1 2010-12-03 00:00:22 mizery has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
   2 2010-12-03 00:00:55 <Diablo-D3> StrangeCharm: yes
   3 2010-12-03 00:01:14 <Diablo-D3> xelister: tell github to fork my repo, then add your shit
   4 2010-12-03 00:01:21 <OneFixt> ;;bc,stats
   5 2010-12-03 00:01:24 <gribble> Current Blocks: 95177 | Current Difficulty: 8078.19525793 | Next Difficulty At Block: 96767 | Next Difficulty In: 1590 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 1 day, 14 hours, 38 minutes, and 34 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 10359.52038785
   6 2010-12-03 00:01:25 <Diablo-D3> if its worth doing, I'll pull the patch from your repo
   7 2010-12-03 00:01:45 mizery has joined
   8 2010-12-03 00:03:05 osmosis has joined
   9 2010-12-03 00:17:58 <andrew12> does anybody know of a json-rpc library for ruby or python that let's you use a username and password? -_-
  10 2010-12-03 00:18:31 <tcatm> use HTTP auth (http://user:pass@host/path)
  11 2010-12-03 00:18:51 <Diablo-D3> andrew12: thats not up to that
  12 2010-12-03 00:18:59 <Diablo-D3> all json-rpc libraries use python's http
  13 2010-12-03 00:19:08 <Diablo-D3> do what tcatm said and change m0's miner to use that url
  14 2010-12-03 00:19:15 <andrew12> tcatm: thanks
  15 2010-12-03 00:19:21 <Diablo-D3> same works on mine too
  16 2010-12-03 00:19:21 <andrew12> Diablo-D3: i'm not using it for a miner :P
  17 2010-12-03 00:19:24 <Diablo-D3> ahh
  18 2010-12-03 00:19:33 <andrew12> just playing around with the bitcoin rpc stuff
  19 2010-12-03 00:24:15 <gavinandresen> andrew12: for python, you need to set the Authorization: header when you urllib2.Request...
  20 2010-12-03 00:24:46 <andrew12> it worked fine the other way
  21 2010-12-03 00:24:56 <andrew12> and it just uses urlopen
  22 2010-12-03 00:25:04 <gavinandresen> good
  23 2010-12-03 00:28:48 <nelisky> how is the time to block estimate calculated?
  24 2010-12-03 00:29:35 darrob has quit (Disconnected by services)
  25 2010-12-03 00:29:36 darrob- has joined
  26 2010-12-03 00:32:25 <Diablo-D3> http://www.boingboing.net/2010/12/02/open-thread-for-scie.html#comment-955366
  27 2010-12-03 00:32:31 * Diablo-D3 just keels over gurgling
  28 2010-12-03 00:32:41 <Diablo-D3> gavinandresen: no he doesnt
  29 2010-12-03 00:32:47 <Diablo-D3> m0's does it that way fine
  30 2010-12-03 00:32:51 <Diablo-D3> oh yeah
  31 2010-12-03 00:32:54 <Diablo-D3> m0's DOES do that
  32 2010-12-03 00:33:00 <Diablo-D3> I forgot and suddenly remembered
  33 2010-12-03 00:33:01 <Diablo-D3> go me
  34 2010-12-03 00:34:08 <gavinandresen> Diablo-D3: you're absolutely right.
  35 2010-12-03 00:34:42 <Diablo-D3> am I? I don't even know who I am anymore!
  36 2010-12-03 00:34:50 * Diablo-D3 runs for president
  37 2010-12-03 00:37:26 <Diablo-D3> http://www.boingboing.net/2010/12/02/open-thread-for-scie.html
  38 2010-12-03 00:37:34 <Diablo-D3> #69 and #83 are the worst thus far
  39 2010-12-03 00:41:37 ArtForz has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
  40 2010-12-03 00:42:43 andrew12 has joined
  41 2010-12-03 00:42:54 <andrew12> mac!~andrew@pool-71-166-152-240.washdc.east.verizon.net|going to try to install libdb again
  42 2010-12-03 00:43:35 <andrew12> mac!~andrew@pool-71-166-152-240.washdc.east.verizon.net|if that doesn't work then i'm probably going to boot my desktop into linux so i can play with stuffz
  43 2010-12-03 00:43:41 <andrew12> mac!~andrew@pool-71-166-152-240.washdc.east.verizon.net|because I know it will work there
  44 2010-12-03 00:45:15 <andrew12> mac!~andrew@pool-71-166-152-240.washdc.east.verizon.net|actually i'm going to reboot it into linux now. :p
  45 2010-12-03 00:46:20 ArtForz has joined
  46 2010-12-03 00:47:06 <andrew12> ...right after the test faucet gets 5000 bc back
  47 2010-12-03 00:47:09 davout has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
  48 2010-12-03 00:50:18 <nanotube> nelisky: clarify your question?
  49 2010-12-03 00:50:50 <nelisky> how does one go from difficulty vs hashrate into expected time between blocks
  50 2010-12-03 00:51:08 <nelisky> nanotube: for one without a major in math ^^
  51 2010-12-03 00:51:28 <andrew12> heh
  52 2010-12-03 00:51:37 <nanotube> well, every sha256 essentially produces a random number between 0 and 2^256
  53 2010-12-03 00:52:03 <andrew12> psuedorandom
  54 2010-12-03 00:52:12 <andrew12> :p
  55 2010-12-03 00:52:32 <nanotube> difficulty '1' is set such that an acceptable block has the sha less than approximately 2^224-1
  56 2010-12-03 00:53:16 <nelisky> ok
  57 2010-12-03 00:53:28 <nanotube> subsequent difficulty levels shrink that number
  58 2010-12-03 00:53:40 <nelisky> but being random means we're talking statistics, when we try to estimate a time span
  59 2010-12-03 00:53:47 <nanotube> so difficulty 8000 has the 'cutoff' as (2^224-1)/8000
  60 2010-12-03 00:53:53 <ColonelPanic1> where is the change log for 0.3.17?
  61 2010-12-03 00:53:59 <nanotube> ColonelPanic1: somewhere on the forum
  62 2010-12-03 00:54:06 <nanotube> nelisky: i haven't gotten to the time bits yet :)
  63 2010-12-03 00:54:19 <ColonelPanic1> does it have the getwork stuff in it?
  64 2010-12-03 00:54:19 <nelisky> nanotube: sorry, I'll be quiet :)
  65 2010-12-03 00:54:26 <Diablo-D3> [07:51:46] <andrew12> psuedorandom
  66 2010-12-03 00:54:30 <Diablo-D3> by definition "random enough"
  67 2010-12-03 00:54:34 <doublec> ColonelPanic1, http://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=1946.msg24631
  68 2010-12-03 00:54:46 andrew12 has quit ()
  69 2010-12-03 00:54:50 <Diablo-D3> secure is a boolean value
  70 2010-12-03 00:54:51 <Diablo-D3> aww
  71 2010-12-03 00:55:04 <nanotube> so, given a threshold number, and an assumed-uniform distribution for sha256, you know that the probability of getting a block with any given hash, is about <threshold>/2^256
  72 2010-12-03 00:55:16 <ColonelPanic1> sick , thank you sure
  73 2010-12-03 00:55:26 <ColonelPanic1> for sure*
  74 2010-12-03 00:57:40 <nanotube> "average time" to calculate the block, then, is related to total network's hash/second capacity, and the probability to hit with any given hash
  75 2010-12-03 00:57:44 <andrew12> mac!~andrew@pool-71-166-152-240.washdc.east.verizon.net|Diablo-D3: i'm still here ;)
  76 2010-12-03 00:57:49 <Diablo-D3> ahh
  77 2010-12-03 00:57:50 <Diablo-D3> secure is a boolean value
  78 2010-12-03 00:57:55 <Diablo-D3> it either is, or it isnt
  79 2010-12-03 00:58:08 <Diablo-D3> sha256 is, until someone breaks it, a random value.
  80 2010-12-03 00:58:36 <nanotube> nelisky: every 2016 blocks, each node looks at how long it took to calculate the 2016 blocks, and if it was 'too slow' it adjusts the difficulty down (threshold goes up), and if it was 'too fast' it adjusts the difficulty up (threshold goes down)
  81 2010-12-03 00:58:52 <andrew12> mac!~andrew@pool-71-166-152-240.washdc.east.verizon.net|it can't be random if you can give it the same argument and it will always give you the same result
  82 2010-12-03 00:58:52 <lfm> pay no attention to "partly broken" reports of encryption and hash algorithms
  83 2010-12-03 00:59:16 <nanotube> nelisky: and that's the basic idea. :)
  84 2010-12-03 00:59:24 <lfm> adrewyes strictly speaking it is "Pseudo-random"
  85 2010-12-03 00:59:53 <andrew12> mac!~andrew@pool-71-166-152-240.washdc.east.verizon.net|yes
  86 2010-12-03 00:59:58 * andrew12 mac!~andrew@pool-71-166-152-240.washdc.east.verizon.net|claps
  87 2010-12-03 00:59:59 <nelisky> nanotube: thanks, I'm somewhat more enlightened, but my question remains unanswered, I believe
  88 2010-12-03 01:00:33 <nelisky> nanotube: which is, how does one calculate the 'at X hashes/s it will take some 20 weeks to find a block, probably'
  89 2010-12-03 01:00:46 <nelisky> I know it's just an estimate, depends on luck etc
  90 2010-12-03 01:00:55 <nanotube> nelisky: aaah, in that case, all you need to do is look at the source for the bc,calc function. ,,bc,calc
  91 2010-12-03 01:00:56 <gribble> (bc,calc <an alias, 1 argument>) -- Alias for "echo The average time to generate a block at $1 Khps, given current difficulty of [bc,diff], is [time elapsed [math calc 1/((2**224-1)/[bc,diff]*$1*1000/2**256)]]".
  92 2010-12-03 01:00:59 <lfm> nelisky, take time since last difficulty change from timestamps on blocks, divide by number of blocks -> average time per block
  93 2010-12-03 01:01:46 <nelisky> lfm: yeah, that part I get, looking at previous data
  94 2010-12-03 01:01:52 <nelisky> nanotube: perfect, thanks!
  95 2010-12-03 01:02:13 CyanDynamo has joined
  96 2010-12-03 01:02:29 <andrew12> mac!~andrew@pool-71-166-152-240.washdc.east.verizon.net|what's gribble written in?
  97 2010-12-03 01:02:52 <lfm> gribble script -> scribble?
  98 2010-12-03 01:02:59 <andrew12> mac!~andrew@pool-71-166-152-240.washdc.east.verizon.net|haha
  99 2010-12-03 01:09:12 <lfm> sometimes hard to understand but more than half of the generated bitcoins have never been transfered since they were generated
 100 2010-12-03 01:10:15 alvarezp has left ()
 101 2010-12-03 01:10:30 arimus has joined
 102 2010-12-03 01:11:31 larsig has joined
 103 2010-12-03 01:12:34 arimus has quit (Client Quit)
 104 2010-12-03 01:22:04 <sgornick> lfm: Was wondering what amount those would be.  So will those wallet.dat's be the "Uncirculated, Mint Condition" collector items worth several ounces of gold a couple decades from now?
 105 2010-12-03 01:24:02 <Diablo-D3> I suspect half of those coins are gone forever
 106 2010-12-03 01:24:16 <Diablo-D3> we're going to have to figure out to recover those
 107 2010-12-03 01:25:53 <[Noodles]> how'd you tell, if coins are gone, or just sitting in a vault as an investment?
 108 2010-12-03 01:28:09 <andrew12> mac!~andrew@pool-71-166-152-240.washdc.east.verizon.net|because usually when you write 0s over all your coins, you lose them
 109 2010-12-03 01:28:24 <andrew12> mac!~andrew@pool-71-166-152-240.washdc.east.verizon.net|:D
 110 2010-12-03 01:28:52 <Diablo-D3> [Noodles]: well, most of the coins HAVE been transfered
 111 2010-12-03 01:29:02 <Diablo-D3> the rest are from people who regularly interact with the community
 112 2010-12-03 01:29:13 <[Noodles]> say who?
 113 2010-12-03 01:29:16 <Diablo-D3> so we'll just say "if you have coins generated on these dates, please contact us"
 114 2010-12-03 01:29:17 <[Noodles]> says
 115 2010-12-03 01:29:24 <[Noodles]> lol
 116 2010-12-03 01:29:34 <Diablo-D3> [Noodles]: if they dont, then the coins really are lost
 117 2010-12-03 01:29:39 <andrew12> mac!~andrew@pool-71-166-152-240.washdc.east.verizon.net|foreverrrrrrrrrr
 118 2010-12-03 01:29:45 <[Noodles]> so i always have to check your news to be sure my coins havent been erased yet?
 119 2010-12-03 01:30:09 <Diablo-D3> the changelogs of software you use? yes you should.
 120 2010-12-03 01:31:02 <[Noodles]> and i thought my bitcoins are safe as long as my walletfile is, not just to the next release
 121 2010-12-03 01:31:38 ArtForz has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
 122 2010-12-03 01:32:27 <[Noodles]> you cant tell, if i put my wallet in a vault right after generating my first 50coins, what if?
 123 2010-12-03 01:32:39 <Diablo-D3> um
 124 2010-12-03 01:32:48 <Diablo-D3> a "vault" would be burning it onto a disc
 125 2010-12-03 01:33:03 <[Noodles]> thumbdrives are affordable these days
 126 2010-12-03 01:33:35 <[Noodles]> why do i keep backups, if you can just erase my coins anyway?
 127 2010-12-03 01:34:18 ArtForz has joined
 128 2010-12-03 01:34:25 <[Noodles]> i doubt there's a way to handle that, we have to live with those "lost coins"
 129 2010-12-03 01:36:03 <noagendamarket> it makes the leftover coins more valuable
 130 2010-12-03 01:36:18 <noagendamarket> wouldnt be good if one day someone recovered all the lost ones
 131 2010-12-03 01:36:34 <noagendamarket> they would be instant bitcoinmillionaires
 132 2010-12-03 01:36:44 <[Noodles]> well, you dont know how many are lost or left, so...
 133 2010-12-03 01:36:58 <Diablo-D3> depends how many are lost
 134 2010-12-03 01:37:07 <Diablo-D3> if its less than 10%, who cares
 135 2010-12-03 01:37:18 <Diablo-D3> noagendamarket: and no they wouldnt
 136 2010-12-03 01:37:22 <Diablo-D3> the coins dont magically change value
 137 2010-12-03 01:37:48 <xelister> ye it would
 138 2010-12-03 01:37:54 <xelister> it lowers supply with same demand
 139 2010-12-03 01:38:01 <Diablo-D3> no I mean
 140 2010-12-03 01:38:05 <Diablo-D3> it wouldnt make them MILLIONARES
 141 2010-12-03 01:38:15 <Diablo-D3> the coins arent worth that much
 142 2010-12-03 01:38:22 <Diablo-D3> the coins would already have to be worth like $50 a pop
 143 2010-12-03 01:38:25 <xelister> right
 144 2010-12-03 01:39:12 <noagendamarket> I didnt say if it happened right now
 145 2010-12-03 01:40:04 <noagendamarket> its not really a concern
 146 2010-12-03 01:40:23 <Diablo-D3> I already said its not
 147 2010-12-03 01:40:27 <Diablo-D3> not enough have been lost
 148 2010-12-03 01:40:44 <[Noodles]> think about it, maybe someones creating a new wallet for each block generated, he has a bunch of 50coin-wallets that he might want to sell for a few thousand bucks in a year or 2 ^.^
 149 2010-12-03 01:40:44 <noagendamarket> over 9000 have been lost
 150 2010-12-03 01:40:59 <nelisky> mtgox: I got charge $2.99 to withdraw LRUSD, on top of the 1%?
 151 2010-12-03 01:41:09 <[Noodles]> those coins have never been transfered
 152 2010-12-03 01:41:27 <Diablo-D3> noagendamarket: out of 24 million or whatever its supposed to be, thats less than a percent.
 153 2010-12-03 01:41:37 <Diablo-D3> [Noodles]: yes, and you have to find ones that never have
 154 2010-12-03 01:41:48 <[Noodles]> and then what?
 155 2010-12-03 01:42:10 <Diablo-D3> and then .... nothing.
 156 2010-12-03 01:42:16 <Diablo-D3> like I said, not enough have been lost
 157 2010-12-03 01:45:53 <lfm> number of unspent generated transactions: 50327so it IS millions of BTC (2516350)
 158 2010-12-03 01:46:11 <Diablo-D3> lfm: unspent doesnt mean lost
 159 2010-12-03 01:46:24 <lfm> yes
 160 2010-12-03 01:46:43 <lfm> these have never been transacted ever
 161 2010-12-03 01:47:15 <lfm> could be hoarders or lost
 162 2010-12-03 01:47:21 <Diablo-D3> hoarders
 163 2010-12-03 01:48:17 <lfm> it is more than half of all bitcoins
 164 2010-12-03 01:48:32 <Diablo-D3> dude, half of all bitcoins art owns
 165 2010-12-03 01:48:54 <lfm> well he isnt moving them around if it is him
 166 2010-12-03 01:49:20 <lfm> 50327 / 95190
 167 2010-12-03 01:49:55 <Diablo-D3> fine
 168 2010-12-03 01:49:57 <Diablo-D3> bitcoin is a failure
 169 2010-12-03 01:50:00 * Diablo-D3 jumps ship
 170 2010-12-03 01:50:27 <lfm> just if it is hoarders, what are they waiting for are they gonna fload the market and sell at some point?
 171 2010-12-03 01:50:38 <lfm> flood
 172 2010-12-03 01:52:30 <Diablo-D3> heh
 173 2010-12-03 01:52:32 <Diablo-D3> who knows
 174 2010-12-03 01:52:52 <lfm> just makes me nervous is all
 175 2010-12-03 01:53:12 <noagendamarket> satoshi himself probably owns a few
 176 2010-12-03 01:53:24 <noagendamarket> i doubt he would flood the market
 177 2010-12-03 01:53:38 <noagendamarket> nor would art or knightmb
 178 2010-12-03 01:53:51 <noagendamarket> its against their own best interest
 179 2010-12-03 01:54:04 Kiba` has quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
 180 2010-12-03 01:54:32 Kiba` has joined
 181 2010-12-03 01:55:35 <lfm> maybe you know them better than me. I havn't seen any reassurance from them on the subject
 182 2010-12-03 01:56:09 <lfm> I think art has been selling a lot of them all along, to subsidize his hardware addiction
 183 2010-12-03 01:58:22 mizery has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
 184 2010-12-03 01:59:23 mizery has joined
 185 2010-12-03 02:01:05 <lfm> as for "recovering" some that may be lost, Id be against it. I say just let them be lost, better to leave them be than accidently taking them away from some quiet hoarder.
 186 2010-12-03 02:01:17 <mizery> Anyone here have any bitcoin-related websites that they would consider advertising on other sites?
 187 2010-12-03 02:01:26 mtgox has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
 188 2010-12-03 02:01:49 <andrew12> mac!~andrew@pool-71-166-152-240.washdc.east.verizon.net|yay for installing berkeley db on my desktop
 189 2010-12-03 02:02:18 <lfm> mac desktop?
 190 2010-12-03 02:02:24 <andrew12> mac!~andrew@pool-71-166-152-240.washdc.east.verizon.net|no
 191 2010-12-03 02:02:26 <andrew12> mac!~andrew@pool-71-166-152-240.washdc.east.verizon.net|linux
 192 2010-12-03 02:02:38 <andrew12> mac!~andrew@pool-71-166-152-240.washdc.east.verizon.net|i can't get it to compile on my mac
 193 2010-12-03 02:02:47 <lfm> oh, never known anyone to have trouble with that
 194 2010-12-03 02:03:02 <lfm> mac yes, linux no
 195 2010-12-03 02:04:09 <andrew12> mac!~andrew@pool-71-166-152-240.washdc.east.verizon.net|wait, you've heard people to have trouble with it on linux? or mac? lol
 196 2010-12-03 02:04:18 <lfm> yes
 197 2010-12-03 02:04:23 <lfm> lol
 198 2010-12-03 02:04:36 <Kiba`> finally got a drawing out tonight
 199 2010-12-03 02:04:38 <andrew12> mac!~andrew@pool-71-166-152-240.washdc.east.verizon.net|both?
 200 2010-12-03 02:05:01 <lfm> no trouble in linux. not really heard much from mac people
 201 2010-12-03 02:06:26 <lfm> kiba, you get paid for it?
 202 2010-12-03 02:07:26 <Kiba`> I just uploaded it!
 203 2010-12-03 02:07:58 <Kiba`> http://www.bitcoinservice.co.uk/files/14
 204 2010-12-03 02:08:03 * Kiba` is experimenting with bitcoin prices
 205 2010-12-03 02:09:37 <lfm> kiba might help if you put a description and/or a thumbnail on the page asking for payment
 206 2010-12-03 02:10:04 <andrew12> mac!~andrew@pool-71-166-152-240.washdc.east.verizon.net|yeah
 207 2010-12-03 02:11:20 * delta9 just wasted 0.1 BTC..
 208 2010-12-03 02:11:55 <lfm> hehe
 209 2010-12-03 02:12:53 <lfm> so like $0.025 really not worth that much?
 210 2010-12-03 02:13:16 <Kiba`> lfm: blame bencoder
 211 2010-12-03 02:13:28 <Kiba`> delta9: so you think my art is crap?
 212 2010-12-03 02:15:19 <delta9> ive seen better
 213 2010-12-03 02:15:50 <lfm> well theres a fair distance between the old masters and crap generally
 214 2010-12-03 02:16:23 * Kiba` is a newbie.
 215 2010-12-03 02:16:54 <andrew12> mac!~andrew@pool-71-166-152-240.washdc.east.verizon.net|I would look at your picture if I had any bitcoins.
 216 2010-12-03 02:18:36 <delta9> get some...
 217 2010-12-03 02:19:43 * andrew12 mac!~andrew@pool-71-166-152-240.washdc.east.verizon.net|snaps his fingers
 218 2010-12-03 02:19:47 andrew12 is now known as mac!~andrew@pool-71-166-152-240.washdc.east.verizon.net|andrew12
 219 2010-12-03 02:19:59 <doublec> andrew12|mac, post an address and I'll send you enough bitcoins to view Kiba's pic
 220 2010-12-03 02:20:18 <andrew12> nah, on this PC i don't have all of the chunks, and right now i'm running linux on my desktop (rather than windows, where my main bitcoin install is)
 221 2010-12-03 02:20:34 <andrew12> s/chunks/blocks/ .. i've been playing minecraft too much
 222 2010-12-03 02:24:32 <Foggymyst> Who runs the BitCoin Roulette?
 223 2010-12-03 02:24:35 <Foggymyst> Cashcow?
 224 2010-12-03 02:29:16 <doublec> joe_1
 225 2010-12-03 02:29:33 <doublec> he comes into the channel occasionally
 226 2010-12-03 02:40:49 <Kiba`> Bruce Wagner had to explained how bitcoins work....
 227 2010-12-03 02:41:16 <andrew12> had to explained?
 228 2010-12-03 02:41:25 <andrew12> :D
 229 2010-12-03 02:48:49 bonsaikitten has quit (Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.)
 230 2010-12-03 02:49:01 <Foggymyst> Well, thanks Joe_1.  I doubled my bitcoin.
 231 2010-12-03 02:49:05 bonsaikitten has joined
 232 2010-12-03 02:49:18 theymos has joined
 233 2010-12-03 02:51:35 <theymos> ;;bc,estimate
 234 2010-12-03 02:51:35 <gribble> 10344.20063632
 235 2010-12-03 02:51:36 <theymos> WTF happened to the difficulty estimate!? It went up by like 2000.
 236 2010-12-03 02:52:31 <Foggymyst> Curious.
 237 2010-12-03 02:53:39 <brocktice> someone is bringing 5970s online
 238 2010-12-03 02:53:41 <brocktice> must be
 239 2010-12-03 02:53:45 <brocktice> or similar
 240 2010-12-03 02:53:57 <andrew12> well, it's compiling.
 241 2010-12-03 02:54:01 <andrew12> on my desktop, that is
 242 2010-12-03 02:54:14 <andrew12> wait, i lied. wxgtk is.
 243 2010-12-03 02:54:15 <Foggymyst> So difficulty is driven by rate of generation?
 244 2010-12-03 02:54:23 <theymos> Foggymyst: Yes.
 245 2010-12-03 02:55:42 <theymos> Looks like I'll lose my bet with Lyspooner. :( I'll win on BitcoinSportsBook, though. ;)
 246 2010-12-03 02:57:07 <nelisky> theymos: nice hedging
 247 2010-12-03 02:57:10 <nelisky> :)
 248 2010-12-03 02:58:48 <nanotube> theymos: hehe yea, i mentioned about your bet the other day when i saw estimate going up :)
 249 2010-12-03 02:58:54 <nanotube> andrew12: gribble is python. see ,,version
 250 2010-12-03 02:58:55 <gribble> The current (running) version of this Supybot is 0.83.4.1+gribble (2010-10-10T17:52:04-0400).  The newest version available in the gribble git repository is 0.83.4.1+gribble (2010-12-01T16:53:08-0500).
 251 2010-12-03 02:59:48 <Diablo-D3> brocktice: art must have got his shipment
 252 2010-12-03 03:00:03 <brocktice> Diablo-D3: he said earlier today he only had a couple more online
 253 2010-12-03 03:00:08 <brocktice> and the it wasn't him boosting it so much
 254 2010-12-03 03:00:12 <Diablo-D3> heh
 255 2010-12-03 03:00:24 <brocktice> Also he downclocked his, I think he's running out of juice
 256 2010-12-03 03:00:35 <Diablo-D3> holy shit
 257 2010-12-03 03:00:39 <Diablo-D3> team fortress 2 beta
 258 2010-12-03 03:00:41 * Diablo-D3 shits pants
 259 2010-12-03 03:00:42 <brocktice> figured out he gets more hashes/watt that way
 260 2010-12-03 03:01:00 <Foggymyst> So Art is making a 5970 farm?
 261 2010-12-03 03:01:23 <Diablo-D3> making?
 262 2010-12-03 03:01:26 <Diablo-D3> dude
 263 2010-12-03 03:01:27 <Diablo-D3> HE HAS ONE
 264 2010-12-03 03:01:30 <Diablo-D3> its huge
 265 2010-12-03 03:01:37 <Foggymyst> I dont know much about it, fill me in.
 266 2010-12-03 03:01:47 <mizery> it's like ants, but with graphics cards
 267 2010-12-03 03:02:30 <Foggymyst> Is there a thread about his farm?
 268 2010-12-03 03:03:10 <Foggymyst> I just wanted to know a little more about it.
 269 2010-12-03 03:03:35 <btcex> why nvidia cards are too slow for mining?
 270 2010-12-03 03:04:33 <Diablo-D3> btcex: they're not SLOW slow
 271 2010-12-03 03:04:41 <Diablo-D3> btcex: they're like radeon 4xxx
 272 2010-12-03 03:04:46 <brocktice> Foggymyst: He is currently doing around 16 ghash/s
 273 2010-12-03 03:04:58 <Diablo-D3> well, a tad slower than 4xxx
 274 2010-12-03 03:05:09 <Diablo-D3> btcex: the big thing is 5xxx has hardware shifting instructions
 275 2010-12-03 03:05:15 <btcex> Diablo-D3: approx. 8 times slow what equal ATI cards?
 276 2010-12-03 03:05:22 <btcex> equal by cost
 277 2010-12-03 03:05:23 <brocktice> nvidia cards are much faster than CPUs for example
 278 2010-12-03 03:05:25 <Diablo-D3> you're measuring it somewhat wrong
 279 2010-12-03 03:05:32 <Diablo-D3> you measure in watts not cost
 280 2010-12-03 03:05:37 <Diablo-D3> nvidia uselessly overprices their cards
 281 2010-12-03 03:05:45 <Diablo-D3> but you cant lie about watts
 282 2010-12-03 03:05:54 <brocktice> Diablo-D3: I heard some complaints today about ATI's opencl compilers/drivers.
 283 2010-12-03 03:06:04 <brocktice> Diablo-D3: something about silent corruption and crashes
 284 2010-12-03 03:06:04 <Diablo-D3> btcex: 8000 through gtx 500 are all the same arch
 285 2010-12-03 03:06:09 bertodsera has quit (Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.)
 286 2010-12-03 03:06:15 <btcex> brocktice: and about linux supporting )
 287 2010-12-03 03:06:17 <Diablo-D3> brocktice: this is why you turn crossfire off
 288 2010-12-03 03:06:27 bertodsera has joined
 289 2010-12-03 03:06:36 <Diablo-D3> btcex: gtx 400 is about as efficient as a radeon 4xxx, or about 5x slower than radeon 5xxxes
 290 2010-12-03 03:06:37 zylche has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
 291 2010-12-03 03:06:40 <brocktice> Diablo-D3: that and mining doesn't work right with it on
 292 2010-12-03 03:06:40 <Diablo-D3> btcex: per watt
 293 2010-12-03 03:06:41 <theymos> Foggymyst: <ArtForz> boxes are 4*5970, 4*5970, 2*5970+2*5770, 5970+5770, 5970+6870
 294 2010-12-03 03:06:48 <theymos> http://bayimg.com/PaAflaADC http://bayimg.com/KAAeaaAdp
 295 2010-12-03 03:06:49 <Diablo-D3> brocktice: opencl shits itself on crossfire period
 296 2010-12-03 03:07:19 zylche has joined
 297 2010-12-03 03:07:28 <brocktice> here's my dedicated miner: http://www.flickr.com/photos/brocktice/5195604987/
 298 2010-12-03 03:07:34 <brocktice> my workstation is also running two 5770s
 299 2010-12-03 03:07:45 <brocktice> miner is 75% paid off today
 300 2010-12-03 03:08:11 <andrew12> oh it's supybot
 301 2010-12-03 03:08:27 <btcex> Diablo-D3: watt? why care about watts?
 302 2010-12-03 03:08:31 <brocktice> ;;seen ArtForz
 303 2010-12-03 03:08:32 <gribble> ArtForz was last seen in #bitcoin-dev 3 hours, 39 minutes, and 15 seconds ago: <ArtForz> yes, but 2/4 sounds a bit... high
 304 2010-12-03 03:08:39 <btcex> $$ cost are important
 305 2010-12-03 03:08:49 <brocktice> btcex: long term cost of power is more important
 306 2010-12-03 03:09:04 <brocktice> brb
 307 2010-12-03 03:09:15 <btcex> brocktice: sure? what your electricity prices?
 308 2010-12-03 03:09:18 <Foggymyst> My miner: http://yfrog.com/nd15479515272601344501023j
 309 2010-12-03 03:09:25 <Foggymyst> You think it would be good
 310 2010-12-03 03:09:35 <Foggymyst> Its 166Ghz....of CPU.
 311 2010-12-03 03:09:56 <theymos> Bruce is just making stuff up in his interview... he said that Satoshi is famous and from Tokyo.
 312 2010-12-03 03:10:15 <noagendamarket> haha
 313 2010-12-03 03:10:29 <noagendamarket> thats promotions for you
 314 2010-12-03 03:10:52 <brocktice> btcex: $0.09/kW-h
 315 2010-12-03 03:11:02 <btcex> my prices is 0.0096 $ per kW*h
 316 2010-12-03 03:11:08 <brocktice> wow
 317 2010-12-03 03:11:15 <brocktice> Bruce plays it a little fast and loose with the facts
 318 2010-12-03 03:11:23 <Diablo-D3> btcex: because watts are consistent
 319 2010-12-03 03:11:24 <brocktice> but he sure has a lot of enthusiasm
 320 2010-12-03 03:11:56 <andrew12> gribble is cool
 321 2010-12-03 03:12:02 <Diablo-D3> btcex: nvidia overprices cards
 322 2010-12-03 03:12:07 <Diablo-D3> btcex: because they think people will pay for it
 323 2010-12-03 03:12:10 <btcex> so I do not care about watts
 324 2010-12-03 03:12:27 <btcex> Diablo-D3: yes, because they support linuxes
 325 2010-12-03 03:12:27 <brocktice> That and it determines how many you can fit on a PSU.
 326 2010-12-03 03:12:41 <Diablo-D3> btcex: AMD pays millions of dollars a year to support actual real open source "linuxes"
 327 2010-12-03 03:12:43 <btcex> ATI has buggy scrap drivers
 328 2010-12-03 03:12:49 <Diablo-D3> btcex: nvidia already admitted they dont give a fuck about linux
 329 2010-12-03 03:12:57 <Diablo-D3> and they even threatened to sue the guys who write novaeu
 330 2010-12-03 03:13:36 <btcex> Diablo-D3: hm... In 2006 I has PC with nvidia card. I  sell my ATI card because it won't work on linux
 331 2010-12-03 03:13:44 <brocktice> btcex: I have been there
 332 2010-12-03 03:13:45 <btcex> nvidia works fine
 333 2010-12-03 03:13:47 <Diablo-D3> thats before AMD bought them
 334 2010-12-03 03:13:49 <brocktice> btcex: they are catching up
 335 2010-12-03 03:14:25 <Diablo-D3> btcex: the original ATI fglrx was thrown out
 336 2010-12-03 03:14:32 <Diablo-D3> the new one, now called catalyst, backported the windows code
 337 2010-12-03 03:14:39 <btcex> Now linuxuids buying ati/amd?
 338 2010-12-03 03:14:40 <Diablo-D3> so anyone who says LOL ATI SUCKS is a fucking idiot.
 339 2010-12-03 03:14:43 <Diablo-D3> btcex: yes.
 340 2010-12-03 03:14:53 <Diablo-D3> nvidia already admitted they dont care about linux
 341 2010-12-03 03:14:55 <Diablo-D3> so fuck them
 342 2010-12-03 03:15:03 <Diablo-D3> and they're going to be filing for bankruptcy soon anyhow
 343 2010-12-03 03:15:05 <btcex> Diablo-D3: ok, thans for info
 344 2010-12-03 03:15:12 <brocktice> I was pleasantly surprised by how well ATI works in Linux now.
 345 2010-12-03 03:15:17 <Diablo-D3> btcex: I dont see nvidia releasing entire specification and programming documents for the public
 346 2010-12-03 03:16:20 <btcex> I remember that ATI has opened specs due to the fact that their drivers are complete shit.
 347 2010-12-03 03:16:36 <Diablo-D3> btcex: I dont see nvidia paying X and mesa developers to code an entire new framework to use modern gpus with
 348 2010-12-03 03:16:39 <Diablo-D3> and no
 349 2010-12-03 03:16:42 <Diablo-D3> those so called "drivers"
 350 2010-12-03 03:16:49 <Diablo-D3> were written by the orders of upper management
 351 2010-12-03 03:16:54 <Diablo-D3> they were all fired when AMD bought ATI
 352 2010-12-03 03:16:54 <btcex> But I think that the community will never write such a complicated thing as a 3d video driver
 353 2010-12-03 03:17:00 <Diablo-D3> never?
 354 2010-12-03 03:17:01 <Diablo-D3> lololol
 355 2010-12-03 03:17:04 <Diablo-D3> its already being done
 356 2010-12-03 03:17:09 <brocktice> Didn't they... yeah
 357 2010-12-03 03:17:16 <Diablo-D3> mesa also already has the beginning of a prototype opencl compiler
 358 2010-12-03 03:17:24 <brocktice> argh, bitcoins are not encrypted
 359 2010-12-03 03:17:36 <btcex> Diablo-D3: I thought that*
 360 2010-12-03 03:17:49 <brocktice> It's a herculean undertaking of him to try to explain this on a radio show though
 361 2010-12-03 03:18:00 <Diablo-D3> btcex: first of all, before gallium, we already HAD 3d drivers
 362 2010-12-03 03:18:15 <Diablo-D3> ones that were open source
 363 2010-12-03 03:18:26 <Diablo-D3> Ive sued them, they kind of sucked on modern hardware because the system wasnt designed for it
 364 2010-12-03 03:18:30 <Diablo-D3> gallium IS designed for it
 365 2010-12-03 03:18:37 <Diablo-D3> and ati and intel are both paying for it
 366 2010-12-03 03:18:42 <Diablo-D3> s/ati/amd/
 367 2010-12-03 03:18:53 <btcex> Then I will not worry and just go buy a amd powered pc!
 368 2010-12-03 03:19:23 <brocktice> btcex: I finally got 4 monitors driven with compiz thanks to an ATI card
 369 2010-12-03 03:19:33 <brocktice> I had two nvidia cards and it was a big problem.
 370 2010-12-03 03:19:43 <Diablo-D3> btcex: oh, and as a side note
 371 2010-12-03 03:19:50 <Diablo-D3> btcex: nvidia's opencl impl is not compliant with the spec
 372 2010-12-03 03:19:51 <brocktice> I had the same reaction as you when I started talking with Diablo-D3 in here
 373 2010-12-03 03:19:54 <Diablo-D3> it doesnt work with my miner.
 374 2010-12-03 03:20:03 <Diablo-D3> and its not a bug in my miner
 375 2010-12-03 03:20:05 <brocktice> it works with m0's
 376 2010-12-03 03:20:07 <nanotube> brocktice: did bruce post an mp3 of his radio interview? :)
 377 2010-12-03 03:20:10 <Diablo-D3> m0's doesnt do what I do
 378 2010-12-03 03:20:16 <btcex> So much information - I do not have time for all to follow. Technological Singularity somewhere nearby, I think
 379 2010-12-03 03:20:17 <brocktice> nanotube: yeah
 380 2010-12-03 03:20:19 <theymos> Interview: "Just take a breath, Bruce, It'll be OK" LOL
 381 2010-12-03 03:20:38 <brocktice> http://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=1945.msg26326#msg26326
 382 2010-12-03 03:20:49 <brocktice> theymos: the interviewer is actually pretty good
 383 2010-12-03 03:21:02 <brocktice> he keeps redirecting Bruce in a useful and skillful way
 384 2010-12-03 03:21:03 <nanotube> brocktice: thanks for the linky... heh. how long's the file?
 385 2010-12-03 03:21:14 <theymos> An hour.
 386 2010-12-03 03:21:25 <brocktice> theymos: I think you're just ahead of me
 387 2010-12-03 03:21:38 <nanotube> theymos: maybe i should wait for a transcript hehe
 388 2010-12-03 03:22:54 <brocktice> he got pretty lucky
 389 2010-12-03 03:22:58 <brocktice> 50 bitcoins in two weeks
 390 2010-12-03 03:23:15 <brocktice> Although I don't know when he started.
 391 2010-12-03 03:23:19 <brocktice> ruples?
 392 2010-12-03 03:23:25 <brocktice> Isn't it rubles?
 393 2010-12-03 03:23:34 <brocktice> could be an accident I guess
 394 2010-12-03 03:23:42 <brocktice> b/p are very similar
 395 2010-12-03 03:24:47 <Diablo-D3> btcex: I think the technological singularity already passed
 396 2010-12-03 03:24:58 <Diablo-D3> it wasnt nearly as awesome as the books said it would be
 397 2010-12-03 03:25:14 <Kiba`> why would it already passed?
 398 2010-12-03 03:25:17 <Kiba`> we still don't have AI yet
 399 2010-12-03 03:25:28 <Kiba`> well human level AI
 400 2010-12-03 03:26:00 <Diablo-D3> like I said
 401 2010-12-03 03:26:04 <Diablo-D3> wasnt as good as the books
 402 2010-12-03 03:28:44 <Kiba`> dundundundun
 403 2010-12-03 03:29:07 <btcex> I want to see bitcoinme.com statistics
 404 2010-12-03 03:30:04 <Kiba`> look like the price actually rose
 405 2010-12-03 03:30:07 <btcex> in connection with the radio show
 406 2010-12-03 03:30:08 <Kiba`> could be a coincidence
 407 2010-12-03 03:31:05 <theymos> The interviewer is good. It's hard to make sense of what Bruce is saying, but he manages pretty well.
 408 2010-12-03 03:32:01 <Kiba`> well anybody who try to explain what the heck bitcoin is will have a hard time
 409 2010-12-03 03:32:19 <Foggymyst> Anyone have the address of a good pooled mining group?
 410 2010-12-03 03:32:44 <theymos> "Dozens of world-renowed cryptography experts..." I guess he counts all of us as "cryptography experts" ;)
 411 2010-12-03 03:32:50 <Kiba`> 69.164.214.82
 412 2010-12-03 03:32:53 <[Noodles]> is there more than one group? http://www.bluishcoder.co.nz/bitcoin-pool/
 413 2010-12-03 03:32:59 <Kiba`> it's the only one we know
 414 2010-12-03 03:33:05 <kermit> theymos: we are?  cool, i'll add that to my resume.
 415 2010-12-03 03:33:08 <Kiba`> theymos: LOL.
 416 2010-12-03 03:33:15 <Foggymyst> Ah, roger.
 417 2010-12-03 03:33:50 <Kiba`> I think Bruce Wagner exaggerates some thing
 418 2010-12-03 03:33:59 <Kiba`> he also say that Satoshi is from Tokyo, Japan.
 419 2010-12-03 03:34:20 <nanotube> yea, based on what i'm hearing in this channel, maybe theymos would have done a better job. :)
 420 2010-12-03 03:34:36 <[Noodles]> Kiba: go proove him wrong ^.^
 421 2010-12-03 03:34:38 <nanotube> [Noodles]: btw, there's a ,,pool factoid. for your future reference. :)
 422 2010-12-03 03:34:38 <gribble> No fancy GPU, and don't want to wait for months for a block gen? Join the mining pool! http://www.bluishcoder.co.nz/bitcoin-pool/
 423 2010-12-03 03:34:53 <doublec> now that there are different 'how to calculate payment' options in the pooled miner it'll be interesting to see if other pools pop up and compete on it
 424 2010-12-03 03:34:57 <Foggymyst> You the owner Gribble?
 425 2010-12-03 03:35:01 sgornick has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
 426 2010-12-03 03:35:09 <Kiba`> Gribble is a bot, Foggymyst
 427 2010-12-03 03:35:15 <Foggymyst> Dog.
 428 2010-12-03 03:35:18 <Foggymyst> Er, doh.
 429 2010-12-03 03:35:19 <Foggymyst> =)
 430 2010-12-03 03:35:19 <Kiba`> he doesn't own anything. He's the slave of a certain somebody.
 431 2010-12-03 03:35:22 <Foggymyst> I should have known that.
 432 2010-12-03 03:35:40 <nanotube> heh
 433 2010-12-03 03:35:54 <nanotube> actually doublec is the pool organizer.
 434 2010-12-03 03:35:59 <Foggymyst> Ah
 435 2010-12-03 03:36:13 <doublec> puddinpop's newest code breaks compatibility so when I switch over at some point the existing miners will need to update
 436 2010-12-03 03:36:18 <doublec> I'll be holding off for a while on that though
 437 2010-12-03 03:36:23 <Foggymyst> Whats the new code have?
 438 2010-12-03 03:36:27 <theymos> doublec: Are you switching to the other distribution method?
 439 2010-12-03 03:36:31 <appamatto> doublec, how goes the pooling?
 440 2010-12-03 03:36:35 <doublec> theymos, I haven't decided
 441 2010-12-03 03:36:44 <nanotube> what is the new distribution method?
 442 2010-12-03 03:36:49 <doublec> appamatto, 85 connected licents, about 64000 khash/s
 443 2010-12-03 03:36:54 <Kiba`> doublec: you didn't gitify it :*(
 444 2010-12-03 03:36:55 <doublec> s/licents/clients
 445 2010-12-03 03:37:01 <theymos> The current method is more beneficial for me, but the other method is certainly better for casual users.
 446 2010-12-03 03:37:02 <appamatto> haha
 447 2010-12-03 03:37:05 <Foggymyst> Does the new code allow me to run more than 1 thread per instance?
 448 2010-12-03 03:37:08 <doublec> Kiba`, yeah I'll do something on the weekend
 449 2010-12-03 03:37:09 <Kiba`> GITIFY!
 450 2010-12-03 03:37:10 <appamatto> so together you are one of ArtForz's machines
 451 2010-12-03 03:37:19 <theymos> appamatto: Not even close.
 452 2010-12-03 03:37:31 <doublec> we're about equivalent to a bad nvidia card
 453 2010-12-03 03:37:34 <Kiba`> Why should ArtFOrz contribute?
 454 2010-12-03 03:37:49 <appamatto> hey, you're better than my good nvidia card
 455 2010-12-03 03:37:50 <Foggymyst> doublec: I think I am contributing a little more than half of the pools power.... let me know when you make the switch
 456 2010-12-03 03:37:56 <Foggymyst> doublec: I wont be around this weekend.
 457 2010-12-03 03:38:00 <theymos> Kiba`: He shouldn't. He would be earning slightly less.
 458 2010-12-03 03:38:05 <doublec> Foggymyst, are you the 24 core person?
 459 2010-12-03 03:38:09 <Foggymyst> Yah
 460 2010-12-03 03:38:12 <doublec> nice!
 461 2010-12-03 03:38:12 <Foggymyst> I got two 24 core machines
 462 2010-12-03 03:38:15 <appamatto> Is this compatible with GPU generation?
 463 2010-12-03 03:38:18 <Kiba`> wowzer
 464 2010-12-03 03:38:25 <doublec> I'll probably switch after the weekend sometime
 465 2010-12-03 03:38:27 <Foggymyst> But I have to open 24 command line windows on each machine.
 466 2010-12-03 03:38:41 <andrew12> http://fxnet.co.cc/ looks interesting
 467 2010-12-03 03:38:45 <doublec> appamatto, currently there are no GPU compatible remote miners
 468 2010-12-03 03:38:47 <Foggymyst> Since remoteminer is single threaded.
 469 2010-12-03 03:38:55 <doublec> appamatto, but I'd like to get one done
 470 2010-12-03 03:38:57 <Kiba`> it need to be multithreaded!
 471 2010-12-03 03:39:15 <appamatto> doublec, does the pool do anything other than lower variance?
 472 2010-12-03 03:39:34 <Kiba`> lower variance?
 473 2010-12-03 03:39:34 <doublec> appamatto, no, that's all it does
 474 2010-12-03 03:39:52 <doublec> appamatto, it allows smaller cpu's to get smaller amounts of coins sooner
 475 2010-12-03 03:40:22 <doublec> so it'd be nice to get at least one gpu to join to up the rate that the cpu's get something
 476 2010-12-03 03:40:53 <Foggymyst> Yah, theres a lot of work that needs to be done. =)
 477 2010-12-03 03:41:05 <Foggymyst> I am pretty blown away at how well GPUs doing integer math.
 478 2010-12-03 03:41:06 <doublec> it'd be much nicer to get .2 coins every 6 hours than 50 coins every 2 months
 479 2010-12-03 03:41:22 <Foggymyst> I had heard about it...but didn't actually see the difference.
 480 2010-12-03 03:41:53 <Foggymyst> doublec: When was the last block decrypted?
 481 2010-12-03 03:41:56 <Kiba`> wee! Thanks for the bacon
 482 2010-12-03 03:41:57 <Foggymyst> Or whatever the term is. ;)
 483 2010-12-03 03:42:21 <Kiba`> 3 people download my file. Now, I already made .27 cents
 484 2010-12-03 03:42:39 <doublec> Foggymyst, we haven't had one yet. Now that you're part of the pool we should average 6 days or so
 485 2010-12-03 03:42:48 <Foggymyst> Cool!
 486 2010-12-03 03:42:55 <Foggymyst> I got super, super lucky the other day.
 487 2010-12-03 03:42:56 <doublec> the pools only be running a few days
 488 2010-12-03 03:43:16 <Foggymyst> I heard about bitcoin, a few hours later had the GPU client going and when I woke up I had 50BTC.
 489 2010-12-03 03:43:26 <doublec> nice!
 490 2010-12-03 03:43:31 <noagendamarket> thats awesome
 491 2010-12-03 03:43:32 <Kiba`> LUCKY LUCKY LUCKY LUCKY
 492 2010-12-03 03:43:52 <noagendamarket> now youre hooked ?
 493 2010-12-03 03:43:54 <Foggymyst> It felt really rewarding.  Since then, nothing.
 494 2010-12-03 03:43:55 <noagendamarket> lol
 495 2010-12-03 03:43:56 <Foggymyst> yah
 496 2010-12-03 03:44:05 <Foggymyst> I took the 50BTC and played roulette and now have 101.
 497 2010-12-03 03:44:10 <Foggymyst> My empire's genesis.
 498 2010-12-03 03:44:11 <doublec> haha
 499 2010-12-03 03:44:17 <Kiba`> LUCKY LUCKY LUCKY LUCKY
 500 2010-12-03 03:44:29 <theymos> doublec: What happens to the sub-0.01 portions when it's time to pay out? Does the pool get it?
 501 2010-12-03 03:44:31 <Kiba`> I am earning bitcoins through the hard way
 502 2010-12-03 03:44:41 <doublec> theymos, the server gets it
 503 2010-12-03 03:44:58 <Foggymyst> I kind of want to work on the bitcoin video.
 504 2010-12-03 03:45:09 <btcex> Why do not we call bitcoin a 'digital cash'? Very precise definition, removing many of the issues
 505 2010-12-03 03:45:10 <doublec> the pooled server takes a bit more cpu than I expected
 506 2010-12-03 03:45:11 <noagendamarket> youre welcome too
 507 2010-12-03 03:45:18 <doublec> the vps is averaging about 60% usage
 508 2010-12-03 03:45:21 <theymos> It would be cool if the change went to whichever node actually ended up solving the block.
 509 2010-12-03 03:45:24 <appamatto> How do you deal with cheating?
 510 2010-12-03 03:45:34 <doublec> theymos, can you send sub 0.01 amouints?
 511 2010-12-03 03:45:45 <Kiba`> I thought the bitcoin block get distributed?
 512 2010-12-03 03:46:11 <doublec> Kiba`, it gets distributed amongst the participants. any roundoff goes to the server.
 513 2010-12-03 03:46:22 <Kiba`> roundoff?
 514 2010-12-03 03:46:47 <Kiba`> so pudding the guy doing the development?
 515 2010-12-03 03:47:13 <doublec> "This means the generated coins will have precision all the way down to the smallest decimal place bitcoin allows.  Because of rounding issues inherit with floating point operations, the server will accrue all left over fractional coins, which almost always be a single digit number at the smallest decimal position."
 516 2010-12-03 03:47:14 <theymos> doublec: When you add all of the individual sub-0.01 amounts from all of the addresses, you should get some sendable amount. (And since you're a generator, it's possible for you to exempt sub-0.01 restrictions from just your transactions.)
 517 2010-12-03 03:47:21 <doublec> from: http://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=1458.0
 518 2010-12-03 03:47:43 <doublec> so it'll actually be 0.00000001
 519 2010-12-03 03:47:44 <doublec> or so
 520 2010-12-03 03:48:15 <doublec> Kiba`, yes, puddinpop is doing the development
 521 2010-12-03 03:48:36 <noagendamarket> how do you monitor that?
 522 2010-12-03 03:49:35 OneFixt_ has joined
 523 2010-12-03 03:50:31 sgornick has joined
 524 2010-12-03 03:50:44 <Kiba`> so a 50 bitcoin will get subdivided into nothingness?
 525 2010-12-03 03:51:14 <Kiba`> maybe you could distribute earning based on the portion of hashrate you contributed
 526 2010-12-03 03:51:14 <noagendamarket> how many .00000001 are in 50btc?
 527 2010-12-03 03:51:19 <noagendamarket> lol
 528 2010-12-03 03:51:38 <Kiba`> not all miners are created equal
 529 2010-12-03 03:51:42 <Kiba`> some are better than others.
 530 2010-12-03 03:51:52 OneFixt has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
 531 2010-12-03 03:51:56 <Kiba`> All miners are equal. Some miners are more equal than others.
 532 2010-12-03 03:51:59 <doublec> Kiba`, in the latest code drop there are two distribution options
 533 2010-12-03 03:52:01 <CyanDynamo> isn't that how it's one
 534 2010-12-03 03:52:05 <CyanDynamo> done*
 535 2010-12-03 03:52:10 <doublec> Kiba`, one is based on khash value
 536 2010-12-03 03:52:17 <doublec> Kiba`, the other is on actual hashes contributed
 537 2010-12-03 03:52:27 OneFixt has joined
 538 2010-12-03 03:52:42 <Kiba`> oh.. so it isn't....spilt equally for everyone
 539 2010-12-03 03:52:44 <doublec> My server is currently using the first option since that's all that was available in that version of the server
 540 2010-12-03 03:52:48 <doublec> Kiba`, correcty
 541 2010-12-03 03:52:52 OneFixt has quit (Changing host)
 542 2010-12-03 03:52:53 OneFixt has joined
 543 2010-12-03 03:53:06 <doublec> Kiba`, when you run a miner it periodically tells you what your portion will be if a block is generated
 544 2010-12-03 03:53:34 <doublec> eg: Address X will receive 0.774018 BTC if this block is solved
 545 2010-12-03 03:54:03 <Kiba`> I never get that information
 546 2010-12-03 03:54:07 <Kiba`> perhaps I need to update
 547 2010-12-03 03:54:10 <Kiba`> but it's a pain
 548 2010-12-03 03:54:12 <Kiba`> I want git.
 549 2010-12-03 03:54:12 OneFixt_ has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
 550 2010-12-03 03:54:40 <doublec> Yeah, that's only shown with the miner update before this most recent one
 551 2010-12-03 03:55:33 <doublec> Kiba`, if I do a git now would you test it right now?
 552 2010-12-03 03:56:18 <theymos> I wonder if the server is trying to create a block with a ton of outputs, splitting the earned amount immediately. Then you could distribute sub-0.01 amounts easily.
 553 2010-12-03 03:57:15 <Kiba`> yes
 554 2010-12-03 03:58:05 <doublec> Kiba`, ok give me a few minutes
 555 2010-12-03 03:58:09 ooze__ has quit (Quit: leaving)
 556 2010-12-03 04:00:32 <btcex> What do you think is ethical to publish the address of exchange user? hi is scammer
 557 2010-12-03 04:01:05 <theymos> I say do it if you know for sure he's a scammer.
 558 2010-12-03 04:01:18 <Kiba`> blacklist?
 559 2010-12-03 04:01:39 <Kiba`> interesting. Blacklist database.
 560 2010-12-03 04:01:46 <btcex> https://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=1070.msg24892#msg24892 (russian)
 561 2010-12-03 04:02:00 <Kiba`> though it doesn't actually do anything if generate a new address
 562 2010-12-03 04:02:07 <btcex> we need tool for view of graph of the transactions
 563 2010-12-03 04:02:23 <btcex> sql db with transactions + viewer
 564 2010-12-03 04:02:49 <theymos> I was thinking of creating a feature for BBE that would mark scam addresses and all addresses that recieved coins from that address (over multiple levels). Would that be useful?
 565 2010-12-03 04:03:05 <Kiba`> theymos: it would hurt reputable users who recevied from that address
 566 2010-12-03 04:03:26 <btcex> theymos: they conduct money for HYIP :) and after 2-3 month his HYIP funds was stolen by one of his traders
 567 2010-12-03 04:03:41 <btcex> I thing this story is bullshit
 568 2010-12-03 04:03:48 <theymos> Kiba`: That's one of the reasons I haven't implemented it. It's impossible to say for sure that "dirty coins" = "bad person".
 569 2010-12-03 04:03:51 <Kiba`> a trading group?
 570 2010-12-03 04:04:22 <Kiba`> I heard one of the investing club had to liquidate the money
 571 2010-12-03 04:04:34 <Kiba`> had to liquidate their assets
 572 2010-12-03 04:04:36 <btcex> theymos: what db you use? if you use postgres i can write query for searching our scammer
 573 2010-12-03 04:05:01 <theymos> btcex: I do use postgres.
 574 2010-12-03 04:05:11 <doublec> Kiba`, https://github.com/doublec/bitcoin-pool
 575 2010-12-03 04:05:20 mizery has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
 576 2010-12-03 04:05:49 <Kiba`> thanks
 577 2010-12-03 04:06:03 <btcex> theymos: can you give me access to db for reading?
 578 2010-12-03 04:06:31 mizery has joined
 579 2010-12-03 04:07:00 <Kiba`> doublec: it didn't have installation guide
 580 2010-12-03 04:07:18 <doublec> Kiba`, just do: cmake .
 581 2010-12-03 04:07:25 <doublec> in the root of the github repository
 582 2010-12-03 04:07:34 <doublec> I'll write a README and stuff laster
 583 2010-12-03 04:07:36 <Kiba`> gottach
 584 2010-12-03 04:07:36 <doublec> later
 585 2010-12-03 04:07:41 <Kiba`> what's the license?
 586 2010-12-03 04:08:18 <theymos> btcex: Hmm... I never intended the database to be accessible over the Internet. I disabled all such features in the configuration file, and possibly at compilation (can't remember). If you really want I'll create a temporary ssh account for you.
 587 2010-12-03 04:08:42 <doublec> Kiba`, puddinpop's changes are GPL
 588 2010-12-03 04:08:44 <btcex> theymos: ok
 589 2010-12-03 04:08:50 <doublec> Kiba`, 2 or later
 590 2010-12-03 04:09:27 <btcex> theymos: (My db is accessible from internet, I trust to the database code :))
 591 2010-12-03 04:09:47 <Kiba`> it works
 592 2010-12-03 04:09:52 <doublec> great!
 593 2010-12-03 04:10:54 <btcex> theymos: can you implement graph viewer? I think it's not hard. need a field for entering addresses of interest. search chains involving these addresses and viewer
 594 2010-12-03 04:11:20 <btcex> and field for interesting 'radius' of searching.
 595 2010-12-03 04:11:29 <theymos> btcex: I might at some point. I'm awfully busy with college now, but I'll soon get about a month off.
 596 2010-12-03 04:11:37 <Kiba`> oh yeah, this is good stuff, doublec
 597 2010-12-03 04:11:49 <btcex> the postgres supports excellent 'recursive' queries for that
 598 2010-12-03 04:12:35 <btcex> theymos: ok, maybe I'll do it faster for domestic use
 599 2010-12-03 04:13:17 <btcex> theymos: as you read the contents of the chains to the database?
 600 2010-12-03 04:13:23 <btcex> theymos: how you read the contents of the chains to the database?
 601 2010-12-03 04:13:33 <theymos> I process getblock output.
 602 2010-12-03 04:15:19 <btcex> theymos: how you get updates to db? periodically reread?
 603 2010-12-03 04:16:11 <theymos> The pages are fetched from the database on-the-fly. Load is significantly reduced through good if-none-match support.
 604 2010-12-03 04:17:38 <btcex> theymos: I am about bitcoind -> db
 605 2010-12-03 04:18:17 <btcex> oh, is it not a standard getblock command :(
 606 2010-12-03 04:20:20 <theymos> btcex: Blocks are not usually changed. Whenever I update, I do re-check the last 5 blocks since my last update in case some happened to be superseded.
 607 2010-12-03 04:26:09 <andrew12> how do other miners work anyways? like, how does the client know when they solve a block?
 608 2010-12-03 04:26:57 <theymos> The hash needs to be below the target. Current target: http://blockexplorer.com/q/hextarget
 609 2010-12-03 04:28:07 <andrew12> i'm aware. how does a miner tell Bitcoin itself when it solves a block
 610 2010-12-03 04:28:48 <theymos> I think it counts the leading zeroes, and Bitcoin checks that it meets the rest of the target.
 611 2010-12-03 04:31:37 <Foggymyst> It seems like the only way to build a bitcoin miner is to check out the source for an exsisting miner.  There doesn't appear to be a technical document on how the solving is done.  Am I correct?
 612 2010-12-03 04:31:59 <andrew12> you're probably right
 613 2010-12-03 04:34:11 <jgarzik> Foggymyst: correct
 614 2010-12-03 04:34:17 <Foggymyst> Gargh. ;)
 615 2010-12-03 04:34:25 <jgarzik> Foggymyst: my demonstration miner was intended to be small and easy to read for programmers
 616 2010-12-03 04:34:32 <Foggymyst> Oh yah?
 617 2010-12-03 04:34:36 <Foggymyst> Link?
 618 2010-12-03 04:34:40 <andrew12> ^^
 619 2010-12-03 04:34:44 <noagendamarket> http://forum.icann.org/lists/5gtld-guide/pdf4SSmb5oOd5.pdf   FFFUUUUU!!!
 620 2010-12-03 04:34:54 <jgarzik> Foggymyst: http://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=1925.0;all
 621 2010-12-03 04:35:13 <jgarzik> GPL'd
 622 2010-12-03 04:35:59 <Foggymyst> Awesome, thank you.
 623 2010-12-03 04:36:42 <nanotube> doublec: based on total hashes contributed seems like a better way to distribute...
 624 2010-12-03 04:37:04 <doublec> nanotube, yeah sounds like it
 625 2010-12-03 04:39:06 <[Noodles]> that's like guaranteed coins, isnt it?
 626 2010-12-03 04:39:41 <[Noodles]> you dont know how much, but u'll get some
 627 2010-12-03 04:40:17 mizery has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
 628 2010-12-03 04:41:49 <andrew12> oh. it calls getwork with a hash
 629 2010-12-03 04:41:52 <nanotube> btcex: heh, so bitcointrade.biz went tits up eh? i've been keeping an eye on the thread waiting for it to do so. heh.
 630 2010-12-03 04:42:56 <theymos> Mtgox told me that the scammer or someone close to him deposited like 60,000 BTC in MtGox. I can't believe so many people fell for it.
 631 2010-12-03 04:44:29 redengin has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
 632 2010-12-03 04:45:11 <nanotube> theymos: "the" scammer? there's only one?
 633 2010-12-03 04:45:29 <nanotube> or are you talking specifically about the bitcointrade.biz guys?
 634 2010-12-03 04:46:04 <theymos> I'm talking about bitcointrade.biz. They either moved everything to MtGox, or they sold it to someone and that person moved it to MtGox.
 635 2010-12-03 04:46:22 <nanotube> ah mmm how did mtgox know it was them?
 636 2010-12-03 04:46:46 <theymos> Tracked them through BBE. ;) Because of the ambiguity of the situation, I think he decided to just let them sell.
 637 2010-12-03 04:47:13 <nanotube> mmmm i c. in mtgox's place, i'd have held the funds pending detailed investigation...
 638 2010-12-03 04:47:23 <nanotube> and btw, bbe ftw :D
 639 2010-12-03 04:48:08 <theymos> Yeah; I recommended that he hold the funds and post on the forum about it.
 640 2010-12-03 04:48:14 <MacRohard> eh. what can you do
 641 2010-12-03 04:49:11 <MacRohard> it looks like bitcointrade.biz' operating model calls for them to sell large quantities of borrowed bitcoins in order to try and make money
 642 2010-12-03 04:49:17 <andrew12> how much were they selling it for?
 643 2010-12-03 04:50:04 <MacRohard> so.. maybe they're just doign what it says they do on their site - i dunno though they may well be scammers.
 644 2010-12-03 04:51:47 btcex has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
 645 2010-12-03 04:51:48 <nanotube> MacRohard: well according to the forum thread, their money has been absconded with by one of their traders.
 646 2010-12-03 04:52:00 <nanotube> so they're no longer doing anything with it, really.
 647 2010-12-03 04:52:05 <andrew12> link to thread?
 648 2010-12-03 04:52:13 <MacRohard> nanotube, ahh
 649 2010-12-03 04:52:13 <Kiba`> a large scale scam?
 650 2010-12-03 04:52:30 <andrew12> is this the first ever bitscam?
 651 2010-12-03 04:52:42 <Kiba`> no
 652 2010-12-03 04:52:53 <Kiba`> somebody scammed mtgox
 653 2010-12-03 04:52:57 <Kiba`> it lead to a bank run
 654 2010-12-03 04:53:11 <andrew12> :|
 655 2010-12-03 04:53:11 <Kiba`> so no moar paypal
 656 2010-12-03 04:53:16 <nanotube> andrew12: haha certainly not the first ever. there was a paypal scam wave some months before.
 657 2010-12-03 04:53:34 <nanotube> andrew12: https://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=1070.40 that's the thread.
 658 2010-12-03 04:53:35 sgornick has quit (Changing host)
 659 2010-12-03 04:53:35 sgornick has joined
 660 2010-12-03 04:53:37 <noagendamarket> the first scam was a cuda client
 661 2010-12-03 04:53:40 <theymos> The transfer in question (actually 90,000 BTC): http://blockexplorer.com/t/2AcJQPERK1
 662 2010-12-03 04:53:56 <nanotube> noagendamarket: that wasn't a scam. puddinpop clearly declared the 10% fee.
 663 2010-12-03 04:54:11 <noagendamarket> no it wasnt that
 664 2010-12-03 04:54:21 <nanotube> theymos: ah i remember the guy asking on the forums about it. complaining about the 1000 usd withdrawal limit...
 665 2010-12-03 04:54:28 <nanotube> noagendamarket: oh? something else?
 666 2010-12-03 04:54:33 <MacRohard> yea some guy offered to sell a cuda client (without having one) and people just sent him money
 667 2010-12-03 04:54:40 <nanotube> ah hehe ic.
 668 2010-12-03 04:54:43 <Kiba`> puddingpop?
 669 2010-12-03 04:54:44 <noagendamarket> yea what macrohard said
 670 2010-12-03 04:54:48 <nanotube> scammers suck
 671 2010-12-03 04:55:14 <Kiba`> we're learning a new way of living in this world
 672 2010-12-03 04:55:44 <andrew12> yay for google's magic translate
 673 2010-12-03 04:55:59 sgornick has quit (Quit: Leaving.)
 674 2010-12-03 04:56:42 andrew12 has quit (Quit: Lost terminal)
 675 2010-12-03 04:57:15 sgornick has joined
 676 2010-12-03 04:59:57 * nanotube thinks about offering for sale a nonexistent super-cpu miner that's capable of getting 100mhps out of a intel corei7. under a pseudonym of course... >:3
 677 2010-12-03 05:00:07 <entel> bitcoin scams, fascinating
 678 2010-12-03 05:00:31 <noagendamarket> lol nanotube
 679 2010-12-03 05:00:35 <Kiba`> well, people are going to scam and they're going to get away with it
 680 2010-12-03 05:00:37 <Kiba`> but people will learn
 681 2010-12-03 05:00:43 btcex has joined
 682 2010-12-03 05:00:53 <Kiba`> at least until new suckers come along
 683 2010-12-03 05:00:58 <btcex> <btcex> nanotube: probably
 684 2010-12-03 05:00:58 <btcex> <btcex> nanotube: but what you want from the Russian HYIP ? :)
 685 2010-12-03 05:00:58 <btcex> <btcex> I do not know how this phenomenon is common in the West but in Russia all sorts of pyramids and deceptions on the Internet is 95% of business :)
 686 2010-12-03 05:00:58 <btcex> <btcex> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MMM_(Ponzi_scheme) - epic from 1994
 687 2010-12-03 05:00:58 <btcex> <btcex> and people have not changed :)
 688 2010-12-03 05:01:00 <btcex> <btcex> 95% of internet business*
 689 2010-12-03 05:01:06 <nanotube> entel: one thing history has shown with almost perfect regularity, is that scammers are always quick to the party. :)
 690 2010-12-03 05:01:16 <entel> heh
 691 2010-12-03 05:01:26 <nanotube> btcex: haha yea, good old MMM.
 692 2010-12-03 05:01:34 <entel> my first thoughts when i discovered bitcoin
 693 2010-12-03 05:01:39 <btcex> nanotube: You know about it?
 694 2010-12-03 05:02:09 andrew12 has joined
 695 2010-12-03 05:02:16 <theymos> Trying to track down the scammers -- like people are doing with the fake GPU seller -- really works to discourage scams, I think.
 696 2010-12-03 05:02:32 <entel> lets catch em all
 697 2010-12-03 05:02:40 <andrew12> Gotta catch 'em all!
 698 2010-12-03 05:02:49 <entel> is my point
 699 2010-12-03 05:02:51 <nanotube> right :)
 700 2010-12-03 05:02:59 <entel> in the vein of a popular japanese cartoon
 701 2010-12-03 05:03:01 <nanotube> btcex: yes. :)
 702 2010-12-03 05:03:09 <andrew12> Bitcoin users are like pokemon
 703 2010-12-03 05:03:15 <entel> lol
 704 2010-12-03 05:03:29 <entel> alright im done pulluting this intelligent conversation
 705 2010-12-03 05:03:30 <Diablo-D3> bzzt
 706 2010-12-03 05:03:34 * entel leaves
 707 2010-12-03 05:03:35 <Diablo-D3> popular japanese GAME
 708 2010-12-03 05:03:37 <andrew12> haha
 709 2010-12-03 05:03:42 <andrew12> it's a show
 710 2010-12-03 05:03:42 <Diablo-D3> everyone always forgets that fucking game came first
 711 2010-12-03 05:03:47 <noagendamarket> lmao pokemon
 712 2010-12-03 05:03:51 <Diablo-D3> before the show, before the card game
 713 2010-12-03 05:03:55 Foggymyst has quit (Quit: Page closed)
 714 2010-12-03 05:04:00 <andrew12> >the card game
 715 2010-12-03 05:04:02 <andrew12> >the game
 716 2010-12-03 05:04:07 <entel> i should know i had it on gameboy
 717 2010-12-03 05:04:08 <Diablo-D3> the game as in the gameboy one
 718 2010-12-03 05:04:13 <noagendamarket> rule 34 on pokemon
 719 2010-12-03 05:04:14 <Diablo-D3> the fucking shitty ass boring game
 720 2010-12-03 05:04:23 <Diablo-D3> noagendamarket: I have seen missingno fucking misty.
 721 2010-12-03 05:04:24 <andrew12> noagendamarket: it's been done
 722 2010-12-03 05:04:24 <nanotube> haha, no worse than the anime itself. :P
 723 2010-12-03 05:04:27 <Diablo-D3> thats pretty much played out.
 724 2010-12-03 05:04:27 <entel> its pretty awesome if u were 12/13
 725 2010-12-03 05:04:29 <andrew12> Diablo-D3: omg
 726 2010-12-03 05:04:30 <Diablo-D3> well
 727 2010-12-03 05:04:39 <Diablo-D3> after saying no to pokemon for a whole fucking decade
 728 2010-12-03 05:04:41 <Diablo-D3> I finally played one
 729 2010-12-03 05:04:53 * entel exits silently
 730 2010-12-03 05:04:56 <btcex> I do supermega search on the chains and concluded the graph but if getblock will be in the official version of the client
 731 2010-12-03 05:05:00 <Diablo-D3> Im glad I pirated it, because it took me all of 2 days to do it
 732 2010-12-03 05:05:00 <btcex> I can do*
 733 2010-12-03 05:05:04 <Diablo-D3> about 12 hours total
 734 2010-12-03 05:05:11 <Diablo-D3> why the fuck do people pay money for this shit
 735 2010-12-03 05:05:23 <Diablo-D3> it was absolutely fucking boring grind fests
 736 2010-12-03 05:05:33 <Diablo-D3> my lvl 99 mudkip was nigh invinsible
 737 2010-12-03 05:05:43 <Kiba`> 99.99% of all MMO are grindfest
 738 2010-12-03 05:05:51 <andrew12> Diablo-D3: did you hack it and get missingno?
 739 2010-12-03 05:05:56 <Diablo-D3> andrew12: wrong one
 740 2010-12-03 05:05:56 <Kiba`> what's new
 741 2010-12-03 05:06:04 <andrew12> figured
 742 2010-12-03 05:06:07 <Diablo-D3> this was the one with team magma and aqua in it
 743 2010-12-03 05:06:12 <Diablo-D3> platinum?
 744 2010-12-03 05:06:18 <andrew12> i've never actually played the games so i have no idea
 745 2010-12-03 05:06:19 <andrew12> :p
 746 2010-12-03 05:06:20 * Diablo-D3 cant keep them straight
 747 2010-12-03 05:06:25 <Diablo-D3> all I know is
 748 2010-12-03 05:06:27 <Diablo-D3> it didnt have team rocket
 749 2010-12-03 05:06:38 <Diablo-D3> which is about the only thing the pokemon franchise had going for it
 750 2010-12-03 05:07:18 <Diablo-D3> and a lvl99 mudkip is unstoppable rape
 751 2010-12-03 05:08:07 <Diablo-D3> I mean, seriously, I dont get the point of the game
 752 2010-12-03 05:08:13 <andrew12> so i herd u liek mudkipz
 753 2010-12-03 05:08:13 <Diablo-D3> even for "kids", that makes no sense
 754 2010-12-03 05:08:25 <Kiba`> da whole point is to catch them all
 755 2010-12-03 05:08:27 <Diablo-D3> I played fucking dragon warrior 1 when I was 8
 756 2010-12-03 05:08:33 <Diablo-D3> and beat it
 757 2010-12-03 05:08:42 <Diablo-D3> and that was a more enjoyable grindfest than this
 758 2010-12-03 05:08:48 <noagendamarket> its all dand d
 759 2010-12-03 05:08:55 <andrew12> i still think it's funny that i managed to memorize the pokemon theme song when i never deliberately watched the show
 760 2010-12-03 05:08:55 <noagendamarket> with eye candy
 761 2010-12-03 05:09:11 <Diablo-D3> andrew12: but you got to carch them all (pokemon!)
 762 2010-12-03 05:09:12 <andrew12> okay well
 763 2010-12-03 05:09:21 <noagendamarket> *thinks justin bieber is a pokemon
 764 2010-12-03 05:09:24 <andrew12> i'm going to watch big bang theory then go to sleep (maybe)
 765 2010-12-03 05:09:34 <Diablo-D3> noagendamarket: Im pretty sure there are no lesbian pokemon
 766 2010-12-03 05:09:40 <andrew12> noagendamarket: hey, try typing /me thinks justin bieber is a pokemon
 767 2010-12-03 05:09:55 <Diablo-D3> actually
 768 2010-12-03 05:10:07 <Diablo-D3> I think Ive seen rule 34 of just that
 769 2010-12-03 05:10:14 <Diablo-D3> in non-overtly furry form
 770 2010-12-03 05:10:17 <andrew12> you would
 771 2010-12-03 05:10:33 <Diablo-D3> I once went through an entire rule 34 thread on an old defunct -chan
 772 2010-12-03 05:10:39 <Diablo-D3> it was interesting.
 773 2010-12-03 05:11:22 <Diablo-D3> theres a picture of bart fucking a futa mrs hill out there.
 774 2010-12-03 05:11:39 <andrew12> what has been seen cannot be unseen
 775 2010-12-03 05:12:07 <Diablo-D3> its not really that bad.
 776 2010-12-03 05:12:10 <noagendamarket> lol
 777 2010-12-03 05:12:23 <Diablo-D3> I mean, you've seen one 54 year old woman with a dick, you've seen them all
 778 2010-12-03 05:12:27 <noagendamarket> some guy in australia went to jail because of simpsons porn
 779 2010-12-03 05:12:32 <andrew12> who wants to send me bitcoins because i'm cool?!
 780 2010-12-03 05:12:40 <andrew12> inb4 no one
 781 2010-12-03 05:12:43 <nanotube> andrew12: only if you send me back twice as much. :P
 782 2010-12-03 05:12:49 <Diablo-D3> noagendamarket: which is insane, bart is in his 20s now
 783 2010-12-03 05:13:10 <noagendamarket> yeah incest is still illegal tho lol
 784 2010-12-03 05:13:13 <nanotube> andrew12: in fact, let's just cancel them out right now, you can send me 50btc please. :)
 785 2010-12-03 05:13:21 <Diablo-D3> noagendamarket: but they're all actors, its not real
 786 2010-12-03 05:13:31 <noagendamarket> try telling that to the judge
 787 2010-12-03 05:13:38 <andrew12> nanotube: okay. my balance would be -50
 788 2010-12-03 05:13:39 <Diablo-D3> I just want to nuke all of australia
 789 2010-12-03 05:13:47 <nanotube> andrew12: haha, that's acceptable to me. :P
 790 2010-12-03 05:13:52 <Diablo-D3> it would solve quite a few world problems
 791 2010-12-03 05:14:10 <Diablo-D3> like, for one, who the fuck puts shrimp on a barbie?
 792 2010-12-03 05:14:11 <nanotube> i think there are other places, nuking which would solve even more problems.
 793 2010-12-03 05:14:13 <Diablo-D3> thats disgusting
 794 2010-12-03 05:14:22 <noagendamarket> http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/news/2010/01/simpsons-powerpuff-girls-porn-nets-jail-time-for-australian.ars
 795 2010-12-03 05:14:35 <Diablo-D3> noagendamarket: yes, and Im glad I live in the free world
 796 2010-12-03 05:14:41 <Diablo-D3> ZOMG THINK OF THE CHILDREN
 797 2010-12-03 05:14:48 <noagendamarket> we still have a fuckin queen
 798 2010-12-03 05:14:59 <Diablo-D3> noagendamarket: I thought Freddy Mercury died?
 799 2010-12-03 05:15:01 <Diablo-D3> dohohohoho
 800 2010-12-03 05:15:02 <andrew12> the children are the ones looking at it
 801 2010-12-03 05:15:06 <noagendamarket> lol
 802 2010-12-03 05:15:25 <noagendamarket> Im andrew12 and what is this?
 803 2010-12-03 05:15:29 <Diablo-D3> man, I am awesome
 804 2010-12-03 05:15:31 <noagendamarket> hehe
 805 2010-12-03 05:15:44 <andrew12> except i'm not 12
 806 2010-12-03 05:15:56 <Diablo-D3> you're not 12 inches either
 807 2010-12-03 05:16:09 <andrew12> you would know that
 808 2010-12-03 05:16:25 <noagendamarket> haha
 809 2010-12-03 05:16:29 <Diablo-D3> Im pretty sure famous porn stars are not interested in bitcoin
 810 2010-12-03 05:16:34 <noagendamarket> 12 inches of gpu
 811 2010-12-03 05:16:38 <andrew12> Diablo-D3: this is true
 812 2010-12-03 05:16:54 <andrew12> noagendamarket: one of my friends has a gpu that's fucking enormous
 813 2010-12-03 05:16:59 <nanotube> Diablo-D3: maybe as a means to get paid? :)
 814 2010-12-03 05:17:11 <Diablo-D3> now, in honor of freddie mercury, I am now listening to bohemian rhapsody
 815 2010-12-03 05:17:18 <noagendamarket> I dont even have a gpu :(
 816 2010-12-03 05:17:22 <Diablo-D3> also, you wont beat real commercial shit
 817 2010-12-03 05:17:33 <Diablo-D3> there once was a gpu that came on 3 full sized boards
 818 2010-12-03 05:17:41 <Diablo-D3> and the geomeotry processor was a DEC Alpha
 819 2010-12-03 05:17:50 <Diablo-D3> full sized == at least 12 inches long
 820 2010-12-03 05:18:09 <Diablo-D3> you will NOT fit it in most cases
 821 2010-12-03 05:18:15 <Diablo-D3> fucking huge fucker
 822 2010-12-03 05:18:16 <noagendamarket> what size case do you need for that>
 823 2010-12-03 05:18:26 <Diablo-D3> I think the workstations it was for were EATX sized
 824 2010-12-03 05:18:35 <Diablo-D3> some SGI fuckers I think
 825 2010-12-03 05:18:35 <noagendamarket> woot casemod
 826 2010-12-03 05:18:43 <btcex> By the way, it is reall make a card for sha256 cracking
 827 2010-12-03 05:18:55 <Diablo-D3> but the framebuffer was on card
 828 2010-12-03 05:18:57 <Diablo-D3> the geometry on the other
 829 2010-12-03 05:19:08 <Diablo-D3> and a rudiemntary fragment processor of sorts on the third
 830 2010-12-03 05:19:16 <btcex> Why CUDA has small kHash/s speed?
 831 2010-12-03 05:19:22 <Diablo-D3> btcex: not cuda, its the hardware
 832 2010-12-03 05:19:30 <btcex> oops, yes, NVidia
 833 2010-12-03 05:19:33 <btcex> why?
 834 2010-12-03 05:19:37 <Diablo-D3> cuda and opencl is processed by the same compiler on nvidia shit
 835 2010-12-03 05:19:42 <Diablo-D3> and it comes out mostly the same way
 836 2010-12-03 05:19:59 <Diablo-D3> although I suspect nvidia is intentially fucking over opencl users as a shit attempt on vendor lockin
 837 2010-12-03 05:20:05 <Diablo-D3> you know how you do vendor lockin right?
 838 2010-12-03 05:20:13 <Diablo-D3> you make hardware that isnt shit, and you sell it cheaper than the other guy
 839 2010-12-03 05:20:35 <Diablo-D3> TADA, everyone is buying your shit and wont consider anyone else
 840 2010-12-03 05:20:48 <Diablo-D3> so, clearly, AMD graduated from the Diablo School of Business
 841 2010-12-03 05:21:52 asdf30 has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 842 2010-12-03 05:22:03 <Diablo-D3> btcex: but yes, lets take the most modern version of their arch
 843 2010-12-03 05:22:25 <Diablo-D3> and by arch, I define radeon 4xxx, 5xxx, and geforce 8xxx through gtx 5xx as a single arch
 844 2010-12-03 05:22:27 <Diablo-D3> er
 845 2010-12-03 05:22:32 <Diablo-D3> as THREE single archs, rather
 846 2010-12-03 05:22:43 <Diablo-D3> thats how screwed nvidia is
 847 2010-12-03 05:23:05 <Diablo-D3> they just keep die shrinking and adding more pipes
 848 2010-12-03 05:23:11 <Diablo-D3> they dont actually try to improve the design
 849 2010-12-03 05:23:24 <Diablo-D3> sure, it goes faster, but who cares when AMD goes even faster than that with much less effort
 850 2010-12-03 05:23:30 <Diablo-D3> but yeah, so
 851 2010-12-03 05:23:35 <Diablo-D3> this geforce arch thats out
 852 2010-12-03 05:23:40 <Diablo-D3> take gtx 5xx
 853 2010-12-03 05:23:54 <Diablo-D3> its about as fast as a radeon 4xxx, per watt.
 854 2010-12-03 05:24:05 <Diablo-D3> because it has absolutely totally fucking shit integer performance
 855 2010-12-03 05:24:37 <btcex> Diablo-D3: who need integer performance?
 856 2010-12-03 05:24:43 <Diablo-D3> BCBot: bitcoin.
 857 2010-12-03 05:24:51 <Diablo-D3> erm, btcex
 858 2010-12-03 05:24:52 <btcex> 3d games do not use it
 859 2010-12-03 05:24:56 <Diablo-D3> bitcoin does.
 860 2010-12-03 05:25:03 <Diablo-D3> and no, its a gpgpu processor and sold as such
 861 2010-12-03 05:25:09 <btcex> Diablo-D3: what is size of bitcoiners market? :)
 862 2010-12-03 05:25:10 <Diablo-D3> its expected to properly run ALL gpgpu applications
 863 2010-12-03 05:25:24 <btcex> In my calculations, we have 20-30 GPU miners
 864 2010-12-03 05:25:37 <Diablo-D3> btcex: no
 865 2010-12-03 05:25:44 <btcex> <Diablo-D3> its expected to properly run ALL gpgpu applications
 866 2010-12-03 05:25:47 <Diablo-D3> 5xxx has hardware shift instructions
 867 2010-12-03 05:25:57 <btcex> ok, 3000 chips for CIA and FBI
 868 2010-12-03 05:26:06 <btcex> it is too smal
 869 2010-12-03 05:26:08 <btcex> small
 870 2010-12-03 05:26:10 <Diablo-D3> those 10 or whatever 5970s that art has?
 871 2010-12-03 05:26:27 <Diablo-D3> thats a significantly large chunk of the output of everybody combined
 872 2010-12-03 05:26:40 <Diablo-D3> each one does something like 650 mhash/sec
 873 2010-12-03 05:26:50 <Diablo-D3> my c2d e8500 @ 3.16ghz does 2.9.
 874 2010-12-03 05:28:11 <nanotube> still, 200 5970s is chump change for a govt or a corp.
 875 2010-12-03 05:28:33 <nanotube> we need moar cpu power in the network.
 876 2010-12-03 05:30:44 <Diablo-D3> s/cpu//
 877 2010-12-03 05:31:51 <Diablo-D3> nanotube: btw
 878 2010-12-03 05:31:54 <Diablo-D3> even if we got 200
 879 2010-12-03 05:32:04 <Diablo-D3> it'd just raise the difficulty
 880 2010-12-03 05:32:31 <nanotube> well, s/cpu/processing/ :)
 881 2010-12-03 05:32:41 <nanotube> yes it would... it would also raise the difficulty of network takeover by a hostile party.
 882 2010-12-03 05:33:03 <Diablo-D3> ArtForz: quickly!
 883 2010-12-03 05:33:06 <Diablo-D3> buy 200 more cards!
 884 2010-12-03 05:33:10 <nanotube> for now, the cost of a network takeover is maybe 200k usd.
 885 2010-12-03 05:33:23 <nanotube> once it gets to be 100m usd, then maybe we're getting somewhere. :)
 886 2010-12-03 05:33:28 <nanotube> no, not artforz. it has to be distributed.
 887 2010-12-03 05:33:36 <Diablo-D3> hes the only one with the fucking money
 888 2010-12-03 05:33:41 <nanotube> otherwise, it may become cheaper to just raid artforz and destroy his house.
 889 2010-12-03 05:33:57 <Diablo-D3> its not really a house any more
 890 2010-12-03 05:33:59 <Diablo-D3> its a small DC
 891 2010-12-03 05:34:01 <nanotube> Diablo-D3: think, there are hundreds of thousands (?) of people with ati 5xxx cards.
 892 2010-12-03 05:34:13 <nanotube> if we can get them all to run a miner
 893 2010-12-03 05:34:15 <Diablo-D3> theres about 5 people with 5970s though
 894 2010-12-03 05:34:21 <Diablo-D3> who the fuck can afford those >_>
 895 2010-12-03 05:34:34 <nanotube> 5770s are just fine too.
 896 2010-12-03 05:34:38 <nanotube> if we are talking millions
 897 2010-12-03 05:34:45 <ne0futur> is there a python client for mining bitcoins ?
 898 2010-12-03 05:35:13 <Diablo-D3> ne0futur: yes
 899 2010-12-03 05:35:16 <Diablo-D3> where have you been
 900 2010-12-03 05:35:24 <ne0futur> ( server mode, no need for gui )
 901 2010-12-03 05:35:30 <Diablo-D3> its called poclbm
 902 2010-12-03 05:35:34 <Diablo-D3> it doesnt have a ui
 903 2010-12-03 05:35:37 <ne0futur> great
 904 2010-12-03 05:35:43 <Diablo-D3> and then theres mine
 905 2010-12-03 05:35:45 <Diablo-D3> which is superior
 906 2010-12-03 05:35:50 <Diablo-D3> and doesnt require that nasty python
 907 2010-12-03 05:35:55 <ne0futur> and its on github hehe great
 908 2010-12-03 05:36:01 <Diablo-D3> so is mine
 909 2010-12-03 05:36:11 <ne0futur> i have cpu power on python only environment
 910 2010-12-03 05:36:20 <Diablo-D3> ne0futur: then dont bother
 911 2010-12-03 05:36:23 <Diablo-D3> opencl on cpu sucks
 912 2010-12-03 05:36:28 <Diablo-D3> just use bitcoin itself
 913 2010-12-03 05:36:51 <ne0futur> i cant run binaries, only python on some servers
 914 2010-12-03 05:37:03 <ne0futur> https://github.com/m0mchil/poclbm/blob/master/poclbm.py
 915 2010-12-03 05:37:03 <Diablo-D3> then dont bother
 916 2010-12-03 05:37:06 <ne0futur> seems cool for me ;)
 917 2010-12-03 05:37:10 <Diablo-D3> opencl is slow on cpus
 918 2010-12-03 05:37:18 <Kiba`> me wishy wishy a block is generated now
 919 2010-12-03 05:37:23 <ne0futur> and unused cpu hours
 920 2010-12-03 05:37:26 <Diablo-D3> and you have to install binaries anyhow
 921 2010-12-03 05:37:34 <Diablo-D3> otherwise how do you intend on getting opencl?
 922 2010-12-03 05:38:23 <ne0futur> i have cpu hours i should be able to use them with python
 923 2010-12-03 05:38:39 <Diablo-D3> ne0futur: I think you misunderstood.
 924 2010-12-03 05:38:44 <Diablo-D3> opencl drivers are written in C.
 925 2010-12-03 05:38:54 <Diablo-D3> you need those to use poclbm
 926 2010-12-03 05:39:02 <Diablo-D3> no opencl, no poclbm
 927 2010-12-03 05:39:10 <Diablo-D3> even if you run the opencl on a cpu, you still need it
 928 2010-12-03 05:39:32 <ne0futur> opencl  seems ok
 929 2010-12-03 05:39:33 <nanotube> heh yea running gen on pure python would be... slow. :)
 930 2010-12-03 05:39:38 <ne0futur> just need python
 931 2010-12-03 05:39:51 <nanotube> ah well if you have opencl drivers already installed...
 932 2010-12-03 05:40:09 <btcex> http://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=724.msg26151#msg26151 jgarzik means what getblock patch updated to official src?
 933 2010-12-03 05:41:35 <nanotube> btcex: there's a url in post #3 in that thread.
 934 2010-12-03 05:43:12 Foggymyst has joined
 935 2010-12-03 05:51:22 theymos has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 936 2010-12-03 05:55:42 <btcex> nanotube: August 07, 2010, 05:05 am
 937 2010-12-03 05:55:55 <btcex> but I can not find getblock in official 0.3.17 client
 938 2010-12-03 05:56:13 <nanotube> i don't think it is in .3.17
 939 2010-12-03 05:56:20 <nanotube> that's why there's a patch.
 940 2010-12-03 06:03:59 acous has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
 941 2010-12-03 06:04:46 <Kiba`> ....MUAHHAHAHAHAHA
 942 2010-12-03 06:04:58 <Kiba`> so, only 3 people download my latest art?
 943 2010-12-03 06:05:00 <Kiba`> price too high?
 944 2010-12-03 06:05:13 <Kiba`> http://www.bitcoinservice.co.uk/files/14
 945 2010-12-03 06:09:19 TheAncientGoat has joined
 946 2010-12-03 06:09:27 <nanotube> Kiba`: problem is, no previews. with the scammers abounding... buying a cat in the bag is not a very attractive proposition.
 947 2010-12-03 06:16:32 <Kiba`> I know! I'll chew out bencoder for not providing preview!
 948 2010-12-03 06:16:44 <nanotube> sounds like a plan. :)
 949 2010-12-03 06:17:04 <nanotube> btw, you have 2 days until your loan is due. i hope you were able to profit off the recent price drop. :)
 950 2010-12-03 06:17:05 <Kiba`> nanotube: in any case, I already made a killing compared to ubitious
 951 2010-12-03 06:17:16 <Kiba`> nanotube: no sire.
 952 2010-12-03 06:17:27 <Kiba`> but I am able to pay off my loand
 953 2010-12-03 06:17:31 <Kiba`> s/loand/laon
 954 2010-12-03 06:17:35 <Kiba`> s/laon/loan
 955 2010-12-03 06:17:45 <Kiba`> I will be able to pay off my loan
 956 2010-12-03 06:18:07 <nanotube> ok, i'll be ready to receive whenever you're ready to send. you have my loan-return address on file?
 957 2010-12-03 06:19:37 <Kiba`> I sure do.
 958 2010-12-03 06:19:43 duck1123_ has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
 959 2010-12-03 06:19:57 <nanotube> cool. :)
 960 2010-12-03 06:27:10 <Kiba`> those damn DMCA
 961 2010-12-03 06:27:31 <Kiba`> people own their xbox, not M$
 962 2010-12-03 06:32:17 noagendamarket has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
 963 2010-12-03 06:34:56 entel has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
 964 2010-12-03 06:46:25 entel has joined
 965 2010-12-03 06:46:26 entel has quit (Changing host)
 966 2010-12-03 06:46:26 entel has joined
 967 2010-12-03 06:51:22 <kermit> Kiba`: you dont even own your money in the US
 968 2010-12-03 06:51:35 <kermit> the coins in your pocket are federal property
 969 2010-12-03 06:51:44 <entel> heh
 970 2010-12-03 06:53:01 <Kiba`> hmm, I am now more qualified in public speaking!
 971 2010-12-03 06:53:06 <wumpus> heh, and then they call it the land of the free
 972 2010-12-03 06:53:25 <kermit> wumpus: noone really calls it that lately
 973 2010-12-03 06:53:57 <kermit> as they stand with their arms up and legs spread in a body scanner
 974 2010-12-03 06:54:19 <wumpus> I'm Dutch and when I was young my family was already joking about the land of the free with its many rules, it started as a joke, but it seems t ohave become much worse since then
 975 2010-12-03 06:54:42 <wumpus> then again, it's not Russia yet :)
 976 2010-12-03 06:55:46 <Kiba`> Americans don't care about freedom
 977 2010-12-03 06:55:52 <Kiba`> they care about being protected from terrorists
 978 2010-12-03 06:55:59 <kermit> they care about whatever the MSM tells them to care about
 979 2010-12-03 06:56:17 <Kiba`> terrorists have an intelligent face
 980 2010-12-03 06:56:21 <Kiba`> car accidents don't
 981 2010-12-03 06:56:31 <kermit> which is basicly to be afraid of everything and everyone and be addicted to stress relief drugs
 982 2010-12-03 06:57:20 <wumpus> yeah, afraid is indeed the right word
 983 2010-12-03 06:58:09 <Kiba`> nobody is afraid of car accidents
 984 2010-12-03 06:58:11 <wumpus> if you look at it a rational way, the terrorism is almost moot, how can a few people with a bomb really hurt a big country like america
 985 2010-12-03 06:58:13 <wumpus> but they did 
 986 2010-12-03 06:58:15 <Kiba`> nobody is waging a war on terrors
 987 2010-12-03 06:58:21 <Kiba`> but drug addicts and terrorists are scary
 988 2010-12-03 06:58:46 <Kiba`> waging a war on car accidents
 989 2010-12-03 06:58:53 <wumpus> that'd at least be usedful
 990 2010-12-03 06:58:58 <wumpus> or a war on onsolved problems in science
 991 2010-12-03 06:58:59 <wumpus> :P
 992 2010-12-03 06:59:27 <Kiba`> damn it, plane accidents are way scarier, but you're less likely to die in a plane accident than you would in a car
 993 2010-12-03 07:00:08 <wumpus> or a big push for colonizing space
 994 2010-12-03 07:00:23 <wumpus> why not do something interesting for a change instead of consistenly being hooked up in our own problems...
 995 2010-12-03 07:00:23 <doublec> I think you're more likely to die if you are in a plane accident vs being in a car accident
 996 2010-12-03 07:00:59 <wumpus> yes, but plane accidents are very very rare
 997 2010-12-03 07:01:06 <Kiba`> somebody should perform a speech using Bruce Schenier's as material
 998 2010-12-03 07:01:40 <Kiba`> wumpus: plus they actually make sure that accidents don't occur again...well at least they try.
 999 2010-12-03 07:01:46 <wumpus> which makes sense as there are much less planes in the sky as there are cars on the ground.. apart from the weather, the trajectory of a  plane is very predictable
1000 2010-12-03 07:01:56 OneFixt has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
1001 2010-12-03 07:01:58 <Kiba`> using Bruce Schenier's Closing Washington Momument
1002 2010-12-03 07:02:04 <Kiba`> http://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2010/12/close_the_washi.html
1003 2010-12-03 07:02:06 <wumpus> heh I loved that article
1004 2010-12-03 07:02:37 <wumpus> they should close down the statue of liberty as well
1005 2010-12-03 07:02:53 <wumpus> or hide it
1006 2010-12-03 07:02:57 <wumpus> build a big bunker around it
1007 2010-12-03 07:02:58 <Kiba`> there is nothing to FEAR but FEAR ITSELF.
1008 2010-12-03 07:03:10 <wumpus> to 'protect' liberty
1009 2010-12-03 07:03:19 <wumpus> that'd be awesome :P
1010 2010-12-03 07:04:08 <wumpus> fear itself is the most scary thing, indeed, and what it does to people
1011 2010-12-03 07:05:27 <wumpus> but I'm sure they will keep the washington monument open
1012 2010-12-03 07:06:22 <nanotube> Kiba`: nice article
1013 2010-12-03 07:06:49 <wumpus> if we can rely on prior evidence from countries becoming dictatorships they build more monuments to freedom the more restricted the freedom becomes
1014 2010-12-03 07:07:33 <wumpus> ideological brainwashing.. the great free USA.. makes as much sense as people's republic of nk
1015 2010-12-03 07:08:30 OneFixt has joined
1016 2010-12-03 07:08:31 OneFixt has quit (Changing host)
1017 2010-12-03 07:08:32 OneFixt has joined
1018 2010-12-03 07:16:19 wumpus has quit (No Ping reply in 180 seconds.)
1019 2010-12-03 07:16:39 wumpus has joined
1020 2010-12-03 07:20:03 <OneFixt> ;;bc,stats
1021 2010-12-03 07:20:08 <gribble> Current Blocks: 95232 | Current Difficulty: 8078.19525793 | Next Difficulty At Block: 96767 | Next Difficulty In: 1535 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 1 day, 7 hours, 48 minutes, and 5 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 10343.62764978
1022 2010-12-03 07:25:21 <MT`AwAy> ooh, next difficulty will go over 10k
1023 2010-12-03 07:26:25 <btcex> nk is a North Korea?
1024 2010-12-03 07:26:28 <wumpus> yes
1025 2010-12-03 07:26:51 TheAncientGoat has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
1026 2010-12-03 07:27:13 <btcex> Yes, the world changes, it seems. Son of Kim Chen Ir will lose the country
1027 2010-12-03 07:27:31 <wumpus> let's hope so, that he's a weakling and can't manage the country
1028 2010-12-03 07:27:56 <wumpus> even if the country would simply be annexed by China it'd be better for the people there
1029 2010-12-03 07:28:25 <Kiba`> well, maybe the North Korean will simply go South
1030 2010-12-03 07:28:27 <btcex> In Russia, too, probably will change. Corruption eats up the country.
1031 2010-12-03 07:28:45 <Kiba`> sucks to be a Russian
1032 2010-12-03 07:29:07 <btcex> I speak just for the photo - as it does not look angry and majestic. Rather looks like a petty crook.
1033 2010-12-03 07:29:09 <MT`AwAy> corruption is everywhere
1034 2010-12-03 07:29:11 <Kiba`> Eric Raymond said the affair with entitlement pension in USA and Europe can't last forever
1035 2010-12-03 07:29:55 <btcex> Kiba`: Watching where. In other countries you can scare crooks saying that you are from the Russian mafia.
1036 2010-12-03 07:30:14 <btcex> MT`AwAy: not on such a scale
1037 2010-12-03 07:30:19 <wumpus> yes even here the russian mafia is much more feared then even the italian mafia
1038 2010-12-03 07:30:30 <Foggymyst> where is here?
1039 2010-12-03 07:30:30 <MT`AwAy> btcex: corruption is the stronger where it is not visible
1040 2010-12-03 07:30:36 <wumpus> the netherlands
1041 2010-12-03 07:30:42 <Kiba`> wikileak is a sanitation bottle
1042 2010-12-03 07:30:52 <Kiba`> it cleans the vermin by exposing corruption to light
1043 2010-12-03 07:31:01 <Foggymyst> wumpus: Netherelands has issues with the russian mafia?
1044 2010-12-03 07:31:06 <Kiba`> a muck raker, to say the least
1045 2010-12-03 07:31:10 <btcex> This is because the Russian is easily ready to break the law. It suffices to exchange glances with your partner and you can evade taxes.
1046 2010-12-03 07:31:36 <nanotube> btcex: evading taxes is not the same as corruption...
1047 2010-12-03 07:31:48 <wumpus> Foggymyst: well not on a large scale, but a lot of fraud is being traced back to there
1048 2010-12-03 07:32:16 <btcex> And the number of bears is reduced :)
1049 2010-12-03 07:32:21 <wumpus> skimming, phishing, etc
1050 2010-12-03 07:32:23 <Kiba`> Plunder...
1051 2010-12-03 07:32:32 <btcex> nameless|: taxes is for example
1052 2010-12-03 07:32:36 <Kiba`> is the operative modus of governments since ancient time
1053 2010-12-03 07:32:46 <nanotube> btcex: tab completion fail again
1054 2010-12-03 07:32:49 <btcex> nameless|: any breakin the law
1055 2010-12-03 07:32:56 <nanotube> and again
1056 2010-12-03 07:32:58 <btcex> oops, is for nanotube
1057 2010-12-03 07:33:00 <nanotube> :)
1058 2010-12-03 07:33:11 <wumpus> Kiba`: yes, if we don't get to have privacy, the governments shouldn't have any either :)
1059 2010-12-03 07:34:03 <nanotube> btcex: in xchat, go to settings -> preferences -> input box, and set 'nick completion sorted' item to 'last spoke order'
1060 2010-12-03 07:34:05 <Kiba`> we do not gain freedom by invading a country and then get heroin shipped in and make American go bye-bye from heroin overdose
1061 2010-12-03 07:34:29 <btcex> nanotube: wow!
1062 2010-12-03 07:34:30 <Kiba`> heroin production started up in Afghanistan again...what da ya know. The Afghans get a little...REVENGE.
1063 2010-12-03 07:34:32 <btcex> thanks!
1064 2010-12-03 07:35:05 <nanotube> btcex: yea, it's much nicer that way. :)
1065 2010-12-03 07:35:27 <btcex> Kiba`: Quite difficult to increase sales of heroin in Russia. market is full, dumping. A dose will cost about $ 5
1066 2010-12-03 07:35:36 <nanotube> as long as i am the most recent person to speak with name starting with 'n', i'll come up even on 'n<tab>'
1067 2010-12-03 07:36:06 <btcex> nanotube: It is strange that this is not the default setting
1068 2010-12-03 07:36:25 <nanotube> btcex: heh well... you can ask on #xchat why that is...
1069 2010-12-03 07:36:37 <nanotube> i agree it should be default.
1070 2010-12-03 07:37:05 <Kiba`> well, at least with the bitcoin network, we could save oursleves from inflation
1071 2010-12-03 07:37:10 <Kiba`> hyperinflation
1072 2010-12-03 07:38:09 <btcex> Oh! I wonder what you think about Chechnya? how to solve this problem?
1073 2010-12-03 07:39:14 <nanotube> anyone who wants his own country gets his own country. that's what i say. :)
1074 2010-12-03 07:39:41 <btcex> nanotube: They no longer want their country
1075 2010-12-03 07:39:53 <btcex> They wanted it in 1993
1076 2010-12-03 07:40:14 <wumpus> well, then give me my own country :P
1077 2010-12-03 07:40:31 <btcex> Now they like to live at the expense of humanitarian aid money
1078 2010-12-03 07:40:36 <Kiba`> btcex: are the Russian still in love with Soviet Union?
1079 2010-12-03 07:40:47 altamic has joined
1080 2010-12-03 07:40:50 <nanotube> wumpus: if it were in my power, i would. :)
1081 2010-12-03 07:40:57 <nanotube> wumpus: right after i start my own one, first. :)
1082 2010-12-03 07:41:18 <wumpus> heh :)
1083 2010-12-03 07:41:25 <nanotube> btcex: well see, should have given it to them back in 93, and you wouldn't have that problem now. :D
1084 2010-12-03 07:41:31 <wumpus> it'd have some difficult issues though, like how to protect it from invaders
1085 2010-12-03 07:42:00 <btcex> Kiba`: Stunned? :) Only the fans of Stalin and BDSM like the Soviet Union
1086 2010-12-03 07:42:35 <nanotube> wumpus: we could join forces.
1087 2010-12-03 07:42:59 <nanotube> and eventually, we would have ... a big country. hehe
1088 2010-12-03 07:43:07 <btcex> nanotube: situation there so that on referendum citizens will approve a thermonuclear bombing of the region
1089 2010-12-03 07:43:37 <wumpus> indeed, eventually it'd be the same as all other countries, i guess
1090 2010-12-03 07:44:04 <nanotube> wumpus: yep... anarchy is nice, until you realize there are bullies. with guns.
1091 2010-12-03 07:44:06 <wumpus> things only stay 'new' for a very short time :)
1092 2010-12-03 07:44:18 <nanotube> btcex: well, that's certainly one solution. :)
1093 2010-12-03 07:44:28 <wumpus> indeed, I've never believed in anarchy as a feasible state form
1094 2010-12-03 07:44:52 <Kiba`> btcex: I heard the United States simply gave the Soviet Union grains
1095 2010-12-03 07:44:58 <MT`AwAy> http://www.bankrun2010.com/ <- meh
1096 2010-12-03 07:45:03 <Kiba`> with loans that they knew the Soviet can't pay
1097 2010-12-03 07:45:10 <Kiba`> so that's why the Soviet last 70+ years
1098 2010-12-03 07:45:12 <Kiba`> or something
1099 2010-12-03 07:45:19 <wumpus> then again, I do believe a bit of anarchy and chaos once in a while is good
1100 2010-12-03 07:45:21 <nanotube> MT`AwAy: heh yea i've heard of that. :) curious to see how that turns out.
1101 2010-12-03 07:45:27 <Kiba`> I heard Wall Street Bankers funded the Communist Revolution
1102 2010-12-03 07:45:40 <btcex> Kiba`: in 89-92? yes, ussr and russia received humanitarian assistance
1103 2010-12-03 07:45:41 <MT`AwAy> nanotube: it may be fun to watch if enough people follow
1104 2010-12-03 07:46:18 <Kiba`> how do you feel about a bunch of rich American bankrolling the Boshelivck?
1105 2010-12-03 07:46:30 <btcex> Kiba`: No, the real problem began with the fall in oil prices in the mid 80s
1106 2010-12-03 07:46:45 vfo has left ()
1107 2010-12-03 07:46:47 <wumpus> bankrun2010? they're almost too late then 
1108 2010-12-03 07:46:50 <btcex> Because the USSR was sitting on the oil needle as well as Russia now
1109 2010-12-03 07:47:39 <btcex> Kiba`: But Soviet citizens knew nothing about the markets and oil prices and export volume. Therefore, they still think that Gorbachev ruined the country
1110 2010-12-03 07:48:07 <wumpus> nah
1111 2010-12-03 07:48:20 <btcex> If North Korea will collapse and there will also be a similar situation. There will be organized MMM and earn money for a simpleton:)
1112 2010-12-03 07:48:27 <wumpus> didn't Lenin and Stalin ruin the country already 
1113 2010-12-03 07:48:53 <nanotube> btcex: we should invest in korean mmm, and get out before it falls apart. :)
1114 2010-12-03 07:49:05 <btcex> wumpus: in 1910-1950 communistic ideas was very popular
1115 2010-12-03 07:49:30 <wumpus> except that North Korea has no natural resources to speak of, as far as I know
1116 2010-12-03 07:49:35 <btcex> and to 1980  in some places and heads
1117 2010-12-03 07:49:45 <wumpus> btcex: yes, it was popular, but not good for the country
1118 2010-12-03 07:49:47 <btcex> RAF, japan Red Army, 'Jackal'...
1119 2010-12-03 07:49:48 <Foggymyst> North Korea has a ton of natural resources.
1120 2010-12-03 07:49:50 <Kiba`> Japan have no to little natural resource and look at what it become
1121 2010-12-03 07:50:00 <Foggymyst> Mining, mostly.
1122 2010-12-03 07:50:11 <Foggymyst> They have difficulty farming.
1123 2010-12-03 07:50:16 <wumpus> Foggymyst: yes, but not enough to be an export market
1124 2010-12-03 07:50:19 <Foggymyst> South Korea can farm, but has dififculty mining.
1125 2010-12-03 07:50:25 <btcex> wumpus:  has no natural resources to speak of, as far as I know - Where if they take the uranium?
1126 2010-12-03 07:50:27 <Foggymyst> Yes, thats why china is buddies with them.
1127 2010-12-03 07:50:37 <Kiba`> Foggymyst: sound...like....TRADING SYNERGY
1128 2010-12-03 07:50:56 <Kiba`> too bad the country is divided
1129 2010-12-03 07:51:01 <Foggymyst> Yah.
1130 2010-12-03 07:51:02 <Kiba`> imagine what power Korea could become!
1131 2010-12-03 07:51:10 <wumpus> yes it could
1132 2010-12-03 07:51:10 <Foggymyst> I visited North Korea two years ago.
1133 2010-12-03 07:51:14 <Kiba`> I think China don't like that though
1134 2010-12-03 07:51:22 <Foggymyst> It was an interesting place.
1135 2010-12-03 07:51:22 <wumpus> south korea's technology and north korea's army
1136 2010-12-03 07:51:23 <wumpus> ouch
1137 2010-12-03 07:51:34 <Kiba`> a trading empire
1138 2010-12-03 07:51:44 <btcex> Foggymyst: USSR in 1950-1960 looks like NK now
1139 2010-12-03 07:51:57 <Foggymyst> btcex: Yah, that was my impression.
1140 2010-12-03 07:52:06 <Foggymyst> btcex: Although they still farm with oxen.
1141 2010-12-03 07:52:10 redengin has joined
1142 2010-12-03 07:52:35 <Foggymyst> btcex: http://developer.smugmug.com/Travel/North-Korea-Oct-2007/3577424_Ehyo8#203136005_zqNRA
1143 2010-12-03 07:52:44 <wumpus> and they hardly have electric lighting
1144 2010-12-03 07:52:47 <Kiba`> apperantly, they have markets in NK. It was like the only way that NK could achevie some wealth.. T hey have some concept of..SAVING.
1145 2010-12-03 07:52:48 <btcex> Foggymyst: its because embargos, I mean
1146 2010-12-03 07:53:11 <Kiba`> but their leaders are faggots
1147 2010-12-03 07:53:20 <wumpus> yes
1148 2010-12-03 07:54:04 <btcex> thats soviet shizofrenia, looks like Orwell's 1984
1149 2010-12-03 07:54:33 <btcex> The people in his heads have two realities
1150 2010-12-03 07:55:01 <btcex> hunger and dirt and poverty
1151 2010-12-03 07:55:02 <btcex> and the second is that they make a bright future
1152 2010-12-03 07:55:28 <btcex> War is peace, freedom is slavery...
1153 2010-12-03 07:55:58 <Kiba`> too bad Orwell is a socialist
1154 2010-12-03 07:56:24 <wumpus> and they don't know anything about the world outside north korea, so they cannot compare their lives to anything
1155 2010-12-03 07:56:55 <btcex> It seems not. Maybe you confused with Wells?
1156 2010-12-03 07:57:14 <wumpus> it doesn't matter what his political occupation was, he wrote some very insightful things
1157 2010-12-03 07:57:48 <btcex> wumpus: yes. as USSR citizens don't know anything about markets etc
1158 2010-12-03 07:58:26 <wumpus> btcex: yes, but they don't even know about the standards of living of people outside their country compared to theirs... they think they're the best country in the world to live in
1159 2010-12-03 07:58:33 <wumpus> I guess that was the same in the soviet union though
1160 2010-12-03 07:58:53 <btcex> wumpus: it is correct and for USSR citizens
1161 2010-12-03 07:59:08 <wumpus> they also think that all world leaders outside north korea worhip Kim, or hold him in very high regard
1162 2010-12-03 07:59:29 <btcex> Many people still think so. And the sun shone brightly after all then, and the erection was better.
1163 2010-12-03 07:59:33 <Kiba`> they must even thought that their country is biggest of them all
1164 2010-12-03 07:59:55 <wumpus> but USSR really was a world power, NK never was
1165 2010-12-03 08:00:18 <Kiba`> the USSR will collapse on itself eventually
1166 2010-12-03 08:00:27 <btcex> wumpus: but NK hasn't territories as ussr
1167 2010-12-03 08:00:32 sgornick has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
1168 2010-12-03 08:00:34 <Kiba`> no market..not enough toilets will get produced
1169 2010-12-03 08:00:48 <wumpus> any empire will collapse on itself eventually
1170 2010-12-03 08:01:06 <Kiba`> because they have poor fundamentals
1171 2010-12-03 08:01:21 <wumpus> btcex: exactly, they don't have infrastructure either
1172 2010-12-03 08:01:34 <btcex> wumpus: as in ussr
1173 2010-12-03 08:01:51 <Kiba`> they have subs and nuclear missles
1174 2010-12-03 08:01:51 <wumpus> right
1175 2010-12-03 08:02:01 <btcex> ussr has only railroads, its important for military purposes
1176 2010-12-03 08:02:12 <wumpus> yes, getting weapons isn't a problem
1177 2010-12-03 08:02:18 <wumpus> kim il jong is even printing dollars
1178 2010-12-03 08:02:30 <Kiba`> counterfieting?
1179 2010-12-03 08:02:32 <wumpus> yes
1180 2010-12-03 08:02:34 <btcex> kim il jong == Kim Chen Ir?
1181 2010-12-03 08:02:42 <btcex> what his correct name?
1182 2010-12-03 08:02:49 <wumpus> that's a big part of why the US blockades them economically
1183 2010-12-03 08:02:57 <Kiba`> can't believe that Dear Leader have the balls to produce children
1184 2010-12-03 08:03:21 <btcex> Kiba`: I think hi has 20-30 wifes
1185 2010-12-03 08:03:23 <wumpus> btcex: Kim Jong-il
1186 2010-12-03 08:03:42 <Kiba`> a fat man shouldn't be allowed to have sex
1187 2010-12-03 08:04:01 <Kiba`> especially an evil faggot like him
1188 2010-12-03 08:04:19 <wumpus> yes he's a psychopath
1189 2010-12-03 08:04:29 <btcex> Kiba`: What a youthful maximalism? show your photo!
1190 2010-12-03 08:04:44 <wumpus> most leaders at least believe they are doing something good for their country
1191 2010-12-03 08:04:58 <Kiba`> btcex: I am a fat person...but I am not evil and is trying to lose weight...so...I can date women.
1192 2010-12-03 08:04:59 <wumpus> but he.. nah.. :/
1193 2010-12-03 08:05:13 * Kiba` is a much more efficent runner now despite weighting 205 pounds
1194 2010-12-03 08:05:47 <CyanDynamo> http://www.harpers.org/archive/2005/02/0080381
1195 2010-12-03 08:05:53 <nanotube> Kiba`: if you want to lose weight, you have to be an /inefficient/ runner. when you're efficient, you use less energy.
1196 2010-12-03 08:05:54 <nanotube> :)
1197 2010-12-03 08:05:56 <Kiba`> I sitll have not lose weight.
1198 2010-12-03 08:06:00 <wumpus> Kiba`: who are you running from? :)
1199 2010-12-03 08:06:06 <btcex> I scored 5 kg since the summer while engaging bitcoin
1200 2010-12-03 08:06:07 <Kiba`> nanotube: what I mean is that I can run longer
1201 2010-12-03 08:06:14 <Kiba`> wumpus: I run barefoot
1202 2010-12-03 08:06:34 <wumpus> ok then
1203 2010-12-03 08:06:38 <CyanDynamo> my favorite title: Eternal Bosom of Hot Love
1204 2010-12-03 08:07:23 <nanotube> Kiba`: ah ic. re: barefoot: be careful you don't hurt your joints.
1205 2010-12-03 08:07:54 <wumpus> I love the test network, I actaully generated 3 blocks already :P
1206 2010-12-03 08:07:55 <Kiba`> meh,
1207 2010-12-03 08:08:00 <Kiba`> barefoot don't hurt at all
1208 2010-12-03 08:08:08 <Kiba`> it's the annoying rock pebble that's bad
1209 2010-12-03 08:08:19 <CyanDynamo> we werent made to run on cement. gotta run on dirt
1210 2010-12-03 08:08:30 <nanotube> yea, or rubbery
1211 2010-12-03 08:08:31 <nanotube> things
1212 2010-12-03 08:08:57 <Kiba`> I run on cement
1213 2010-12-03 08:09:03 <Kiba`> cement ain't that bad
1214 2010-12-03 08:09:10 <Kiba`> it's the annoying rocks that's killer
1215 2010-12-03 08:09:42 <Kiba`> pretty soon, I'll be able to run the whole neighborhood without stopping
1216 2010-12-03 08:11:26 <Kiba`> when I first started, my feet start hurting real bad toward the end of the run
1217 2010-12-03 08:11:28 <btcex> what is a cement?
1218 2010-12-03 08:12:01 <wumpus> concrete
1219 2010-12-03 08:12:10 <wumpus> I think
1220 2010-12-03 08:12:32 <Kiba`> close, but not really
1221 2010-12-03 08:12:34 <Kiba`> it's a binder
1222 2010-12-03 08:14:13 <Kiba`> concrete is a composite construction materials made of cements and other material
1223 2010-12-03 08:14:48 <wumpus> so it's the stuff used to 'glue' stones together for building? we call that 'cement' too, but I couldn't imagine running on that
1224 2010-12-03 08:15:27 T_X_ is now known as T_X
1225 2010-12-03 08:15:29 <Kiba`> it's a substance that set and harden indepently
1226 2010-12-03 08:15:31 T_X has quit (Quit: http://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.)
1227 2010-12-03 08:15:42 <wumpus> as it's very rough
1228 2010-12-03 08:15:42 T_X has joined
1229 2010-12-03 08:16:11 <Kiba`> well, cement bind materials together in concrete
1230 2010-12-03 08:17:08 <btcex> Kiba`: not :)
1231 2010-12-03 08:17:22 <btcex> concrete != cement + rocks
1232 2010-12-03 08:17:59 <btcex> But I thought its about software
1233 2010-12-03 08:18:19 <Kiba`> well, we're talking about running
1234 2010-12-03 08:18:28 <Kiba`> I ran on sidewalks
1235 2010-12-03 08:18:41 <Kiba`> sidewalks differ in quality and texture greatly
1236 2010-12-03 08:18:50 <Kiba`> some were very rough...others very smooth
1237 2010-12-03 08:20:11 <wumpus> btcex: hehe, my software runs a lot too, but I don't seem to lose weight from that :)
1238 2010-12-03 08:21:42 <wumpus> wow, even the email spam is in chinese these days, there must be an economic boom there
1239 2010-12-03 08:22:07 <btcex> wumpus: score?.. I am increase my weight to 5 kg
1240 2010-12-03 08:34:45 altamic has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
1241 2010-12-03 08:46:33 <btcex> We finally made the issuance of payment history
1242 2010-12-03 08:50:38 altamic has joined
1243 2010-12-03 08:52:04 altamic has quit (Client Quit)
1244 2010-12-03 08:53:02 <btcex> jgarzik: tcatm https://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=2050.msg26370#msg26370
1245 2010-12-03 08:54:33 sgornick has joined
1246 2010-12-03 08:54:35 sgornick has quit (Changing host)
1247 2010-12-03 08:54:35 sgornick has joined
1248 2010-12-03 08:59:55 altamic has joined
1249 2010-12-03 09:08:05 <LobsterMan> Kiba` do you play counter-strike source?
1250 2010-12-03 09:09:46 <LobsterMan> ....just wondering, i was in my server earlier and there was another dude named kiba in there:
1251 2010-12-03 09:09:46 <LobsterMan> http://imgur.com/2GlFr.jpg
1252 2010-12-03 09:09:56 <LobsterMan> well i assume they were male
1253 2010-12-03 09:13:43 a_meteorite has quit (Quit: http://bzfx.net/)
1254 2010-12-03 09:19:14 <btcex> LobsterMan: male? Kiba` is female?
1255 2010-12-03 09:19:22 <LobsterMan> i have no idea
1256 2010-12-03 09:19:27 <LobsterMan> lol
1257 2010-12-03 09:20:11 <altamic> is correct to say that an instance of CBigNum is bounded by 0 and 2^(2048)?
1258 2010-12-03 09:29:06 <btcex> how I can check .nz pooled mine?
1259 2010-12-03 09:29:27 <btcex> my friend connecting to them with powerful GPU
1260 2010-12-03 09:29:58 <btcex> what is current kHash/s?
1261 2010-12-03 09:32:22 altamic has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
1262 2010-12-03 09:42:18 <btcex> Server Status : 91 clients, 62607 khash/s
1263 2010-12-03 09:42:18 <btcex> Server reports my khash/s as 566
1264 2010-12-03 09:44:12 <MT`AwAy> I'd say "Kiba" is a rather common nickname
1265 2010-12-03 09:44:18 <MT`AwAy> I got 3 other ones in the ppl I know
1266 2010-12-03 09:45:42 <[Noodles]> btcex: the pooled mining is cpu-only, as far as i know there's no gpu-version available yet
1267 2010-12-03 09:46:13 <btcex> [Noodles]: sure?
1268 2010-12-03 09:47:05 <[Noodles]> i havent noticed any gpu-version, i'd also hook up one as soon as its available
1269 2010-12-03 09:47:33 redengin has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
1270 2010-12-03 09:48:27 <btcex> [Noodles]: I seen GPU options in the cmake configs
1271 2010-12-03 09:48:43 <btcex> but pooled may not be implemented, yes
1272 2010-12-03 09:56:01 <btcex> it is need set a option for GPU generating with official client?
1273 2010-12-03 09:56:13 <btcex> or it is not supports GPU at all?
1274 2010-12-03 09:56:24 <btcex> (i am connsulting new user)
1275 2010-12-03 09:57:05 <[Noodles]> i'm using m0mchil's poclbm GPU-miner with the official client
1276 2010-12-03 09:59:06 <[Noodles]> --user=xxxx --pass=xxxx should do it, --host=ip if its a remote machine
1277 2010-12-03 09:59:32 <[Noodles]> --device=N for multiple GPUs
1278 2010-12-03 09:59:57 <[Noodles]> that's it more or less
1279 2010-12-03 10:00:49 <btcex> but on NVidia mu friend with official client do 30 000 khash/s
1280 2010-12-03 10:01:13 <btcex> without any switches
1281 2010-12-03 10:01:16 <btcex> or options
1282 2010-12-03 10:01:32 <btcex> 30 000 khash/s reached without GPU?
1283 2010-12-03 10:01:47 <[Noodles]> i doubt that
1284 2010-12-03 10:04:15 <[Noodles]> what miner is used? doesnt seem to be the official bitcoin-client mining, my Nvidia card (gtx260) gets 36 000khash/s stock and up to 47 000  overclocked
1285 2010-12-03 10:05:37 <[Noodles]> u need like 2 6core-AMDs to get 30M from CPUs
1286 2010-12-03 10:06:00 <btcex> [Noodles]: offcial client's miner
1287 2010-12-03 10:06:13 <btcex> hi use gtx250
1288 2010-12-03 10:06:25 <[Noodles]> strange, what CPU?
1289 2010-12-03 10:09:04 <btcex> he is offline
1290 2010-12-03 10:10:02 <[Noodles]> bitcoind, or gui? maybe he got the getinfo-data wrong
1291 2010-12-03 10:10:04 <btcex> he uses top CPU and GPU, becouse he wokrs in computer hardware shop
1292 2010-12-03 10:10:11 <btcex> [Noodles]: GUI
1293 2010-12-03 10:13:08 <[Noodles]> 30M for a CPU would be impressive, top-CPU in this list http://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=1628.0 is i7 980x doing 19200 khash/s, followed by AMD X6 at 15000
1294 2010-12-03 10:14:24 <[Noodles]> still less efficient than any decent GPU though
1295 2010-12-03 10:15:55 <btcex> how bad that src has no changelog
1296 2010-12-03 10:16:25 acous has joined
1297 2010-12-03 10:18:18 <[Noodles]> i'm not into the source at all, havent build anything myself so far, i'm just a user, not a coder, just do some (un-professional) php and lsl scripting for fun
1298 2010-12-03 10:21:18 <Diablo-D3> [Noodles]: yes, but isnt that 980x a $1000 cpu?
1299 2010-12-03 10:21:34 <[Noodles]> no idea, i don't own it ^.^
1300 2010-12-03 10:21:45 <eureka^> does bitcoin support mpi?
1301 2010-12-03 10:22:39 <btcex> Radeon HD 6990 http://golubev.com/gpuest.htm
1302 2010-12-03 10:22:42 <btcex> huh
1303 2010-12-03 10:23:48 <eureka^> i've got 3 racks full of dual quad xeon 5520s, might want to use some free cpu cycles for bitcoin :P
1304 2010-12-03 10:27:44 <MT`AwAy> eureka^: careful with power usage
1305 2010-12-03 10:28:09 <eureka^> MT`AwAy; the machines are already running at pretty heavy force
1306 2010-12-03 10:28:23 <eureka^> i manage a decently sized budget vps company so they're usually pegged pretty good
1307 2010-12-03 10:28:54 <eureka^> but i think i could sneak a few cores for bitcoin lol
1308 2010-12-03 10:29:43 <btcex> [Noodles]: my friend have q9400, overclocked to 3.6
1309 2010-12-03 10:33:43 sgornick has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
1310 2010-12-03 10:42:51 <Diablo-D3> btcex: yes it exists
1311 2010-12-03 10:43:02 <Diablo-D3> and no this table isnt useful
1312 2010-12-03 10:44:54 <btcex> Diablo-D3: GPU buil-in miner?
1313 2010-12-03 10:44:59 <btcex> you are about it?
1314 2010-12-03 10:45:28 <Diablo-D3> english please
1315 2010-12-03 10:45:30 <[Noodles]> ah, now i got it, i think *lol
1316 2010-12-03 10:45:56 <Diablo-D3> eureka^: your company is not nearly as awesome as rapidxen
1317 2010-12-03 10:46:00 <[Noodles]> btcex: your friend is using puddinpops bitcoin-client, not the remoteminer?
1318 2010-12-03 10:46:15 <eureka^> heh, don't get me started on rapidxen ;)
1319 2010-12-03 10:46:23 <[Noodles]> that one would have "build-in" gpu support
1320 2010-12-03 10:46:25 <btcex> [Noodles]: he uses official bitcoin client for windows
1321 2010-12-03 10:46:37 <btcex> and clicks to 'generate'
1322 2010-12-03 10:46:46 <Diablo-D3> what, that rapidxen is a perfect company and has zero flaws and everyone should do business with it?
1323 2010-12-03 10:47:08 <eureka^> heh, alright
1324 2010-12-03 10:47:42 <[Noodles]> then maybe it's just quite fast for a CPU, i don't know
1325 2010-12-03 10:48:03 <Diablo-D3> eureka^: and nenolod likes bitcoin.
1326 2010-12-03 10:48:31 <Diablo-D3> [Noodles]: per watt or per dollar? its slow as ancient outdated broken shit
1327 2010-12-03 10:48:59 <[Noodles]> "for a CPU", still quite expensive
1328 2010-12-03 10:49:33 <Diablo-D3> for a CPU its a pile of shit
1329 2010-12-03 10:49:54 <Diablo-D3> I can buy like 3 of those phenom IIs for the cost of an extreme i7
1330 2010-12-03 10:50:02 sgornick has joined
1331 2010-12-03 10:50:03 <Diablo-D3> er, II x6s, to make that clear
1332 2010-12-03 10:51:05 <[Noodles]> yeah, or just an old HD5570 to double the hashrate and half the power needed
1333 2010-12-03 10:54:14 <[Noodles]> i wasnt talking about the i7 though, but about the "q9400, overclocked to 3.6" doing 30M (however that's possible)
1334 2010-12-03 10:54:37 <Diablo-D3> thats not possible
1335 2010-12-03 10:54:59 <[Noodles]> that's what btcex quotes from his friend
1336 2010-12-03 10:55:16 <Diablo-D3> from that table?
1337 2010-12-03 10:55:19 <Diablo-D3> that lists sha1 rates
1338 2010-12-03 10:55:38 <Diablo-D3> they're not the same as sha2 rates, and bitcoin runs sha2 twice
1339 2010-12-03 10:56:01 <[Noodles]> from the official windows-gui-client mining
1340 2010-12-03 10:56:03 <btcex> And so I asked the question: Is integrated into the official client GPU miner?
1341 2010-12-03 10:56:12 <Diablo-D3> btcex: is what?
1342 2010-12-03 10:56:14 <btcex> it is*
1343 2010-12-03 10:56:22 <[Noodles]> and i said: no
1344 2010-12-03 10:56:23 <btcex> mmrr
1345 2010-12-03 10:56:41 <btcex> And so I asked the question: GPU miner is integrated into the official client ?
1346 2010-12-03 10:56:43 <Diablo-D3> WHAT official client gpu miner?
1347 2010-12-03 10:56:54 <Diablo-D3> theres only two, m0's and mine
1348 2010-12-03 10:57:31 <btcex> My friend downloaded official windows archive from bitcoin.org.
1349 2010-12-03 10:57:38 <[Noodles]> well, there's puddinpops too, it works GPUs from the windows-client-gui i think
1350 2010-12-03 10:57:46 <doublec> there is no gpu miner built into the official client bcex
1351 2010-12-03 10:57:46 <Diablo-D3> [Noodles]: no
1352 2010-12-03 10:57:49 <[Noodles]> but it's not "official"
1353 2010-12-03 10:57:50 <btcex> and use binary from it
1354 2010-12-03 10:58:04 <Diablo-D3> satoshi added getwork to trunk
1355 2010-12-03 10:58:10 <btcex> doublec: ok, thanks
1356 2010-12-03 10:58:11 <doublec> btcex, but the official client has support for using external gpu miners
1357 2010-12-03 10:58:14 <Diablo-D3> so you can now use a miner from it without a patch
1358 2010-12-03 10:58:20 <doublec> like Diablo-D3's
1359 2010-12-03 10:58:40 <Diablo-D3> doublec: yeah, except mine doesnt support satoshi's getwork impl yet
1360 2010-12-03 10:58:55 <doublec> ah, ok
1361 2010-12-03 10:59:05 <Diablo-D3> its on the todo list
1362 2010-12-03 10:59:26 <[Noodles]> i'm not using puddinpops anymore (except for the pooled cpu-miner now), so i just guessed
1363 2010-12-03 10:59:35 <Diablo-D3> no one uses puddinpops
1364 2010-12-03 10:59:53 <[Noodles]> tried to explain a hashrate of 30M from the GUI
1365 2010-12-03 11:00:04 <Diablo-D3> you cant.
1366 2010-12-03 11:00:10 <Diablo-D3> its an invalid value.
1367 2010-12-03 11:00:38 <Diablo-D3> there is nothing that can be described as a cpu that can do that
1368 2010-12-03 11:13:18 <btcex> what a hardware can mine even faster in theory? cell processor?
1369 2010-12-03 11:15:00 <Diablo-D3> btcex: in theory?
1370 2010-12-03 11:15:07 <Diablo-D3> a chip expressly designed for the task.
1371 2010-12-03 11:15:19 <Diablo-D3> but I hope you have a few million to pull that ioff
1372 2010-12-03 11:15:29 <Diablo-D3> it'd be cheaper to just buy a bunch of radeon 5xxxes
1373 2010-12-03 11:15:34 <btcex> Diablo-D3: chip must be not in theory :)
1374 2010-12-03 11:22:04 mtgox has joined
1375 2010-12-03 11:23:49 Kiba`` has joined
1376 2010-12-03 11:24:41 <wumpus> btcex: FPGA, maybe
1377 2010-12-03 11:24:52 <wumpus> then again, those are really expensive
1378 2010-12-03 11:25:12 Kiba` has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
1379 2010-12-03 11:26:08 <btcex> wumpus: http://www.scribd.com/doc/26191199/Using-FPGA-Clusters-for-Fast-Password-Recovery
1380 2010-12-03 11:26:56 <wumpus> yeah... as you can program at the gate level, you can make an incredibly fast sha256, and also put many parallel circuits ona chip
1381 2010-12-03 11:29:36 <Diablo-D3> btcex: its not really useful
1382 2010-12-03 11:29:53 <Diablo-D3> the cost of a fpga that can keep up with a radeon 5870 is more expensive than just buying a 5870
1383 2010-12-03 11:30:03 <wumpus> I somehow expected that
1384 2010-12-03 11:31:03 <btcex> http://picocomputing.com/sc_series.html  they are afraid to show prices
1385 2010-12-03 11:31:06 <wumpus> with GPUs you have the advantage of mass production
1386 2010-12-03 11:31:24 <btcex> yes, it is true
1387 2010-12-03 11:36:07 <Diablo-D3> I swear I have to school noobs on a daily basis
1388 2010-12-03 11:42:46 altamic has joined
1389 2010-12-03 11:44:09 <btcex> I can not find anywhere price of modern FPGA systems
1390 2010-12-03 11:47:09 <Diablo-D3> about $3k for the kind that beats a 5970
1391 2010-12-03 11:47:55 <btcex> 33 Kgates 200MHz FPGA can do 1.9 Mbps
1392 2010-12-03 11:48:30 <btcex> platform: ASIC (I don't know what is it)
1393 2010-12-03 11:49:32 <edcba> asic is what you won't be able to afford iirc :)
1394 2010-12-03 11:49:59 <edcba> ie what you use when you build a gpu card :)
1395 2010-12-03 11:50:19 <btcex> ASIC != FPGA
1396 2010-12-03 11:50:21 <btcex> hm...
1397 2010-12-03 11:50:46 <edcba> http://www.xilinx.com/company/gettingstarted/fpgavsasic.htm
1398 2010-12-03 11:50:58 <Diablo-D3> btcex: asic means application specific intergrated circuit
1399 2010-12-03 11:51:31 <Diablo-D3> btcex: and thats 1.9mbps sha256?
1400 2010-12-03 11:51:42 <Diablo-D3> thats about 8 khash/sec
1401 2010-12-03 11:51:53 <Diablo-D3> you have another 600 some to go.
1402 2010-12-03 11:51:54 <btcex> Diablo-D3: speed depends from data length
1403 2010-12-03 11:52:03 <Diablo-D3> its 128 bytes.
1404 2010-12-03 11:52:20 <Diablo-D3> ahh wait, sorry, its 15 khash/sec
1405 2010-12-03 11:55:20 <ArtForz> 192
1406 2010-12-03 11:55:38 <ArtForz> 128 bytes hash + 64 bytes hash-of-hash
1407 2010-12-03 11:55:48 <Diablo-D3> ArtForz: yeah but we should be able to hijack the thing
1408 2010-12-03 11:55:52 <Diablo-D3> since its a fpga
1409 2010-12-03 11:56:12 <ArtForz> wait.. we can lose the first round so back to 128
1410 2010-12-03 11:56:17 <Diablo-D3> ding
1411 2010-12-03 11:56:55 <ArtForz> 128 byte = 1024 bit, so 1.9mbps = 1.86khash
1412 2010-12-03 11:59:16 <Diablo-D3> errr
1413 2010-12-03 11:59:21 <Diablo-D3> I forgot to divide by 8
1414 2010-12-03 11:59:27 <Diablo-D3> its even worse than I thought
1415 2010-12-03 11:59:33 <ArtForz> a altera EP4CE115 gets ~50Mhash/s
1416 2010-12-03 12:00:01 <ArtForz> ~$350 for the chip alone
1417 2010-12-03 12:01:36 <ArtForz> to match a quad 5970 box you'd need 48 or so ...
1418 2010-12-03 12:02:09 <edcba> so if you want to beat gpu you need to design your own ? :)
1419 2010-12-03 12:02:59 <ArtForz> add config memory, PCB, power supply, enclosure ... and you're looking at >$20k to match a ~$2.5k PC
1420 2010-12-03 12:05:50 RazielZ has joined
1421 2010-12-03 12:06:37 <ArtForz> yeah, pretty much
1422 2010-12-03 12:07:06 <tcatm> btcex: thanks for the trade history data! (added JPY and WMR)
1423 2010-12-03 12:07:11 <btcex> ArtForz: what is number of gates its contain?
1424 2010-12-03 12:07:29 <btcex> tcatm: thanx for you)
1425 2010-12-03 12:08:23 altamic has left ()
1426 2010-12-03 12:09:44 <ArtForz> 114480 4-LUTs
1427 2010-12-03 12:10:13 <btcex> I gave details from an academic article
1428 2010-12-03 12:11:20 <btcex> http://www.dinigroup.com/new/DNV6F6PCIe.html PCI card with Vertex-6 FPGA
1429 2010-12-03 12:11:31 <btcex> 24+ million ASIC gates (ASIC measure) when stuffed with 6 Virtex-6 LX550T
1430 2010-12-03 12:11:31 <btcex> 21+ million ASIC gates and 12,096, 25x18 multipliers with 6 Virtex-6 SX475T
1431 2010-12-03 12:11:40 <ArtForz> should be about equiv to 5.5M gates
1432 2010-12-03 12:11:56 <Diablo-D3> btcex: fpga are only really useful for designing new chips
1433 2010-12-03 12:12:02 <ArtForz> have you checked what a single virtex costs?
1434 2010-12-03 12:12:09 <Diablo-D3> btcex: and you cant fab chips in batches smaller than like 100k
1435 2010-12-03 12:12:11 <btcex> Diablo-D3: and for sha-256 :)
1436 2010-12-03 12:12:25 <btcex> ArtForz: in progress
1437 2010-12-03 12:12:25 <Diablo-D3> nope, they really arent
1438 2010-12-03 12:12:27 <Diablo-D3> use a radeon
1439 2010-12-03 12:13:04 <ArtForz> small hint: a SX475T is ~$9k
1440 2010-12-03 12:13:19 <btcex> muhahaha
1441 2010-12-03 12:13:24 <btcex> $24950
1442 2010-12-03 12:14:22 <ArtForz> a LX550T is ~$7k
1443 2010-12-03 12:15:05 <btcex> ArtForz: link?
1444 2010-12-03 12:15:26 <ArtForz> just check digikey
1445 2010-12-03 12:15:51 <btcex> wow, cool site
1446 2010-12-03 12:16:26 altamic has joined
1447 2010-12-03 12:29:51 <btcex> seems to be available fpga cards with millions of gates emulate them. switching their by holding gates map in memory or something like that
1448 2010-12-03 12:29:54 <btcex> yep?
1449 2010-12-03 12:31:35 <btcex> seems to be available fpga cards with millions of gates it is just emulation. this cards holding gates map in the memory and switching pages, or something like that
1450 2010-12-03 12:31:48 <btcex> yes, a complex sentence :)
1451 2010-12-03 12:33:54 <wumpus> emulating gates, that's kind of lame
1452 2010-12-03 12:34:21 <btcex> wumpus: for development purposes
1453 2010-12-03 12:34:43 <btcex> it is more faster what emulate FPGA by x86 CPU
1454 2010-12-03 12:34:46 <wumpus> true
1455 2010-12-03 12:34:54 <wumpus> so it's for in circuit emulation
1456 2010-12-03 12:34:57 <wumpus> then it makes sense
1457 2010-12-03 12:35:28 <btcex> It is my assumption because I see that prices vary on 10 on the boards with the same chip
1458 2010-12-03 12:39:23 altamic has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
1459 2010-12-03 12:45:57 altamic has joined
1460 2010-12-03 12:49:35 <btcex> yep, FPGA is too expensive
1461 2010-12-03 12:50:11 <btcex> number of gates depends from chip. and really on board can be implemented millons of them
1462 2010-12-03 12:50:33 <btcex> but it costs as A-380 plane
1463 2010-12-03 12:51:43 <btcex> May be lucky enough to find in a garbage device who uses FPGA chips and reprogram it. For more I would not expect
1464 2010-12-03 12:59:53 <StrangeCharm> if bitcoin is set to use a proxy server, will i still be able to connect to it on localhost?
1465 2010-12-03 13:00:18 <Diablo-D3> wumpus: fpga is for chip design
1466 2010-12-03 13:00:26 <Diablo-D3> wumpus: its not actually meant to be used for real serious shit
1467 2010-12-03 13:00:31 <Diablo-D3> although some insane people do
1468 2010-12-03 13:01:38 darrob has joined
1469 2010-12-03 13:02:15 darrob- has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
1470 2010-12-03 13:05:16 <btcex> StrangeCharm: Yes. Bitcoin doing outgoing connection using proxy
1471 2010-12-03 13:05:29 <btcex> but incoming connections on 127.0.0.1 also accepted
1472 2010-12-03 13:05:42 <btcex> if i correctly understand you
1473 2010-12-03 13:05:57 <StrangeCharm> what would prevent me from getting a response from the server when i run [for instance] bitcoind getinfo ?
1474 2010-12-03 13:06:03 <wumpus> Diablo-D3: yes, they are used for a lot of 'serious shit' as well
1475 2010-12-03 13:06:20 <wumpus> especially before the GPU hype
1476 2010-12-03 13:07:42 <Diablo-D3> wumpus: which is insane
1477 2010-12-03 13:07:49 <Diablo-D3> I know of several products that use them
1478 2010-12-03 13:07:56 <Diablo-D3> its lazy hardware design, pure and simple
1479 2010-12-03 13:08:19 <wumpus> intel is even planning to embed FPGA on their future mobile chips
1480 2010-12-03 13:08:43 <wumpus> which makes sense as an alternative to real custom ASICs which they don't allow on their chips
1481 2010-12-03 13:09:11 <Diablo-D3> yeah, so I'd just buy an ARM license and do it myself.
1482 2010-12-03 13:09:43 <wumpus> yes, ARM are the ones they want to compete against
1483 2010-12-03 13:11:54 <wumpus> which is interesting, but x86 is a pretty wasteful architecture, they might win on their smaller chip production process though
1484 2010-12-03 13:12:26 <Diablo-D3> dear god, if they ever make a desktop ARM
1485 2010-12-03 13:12:38 <btcex> StrangeCharm: show output of bitcoin client
1486 2010-12-03 13:13:10 <StrangeCharm> btcex, what?
1487 2010-12-03 13:13:27 <btcex> StrangeCharm: Please show output of your bitcoin client
1488 2010-12-03 13:13:31 <btcex> <StrangeCharm> what would prevent me from getting a response from the server when i run [for instance] bitcoind getinfo ?
1489 2010-12-03 13:13:55 <StrangeCharm> error: cannot connect to server
1490 2010-12-03 13:14:11 <StrangeCharm> excuse me: error: no response from server
1491 2010-12-03 13:14:16 <btcex> StrangeCharm: bitcoind is enabled?
1492 2010-12-03 13:14:30 <StrangeCharm> rand bitcoind and there's a process called bitcoind
1493 2010-12-03 13:15:02 <btcex> StrangeCharm: netstat -an|grep 833
1494 2010-12-03 13:16:15 Insti has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
1495 2010-12-03 13:16:53 <StrangeCharm> http://pastebin.com/pLRXJaTa btcex
1496 2010-12-03 13:18:53 <btcex> StrangeCharm: looks ok
1497 2010-12-03 13:19:54 <btcex> StrangeCharm: can you show CLI command?
1498 2010-12-03 13:19:55 <StrangeCharm> nonetheless, i don't get any response from the server when i try to connect to it, btcex
1499 2010-12-03 13:20:24 <StrangeCharm>  /whatever/bitcoind getinfo
1500 2010-12-03 13:22:51 <Diablo-D3> btcex: bitcoind also acts as a bitcoind client
1501 2010-12-03 13:23:06 <Diablo-D3> so you can do bitcoind command, and it'll tell the running bitcoind to do it
1502 2010-12-03 13:23:25 <btcex> Diablo-D3: i know
1503 2010-12-03 13:23:44 <btcex> StrangeCharm: show your bitcoin config?
1504 2010-12-03 13:25:53 <StrangeCharm> btcex, http://pastebin.com/s1ANCr3B
1505 2010-12-03 13:26:51 <btcex> StrangeCharm: ip addr
1506 2010-12-03 13:27:04 <btcex> show output of ip addr
1507 2010-12-03 13:27:22 <btcex> lo interface is up?
1508 2010-12-03 13:28:10 <StrangeCharm> lo is up btc
1509 2010-12-03 13:28:13 <StrangeCharm> btcex,
1510 2010-12-03 13:28:33 <Diablo-D3> Im going to bed
1511 2010-12-03 13:28:34 <Diablo-D3> night all
1512 2010-12-03 13:29:17 <btcex> StrangeCharm: telnet 127.0.0.1 8332
1513 2010-12-03 13:30:20 <StrangeCharm> connected
1514 2010-12-03 13:30:32 <StrangeCharm> btcex,
1515 2010-12-03 13:30:58 <btcex> hmmmm
1516 2010-12-03 13:31:10 <btcex> strace /whatever/bitcoind getinfo
1517 2010-12-03 13:31:13 <btcex> ?
1518 2010-12-03 13:34:39 <StrangeCharm> btcex, http://pastebin.com/8v7edX1k
1519 2010-12-03 13:35:38 <btcex> StrangeCharm: daemon is responding
1520 2010-12-03 13:35:51 <btcex> client and daemon are same versions?
1521 2010-12-03 13:35:58 <StrangeCharm> btcex, same file
1522 2010-12-03 13:36:23 <btcex> connect(5, {sa_family=AF_INET, sin_port=htons(8332), sin_addr=inet_addr("127.0.0.1")}, 16) = 0
1523 2010-12-03 13:36:26 altamic has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
1524 2010-12-03 13:36:54 <btcex> StrangeCharm: SSL...
1525 2010-12-03 13:37:04 <StrangeCharm> bash: syntax error near unexpected token `5,'
1526 2010-12-03 13:37:11 <btcex> I thing this is problem
1527 2010-12-03 13:37:25 <StrangeCharm> ssl?
1528 2010-12-03 13:37:30 <StrangeCharm> ssl is off in my config
1529 2010-12-03 13:37:52 <btcex> StrangeCharm: no, it is not cli command , i am quote strace output for illustrate what all is ok
1530 2010-12-03 13:38:15 <btcex> oops, yes, true
1531 2010-12-03 13:38:19 <StrangeCharm> i worked that out after the fact
1532 2010-12-03 13:39:01 <btcex> StrangeCharm: turn off generation
1533 2010-12-03 13:39:09 <btcex> may be system is too busy
1534 2010-12-03 13:39:34 <btcex> also, you can not be able to stop daemon
1535 2010-12-03 13:39:49 <btcex> you should kill daemon
1536 2010-12-03 13:40:29 <StrangeCharm> when i want the daemon to stop, i just killall bitcoind
1537 2010-12-03 13:40:36 <btcex> yep
1538 2010-12-03 13:40:38 <StrangeCharm> restarting with gen=0 doesn't help
1539 2010-12-03 13:40:52 <btcex> and check after it what it is killed
1540 2010-12-03 13:41:19 <StrangeCharm> what?
1541 2010-12-03 13:41:21 <btcex> StrangeCharm: backup your config and replase it them:
1542 2010-12-03 13:41:41 <btcex> $ cat .bitcoin/bitcoin.conf
1543 2010-12-03 13:41:41 <btcex> rpcuser=denizzz
1544 2010-12-03 13:41:42 <btcex> rpcpassword=123
1545 2010-12-03 13:41:50 <btcex> it is my config
1546 2010-12-03 13:42:33 <Diablo-D3> StrangeCharm: no
1547 2010-12-03 13:42:39 <Diablo-D3> you use bitcoind stop to stop
1548 2010-12-03 13:43:26 <Diablo-D3> btw, you cant change rpcuser and rpcpassword while bitcoind is running
1549 2010-12-03 13:43:32 <StrangeCharm> Diablo-D3, except that bitcond can't connect!
1550 2010-12-03 13:43:33 <btcex> Diablo-D3: it is imposibble, daemon is not respond to commands
1551 2010-12-03 13:43:34 <Diablo-D3> otherwise bitcoind as a client uses the wrong shit
1552 2010-12-03 13:44:02 <btcex> carramba!11
1553 2010-12-03 13:44:05 <btcex> bitcoinD ????
1554 2010-12-03 13:44:20 <btcex> StrangeCharm: you used bitcoind as client?
1555 2010-12-03 13:44:45 <StrangeCharm> btcex, yes
1556 2010-12-03 13:45:23 <StrangeCharm> all right, it works with an empty config
1557 2010-12-03 13:45:41 <StrangeCharm> i'll just go through my config, messing with stuff until i work out what's breaking it
1558 2010-12-03 13:47:26 <btcex> StrangeCharm: bitcoind also work as client now?
1559 2010-12-03 13:47:34 <StrangeCharm> yes
1560 2010-12-03 13:47:39 <btcex> ok
1561 2010-12-03 13:47:45 <btcex> but it is not ok :)
1562 2010-12-03 13:47:55 <StrangeCharm> what?
1563 2010-12-03 13:49:21 <btcex> StrangeCharm: using bitcoind as bitcoin client is a bad style
1564 2010-12-03 13:50:07 mizery has joined
1565 2010-12-03 13:50:15 <StrangeCharm> btcex, what should i use as a bitcoin client?
1566 2010-12-03 13:50:27 <btcex> One day they will be different binaries and you'll catch a error
1567 2010-12-03 13:50:38 <btcex> StrangeCharm: bitcoin, not bitcoinD
1568 2010-12-03 13:51:05 <StrangeCharm> btcex, bitcoin is a gui program, that's no good for me
1569 2010-12-03 13:51:11 Diablo-D3 has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
1570 2010-12-03 13:51:28 <btcex> StrangeCharm: no
1571 2010-12-03 13:51:46 <btcex> StrangeCharm: bitcoin have cli options
1572 2010-12-03 13:52:03 <btcex> StrangeCharm: bitcoin have cli client functionality
1573 2010-12-03 13:52:37 <StrangeCharm> btcex, so i can run - for instance - bitcoin getinfo and it won't greate an x session?
1574 2010-12-03 13:52:50 <btcex> although I can not right, but it seems to me it everything must be divided into binaries .. More, more binaries!
1575 2010-12-03 13:53:01 <btcex> StrangeCharm: yes
1576 2010-12-03 13:53:49 <StrangeCharm> btcex, can i run a local version of the gui client, connecting to a remote instance of bitcoind?
1577 2010-12-03 13:54:01 <btcex> StrangeCharm: yes
1578 2010-12-03 13:54:03 <btcex> ooop
1579 2010-12-03 13:54:04 <btcex> no
1580 2010-12-03 13:54:08 <wumpus> no yo can't
1581 2010-12-03 13:54:21 <wumpus> there is no separate thin gui client yet that can connect to a server
1582 2010-12-03 13:54:33 <wumpus> bitcoin gui acts as its own server
1583 2010-12-03 13:54:57 <StrangeCharm> where does this thin gui client live?
1584 2010-12-03 13:55:30 <StrangeCharm> btcex, the problem was turning off ssl
1585 2010-12-03 13:55:34 <wumpus> it doesn't exist, as far as I know
1586 2010-12-03 13:55:59 <StrangeCharm> btcex, without rpcssl=0 it works
1587 2010-12-03 13:56:19 <btcex> StrangeCharm: I guess :)
1588 2010-12-03 13:56:27 <StrangeCharm> wumpus, so, the best (only) way to remote administer my bitcoin server is via cli?
1589 2010-12-03 13:56:43 <btcex> StrangeCharm: yes
1590 2010-12-03 13:56:45 <wumpus> yes
1591 2010-12-03 13:57:02 <StrangeCharm> sigh
1592 2010-12-03 13:57:12 <StrangeCharm> this calls for a php web interface!
1593 2010-12-03 13:57:54 <btcex> php? web interface? FFFUUU!111
1594 2010-12-03 13:58:32 <btcex> json cli interface is very useful
1595 2010-12-03 13:58:50 <StrangeCharm> btcex, you're not a fan of web interfaces using php?
1596 2010-12-03 13:59:18 <wumpus> feel free to write one
1597 2010-12-03 13:59:22 <btcex> jsonawk for parse its output and execv for safety executing
1598 2010-12-03 13:59:31 <StrangeCharm> thats what i menat, wumpus
1599 2010-12-03 13:59:33 <wumpus> but please make it secure :)
1600 2010-12-03 13:59:49 <btcex> StrangeCharm: it violates the KISS principle
1601 2010-12-03 14:00:03 <wumpus> it's very dangerous to expose it over plain http
1602 2010-12-03 14:00:13 <wumpus> everyone could sniff your connection and take over the session
1603 2010-12-03 14:00:23 <wumpus> and send all your coins to themselves
1604 2010-12-03 14:00:41 <btcex> StrangeCharm: also I think that bitcoin turn into a small binary application and GUI will be separately
1605 2010-12-03 14:00:57 <btcex> as postgresql and its user interfaces
1606 2010-12-03 14:01:38 <wumpus> yes, the GUI should use the json/ssl interface too
1607 2010-12-03 14:02:03 <wumpus> or at least be able too -- for most (windows) users, there should also be an integrated version
1608 2010-12-03 14:03:03 <StrangeCharm> wumpus, well, i was assuming running the web interface on the server, only accessible via localhost, and connecting to the server via ssh
1609 2010-12-03 14:03:21 <StrangeCharm> so, security is implied, even if the client is actually very insecure
1610 2010-12-03 14:03:41 mizery has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1611 2010-12-03 14:04:41 <wumpus> StrangeCharm: ok, just be careful, if you open source it don't make it too easy to deploy in a insecure environment :)
1612 2010-12-03 14:05:22 <wumpus> there were so many exploits using mysqladmin, for example
1613 2010-12-03 14:05:40 <wumpus> and a bitcoin heist wouldn't be good publicity
1614 2010-12-03 14:12:44 akem has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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1617 2010-12-03 14:20:13 mizery has joined
1618 2010-12-03 14:20:33 Kiba`` is now known as kiba
1619 2010-12-03 14:20:37 <kiba> hey
1620 2010-12-03 14:21:45 <tcatm> hi kiba
1621 2010-12-03 14:26:06 <kiba> hmm
1622 2010-12-03 14:26:11 <kiba> I like the ability to set my own pricing
1623 2010-12-03 14:27:43 <tcatm> Does ubitio.us support it?
1624 2010-12-03 14:28:11 <kiba> 50% commision rate.
1625 2010-12-03 14:28:23 <kiba> and no ability to set my own price last time I check
1626 2010-12-03 14:28:25 mizery has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1627 2010-12-03 14:28:37 <kiba> and I have to pay .02 to be able to upload and make money.
1628 2010-12-03 14:28:50 <kiba> Ubitious's payrate sucks.
1629 2010-12-03 14:29:16 <tcatm> I think it should be possible to set a custom price.
1630 2010-12-03 14:29:24 <kiba> and also
1631 2010-12-03 14:29:27 <kiba> Ubitious files expire
1632 2010-12-03 14:29:40 <kiba> bencoder's terms are muuuuuuuuuuch more favorable
1633 2010-12-03 14:29:48 mizery has joined
1634 2010-12-03 14:30:02 <tcatm> There's a new service?
1635 2010-12-03 14:31:31 <kiba> bitcoinservice.co.uk
1636 2010-12-03 14:31:37 <kiba> competing service, yah.
1637 2010-12-03 14:32:33 <kiba> ubitious just lost my....
1638 2010-12-03 14:32:41 <kiba> support
1639 2010-12-03 14:32:58 <kiba> and some profit in the process
1640 2010-12-03 14:36:12 <bencoder> :)
1641 2010-12-03 14:36:46 <tcatm> bencoder: great service :)
1642 2010-12-03 14:37:47 <nanotube> bencoder: add previews.
1643 2010-12-03 14:40:57 <kiba> bencoder: add previews, please.
1644 2010-12-03 14:41:13 <kiba> preview = more downloads = more profit
1645 2010-12-03 14:42:15 <nanotube> (or less downloads... depending on quality :) )
1646 2010-12-03 14:42:32 <tcatm> Previews should also be custom images (so you can upload a .zip with many images and still have a preview).
1647 2010-12-03 14:43:59 <nanotube> there should also be some information about the file - type, size, etc. and for single imgs, preview should be autogenerated, to prevent cheating (as in, setting preview=something, actual image=something entirely different)
1648 2010-12-03 14:44:13 <kiba> we...have...a....bitcoin...gem
1649 2010-12-03 14:44:28 * kiba have dreams about a bunch of you guys going to a forum and getting kicked out
1650 2010-12-03 14:44:51 <kiba> you tried to promote bitcoin but forgot the advice that you need to be well integrated with the forum community at hand
1651 2010-12-03 14:45:13 <kiba> only one person I remember was able to stay there based on reputation
1652 2010-12-03 14:45:20 <kiba> forgot my advice*
1653 2010-12-03 14:45:39 <kiba> gavinandresen was the lucky bastard that get to advertise bitcoin..or was it someone else
1654 2010-12-03 14:45:42 <kiba> it was a dream
1655 2010-12-03 14:45:52 <kiba> haha
1656 2010-12-03 14:45:55 <kiba> I have bitcoin dreams
1657 2010-12-03 14:47:14 <gavinandresen> kiba: I have the opposite problem, bitcoin gives me insomnia
1658 2010-12-03 14:47:47 <tcatm> wow I made money from ads on bitcoincharts
1659 2010-12-03 14:48:48 <gavinandresen> StrangeCharm still here?  The -rpcssl=0 problem is a bug, sorry about that!
1660 2010-12-03 14:49:28 davex__ has quit (Quit: Ex-Chat)
1661 2010-12-03 14:50:17 albatross has joined
1662 2010-12-03 14:52:15 mizery has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
1663 2010-12-03 14:52:42 <MT`AwAy> https://twitter.com/#!/MagicalTux/status/10707594410725376 <- should anyone here be interested in wikileaks, I (somehow) translated in english latest letter from the current wikileaks hosting provider
1664 2010-12-03 14:54:11 TheAncientGoat has joined
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1669 2010-12-03 15:06:38 akem has joined
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1672 2010-12-03 15:17:49 noagendamarket has joined
1673 2010-12-03 15:21:22 davex__ has joined
1674 2010-12-03 15:28:55 <djoot> MT`AwAy: The whole hosting thing seems a bit weird, wikileaks.org is down, it has as ns[1-4].everydns.net as their nameservers.
1675 2010-12-03 15:29:08 <MT`AwAy> djoot: use the ip
1676 2010-12-03 15:29:21 <djoot> wikileaks.ch also have everydns resolving for them
1677 2010-12-03 15:29:28 <MT`AwAy> http://twitter.com/wikileaks/status/10621245489938433
1678 2010-12-03 15:29:32 <MT`AwAy> here's the IP
1679 2010-12-03 15:29:38 <MT`AwAy> http://blog.magicaltux.net/2010/12/04/ovh-the-wikileaks-case/ <- and here's an updated version of my translation
1680 2010-12-03 15:29:57 <djoot> and that does resolve, to a bahnhof host in sweden
1681 2010-12-03 15:30:10 <MT`AwAy> djoot: the ip in there redirects to a french ip
1682 2010-12-03 15:30:25 <MT`AwAy> http://213.251.145.96/ <- in France
1683 2010-12-03 15:30:35 <djoot> ok :)
1684 2010-12-03 15:31:40 <djoot> did you read the Q&A with Assange and guardian readers?
1685 2010-12-03 15:31:57 <MT`AwAy> quickly
1686 2010-12-03 15:35:25 <nathan7> wikileaks.info is up
1687 2010-12-03 15:36:18 <djoot> was it ever down?
1688 2010-12-03 15:36:32 <djoot> it's not uptodate though
1689 2010-12-03 15:38:02 <djoot> sorry, my bad, it is :)
1690 2010-12-03 15:38:29 <djoot> kind of
1691 2010-12-03 15:39:31 <MT`AwAy> xd
1692 2010-12-03 15:40:28 <djoot> aah, the wikileaks.ch points to a bahnhof host that redirects to the french one :)
1693 2010-12-03 15:41:28 <MT`AwAy> :p
1694 2010-12-03 15:41:29 <MT`AwAy> yes
1695 2010-12-03 15:41:59 <kiba> bencoder: so, when are you going to work on your download service?
1696 2010-12-03 15:43:21 <bencoder> I'll work on it over this weekend, will push a new release sunday evening
1697 2010-12-03 15:44:56 <bencoder> i've gotta clean it up some because i made some design decisions in my haste that don't make much sense, after thinking about them
1698 2010-12-03 15:46:34 dwdollar has left ()
1699 2010-12-03 15:47:23 <bencoder> I also need to work on the terms and such. I'll stick with no expiry but might have to add a maximum size for account and minimum prices dependent on the file size.
1700 2010-12-03 15:47:43 <kiba> this remind me that I should be doing short sprint with my project so I have something to upload frequently
1701 2010-12-03 15:51:32 larsig has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
1702 2010-12-03 15:54:58 dwdollar1 has joined
1703 2010-12-03 16:01:27 <tcatm> bencoder: You could charge for uploads.
1704 2010-12-03 16:04:22 wumpus has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
1705 2010-12-03 16:04:42 wumpus has joined
1706 2010-12-03 16:06:30 nelisky has quit (Quit: nelisky)
1707 2010-12-03 16:07:55 <bencoder> tcatm: I want to encourage uploads
1708 2010-12-03 16:08:21 larsig has joined
1709 2010-12-03 16:18:30 * kiba dares bencoder to put up a preview feature in 30 minutes
1710 2010-12-03 16:28:31 <nanotube> mm, wikileaks should accept bitcoin donations... :)
1711 2010-12-03 16:29:54 <CyanDynamo> then charge for downloads
1712 2010-12-03 16:30:09 <btcex> tcatm: it seems you forgot to add bid/ask for btcex.com
1713 2010-12-03 16:30:44 <tcatm> btcex: you haven't told me where I can find your orderbook (bid/ask is calculated from orderbook)
1714 2010-12-03 16:31:22 <btcex> tcatm: https://btcex.com/ticker.json
1715 2010-12-03 16:31:32 <btcex> aah
1716 2010-12-03 16:31:36 <btcex> orderbook
1717 2010-12-03 16:31:51 <btcex> ok, postpone it
1718 2010-12-03 16:44:16 <tcatm> JPY needs a few more trades.
1719 2010-12-03 16:44:52 * MT`AwAy too lazy
1720 2010-12-03 16:45:22 <kiba> we need a Korean Won
1721 2010-12-03 16:45:28 <kiba> and the Chinese Yuan!
1722 2010-12-03 16:45:46 <kiba> you know what?
1723 2010-12-03 16:45:52 <kiba> a bitcoin is actually worth more than a yuan
1724 2010-12-03 16:46:22 <albatross> what we really need is EUR/BTC
1725 2010-12-03 16:46:33 <albatross> GBP/BTC
1726 2010-12-03 16:48:54 <btcex> albatross: you are in UK?
1727 2010-12-03 16:49:45 <albatross> no...just saying. should have the major currencies covered: USD/EUR/GBP
1728 2010-12-03 16:51:51 <btcex> https://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=1485.0 btcex.com looking for partners topic
1729 2010-12-03 16:52:01 <btcex> about adding new currencies
1730 2010-12-03 16:53:44 <tcatm> Why do you need partners? Can't you add EUR on your own?
1731 2010-12-03 16:56:27 <btcex> tcatm: I can, but in Russia there is the concept of "foreign currency monitoring". It is not makes any problems except that they treat each payment within 2 weeks.
1732 2010-12-03 16:57:18 <tcatm> Open a bank account somewhere else?
1733 2010-12-03 16:57:23 <btcex> This is one reason why with Russia is not fully working a Paypal (rumors)
1734 2010-12-03 16:58:00 <btcex> tcatm: by the internet?
1735 2010-12-03 16:58:42 <tcatm> Or by going there (or asking a friend to do it).
1736 2010-12-03 16:59:25 <btcex> tcatm: you can not open an account by providing documents of another person
1737 2010-12-03 16:59:55 <btcex> or asking a friend? btcex.com looking for partners topic about that :)
1738 2010-12-03 17:01:15 <btcex> And I live at ~7000 kilometers away from European border and approximately in 9000 km from American border
1739 2010-12-03 17:01:43 glassresistor has joined
1740 2010-12-03 17:02:03 <kiba> In Soviet Russia, bitcoins sell YOU!
1741 2010-12-03 17:02:14 sgornick has quit (Quit: Leaving.)
1742 2010-12-03 17:02:19 <btcex> ...coins bit you! :)
1743 2010-12-03 17:03:23 <btcex> Closest to me are China and Mongolia - about 3000-4000 km :)
1744 2010-12-03 17:04:37 <btcex> Perhaps that is why we do not care about all sorts of world cataclysms.
1745 2010-12-03 17:04:39 <btcex> :)
1746 2010-12-03 17:07:12 <glassresistor> with the difficulty getting as high as it is im suprised the exchange rate has been dropping lately
1747 2010-12-03 17:07:30 <glassresistor> im starting to regret not selling some afew months ago
1748 2010-12-03 17:07:49 <kiba> that is inflation for ya
1749 2010-12-03 17:07:51 <CyanDynamo> btcex: is russia monitoring foreign currencies because of the deal with china, or is it old news?
1750 2010-12-03 17:08:00 <btcex> glassresistor: just someone sold a large amount
1751 2010-12-03 17:08:10 <tcatm> Everything > 0.10 BTC/USD is still good
1752 2010-12-03 17:08:54 <kiba> plus
1753 2010-12-03 17:08:59 <kiba> bitcoin is worth more than....
1754 2010-12-03 17:09:02 <kiba> YUAN
1755 2010-12-03 17:09:45 <btcex> CyanDynamo: This is an old system, introduced in 1992, it seems. It does not correspond to modern realities. Its very easy to get around, but just honest payments such as those that you suggested will experience problems.
1756 2010-12-03 17:09:48 <brocktice> glassresistor: I thought the same thing but generation adds less than 1% to the number of bitcoins every day.
1757 2010-12-03 17:10:31 <brocktice> right now about 0.15%/day
1758 2010-12-03 17:10:33 <CyanDynamo> btcex: oh, so it was in response to the trouble the ruble was having then?
1759 2010-12-03 17:10:39 <brocktice> it's a very small fraction of the supply
1760 2010-12-03 17:11:28 <btcex> the fact that we have no laws describing the e-currency.
1761 2010-12-03 17:12:05 <btcex> Therefore, a lot of unfair payment systems
1762 2010-12-03 17:14:35 <btcex> Currency monitoring was coined in order to limit the export of capital abroad. In other countries there that something like that?
1763 2010-12-03 17:15:07 <btcex> I think it strange at all, but people got used to it
1764 2010-12-03 17:15:24 <glassresistor> brocktice: im not thinking about inflation, it just seems reasonable to assume that btc's value should be related to the difficulty of generation
1765 2010-12-03 17:17:16 <glassresistor> i mean generation has been impractical even with high grade comsumer gpus and cpus, you basically need a cluster to make more than a block a day
1766 2010-12-03 17:17:57 noagendamarket has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
1767 2010-12-03 17:18:36 <tcatm> There are already many coins so generation is not really needed to meet current demand.
1768 2010-12-03 17:19:35 <tcatm> Total bid volume is about 50k BTC at mtgox.
1769 2010-12-03 17:24:15 <davex__> glassresistor, you're confusing cause and effect.  like labor theory of value does.
1770 2010-12-03 17:25:22 <davex__> something doesn't have value because of the labor needed to produce it, labor is expended because the thing is expected to have value.
1771 2010-12-03 17:26:18 <ArtForz> davex__: agree
1772 2010-12-03 17:26:26 asdf30 has joined
1773 2010-12-03 17:29:19 asdf58 has joined
1774 2010-12-03 17:31:40 asdf30 has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1775 2010-12-03 17:52:35 <albatross> ;;bc,stats
1776 2010-12-03 17:52:38 <gribble> Current Blocks: 95316 | Current Difficulty: 8078.19525793 | Next Difficulty At Block: 96767 | Next Difficulty In: 1451 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 0 days, 19 hours, 40 minutes, and 15 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 10409.58663664
1777 2010-12-03 18:08:02 nelisky has joined
1778 2010-12-03 18:10:08 <btcex> Please follow me on twitter: @btcex
1779 2010-12-03 18:15:13 <donpdonp> i dont read russian :(
1780 2010-12-03 18:16:01 <donpdonp> oh never mind i see the translation is in the second half of the tweet :)
1781 2010-12-03 18:16:52 <btcex> :)
1782 2010-12-03 18:22:40 nelisky has quit (Quit: nelisky)
1783 2010-12-03 18:24:22 <nanotube> btcex: what do you plan on putting there, anyway?
1784 2010-12-03 18:25:01 <btcex> Hotline and downtime reports
1785 2010-12-03 18:26:28 <nanotube> heh well, since i (a) don't use twitter, and (b) don't use btcex... i'll pass, and just stick to irc. :D
1786 2010-12-03 18:26:48 <btcex> nanotube: i am also don't use twitter
1787 2010-12-03 18:27:24 <nanotube> then how did you get your msg up there?
1788 2010-12-03 18:27:43 <nanotube> with the privet, and everything? :)
1789 2010-12-03 18:28:22 <btcex> nanotube: emergency hotline
1790 2010-12-03 18:28:57 <btcex> so when we go for a couple of nights to down there was no panic
1791 2010-12-03 18:29:36 <nanotube> ah
1792 2010-12-03 18:31:00 <CyanDynamo> just have a bot announce it here
1793 2010-12-03 18:31:46 <btcex> CyanDynamo: to see the news on the IRC you need to sit here and watch to the chat
1794 2010-12-03 18:33:12 <AAA_awright> Anyone a computer algroithm engineer, seen this? http://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=2035.0
1795 2010-12-03 18:34:32 <nanotube> CyanDynamo: yea, for wider, and more persistent, distribution of announcements, twitter is pretty decent. though personally i would prefer identica (being foss and all) :)
1796 2010-12-03 18:35:10 <CyanDynamo> well, i'm just saying, use twitter, but have a bot announce the twitters or something
1797 2010-12-03 18:35:28 <btcex> AAA_awright: you propose a chain cutter?
1798 2010-12-03 18:35:41 <btcex> an old idea
1799 2010-12-03 18:35:47 <AAA_awright> What's that?
1800 2010-12-03 18:36:43 <nanotube> CyanDynamo: well, there's already a bot announcing twitter. join #bc-news.
1801 2010-12-03 18:36:46 <AAA_awright> btcex: I'm not sure anyone has even considered it, the features that it provides (in theory)
1802 2010-12-03 18:36:57 <AAA_awright> But even if it is "old" what does it matter?
1803 2010-12-03 18:37:01 <nanotube> CyanDynamo: but we sure don't want botspam on this channel... it's busy enough as it is. :)
1804 2010-12-03 18:37:25 theymos has joined
1805 2010-12-03 18:37:40 <CyanDynamo> nanotube: indeed
1806 2010-12-03 18:37:53 <btcex> No, it does not.
1807 2010-12-03 18:38:20 <btcex> AAA_awright: No, it does not.
1808 2010-12-03 18:38:31 <btcex> i am goin to sleep
1809 2010-12-03 18:38:38 btcex has quit (Quit: Тают запасы хвойного древостоя!..)
1810 2010-12-03 18:38:42 <AAA_awright> It doesn't what?
1811 2010-12-03 18:38:45 <AAA_awright> >:(
1812 2010-12-03 18:38:58 <nanotube> i think he meant, it doesn't matter if it's old.
1813 2010-12-03 18:39:07 <AAA_awright> Yeah
1814 2010-12-03 18:43:30 JudStephenson has joined
1815 2010-12-03 18:44:12 <AAA_awright> I would like at least one person who knows something about anything there to say "yeah this could be possible in theory"
1816 2010-12-03 18:50:05 Hogofwar has joined
1817 2010-12-03 18:53:59 <davex__> AAA_awright, How would the initial distribution of coins happen?
1818 2010-12-03 18:54:39 <AAA_awright> davex__: It would probably be centralized, could happen on an infrastructure similar to Bitcoin right now...
1819 2010-12-03 18:55:12 <AAA_awright> davex__: You could move the balances into millions of seperate, but weak private keys, and first person to crack the private key gets the account balance
1820 2010-12-03 18:55:55 <AAA_awright> If everyone works at seperate private keys, the rate at which they are solved will fall off
1821 2010-12-03 18:56:49 <davex__> inflation rate would be subject to computing power then.
1822 2010-12-03 18:57:33 <JudStephenson> I know im late to the discussion, but what problem are we trying to address with centralized distribution?
1823 2010-12-03 18:57:33 <davex__> unless somehow private keys got readjusted, not sure how that would work
1824 2010-12-03 18:57:46 <AAA_awright> There's any number of ways to allocate it, that's one I came up with on the spot
1825 2010-12-03 18:58:05 <davex__> i guess he's trying to avoid an audit trail?
1826 2010-12-03 18:58:32 <JudStephenson> ah
1827 2010-12-03 18:58:34 <AAA_awright> JudStephenson: <AAA_awright> Anyone a computer algroithm engineer, seen this? http://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=2035.0
1828 2010-12-03 18:59:56 <JudStephenson> I'm no algorithm engineer, just an economist
1829 2010-12-03 19:00:45 <JudStephenson> but while I'm sure at some level your idea could be executed, wouldn't it kill off some of the beneficial elements of non-centralized distribution?
1830 2010-12-03 19:00:59 <AAA_awright> That is non-centralized
1831 2010-12-03 19:01:23 <AAA_awright> It's so distributed it would work without a network
1832 2010-12-03 19:02:23 <JudStephenson> hmm, I'm reading over your idea right now.
1833 2010-12-03 19:02:35 <Foggymyst> You know what a big problem is?  From the time you hear about BitCoin to the time you actually have any to spend is at minimum 8 days of 100% CPU.
1834 2010-12-03 19:03:01 <brocktice> Foggymyst: generation is not a good way to get bitcoins for most people
1835 2010-12-03 19:03:08 <davex__> you did well, i think, at 8 days
1836 2010-12-03 19:03:10 <Foggymyst> Exactly.
1837 2010-12-03 19:03:23 <Foggymyst> So how do people get bitcoins?
1838 2010-12-03 19:03:34 <theymos> Dollars are even worse: my computer hasn't produced any yet!
1839 2010-12-03 19:03:40 <JudStephenson> I think it is too easy to focus on the hassle of "generating"
1840 2010-12-03 19:03:56 <JudStephenson> If you relate bitcoins to gold, not everyone who owns gold is a miner
1841 2010-12-03 19:04:01 <Foggymyst> Its not the hassle of generating....it's the hassle of being able to use bitcoin.
1842 2010-12-03 19:04:14 <davex__> use an exchange
1843 2010-12-03 19:04:36 <AAA_awright> It's supposed to be the feature, right? Eh, a centralized chain in order to exchange with any other person is the downfall
1844 2010-12-03 19:04:37 <JudStephenson> Foggymyst: correct, which is why exchanges will pop up allowing, essentially, currency exchange
1845 2010-12-03 19:04:58 <Foggymyst> "Hey, donate to my blog with bitcoins!"   "Ok, how?"  "Get a $5 bill, put it in envelope and mail it to some guy and in a few days you'll have some bitcoin"
1846 2010-12-03 19:05:00 <JudStephenson> * there are already a few
1847 2010-12-03 19:05:36 <davex__> same problem if someone only accepts, say euros
1848 2010-12-03 19:05:41 <JudStephenson> Foggymyst: You have to think of bitcoin as a foreign currency
1849 2010-12-03 19:06:11 <davex__> think I'll just let Jud handle this. :P
1850 2010-12-03 19:06:31 <JudStephenson> haha, I feel like an echo
1851 2010-12-03 19:06:40 <Foggymyst> JudStephenson: I understand what you are saying, but my viewpoint is you have to think of bitcoin as a product.  Without adoption it's useless and right now there are huge barriers to entry preventing adoption.
1852 2010-12-03 19:07:05 <Foggymyst> JudStephenson: Have you ever read Crossing The Chasm?
1853 2010-12-03 19:07:32 <JudStephenson> Foggymyst: you are correct that without adoption it is hard for it to catch on, but Bitcoin is still young and I think there are solutions to those problems being developed
1854 2010-12-03 19:07:58 <JudStephenson> I'm looking it up now, I haven't read it though
1855 2010-12-03 19:08:54 <Foggymyst> JudStephenson: The idea is that most products have multiple phases of adoption.... early on it's the technophiles and 'early adopters'.  But to get from there to 'mass consumer' there is a chasm that most products are never able to cross and they eventually fail.
1856 2010-12-03 19:09:01 <JudStephenson> I think adoption of bitcoin could be pretty easy actually - for a huge chunk of the market, you would just need to get paypal to offer conversion :p
1857 2010-12-03 19:09:26 <JudStephenson> Foggymyst: I completely agree! My mom would have no clue how to use bitcoin
1858 2010-12-03 19:09:31 <Foggymyst> JudStephenson: And so the book is about....how do you make the leap from the technophiles who give up convience for new technology to mass consumption where they simply want convience.
1859 2010-12-03 19:10:20 <JudStephenson> I think bitcoin has the ability to be adopted by merchants the most since there is no fear of chargebacks and no transaction fees
1860 2010-12-03 19:10:37 <JudStephenson> *of course, that can be both good and bad
1861 2010-12-03 19:10:44 <Foggymyst> JudStephenson: I 110% agree
1862 2010-12-03 19:10:52 <Foggymyst> I think that is by far it's BIGGEST selling point
1863 2010-12-03 19:11:13 <Foggymyst> All the distributed stuff and other technology mumbo jumbo is just icing on the cake.
1864 2010-12-03 19:11:13 <AAA_awright> But it's weak in propagating transactions
1865 2010-12-03 19:11:39 <AAA_awright> It's really weak for store transactions because it takes an hour to verify with any certainty
1866 2010-12-03 19:11:51 <JudStephenson> I have no clue if bitcoin is "THE" currency of the future, but you would have to assume that the days of $20 wire transfers and 4% transaction fees on visa's network are numbered, right?
1867 2010-12-03 19:11:54 <Foggymyst> AAA_awright: Yah, I have started to realize that as I used it more.
1868 2010-12-03 19:12:06 <AAA_awright> Actually I should comment about that because that's the biggest thing that my idea fixes
1869 2010-12-03 19:12:20 <brocktice> from what I read on the forums it's actually pretty safe even with 0 confirmations
1870 2010-12-03 19:12:22 <Foggymyst> JudStephenson: Except those wire transfers and 4% fees are what you have to do to get any bitcoin to begin with
1871 2010-12-03 19:12:28 <AAA_awright> It still doesn't do away with it
1872 2010-12-03 19:12:33 <brocktice> though it gets much safer with more
1873 2010-12-03 19:12:50 <JudStephenson> Well true, though, ACH transactions are much cheaper ($0.5/ea and no fees)
1874 2010-12-03 19:12:55 <AAA_awright> You can't, but the way it would work would make it much faster since you aren't waiting for a block to confirm your transaction was accepted
1875 2010-12-03 19:13:14 <Foggymyst> JudStephenson: If somehow magically we rewarded mining at 1BC more frequently instead of 50BC very infrequently...we'd be on our way.
1876 2010-12-03 19:13:22 <Hogofwar> yes
1877 2010-12-03 19:13:54 <Foggymyst> JudStephenson: I think the pooled mining should be built into the official client by default and that it should connect to an official pool by default
1878 2010-12-03 19:14:17 <Foggymyst> Anyways, i have to fold laundry or the fiance is going to be mad. ;)
1879 2010-12-03 19:14:30 <Foggymyst> I enjoyed talking with you guys, hope to see you around more.
1880 2010-12-03 19:14:35 <JudStephenson> That would get bitcoins in people's hands, but of course probably not enough to make a difference
1881 2010-12-03 19:15:24 <JudStephenson> but I have always assumed that as bitcoin matures, the model of Mt Gox would become more prevalent, with companies offering merchant services and essentially "banking" products
1882 2010-12-03 19:15:44 <jgarzik> Foggymyst: an official pooled client will happen, IMO.  (I don't have any special inside knowledge, just a gut feeling)
1883 2010-12-03 19:15:50 <jgarzik> Foggymyst: an official pool... unlikely
1884 2010-12-03 19:16:06 <jgarzik> pools are more of a "market will make it happen" thing, with several competitors.
1885 2010-12-03 19:16:18 <AAA_awright> How do you prove the work you are doing?
1886 2010-12-03 19:16:31 <jgarzik> see the forums
1887 2010-12-03 19:16:36 <AAA_awright> You would have to have a subnetwork with a lower difficulty
1888 2010-12-03 19:16:40 <jgarzik> yes
1889 2010-12-03 19:18:08 <Hogofwar> I cannot get java working to use the daemons jsonrpc stuff
1890 2010-12-03 19:19:29 <jgarzik> Hogofwar: JSON-RPC does not require Java.
1891 2010-12-03 19:26:47 vfo has joined
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1894 2010-12-03 19:42:06 <glassresistor> davex__: i agree with you in the long term, once a currency is mature(or more mature), but initially the value of gold was determined by the amount of labor required to pull it out of the ground until its more profitable to gain gold through exchange than through mining
1895 2010-12-03 19:45:06 <glassresistor> davex__: ultimately both require an expectation of it having value but the source of the value is different
1896 2010-12-03 19:45:12 nelisky has joined
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1899 2010-12-03 19:48:28 albatross has left ()
1900 2010-12-03 19:49:07 <nelisky> andrew12: and once again, I win
1901 2010-12-03 19:49:31 <nelisky> this is not too much fun with just the two of us, but I'm feeding the earnings back into yet another pick3
1902 2010-12-03 19:49:35 * tcatm starts working on android client
1903 2010-12-03 19:50:06 tg has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1904 2010-12-03 19:51:10 tg has joined
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1908 2010-12-03 20:04:29 <glassresistor> AAA_awright: the hash-based transaction at a glance looks like it might have a problem with recursive hashing
1909 2010-12-03 20:07:05 <andrew12> nelisky: -.-
1910 2010-12-03 20:09:39 <andrew12> I think I might write a JSON-RPC library for ruby since there currently isn't one
1911 2010-12-03 20:10:41 bitanarchy has joined
1912 2010-12-03 20:12:05 <andrew12> at least, there isn't a gem for one
1913 2010-12-03 20:13:11 <davex__> that's sort of surprising
1914 2010-12-03 20:13:19 <andrew12> i agree
1915 2010-12-03 20:14:02 <andrew12> I think i'm going to take the code for xmlrpc and make it be json instead
1916 2010-12-03 20:14:07 sgornick has joined
1917 2010-12-03 20:14:29 <kiba> andrew12: that's incorrect
1918 2010-12-03 20:14:34 <andrew12> hmm?
1919 2010-12-03 20:14:35 <kiba> that's a a rubygem for bitcoin
1920 2010-12-03 20:14:38 altamic has joined
1921 2010-12-03 20:14:44 <kiba> search rubygem.org
1922 2010-12-03 20:14:51 <kiba> there's a rubygem for bitcoin
1923 2010-12-03 20:15:10 <andrew12> http://rubygems.org/
1924 2010-12-03 20:15:46 <kiba> yeah, whatever
1925 2010-12-03 20:15:53 <andrew12> lol
1926 2010-12-03 20:16:24 <altamic> that gem squattering
1927 2010-12-03 20:16:29 <altamic> that's
1928 2010-12-03 20:16:55 <andrew12> hmm?
1929 2010-12-03 20:18:03 <altamic> https://github.com/requnix/bitcoin/blob/master/lib/bitcoin.rb
1930 2010-12-03 20:18:16 <kiba> did anybody have any success with mtgox merchant service?
1931 2010-12-03 20:22:12 wizeman_ has quit (Quit: http://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.)
1932 2010-12-03 20:22:24 Foggymyst has quit (Quit: Page closed)
1933 2010-12-03 20:23:30 <mtgox> kiba: just email me your code
1934 2010-12-03 20:23:33 <nanotube> ;;later tell foggymyst you can buy bitcoins with a credit card at bitcoingateway.com
1935 2010-12-03 20:23:33 <gribble> The operation succeeded.
1936 2010-12-03 20:23:53 <nanotube> mtgox: howdy :)
1937 2010-12-03 20:23:59 <mtgox> hey
1938 2010-12-03 20:24:33 <kiba> email what code?
1939 2010-12-03 20:25:00 <nanotube> mtgox: i see you're working on opening up more ways to get $$ into mtgox. great. :)
1940 2010-12-03 20:25:19 <kiba> Isn't it your end. Your server didn't contact mine
1941 2010-12-03 20:26:12 wizeman has joined
1942 2010-12-03 20:26:30 <kiba> mtgox: also, how long does it take for manual payment to occurs?
1943 2010-12-03 20:26:57 <kiba> I sent 20 BTC. One of which, I did't click on "I sent" because I didn't see it.
1944 2010-12-03 20:28:09 <mtgox> kiba: You have some code that should be starting the transaction. Send that to me
1945 2010-12-03 20:28:42 <kiba> a post form?
1946 2010-12-03 20:28:48 <kiba> that is the code for generating a post form
1947 2010-12-03 20:28:51 <kiba> you want the output?
1948 2010-12-03 20:28:58 <mtgox> sure
1949 2010-12-03 20:30:58 nelisky has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
1950 2010-12-03 20:31:23 <kiba> https://gist.github.com/727505
1951 2010-12-03 20:32:18 <kiba> blah, want am I sending you email anyway?
1952 2010-12-03 20:32:20 <kiba> the code is all public
1953 2010-12-03 20:32:30 <kiba> https://gist.github.com/727505
1954 2010-12-03 20:32:33 <kiba> err
1955 2010-12-03 20:33:03 <kiba> hmm, the generated form is not supposed to have authencity thingy?
1956 2010-12-03 20:33:31 nelisky has joined
1957 2010-12-03 20:37:10 JudStephenson has left ()
1958 2010-12-03 20:42:43 glassresistor has quit (Quit: Changing server)
1959 2010-12-03 20:44:43 Hogofwar has joined
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1961 2010-12-03 20:45:54 RazielZ has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1962 2010-12-03 20:46:54 <Hogofwar> Is the bitcoind auto configured to refuse external connections?
1963 2010-12-03 20:48:33 <theymos> Yes. It listens only on localhost by default.
1964 2010-12-03 20:48:41 <Hogofwar> How do i change that?
1965 2010-12-03 20:48:52 <theymos> rpcallowip=ip
1966 2010-12-03 20:50:31 bitanarchy has quit (Quit: Page closed)
1967 2010-12-03 20:50:43 <Hogofwar> Ip of the specific one i want to allow?
1968 2010-12-03 20:50:48 <theymos> Yes.
1969 2010-12-03 20:50:51 <Hogofwar> okay
1970 2010-12-03 20:50:58 <Hogofwar> I will try that, thanks
1971 2010-12-03 20:56:48 nelisky has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
1972 2010-12-03 20:56:59 nelisky has joined
1973 2010-12-03 20:57:43 <Hogofwar> okay
1974 2010-12-03 20:58:16 <Hogofwar> I can connect using user:pass@127.0.0.1:8332
1975 2010-12-03 20:58:36 <Hogofwar> But when i use my ip instead of 127.0.0.1 it does not resolve/allow me
1976 2010-12-03 21:00:09 <theymos> The IP of the script connecting to Bitcoin is allowed with rpcallowip?
1977 2010-12-03 21:00:37 <Hogofwar> yes
1978 2010-12-03 21:00:50 <Hogofwar> but when just using my browser through my actual ip it doesn't work
1979 2010-12-03 21:00:55 <theymos> Try rpcallowip=* to test allowing all IPs.
1980 2010-12-03 21:00:57 <Hogofwar> on teh same machine
1981 2010-12-03 21:02:22 <Hogofwar> The server at 80.0.171.215 is taking too long to respond.
1982 2010-12-03 21:02:27 <Hogofwar> oh wait >_>
1983 2010-12-03 21:02:35 <Hogofwar> Anyway
1984 2010-12-03 21:02:46 <Hogofwar> Yeah, no chnage
1985 2010-12-03 21:05:02 <Hogofwar> I have forwared port 8332 and 8333
1986 2010-12-03 21:05:08 <Hogofwar> *forwarded
1987 2010-12-03 21:05:24 <Hogofwar> Shouldn't my ip work anyway to connect?
1988 2010-12-03 21:06:12 <brocktice> this should help bitcoin: http://yro.slashdot.org/story/10/12/03/1747258/Feds-Warrantlessly-Tracking-Americans-Real-Time-Credit-Card-Activity
1989 2010-12-03 21:06:42 <kiba> brocktice: you have to realize that the software behind credit card processing are often crap
1990 2010-12-03 21:06:46 <kiba> it might be ineffective.
1991 2010-12-03 21:07:12 <brocktice> I don't know, Chase seems to have fucking neural network software hooked up to theirs
1992 2010-12-03 21:07:23 <brocktice> Which scarily detects abnormal activity.
1993 2010-12-03 21:07:32 <CyanDynamo> kiba: yeah, but average people dont
1994 2010-12-03 21:07:49 <kiba> don't what?
1995 2010-12-03 21:07:59 <Hogofwar> so no help?
1996 2010-12-03 21:08:24 <CyanDynamo> they don't know that it's crap
1997 2010-12-03 21:08:32 <CyanDynamo> i didn't/don't
1998 2010-12-03 21:08:41 <CyanDynamo> though it doesn't surprise me
1999 2010-12-03 21:09:28 <theymos> Hogofwar: I've noticed oddities in other programs with connecting to myself using an external IP. I think IP is supposed to bring it back to the localhost interface, but it's probably best to just avoid doing that.
2000 2010-12-03 21:12:23 dwdollar1 is now known as dwdollar
2001 2010-12-03 21:16:25 Diablo-D3 has joined
2002 2010-12-03 21:18:48 <brocktice> The account stuff isn't visible in the UI yet, right?
2003 2010-12-03 21:19:53 <ArtForz> I think so
2004 2010-12-03 21:20:07 <brocktice> I'm rebuilding just to make sure
2005 2010-12-03 21:21:53 <Hogofwar> So why won't my script work then if it is trying to connect to my ip from an external machine that is allowed?
2006 2010-12-03 21:24:54 <bencoder> so just been thinking.. i'm sure this has come up before and been solved, but how is the problem of a competing, fake blockchain overtaking the existing one solved? Does the bitcoin client take into account difficulty when deciding which block chain to use? because if not then wouldn't it be possible to engineer a blockchain where the difficulty is kept as low as possible, therefore making the computation much less in order to overtake the ex
2007 2010-12-03 21:25:11 <brocktice> bencoder: yep, uses difficulty
2008 2010-12-03 21:25:23 <ArtForz> yep
2009 2010-12-03 21:25:42 <bencoder> okay, just whenever people talk about it they say "whichever one is longer" but that's not entirely true then :) cool
2010 2010-12-03 21:25:43 <brocktice> 'length' = SUM 0-n (block n * difficulty of block n) where n = number of blocks
2011 2010-12-03 21:25:48 <ArtForz> "longest" chain = gihest sum of difficulty
2012 2010-12-03 21:25:56 <brocktice> I think
2013 2010-12-03 21:26:00 <ArtForz> afair that's even in the paper
2014 2010-12-03 21:26:08 <brocktice> They have weighted lengths, basically
2015 2010-12-03 21:26:24 <bencoder> ok I see
2016 2010-12-03 21:26:34 <brocktice> even easier you could just say a block's length is its difficulty
2017 2010-12-03 21:26:42 <theymos> It is in the paper, but I didn't understand the meaning behind it until Satoshi explained it.
2018 2010-12-03 21:27:21 <bencoder> yeah it's been several months since i read the paper, shoulda looked instead of asking now i guess
2019 2010-12-03 21:31:57 <Hogofwar> is there a limit of how many confiramtions you cna have?
2020 2010-12-03 21:32:02 <Hogofwar> *confirmations
2021 2010-12-03 21:32:04 <kiba> no
2022 2010-12-03 21:32:14 <kiba> I believe it keep going and going and going and going...
2023 2010-12-03 21:32:22 <kiba> as long as blocks are generated
2024 2010-12-03 21:34:51 <Hogofwar> i don't think it is such a good idea for me to run 50 instances of remoteminer
2025 2010-12-03 21:51:29 <brocktice> Hm, I'm a little worried
2026 2010-12-03 21:51:34 <brocktice> I tried to run a newer bitcoin build
2027 2010-12-03 21:51:36 <brocktice> and got this:
2028 2010-12-03 21:51:58 <brocktice> EXCEPTION: NSt8ios_base7failureE
2029 2010-12-03 21:51:58 <brocktice> CDataStream::read() : end of data
2030 2010-12-03 21:51:59 <brocktice> bitcoin in AppInit()
2031 2010-12-03 21:52:21 <ArtForz> that doesnt sound nice
2032 2010-12-03 21:52:43 <brocktice> no, not at all
2033 2010-12-03 21:53:11 <brocktice> Seems like maybe something got corrupted?
2034 2010-12-03 21:53:18 <ArtForz> possibly
2035 2010-12-03 21:53:43 <theymos> Try moving out your block databases.
2036 2010-12-03 21:53:50 <brocktice> theymos: which are those?
2037 2010-12-03 21:53:53 <ArtForz> yeah, I'd test with a fresh datadir and old wallet
2038 2010-12-03 21:53:59 <Hogofwar> Can nobody help me with my problem of being able to access bitcoind externally (using my ip even on the computer i have it running on)
2039 2010-12-03 21:54:11 <Hogofwar> It doesn't find it at all
2040 2010-12-03 21:54:21 <theymos> brocktice: Just remove all files except wallet.dat and bitcoin.conf.
2041 2010-12-03 21:54:25 <brocktice> ah ok
2042 2010-12-03 21:54:32 <brocktice> don't touch the directories?
2043 2010-12-03 21:54:38 <theymos> Move those, too.
2044 2010-12-03 21:54:58 <bencoder> Hogofwar: that's for security, by default it's bound only to 127.0.0.1
2045 2010-12-03 21:55:12 <Hogofwar> Yeah i have set it up to allow any inbound connections
2046 2010-12-03 21:55:24 <brocktice> still doing it
2047 2010-12-03 21:55:24 <Hogofwar> rcpallowip=*
2048 2010-12-03 21:55:24 <bencoder> oh
2049 2010-12-03 21:55:28 <brocktice> maybe I'll try an official build
2050 2010-12-03 21:55:58 <bencoder> I don't know then. I wouldn't do that personally
2051 2010-12-03 21:56:16 <Hogofwar> i didn't do that at the start, i used the ip of what i wanted to be able to acces it
2052 2010-12-03 21:56:25 <Hogofwar> but that stillw ouldn't work
2053 2010-12-03 21:56:52 <bencoder> oh
2054 2010-12-03 21:57:27 <Hogofwar> ugh nothing i can find
2055 2010-12-03 21:57:34 <Hogofwar> I have forwared the ports
2056 2010-12-03 21:57:40 <Hogofwar> unless
2057 2010-12-03 21:58:05 <Hogofwar> Should i set the ports to tcp/udp or just tcp or udp
2058 2010-12-03 21:58:26 <brocktice> ruh roh
2059 2010-12-03 21:58:28 <brocktice> this is not working
2060 2010-12-03 22:00:17 <bencoder> Hogofwar: it'd be tcp, but also, you've got it as rpcallowip and not rcpallowip right?
2061 2010-12-03 22:00:52 <brocktice> even an old wallet is not working
2062 2010-12-03 22:01:10 <bencoder> just looking at what you said up there ^ though i'm sure you've got it right in the file
2063 2010-12-03 22:02:43 <Hogofwar> ffs
2064 2010-12-03 22:03:35 <brocktice> hm, you guys know some way to repair a berkely db?
2065 2010-12-03 22:03:37 <bencoder> was that it?
2066 2010-12-03 22:05:17 <bencoder> brocktice: db_recover ? but no experience..
2067 2010-12-03 22:05:50 <kiba> mtgox's lack of response is concerning me
2068 2010-12-03 22:05:56 <kiba> I can't get fix
2069 2010-12-03 22:06:07 <kiba> without mtgox's help
2070 2010-12-03 22:06:15 <bencoder> what's the problem?
2071 2010-12-03 22:06:27 <brocktice> I finally found an old enough wallet
2072 2010-12-03 22:06:28 <kiba> it's something with notify_url information being wrong
2073 2010-12-03 22:07:10 <brocktice> So, question is, what happens if I'm using an old wallet?
2074 2010-12-03 22:07:28 <brocktice> Will I lose some money?
2075 2010-12-03 22:07:30 <bencoder> how old is it?
2076 2010-12-03 22:07:40 <brocktice> few days
2077 2010-12-03 22:07:57 <bencoder> you'll probably be fine with the 100address buffer, depending on how many transactions you've made
2078 2010-12-03 22:08:08 <brocktice> not a ton
2079 2010-12-03 22:08:29 <brocktice> is there a rolling buffer?
2080 2010-12-03 22:08:31 entel has quit (Quit: Lost terminal)
2081 2010-12-03 22:08:46 <brocktice> I thought it was only when you started
2082 2010-12-03 22:09:21 <theymos> The pool is always kept filled at 100.
2083 2010-12-03 22:10:09 <brocktice> oh
2084 2010-12-03 22:10:10 * jgarzik wonders how many clients have been hacked to use freenode's #bitcoin for IRC seeding
2085 2010-12-03 22:10:14 <brocktice> OK, probably I'll be alright then
2086 2010-12-03 22:10:24 <appamatto> I know there are some free-marketeers in here; any good podcasts you recommend about economics, politics, etc. from a non-ridiculous perspective?
2087 2010-12-03 22:10:44 <kiba> econtalk?
2088 2010-12-03 22:10:52 <theymos> jgarzik: Extremely old versions used to use Freenode. I doubt anyone hacked their version to do so.
2089 2010-12-03 22:11:29 <theymos> appamatto: A lot of the lectures on mises.org are good. Not sure if you want that kind of thing.
2090 2010-12-03 22:12:08 * jgarzik also wonders how many drop-n-run bitcoin installs exist out there...  ie. where someone has access to a computer for a short period of time, installs bitcoin and a script to forward generated transactions, and then disappears :)
2091 2010-12-03 22:12:12 <appamatto> Yeah, I'm definitely into mises.org
2092 2010-12-03 22:12:15 <kiba> GAH
2093 2010-12-03 22:12:20 <kiba> I dislike my business being put on hold
2094 2010-12-03 22:12:37 <appamatto> Something like that would be nice, but maybe more conversational or perhaps less angry :p
2095 2010-12-03 22:13:12 <kiba> http://www.econtalk.org/
2096 2010-12-03 22:13:50 glassresistor has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
2097 2010-12-03 22:13:55 <Hogofwar> GODDAMN WHY WON'T IT LET IT CONNECT
2098 2010-12-03 22:14:26 <appamatto> kiba, thanks, I'll check it out
2099 2010-12-03 22:14:46 <gavinandresen> Hogofwar: are you restarting bitcoin after changing bitcoin.conf ?
2100 2010-12-03 22:14:50 <appamatto> I listened to freetalklive for a while, but I'm not sure it's appropriate for at-work listening
2101 2010-12-03 22:16:13 <tcatm> theymos: What's the URL to your testnet explorer? (You should add a link somehwere..)
2102 2010-12-03 22:16:21 <gavinandresen> econtalk is awesome.
2103 2010-12-03 22:16:27 <theymos> tcatm: http://blockexplorer.com/testnet/
2104 2010-12-03 22:17:17 <appamatto> Is the guy from the Austrian school?
2105 2010-12-03 22:17:34 <tcatm> thanks
2106 2010-12-03 22:17:42 <appamatto> It really pains me to listen to mainstream economists
2107 2010-12-03 22:18:02 <tcatm> Looks like I have to wait quite a long time to receive my testnet bitcoins :/
2108 2010-12-03 22:18:05 <gavinandresen> appamatto: you mean Russ Roberts of econtalk?   I think he's somewhat agnostic.  Schooled at Chicago....
2109 2010-12-03 22:18:37 <gavinandresen> appamatto:  Professor Roberts is appropriately skeptical of all the flavors of economics, I think.
2110 2010-12-03 22:19:13 <appamatto> Cool, I'll give it a listen :)
2111 2010-12-03 22:19:26 asdf58 has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
2112 2010-12-03 22:20:08 <gavinandresen> There are a couple of econtalk episodes about the bus system in Santiago Chile that are great.
2113 2010-12-03 22:20:41 <kiba> problem with mtgox on IRC: he's not attentive to IRC at all. Poor communication.
2114 2010-12-03 22:20:59 <jgarzik> kiba: in fairness, he's not a paid 24/7 support staffer either
2115 2010-12-03 22:21:11 <kiba> yeah I know.
2116 2010-12-03 22:21:47 <kiba> but it pains me no matter the same. I really wanna wanna wanna earn bitcoins
2117 2010-12-03 22:24:48 <Hogofwar> Gavinandreson: Yes I am
2118 2010-12-03 22:25:01 <Hogofwar> It allows me to acces it from 127.0.0.1
2119 2010-12-03 22:25:12 <Hogofwar> But not anywhere else (even if i have allowed it)
2120 2010-12-03 22:25:33 <Hogofwar> ir even using my own ip to my computer on teh computer i  and the server am on
2121 2010-12-03 22:26:01 <jgarzik> kiba: then build a prediction market :)
2122 2010-12-03 22:26:29 <jgarzik> kiba: you will make money and earn fame to boot, propelling bitcoin into the spotlight (for better or worse)
2123 2010-12-03 22:27:01 <kiba> jgarzik: I am still reliant on knowledge of how to implement payment processing API
2124 2010-12-03 22:27:14 <gavinandresen> Hogofwar: running a recent version of bitcoin/bitcoind?  Are you behind a firewall or running iptables rules that might prevent the connection?
2125 2010-12-03 22:27:15 <kiba> but yes, in the meantime, I can work on the rest of the project
2126 2010-12-03 22:27:15 <jgarzik> kiba: that's the easy part
2127 2010-12-03 22:27:47 <jgarzik> kiba: for version 0, the "it works... barely" prototype, all you need is a kiba-written payment module that returns success for all payments
2128 2010-12-03 22:29:14 <kiba> I'll need access to a server, and aceat64 had yet to reply
2129 2010-12-03 22:29:15 <Hogofwar> so nobody can help with my problem?
2130 2010-12-03 22:29:24 <kiba> jgarzik: that's keeping in with my philosophy...
2131 2010-12-03 22:30:05 <jgarzik> kiba: you can do all the development on your own computer these days
2132 2010-12-03 22:30:08 <gavinandresen> Hogofwar:  what's the bitcoin version number from ./bitcoind getinfo   ?
2133 2010-12-03 22:30:40 <jgarzik> kiba: everybody has 127.0.0.1 (loopback), which is all you need to test HTTP server applications
2134 2010-12-03 22:31:23 <jgarzik> kiba: once you have something that works locally, I imagine plenty of interested people would invest or help, by providing a server
2135 2010-12-03 22:31:31 * bencoder nods
2136 2010-12-03 22:31:33 <kiba> jgarzik: that's not the point. I need to develop a deploy script.
2137 2010-12-03 22:31:35 <gavinandresen> And Hogofwar:  do you have  rpcssl=something in your bitcoin.conf?
2138 2010-12-03 22:31:47 <kiba> and I made an agreement with aceat64
2139 2010-12-03 22:32:09 <kiba> I want to be able to deploy app to production server as quickly as possible
2140 2010-12-03 22:32:20 <jgarzik> kiba: a deploy script is something that is needed -after- you actually have a working prototype
2141 2010-12-03 22:33:23 <jgarzik> kiba: I think it's more important to have a working prototype, rather than a non-working nothing that can be deployed quickly to a production server.
2142 2010-12-03 22:33:39 <jgarzik> but hey, I'm not doing the work, so that IMHO
2143 2010-12-03 22:35:00 <tcatm> jgarzik, nelisky: For phone API... any idea how user authentication should be done?
2144 2010-12-03 22:35:19 <jgarzik> kiba: just try to avoid self-imposed limits, which can become hurdles to getting any work done
2145 2010-12-03 22:36:26 <jgarzik> tcatm: #include standard_answers.h :)    Either stored auth (un/pw), or OTP, or query some API via SASL that triggers various authentication prompts in the UI.
2146 2010-12-03 22:38:40 <kiba> jgarzik: whatever the case, my web service is fully operational. The only problem is that I cannot make money.
2147 2010-12-03 22:39:17 <bencoder> kiba: doesn't mybitcoin offer merchant services that you could use?
2148 2010-12-03 22:39:43 andrew12 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2149 2010-12-03 22:40:06 <kiba> bencoder: I did try using their service..but I thought mtgox mgith have better merchant service..I guess it wasn't anything special
2150 2010-12-03 22:40:21 <bencoder> or is that just shopping card t thing
2151 2010-12-03 22:40:32 <kiba> but it would required me to implement some thing...
2152 2010-12-03 22:40:38 <kiba> I'll get it working tonight
2153 2010-12-03 22:40:43 <bencoder> gah sorry my connection is terrible and i often can't see what i'm typing
2154 2010-12-03 22:40:54 <Hogofwar> LEt me check that gavinandreson
2155 2010-12-03 22:41:19 <Hogofwar> i do not have rpcssl
2156 2010-12-03 22:42:40 <jgarzik> kiba: your prediction market is operational?
2157 2010-12-03 22:43:12 <Hogofwar> When i use getinfo it says cannot find server
2158 2010-12-03 22:43:21 <jgarzik> (except for payment processing)
2159 2010-12-03 22:43:27 <Hogofwar> (using a shortcut)
2160 2010-12-03 22:43:48 asdf30 has joined
2161 2010-12-03 22:45:26 <kiba> jgarzik: no.
2162 2010-12-03 22:45:46 <kiba> www.soulplaying.com for all practical purpose is operational.
2163 2010-12-03 22:46:46 <donpdonp> kiba: cool. can you add to #navbar { list-style: none } to get rid of the dots?
2164 2010-12-03 22:47:12 <kiba> there are dots?
2165 2010-12-03 22:47:42 genjix has joined
2166 2010-12-03 22:48:16 <kiba> donpdonp: I specified none
2167 2010-12-03 22:48:40 <donpdonp> kiba: where
2168 2010-12-03 22:48:46 <donpdonp> kiba: i see http://yfrog.com/cbv2jp
2169 2010-12-03 22:48:48 <Hogofwar> There are dots
2170 2010-12-03 22:49:03 <Hogofwar> i see taht too
2171 2010-12-03 22:49:10 <theymos> I see dots, too.
2172 2010-12-03 22:49:22 <kiba> oh
2173 2010-12-03 22:49:27 <kiba> what browsers are you guys using?
2174 2010-12-03 22:49:31 <kiba> I am using chromium
2175 2010-12-03 22:49:32 <theymos> Firefox.
2176 2010-12-03 22:50:31 <donpdonp> kiba: you want ul#navbar
2177 2010-12-03 22:50:41 <donpdonp> kiba: instead of "#navbar ul"
2178 2010-12-03 22:50:50 <donpdonp> in the stylesheet
2179 2010-12-03 22:51:22 <kiba> donpdonp: hmm, must be the sass thing
2180 2010-12-03 22:53:41 <kiba> wee
2181 2010-12-03 22:53:45 <kiba> we're a little hyper today
2182 2010-12-03 22:53:46 <kiba> 311 posts
2183 2010-12-03 22:56:34 <kiba> alright, time to earn some money by drawing arts for bitcoin
2184 2010-12-03 22:57:46 <bencoder> how many buyers did you get through my site kiba?
2185 2010-12-03 22:59:51 <kiba> 4 last time I check
2186 2010-12-03 22:59:53 <kiba> 3 btc for you
2187 2010-12-03 23:00:00 <kiba> err .03 btc for you
2188 2010-12-03 23:00:11 <bencoder> .04 no?
2189 2010-12-03 23:00:23 <bencoder> 10% of .4
2190 2010-12-03 23:00:49 <bencoder> i was one of the buyers though, so haven't recouped my expenses yet :P
2191 2010-12-03 23:01:48 <kiba> I am thinking of branding my own art site and using your service as a download processor
2192 2010-12-03 23:02:18 <kiba> but you don't have an API yet so I would have to manually update my own site everytime I upload a picture
2193 2010-12-03 23:02:21 <bencoder> once i've cleaned it up a bit i think i'll put my source code on there to buy for 100 bitcoins or something
2194 2010-12-03 23:02:51 <kiba> why would you do that?
2195 2010-12-03 23:02:58 <bencoder> to earn money
2196 2010-12-03 23:03:46 <kiba> meh, I don't really care about using your source code
2197 2010-12-03 23:03:48 <kiba> it's all python
2198 2010-12-03 23:03:50 <kiba> I used rails
2199 2010-12-03 23:03:57 <bencoder> na actually i used php for that
2200 2010-12-03 23:03:58 <kiba> and I don't to maintain a copy of bencoder's site
2201 2010-12-03 23:04:10 <kiba> bencoder: see? all the more reason to let you do the maintenance
2202 2010-12-03 23:04:16 <bencoder> but it wasn't for you in particular
2203 2010-12-03 23:04:31 <kiba> I know.
2204 2010-12-03 23:04:44 <kiba> I could keep all the profit if I download and use your site on my server
2205 2010-12-03 23:04:51 <bencoder> but someone else could compete on the same level straight away, and that gives me drive to do better
2206 2010-12-03 23:04:59 <kiba> but that's offset by maintenance cost. I am not really in the business of selling a download service.
2207 2010-12-03 23:05:00 <brocktice> well, this is strange
2208 2010-12-03 23:05:15 <brocktice> I seem to maybe be missing a few bitcoins
2209 2010-12-03 23:05:29 <brocktice> but more, i'm missing a transaction where I sent BTC to MtGox this morning
2210 2010-12-03 23:05:49 <kiba> brocktice: yeah, I have a problem with mtgox's transaction history
2211 2010-12-03 23:05:59 <kiba> it's missing 40 BTC I sent using the payment service for testing
2212 2010-12-03 23:05:59 <brocktice> kiba: My wallet.dat got corrupted
2213 2010-12-03 23:06:01 <brocktice> I restored an old one
2214 2010-12-03 23:06:24 <brocktice> But mtgox got the coins, no doubt
2215 2010-12-03 23:06:28 <brocktice> because I already sold them
2216 2010-12-03 23:06:32 <brocktice> earlier today
2217 2010-12-03 23:06:40 <brocktice> so do I just have no record of that address or something?
2218 2010-12-03 23:06:42 <brocktice> it's strange
2219 2010-12-03 23:06:51 <bencoder> presumably, brocktice
2220 2010-12-03 23:06:53 <theymos> brocktice: You likely lost the change for that transaction.
2221 2010-12-03 23:07:08 <brocktice> theymos: I keep hearing about the change
2222 2010-12-03 23:07:12 <brocktice> I don't really understand that
2223 2010-12-03 23:07:25 <brocktice> I think you're right though, looks like I'm missing maybe 100-200 BTC
2224 2010-12-03 23:07:31 <gavinandresen> brocktice: were you running a 'stock' client or one you compiled from source with patches?
2225 2010-12-03 23:07:40 <brocktice> gavinandresen: It just had the getwork patch
2226 2010-12-03 23:07:50 <theymos> brocktice: Did you delete all of your block database files before you restored your wallet.dat?
2227 2010-12-03 23:07:51 <brocktice> I think I might have used the same wallet between too many different versions or something though
2228 2010-12-03 23:07:55 <brocktice> er, not getwork
2229 2010-12-03 23:07:56 <brocktice> theymos: yep
2230 2010-12-03 23:07:59 <brocktice> listtransactions
2231 2010-12-03 23:08:00 <bencoder> when you make a transaction it empties one or more of your addresses, sends the coins to the receiver, and anything left over gets sent back to you, to a new address(or one from the pool)
2232 2010-12-03 23:08:11 <brocktice> ah, strange
2233 2010-12-03 23:08:22 <theymos> bencoder: It doesn't empty a whole address. Just one previous transaction (a "coin").
2234 2010-12-03 23:08:45 <bencoder> oh, yes sorry, i use a new address for all transactions, so i forgot, just looks that way to me
2235 2010-12-03 23:08:49 <jgarzik> brocktice: you receive a "100 BTC unit", which must be broken up into multiple units, if you are sending any amount other than 100 BTC
2236 2010-12-03 23:08:53 <brocktice> theymos: should I try restoring the block database files?
2237 2010-12-03 23:08:58 <brocktice> jgarzik: oh, ok
2238 2010-12-03 23:09:41 <theymos> brocktice: I don't see any way that would help.
2239 2010-12-03 23:09:50 <brocktice> theymos: Oh, ok, neither did I :)
2240 2010-12-03 23:09:51 <jgarzik> brocktice: if you receive 100 BTC, and send me 1 BTC, your transaction will look like:  in { 100 }, out { 99, 1 }
2241 2010-12-03 23:09:57 Hogofwar has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
2242 2010-12-03 23:10:09 <jgarzik> brocktice: that '99' is the change transaction, which bitcoin essentially sends "from yourself to yourself"
2243 2010-12-03 23:11:02 <theymos> Here is a transaction with change: http://blockexplorer.com/t/7ZGHX5w8if . This is probably Bitcoin Facuet. It wants to send 0.05, but it can only access an entire previous transaction, so it sends some BTC back to itself at a new address.
2244 2010-12-03 23:12:17 <gavinandresen> brocktice:  davout ran into exactly the same problem, which makes me worried.  The wallet reading code should be more robust.
2245 2010-12-03 23:13:18 <jgarzik> brocktice: if you receive 100 BTC, send me 1 BTC, and pay a TX fee of 0.02, your transaction will look like:  in { 100 }, out { 98.98, 1 }
2246 2010-12-03 23:15:45 ByteCoin has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
2247 2010-12-03 23:15:58 asdf58 has joined
2248 2010-12-03 23:16:18 * Diablo-D3 looks at the news feed he publishes
2249 2010-12-03 23:16:41 asdf30 has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2250 2010-12-03 23:16:50 <Diablo-D3> lets see here
2251 2010-12-03 23:17:41 <Diablo-D3> wikileaks, us fail, wikileaks, wikileaks, wikileaks, wikileaks, wikileaks, ubuntu sucks, nasa rocks, tsa sucks, comcast sucks, xboxes suck, dolly the sheep, and a few more wikileaks
2252 2010-12-03 23:36:15 <genjix> ubuntu sucks?
2253 2010-12-03 23:36:43 <AAA_awright> Yes
2254 2010-12-03 23:37:00 <genjix> remember the old days?
2255 2010-12-03 23:37:01 <AAA_awright> Diablo-D3: Reading slashdot?
2256 2010-12-03 23:37:18 <genjix> when youd install a distro and it'd cnstantly break?
2257 2010-12-03 23:37:25 * genjix remembers the old days
2258 2010-12-03 23:38:33 JudStephenson has joined
2259 2010-12-03 23:46:41 <kiba> remember the old days when the price used to be 0.06 cents?
2260 2010-12-03 23:46:48 <kiba> Those were the time!
2261 2010-12-03 23:48:56 <bencoder> yes
2262 2010-12-03 23:49:00 <bencoder> :(
2263 2010-12-03 23:49:10 <LobsterMan> mtgox
2264 2010-12-03 23:49:12 <bencoder> i had lots of bitcoins once upon a time
2265 2010-12-03 23:49:13 <LobsterMan> your site is broken
2266 2010-12-03 23:49:21 <LobsterMan> i can't sell btc atm :\
2267 2010-12-03 23:50:22 * LobsterMan slaps mtgox around with a heavy metal pole
2268 2010-12-03 23:52:01 <bencoder> yeah would seem there's something up with mtgox at the moment
2269 2010-12-03 23:52:10 <bencoder> http://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=2065.0 also
2270 2010-12-03 23:52:18 sgornick has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
2271 2010-12-03 23:53:13 kermit has quit (Quit: Leaving.)
2272 2010-12-03 23:53:20 * LobsterMan rolls eyes
2273 2010-12-03 23:58:08 altamic has quit (Quit: altamic)