or encrypted operations (to charge, for example). Felica SDK does not allow to program the card more than that
820 2010-11-20 10:51:06 <bd_> Hm? Felica doesn't have a central server to protect against replay attacks?
821 2010-11-20 10:52:27 <MT`AwAy> bd_: I'm testing a lot of things (the SDK is quite fun btw), but felica does not seem to me to be 100% secure
822 2010-11-20 10:53:46 <bd_> you'd think suica and the like would insist on security, given that it's their money.. >_>;
823 2010-11-20 10:54:01 <MT`AwAy> :D
824 2010-11-20 10:54:28 <MT`AwAy> I'm playing with it with the goal of writing an article on that on my spare time since I like playing around with security
825 2010-11-20 10:54:37 <bd_> That said, there must be some kind of central reconciliation at some point
826 2010-11-20 10:54:42 <MT`AwAy> maybe I should sell whatever I find to the local mafia and make big bucks with that
827 2010-11-20 10:54:48 <bd_> maybe they allow deferred reconciliation on small transactions or something
828 2010-11-20 10:55:02 <bd_> though I haven't seen the SDK, so I can't say much for sore
829 2010-11-20 10:55:04 <bd_> sure*
830 2010-11-20 10:55:18 <MT`AwAy> bd_: card unique id is recorded with each transaction, and they check for ins/outs
831 2010-11-20 10:55:39 <bd_> MT`AwAy: if they check in with a central server immediately, sure, no problem
832 2010-11-20 10:55:53 <MT`AwAy> bd_: there's no real time checks in train stations
833 2010-11-20 10:56:35 <bd_> sure, that makes sense - it's cheaper to deal with a small chance of potentially delayed/rejected transactions than slow down the rush hour traffic with server latency
834 2010-11-20 10:56:54 <bd_> but for purchases and the like I'd expect realtime reconciliation
835 2010-11-20 10:56:57 <MT`AwAy> same thing for conbini accepting suica (family mart)
836 2010-11-20 10:57:02 <bd_> or, well, realtime authorization
837 2010-11-20 10:57:48 <bd_> okay, that's a bit scary then <_<
838 2010-11-20 10:58:14 <MT`AwAy> well, replay would imply "making" a suica card
839 2010-11-20 10:58:25 <bd_> pretty much
840 2010-11-20 10:58:41 <bd_> but it doesn't have to be the same form factor - you could hide the equipment in a wallet or something
841 2010-11-20 10:58:52 <bd_> plenty of room for a FPGA, some batteries, and an antenna then
842 2010-11-20 10:58:55 <MT`AwAy> lately I've been recording how charge/spend works via internet (I record usb traffic and check what happens)
843 2010-11-20 10:59:08 <MT`AwAy> [19:51:06] <bd_> but it doesn't have to be the same form factor - you could hide the equipment in a wallet or something <- or in a mobile phone ;)
844 2010-11-20 10:59:13 <bd_> hehe :)
845 2010-11-20 10:59:21 <MT`AwAy> nobody would worry seeing you use a mobile phone to "pay by suica"
846 2010-11-20 10:59:41 <bd_> question is, if reconciliation is delayed, exactly how long is it delayed by
847 2010-11-20 10:59:48 <MT`AwAy> yep
848 2010-11-20 10:59:52 <bd_> a two-second delay is short enough that you wouldn't be able to get away with it
849 2010-11-20 11:00:14 <bd_> if they batch things up and submit at the end of the day...
850 2010-11-20 11:00:27 <MT`AwAy> chances are this is how this happens
851 2010-11-20 11:00:37 <bd_> :|
852 2010-11-20 11:00:58 <MT`AwAy> anyway making a felica card is kind of difficult since the traffic is encrypted at communication layer
853 2010-11-20 11:01:13 <MT`AwAy> since I work with the SDK and a few usb felica layer, they already handle the encryption for me
854 2010-11-20 11:01:13 * bd_ wonders how they disable cards registered to a person's name if they're lost
855 2010-11-20 11:01:39 <MT`AwAy> [19:53:38] * bd_ wonders how they disable cards registered to a person's name if they're lost <- I don't think they do. It's kind of the same thing as losing a wallet... maybe I should try asking
856 2010-11-20 11:01:49 <MT`AwAy> however since suica cards are anonymous anyway, it's probably not easy
857 2010-11-20 11:02:30 <bd_> MT`AwAy: Yuucho ATM cards come with a suica chip. It's a seperate account, but you can get it replaced (keeping the funds) if it's lost
858 2010-11-20 11:02:50 <bd_> Pasmo cards can also be registered, if you lose them they'll reissue them with a small fee
859 2010-11-20 11:03:01 <MT`AwAy> mh
860 2010-11-20 11:03:04 <MT`AwAy> I should try that
861 2010-11-20 11:03:11 <MT`AwAy> get a registered passmo, and claim it lost/stolen
862 2010-11-20 11:03:28 <MT`AwAy> then wait 1 week, and try to use it
863 2010-11-20 11:03:34 <MT`AwAy> (if it calls the police I'll just say "I found it back")
864 2010-11-20 11:03:48 <bd_> so with the felica SDK, can you actually charge against suica cards and have the charged funds sent to you?
865 2010-11-20 11:04:39 <MT`AwAy> no
866 2010-11-20 11:04:57 <bd_> How do you know authorization/reconciliation is delayed then?
867 2010-11-20 11:05:01 <MT`AwAy> the felica SDK allows me to program my own felica cards, however I cannot do much with other companies cards
868 2010-11-20 11:05:37 <MT`AwAy> all the cards I have includes a public key, and charge orders are made against a specific card number with a unique incremental nonce and can only be used against the card I'm charging
869 2010-11-20 11:05:47 <MT`AwAy> and are signed with a private key I have to keep private
870 2010-11-20 11:06:33 <MT`AwAy> reconciliation is to be done by me if I want to, by collecting card codes on charge and when used
871 2010-11-20 11:06:33 <bd_> right, but in that case perhaps suica and friends perform a server check _as well_ as a charge on the card itself
872 2010-11-20 11:07:10 <MT`AwAy> difficult to say
873 2010-11-20 11:07:11 <MT`AwAy> :p
874 2010-11-20 11:07:45 <MT`AwAy> I think I'll go to the family mart 2 minutes from here and look what their suica terminal is connected to
875 2010-11-20 11:08:10 <bd_> IIRC they have an ethernet line heading in there... could be wrong though
876 2010-11-20 11:08:10 <MT`AwAy> I know Edy uses real time check for charge and use, and the delay can be felt sometimes
877 2010-11-20 11:08:52 <bd_> yeah, if I were designing it I'd have an onboard balance for the train gates and instant feedback, but perform a check before telling the cashier it's done
878 2010-11-20 11:09:10 <bd_> ie, you can show the user their new balance instantly, but take the time to talk to the server
879 2010-11-20 11:09:21 <MT`AwAy> yep
880 2010-11-20 11:09:42 <MT`AwAy> would be the most logical way
881 2010-11-20 11:09:59 <bd_> How much storage space do you have to work with on those felica cards, btw?
882 2010-11-20 11:10:00 <MT`AwAy> maybe I'll try to contact suica too and ask them for the requirements to have a suica terminal in my shop
883 2010-11-20 11:10:09 <bd_> and how much processing power
884 2010-11-20 11:10:09 <MT`AwAy> bd_: usually between 5k and 19k
885 2010-11-20 11:10:22 <MT`AwAy> and you do not manage processing power, you cannot do any processing by yourself
886 2010-11-20 11:10:32 <bd_> ah - the terminal can just read/write the space then
887 2010-11-20 11:10:41 <MT`AwAy> yep, or call functions from the Sony Felica api
888 2010-11-20 11:10:45 <MT`AwAy> like taking money
889 2010-11-20 11:11:06 <bd_> well, there goes the bitcoin plans - you'd be giving your entire wallet to any merchant you go to
890 2010-11-20 11:11:11 <MT`AwAy> sony only guarantees that a transaction to take money from a card completes within 0.1s
891 2010-11-20 11:11:31 <MT`AwAy> bd_: no, since the card would not provide the private key, only sign transactions
892 2010-11-20 11:11:52 <bd_> hm? then you'd need to put a txn-signing program onto the card, surely?
893 2010-11-20 11:12:04 <MT`AwAy> yep, that's why I said it wouldn't be compatible with felica
894 2010-11-20 11:12:12 <bd_> ah. very well then.
895 2010-11-20 11:12:40 <MT`AwAy> felica is an interesting example of successful IC cards
896 2010-11-20 11:13:40 <MT`AwAy> btw in "felica for mobile" (like mobile suica), the felica part is independent from the mobile part
897 2010-11-20 11:13:53 <MT`AwAy> which means the felica card can be used even if the mobile is off
898 2010-11-20 11:14:09 <bd_> hmm, but there's a communication channel, right?
899 2010-11-20 11:14:12 <MT`AwAy> however if the mobile is on, the operator can send a "disable" command
900 2010-11-20 11:14:14 <MT`AwAy> yep
901 2010-11-20 11:14:30 <MT`AwAy> it's the same kind of channel than when you communicate with the felica card wirelessly
902 2010-11-20 11:14:42 <MT`AwAy> the mobiles gives power to the card, issue commands, then stop power
903 2010-11-20 11:14:42 <bd_> I know I've seen terminals where you can touch the phone to receive a URL
904 2010-11-20 11:15:25 <MT`AwAy> yep, maybe by using an interrupt from the felica chip to the mobile when such a thing is received
905 2010-11-20 11:15:52 <MT`AwAy> 1. terminal gives power to felica. 2. terminal sends url to felica, url is recorded 3. felica gives an interrupt to the mobile 4. mobile runs the right app that powers felica and reads the url
906 2010-11-20 11:15:56 <MT`AwAy> probably something like that
907 2010-11-20 11:16:07 <MT`AwAy> (or maybe it doesn't use felica but something else for all I know)
908 2010-11-20 11:16:43 <bd_> *shrug* my phone doesn't have felica, so I don't know either :)
909 2010-11-20 11:17:17 <MT`AwAy> I'll try later then :D
910 2010-11-20 11:17:45 <MT`AwAy> anyway it's a real bliss to use mobile suica/mobile edy/mobile nanaco/mobile yodobashi gold card/etc, I like it very much :D
911 2010-11-20 11:18:12 <bd_> if only they were a bit cheaper... :S
912 2010-11-20 11:18:15 <bd_> oh well.
913 2010-11-20 11:18:35 <MT`AwAy> well, it was 36k¥ to get a compatible mobile phone
914 2010-11-20 11:18:48 <MT`AwAy> (without contract)
915 2010-11-20 11:19:18 <MT`AwAy> (well, with a contract but without money to pay to cancel before 24 months)
916 2010-11-20 11:19:52 <bd_> when I did the math, it was a lot cheaper to get such a contract even considering that I'd be paying to break the contract early *shrug*
917 2010-11-20 11:20:10 <MT`AwAy> anyway gotta go use it at famima to buy a bento, it's already 8pm
918 2010-11-20 11:20:19 <bd_> I should get something to eat too :)
919 2010-11-20 11:20:35 <MT`AwAy> bd_: and if you have spare time for a drink or something sometime just tell me
920 2010-11-20 11:20:44 <MT`AwAy> (going to akiba from where I live is rather easy too)
921 2010-11-20 11:21:45 <bd_> heh, I don't drink :)
922 2010-11-20 11:21:56 <bd_> well, not alcoholic drinks anyway
923 2010-11-20 11:22:33 <bd_> anyway afk a bit
924 2010-11-20 11:22:38 <MT`AwAy> could be some coffee/tea at starbucks
925 2010-11-20 11:22:47 <MT`AwAy> :p
926 2010-11-20 11:24:30 Toadyonps3 has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
927 2010-11-20 11:25:57 <joe_1> i need confirmations
928 2010-11-20 11:27:47 <MT`AwAy> joe_1: generate more blocks ?
929 2010-11-20 11:28:07 <joe_1> i dont have any radeons
930 2010-11-20 11:28:36 <MT`AwAy> then use the test network? :p
931 2010-11-20 11:28:41 <joe_1> no i need to get my transactions confirmed to 5
932 2010-11-20 11:28:49 <joe_1> so the dart game will pay out
933 2010-11-20 11:29:06 <MT`AwAy> joe_1: you consider an incoming transaction confirmed when you want
934 2010-11-20 11:29:31 <joe_1> no, i need my outgoing transactions confirmed
935 2010-11-20 11:29:56 <joe_1> before it will pay out what i won. it's a weird system
936 2010-11-20 11:31:04 <MT`AwAy> joe_1: you can't confirm your outgoing transactions faster by yourself, it's fully dependent on how many blocks whoever received the transaction wants
937 2010-11-20 11:32:14 <joe_1> maybe artforz can fire up his radeons or something
938 2010-11-20 11:32:36 <MT`AwAy> :D
939 2010-11-20 11:33:43 <MT`AwAy> or maybe you can just wait a bit more, it'll probably be the same since nobody seems to be around
940 2010-11-20 11:37:09 <joe_1> yeah
941 2010-11-20 11:37:27 <joe_1> privacy shark is turning out to be a disaster
942 2010-11-20 11:38:06 <joe_1> i emailed them and PMd them on bitcoin.org, to change the DNS of my domain to point to the vps
943 2010-11-20 11:38:10 <joe_1> it's been a week nothing
944 2010-11-20 11:40:18 <MT`AwAy> joe_1: btw you could register a domain on kalyhost and use our privacy option (ask me to have privacy enabled)
945 2010-11-20 11:40:51 <joe_1> it's already registered to me under privacy shark
946 2010-11-20 11:40:55 <joe_1> is there any way to switch it over
947 2010-11-20 11:41:13 <MT`AwAy> transfer, but it requires the old registrar to unlock domain and provide auth info code
948 2010-11-20 11:41:33 <UukGoblin> i think there's a memory leak either in bitcoind itself or m0's getwork
949 2010-11-20 11:42:56 <MT`AwAy> UukGoblin: bitcoind seems fine here
950 2010-11-20 11:43:07 <MT`AwAy> ah
951 2010-11-20 11:43:08 <MT`AwAy> maybe not
952 2010-11-20 11:43:10 <UukGoblin> MT`AwAy, with getwork?
953 2010-11-20 11:43:19 Toadyonps3 has joined
954 2010-11-20 11:43:27 <MT`AwAy> UukGoblin: without
955 2010-11-20 11:43:31 <MT`AwAy> but in fact it's not fine
956 2010-11-20 11:43:34 <UukGoblin> being called by a miner every few seconds or so?
957 2010-11-20 11:43:38 <UukGoblin> ah.
958 2010-11-20 11:43:51 <UukGoblin> well after 2 or 3 days it took 80% of my 2gb
959 2010-11-20 11:43:53 <MT`AwAy> I'm checking
960 2010-11-20 11:44:04 <MT`AwAy> I got 24GB ram here so didn't notice
961 2010-11-20 11:44:16 <MT`AwAy> mh
962 2010-11-20 11:44:39 <MT`AwAy> no
963 2010-11-20 11:44:49 <MT`AwAy> even after restarting it still takes 1GB memory, so this one is not a leak
964 2010-11-20 11:45:07 <MT`AwAy> probably linked to the fact my wallet.dat is 616MB
965 2010-11-20 11:45:49 <joe_1> is there any limitation on configuring the iptables on the vps?
966 2010-11-20 11:46:39 <MT`AwAy> joe_1: none
967 2010-11-20 11:46:51 <MT`AwAy> just remember to not lock yourself out
968 2010-11-20 11:47:01 * UukGoblin suspects either m0's getwork or jsonrpc stack in general
969 2010-11-20 11:47:02 <joe_1> i know, i was scaring the crap out of myself a few days ago
970 2010-11-20 11:47:15 <UukGoblin> will debug further when i'm back from holiday
971 2010-11-20 11:47:23 <MT`AwAy> UukGoblin: I got a bitcoind running on a server with a getinfo call done every 10min
972 2010-11-20 11:47:28 <MT`AwAy> not using more ram that normal
973 2010-11-20 11:47:42 <UukGoblin> getwork is called every few secs
974 2010-11-20 11:47:42 <MT`AwAy> my local inactive bitcoind is using a lot of ram, but that's because of the wallet.dat file
975 2010-11-20 11:48:06 <MT`AwAy> UukGoblin: on my server it uses 77k of ram
976 2010-11-20 11:50:31 maqr has joined
977 2010-11-20 11:52:23 <MT`AwAy> btw joe_1 was it with you that I had some vps issues?
978 2010-11-20 11:52:50 <MT`AwAy> mh, seems not
979 2010-11-20 11:52:54 <MT`AwAy> :p
980 2010-11-20 11:53:01 <MT`AwAy> (finally found the infos)
981 2010-11-20 11:56:13 <joe_1> which vps?
982 2010-11-20 11:56:15 <joe_1> oh, no
983 2010-11-20 11:56:18 <joe_1> i didn't have any problems with it
984 2010-11-20 11:56:31 <joe_1> i'm getting confused between vpn and vps
985 2010-11-20 11:57:38 <MT`AwAy> :)
986 2010-11-20 11:58:27 <MT`AwAy> in fact someone else who ordered in bitcoins wasn't so lucky
987 2010-11-20 11:58:32 noagendamarket has joined
988 2010-11-20 11:59:57 <joe_1> that sucks
989 2010-11-20 12:00:03 <joe_1> was it a problem beyond their control, or did they cause it some how?
990 2010-11-20 12:01:02 <MT`AwAy> joe_1: in fact I had a problem with the code in charge of creating the vps initial image on a specific vps node
991 2010-11-20 12:01:17 <joe_1> oh
992 2010-11-20 12:01:19 <MT`AwAy> anyway the problem is fixed, and now I'm giving one month free to make up for it
993 2010-11-20 12:03:55 <joe_1> to all customers ?!
994 2010-11-20 12:04:12 <MT`AwAy> no, to this one
995 2010-11-20 12:04:12 <MT`AwAy> :p
996 2010-11-20 12:04:28 <joe_1> o
997 2010-11-20 12:04:41 <joe_1> do you know anything about VPNs?
998 2010-11-20 12:04:57 <MT`AwAy> yep, I know enough to say it's a pain to configure server-side
999 2010-11-20 12:05:18 <jercos> Pain? VPN? Those words don't belong together.
1000 2010-11-20 12:05:47 <MT`AwAy> jercos: configuring openvpn or the like is easy. Making PPTP+L2TP work server-side for windows/mac clients is a *pain*
1001 2010-11-20 12:06:22 <jercos> PPTP is always a pain, period. It's not the fault of the concept of a VPN, PPTP support just kinda sucks.
1002 2010-11-20 12:07:00 <MT`AwAy> :D
1003 2010-11-20 12:07:12 <jercos> AN' is it really that hard to tell clients they need to install software? :p
1004 2010-11-20 12:07:40 <MT`AwAy> never said it was the fault of the concept of a VPN, just that most people understand "VPN" as "something I can configure on mac/windows/iphone without installing anything"
1005 2010-11-20 12:08:38 <jercos> Of course, most of the VPNs I've worked with have been redundancy meshing VPNs to make sure servers are reachable, or just to encrypt traffic without modifying an application's configuration... so I guess I have something of a side-on viw.
1006 2010-11-20 12:08:42 <jercos> view*
1007 2010-11-20 12:08:58 <jercos> >.>
1008 2010-11-20 12:09:13 <jercos> Silly windows users and their toys.
1009 2010-11-20 12:09:27 <MT`AwAy> yep
1010 2010-11-20 12:09:50 <MT`AwAy> since I'm doing end-user stuff (vps, web hosting, etc) most of the time when someone asks me about "VPN" it's this kind
1011 2010-11-20 12:10:03 <joe_1> if i want the openvpn client to act as an http server thru the vpn, do i have to configure its routing table to route all internet IP addresses to the VPN, or can it accept inbound TCP on port 80 while still having the internet routed to the regular internet instead of the VPN?
1012 2010-11-20 12:10:53 <MT`AwAy> joe_1: yep, you can
1013 2010-11-20 12:11:25 <MT`AwAy> just have a private network on your vpn (192.168.x.x for example) and have the server do masquerading
1014 2010-11-20 12:11:44 <MT`AwAy> so all connections will appear coming from the vpn server (ie. 192.168.0.1) to the vpn client's http server
1015 2010-11-20 12:11:48 <joe_1> will masquerading take away the IP address of the visitor though?
1016 2010-11-20 12:11:53 <MT`AwAy> yep
1017 2010-11-20 12:12:08 <MT`AwAy> if you don't want that you have to find a way to somehow have only the http client's traffic go through the vpn
1018 2010-11-20 12:12:43 <jercos> You could add a higher-metric default route through the VPN, and bind the web server to the VPN interface...
1019 2010-11-20 12:13:22 <MT`AwAy> on Linux I'd use iptable -t mangle and ip route/ip rule
1020 2010-11-20 12:13:52 <jercos> mangling works too, I suppose :p
1021 2010-11-20 12:14:02 <MT`AwAy> with fwmark :D
1022 2010-11-20 12:14:06 <joe_1> i used iptables -t nat, to redirect incoming port 80 tcp from the real internet to a non-standard port on the openvpn client
1023 2010-11-20 12:14:21 <MT`AwAy> joe_1: the problem is on the other side, client => internet
1024 2010-11-20 12:14:42 <MT`AwAy> maybe you could route outgoing traffic directly through your ISP, if you do not have a nat router
1025 2010-11-20 12:14:58 <MT`AwAy> (with the vpn's ip)
1026 2010-11-20 12:15:19 <MT`AwAy> well, anyway there's a lot of ways do do what you ask, but none are really easy :D
1027 2010-11-20 12:16:39 <joe_1> well i had it to where i could ping both ways across the tunnel, and access the website from the openvpn server using the openvpn client's vpn ip
1028 2010-11-20 12:16:47 <jercos> 'swhy I rather line ethernet VPNs. YOu can always just slap a user mode linux instance or something on the interface, and run your server in there.
1029 2010-11-20 12:16:52 <jercos> like*
1030 2010-11-20 12:17:05 <joe_1> but i just couldn't get it to work after doing the forwarding
1031 2010-11-20 12:17:24 <joe_1> accessing website from a remote client
1032 2010-11-20 12:17:50 <joe_1> im about to bring everything back up and start messing with it again
1033 2010-11-20 12:36:54 <joe_1> ok i need inbound tcp port 80 traffic to be redirected to the vpn client's 10. address on a different port. what do i do with iptables -t mangle?
1034 2010-11-20 12:46:45 utyut has quit (Quit: HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- IRC with a difference)
1035 2010-11-20 12:55:32 <joe_1> ok, it works if i do an SNAT to change source IP to the openvpn server
1036 2010-11-20 13:22:29 <lfm> the channel topic need update again for 0.3.15
1037 2010-11-20 13:26:43 <lfm> Average interval since last diff change: 10.22 min finally leveled off?
1038 2010-11-20 13:28:20 <lfm> Or has Art decided its not worth his power bill at this level?
1039 2010-11-20 13:37:23 <Diablo-D3> I think everyone gave up
1040 2010-11-20 13:37:49 bulbasaur has joined
1041 2010-11-20 13:37:55 <lfm> not every one since there is still almost one block per 10 minutes
1042 2010-11-20 13:38:19 <Diablo-D3> you know what I mean
1043 2010-11-20 13:38:24 <Diablo-D3> ;;bc,estimate
1044 2010-11-20 13:38:25 <gribble> 6677.74051919
1045 2010-11-20 13:38:42 <lfm> ya the ones who pay for their electricity and care what it costs
1046 2010-11-20 13:38:48 <Diablo-D3> ;;sell 20
1047 2010-11-20 13:38:48 <gribble> (sell <btcamount> [btc|bitcoin|bitcoins] [at|@] <priceperbtc> <othercurrency> [<notes>]) -- Logs a sell order for <btcamount> BTC, at a price of <priceperbtc> per BTC, in units of <othercurrency>. Use the optional <notes> field to put in any special notes.
1048 2010-11-20 13:38:52 <Diablo-D3> ;;sell 20 btc
1049 2010-11-20 13:38:52 <gribble> (sell <btcamount> [btc|bitcoin|bitcoins] [at|@] <priceperbtc> <othercurrency> [<notes>]) -- Logs a sell order for <btcamount> BTC, at a price of <priceperbtc> per BTC, in units of <othercurrency>. Use the optional <notes> field to put in any special notes.
1050 2010-11-20 13:39:01 <Diablo-D3> ;;sell 20 btc at usd
1051 2010-11-20 13:39:02 <gribble> Error: 'usd' is not a valid floating point number.
1052 2010-11-20 13:39:07 <Diablo-D3> bleh
1053 2010-11-20 13:39:13 <lfm> try just $
1054 2010-11-20 13:39:22 <Diablo-D3> how much is 20 btc worth
1055 2010-11-20 13:40:22 <lfm> at $0.25 itd be $5.00
1056 2010-11-20 13:40:36 <lfm> so a bit more
1057 2010-11-20 13:40:49 <Diablo-D3> so, donations to me for the miner have reached.... $5.
1058 2010-11-20 13:40:56 <lfm> yay
1059 2010-11-20 13:41:29 bulbasaur has quit (Client Quit)
1060 2010-11-20 13:42:48 <davex__> gribble can do exchanges?
1061 2010-11-20 13:44:11 <Diablo-D3> amount my miner has earned..... $0.
1062 2010-11-20 13:44:29 <wumpus> hehe, I think you make more money creating a miner than actually mining
1063 2010-11-20 13:44:32 <lfm> I thot you said you got $5?
1064 2010-11-20 13:44:44 <Diablo-D3> wumpus: exactly
1065 2010-11-20 13:44:52 <wumpus> which is almost like in real life, I guess..
1066 2010-11-20 13:44:54 <Diablo-D3> lfm: no, someone gave me 20 btc
1067 2010-11-20 13:45:06 <Diablo-D3> lfm: it hasnt yet created a block on the main network
1068 2010-11-20 13:45:16 <lfm> that you know of?
1069 2010-11-20 13:46:03 <lfm> the person that sent you 20 prolly got 50
1070 2010-11-20 13:46:22 <davex__> can that happen?
1071 2010-11-20 13:46:32 <Diablo-D3> lfm: not from my miner
1072 2010-11-20 13:46:35 <wumpus> companies selling mining equipment generalle are more stable and do better than actual mining companies
1073 2010-11-20 13:46:36 <lfm> people can get 50 ya
1074 2010-11-20 13:46:47 <Diablo-D3> its only absolutely 100% been verified to work for less than a day
1075 2010-11-20 13:47:42 <lfm> weren't you able to try it on the test net?
1076 2010-11-20 13:48:11 <Diablo-D3> I did
1077 2010-11-20 13:48:18 <Diablo-D3> but testnet coins have no value
1078 2010-11-20 13:48:37 <lfm> but its a pretty good test of "working" or not
1079 2010-11-20 13:50:22 <lfm> cuz even if you get a real 50BTC you cant be sure its working absolutly right and not missing chances or something
1080 2010-11-20 13:50:33 <Diablo-D3> yes, and within the last 24 hours, I got it working on the test net.
1081 2010-11-20 13:51:14 <lfm> oh so you got the 20BTC before it was working right?
1082 2010-11-20 13:51:39 <Diablo-D3> yes.
1083 2010-11-20 13:51:44 <Diablo-D3> I think brock sent it
1084 2010-11-20 13:51:53 <lfm> nice of him
1085 2010-11-20 13:52:04 davout has joined
1086 2010-11-20 13:52:09 <davout> hi
1087 2010-11-20 13:52:15 <lfm> hi
1088 2010-11-20 13:52:37 <davout> anyone here using gavin's git fork ?
1089 2010-11-20 13:53:15 <davout> compiles fine but doesn't seem to recognize listtransactions using CLI
1090 2010-11-20 13:53:54 <lfm> sure its not just misspelt or something?
1091 2010-11-20 13:55:17 <Diablo-D3> you know
1092 2010-11-20 13:55:21 <Diablo-D3> saying git fork
1093 2010-11-20 13:55:25 <Diablo-D3> is kind of redundant
1094 2010-11-20 13:55:46 <Diablo-D3> its git, every time you clone a repo, its a fork
1095 2010-11-20 13:56:16 <lfm> sounded like he forked git. I wondered why hed ask about it here
1096 2010-11-20 13:56:41 <davout> hmm
1097 2010-11-20 13:56:53 <davout> doesn't seem to be misspelt
1098 2010-11-20 13:56:58 <wumpus> maybe he gets paid in bitcoin to fork git :P
1099 2010-11-20 13:57:16 <davout> thing is help doesn't show the command
1100 2010-11-20 13:57:28 <davout> even though it's present in the source
1101 2010-11-20 13:57:53 <davout> double checked the branch i was building all seems fine
1102 2010-11-20 13:58:09 <davout> would it be that some methods are available *only* through json rpc ?
1103 2010-11-20 13:58:26 <lfm> is it executing the one you think its executing? like is another one on your path?
1104 2010-11-20 13:58:57 <davout> no, i see stuff in getinfo that i didn't use to see
1105 2010-11-20 13:59:26 <davout> also i call it with full path
1106 2010-11-20 13:59:31 <lfm> getinfo shows the right version?
1107 2010-11-20 13:59:45 <davout> 31501
1108 2010-11-20 13:59:52 <davout> seems right to me
1109 2010-11-20 14:00:13 <davout> gonna try /w json rpc instead of cli
1110 2010-11-20 14:03:31 <lfm> if theres no error message I think its recognizing the command, just not interpreting the result or soemthing
1111 2010-11-20 14:05:08 grondilu has joined
1112 2010-11-20 14:05:21 <davout> json rpc call doesn't work either, gonna triple check the source ...
1113 2010-11-20 14:05:51 <grondilu> What's up with the EFF ? Don't they accept btc donations anymore ?
1114 2010-11-20 14:13:06 hippich_ has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
1115 2010-11-20 14:24:28 AAA_awright_ has joined
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1117 2010-11-20 14:26:54 grondilu has quit (Quit: ah nevernmind)
1118 2010-11-20 14:39:08 <gavinandresen> davout: weird, listtransactions got lost in the merge shuffle somewhere. I committed the fix.
1119 2010-11-20 14:48:46 davout has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1120 2010-11-20 15:05:31 rlifchitz_london is now known as rlifchitz
1121 2010-11-20 15:09:11 xelister has joined
1122 2010-11-20 15:09:35 <xelister> hm.. recently m0's miner started hanging
1123 2010-11-20 15:10:44 <xelister> it hangs on futex(0x201f634, FUTEX_WAIT_PRIVATE, 155037, NULL
1124 2010-11-20 15:11:20 <xelister> bascailly only change was some upgrades in ubuntu
1125 2010-11-20 15:13:27 <xelister> Diablo-D3: how stable is yours miner?
1126 2010-11-20 15:27:46 AAA_awright has joined
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1128 2010-11-20 15:54:50 utyut has joined
1129 2010-11-20 15:59:23 redMBA has joined
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1131 2010-11-20 16:06:30 hippich_ has joined
1132 2010-11-20 16:08:50 <Diablo-D3> xelister: try it and find out
1133 2010-11-20 16:09:01 <Diablo-D3> xelister: except that looks like a driver bug not a m0 bug
1134 2010-11-20 16:09:22 <xelister> hm, I ugraded a bit ubuntu, possibly with kernel
1135 2010-11-20 16:09:23 <Diablo-D3> futexes are common in driver code
1136 2010-11-20 16:09:57 <Diablo-D3> why do you use a shit distro
1137 2010-11-20 16:10:15 <xelister> because I wanted to buy Debian at local store but they sent me off to a museum
1138 2010-11-20 16:10:36 <xelister> and there I was like, wow new boost lib in stable, after just 1.5 years, good job
1139 2010-11-20 16:11:20 hippich_ has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1140 2010-11-20 16:11:23 <xelister> ubuntu is more up to date and works much better without fucking with it's configuration
1141 2010-11-20 16:11:35 <xelister> in most cases
1142 2010-11-20 16:11:47 <Diablo-D3> xelister: uh
1143 2010-11-20 16:12:02 <Diablo-D3> you do realize you just admitted in public you have no clue how to use debian, right?
1144 2010-11-20 16:12:12 FreeMoneyq has joined
1145 2010-11-20 16:12:33 <Diablo-D3> ubuntu stable is more out of date than debian testing
1146 2010-11-20 16:12:46 <xelister> is there some secret way of using debian stable that makes it use not very old packages (and of course not doing inadvisible things like mixing distros)
1147 2010-11-20 16:13:10 <xelister> oh debian testing. Well usually people in #debian said, what, TESTING? then you are on your own - just use stable
1148 2010-11-20 16:13:17 <wumpus> switch to debian unstable? :P
1149 2010-11-20 16:13:44 <wumpus> or ubuntu, it's based on debian and has somewhat newer packages
1150 2010-11-20 16:14:01 <xelister> wumpus: yeah I did switched to ubuntu, but Diablo-D3 complains
1151 2010-11-20 16:14:08 <wumpus> heh
1152 2010-11-20 16:14:26 <wumpus> and sometimes backports of newer packages are available
1153 2010-11-20 16:14:37 <Diablo-D3> ubuntu is almost constantly broken
1154 2010-11-20 16:14:48 <Diablo-D3> most upstreams hate ubuntu because they allow bullshit to be packaged and users blame upstream
1155 2010-11-20 16:14:59 <Diablo-D3> and ubuntu is really a microsoft scam anyhow
1156 2010-11-20 16:15:00 <Diablo-D3> so fuck them
1157 2010-11-20 16:15:04 <wumpus> and for some languages you have native support for getting new stuff.. for example python, you can use a isolated environment and easy_install in there
1158 2010-11-20 16:15:08 <xelister> well I use debian too, it had more problems when using it, because all libs and programs where too old for anything
1159 2010-11-20 16:15:20 <Diablo-D3> xelister: because you fail at linux
1160 2010-11-20 16:15:23 <Diablo-D3> use debian testing
1161 2010-11-20 16:15:28 <Diablo-D3> stable is not for end users like you
1162 2010-11-20 16:15:29 <wumpus> i've been using ubuntu for more than 4 year now but never had any problem with it
1163 2010-11-20 16:15:29 <xelister> I did. It sucked cocks
1164 2010-11-20 16:15:35 <Diablo-D3> "it sucked cocks"
1165 2010-11-20 16:15:36 <Diablo-D3> lol
1166 2010-11-20 16:15:43 <xelister> yeah, I have a photo of it
1167 2010-11-20 16:15:45 <Diablo-D3> xelister: can you fail any harder?
1168 2010-11-20 16:15:48 <xelister> I think it was taken in maxico
1169 2010-11-20 16:16:15 <wumpus> and i don't see why ubuntu would be a 'microsoft scam' :/
1170 2010-11-20 16:16:27 <Diablo-D3> wumpus: they install mono by default
1171 2010-11-20 16:16:29 <wumpus> i take it you don't like it, but comparing it to microsoft is getting on dangerous territory
1172 2010-11-20 16:16:30 <wumpus> :P
1173 2010-11-20 16:16:34 <xelister> Diablo-D3: I could install debian stable and failt TOTALLY but having too old libs to build any shit including bitcoin
1174 2010-11-20 16:16:48 <wumpus> yeah, mono is not my piece of cake either
1175 2010-11-20 16:16:53 <wumpus> I just don't use it
1176 2010-11-20 16:16:57 <Diablo-D3> xelister: yes, because you chose to install debian stable. use testing.
1177 2010-11-20 16:17:08 <xelister> I did USED DEBIAN TESTING
1178 2010-11-20 16:17:08 <wumpus> especially on server ubuntu there is no reason you'd want to have it installed
1179 2010-11-20 16:17:11 <xelister> for years
1180 2010-11-20 16:17:17 <Diablo-D3> wumpus: yes, but microsoft still lies and says x people have .net installed on linux
1181 2010-11-20 16:17:28 <xelister> after this time my impression was: it is old and lacks easy install for derivers and shit -> it sucks donkey cocks in maxico
1182 2010-11-20 16:17:42 <Diablo-D3> wumpus: ubuntu is also trying to somehow fork gnome and make mono a required dep
1183 2010-11-20 16:17:48 <Diablo-D3> wumpus: so fuck ubuntu
1184 2010-11-20 16:18:05 <wumpus> yeah, everyone to his own tastes I guess
1185 2010-11-20 16:18:36 <wumpus> i'm very pragmatic with that, it works for me so I use it... if something else works better i'll use that
1186 2010-11-20 16:18:40 <wumpus> screw politics :)
1187 2010-11-20 16:18:56 <xelister> on the other hand, if you ignore politicis, politicians will screw you
1188 2010-11-20 16:19:05 <wumpus> they'll screw me anyway
1189 2010-11-20 16:19:15 <xelister> but still ubuntu is rather ok, Im not paying to microsoft or shit, so cheer up
1190 2010-11-20 16:19:17 <wumpus> fear of politicians screwing you is like fear of dying
1191 2010-11-20 16:19:20 <wumpus> it won't help you :)
1192 2010-11-20 16:19:21 <xelister> and try to make debian better ;)
1193 2010-11-20 16:19:41 <xelister> wumpus: but doing something is like going to a doctor
1194 2010-11-20 16:20:06 <Diablo-D3> wumpus: in this case, you cant screw politics
1195 2010-11-20 16:20:07 <wumpus> i don't have any influence on the world anyway
1196 2010-11-20 16:20:33 <xelister> wumpus: you do have influence at few people and few things; everyone doing his part changes the world
1197 2010-11-20 16:20:40 <Diablo-D3> wumpus: ubuntu is trying to shove .net down everyone's throats, even though its broken, swpat hell, slow, bloated, and provides nothing useful
1198 2010-11-20 16:21:00 <Diablo-D3> wumpus: and yes, you ARE paying microsoft
1199 2010-11-20 16:21:05 <Diablo-D3> you're giving them free advertising space
1200 2010-11-20 16:21:18 * xelister inspects his init.d for microsoft-ad-server
1201 2010-11-20 16:21:41 <xelister> Diablo-D3: you appear to have done goofed
1202 2010-11-20 16:21:42 <Diablo-D3> allowing them to count you as a .net user allows them to make money off of people who believe their lies
1203 2010-11-20 16:21:45 <wumpus> i guess so...
1204 2010-11-20 16:22:01 <wumpus> they can count me as everything they like, as least I don't run their software :)
1205 2010-11-20 16:22:15 <Diablo-D3> except you do
1206 2010-11-20 16:22:17 <Diablo-D3> its installed.
1207 2010-11-20 16:22:25 <xelister> wumpus: I count you as pedo and terrorist
1208 2010-11-20 16:22:43 <xelister> who else would like use not gov controlled software with options for privacy and encryption
1209 2010-11-20 16:22:53 <wumpus> xelister: if that makes you feel better
1210 2010-11-20 16:22:56 <Diablo-D3> mark shuttlecock can enjoy his AIDS
1211 2010-11-20 16:23:07 <xelister> this ad was brought to you by lolbama. Please support the anti-encryption ACT, please think of the children
1212 2010-11-20 16:23:43 <xelister> lol "mark shuttlecock can enjoy his AIDS"
1213 2010-11-20 16:23:52 <xelister> shuffle
1214 2010-11-20 16:23:56 <wumpus> I use privacy and encryption options where I can, at least way more than most people...
1215 2010-11-20 16:25:12 <xelister> anyhow.............
1216 2010-11-20 16:25:14 <wumpus> that's all that's security is about, making things difficult so attackers will choose another target
1217 2010-11-20 16:25:23 <xelister> anyone experienced mom's generator hanging?
1218 2010-11-20 16:25:41 <wumpus> if someone really wanted to r00t your b0x they will :P
1219 2010-11-20 16:25:45 <xelister> why m0 is not online here for days :/
1220 2010-11-20 16:26:15 <wumpus> because he's too busy mining
1221 2010-11-20 16:26:45 <Diablo-D3> m0 was around earlier
1222 2010-11-20 16:27:13 <wumpus> btw diablo why did you make your miner in java, isn't oracle just as evil as microsoft? :)
1223 2010-11-20 16:27:37 <Diablo-D3> oracle is, sun wasnt
1224 2010-11-20 16:27:43 <wumpus> ture
1225 2010-11-20 16:27:44 <wumpus> true*
1226 2010-11-20 16:27:48 <wumpus> sun was a great company
1227 2010-11-20 16:27:50 <Diablo-D3> sun open sourced java as Free Software
1228 2010-11-20 16:27:57 <Diablo-D3> oracle is now trying to use swpats to undo that
1229 2010-11-20 16:28:01 <wumpus> they really still had the hacker spirit
1230 2010-11-20 16:28:16 <Diablo-D3> the same way microsoft makes mono non-free, even though its BSD licensed
1231 2010-11-20 16:28:34 <Diablo-D3> oracle will soon lose java anyhow
1232 2010-11-20 16:28:35 <wumpus> yep
1233 2010-11-20 16:28:41 <Diablo-D3> java does not belong to oracle
1234 2010-11-20 16:28:54 <Diablo-D3> and suing google was a rather bad idea
1235 2010-11-20 16:29:02 <wumpus> I really hope they lose against google
1236 2010-11-20 16:29:21 Toadyonps3 has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1237 2010-11-20 16:29:25 <Diablo-D3> they will
1238 2010-11-20 16:29:41 <Diablo-D3> they'll also lose against apache and any future forks of openjdk
1239 2010-11-20 16:29:53 <wumpus> you never know with the US legal system
1240 2010-11-20 16:30:08 <xelister> US legal system is shit isn't it
1241 2010-11-20 16:30:14 <Diablo-D3> wumpus: well no
1242 2010-11-20 16:30:16 <Diablo-D3> the problem is
1243 2010-11-20 16:30:33 <Diablo-D3> they allowed outside java implementations
1244 2010-11-20 16:30:35 <wumpus> xelister: especially the texas courts, they always agree with the patent trolls
1245 2010-11-20 16:30:39 <Diablo-D3> even up to the point of having a testing suite
1246 2010-11-20 16:31:09 <Diablo-D3> once they made java Free Software, they can't in any way stop people from writing compatible implementations of java
1247 2010-11-20 16:31:32 <wumpus> indeed, and android isn't even officially java
1248 2010-11-20 16:31:33 <Diablo-D3> the only thing they could really sue for is to make google never refer to java on android as java(tm)
1249 2010-11-20 16:31:40 <Diablo-D3> and google doesnt anyhow
1250 2010-11-20 16:31:48 <Diablo-D3> at least, not officially
1251 2010-11-20 16:31:49 Toadyonps3 has joined
1252 2010-11-20 16:31:49 <wumpus> then again, I wouldn't assume a judge would understand such technological subtleties
1253 2010-11-20 16:32:02 <Diablo-D3> its not, wumpus
1254 2010-11-20 16:32:13 <Diablo-D3> this is simple contract and trademark law
1255 2010-11-20 16:32:22 <Diablo-D3> cases like this are a dime a dozen
1256 2010-11-20 16:32:30 <wumpus> yes
1257 2010-11-20 16:32:43 <Diablo-D3> companies try to sue people who make compatible implementations and/or parts for shit all the time
1258 2010-11-20 16:32:46 <xelister> ups i did it again!
1259 2010-11-20 16:32:48 <Diablo-D3> and they almost always lose
1260 2010-11-20 16:32:49 <xelister> m0ms hanged
1261 2010-11-20 16:32:53 <Diablo-D3> xelister: try mine
1262 2010-11-20 16:32:56 * xelister is tired of this bullshit
1263 2010-11-20 16:32:59 <xelister> ok then Diablo-D3
1264 2010-11-20 16:33:17 <xelister> what are the dependencies in yours? like
1265 2010-11-20 16:33:22 <wumpus> at least m0ms minder works on nvidia cards
1266 2010-11-20 16:33:23 <Diablo-D3> a jre
1267 2010-11-20 16:33:30 <Diablo-D3> wumpus: mine works on nvidia now
1268 2010-11-20 16:33:44 <wumpus> it doesn't assume the AMD extension anymore?
1269 2010-11-20 16:33:48 <wumpus> cool
1270 2010-11-20 16:33:58 <Diablo-D3> mine never did use the amd extension
1271 2010-11-20 16:34:13 <Diablo-D3> wumpus: anyhow, re oracle's patents, there is three ways to invalidate
1272 2010-11-20 16:34:19 <Diablo-D3> 1) it was never valid to begin with
1273 2010-11-20 16:34:22 <xelister> with m0m's we got... AMD drivers (fglrx), then AMD stream lib installed by unpacking + profile file
1274 2010-11-20 16:34:27 <Diablo-D3> 2) it doesn't apply to dalvik, it odes it differently
1275 2010-11-20 16:34:40 <wumpus> yep I've heard those arguments many times
1276 2010-11-20 16:34:42 <xelister> and pyopencl python package
1277 2010-11-20 16:34:48 <xelister> and python sues that all, done
1278 2010-11-20 16:34:49 <wumpus> but I still fear oracle will win, because of money motives
1279 2010-11-20 16:34:50 <Diablo-D3> 3) dalvik DOES do it that way, but you can only do it one way
1280 2010-11-20 16:35:05 <Diablo-D3> google, using cash on hand alone, can buy 1/3rd of oracle
1281 2010-11-20 16:35:14 <Diablo-D3> they could get the other 2/3rds easily
1282 2010-11-20 16:35:24 <wumpus> true, but it'd be like a poison pill :)
1283 2010-11-20 16:35:32 <Diablo-D3> not quite
1284 2010-11-20 16:35:36 <Diablo-D3> they'd destroy the company
1285 2010-11-20 16:35:38 <wumpus> buying oracle would kill google from the inside out
1286 2010-11-20 16:35:47 <wumpus> it's like a cancer
1287 2010-11-20 16:35:48 <Diablo-D3> open source everything, fire everybody who isnt an actual programmer
1288 2010-11-20 16:35:58 <Diablo-D3> and sell off the hardware division to someone or spin it off
1289 2010-11-20 16:36:08 <xelister> yeah who needs artists, translators, testers and marketers?
1290 2010-11-20 16:36:10 <wumpus> heh yeah that'd be great
1291 2010-11-20 16:36:14 <Diablo-D3> xelister: google doesnt.
1292 2010-11-20 16:36:19 <xelister> lol
1293 2010-11-20 16:36:21 <xelister> you'r funny Diablo-D3
1294 2010-11-20 16:36:26 <wumpus> yeah who needs people anyway
1295 2010-11-20 16:36:40 <Diablo-D3> foss has kind of proved you dont REALLY need all those people
1296 2010-11-20 16:36:47 <xelister> google is for people, not for some computer geeks
1297 2010-11-20 16:36:59 <wumpus> google super neural network will work work so much better :P
1298 2010-11-20 16:37:18 <Diablo-D3> xelister: btw, the only thing poclbm needs that isnt packaged is ati stream sdk and python jsonrpc
1299 2010-11-20 16:37:22 <xelister> they dont want to have I AR BUTTON but rather "Feeling lucky", and other shit
1300 2010-11-20 16:37:41 <wumpus> google does produce a lot of stuff for 'computer geeks'
1301 2010-11-20 16:37:44 <xelister> Diablo-D3: depends. on non-debians it turned out it needs pyopencl that is not packaged there
1302 2010-11-20 16:37:45 <wumpus> like open source libraries and stuff
1303 2010-11-20 16:37:56 <Diablo-D3> xelister: non-debians can go fuck themselves
1304 2010-11-20 16:38:01 <xelister> wumpus: yeah, it is not ONLY for geeks, also for normal people
1305 2010-11-20 16:38:06 <wumpus> much more than oracle, at least
1306 2010-11-20 16:38:12 <Diablo-D3> xelister: oh, and you only need ati stream sdk on ati
1307 2010-11-20 16:38:18 <Diablo-D3> xelister: so its only one real actual external dep
1308 2010-11-20 16:38:23 <xelister> Diablo-D3: now this is just retarded, what now, only debian is the true linux? slackware? GENTOO? redhat?
1309 2010-11-20 16:38:28 <wumpus> well yeah I guess your company won't become really big if you cater only to computer geeks
1310 2010-11-20 16:38:31 <Diablo-D3> gentoo isnt even a distro
1311 2010-11-20 16:38:39 <Diablo-D3> its some sort of convulted makefile from hell
1312 2010-11-20 16:38:46 <xelister> "gentoo isnt even a distro"
1313 2010-11-20 16:38:47 <xelister> lol
1314 2010-11-20 16:38:49 <xelister> woot?
1315 2010-11-20 16:38:54 <wumpus> hehe
1316 2010-11-20 16:38:59 * Diablo-D3 hatse gentoo with a passion
1317 2010-11-20 16:39:02 <Diablo-D3> fucking ricers
1318 2010-11-20 16:39:05 <wumpus> makefile contraption from hell
1319 2010-11-20 16:39:20 <wumpus> I started with slackware, then switched to gentoo, then to ubuntu
1320 2010-11-20 16:39:24 <Diablo-D3> PAINT IT RED, IT'LL GO THREE TIMES FASTER
1321 2010-11-20 16:39:31 <Diablo-D3> I started with debian over a decade ago. I win.
1322 2010-11-20 16:39:51 <xelister> you won a museum ticket?
1323 2010-11-20 16:39:55 <wumpus> I like the 'compile everything from source' mentality, it's just that it's a waste of time :)
1324 2010-11-20 16:40:03 <Diablo-D3> anyhow, xelister
1325 2010-11-20 16:40:10 <Diablo-D3> xelister: everything you need but the jre is in the zip
1326 2010-11-20 16:40:23 <xelister> ok
1327 2010-11-20 16:40:24 <wumpus> when I want to install a cluster of 64 systems I don't want to compile linux on every one of them
1328 2010-11-20 16:40:30 <wumpus> that kind of rules out gentoo :P
1329 2010-11-20 16:40:31 <xelister> well I would like to build it from sources though, Diablo-D3
1330 2010-11-20 16:40:59 <xelister> wumpus: well I dunno.. cant you for i in host ; do ssh $i "my_install_script.sh" ; or something
1331 2010-11-20 16:41:02 <xelister> for 64
1332 2010-11-20 16:41:04 <Diablo-D3> xelister: kinda pointless
1333 2010-11-20 16:41:07 <xelister> but I see your point for 3
1334 2010-11-20 16:41:10 <wumpus> then again, half of the time the compile crashed halfway
1335 2010-11-20 16:41:11 <xelister> Diablo-D3: what is poinltess?
1336 2010-11-20 16:41:12 <Diablo-D3> xelister: get it from git, run mvn package
1337 2010-11-20 16:41:18 <Diablo-D3> xelister: building it from source
1338 2010-11-20 16:41:21 <wumpus> I had to fix something and re-run tha evil make script
1339 2010-11-20 16:41:23 <xelister> Diablo-D3: I will modify it
1340 2010-11-20 16:41:31 <wumpus> xelister: sure, but the machine will still be wasting time
1341 2010-11-20 16:41:34 <xelister> I need good, stable, modificable miner
1342 2010-11-20 16:41:39 <Diablo-D3> xelister: you dont need to rebuild it to edit the opencl file
1343 2010-11-20 16:41:39 <xelister> I hope your code is readable :)
1344 2010-11-20 16:41:53 <xelister> I will be changing the miner program, not the kernel
1345 2010-11-20 16:41:56 <Diablo-D3> which, btw, if you're on 5xxx, edit DiabloMiner.cl
1346 2010-11-20 16:42:06 <Diablo-D3> comment the first line, uncomment lines 2 and 3
1347 2010-11-20 16:42:13 <xelister> oh awesome.. WHAT NOW?
1348 2010-11-20 16:42:35 <xelister> even before I download it, there is first bug that expresses on radeons 5xxx ?
1349 2010-11-20 16:42:57 <Diablo-D3> not bug
1350 2010-11-20 16:43:03 <Diablo-D3> I dont automatically detect 5xxx on 2.1 yet
1351 2010-11-20 16:43:05 <xelister> your responsiblity to work around
1352 2010-11-20 16:43:15 <Diablo-D3> so it wont automatically use amd shift
1353 2010-11-20 16:43:19 <xelister> well "my" miner needs to Just Work® easly, on typocal radeons and the nvidias that make at least some sense (>30 Mhash)
1354 2010-11-20 16:43:33 <Diablo-D3> xelister: specific use case issue
1355 2010-11-20 16:43:39 <Diablo-D3> its not needed for 2.2
1356 2010-11-20 16:43:52 <Diablo-D3> and it shouldnt have been needed for 2.1 either
1357 2010-11-20 16:43:56 <xelister> can you work around, by heaving like DialoMiner-bitshifts.cl and loading that dependin on the reported core name like Jupiter
1358 2010-11-20 16:44:04 tcatm has joined
1359 2010-11-20 16:44:23 <xelister> Diablo-D3: hm what is the situation for windows users?
1360 2010-11-20 16:44:30 <Diablo-D3> xelister: read the forum post
1361 2010-11-20 16:44:49 <xelister> which forum thread is main one?
1362 2010-11-20 16:44:58 <Diablo-D3> the one that I started
1363 2010-11-20 16:45:10 <xelister> got it bookmarked perhaps?
1364 2010-11-20 16:45:13 <Diablo-D3> http://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=1721.0;all
1365 2010-11-20 16:45:14 <Diablo-D3> there
1366 2010-11-20 16:45:24 <Diablo-D3> xelister: and no, re: detection
1367 2010-11-20 16:45:24 <xelister> http://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=1721.0 ?
1368 2010-11-20 16:45:26 <xelister> ah ok
1369 2010-11-20 16:45:28 <Diablo-D3> yes, the code needs to be written BUT
1370 2010-11-20 16:45:36 <Diablo-D3> I need a list of all possible 5xxx names
1371 2010-11-20 16:45:39 <xelister> ok
1372 2010-11-20 16:45:46 <Diablo-D3> m0 broke his detection code that it doesnt work on 4xxx
1373 2010-11-20 16:45:57 <Diablo-D3> and like I said, its not required on 2.2
1374 2010-11-20 16:45:57 <xelister> will you credit me for help with such list? ;)
1375 2010-11-20 16:46:17 <Diablo-D3> and no, Im not going to have multiple .cls
1376 2010-11-20 16:46:18 <Diablo-D3> thats dumb
1377 2010-11-20 16:46:24 <xelister> Diablo-D3: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_AMD_graphics_processing_units#Evergreen_.28HD_5xxx.29_series ta-dam
1378 2010-11-20 16:46:36 <Diablo-D3> xelister: iirc I showed you that wikipedia page
1379 2010-11-20 16:46:44 <xelister> also, well your attitude towards users is bad. you do what ever needed to have it JUST WORKING RIGHT
1380 2010-11-20 16:46:52 <xelister> swo why you ask for list of core name
1381 2010-11-20 16:46:53 <Diablo-D3> no I dont, xelister.
1382 2010-11-20 16:47:02 <Diablo-D3> I dont have to make any of it work right
1383 2010-11-20 16:47:04 <Diablo-D3> its open source.
1384 2010-11-20 16:47:13 <Diablo-D3> not only that, in 2-3 years, it'll also be dead.
1385 2010-11-20 16:47:16 <Diablo-D3> since mining will be over
1386 2010-11-20 16:48:25 <wumpus> you can't demand anything as a 'customer' of opne source software
1387 2010-11-20 16:48:34 <wumpus> the right way is: make a patch and submit it to the author
1388 2010-11-20 16:48:41 <Diablo-D3> exactly what wumpus said
1389 2010-11-20 16:48:51 <Diablo-D3> but the larger issue is, there are no users of it
1390 2010-11-20 16:49:00 <Diablo-D3> it has one very specific task: mine bitcoins
1391 2010-11-20 16:49:01 <xelister> Diablo-D3: yeah, I ment what is needed
1392 2010-11-20 16:49:06 <xelister> if not you, then perhaps I will :)
1393 2010-11-20 16:49:07 <wumpus> or you can pay the author, or some other programmer, to do it
1394 2010-11-20 16:49:13 <Diablo-D3> a very extremely small number of bitcoin users mine on gpus
1395 2010-11-20 16:49:25 <Diablo-D3> theres less than a dozen people who'd ever run this program
1396 2010-11-20 16:49:28 rlifchitz has quit (Quit: "I never worry about action, but only about inaction" (W. Churchill))
1397 2010-11-20 16:49:31 <wumpus> my gpu is too slow anyway
1398 2010-11-20 16:49:39 <xelister> well yeah it seems 80% of bitcoins nowdays come from 20% of users
1399 2010-11-20 16:49:48 <Diablo-D3> wumpus: single digit mhash vs mid to high double digit?
1400 2010-11-20 16:49:51 <xelister> or even like 95% from 5% since GPU clusters
1401 2010-11-20 16:49:54 <Diablo-D3> wumpus: cant be THAT slow
1402 2010-11-20 16:50:03 <wumpus> it doesn't even get to the mhash
1403 2010-11-20 16:50:08 <xelister> wumpus: lol what?
1404 2010-11-20 16:50:08 <Diablo-D3> wtf is your gpu
1405 2010-11-20 16:50:19 <xelister> it supports OpenCL, but is <1 Mhash?
1406 2010-11-20 16:50:26 <Diablo-D3> that sounds like bullshit
1407 2010-11-20 16:50:26 <xelister> lol wait
1408 2010-11-20 16:50:42 <xelister> did you started the miner and then looked at STANDARD BITCOIND to FIND OUT THE HASHRATE?? ;)
1409 2010-11-20 16:50:51 <Diablo-D3> yes what xelister said
1410 2010-11-20 16:51:29 <xelister> because if you did, then flash news, bitcoin(d) does NOT show the hash rate taking into account EXTERNAL MINER =)
1411 2010-11-20 16:51:39 <xelister> thats why miner usually print stats to console
1412 2010-11-20 16:52:24 <xelister> Diablo-D3: does your miner have a main loop or function that is called periodicaly and that can have access to information about number of blocks generated? is there some code that is executed on each generation? and can I send my own RPC command periodically easly with your miner?
1413 2010-11-20 16:53:13 <Diablo-D3> xelister: it outputs log to terminal when it generates blocks
1414 2010-11-20 16:53:18 <xelister> im making quickly installable miner that will send all generated to centrall computer basicall, and provide extra logging to know if all works well
1415 2010-11-20 16:53:27 <wumpus> ehh I was wrong
1416 2010-11-20 16:53:38 <wumpus> it reports khash not hash :P
1417 2010-11-20 16:53:42 <Diablo-D3> wumpus: you moron.
1418 2010-11-20 16:53:45 <xelister> lololololol
1419 2010-11-20 16:53:51 <wumpus> so yeah, I get around 5 mhash on my gpu...
1420 2010-11-20 16:53:58 <Diablo-D3> xelister: and I wrote a json rpc impl
1421 2010-11-20 16:54:16 <Diablo-D3> xelister: see how getwork add sendwork work in the json class at the bottom
1422 2010-11-20 16:54:19 <xelister> wumpus: that will be 1 BTC to 13BB3otAkZ6HmyjRNzabEn3knCmbYdxjoE . next!
1423 2010-11-20 16:54:23 <wumpus> it's pretty ancient :)
1424 2010-11-20 16:54:36 <Diablo-D3> wumpus: what gpu
1425 2010-11-20 16:54:41 <Diablo-D3> because it shouldnt even run opencl
1426 2010-11-20 16:54:51 <xelister> is it Geforce 8000 ?
1427 2010-11-20 16:54:54 <wumpus> Geforce 6800GT
1428 2010-11-20 16:54:57 <Diablo-D3> erm
1429 2010-11-20 16:54:58 <xelister> huhu
1430 2010-11-20 16:54:59 <Diablo-D3> wumpus
1431 2010-11-20 16:55:01 <wumpus> 8600GT
1432 2010-11-20 16:55:05 <Diablo-D3> oh
1433 2010-11-20 16:55:05 Kiba has joined
1434 2010-11-20 16:55:07 <wumpus> same series as 8800
1435 2010-11-20 16:55:08 <wumpus> but slower
1436 2010-11-20 16:55:10 <Diablo-D3> because 6xxx cant run opencl at all
1437 2010-11-20 16:55:11 <xelister> haha
1438 2010-11-20 16:55:14 <Diablo-D3> wumpus: but yeah, thats sick
1439 2010-11-20 16:55:18 <xelister> this channel is funny as shit
1440 2010-11-20 16:55:20 <Diablo-D3> wumpus: buy a 69xx when they come out
1441 2010-11-20 16:55:25 <xelister> same series as 8800 but slower
1442 2010-11-20 16:55:44 <wumpus> it can run opencl and cuda, that's why I bought it, three or four years ago :P
1443 2010-11-20 16:55:45 <Diablo-D3> xelister: anyhow, how would it function if I didnt have a loop?
1444 2010-11-20 16:56:11 <xelister> Diablo-D3: you could have some callback system and oepncl could run the main loop as it is done with opengl/glut? I dunno :)
1445 2010-11-20 16:56:24 <Diablo-D3> xelister: I removed the callbacks actually
1446 2010-11-20 16:56:28 <Diablo-D3> required opencl 1.1
1447 2010-11-20 16:56:37 <xelister> and?
1448 2010-11-20 16:56:44 <Diablo-D3> and ati stream sdk 2.1 doesnt provide 1.1
1449 2010-11-20 16:56:46 <xelister> required opencl==1.1 ?
1450 2010-11-20 16:56:47 <Diablo-D3> neither does anything nvidia
1451 2010-11-20 16:56:52 <xelister> whet they provide? 1.0 ?
1452 2010-11-20 16:56:58 <Diablo-D3> yeah 1.0
1453 2010-11-20 16:57:01 <xelister> ah
1454 2010-11-20 16:57:06 <Diablo-D3> the event callbacks were added in 1.1
1455 2010-11-20 16:57:11 <Diablo-D3> much more efficient system, but bleh
1456 2010-11-20 16:57:17 <xelister> that probably is not performance penalty
1457 2010-11-20 16:57:18 <Diablo-D3> 2.1 runs faster
1458 2010-11-20 16:57:26 <Diablo-D3> well, with the way m0 does it, it is
1459 2010-11-20 16:57:29 <Diablo-D3> the way I do it, its not
1460 2010-11-20 16:57:33 <xelister> :]
1461 2010-11-20 16:57:48 <Diablo-D3> I just spawn multiple threads to babysit multiple queues per device
1462 2010-11-20 16:57:48 <xelister> well lets see if your's will not hang as shit
1463 2010-11-20 16:58:02 <Diablo-D3> its the only way to not get raped by blocking
1464 2010-11-20 16:58:02 <xelister> how your supports 2 GFX cards?
1465 2010-11-20 16:58:04 <xelister> two radeons
1466 2010-11-20 16:58:10 <Diablo-D3> mine supports unlimited devices.
1467 2010-11-20 16:58:15 <wumpus> indeed, m0's miner fires off a few blocks and then wait()'s, it can't be the best way
1468 2010-11-20 16:58:17 <xelister> they can be different?
1469 2010-11-20 16:58:27 <Diablo-D3> xelister: they have to exist.
1470 2010-11-20 16:58:52 <xelister> will board with 2 of PCIEx16, and with say R-5770 + R-5970 work correctly? including drivers in linux, and the miner and opencl
1471 2010-11-20 16:59:07 <xelister> or is anything in that setup that can fail
1472 2010-11-20 16:59:16 <brocktice> ;;bc,stats
1473 2010-11-20 16:59:18 <wumpus> is AMD/ATI any good on linux these days?
1474 2010-11-20 16:59:18 <gribble> Current Blocks: 93002 | Current Difficulty: 6866.89864897 | Next Difficulty At Block: 94752 | Next Difficulty In: 1750 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 5 days, 15 hours, 10 minutes, and 29 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 6606.23683238
1475 2010-11-20 16:59:28 <Diablo-D3> wumpus: you should only be using AMD.
1476 2010-11-20 16:59:31 <Diablo-D3> nvidia is shit.
1477 2010-11-20 16:59:37 <brocktice> wtf is up with the block rate?
1478 2010-11-20 16:59:44 <xelister> well radeon card is superior
1479 2010-11-20 16:59:49 <Diablo-D3> xelister: that'd work under m0's, you'd just have to run a m0 for each device
1480 2010-11-20 16:59:53 <xelister> but its driver can be better. on both windows and linu
1481 2010-11-20 17:00:03 <Diablo-D3> nvidia's driver can be MUCH better
1482 2010-11-20 17:00:14 <Diablo-D3> nvidia still cant do 2.1
1483 2010-11-20 17:00:15 <Diablo-D3> so fuck them
1484 2010-11-20 17:00:15 <xelister> yeah ATI always release a bit crappy drivers
1485 2010-11-20 17:00:20 <Diablo-D3> amd drivers are fine
1486 2010-11-20 17:00:21 <wumpus> yea nvidia sucks for bitcoin mining it seems :') but I wonder if that is because the current miners are AMD optimized or some other reason
1487 2010-11-20 17:00:23 <xelister> since like 5 years
1488 2010-11-20 17:00:32 <xelister> wumpus: other reason
1489 2010-11-20 17:00:40 <Diablo-D3> wumpus: no, radeon 5xxx has far superior integer performance plus hardware ops for shifting
1490 2010-11-20 17:00:43 <xelister> wumpus: radeon card simply is x4 better for integer operations
1491 2010-11-20 17:00:45 <wumpus> nvidia was the first to offer cuda/opencl but seems they didn't keep the advantage
1492 2010-11-20 17:00:51 <Diablo-D3> closer to 5x per dollar/watt, xelister
1493 2010-11-20 17:01:01 <Diablo-D3> wumpus: nvidia didnt "offer" opencl
1494 2010-11-20 17:01:13 <Diablo-D3> they want to lock people into a single vendor using cuda
1495 2010-11-20 17:01:21 <xelister> yea
1496 2010-11-20 17:01:22 <wumpus> well ati had the same shit
1497 2010-11-20 17:01:23 <Diablo-D3> so they purposely fuck their opencl impl up
1498 2010-11-20 17:01:24 <wumpus> with their stream api
1499 2010-11-20 17:01:28 <Diablo-D3> wumpus: no
1500 2010-11-20 17:01:29 <xelister> although ati would do same.. yea as wumpus said
1501 2010-11-20 17:01:34 <Diablo-D3> they discontinued CTM when opencl came out
1502 2010-11-20 17:01:36 <wumpus> but now we have opencl
1503 2010-11-20 17:01:38 <wumpus> thanks to apple
1504 2010-11-20 17:01:39 <wumpus> :D
1505 2010-11-20 17:01:41 <brocktice> is the tx flood still going on?
1506 2010-11-20 17:01:45 <Diablo-D3> s/apple/khronos/
1507 2010-11-20 17:01:48 <xelister> thanks to apple? now thats unexpected
1508 2010-11-20 17:01:55 <wumpus> khronos is mainly apple
1509 2010-11-20 17:01:55 <Diablo-D3> apple didnt invent opencl
1510 2010-11-20 17:02:01 <wumpus> apple is the big pusher
1511 2010-11-20 17:02:03 <wumpus> for opengl, opencl
1512 2010-11-20 17:02:08 <Diablo-D3> apple is a member of what used to be known as the opengl steering board
1513 2010-11-20 17:02:16 <Diablo-D3> so was nvidia and ati, and amd before they bought ati
1514 2010-11-20 17:02:17 <wumpus> I don't like them any more then you do, but you have to give them that
1515 2010-11-20 17:02:17 <Diablo-D3> and intel
1516 2010-11-20 17:02:20 <wumpus> microsoft would kill opencl
1517 2010-11-20 17:02:21 <xelister> perhaps because of the need for 3d effects for theirs gay userbase :P
1518 2010-11-20 17:02:24 <Diablo-D3> and microsoft a LONG time ago
1519 2010-11-20 17:02:30 <wumpus> yes
1520 2010-11-20 17:02:33 <Diablo-D3> wumpus: microsoft tried to
1521 2010-11-20 17:02:38 <Diablo-D3> but opencompute is the same fucking shit
1522 2010-11-20 17:02:42 <wumpus> those 'gay' 3d effects are a big money maker
1523 2010-11-20 17:02:53 <xelister> yeah because users are gay
1524 2010-11-20 17:02:57 <Diablo-D3> opencompute == hlsl for gpgpu
1525 2010-11-20 17:03:03 <xelister> I bet big gay Al would use iPhone
1526 2010-11-20 17:03:05 <Diablo-D3> opencl == glsl for gpgpu
1527 2010-11-20 17:03:16 <xelister> whats hlsl
1528 2010-11-20 17:03:16 <Diablo-D3> in the end, it gets executed the same the same way.
1529 2010-11-20 17:03:26 <Diablo-D3> xelister: hlsl is d3d's glsl
1530 2010-11-20 17:03:27 <wumpus> yes but it's a closed, propetrary standard
1531 2010-11-20 17:03:31 <xelister> and glsl.. ?
1532 2010-11-20 17:03:36 <wumpus> 'open'compute is directx 11
1533 2010-11-20 17:03:38 <Diablo-D3> xelister: are you fucking kidding me?
1534 2010-11-20 17:03:46 <xelister> do I look like a wikipedia
1535 2010-11-20 17:03:59 <xelister> shading language
1536 2010-11-20 17:04:00 <xelister> ok
1537 2010-11-20 17:04:01 <Diablo-D3> gl shading language
1538 2010-11-20 17:04:07 <wumpus> at least apple pushes standards that can be implemented on every OS
1539 2010-11-20 17:04:16 <brocktice> avg block rate is below 5/hour
1540 2010-11-20 17:04:17 <wumpus> or, rather, are allowed to be implemented on every OS
1541 2010-11-20 17:04:28 <xelister> brocktice: why?
1542 2010-11-20 17:04:50 <brocktice> tx flooding?
1543 2010-11-20 17:05:32 <Diablo-D3> wumpus: osx doenst do 1.1 yet
1544 2010-11-20 17:07:03 <Diablo-D3> but yeah
1545 2010-11-20 17:07:04 <Diablo-D3> whatever
1546 2010-11-20 17:07:09 <wumpus> hm ok
1547 2010-11-20 17:07:14 <wumpus> I don't have a mac myself I wouldn't know
1548 2010-11-20 17:07:18 <Diablo-D3> Im tired of looking at my miner
1549 2010-11-20 17:07:24 <Diablo-D3> I worked on it for most of the day
1550 2010-11-20 17:07:45 <wumpus> heh
1551 2010-11-20 17:08:26 <Diablo-D3> its simply not going to get any faster than thos
1552 2010-11-20 17:09:13 <brocktice> btw cypress and juniper are 5xxx names
1553 2010-11-20 17:09:39 <Diablo-D3> I dont think Im going to autodetect that
1554 2010-11-20 17:09:39 <xelister> I should buy a cypress card and mount it on mainboard codename hill
1555 2010-11-20 17:09:55 <Diablo-D3> just provide a flag for it
1556 2010-11-20 17:09:57 anomnom has joined
1557 2010-11-20 17:09:58 <xelister> brocktice: I will perhaps implement that
1558 2010-11-20 17:09:59 <brocktice> k
1559 2010-11-20 17:10:29 <Diablo-D3> --force-radeon-5000-hw-shift or something
1560 2010-11-20 17:10:32 <brocktice> xelister check out my version of m0's
1561 2010-11-20 17:10:44 <xelister> brocktice: well, first, m0's hangs for me
1562 2010-11-20 17:10:47 <xelister> brocktice: what os you use?
1563 2010-11-20 17:10:51 <xelister> anyone here mines on 10.10 ?
1564 2010-11-20 17:10:54 <brocktice> linux
1565 2010-11-20 17:10:57 <xelister> anyone here mines on ubuntu 10.10 ?
1566 2010-11-20 17:10:57 <brocktice> yep
1567 2010-11-20 17:11:01 <xelister> oh
1568 2010-11-20 17:11:01 <brocktice> no
1569 2010-11-20 17:11:12 <xelister> what linux?
1570 2010-11-20 17:11:14 <brocktice> 10.04
1571 2010-11-20 17:11:17 <brocktice> server
1572 2010-11-20 17:11:27 <xelister> do you use gfx while mining?
1573 2010-11-20 17:11:37 <brocktice> just x running
1574 2010-11-20 17:11:45 <brocktice> don't use it though
1575 2010-11-20 17:11:49 <xelister> now, the m0's hang when I do stuff in X, the more stuff the faster it hangs. i.e. movie==hand in 1 minute or so
1576 2010-11-20 17:11:52 <brocktice> dedicated box
1577 2010-11-20 17:12:01 <xelister> doing nothing and normal desktop turend on == hour or so
1578 2010-11-20 17:12:04 <brocktice> heat?
1579 2010-11-20 17:12:07 <xelister> no
1580 2010-11-20 17:12:25 <xelister> it was not heaving this problems like 2 days ago before I restarted after ubutnu upgrade
1581 2010-11-20 17:12:35 <xelister> hm. perhasp I should rebuild/install soemthing after libc/kernel changes
1582 2010-11-20 17:13:13 <wumpus> xelister: yes
1583 2010-11-20 17:13:30 <xelister> ok but what
1584 2010-11-20 17:13:33 * xelister scrathes head
1585 2010-11-20 17:13:40 <wumpus> I've just upgraded to 10.10 and the miner still works
1586 2010-11-20 17:13:42 <xelister> I build bitcoind but that should be the problem
1587 2010-11-20 17:14:03 <xelister> wumpus: can you try running an mplayer with a movie (so the window is visible) and wait like 10 minutes
1588 2010-11-20 17:14:16 <wumpus> but yeah the gpu miner also crashes my system
1589 2010-11-20 17:14:18 <xelister> what exact cmd line you use to miner btw? what bitcoind revision?
1590 2010-11-20 17:14:26 <wumpus> must be an nvidia bug or the stuff is overheating :P
1591 2010-11-20 17:14:27 <xelister> lol. crashes? now that is terrible
1592 2010-11-20 17:14:31 <brocktice> which catalyst
1593 2010-11-20 17:14:38 <xelister> brocktice: how to check?
1594 2010-11-20 17:14:53 <brocktice> hm not sure
1595 2010-11-20 17:15:01 <wumpus> xelister: no problem with mplayer though
1596 2010-11-20 17:15:06 <wumpus> playing movies etc works fine
1597 2010-11-20 17:15:12 <Kiba> hmm
1598 2010-11-20 17:15:15 <brocktice> did you use ubuntu's fglrx?
1599 2010-11-20 17:15:16 <xelister> I got fglrx from ubuntu, and got latest Stream SDK from ait page
1600 2010-11-20 17:15:20 <Kiba> it seem that I am becoming known as the "bounty guy"
1601 2010-11-20 17:15:25 <wumpus> no, I use the nvidia driver from the nvidia site
1602 2010-11-20 17:15:33 <brocktice> don't use 2.2 sdk
1603 2010-11-20 17:15:40 <xelister> brocktice: why? and how to check
1604 2010-11-20 17:15:51 <xelister> yeah, it is 2.2
1605 2010-11-20 17:15:54 <brocktice> use 2.r
1606 2010-11-20 17:15:57 <brocktice> .1
1607 2010-11-20 17:16:00 <xelister> why
1608 2010-11-20 17:16:01 <Diablo-D3> use 2.1
1609 2010-11-20 17:16:04 <xelister> whyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy
1610 2010-11-20 17:16:07 <brocktice> sorry, on phone
1611 2010-11-20 17:16:09 <Diablo-D3> 0 cpu usage, much faster
1612 2010-11-20 17:16:13 <xelister> 1000 BTC to brocktice if he responses in 3
1613 2010-11-20 17:16:15 <xelister> 2
1614 2010-11-20 17:16:16 <xelister> 1
1615 2010-11-20 17:16:18 <xelister> ok, no then no
1616 2010-11-20 17:16:21 <Kiba> GAME OVER
1617 2010-11-20 17:16:22 <xelister> <_<
1618 2010-11-20 17:16:22 <Diablo-D3> xelister: give me the 1000 btc instead
1619 2010-11-20 17:16:24 <brocktice> lol
1620 2010-11-20 17:16:33 <xelister> I BET YOU ARE HAPPY WITH YOUR PHONE CALL NOW
1621 2010-11-20 17:16:35 <xelister> lol
1622 2010-11-20 17:16:52 <xelister> Diablo-D3: ok
1623 2010-11-20 17:16:54 <brocktice> no, typing ob phone
1624 2010-11-20 17:16:56 <brocktice> on
1625 2010-11-20 17:17:14 <xelister> Diablo-D3: yeah, wtf it is with 2.2 using 100% of 1 cpu core when mining (m0m)
1626 2010-11-20 17:17:21 <Diablo-D3> oh its worse on mine
1627 2010-11-20 17:17:25 <Diablo-D3> I can exceed 100%
1628 2010-11-20 17:17:26 <xelister> ...
1629 2010-11-20 17:17:28 <xelister> wtf
1630 2010-11-20 17:17:30 <wumpus> xelister: I used to have that problem with the old nvidia driver
1631 2010-11-20 17:17:35 <Diablo-D3> 2.2 is that fucked up
1632 2010-11-20 17:17:35 <wumpus> seems it busy waits for the GPU
1633 2010-11-20 17:17:39 <xelister> xelister: but in 2.1 its 0?
1634 2010-11-20 17:17:43 <Diablo-D3> 2.1 I get 1% java 0% X
1635 2010-11-20 17:17:51 <wumpus> with the new driver CPU usage is more like 2%
1636 2010-11-20 17:17:52 <Diablo-D3> 2.2 I get, eh, about 85% java 25% X
1637 2010-11-20 17:18:07 <Diablo-D3> 2.1 I get 75 mhahs, 2.2 I get around 68
1638 2010-11-20 17:18:08 <wumpus> seems that for ATI it's the other way around :P
1639 2010-11-20 17:18:32 <Diablo-D3> xelister: 1Pdsx1DJdxZxFxGJLmcjrZvpDFTvh2fYMP
1640 2010-11-20 17:18:49 <wumpus> nvidia used to recommend 1 CPU per GPU, just so that it could busy wait and take 100% :P luckily they're come back from that and use sensible interrupt-driven wakeup now
1641 2010-11-20 17:19:34 genjix has joined
1642 2010-11-20 17:20:27 anarchyx has quit ()
1643 2010-11-20 17:23:32 hippich_ has joined
1644 2010-11-20 17:27:20 <xelister> so the drivers can wait for GPU - this is a /bug/ with nvidia, and on radeon with SDK 2.2, but older SDK 2.1 does not have this problem?
1645 2010-11-20 17:27:24 FreeMoneyq has quit (Quit: Page closed)
1646 2010-11-20 17:27:52 <Diablo-D3> nvidia sucks, who cares
1647 2010-11-20 17:28:26 <xelister> and did I described it right for the radeon
1648 2010-11-20 17:29:06 <Diablo-D3> xelister: if you said "2.1 is superior" then yes, you'd be right
1649 2010-11-20 17:29:27 <xelister> ok
1650 2010-11-20 17:39:15 altamic has joined
1651 2010-11-20 17:40:42 <xelister> Diablo-D3: so would you say, that now your miner works easly on linux with both ati/nv, and on windows with both ati/nv? Any known problems or pitfalls other that changing the lines in .cl for 5xxx to have optimal speed?
1652 2010-11-20 17:40:56 <djoot> Kiba: you should tell that acrylicist guy that there is no moving the decimal point, if someone wants to call their coins mBTC just means they will have to send 1000 mBTC for every BTC.....
1653 2010-11-20 17:58:34 anarchy has joined
1654 2010-11-20 17:59:32 <anarchy> ;;bc,stats
1655 2010-11-20 17:59:34 <gribble> Current Blocks: 93006 | Current Difficulty: 6866.89864897 | Next Difficulty At Block: 94752 | Next Difficulty In: 1746 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 5 days, 15 hours, 47 minutes, and 58 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 6577.58212170
1656 2010-11-20 17:59:48 <anarchy> lower estimate? :)
1657 2010-11-20 18:07:29 <xelister> Diablo-D3: what is license of your miner? Same as bitcoind, so MIT?
1658 2010-11-20 18:07:40 rlifchitz has joined
1659 2010-11-20 18:07:40 rlifchitz has quit (Changing host)
1660 2010-11-20 18:07:40 rlifchitz has joined
1661 2010-11-20 18:08:35 hippich_ has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
1662 2010-11-20 18:11:31 hippich_ has joined
1663 2010-11-20 18:13:36 <Diablo-D3> xelister: gplv3
1664 2010-11-20 18:13:54 <Diablo-D3> xelister: the only pitfalls of changing the lines is you have to
1665 2010-11-20 18:14:10 <Diablo-D3> xelister: at least until I add the code to do it saner
1666 2010-11-20 18:14:30 <Diablo-D3> xelister: and my miner, theoretically, works basically anywhere
1667 2010-11-20 18:16:31 <xelister> Diablo-D3: gplv3? What is required if I want to modify it a bit and then distribute (payable)
1668 2010-11-20 18:17:16 <xelister> actually it would be really good if it would be NOT required to publish the source - I mean, I can publish my triviall modifications if you want, but I would rather not distribute the sources /with/ the binary file
1669 2010-11-20 18:17:28 <xelister> for security reasons etc (say a hidden key in code)
1670 2010-11-20 18:18:06 <Diablo-D3> xelister: distribute is defined as "to other people"
1671 2010-11-20 18:18:15 <Diablo-D3> no one gives a shit what you do locally
1672 2010-11-20 18:18:20 <xelister> it is to other people
1673 2010-11-20 18:18:44 <Diablo-D3> btw, you dont have to distribute the sources WITH the binary, just make them generally available
1674 2010-11-20 18:18:56 <xelister> so say someoen buys such miner for like 1 USD from me, what I am required to do? Put there LICENSE.txt or something? must the souce file be right there too?
1675 2010-11-20 18:19:13 <xelister> ah ok. so like make a github project or something
1676 2010-11-20 18:19:14 <Diablo-D3> xelister: you need to keep the license and the copyright notification
1677 2010-11-20 18:19:25 <Diablo-D3> you dont even need a github _project_
1678 2010-11-20 18:19:30 <Diablo-D3> just tell github to fork my repo
1679 2010-11-20 18:19:35 <Diablo-D3> and then I can just pull your changes back
1680 2010-11-20 18:19:42 <xelister> mhm sounds ok
1681 2010-11-20 18:19:58 <xelister> you know svn too, Diablo-D3?
1682 2010-11-20 18:20:02 <Diablo-D3> I hate svn.
1683 2010-11-20 18:20:18 <Diablo-D3> its the first time in history I have found a gold plated turd
1684 2010-11-20 18:20:23 <Diablo-D3> (where the turd in question is cvs)
1685 2010-11-20 18:20:25 <xelister> what is the equivalent, in git, of: svn up; svn st; svn log -l 3; svn ci -m "foo" file1 file2
1686 2010-11-20 18:21:06 <xelister> nah subversion is rather fine. Its not as 100% pro as git, but does shit done. And if you have centralized development nodel, then revision numbering is actually good/better
1687 2010-11-20 18:21:09 <Diablo-D3> what is st and ci?
1688 2010-11-20 18:21:13 <xelister> status
1689 2010-11-20 18:21:15 <xelister> commit
1690 2010-11-20 18:21:31 <Diablo-D3> git pull, git status, git log, git commit -a
1691 2010-11-20 18:21:32 <Diablo-D3> give or take
1692 2010-11-20 18:21:32 <xelister> status - list what files are changed and are about to be send to repo
1693 2010-11-20 18:21:41 <Diablo-D3> no
1694 2010-11-20 18:21:46 <davex__> how is svn revision numbering better
1695 2010-11-20 18:21:50 <davex__> git has it too
1696 2010-11-20 18:22:02 <Diablo-D3> git pull, git log, git commit -a, git status, git push
1697 2010-11-20 18:22:04 <xelister> davex__: well I want to have simply revision 1 then 2 then 3...
1698 2010-11-20 18:22:10 <xelister> not Db589DcFaed2jgqejrge
1699 2010-11-20 18:22:18 <xelister> (yeah, I know its hex)
1700 2010-11-20 18:22:24 <davex__> not sure about git, but mercurial does that at least
1701 2010-11-20 18:22:35 <davex__> thought they were basically the same thing
1702 2010-11-20 18:22:37 <Diablo-D3> its a signature
1703 2010-11-20 18:22:44 <xelister> because whatn I call an user
1704 2010-11-20 18:22:47 <Diablo-D3> you cant do single incrementing revisions
1705 2010-11-20 18:22:51 <davex__> oh
1706 2010-11-20 18:22:54 <xelister> - what version you have exactly? - rev5211
1707 2010-11-20 18:23:09 <Diablo-D3> xelister: "the one an hour ago"
1708 2010-11-20 18:23:28 <xelister> - what version you have exactly? - CD0f..uh..3851C..hmm..Ezj ? -sir? that is not possible... -wtf fuck you geeks *rage disconnect*
1709 2010-11-20 18:23:29 AAA_awright_ has joined
1710 2010-11-20 18:23:41 <Diablo-D3> xelister: uh no
1711 2010-11-20 18:23:46 <Diablo-D3> why are users getting access to the repo?
1712 2010-11-20 18:24:08 <xelister> - sir, what git hub version you checked out? - WHAT? wtf is git pub? I ain't going to no pub's mister! and Im not CHECKING OUT any ladies, who told you this lies, my wife? RAGE QUIT
1713 2010-11-20 18:24:22 <xelister> Diablo-D3: repeat after me: AIMED AT NORMAL USERS - not at fucking geeks like us ;)
1714 2010-11-20 18:24:22 * Diablo-D3 helps xel do drugs
1715 2010-11-20 18:24:49 <xelister> above is what normal user will react to stupid technical questions about some git and other shit he has /no/ idea it exists
1716 2010-11-20 18:25:08 <xelister> which is why I prefer simply printing a numerical revision number
1717 2010-11-20 18:25:10 <Diablo-D3> xelister: git is _not_ aimed at users
1718 2010-11-20 18:25:13 <Diablo-D3> period
1719 2010-11-20 18:25:20 <Diablo-D3> users shouldnt even know what source code is
1720 2010-11-20 18:25:26 <xelister> meh.. so I can just tag / name each version like "version 67" etc
1721 2010-11-20 18:25:35 <Diablo-D3> and no
1722 2010-11-20 18:25:37 <Diablo-D3> if someone asks me
1723 2010-11-20 18:25:38 <Diablo-D3> I can say
1724 2010-11-20 18:25:39 <davex__> wait... can't you just go git checkout [<rev>]
1725 2010-11-20 18:25:39 <xelister> still somehow this feature of svn is fine imho
1726 2010-11-20 18:25:41 <Diablo-D3> "HEAD"
1727 2010-11-20 18:25:41 AAA_awright has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
1728 2010-11-20 18:25:49 <Diablo-D3> davex__: yes, but git has long strings
1729 2010-11-20 18:25:58 <xelister> Diablo-D3: it doesnt work that way for finding bugs
1730 2010-11-20 18:26:11 <Diablo-D3> xelister: I can copy pasta the rev number
1731 2010-11-20 18:26:17 <xelister> - what revision in you found the bug 2 weeks ago? - HEAD - head of what, when? when you builded it exactly? -huhuhu
1732 2010-11-20 18:26:21 <davex__> hmm. yeah i don't like that either.
1733 2010-11-20 18:26:37 <davex__> HG > Git
1734 2010-11-20 18:26:46 <davex__> > svn
1735 2010-11-20 18:26:54 <wumpus> git has long random strings because it is the only unique identifier method that works well with distributed systems
1736 2010-11-20 18:27:01 <xelister> yeah I know
1737 2010-11-20 18:27:03 <Diablo-D3> davex__: no
1738 2010-11-20 18:27:06 <Diablo-D3> hg isnt better than git
1739 2010-11-20 18:27:09 <Diablo-D3> nor is get better than hg
1740 2010-11-20 18:27:11 <Diablo-D3> they tie
1741 2010-11-20 18:27:17 <wumpus> yeah hg and git are mostly the same
1742 2010-11-20 18:27:17 <xelister> but Im heaving a centralized model here
1743 2010-11-20 18:27:18 <Diablo-D3> wumpus: it applies to hg as well, btw
1744 2010-11-20 18:27:26 <Diablo-D3> xelister: centralized sucks
1745 2010-11-20 18:27:30 <Diablo-D3> xelister: quit living in the 90s
1746 2010-11-20 18:27:30 <xelister> why?
1747 2010-11-20 18:27:40 <wumpus> never found a reason why hg/git would be better, though I like that hg is python based
1748 2010-11-20 18:27:51 <wumpus> but that's just personal nonsense :)
1749 2010-11-20 18:27:53 <Diablo-D3> xelister: because, for one, I dont accept patches.
1750 2010-11-20 18:27:54 <xelister> it's one program, developed by 1 or 2 people, sold to few people
1751 2010-11-20 18:28:06 <Diablo-D3> xelister: and why are you trying to sell my miner, anyhow?
1752 2010-11-20 18:28:06 <xelister> not next version of kernel
1753 2010-11-20 18:28:14 <xelister> because I can? :)
1754 2010-11-20 18:28:20 <Diablo-D3> to who, though?
1755 2010-11-20 18:28:38 <xelister> actually it will be sold for symbolical price, for some legal purposes
1756 2010-11-20 18:28:41 <xelister> probably
1757 2010-11-20 18:28:45 <wumpus> centralized is fine if you have a strict organisation, otherwise it is a dangerous single point of failure
1758 2010-11-20 18:28:58 <Diablo-D3> xelister: now you're not making sense
1759 2010-11-20 18:29:13 <Diablo-D3> xelister: the GPLv3 doesn't require me to sell my software to people for the license to apply to them
1760 2010-11-20 18:29:24 LobsterMan has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1761 2010-11-20 18:29:30 <xelister> yeah but something else requires software to be actually sold
1762 2010-11-20 18:29:34 <wumpus> I don't even use centralized version management systems for personal projects anymore
1763 2010-11-20 18:29:35 <xelister> at least here in poland
1764 2010-11-20 18:29:38 <Kiba> always believe that your organizations is run by devils
1765 2010-11-20 18:29:49 <wumpus> at least if one of my servers fails I have copies of the repos everywhere
1766 2010-11-20 18:29:50 <Diablo-D3> xelister: poland does not conflict with the GPL
1767 2010-11-20 18:29:50 <xelister> if it works out I will tell the stroy ;)
1768 2010-11-20 18:30:01 <Diablo-D3> xelister: if it works out, I want a share of the profits >_>
1769 2010-11-20 18:30:23 LobsterMan has joined
1770 2010-11-20 18:30:24 LobsterMan has quit (Changing host)
1771 2010-11-20 18:30:24 LobsterMan has joined
1772 2010-11-20 18:30:44 <xelister> LobsterMan: btw you where decloaked before reconnect, you know?
1773 2010-11-20 18:30:54 <xelister> --> LobsterMan has joined this channel (~lol@pool-98-114-48-51.phlapa.fios.verizon.net) --> LobsterMan has joined this channel (~lol@unaffiliated/lobsterman).
1774 2010-11-20 18:31:02 <wumpus> weird
1775 2010-11-20 18:31:03 <Diablo-D3> thats normal
1776 2010-11-20 18:31:08 <Diablo-D3> he didnt part and join
1777 2010-11-20 18:31:20 <Diablo-D3> the ircd does that automatically on hostmask change to force client updates
1778 2010-11-20 18:31:20 <xelister> hm? thats like, taking away the sense of cloaks to not show IP
1779 2010-11-20 18:31:23 <wumpus> he logged out his nickserv account and logged in?
1780 2010-11-20 18:31:23 <Diablo-D3> to him, he saw nothing
1781 2010-11-20 18:31:32 <Diablo-D3> no, he joined before nickserv applied the hostmask
1782 2010-11-20 18:31:38 <xelister> so what is the point of cloaks if /we/ seen it
1783 2010-11-20 18:31:47 <wumpus> right, he just got his cloak
1784 2010-11-20 18:31:50 <Diablo-D3> xelister: cloaks have no point
1785 2010-11-20 18:31:57 <davex__> ok, time for a long drive with mises audio on the ipod. any recommendations?
1786 2010-11-20 18:32:08 <xelister> Diablo-D3: they probably do on servers with SSL, including afaik irc.oftc.net
1787 2010-11-20 18:32:28 <wumpus> this server has SSL
1788 2010-11-20 18:32:29 <xelister> davex__: get a hooker (before, NOT on the road)
1789 2010-11-20 18:32:45 <xelister> bonus if she can sign and or accept btc
1790 2010-11-20 18:32:55 <wumpus> which is pretty cool, I didn't know that until a few days ago
1791 2010-11-20 18:32:56 <davex__> a hooker that can recite mises audio?
1792 2010-11-20 18:34:03 <xelister> actually SSL is often bullshit due to stupid implementations that allow rogue CA's or just do not check cert at all (like some retarded pin-token thing - there was in slashdot)
1793 2010-11-20 18:35:01 <wumpus> yeah, it can certainly be cracked, especially by big agencies and governments which control the root CAs, but it's surely better than plaintext
1794 2010-11-20 18:35:32 <Diablo-D3> xelister: well, no, if you have the ircd activate your cloak on connect instead of on ns ident, then it works
1795 2010-11-20 18:35:39 <OneFixt> ;;bc,stats
1796 2010-11-20 18:35:42 <Diablo-D3> on freenode, though, cloaks are just a dick size thing
1797 2010-11-20 18:35:43 <gribble> Current Blocks: 93012 | Current Difficulty: 6866.89864897 | Next Difficulty At Block: 94752 | Next Difficulty In: 1740 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 5 days, 12 hours, 53 minutes, and 35 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 6618.29448257
1798 2010-11-20 18:35:50 <LobsterMan> xelister i think i dropped
1799 2010-11-20 18:35:53 <wumpus> it at least makes it impossible for idiots with tcpdump/wireshark to listen in
1800 2010-11-20 18:36:01 <LobsterMan> i guess it didn't re-ident me right away
1801 2010-11-20 18:36:11 <LobsterMan> don't call the cops cause i'm using bitcoin plz :P
1802 2010-11-20 18:37:04 <wumpus> just send your bitcoins to me and your problem is gone :P
1803 2010-11-20 18:43:01 <tcatm> mhm any idea how i could handle identical trades from mtgox? (i.e. same timestamp, same price, same volume)
1804 2010-11-20 18:43:21 <Diablo-D3> alright Im going to bed
1805 2010-11-20 18:43:42 <Diablo-D3> tcatm: easy, use that information to assign a unique cryptographic checksum
1806 2010-11-20 18:43:55 <Diablo-D3> and then reject entries that contain the same
1807 2010-11-20 18:43:58 <Diablo-D3> night all
1808 2010-11-20 18:44:35 <ArtForz> hey
1809 2010-11-20 18:44:49 <ArtForz> tcatm: wheres the problem with that?
1810 2010-11-20 18:45:56 <tcatm> deciding whether it's a new trade or if it's already in the database
1811 2010-11-20 18:46:15 <ArtForz> you use getTrades or something else?
1812 2010-11-20 18:46:21 <tcatm> getTrades.php
1813 2010-11-20 18:46:54 <ArtForz> yeah, (date + price + amount) isnt enough info to uniquely identify a trade
1814 2010-11-20 18:46:59 <tcatm> basically I do a SELECT WHERE timestamp, price, volume and if it returns nothing I add a new trade
1815 2010-11-20 18:47:10 <xelister> isnt there like, an ID of the trade?
1816 2010-11-20 18:47:24 <ArtForz> there probably is, but getTrades doesnt show it
1817 2010-11-20 18:47:34 <xelister> wow price went up
1818 2010-11-20 18:47:37 <xelister> going for 0.3 ?
1819 2010-11-20 18:47:59 <xelister> perhaps 0.4 is the next long term step? :)
1820 2010-11-20 18:48:19 Diablo-D3 has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
1821 2010-11-20 18:48:41 <ArtForz> theres still ~20k of asks in the 0.29-0.3 range, might take a while to clear those
1822 2010-11-20 18:48:59 <ArtForz> but yeah, I agree long term trend is up
1823 2010-11-20 18:49:27 <xelister> so some people want to buy around 20.000 BTCs @ 0.29-0.30 usd/btc?
1824 2010-11-20 18:49:55 <ArtForz> sell btc
1825 2010-11-20 18:50:17 <xelister> at what URL can we see this information?
1826 2010-11-20 18:50:52 <ArtForz> https://mtgox.com/trade/history depth of market, check the depth table
1827 2010-11-20 18:51:42 <xelister> neat
1828 2010-11-20 18:52:03 <xelister> wow 200.000 trade
1829 2010-11-20 18:52:06 <xelister> was that you, ArtForz ;)
1830 2010-11-20 18:52:13 <ArtForz> it's a decimal point
1831 2010-11-20 18:52:21 <xelister> 200,000
1832 2010-11-20 18:52:32 <tcatm> should I just ignore identical trades?
1833 2010-11-20 18:52:34 <xelister> so the graph does not show was it volume of sells or of buys?
1834 2010-11-20 18:53:02 <ArtForz> tcatm: no
1835 2010-11-20 18:53:22 <ArtForz> lets say you have 2 asks, each 10BTC @ 0.1
1836 2010-11-20 18:53:29 <ArtForz> then a bid for 20BTC @ 0.1 comes along
1837 2010-11-20 18:53:55 <ArtForz> and you get 2 trades, with (10btc, 0.1, identical timestamp)
1838 2010-11-20 18:54:10 <tcatm> ah i see
1839 2010-11-20 18:54:33 <ArtForz> crazy idea:
1840 2010-11-20 18:54:36 <tcatm> okay, how do i figure that out by just comparing getTrades with the db?
1841 2010-11-20 18:54:53 <xelister> is the author of mtgox.com here? perhaps he could just include the ID field in getTrade
1842 2010-11-20 18:55:00 <ArtForz> timestamp in getTrades to figure out where to start
1843 2010-11-20 18:55:08 <tcatm> and delete all newer trades?
1844 2010-11-20 18:55:14 <ArtForz> no
1845 2010-11-20 18:55:28 <ArtForz> basically you call gettrades, you get a bunch of trades with increasing timestamps
1846 2010-11-20 18:56:13 <ArtForz> you fetch the newest timestamp you have in DB
1847 2010-11-20 18:56:38 <ArtForz> everything before that is by definition old data which you should already have
1848 2010-11-20 18:57:18 <tcatm> and then add all newer trades
1849 2010-11-20 18:57:37 <ArtForz> and possibly add more trades at the same timestamp
1850 2010-11-20 18:57:58 <tcatm> then i'd have the same problem at that timestamp again
1851 2010-11-20 18:58:08 <ArtForz> if you have 5 trades @ 123434233 in DB and mtgox shows 7, you're missing 2
1852 2010-11-20 18:58:45 <ArtForz> so either do a update/insert or remove those in db and readd from the new gettrades call
1853 2010-11-20 18:59:44 <ArtForz> you have to ask mtgox if gettrades is atomic
1854 2010-11-20 18:59:53 <tcatm> so i could DELETE WHERE timestamp = latest; for t in trades do addTrade() done
1855 2010-11-20 18:59:58 <ArtForz> = if it shows one trade @ timestamp X, it shows all trades @ timestamp X
1856 2010-11-20 19:00:10 <ArtForz> pretty much, yeah
1857 2010-11-20 19:00:13 hippich_ has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
1858 2010-11-20 19:00:47 <tcatm> i assume getTrades does something like WHERE timestamp >= now - 2*86400 as the number of trades varies
1859 2010-11-20 19:00:51 <ArtForz> it should work fine as long as you call gettrades often enough to still have a known Tx in it
1860 2010-11-20 19:01:00 <ArtForz> probably
1861 2010-11-20 19:01:23 <xelister> HOLLY DUCK
1862 2010-11-20 19:01:30 <tcatm> i hope i can ask him to ping bitcoincharts at every new trade (so i don't have to poll every few minutes)
1863 2010-11-20 19:01:32 <xelister> fufme devices are befcoming reality? lol. http://www.gizmag.com/realtouch-virtual-sex-device-for-men/14126/picture/110570/
1864 2010-11-20 19:01:43 davex__ has quit (Quit: Ex-Chat)
1865 2010-11-20 19:01:45 <ArtForz> the question is, can you call gettrades twice, and get lets say 1 trade at TS X in #1 and that one + 1 more at the same TS in call #2 ?
1866 2010-11-20 19:03:18 <tcatm> would be quite unlikely as long as i call less often than once a second
1867 2010-11-20 19:03:47 <ArtForz> it'd still be possible
1868 2010-11-20 19:04:21 <ArtForz> imagine trade #1 coming in at x.0 s, you call gettrades at x.3 s, trade #2 coming in at x.7 s
1869 2010-11-20 19:05:16 <tcatm> mhm
1870 2010-11-20 19:05:49 <tcatm> in that case i might never know of trade #2
1871 2010-11-20 19:06:02 <ArtForz> thats why I added the "assume there might've been trades at your DB tsLatest added"
1872 2010-11-20 19:07:13 <ArtForz> = delete/reinsert those
1873 2010-11-20 19:07:42 jrabbit has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
1874 2010-11-20 19:07:51 <ArtForz> as long as you call gettrades at least once every 2 days it should work
1875 2010-11-20 19:08:24 <tcatm> mhm will it work for bcm, too?
1876 2010-11-20 19:08:36 <ArtForz> bcm has unique tradeIDs, no?
1877 2010-11-20 19:08:51 <tcatm> yes, but i'm not sure i want them in my db
1878 2010-11-20 19:09:30 <tcatm> though for bcm i could probably delete all old entries and re-import everything
1879 2010-11-20 19:10:01 <brocktice> Art, you getting coins?
1880 2010-11-20 19:10:07 <brocktice> I got one in the middle of the night, but the average is way way down
1881 2010-11-20 19:10:16 <brocktice> (for the whole network)
1882 2010-11-20 19:10:39 <xelister> how fast should the network re-adjust?
1883 2010-11-20 19:10:47 <xelister> to keep 1 block / 10 minutes
1884 2010-11-20 19:11:30 <brocktice> xelister: everyo 2016 blocks
1885 2010-11-20 19:11:33 <brocktice> *every
1886 2010-11-20 19:11:41 <brocktice> or is it 2018?
1887 2010-11-20 19:12:00 <brocktice> 2016
1888 2010-11-20 19:12:45 <ArtForz> yes
1889 2010-11-20 19:12:56 <ArtForz> I'm a bit below avg, but not much
1890 2010-11-20 19:14:18 <brocktice> looks like tx spamming is over too?
1891 2010-11-20 19:14:24 <brocktice> not seeing much in BBE
1892 2010-11-20 19:14:44 <ArtForz> not seeing anything in my client either
1893 2010-11-20 19:14:52 <brocktice> hm
1894 2010-11-20 19:16:09 <brocktice> ArtForz: It's possible to have all gpus in the xorg.conf without actually using all of them for the X desktop, right?
1895 2010-11-20 19:16:18 <brocktice> Seems to be the case now but I don't really use that desktop for anything
1896 2010-11-20 19:16:27 <ArtForz> I think so, but not sure
1897 2010-11-20 19:16:32 <brocktice> k
1898 2010-11-20 19:16:45 <brocktice> I'm thinking I may move that 5770 into my workstation once the eyefinity 5 gets here
1899 2010-11-20 19:16:58 <brocktice> it's not breathing well in the miner up against the back of a 5970
1900 2010-11-20 19:17:15 <brocktice> Kind of a dumb blower design IMO
1901 2010-11-20 19:17:18 <brocktice> on those cards
1902 2010-11-20 19:17:36 <brocktice> I guess it's probably quieter than a row of small high-rpm fans though, and cheaper
1903 2010-11-20 19:18:02 <ArtForz> yeah :/
1904 2010-11-20 19:18:25 hippich has joined
1905 2010-11-20 19:19:42 <brocktice> "Here, we'll design cards that are meant to be put together in sets of 2-4 in a single system"
1906 2010-11-20 19:19:55 <brocktice> "Yet, if they are put next to each other they can't pull in enough air"
1907 2010-11-20 19:20:09 <brocktice> brilliant
1908 2010-11-20 19:20:18 jrabbit has joined
1909 2010-11-20 19:20:21 <wumpus> yeah, welcome to the wonderful world of gpu computing :p
1910 2010-11-20 19:20:37 <ArtForz> I still wonder how the F they cooled FastraII
1911 2010-11-20 19:20:37 <wumpus> it's veeery fast, that is, until it crashes from overheating :p
1912 2010-11-20 19:20:53 <brocktice> FastraII?
1913 2010-11-20 19:20:58 * brocktice fgis
1914 2010-11-20 19:21:22 <ArtForz> http://fastra2.ua.ac.be/?page_id=38
1915 2010-11-20 19:21:37 <ArtForz> 6*GTX295 + GTX275
1916 2010-11-20 19:21:43 <brocktice> poorly from the looks of it
1917 2010-11-20 19:22:00 <brocktice> how did they *power* it?
1918 2010-11-20 19:22:04 <brocktice> I only see one PSU
1919 2010-11-20 19:22:09 <wumpus> probably it's very fast for the three minutes that it can consecutively run
1920 2010-11-20 19:22:11 <ArtForz> check the drive bays
1921 2010-11-20 19:22:16 <brocktice> or is that 2 server psus
1922 2010-11-20 19:22:24 <ArtForz> no, one normal PSU
1923 2010-11-20 19:22:33 <brocktice> hm, are those psus bolted in the drive bay?
1924 2010-11-20 19:22:37 <ArtForz> yep
1925 2010-11-20 19:22:38 <brocktice> they are strangely sized
1926 2010-11-20 19:22:42 * brocktice wants
1927 2010-11-20 19:22:49 <brocktice> not that I have any drive bays in my miner anymore :(
1928 2010-11-20 19:22:53 <ArtForz> 3 400W 5.25" sized PSUs
1929 2010-11-20 19:23:08 <brocktice> had to take them out for the radiator
1930 2010-11-20 19:25:01 <brocktice> "Although the system is up and running, we are still experiencing software stability issues, probably caused by an incompatibility between the video drivers "
1931 2010-11-20 19:25:05 <brocktice> uh, no
1932 2010-11-20 19:25:10 <brocktice> probably because your cards can't suck any air
1933 2010-11-20 19:25:23 <brocktice> Or am I missing something?
1934 2010-11-20 19:25:33 <ArtForz> no, you arent
1935 2010-11-20 19:25:35 <wumpus> yeah, of couurse, always blame the drivers
1936 2010-11-20 19:25:55 <brocktice> 12 tflops?
1937 2010-11-20 19:25:58 <wumpus> though it could be true, I mean, when have gpu drivers ever been stable
1938 2010-11-20 19:26:01 <brocktice> Isn't a 5970 like 4 on its own?
1939 2010-11-20 19:26:07 <brocktice> 4.3 or something, stock?
1940 2010-11-20 19:26:19 <ArtForz> 4.6
1941 2010-11-20 19:26:25 <brocktice> hahaha
1942 2010-11-20 19:26:41 <ArtForz> also check the cage they made in pic 4
1943 2010-11-20 19:26:50 <brocktice> when was it built? seems like a waste, then
1944 2010-11-20 19:26:58 <ArtForz> where the F are those cards supposed to pull air from?
1945 2010-11-20 19:27:15 <ArtForz> through those small slots in the front?
1946 2010-11-20 19:27:48 <ArtForz> but they actually *lay* on those metal flaps
1947 2010-11-20 19:28:20 <ArtForz> so unless they're of the magic kind, they have to pull air through the thin slit between cards, from top+bottom
1948 2010-11-20 19:28:32 <brocktice> well, the one on the bottom can get air for sure
1949 2010-11-20 19:28:40 <ArtForz> yeah
1950 2010-11-20 19:28:44 <brocktice> if they're already using pci-e extenders, why not space them out more?
1951 2010-11-20 19:28:48 <ArtForz> I fully expected them to put the 275 there ...
1952 2010-11-20 19:29:02 <ArtForz> yep
1953 2010-11-20 19:29:05 <brocktice> something tells me that they didn't realize their problem until after it was all built
1954 2010-11-20 19:29:14 <ArtForz> also dont forget those are *flexible* risers
1955 2010-11-20 19:29:14 <brocktice> and now they're not coming out and saying it
1956 2010-11-20 19:29:22 <brocktice> right exactly
1957 2010-11-20 19:29:27 <ArtForz> so you can arrange the cards somewhat radially
1958 2010-11-20 19:29:40 <brocktice> or, really, they have enough space
1959 2010-11-20 19:29:48 <brocktice> they could have just spread them over the whole case height
1960 2010-11-20 19:29:54 <brocktice> put the main PSU in front too
1961 2010-11-20 19:29:58 <brocktice> sideways
1962 2010-11-20 19:30:17 <brocktice> sawed out the back
1963 2010-11-20 19:30:22 <brocktice> and filled the front with a fuckload of fans
1964 2010-11-20 19:30:24 <ArtForz> I think they pretty much are up against the CPU fan with the top card
1965 2010-11-20 19:30:48 <brocktice> could have gone vertical up there
1966 2010-11-20 19:31:13 <ArtForz> those risers look like they have ~4" of cable
1967 2010-11-20 19:31:42 <brocktice> if you're going to go to all that trouble
1968 2010-11-20 19:31:45 <brocktice> get longer cables
1969 2010-11-20 19:31:55 <brocktice> presumably you could, at worst, daisy-chain them
1970 2010-11-20 19:32:14 <ArtForz> PCIe over cables = hard
1971 2010-11-20 19:32:31 <brocktice> hm
1972 2010-11-20 19:32:32 <ArtForz> most flexible 4" extenders fail at 2.0 speeds
1973 2010-11-20 19:32:57 <ArtForz> I found some that have a total height of ~5" (~4" cable) that seem to work at 2.0
1974 2010-11-20 19:33:27 <brocktice> ah
1975 2010-11-20 19:34:08 <ArtForz> wait... even a bit more
1976 2010-11-20 19:34:30 <ArtForz> total height increase is 147mm... nearly 6"
1977 2010-11-20 19:35:53 <ArtForz> cable is 110mm
1978 2010-11-20 19:37:24 <ArtForz> http://www.pc-adapter.net/products/499.html <- those SUCK
1979 2010-11-20 19:37:55 <ArtForz> http://pc-adapter.net/products/450.html <- those work even at 2.0 speeds
1980 2010-11-20 19:39:57 <ArtForz> and they're pretty cheap
1981 2010-11-20 19:41:30 <ArtForz> the fastra guys used pe-flex16-g2-4", about $80 a pop
1982 2010-11-20 19:41:47 <xelister> is it ok to use rinser card on a board with 1 PCI-Ex16, in order to run two 5970's ?
1983 2010-11-20 19:41:51 <xelister> or a 5970 + 5770 etc
1984 2010-11-20 19:41:55 <ArtForz> huH?
1985 2010-11-20 19:42:22 <xelister> riser
1986 2010-11-20 19:42:52 <ArtForz> it's just a 1:1 extension
1987 2010-11-20 19:42:59 <xelister> meh
1988 2010-11-20 19:43:02 <xelister> there aren't 1:2 are there
1989 2010-11-20 19:43:11 hippich has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
1990 2010-11-20 19:43:12 <xelister> I was thinking, wouldnt there be a speed problem
1991 2010-11-20 19:43:21 <ArtForz> there are, but if you have to ask, they're too expensive
1992 2010-11-20 19:43:35 <brocktice> heh
1993 2010-11-20 19:43:35 <xelister> so better just buy 2 PCIEx16 mobo?
1994 2010-11-20 19:43:42 <ArtForz> yep
1995 2010-11-20 19:43:54 <xelister> mobo has to be "with crossfire" ?
1996 2010-11-20 19:44:01 <ArtForz> nope
1997 2010-11-20 19:44:02 <xelister> they cost +100 afair
1998 2010-11-20 19:44:13 <xelister> so what does "with crossfire" change? is it needed then for gaming and so on?
1999 2010-11-20 19:44:18 <ArtForz> nope
2000 2010-11-20 19:44:22 <xelister> so what for?
2001 2010-11-20 19:44:29 <ArtForz> it's a marketing gimmick
2002 2010-11-20 19:44:52 <ArtForz> crossfire works on any board that can fit multiple GPUs
2003 2010-11-20 19:44:57 <xelister> oh
2004 2010-11-20 19:45:22 <xelister> and overall crossfire is needed for normal games/apps to use power of both GPUs, but it should be temporarly disabled for mining?
2005 2010-11-20 19:45:29 <ArtForz> yep
2006 2010-11-20 19:45:43 <xelister> does it produce any problems? with either sdk 2.1 or 2.2
2007 2010-11-20 19:45:46 <ArtForz> I have 2 5770s in xfire on a nForce3 based board in one of my gaming boxes, works just fine
2008 2010-11-20 19:46:35 <brocktice> from their thermal imaging it doesn't look like it gets too hot
2009 2010-11-20 19:46:38 <ArtForz> yeah, 2 ati cards. in crossfire. on a old-ass S939 board w/ nvidia chipset.
2010 2010-11-20 19:46:48 <ArtForz> brocktice: thats the *outside* of the cards
2011 2010-11-20 19:46:51 <brocktice> oh, but ... yeah
2012 2010-11-20 19:46:52 <brocktice> nm
2013 2010-11-20 19:47:15 <ArtForz> I'd love to see a thermal shot from the rear into the air vents
2014 2010-11-20 19:47:20 <xelister> brocktice: you've got thermal camera?
2015 2010-11-20 19:47:35 <brocktice> wow that's a $450 mobo
2016 2010-11-20 19:47:38 <brocktice> and it's out of stock on newegg
2017 2010-11-20 19:47:40 <brocktice> xelister: hell no
2018 2010-11-20 19:47:43 <brocktice> on the fastraII site
2019 2010-11-20 19:47:45 <brocktice> they have a video
2020 2010-11-20 19:47:51 <ArtForz> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FG9fTkT0JCA
2021 2010-11-20 19:48:10 <brocktice> oh and it has SAS on board
2022 2010-11-20 19:48:11 <brocktice> nice
2023 2010-11-20 19:49:04 hippich_ has joined
2024 2010-11-20 19:49:12 <brocktice> too bad it requires an i7 or xeon
2025 2010-11-20 19:49:30 <ArtForz> I calculated various designs
2026 2010-11-20 19:49:43 <xelister> hm?
2027 2010-11-20 19:49:53 <xelister> ArtForz: arent there cheaper cards with 2 pcie
2028 2010-11-20 19:50:02 <ArtForz> MSI 790FX-GD70 + 2 PCIe extenders seems to be the cheapest option
2029 2010-11-20 19:50:15 <xelister> sas?
2030 2010-11-20 19:50:54 <ArtForz> price for 2 cheap 2x16 boards + 2 cpu + 2 ram > 790FX + cpu + ram + 2 pcie extenders
2031 2010-11-20 19:51:28 <brocktice> serial attached scsi
2032 2010-11-20 19:51:47 <xelister> this one? http://www.msi.com/index.php?func=prodmbspec&maincat_no=1&cat2_no=&cat3_no=&prod_no=1740
2033 2010-11-20 19:51:48 <brocktice> a lot like sata but it can do full-duplex
2034 2010-11-20 19:51:54 <brocktice> it can drive sata too
2035 2010-11-20 19:52:01 <xelister> brocktice: hm what for one would need that
2036 2010-11-20 19:52:11 <xelister> ArtForz: it appears to have.... 4 pci-ex16 ?
2037 2010-11-20 19:52:15 <brocktice> xelister: lots of disk thrashing
2038 2010-11-20 19:52:18 <brocktice> xelister: I don't use them
2039 2010-11-20 19:52:18 <ArtForz> yep, that one
2040 2010-11-20 19:52:22 <brocktice> but it's a nice tech
2041 2010-11-20 19:52:42 <xelister> neat
2042 2010-11-20 19:53:13 <brocktice> ah that one does not have a stupid slot layout like mine
2043 2010-11-20 19:53:24 <xelister> ArtForz: and how the pcie extenders work? you mean 1:1 to have some cards outside of box or some converers from pci or pcigen to pcix16? which extenders you bought?
2044 2010-11-20 19:53:31 <brocktice> ArtForz: what do you do about that one on the end?
2045 2010-11-20 19:53:36 <brocktice> do you shift them all over 1?
2046 2010-11-20 19:53:45 <brocktice> oh wait you stack them veritcally right?
2047 2010-11-20 19:53:49 <brocktice> *vertically
2048 2010-11-20 19:54:01 <ArtForz> yep
2049 2010-11-20 19:54:18 <xelister> yep on what? :)
2050 2010-11-20 19:54:22 <ArtForz> I have a card in blue slots #1 and #3
2051 2010-11-20 19:54:28 <ArtForz> and extender cables in #2 and #4
2052 2010-11-20 19:54:51 <ArtForz> which raise the cards sitting there well above the other two
2053 2010-11-20 19:54:52 <ArtForz> http://pc-adapter.net/products/450.html
2054 2010-11-20 19:54:53 <xelister> so by extenders you mean that raiser cards
2055 2010-11-20 19:54:55 <xelister> ok
2056 2010-11-20 19:55:01 <xelister> sure we ask a lot of questions to poor ArtForz ;)
2057 2010-11-20 19:55:01 <brocktice> why doesn't anyone put real RAID on the damn motherboards?
2058 2010-11-20 19:55:10 <xelister> brocktice: isnt software raid better?
2059 2010-11-20 19:55:10 <brocktice> I told him he should start a FAQ
2060 2010-11-20 19:55:19 <brocktice> xelister: depends
2061 2010-11-20 19:55:31 <ArtForz> it's a flexible cable I just use to go straight up by ~5"
2062 2010-11-20 19:55:39 <brocktice> xelister: hardware RAID cards with battery back-ups can be very nice to work with, and faster as well
2063 2010-11-20 19:55:47 <brocktice> but those half-software ones are annoying
2064 2010-11-20 19:56:03 <ArtForz> fakeraid = teh sux
2065 2010-11-20 19:56:07 <brocktice> I prefer 3ware
2066 2010-11-20 19:56:12 <brocktice> I've had issues with adaptec
2067 2010-11-20 19:56:16 <xelister> brocktice: perhaps. with software you can easly do some crazy configurations, like make raid of some part of hdd A, other part of B and so on
2068 2010-11-20 19:56:25 <brocktice> Especially if you want to cram a fuckload of drives in one box
2069 2010-11-20 19:56:25 <xelister> but I guess for serious use hw one would rock the
2070 2010-11-20 19:56:46 <xelister> fakeraid?
2071 2010-11-20 19:56:55 <ArtForz> yes, fakeraid
2072 2010-11-20 19:56:56 <brocktice> xelister: what most motherboards have now
2073 2010-11-20 19:57:11 * xelister uses wiki more
2074 2010-11-20 19:57:19 <brocktice> I think they exist mainly because windows has (had?) terrible RAID support?
2075 2010-11-20 19:57:22 <brocktice> (software)
2076 2010-11-20 19:57:27 <ArtForz> = plain ole SATA contorller that emulates the raid functionality in BIOS option rom + windoze driver
2077 2010-11-20 19:57:34 <ArtForz> = on host CPU
2078 2010-11-20 19:58:15 <ArtForz> for my personal fileserver I just use "cheap" 8-port fakeraid adapters in non-raid mode + linux md-raid
2079 2010-11-20 19:59:24 <xelister> yeah thats same I would use
2080 2010-11-20 19:59:34 <xelister> btw interesting story
2081 2010-11-20 19:59:44 <brocktice> ArtForz: I got an sata backplane
2082 2010-11-20 19:59:52 <xelister> each few weeks or so, one of my HDD throws errors. lost i/o page on write
2083 2010-11-20 19:59:54 <ArtForz> 16 1T 7.2k sata drives, 8+2 raid6, 4+1 raid5, 1 hot spare
2084 2010-11-20 19:59:56 <xelister> untill restart
2085 2010-11-20 20:00:00 <brocktice> as long as speed isn't a huge issue it works fine
2086 2010-11-20 20:00:04 <xelister> I replaced that disk. New one did the same
2087 2010-11-20 20:00:12 <ArtForz> bad backplane?
2088 2010-11-20 20:00:12 <xelister> replaced it again, new one does the same after some time
2089 2010-11-20 20:00:15 <xelister> ideas?
2090 2010-11-20 20:00:22 <xelister> mainboard? PSU?
2091 2010-11-20 20:00:37 <ArtForz> sata cable?
2092 2010-11-20 20:00:38 <xelister> all 4 other harddrives in this box have no problem
2093 2010-11-20 20:00:40 <xelister> sata
2094 2010-11-20 20:00:56 <ArtForz> no, did you try replacing the sata data cable?
2095 2010-11-20 20:01:24 <xelister> hmmm yes
2096 2010-11-20 20:01:31 <ArtForz> those damn things can be totally or partially fucked while looking perfectly fine
2097 2010-11-20 20:01:40 <xelister> how can one fuck up a cable
2098 2010-11-20 20:01:58 <ArtForz> mainly too tight bends or pulling on the cable instead of the plug body
2099 2010-11-20 20:02:11 <ArtForz> the strain relief in sata plugs is pretty much non-existent
2100 2010-11-20 20:02:16 <xelister> no I didnt do the pooling ;)
2101 2010-11-20 20:02:22 <xelister> what is most likelly though?
2102 2010-11-20 20:02:30 <xelister> can it be mobo
2103 2010-11-20 20:02:36 <ArtForz> *grabs crystal ball*
2104 2010-11-20 20:02:50 <ArtForz> it's just continous bad luck. the universe hates you.
2105 2010-11-20 20:03:30 <ArtForz> so its always the same slot on the backplane causing trouble?
2106 2010-11-20 20:03:59 <xelister> I think so
2107 2010-11-20 20:04:14 <ArtForz> lost i/o on write usually == power problem
2108 2010-11-20 20:04:47 <ArtForz> does that disk show a crapload of ATA CRC errors in smart info?
2109 2010-11-20 20:05:31 <ArtForz> if yes it most likely one of data cable/mainboard/backplane
2110 2010-11-20 20:05:55 <ArtForz> if no it's most likely dying disk(excluded)/PSU/backplane
2111 2010-11-20 20:06:10 <xelister> well problem with backplane == with mainboard, right?
2112 2010-11-20 20:06:18 <ArtForz> huH?
2113 2010-11-20 20:06:19 <xelister> by backplane you mean the sata port on the mainboard?
2114 2010-11-20 20:06:33 <ArtForz> no, the backplane
2115 2010-11-20 20:06:59 <ArtForz> does that backplane have a seperate sata cable for each disk to mainboard or a sasx4 cable?
2116 2010-11-20 20:07:12 <xelister> uhh?
2117 2010-11-20 20:07:20 <ArtForz> if seperate cables, try swapping cables around on each end and see if the error moves
2118 2010-11-20 20:07:27 <xelister> each disk have a normal sata cable, that goes into the mainboard
2119 2010-11-20 20:07:30 <xelister> as usuall
2120 2010-11-20 20:07:38 <xelister> I dont use any expansion cards or enything like that
2121 2010-11-20 20:08:13 <ArtForz> so swap the mainboard port for the problematic slot with another one
2122 2010-11-20 20:08:58 <brocktice> I think you're conused, I'm the one with the backplane
2123 2010-11-20 20:09:04 <brocktice> *confused
2124 2010-11-20 20:09:06 <ArtForz> ho
2125 2010-11-20 20:09:09 <ArtForz> yeah
2126 2010-11-20 20:09:12 <xelister> he called you a ho :o
2127 2010-11-20 20:09:13 <xelister> lol :)
2128 2010-11-20 20:09:26 <ArtForz> fucking fuck
2129 2010-11-20 20:09:35 <brocktice> I ain't no ho
2130 2010-11-20 20:09:44 <brocktice> you the muthafuckin ho
2131 2010-11-20 20:10:08 <xelister> dont make me drive you over with my pimpmobile
2132 2010-11-20 20:10:10 <ArtForz> anyways, spaw cbales at each end and ese if eth errro mvoes
2133 2010-11-20 20:10:38 <xelister> we need to pay 50 cent to make a video wearing a gold bitcoin-neckless, for our pt
2134 2010-11-20 20:10:40 <xelister> pr
2135 2010-11-20 20:10:48 <ArtForz> okay, I think I should just fucking get some sleep
2136 2010-11-20 20:11:16 <xelister> ArtForz: heay I will try :)
2137 2010-11-20 20:12:27 <ArtForz> sleep deprev = interesting
2138 2010-11-20 20:13:07 <xelister> indeed
2139 2010-11-20 20:13:24 <xelister> after 40h it is easy to get sound delusions
2140 2010-11-20 20:13:46 <ArtForz> fucking idiots at work fucking killed half of the control electronics of a $150k machine thats supposed to ship monday
2141 2010-11-20 20:14:04 <xelister> blame it on terrorist s
2142 2010-11-20 20:16:13 <ArtForz> at east the boss now realized why I collect components from failed dev projects in a storage room in the basement
2143 2010-11-20 20:21:17 anomnom has quit (Quit: leaving)
2144 2010-11-20 20:28:44 <brocktice> :(
2145 2010-11-20 20:28:54 <brocktice> ArtForz to the rescue
2146 2010-11-20 20:32:10 hippich_ has quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
2147 2010-11-20 20:32:11 <brocktice> It's what, 20:25 or so there?
2148 2010-11-20 20:32:16 <brocktice> You been up since yesterday?
2149 2010-11-20 20:32:23 <ArtForz> pretty much
2150 2010-11-20 20:32:31 <brocktice> yikes, why are you still up?
2151 2010-11-20 20:32:47 <ArtForz> for fun and profit!
2152 2010-11-20 20:34:35 <tcatm> if i have an sql table with timestamps, prices, volume, can i select all prices/volume pairs where timestamp is the the latest timestamp?
2153 2010-11-20 20:35:26 <ArtForz> just getting the latest timestamp would be easy
2154 2010-11-20 20:35:34 <ArtForz> a order by limit 1 select
2155 2010-11-20 20:36:20 <tcatm> okay
2156 2010-11-20 20:36:35 <tcatm> thought there might be a special operator for such a query
2157 2010-11-20 20:36:57 <ArtForz> there probably is
2158 2010-11-20 20:37:11 hippich has joined
2159 2010-11-20 20:37:26 <tcatm> there isn't even a last() or first() in mysql :P
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2166 2010-11-20 21:05:36 dwdollar has left ()
2167 2010-11-20 21:05:52 theymos has joined
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2169 2010-11-20 21:26:38 <tcatm> should an order book have equal intervals or show raw data?
2170 2010-11-20 21:29:50 <altamic> Kiba: are you around?
2171 2010-11-20 21:32:01 <altamic> this afternoon I've got a couple of hours and I've sketched an UI for an hypothetical android/iphone bitcoin app
2172 2010-11-20 21:32:26 <altamic> I've uploaded it here: michelangelo.altamore.org/tmp/bitcoin-mobile
2173 2010-11-20 21:32:29 <altamic> http://michelangelo.altamore.org/tmp/bitcoin-mobile
2174 2010-11-20 21:35:50 <tcatm> looks good
2175 2010-11-20 21:36:32 <altamic> thank you
2176 2010-11-20 21:36:48 <altamic> I should be able to work on it tomorrow
2177 2010-11-20 21:37:55 <altamic> since I have no android phone
2178 2010-11-20 21:38:20 <altamic> I still can't say how it looks like on android
2179 2010-11-20 21:38:37 <altamic> I've tried only on the emulator
2180 2010-11-20 21:38:52 <altamic> 2.2
2181 2010-11-20 21:40:50 Toadyonps3 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2182 2010-11-20 21:42:28 Toadyonps3 has joined
2183 2010-11-20 21:46:27 <xelister> building diablos miner from sources sucks; )
2184 2010-11-20 21:46:28 <xelister> ;)
2185 2010-11-20 21:49:09 <OneFixt> ;;bc,stats
2186 2010-11-20 21:49:12 <gribble> Current Blocks: 93033 | Current Difficulty: 6866.89864897 | Next Difficulty At Block: 94752 | Next Difficulty In: 1719 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 5 days, 7 hours, 1 minute, and 28 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 6668.48510990
2187 2010-11-20 22:01:01 <ArtForz> rofl
2188 2010-11-20 22:01:27 <ArtForz> wannabe addr spam
2189 2010-11-20 22:02:00 <theymos> The attacker is definitely on IRC. This was just discussed yesterday.
2190 2010-11-20 22:02:06 <ArtForz> yep
2191 2010-11-20 22:02:29 <ArtForz> too bad we already have rate limiting for p2p messages
2192 2010-11-20 22:02:53 <theymos> What effect is the attack having?
2193 2010-11-20 22:03:34 <ArtForz> about 5 addrs per second
2194 2010-11-20 22:03:55 <ArtForz> = roughly 150byte/sec of bandwidth
2195 2010-11-20 22:04:36 <theymos> If Bitcoin receives two identical addr messages within a short period, does it send two addr relays?
2196 2010-11-20 22:04:42 <ArtForz> nope
2197 2010-11-20 22:04:51 <theymos> Waits 24 hours?
2198 2010-11-20 22:04:58 <ArtForz> yup
2199 2010-11-20 22:06:43 <ArtForz> btw, I already suspected the spammer is on this chan, thats why I suggested the "great" idea of addr spam *g*
2200 2010-11-20 22:06:52 <theymos> lol
2201 2010-11-20 22:14:24 <theymos> Addr messages would be a great place to have some proof-of-work.
2202 2010-11-20 22:14:28 <ArtForz> and back to tx spam it is, lol
2203 2010-11-20 22:15:15 <tcatm> you should track down his IP ;)
2204 2010-11-20 22:20:09 <ArtForz> pfff, why even bother
2205 2010-11-20 22:21:34 <OneFixt> Is 3.15 from the main site enough to deal with the spam, or is there a need to build from somewhere else?
2206 2010-11-20 22:21:54 <theymos> SVN r186 is better.
2207 2010-11-20 22:22:07 <ArtForz> r186, = 3.15.04
2208 2010-11-20 22:22:44 <OneFixt> Thanks; is it simple enough to build for windows?
2209 2010-11-20 22:26:29 <OneFixt> ;;bc,stats
2210 2010-11-20 22:26:32 <gribble> Current Blocks: 93038 | Current Difficulty: 6866.89864897 | Next Difficulty At Block: 94752 | Next Difficulty In: 1714 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 5 days, 4 hours, 59 minutes, and 26 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 6695.24551720
2211 2010-11-20 22:27:08 <OneFixt> ;;bc,estimate
2212 2010-11-20 22:27:08 <gribble> 6695.24551720
2213 2010-11-20 22:31:09 <jgarzik> addr spam?
2214 2010-11-20 22:31:13 * jgarzik goes to look at logs
2215 2010-11-20 22:32:29 <jgarzik> bitcoin faucet is quite popular. it's TXs are easy to identify, not only by amount, but also by TX fee usage.
2216 2010-11-20 22:33:21 <jgarzik> ArtForz: where is the rate limit for p2p messages?
2217 2010-11-20 22:39:02 <ArtForz> in sendmessages
2218 2010-11-20 22:44:18 <ArtForz> we actually additionally limit addr forwarding in ProcessMessage
2219 2010-11-20 22:50:23 AAA_awright_ has joined
2220 2010-11-20 22:51:14 AAA_awright has quit (Disconnected by services)
2221 2010-11-20 22:51:18 AAA_awright_ is now known as AAA_awright
2222 2010-11-20 22:57:58 <anarchy> ;;bc,stats
2223 2010-11-20 22:58:01 <gribble> Current Blocks: 93039 | Current Difficulty: 6866.89864897 | Next Difficulty At Block: 94752 | Next Difficulty In: 1713 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 5 days, 6 hours, 21 minutes, and 44 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 6660.15629724
2224 2010-11-20 22:59:09 <anarchy> ;;bc,estimate
2225 2010-11-20 22:59:10 <gribble> 6660.15629724
2226 2010-11-20 23:38:33 altamic has quit (Quit: altamic)
2227 2010-11-20 23:44:14 AAA_awright_ has joined
2228 2010-11-20 23:45:21 AAA_awright has quit (Disconnected by services)
2229 2010-11-20 23:45:25 AAA_awright_ is now known as AAA_awright