1 2010-12-19 00:02:06 <LobsterMan> ;;bc,stats
2 2010-12-19 00:02:08 <gribble> Current Blocks: 98276 | Current Difficulty: 12252.03471156 | Next Difficulty At Block: 98783 | Next Difficulty In: 507 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 3 days, 1 hour, 5 minutes, and 3 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 14165.80392363
3 2010-12-19 00:02:50 <slush_cz> Anybody know which forum nick have user [Noodles]?
4 2010-12-19 00:04:22 mtgox has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
5 2010-12-19 00:04:40 <LobsterMan> slush_cz so what do i need to do in order to join the pooled mining?
6 2010-12-19 00:05:00 <slush_cz> ,,pool follow the instructions
7 2010-12-19 00:05:00 <gribble> No fancy GPU farm, and don't want to wait for months for a block gen? Join the mining pool! http://mining.bitcoin.cz/
8 2010-12-19 00:05:27 <slush_cz> register itself, register worker, run any miner with right commandline
9 2010-12-19 00:05:40 <slush_cz> itself => yourself
10 2010-12-19 00:06:10 <Cusipzzz> my miner wants a raise and benefits
11 2010-12-19 00:06:14 <LobsterMan> so i specify --user=[my username on your side] and -pass=[logon suffix] ?
12 2010-12-19 00:06:20 <LobsterMan> on your site*
13 2010-12-19 00:06:27 <LobsterMan> oh wait
14 2010-12-19 00:06:34 <slush_cz> LobsterMan: Each miner needs separate credentials
15 2010-12-19 00:07:02 <slush_cz> LobsterMan: Any you need to specify --url or so
16 2010-12-19 00:07:38 <jgarzik> looks like gcc 4.5 creates a faster miner than any other known compiler
17 2010-12-19 00:07:43 <jgarzik> including MSFT and Intel
18 2010-12-19 00:08:27 <LobsterMan> so slush_cz do i need to specify --host=mining.bitcoin.cz
19 2010-12-19 00:08:33 <LobsterMan> i use m0mchil's miner
20 2010-12-19 00:08:37 <slush_cz> and port
21 2010-12-19 00:08:39 <slush_cz> 8332
22 2010-12-19 00:08:44 <LobsterMan> ah yes
23 2010-12-19 00:08:45 <slush_cz> user, password, host and port
24 2010-12-19 00:08:48 mtgox has joined
25 2010-12-19 00:10:44 <LobsterMan> ok i think i understand...
26 2010-12-19 00:11:07 <slush_cz> most often mistake is using site's login and password. No, miner has own
27 2010-12-19 00:11:40 <slush_cz> So you can use miner on untrusted computer, if you can
28 2010-12-19 00:11:58 <LobsterMan> so this connects to your server and not my local bitcoin node
29 2010-12-19 00:12:14 <BoBeR> isnt that like promoting botnetism
30 2010-12-19 00:12:29 <BoBeR> installing apps on untrusted computers
31 2010-12-19 00:12:29 <BoBeR> lol
32 2010-12-19 00:12:42 <gibbz> distributed computing nigga
33 2010-12-19 00:12:55 <BoBeR> also slush my account hasnt gotten the email yet
34 2010-12-19 00:12:57 <BoBeR> why not
35 2010-12-19 00:13:34 <slush_cz> BoBeR: You are already active
36 2010-12-19 00:13:49 <slush_cz> BoBeR: is bober182 yours?
37 2010-12-19 00:13:54 <BoBeR> yup
38 2010-12-19 00:14:02 <BoBeR> whtas the email did i make a typo
39 2010-12-19 00:14:38 <LobsterMan> so for my 2 devices...i would launch like:
40 2010-12-19 00:14:38 <LobsterMan> poclbm.exe --host=mining.bitcoin.cz --port=8332 --user=LobsterMan.1 --pass=[pw for miner 1] --device=1 -w 256
41 2010-12-19 00:14:38 <LobsterMan> poclbm.exe --host=mining.bitcoin.cz --port=8332 --user=LobsterMan.2 --pass=[pw for miner 2] --device=1 -w 256
42 2010-12-19 00:14:46 <LobsterMan> ?
43 2010-12-19 00:14:59 <slush_cz> bober_182@hotmail.com
44 2010-12-19 00:15:09 <slush_cz> I already answered you to forum
45 2010-12-19 00:15:23 <slush_cz> LobsterMan: Looks good
46 2010-12-19 00:15:33 <LobsterMan> ok i think i get this now ^_^
47 2010-12-19 00:15:36 <LobsterMan> i'm gonna try this
48 2010-12-19 00:15:54 <slush_cz> Funny that I probably see three independent tries to hack miner :)
49 2010-12-19 00:16:07 <LobsterMan> lol already?
50 2010-12-19 00:16:23 <LobsterMan> so these passwords don't really need to be secuer
51 2010-12-19 00:16:26 <LobsterMan> secure*
52 2010-12-19 00:16:40 <slush_cz> One was succesfull, unfortunately. It was junior mistake - I forgot to uncomment line from testing. But everything was recovered, no shares lost
53 2010-12-19 00:16:48 <slush_cz> LobsterMan: No, don't
54 2010-12-19 00:17:12 <slush_cz> But I see some users are sending crazy hashes :)
55 2010-12-19 00:17:33 <LobsterMan> is your server smart enough to realize that isn't their real hashrate?
56 2010-12-19 00:17:45 <slush_cz> LobsterMan: Yes, I have monitorng here
57 2010-12-19 00:17:49 <LobsterMan> hehe
58 2010-12-19 00:18:25 <slush_cz> Often they send pow but they did not ask for job before :-D
59 2010-12-19 00:19:22 <slush_cz> proof of work
60 2010-12-19 00:19:39 <LobsterMan> heh
61 2010-12-19 00:19:53 <BoBeR> no i need 1 worker account per thread
62 2010-12-19 00:19:59 <BoBeR> im using the cpu miner
63 2010-12-19 00:20:11 <slush_cz> BoBeR: how many threads do you have?
64 2010-12-19 00:20:15 <BoBeR> 2
65 2010-12-19 00:20:19 <slush_cz> no, you dont
66 2010-12-19 00:20:26 <BoBeR> its only at 50% tho
67 2010-12-19 00:20:36 <slush_cz> will work with one login
68 2010-12-19 00:20:43 <slush_cz> what is tho?
69 2010-12-19 00:20:58 <BoBeR> minerd
70 2010-12-19 00:21:05 <BoBeR> i want it at 100% cpu
71 2010-12-19 00:21:08 <BoBeR> so run another one
72 2010-12-19 00:21:17 <slush_cz> but it is not related to pool server
73 2010-12-19 00:21:23 <BoBeR> i know
74 2010-12-19 00:21:24 <slush_cz> I'm not expert in miner parameters
75 2010-12-19 00:21:39 <BoBeR> but shold i have another worker account for the other miner
76 2010-12-19 00:21:44 <BoBeR> if im running 2 exes
77 2010-12-19 00:21:56 <slush_cz> Started miner before weeks and it is just crunching until then
78 2010-12-19 00:22:07 <slush_cz> BoBeR: in this case use two worker logins
79 2010-12-19 00:22:22 <BoBeR> oxay
80 2010-12-19 00:22:25 <BoBeR> okay
81 2010-12-19 00:22:27 <slush_cz> but you can increase thread count in minerd itself
82 2010-12-19 00:22:43 <slush_cz> nobody reported that one instance is not enough for 100% cpu
83 2010-12-19 00:22:45 <cosurgi> slush_cz: does client communicate its hashrate to pool server? If yes - then you can easily verify if it's at all possible that he generated all those PoWs that he is submitting....
84 2010-12-19 00:23:06 <slush_cz> cosurgi: Do not report. It is fully getwork() compatible
85 2010-12-19 00:23:29 <slush_cz> cosurgi: And client can cheat in every case, also in reporting
86 2010-12-19 00:23:47 <cosurgi> I see... so how do you estimate total hash speed of whole pool?
87 2010-12-19 00:24:39 <slush_cz> cosurgi: I know difficulty I'm sending to workers and in long term the solving speed is constant
88 2010-12-19 00:24:48 <cosurgi> ok.
89 2010-12-19 00:24:56 sethsethseth__ has left ()
90 2010-12-19 00:25:02 <cosurgi> I wonder what would happen if somebody set up a local network of his own modified clients, and whatever one of his clients found - then all those clients would submit this as theirs PoWs.
91 2010-12-19 00:25:20 <cosurgi> his share would be multiply counted
92 2010-12-19 00:25:21 kermit has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
93 2010-12-19 00:25:25 <cosurgi> *shares
94 2010-12-19 00:25:37 <slush_cz> cosurgi: I call it 'dynamic difficulty'
95 2010-12-19 00:25:43 <slush_cz> I'm already working on
96 2010-12-19 00:25:56 <slush_cz> There will be also miner proxy, which you will be able to install locally
97 2010-12-19 00:26:11 <slush_cz> It will prefetch data and minimize network overhead for miner itself
98 2010-12-19 00:26:24 <cosurgi> cool
99 2010-12-19 00:26:47 <slush_cz> OMG users are crazy. What is reason to load their profile 50x per second???
100 2010-12-19 00:26:50 <cosurgi> I received payment for my GPU, btw. Nice that it all works! :)
101 2010-12-19 00:26:53 <slush_cz> DDoS
102 2010-12-19 00:27:22 <slush_cz> cosurgi: cool :)
103 2010-12-19 00:27:46 <slush_cz> to all - profile could NOT be hacked, reward is really read only :-D
104 2010-12-19 00:27:53 <cosurgi> m,aybe block reloading for one seond after it was just loaded....?
105 2010-12-19 00:28:23 <slush_cz> cosurgi: but you have to be able to load getwork() in highest possible ratio
106 2010-12-19 00:29:14 <slush_cz> When users will not be sane, I will introduce pairing accounts to any trust network or forum logins
107 2010-12-19 00:29:37 <cosurgi> slush_cz: you could do this only on port :80
108 2010-12-19 00:29:44 <cosurgi> 1 sec delay, I mean.
109 2010-12-19 00:30:03 <slush_cz> cosurgi: Everything is on 80. 8332 is only mapping to mining.bitcoin.cz/getwork/ :)
110 2010-12-19 00:30:12 <cosurgi> Or, you could increase global difficulty by one or two bits. People will connect more rarely.
111 2010-12-19 00:30:29 <slush_cz> cosurgi: this do not prevent user to do
112 2010-12-19 00:30:29 <slush_cz> while True:
113 2010-12-19 00:30:31 <cosurgi> oh... ok.
114 2010-12-19 00:30:32 <slush_cz> getwork()
115 2010-12-19 00:31:02 <DerrikeG> slush_cz: I only load my profile once a half hour / hour. Mostly 'cause my client crashed without me knowing for I don't know how long.
116 2010-12-19 00:31:16 <slush_cz> system is still open, but if those attacks will continue, I should solve it anyway
117 2010-12-19 00:31:41 <slush_cz> DerrikeG: I'm working on notifications, when worker stop responding on common rate
118 2010-12-19 00:31:47 <slush_cz> DerrikeG: by email
119 2010-12-19 00:31:55 <slush_cz> too much work around!
120 2010-12-19 00:32:23 <DerrikeG> Oh boy. I appreciate your efforts in you helping us help you help us all.
121 2010-12-19 00:32:50 <slush_cz> From the time when money was invented, you do not need to say 'thank you' :-D
122 2010-12-19 00:32:56 <slush_cz> kidding
123 2010-12-19 00:33:09 <slush_cz> htop
124 2010-12-19 00:33:13 <TD> anyone with protocol experience here? i'm having trouble getting the checksums to match
125 2010-12-19 00:33:13 <slush_cz> ehh :-D
126 2010-12-19 00:36:37 <LobsterMan> slush_cz my hashrate is very low when i connect
127 2010-12-19 00:36:48 <LobsterMan> like half or less than what it should be
128 2010-12-19 00:37:20 <slush_cz> LobsterMan: did you tried other algos?
129 2010-12-19 00:37:29 <slush_cz> Default is C implementation, which is slowest
130 2010-12-19 00:37:37 <LobsterMan> what do you mean?
131 2010-12-19 00:37:41 <slush_cz> parameter --algo
132 2010-12-19 00:37:50 <slush_cz> oh, you use m0mchil's, right?
133 2010-12-19 00:37:54 <slush_cz> Too many people around :(
134 2010-12-19 00:38:00 <LobsterMan> yeah
135 2010-12-19 00:38:23 <slush_cz> Server is in good condition now and I tried m0mchil's today and worked well
136 2010-12-19 00:38:32 <slush_cz> try ping to mining.bitcoin.cz please
137 2010-12-19 00:39:20 <LobsterMan> Pinging mining.bitcoin.cz [109.74.195.190] with 32 bytes of data:
138 2010-12-19 00:39:20 <LobsterMan> Reply from 109.74.195.190: bytes=32 time=84ms TTL=51
139 2010-12-19 00:39:20 <LobsterMan> Reply from 109.74.195.190: bytes=32 time=84ms TTL=51
140 2010-12-19 00:39:20 <LobsterMan> Reply from 109.74.195.190: bytes=32 time=82ms TTL=51
141 2010-12-19 00:39:20 <LobsterMan> Reply from 109.74.195.190: bytes=32 time=84ms TTL=51
142 2010-12-19 00:39:21 <LobsterMan> Ping statistics for 109.74.195.190:
143 2010-12-19 00:39:21 <LobsterMan> Packets: Sent = 4, Received = 4, Lost = 0 (0% loss),
144 2010-12-19 00:39:22 <LobsterMan> Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
145 2010-12-19 00:39:22 <LobsterMan> Minimum = 82ms, Maximum = 84ms, Average = 83ms
146 2010-12-19 00:39:27 <slush_cz> pretty good
147 2010-12-19 00:39:35 <slush_cz> not the best, but should work well
148 2010-12-19 00:39:58 <slush_cz> Do you use all cores?
149 2010-12-19 00:40:12 <LobsterMan> if i run my miners locally, i get about 50mhash per device, when i run it specifying --host=mining.bitcoin.cz i get 25mhash or less
150 2010-12-19 00:40:16 <slush_cz> m0mchil's can handle only one core per instance
151 2010-12-19 00:40:19 ColonelPanic1 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
152 2010-12-19 00:40:40 <slush_cz> Too bad. I have 560 locally and remotely too
153 2010-12-19 00:40:48 <LobsterMan> any idea why this might be happening?
154 2010-12-19 00:40:54 <slush_cz> thinking
155 2010-12-19 00:41:13 <LobsterMan> i'm going to make a post in m0mchil's thread too
156 2010-12-19 00:41:15 <DerrikeG> Years and years down the line, will people still have to download every block that has ever existed to begin generating coins? After that, are they still necessary to begin having transactions?
157 2010-12-19 00:42:35 <slush_cz> send me your commandline please
158 2010-12-19 00:42:44 ColonelPanic1 has joined
159 2010-12-19 00:42:46 <slush_cz> only skip password :)
160 2010-12-19 00:42:46 <TD> DerrikeG: you can perform transactions without all the block contents
161 2010-12-19 00:43:06 <TD> DerrikeG: only need the headers if you want to do transactions (for the block chain up to that point)
162 2010-12-19 00:43:24 <TD> but AFAIK yes in general the entire chain is needed
163 2010-12-19 00:43:34 <TD> it's not as big a deal as it sounds
164 2010-12-19 00:44:12 <LobsterMan> poclbm.exe --host=mining.bitcoin.cz --port=8332 --user=LobsterMan.1 --pass=[pw for miner #1] --device=1 -w 256
165 2010-12-19 00:44:12 <LobsterMan> poclbm.exe --host=mining.bitcoin.cz --port=8332 --user=LobsterMan.2 --pass=[pw for miner #2] --device=2 -w 256
166 2010-12-19 00:45:00 <slush_cz> device should be 0 and 1, right?
167 2010-12-19 00:45:07 <slush_cz> Im not sure, but it worked for me
168 2010-12-19 00:45:59 <LobsterMan> hah yes
169 2010-12-19 00:46:02 <LobsterMan> let me try that....
170 2010-12-19 00:46:04 * LobsterMan facepalms
171 2010-12-19 00:46:30 skeledrew1 has quit (Quit: Instantbird 0.2)
172 2010-12-19 00:46:39 <LobsterMan> much better
173 2010-12-19 00:46:48 <slush_cz> great
174 2010-12-19 00:47:17 <LobsterMan> can i make my bitcoin.exe connect to your server to mine as well?
175 2010-12-19 00:47:43 <slush_cz> you mean standard client? Unfortunately no
176 2010-12-19 00:47:58 <slush_cz> It would be cool to have url and username in settings for connection remotely
177 2010-12-19 00:48:29 <slush_cz> But I cannot write patch myself and others probably do not care
178 2010-12-19 00:48:38 skeledrew has joined
179 2010-12-19 00:48:44 <slush_cz> should not be so hard
180 2010-12-19 00:49:13 <slush_cz> so hashrate solved?
181 2010-12-19 00:49:23 <LobsterMan> yeah
182 2010-12-19 00:49:38 <LobsterMan> deleting the miners and ill add them again to get the proper hashrate
183 2010-12-19 00:49:39 <LobsterMan> lol
184 2010-12-19 00:50:38 <slush_cz> oh, and dont delete workers when they have some shares on account :)
185 2010-12-19 00:50:51 <LobsterMan> oops...
186 2010-12-19 00:50:53 <slush_cz> I deleted account with 100 shares today
187 2010-12-19 00:51:11 <LobsterMan> you may want to fix mine then, i removed them and i think they may have had a few shares
188 2010-12-19 00:51:21 <LobsterMan> i re-created with the same name and started again
189 2010-12-19 00:51:37 <slush_cz> do you think worker accounts on site?
190 2010-12-19 00:51:43 <slush_cz> No way how to recover lost shares
191 2010-12-19 00:52:03 <LobsterMan> oh so then it's my loss and i didn't actually break anything
192 2010-12-19 00:52:10 <slush_cz> yes
193 2010-12-19 00:52:18 <LobsterMan> slush_cz another thing i noticed, when I add a new miner, i click save once and it appears that nothing happens, i click save again and then after the 2nd click it says updated
194 2010-12-19 00:52:38 <slush_cz> hmm
195 2010-12-19 00:52:54 <LobsterMan> maybe it's just not showing confirmation but it does add
196 2010-12-19 00:54:06 <LobsterMan> so let me get this straight...when i first connect do you send my miner a false low difficulty to determine speed, then after you "calibrate" it, it begins to work on the actual current block?
197 2010-12-19 00:54:09 <Kiba> hmm
198 2010-12-19 00:54:15 <slush_cz> oh i see. You are right, it is stored, but no confirmation
199 2010-12-19 00:54:28 <slush_cz> On first save I'm doing redirect from /edit/ to /edit/<num?
200 2010-12-19 00:54:32 <slush_cz> <num>
201 2010-12-19 00:55:06 <slush_cz> LobsterMan: No, target is low for whole time
202 2010-12-19 00:55:30 joe_1 has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
203 2010-12-19 00:55:33 <slush_cz> but bitcoin is built in way that valid block with lower difficulty can be also valid on higher one
204 2010-12-19 00:55:49 <slush_cz> and every block valid on higher difficulty is also valid on lower...
205 2010-12-19 00:56:24 <slush_cz> H < sT < T
206 2010-12-19 00:56:24 <slush_cz> T - final target
207 2010-12-19 00:56:24 <slush_cz> sT - small target
208 2010-12-19 00:56:24 <slush_cz> H - submitted hash
209 2010-12-19 00:57:14 <slush_cz> unbelievable. Hackers are still working, it is more than two hours.
210 2010-12-19 00:57:47 <LobsterMan> target != difficulty?
211 2010-12-19 00:57:49 <cosurgi> slush_cz: what now?
212 2010-12-19 00:58:18 <slush_cz> LobsterMan: Oh, "difficulty" mentioned on site is another than difficulty in bitcoin. It is my internal structure
213 2010-12-19 00:58:26 <LobsterMan> oh ok
214 2010-12-19 00:58:36 <slush_cz> cosurgi: Still submitting incorrect hashes
215 2010-12-19 00:58:37 <LobsterMan> i still don't totally understand how this works but that's not really an issue ^________^
216 2010-12-19 00:59:05 <cosurgi> heh
217 2010-12-19 00:59:11 <cosurgi> good that you catch this
218 2010-12-19 00:59:12 <slush_cz> LobsterMan: From given difficulty I can build hash which can be compared < > with work you submitted
219 2010-12-19 00:59:36 <slush_cz> cosurgi: Hope it will be so forever :-D
220 2010-12-19 00:59:59 <LobsterMan> are you using a different target than the actual bitcoin network?
221 2010-12-19 01:00:02 * LobsterMan is confused <_<
222 2010-12-19 01:00:19 <slush_cz> LobsterMan: yes
223 2010-12-19 01:00:35 <slush_cz> actual pool target corresponds with difficulty '1' on bitcoin network
224 2010-12-19 01:00:38 <slush_cz> so it is very low
225 2010-12-19 01:00:40 <LobsterMan> then how do coins come from this if it's different?
226 2010-12-19 01:01:01 <Cusipzzz> it's like the matrix...you think there are coins..but are there?
227 2010-12-19 01:01:12 <slush_cz> because time to time the hash which is correct for lower difficulty is also valid for higher difficulty
228 2010-12-19 01:02:01 <slush_cz> Imagine that you are tipping numbers from 0 to 10. low target is 3 and higher is 6. When you tip 4, it is valid share. When you tip 7, it is valid share AND valid block
229 2010-12-19 01:02:39 <slush_cz> so you see there are thousands of solved "block" or lower difficulty in pool. But those "blocks' are shares
230 2010-12-19 01:03:04 <LobsterMan> can it somehow work up to the actual target from all the smaller contributions?
231 2010-12-19 01:03:05 <slush_cz> When somebody is lucky and find share with high difficulty, pool win a block
232 2010-12-19 01:03:48 skeledrew has quit (Quit: Instantbird 0.3a1pre)
233 2010-12-19 01:04:13 <slush_cz> LobsterMan: dont understand
234 2010-12-19 01:04:15 skeledrew has joined
235 2010-12-19 01:04:29 <slush_cz> target is small to get a chance for slow computers to give a share
236 2010-12-19 01:04:31 <cosurgi> hmm... indeed compiling with g++-4.5 gave a little extra speed: from 2200 kh, to 2400 kh/s
237 2010-12-19 01:04:42 <slush_cz> jgarzik already reported...
238 2010-12-19 01:04:48 <BoBeR> no way
239 2010-12-19 01:05:04 <cosurgi> but GPUs are flooding the pool server
240 2010-12-19 01:05:28 <slush_cz> cosurgi: Yes a little bit. Until there will be dynamic target for every worker
241 2010-12-19 01:05:46 <slush_cz> it is almost implemented - as you see 'difficulty' variable in profile. But not yet fully tested
242 2010-12-19 01:06:08 <slush_cz> Server is still OK, approx 1-3 shares per second
243 2010-12-19 01:06:27 <cosurgi> so it's 32 bits now. If I will pick in my profile a difficulty of 34 bits, each my share will be worth 4 normal shares... rght?
244 2010-12-19 01:06:30 <slush_cz> getwork() is much worse
245 2010-12-19 01:06:42 <slush_cz> cosurgi: Exactly!
246 2010-12-19 01:06:50 genjix has joined
247 2010-12-19 01:07:05 <genjix> hey, how can i prove i sent some btc to someone using the txid?
248 2010-12-19 01:07:13 <genjix> do i use blockexplorer?
249 2010-12-19 01:07:15 <LobsterMan> slush_cz so with this if use the pool for a while then stop, but i have some shares, when the block is finally generated i will get credit for the previous block but not the next one after that?
250 2010-12-19 01:07:19 <cosurgi> but if I switch now, be careful to multply by 4 only my new shares, not all of them, that I collected ;-)
251 2010-12-19 01:07:37 <slush_cz> but there are still some issues with little/big endian beast. it works well when target is rounded to doubleword now :)
252 2010-12-19 01:07:42 <genjix> >>> "how can i prove i sent some btc to someone using the txid?"
253 2010-12-19 01:07:50 <slush_cz> LobsterMan: yes
254 2010-12-19 01:08:21 <slush_cz> LobsterMan: You have to found share in current round. When block is found, all shares are cancelled
255 2010-12-19 01:08:23 <cosurgi> heh, sure. It's easier to check 32 bits, maybe 24 and 64 bits. But 34 ?? difficult ;)
256 2010-12-19 01:08:43 <bencoder> genjix: block explorer would work, if it's in a block already
257 2010-12-19 01:08:47 sgornick has quit (Quit: Leaving.)
258 2010-12-19 01:08:52 <cosurgi> err... I meant 32+16 not 24 :)
259 2010-12-19 01:08:59 <genjix> ok
260 2010-12-19 01:09:08 <slush_cz> cosurgi: I have already some code, but I'm little confused in those things. I dont want to live them until I will be sure it is ok
261 2010-12-19 01:09:10 <genjix> it has 8 confirms but he didnt receive it
262 2010-12-19 01:09:22 <bencoder> http://blockexplorer.com/tx/<tx_hash>
263 2010-12-19 01:09:25 <Cusipzzz> blockexplorer
264 2010-12-19 01:10:12 <cosurgi> maybe his wallet address was off by one letter?
265 2010-12-19 01:10:41 <bencoder> cosurgi: shouldn't be possible
266 2010-12-19 01:10:43 <Cusipzzz> not possible w/confirms
267 2010-12-19 01:10:47 <doublec> or he hasn't downloaded the block chain yet
268 2010-12-19 01:10:53 <slush_cz> too late here, I'm going to bed
269 2010-12-19 01:11:00 <doublec> or he's happily generating on another chain and doesn't know it
270 2010-12-19 01:11:11 <doublec> or genjix is
271 2010-12-19 01:11:26 <slush_cz> hackers - if you have ddos script ready, you can start it after few minutes :-D
272 2010-12-19 01:11:35 <genjix> dont think so because he deposited to betco.in
273 2010-12-19 01:11:37 <genjix> http://blockexplorer.com/tx/74a081fc6f3e905eb7979eff5341626b43eccb56a09cb9ac596e16e778b61992
274 2010-12-19 01:11:42 sgornick has joined
275 2010-12-19 01:11:47 <genjix> what does "not yet redeemed" mean?
276 2010-12-19 01:11:59 <genjix> "Not yet redeemed"
277 2010-12-19 01:12:08 <bencoder> means hasn't been sent to another address
278 2010-12-19 01:12:49 <slush_cz> LobsterMan: I hope understand pool server better now :)
279 2010-12-19 01:12:52 <slush_cz> Bye
280 2010-12-19 01:12:56 <LobsterMan> kind of :}
281 2010-12-19 01:12:57 <LobsterMan> cya
282 2010-12-19 01:12:58 <LobsterMan> lol
283 2010-12-19 01:13:14 <LobsterMan> slush_cz one thing
284 2010-12-19 01:13:18 <slush_cz> yes?
285 2010-12-19 01:13:25 <LobsterMan> i got an "invalid or stale" as a result in one of my miners
286 2010-12-19 01:13:27 <LobsterMan> what does that mean?
287 2010-12-19 01:13:28 <bencoder> genjix: you mean that address you sent to is a betcoin address?
288 2010-12-19 01:13:36 <genjix> yep
289 2010-12-19 01:13:45 <genjix> we think betcoin might just be broken
290 2010-12-19 01:13:47 <bencoder> could be betcoin being broken then
291 2010-12-19 01:13:49 <bencoder> yeah
292 2010-12-19 01:13:50 <genjix> so w/e
293 2010-12-19 01:13:52 <genjix> yep
294 2010-12-19 01:14:00 <slush_cz> LobsterMan: glitch on network
295 2010-12-19 01:14:06 <LobsterMan> nothing to worry about?
296 2010-12-19 01:14:15 <genjix> he doesnt know me too well so im a little worried about him thinking im a scammer :p
297 2010-12-19 01:14:19 <slush_cz> LobsterMan: You should be very unlucky to lost winning block :-D
298 2010-12-19 01:14:25 <Cusipzzz> lol
299 2010-12-19 01:14:27 <LobsterMan> hah yeah
300 2010-12-19 01:14:54 <LobsterMan> so as it takes longer for one block to be found, the value of each share diminishes?
301 2010-12-19 01:15:10 <slush_cz> LobsterMan: but this will happen until we use remote network :(
302 2010-12-19 01:15:16 <doublec> genjix, that kinda sucks if it's a betco.in issue and you can't get in touch with the betco.in people
303 2010-12-19 01:15:32 <genjix> wtf why
304 2010-12-19 01:16:31 <doublec> I mean in general - the problem of sending to third parties rather than direct to the other persons bitcoinclient
305 2010-12-19 01:16:42 <doublec> I'm sure you'll be able to get the betco.in people to fix it
306 2010-12-19 01:16:50 <genjix> ah yes ofc
307 2010-12-19 01:17:00 <genjix> i've written to him before
308 2010-12-19 01:17:25 <doublec> it'd be nice if sites like betco.in showed that a 0/unconfirmed had been received
309 2010-12-19 01:17:31 <doublec> so you know immediately if there's a problem
310 2010-12-19 01:17:50 <genjix> that's not a bad idea
311 2010-12-19 01:17:58 <Cusipzzz> ya
312 2010-12-19 01:23:01 Toadyonps3 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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323 2010-12-19 01:39:42 <joe_1> why is bitcoinwatch volume all messed up?
324 2010-12-19 01:41:28 <tcatm> looks accurate. What's messed up?
325 2010-12-19 01:45:59 paul0 has joined
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327 2010-12-19 01:56:46 haploid has joined
328 2010-12-19 01:57:16 blablaa has joined
329 2010-12-19 01:58:08 <doublec> volume is low
330 2010-12-19 01:59:27 <TD> there we go
331 2010-12-19 01:59:28 <TD> getting there
332 2010-12-19 01:59:46 <TD> i now have a bit of java that connects to a node, does a handshake then a getblocks and parses the resulting inv
333 2010-12-19 02:02:01 <davux> i anyone feels in an artist's mood, i would love propositions of a logo for bitcoIM
334 2010-12-19 02:02:04 <davux> http://gitorious.org/bitcoim/pages/Logo
335 2010-12-19 02:09:01 TD has quit (Quit: TD)
336 2010-12-19 02:09:35 TD has joined
337 2010-12-19 02:17:09 <haploid> am I grokking this correctly? My bitcoin balance will go from 0 to 50 after crunching for ~200 days to generate 1 block? 50 btc is the smallest discrete unit here?
338 2010-12-19 02:17:54 <joe_1> tcatm: volume impossibly low
339 2010-12-19 02:18:12 <dissected> random question, but are bitcoins taxable ?
340 2010-12-19 02:18:31 <dissected> seems like any type of income would be
341 2010-12-19 02:18:48 <joe_1> yes it's taxable but not very tax enforceable
342 2010-12-19 02:19:05 <joe_1> i.e. very easy to hide your bitcoin income
343 2010-12-19 02:20:41 <Kiba> joe_1: if you do with an identity that isn't tied to your
344 2010-12-19 02:21:06 <Kiba> haploid: by chance, you will get 50 BTC
345 2010-12-19 02:22:23 <slush_cz> haploid: ,,pool
346 2010-12-19 02:22:23 <gribble> No fancy GPU farm, and don't want to wait for months for a block gen? Join the mining pool! http://mining.bitcoin.cz/
347 2010-12-19 02:26:05 <haploid> ah, nice
348 2010-12-19 02:26:27 MT`AwAy has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
349 2010-12-19 02:26:52 <joe_1> only 100 coins were exchanged on mt gox today?
350 2010-12-19 02:27:24 <Kiba> joe_1: it can get like that sometime
351 2010-12-19 02:27:25 <slush_cz> joe_1: afaik it is last 48 hours
352 2010-12-19 02:27:52 <joe_1> wow
353 2010-12-19 02:28:11 <Kiba> meh.
354 2010-12-19 02:28:18 <Kiba> slow days
355 2010-12-19 02:28:20 <joe_1> so bitcoin is not collapsing?
356 2010-12-19 02:28:37 <Kiba> yes, it's not collapsing
357 2010-12-19 02:28:43 <Grantt> sell, sell!
358 2010-12-19 02:28:49 <Grantt> ;)
359 2010-12-19 02:29:20 <tcatm> joe_1: It's was 169 coins yesterday (UTC)
360 2010-12-19 02:29:23 <Cusipzzz> confirmed collapsing
361 2010-12-19 02:29:37 <Grantt> well price went up 38% over past few days
362 2010-12-19 02:29:41 <Cusipzzz> get out while the getting is good
363 2010-12-19 02:29:53 <Grantt> the rally can't continue, it got overbought, it has to collapse a bit now
364 2010-12-19 02:30:16 fabianhjr has joined
365 2010-12-19 02:30:20 <fabianhjr> Hi, sup?
366 2010-12-19 02:30:48 <Cusipzzz> hello
367 2010-12-19 02:31:32 <joe_1> for months i've always known the volume to be in the mid thousands
368 2010-12-19 02:32:10 <tcatm> joe_1: http://bitcoincharts.com/charts/mtgoxUSD#vzm1g10zm2g25 daily volume of mtgox
369 2010-12-19 02:33:20 <joe_1> ok, that graph makes sense. volume has turned down a bit but i hope it's just seasonal
370 2010-12-19 02:33:38 <DerrikeG> Should an escrow bitcoin service compensate for inflation due to its long hold time on a very volatile currency?
371 2010-12-19 02:34:09 <joe_1> price'll probably fall between now and mid january as people move it on for USD to pay christmas credit card bills
372 2010-12-19 02:34:15 <Grantt> DerrikeG: it could
373 2010-12-19 02:34:25 <Kiba> joe_1: meh
374 2010-12-19 02:34:37 <haploid> I'm trying to understand how bitcoin can possibly be scalable if every wallet/client has to have a copy of the entire chain of all transactions ever conducted
375 2010-12-19 02:34:47 <tcatm> Bid volume is a little bit thin. Price could fall to 0.17 easily.
376 2010-12-19 02:35:02 <Grantt> price can fall to 0.10 in a click
377 2010-12-19 02:35:26 <Kiba> haploid: you forgot to factor in HD space
378 2010-12-19 02:35:27 <Kiba> and...
379 2010-12-19 02:35:29 <tcatm> 0.10 would take about 30k BTC
380 2010-12-19 02:35:32 <Grantt> only takes 3k usd to take it to 0.10
381 2010-12-19 02:35:44 <Kiba> development that allow lightweight block chain
382 2010-12-19 02:35:52 <joe_1> haploid: it's not scalable. when the currency gains wide use, only supercomputers will be able to be full clients.
383 2010-12-19 02:36:20 <Kiba> joe_1: if your definition of scaling include generation
384 2010-12-19 02:36:43 <joe_1> haploid: however maybe i should swallow my words because computers are constantly getting faster, more disk space
385 2010-12-19 02:36:51 <haploid> hmm
386 2010-12-19 02:37:43 <Kiba> I wonder if earth is going to be transformed into a planet size computer
387 2010-12-19 02:38:08 <gibbz> it is
388 2010-12-19 02:38:22 <tcatm> Like 42 being a bitcoin hash? :)
389 2010-12-19 02:39:01 <gibbz> we need a physical bitcoin that is worth 42 bitcoins
390 2010-12-19 02:40:24 <Grantt> gibbz: take a piece of paper and write "Fourty two bitcoins" on it ;)
391 2010-12-19 02:40:35 <DerrikeG> Made out of aluminum.
392 2010-12-19 02:41:04 <Grantt> backed by ati radeon 5970 gpu
393 2010-12-19 02:41:31 <DerrikeG> You can't put the Internet in the microwave, you can't put physical representations of Internet currency in it either.
394 2010-12-19 02:42:06 fabianhjr has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
395 2010-12-19 02:42:33 fabianhjr has joined
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397 2010-12-19 02:43:13 * tcatm suspects a dark pool order near 0.22 at mtgox
398 2010-12-19 02:44:07 <slush_cz> too bad mtgox does not support bracket orders and so
399 2010-12-19 02:48:35 <tcatm> oh new options to add funds to mtgox
400 2010-12-19 02:51:12 <Cusipzzz> ??
401 2010-12-19 02:51:30 <Cusipzzz> telepathy ? plasma donate?
402 2010-12-19 02:51:40 <tcatm> You can select different funding methods it seems.
403 2010-12-19 02:51:46 <slush_cz> oh, cool
404 2010-12-19 02:52:13 <Grantt> thats few days old now :)
405 2010-12-19 02:52:30 <Grantt> Euro Bank Transfer is coming next week i heard
406 2010-12-19 02:52:35 <Cusipzzz> damn i was excited
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411 2010-12-19 03:03:06 PeterCooperJr has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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414 2010-12-19 03:23:11 darrob has joined
415 2010-12-19 03:28:05 MT`AwAy has joined
416 2010-12-19 03:30:51 <genjix> hey MT`AwAy , how can i transfer the domainname to jgarzik ?
417 2010-12-19 03:31:54 <genjix> did you hear gavin saying he prefers new wiki because it looks prettier? :D
418 2010-12-19 03:36:42 <Kiba> lol
419 2010-12-19 03:37:24 Bonham has quit (Quit: Ex-Chat)
420 2010-12-19 03:37:34 Granttt has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
421 2010-12-19 03:37:54 waterfox has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
422 2010-12-19 03:39:19 <genjix> lol https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Proof-of-work
423 2010-12-19 03:39:27 <genjix> dont leave me hanging
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427 2010-12-19 03:45:24 OneFixt_ is now known as OneFixt
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440 2010-12-19 04:21:47 <nanotube> slush_cz: email notification of miners being down would be nice. :)
441 2010-12-19 04:27:28 maximi89 has joined
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454 2010-12-19 05:25:02 MT`AwAy has joined
455 2010-12-19 05:25:23 <DerrikeG> This CPU mining task is stomping all over my flash player.
456 2010-12-19 05:27:15 AAA_awright has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
457 2010-12-19 05:27:36 <nanotube> heh, usually its the flash player that is stomping all over using ... anything else on the computer. :)
458 2010-12-19 05:28:45 <noagendamarket> apple will like that it kills flash
459 2010-12-19 05:29:00 <noagendamarket> they should install it on all ipads
460 2010-12-19 05:29:03 <noagendamarket> lol
461 2010-12-19 05:30:56 <nanotube> haha
462 2010-12-19 05:31:59 <DerrikeG> noagendamarket: Did you see my forum post about the site (BitcoinMedia) stalling and all that? It's still doing that.
463 2010-12-19 05:32:40 AAA_awright_ is now known as AAA_awright
464 2010-12-19 05:33:54 <noagendamarket> yeah derrike I am doing somethign else with it
465 2010-12-19 05:34:11 <noagendamarket> thats only a temporary place for the domain
466 2010-12-19 05:34:52 <DerrikeG> Ah, alright.
467 2010-12-19 05:35:12 <noagendamarket> I have bigger plans for bitcoinmedia lol
468 2010-12-19 05:36:20 phuzion has quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
469 2010-12-19 05:42:10 MT`AwAy has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
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475 2010-12-19 06:17:35 <LobsterMan> http://science.slashdot.org/story/10/12/19/0015223/How-To-Cut-a-Nanotube-Lots-Of-Compression
476 2010-12-19 06:17:39 * LobsterMan slaps nanotube around with a heavy metal pole
477 2010-12-19 06:17:40 <LobsterMan> :P
478 2010-12-19 06:19:16 <nanotube> \o/ :)
479 2010-12-19 06:19:35 MT`AwAy has joined
480 2010-12-19 06:20:58 <mizerydearia> ;;bc,stats
481 2010-12-19 06:21:00 <gribble> Current Blocks: 98314 | Current Difficulty: 12252.03471156 | Next Difficulty At Block: 98783 | Next Difficulty In: 469 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 2 days, 19 hours, 51 minutes, and 31 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 14113.15678613
482 2010-12-19 06:23:21 <nanotube> hmm, diff est went down, it seems.
483 2010-12-19 06:24:53 naseviska has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
484 2010-12-19 06:27:23 <LobsterMan> ;;bc,stats
485 2010-12-19 06:27:25 <gribble> Current Blocks: 98314 | Current Difficulty: 12252.03471156 | Next Difficulty At Block: 98783 | Next Difficulty In: 469 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 2 days, 19 hours, 51 minutes, and 31 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 14113.15678613
486 2010-12-19 06:27:37 <LobsterMan> doesn't change in 6 minutes eh
487 2010-12-19 06:27:40 <LobsterMan> only between blocks?
488 2010-12-19 06:29:54 <nanotube> yea
489 2010-12-19 06:30:09 <nanotube> it's based on 'time to create previous X blocks'
490 2010-12-19 06:32:11 <lfm> time to create previous 2016 blocks
491 2010-12-19 06:33:07 <nanotube> lfm: well, actually... it's time to create the blocks created so far in the current 2016 block batch.
492 2010-12-19 06:33:19 <nanotube> so currently... it's time for the previous 2016-469 blocks.
493 2010-12-19 06:33:49 <lfm> ya but when it actually changes it will be
494 2010-12-19 06:34:41 <LobsterMan> after a new block?
495 2010-12-19 06:34:58 <nanotube> lfm: mm... i thought we were talking about the estimate, not about the difficulty... but anyway, yea we're on the same page. :)
496 2010-12-19 06:35:44 <nanotube> LobsterMan: the estimate that the bot puts out is based on what i said... the actual difficulty changes happen every 2016 blocks, and are based on time to create previous 2016 blocks.
497 2010-12-19 06:36:12 <LobsterMan> yeah but i thought the bot updates its estimate after every block?
498 2010-12-19 06:36:35 <nanotube> estimate, yes, i think it is with every block.
499 2010-12-19 06:36:39 <nanotube> ;;bc,statsa
500 2010-12-19 06:36:39 <gribble> Error: "bc,statsa" is not a valid command.
501 2010-12-19 06:36:41 <nanotube> ;;bc,stats
502 2010-12-19 06:36:43 <gribble> Current Blocks: 98316 | Current Difficulty: 12252.03471156 | Next Difficulty At Block: 98783 | Next Difficulty In: 467 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 2 days, 19 hours, 36 minutes, and 10 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 14106.15745393
503 2010-12-19 06:36:46 <lfm> LobsterMan: ya ok the est is updated every block but the changes should be quite small anyway
504 2010-12-19 06:36:55 <nanotube> there it is, updated...
505 2010-12-19 06:37:00 <nanotube> going down... mm
506 2010-12-19 06:37:17 <LobsterMan> a glitch or less people mining?
507 2010-12-19 06:37:24 Sherpa has joined
508 2010-12-19 06:37:37 <nanotube> no idea...
509 2010-12-19 06:37:45 <nanotube> ;;bc,calc 2700000
510 2010-12-19 06:37:45 <gribble> The average time to generate a block at 2700000 Khps, given current difficulty of 12252.03471156 , is 5 hours, 24 minutes, and 49 seconds
511 2010-12-19 06:38:05 <nanotube> mm the slush pool should be generating every 5.5 hours on avg. :)
512 2010-12-19 06:38:06 <Sherpa> ;;bc,calc 1300000
513 2010-12-19 06:38:07 <gribble> The average time to generate a block at 1300000 Khps, given current difficulty of 12252.03471156 , is 11 hours, 14 minutes, and 38 seconds
514 2010-12-19 06:38:12 <Sherpa> ;;bc,calc 130000
515 2010-12-19 06:38:14 <gribble> The average time to generate a block at 130000 Khps, given current difficulty of 12252.03471156 , is 4 days, 16 hours, 26 minutes, and 25 seconds
516 2010-12-19 06:38:22 <LobsterMan> the slush pool seems to be averaging every 8hrs or so
517 2010-12-19 06:38:38 <Sherpa> Who wrote gribble ?
518 2010-12-19 06:38:49 <Sherpa> ;;about
519 2010-12-19 06:38:49 <gribble> This bot contains factoids with answers to some frequently asked questions. Visit the bot's homepage at http://gribble.sourceforge.net/ for info and a nice list of factoids.
520 2010-12-19 06:38:52 <nanotube> LobsterMan: well, it has grown since the first blocks. it started out being about 1ghps, when i first checked.
521 2010-12-19 06:39:05 <nanotube> Sherpa: gribble's mine. why?
522 2010-12-19 06:39:41 <Sherpa> Just curious
523 2010-12-19 06:39:45 <nanotube> :)
524 2010-12-19 06:39:47 <Sherpa> i see it wasnt written for bitcoin
525 2010-12-19 06:39:50 <Sherpa> but for freenode
526 2010-12-19 06:40:01 <Sherpa> and has just adopted some bitcoin functionality
527 2010-12-19 06:40:02 <Sherpa> :P
528 2010-12-19 06:40:07 <nanotube> it's a generic irc bot
529 2010-12-19 06:40:21 <nanotube> it's 'first use' was for the sourceforge channel...
530 2010-12-19 06:40:22 <Sherpa> I know a thing or two about those
531 2010-12-19 06:40:34 <nanotube> but over time i've started using it in other places. ):
532 2010-12-19 06:40:37 <nanotube> :) that is
533 2010-12-19 06:40:41 tylergillies has joined
534 2010-12-19 06:40:41 tylergillies has quit (Changing host)
535 2010-12-19 06:40:41 tylergillies has joined
536 2010-12-19 06:40:51 * Sherpa has an irc parser in 3 languages written in his head
537 2010-12-19 06:41:03 <nanotube> tylergillies: hiya. :)
538 2010-12-19 06:41:31 <LobsterMan> nanotube what langauge is gribble written in?
539 2010-12-19 06:41:54 <Sherpa> so what source does gribble talk to for its bitcoin data, web socks? mysql? php?
540 2010-12-19 06:42:37 <nanotube> LobsterMan: python. it's based on supybot.
541 2010-12-19 06:42:39 * Sherpa is moderately certain he will start with mIRC Script for bitcoin manipulation then evolve from there
542 2010-12-19 06:42:47 <nanotube> Sherpa: data is from blockexplorer.com
543 2010-12-19 06:42:55 <nanotube> blockexplorer.com/q/ in fact.
544 2010-12-19 06:42:58 MT`AwAy has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
545 2010-12-19 06:43:02 <Sherpa> I've browsed that a lot
546 2010-12-19 06:43:04 <nanotube> see ,,gribble page for info
547 2010-12-19 06:43:04 <gribble> Here's a bitcoin wiki page about gribble: http://www.bitcoin.org/wiki/doku.php?id=gribble
548 2010-12-19 06:43:17 <Sherpa> Thought would wget it or similar method into own mirrored file
549 2010-12-19 06:43:31 <Sherpa> update every hour
550 2010-12-19 06:43:44 <Sherpa> so requests to outside resources are low
551 2010-12-19 06:44:10 <Sherpa> There a good wiki or RFC for forumlas ?
552 2010-12-19 06:44:43 * Sherpa listens to VA_-_Feel_The_Streets__The_Real_Masters_Of_Hip_Hop_-2CD-2010-YSP\VA_-_Feel_The_Streets_(The_Real_Masters_Of_Hip_Hop)-2CD-2010-YSP\207-mase_-_feels_so_good-ysp.mp3
553 2010-12-19 06:45:37 <Sherpa> I'm typing rather dislexic lately
554 2010-12-19 06:46:05 <mizerydearia> http://please.bitcoin.me ^_^
555 2010-12-19 06:46:15 <Sherpa> ...can i use this channel as a test arena ? :)
556 2010-12-19 06:47:27 <mizerydearia> Sherpa, What kind of test?
557 2010-12-19 06:47:36 MT`AwAy has joined
558 2010-12-19 06:47:41 <ColonelPanic1> Sherpa, your client is annoying
559 2010-12-19 06:47:51 <mizerydearia> I wouldn't recommend posting currently listening to infos.
560 2010-12-19 06:48:01 <nanotube> Sherpa: pls don't spam all channels you're on with your now-playing... that's lame. :P
561 2010-12-19 06:48:03 * Sherpa refrains
562 2010-12-19 06:48:23 <ColonelPanic1> I recommend this croup called "BANd hammer"
563 2010-12-19 06:48:33 <nanotube> Sherpa: theymos said he doesn't mind live update requests. up-to-the-latest-block info is nice to have on the bat.
564 2010-12-19 06:48:39 <nanotube> Sherpa: and what do you mean by formulas?
565 2010-12-19 06:49:26 <Sherpa> calculations
566 2010-12-19 06:50:09 MT`AwAy has quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
567 2010-12-19 06:50:32 <Sherpa> (khash/s * difficulty) = block/sec
568 2010-12-19 06:50:41 <Sherpa> or something to that effect
569 2010-12-19 06:50:59 <lfm> Sherpa: blocks/hour = 6
570 2010-12-19 06:51:14 <Sherpa> why?
571 2010-12-19 06:51:15 <Sherpa> :P
572 2010-12-19 06:51:44 <lfm> design parameter
573 2010-12-19 06:51:51 <Sherpa> 144 blocks a day
574 2010-12-19 06:52:05 <Sherpa> 868 blocks a week
575 2010-12-19 06:52:08 <lfm> gross
576 2010-12-19 06:52:42 <Sherpa> 45136 blocks a year
577 2010-12-19 06:53:09 <Sherpa> 225680 blocks after 5 years
578 2010-12-19 06:54:13 <Sherpa> 682.756944 days of block generation ?
579 2010-12-19 06:56:20 <lfm> yup getting to two years
580 2010-12-19 06:59:35 MT`AwAy has joined
581 2010-12-19 06:59:56 <EvanR> 10 minutes per block
582 2010-12-19 07:00:30 <Sherpa> !btc.ver
583 2010-12-19 07:04:30 MT`AwAy has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
584 2010-12-19 07:04:35 MT`AwAy has joined
585 2010-12-19 07:12:06 MT`AwAy has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
586 2010-12-19 07:13:05 MT`AwAy has joined
587 2010-12-19 07:18:40 <Sherpa> BitCoin Blocks:
588 2010-12-19 07:18:40 <Sherpa> !btc.blocks
589 2010-12-19 07:18:56 <nanotube> Sherpa: ?
590 2010-12-19 07:19:00 <nanotube> ;;bc,blocks
591 2010-12-19 07:19:01 <gribble> 98323
592 2010-12-19 07:19:02 maximi89 has quit (Quit: Leaving.)
593 2010-12-19 07:21:30 <Sherpa> !btc.blocks
594 2010-12-19 07:22:14 <Sherpa> !btc.ver
595 2010-12-19 07:22:53 <nanotube> Sherpa: fwiw, i only see your commands, not any output. and fwiw2, might want to do your testing in #bitcoin-bot, or #botters, or something. :)
596 2010-12-19 07:23:11 MT`AwAy has quit (Quit: Bye, see you later!)
597 2010-12-19 07:24:05 MT`BNC has joined
598 2010-12-19 07:24:34 <Sherpa> !btc.blocks
599 2010-12-19 07:25:02 SillyWalker has quit (Quit: Leaving)
600 2010-12-19 07:25:59 <Sherpa> !btc.ver
601 2010-12-19 07:36:14 MT`BNC has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
602 2010-12-19 07:37:05 MT`AwAy has joined
603 2010-12-19 07:38:49 <jgarzik> MT`AwAy: ping
604 2010-12-19 07:40:12 RazielZ has joined
605 2010-12-19 07:41:33 paul0 has quit (Quit: paul0)
606 2010-12-19 07:46:28 * Sherpa twitches
607 2010-12-19 07:46:36 <Sherpa> almost time for sleep
608 2010-12-19 07:47:09 MT`AwAy has quit (Quit: Bye, see you later!)
609 2010-12-19 08:16:59 Tester has joined
610 2010-12-19 08:21:03 Tester has quit (Client Quit)
611 2010-12-19 08:26:06 MT`AwAy has joined
612 2010-12-19 08:26:55 lfm has quit (Quit: Page closed)
613 2010-12-19 08:32:20 chuck251 has joined
614 2010-12-19 09:06:38 craiova has joined
615 2010-12-19 09:06:55 <craiova> Hi. Where was that map with bitcoin nodes?
616 2010-12-19 09:08:42 <MT`AwAy> yes
617 2010-12-19 09:08:48 <MT`AwAy> http://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=2346.0
618 2010-12-19 09:10:00 <craiova> thank you
619 2010-12-19 09:30:43 chuck251 has quit ()
620 2010-12-19 09:32:03 <Kiba> http://www.businessinsider.com/pictures-chinese-ghost-cities-2010-12?slop=1#slideshow-start
621 2010-12-19 09:32:04 <Kiba> wow
622 2010-12-19 09:32:10 <Kiba> an entire empty city! ROFL
623 2010-12-19 09:41:07 <craiova> china is fucking superpowet
624 2010-12-19 09:41:10 <craiova> power
625 2010-12-19 09:45:46 <Kiba> 64 million houses in China are vacant!
626 2010-12-19 09:47:52 noagendamarket has joined
627 2010-12-19 09:48:18 noagendamarket has quit (Changing host)
628 2010-12-19 09:48:18 noagendamarket has joined
629 2010-12-19 09:48:29 <wump> interesting
630 2010-12-19 09:49:32 <Sherpa> !btc.coins
631 2010-12-19 09:49:50 <Sherpa> Someone type that :)
632 2010-12-19 09:50:24 <da2ce7> ;;bc,stats
633 2010-12-19 09:50:26 <gribble> Current Blocks: 98350 | Current Difficulty: 12252.03471156 | Next Difficulty At Block: 98783 | Next Difficulty In: 433 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 2 days, 14 hours, 9 minutes, and 38 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 14224.26081830
634 2010-12-19 09:50:40 <Kiba> craiova: a superpower that waste money doing funny shit like this
635 2010-12-19 09:50:46 slush_cz1 has joined
636 2010-12-19 09:51:45 <craiova> hmmm
637 2010-12-19 09:52:01 <craiova> would they allow a foreigner to move in?
638 2010-12-19 09:52:07 <Kiba> dunno
639 2010-12-19 09:52:15 <Kiba> why would you want to live in such an empty place?
640 2010-12-19 09:52:31 <craiova> yea
641 2010-12-19 09:53:00 <craiova> well, i bet it won't be empty for much longer
642 2010-12-19 09:53:23 <craiova> also, it would be a thing not many people could experience
643 2010-12-19 09:53:31 slush_cz has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
644 2010-12-19 09:54:00 <Sherpa> Can someone type !btc.coins, i want to test my bot
645 2010-12-19 09:54:19 <hundfred> !btc.coins
646 2010-12-19 09:54:20 <Sherpa> BitCoins: 4917500
647 2010-12-19 09:54:27 <Sherpa> thx
648 2010-12-19 09:54:49 <Sherpa> more commands at !btc.help :)
649 2010-12-19 09:55:20 <hundfred> !btc.help
650 2010-12-19 09:55:20 <Sherpa> BTCBot v0.2 Commmands: !btc.ver .blocks .diff .coins .help
651 2010-12-19 09:55:24 <MT`AwAy> !btc.nodes
652 2010-12-19 09:55:25 <MT`AwAy> :D
653 2010-12-19 09:55:29 <Sherpa> soon
654 2010-12-19 09:55:41 <MT`AwAy> based on ?
655 2010-12-19 09:55:50 <Sherpa> I'll find a way
656 2010-12-19 09:55:59 <MT`AwAy> why not take https://smsz.net/btcStats/nodes ?
657 2010-12-19 09:56:22 <hundfred> !btc.send_some_to_punk <...>
658 2010-12-19 09:56:29 <craiova> How is the GPU generation going? How fast can ppl generate?
659 2010-12-19 09:56:42 <MT`AwAy> craiova: between 10 and 1000 times faster than cpu
660 2010-12-19 09:56:44 <craiova> Also, are there bitcoin-viruses that infect the pc and mine?
661 2010-12-19 09:56:50 <MT`AwAy> not yet
662 2010-12-19 09:56:52 <Sherpa> Not yet
663 2010-12-19 09:56:53 <Sherpa> :P
664 2010-12-19 09:57:47 <hundfred> is there a gpu-supported version available for dl?
665 2010-12-19 09:57:57 <craiova> i am so frustrated because i don't know any programming language
666 2010-12-19 09:58:00 <Sherpa> 3rd party yes
667 2010-12-19 09:58:08 <craiova> and there are so many things i want to do with btc
668 2010-12-19 09:58:16 <Sherpa> there is a python converted to windos binaried floating around
669 2010-12-19 09:58:22 <Sherpa> use with bitcoin.exe -server
670 2010-12-19 09:58:30 <Sherpa> specify user and pass in bitcon.conf
671 2010-12-19 09:58:37 <Sherpa> *+i
672 2010-12-19 09:58:58 <Sherpa> the # of typos is indicative of my need for sleep
673 2010-12-19 09:59:17 <kabo69> ;;bc,stats
674 2010-12-19 09:59:19 <gribble> Current Blocks: 98352 | Current Difficulty: 12252.03471156 | Next Difficulty At Block: 98783 | Next Difficulty In: 431 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 2 days, 13 hours, 51 minutes, and 40 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 14227.04080720
675 2010-12-19 10:00:12 <craiova> MT`AwAy: is MTgox yours?
676 2010-12-19 10:00:19 <MT`AwAy> no
677 2010-12-19 10:00:26 <MT`AwAy> mtgox is mtgox's
678 2010-12-19 10:03:21 <craiova> ok
679 2010-12-19 10:07:06 <Kiba> man
680 2010-12-19 10:07:12 <Kiba> economy
681 2010-12-19 10:07:13 <Kiba> and the state
682 2010-12-19 10:07:24 <Kiba> is a very different textbook from what I have read
683 2010-12-19 10:07:31 <Kiba> in the past
684 2010-12-19 10:07:37 <Kiba> it starts with the fundamental
685 2010-12-19 10:07:47 <Kiba> and is a surprising compelling read
686 2010-12-19 10:11:59 <MT`AwAy> mh
687 2010-12-19 10:12:05 <MT`AwAy> my system is getting the node count wrong
688 2010-12-19 10:12:12 <MT`AwAy> fixing a bug
689 2010-12-19 10:12:12 <MT`AwAy> :D
690 2010-12-19 10:12:30 <MT`AwAy> (it kept trying dead nodes again and again, thru not getting new infos from live nodes)
691 2010-12-19 10:12:44 <MT`AwAy> here
692 2010-12-19 10:12:49 <MT`AwAy> will take a few hours to fix
693 2010-12-19 10:13:04 <MT`AwAy> or
694 2010-12-19 10:13:10 <MT`AwAy> *massive db update*
695 2010-12-19 10:15:32 <MT`AwAy> UPDATE `Bitcoin_Node` SET `Next_Check` = NOW() WHERE `Status` = 'up'
696 2010-12-19 10:15:33 <MT`AwAy> :p
697 2010-12-19 10:17:03 <nathan7> :o
698 2010-12-19 10:17:58 calebopeko has joined
699 2010-12-19 10:19:00 <aximilation> does anyone know if there is a euro market for bitcoins yet?
700 2010-12-19 10:19:21 <MT`AwAy> https://smsz.net/btcStats/accepting <- number is growing back
701 2010-12-19 10:19:25 <MT`AwAy> aximilation: soon
702 2010-12-19 10:29:33 Cdh has joined
703 2010-12-19 10:32:51 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|hai
704 2010-12-19 10:33:31 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|shouldn't the topic say that there is 0.3.19 already?
705 2010-12-19 10:53:53 <MT`AwAy> yep, same for the forum
706 2010-12-19 10:57:04 <da2ce7> slush_cz1, I've added my GPU, it is working now with the new version of the python miner.
707 2010-12-19 11:11:24 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|is there an easy to compile opencl client yet?
708 2010-12-19 11:11:59 <ArtForz> huh?
709 2010-12-19 11:14:45 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|i mean, all needed patches on a single site and maintained
710 2010-12-19 11:15:27 <ArtForz> what patches? just use stock bitcoin/bitcoind and a recent build of m0mchil or diablos miner
711 2010-12-19 11:16:18 <ArtForz> getwork patch was merged into mainline 0.3.18
712 2010-12-19 11:29:10 TD_ has joined
713 2010-12-19 11:30:38 calebopeko has quit (Quit: Lost terminal)
714 2010-12-19 11:31:46 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|always outdated software ...
715 2010-12-19 11:33:14 <cosurgi> jgarzik: you are limiting nonce hashing only to 2^24, instead of full 2^32, why?
716 2010-12-19 11:33:59 <cosurgi> jgarzik: you have
717 2010-12-19 11:34:01 <cosurgi> if ((n & 0xffffff) == 0) {
718 2010-12-19 11:34:05 <cosurgi> instead of:
719 2010-12-19 11:34:09 <cosurgi> if ((n & 0xffffffff) == 0) {
720 2010-12-19 11:34:21 <cosurgi> or even:
721 2010-12-19 11:34:27 <cosurgi> if ((n & ~0) == 0) {
722 2010-12-19 11:34:36 <Sirius_> MT`AwAy: ready for the wiki link change to bitcoin.it?
723 2010-12-19 11:35:04 <Sirius_> bitcoin.it looks good :)
724 2010-12-19 11:36:14 Granttt has joined
725 2010-12-19 11:36:37 <MT`AwAy> Sirius_: ok
726 2010-12-19 11:36:50 <MT`AwAy> I'll add a link to the current wiki on the bitcoin.it home page so people can still find it then
727 2010-12-19 11:36:56 <Sirius_> ok
728 2010-12-19 11:37:28 <MT`AwAy> Sirius_: also if you link https://bitcoin.it/ (without language) it'll send to the appropriate language based on user browser
729 2010-12-19 11:37:45 <Sirius_> ok
730 2010-12-19 11:37:58 RichardG has joined
731 2010-12-19 11:38:02 <Sirius_> changed
732 2010-12-19 11:43:54 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|is this normal? http://pastebin.com/yBRT02mU
733 2010-12-19 11:45:16 <ArtForz> 1. I *think* it works better with username/password set via commandline args, 2. your bitcoin client is still catching up dwonloading the block chain, it wont start mining before it's finished
734 2010-12-19 11:45:32 <ArtForz> ;;bc,blocks
735 2010-12-19 11:45:32 <gribble> 98366
736 2010-12-19 11:45:37 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|but why is repeatedly asking for authentication?
737 2010-12-19 11:46:13 <ArtForz> I think the miner is a bit stupid
738 2010-12-19 11:46:34 <ArtForz> iirc when you havent set user/pass via cmdline it assumes getting an error from bitcoin == wrong login/pass and asks over and over
739 2010-12-19 11:48:21 brentl has joined
740 2010-12-19 11:48:51 Muldies has joined
741 2010-12-19 11:49:16 Muldies has left ()
742 2010-12-19 11:49:42 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|i started it now like this ~ % bitcoind --daemon --rpcuser=chris --rpcpassword=12345 --rpcallowip=127.0.0.1 -datadir=/home/chris/temp/bitcoindata -gen
743 2010-12-19 11:49:52 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|and then python2.7 poclbm.py -d 0 --user=chris --pass=12345
744 2010-12-19 11:50:00 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|but i still get asked for username and password
745 2010-12-19 11:51:18 <ArtForz> hmmm, that *should* work
746 2010-12-19 11:53:38 <slush_cz1> da2ce7: So it works also with your bad connection?
747 2010-12-19 11:54:04 <slush_cz1> da2ce7: How many mhash you contributed? We are now touching 3000mhash barrier
748 2010-12-19 11:55:36 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|if i use a miner through rpc should i disable the generating in bitcoin?
749 2010-12-19 11:58:11 <slush_cz1> still far distant from artforz's, but not too bad :)
750 2010-12-19 12:04:45 Remmy has quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
751 2010-12-19 12:05:50 <MT`AwAy> Cdh|2: I think you need to put only one - for bitcoind for parameters
752 2010-12-19 12:05:55 <MT`AwAy> (ie, won't work with --)
753 2010-12-19 12:06:01 Remmy has joined
754 2010-12-19 12:06:23 <ArtForz> MT`AwAy: right
755 2010-12-19 12:07:31 TD_ has quit (Quit: TD_)
756 2010-12-19 12:08:39 <Diablo-D3> hrm
757 2010-12-19 12:08:44 <Diablo-D3> why do people use m0's?
758 2010-12-19 12:09:17 genjix has joined
759 2010-12-19 12:09:17 <MT`AwAy> Diablo-D3: because they are free ? :p
760 2010-12-19 12:09:47 <genjix> morning
761 2010-12-19 12:10:10 RichardG has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
762 2010-12-19 12:10:51 edcba has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
763 2010-12-19 12:11:23 mtgox has joined
764 2010-12-19 12:12:09 <genjix> MT`AwAy: :o we became the new bitcoin.org wiki
765 2010-12-19 12:12:17 <MT`AwAy> genjix: yep, I know, Sirius_ is here
766 2010-12-19 12:12:29 <genjix> nice +1
767 2010-12-19 12:12:49 <MT`AwAy> genjix: hope it'll motivate everyone to contribute more and make this wiki the definitive source for bitcoin informations
768 2010-12-19 12:13:25 <genjix> do you think we should maybe come up with a unified structure for the main page topics
769 2010-12-19 12:13:37 <genjix> or let people decide themselves what's best?
770 2010-12-19 12:14:05 <genjix> 1) more ordered and logical. but people contribute less and get frustrated easier
771 2010-12-19 12:14:15 <genjix> 2) people work faster and better.
772 2010-12-19 12:14:41 <MT`AwAy> genjix: I think most people are able to find what they need easily, but new people need a big pointer to https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Getting_started (page which needs to be completed asap)
773 2010-12-19 12:15:06 <genjix> ok then i'll fix that up over this week
774 2010-12-19 12:15:27 <genjix> i want a bitcoin website for people new to our project :)
775 2010-12-19 12:15:43 <genjix> so i plan to make 1 small change everyday
776 2010-12-19 12:17:05 <MT`AwAy> :)
777 2010-12-19 12:17:12 <MT`AwAy> for now the Contributors Award got 100 BTC
778 2010-12-19 12:17:57 <slush_cz1> how can I obtain my current address using RPC?
779 2010-12-19 12:18:30 <MT`AwAy> slush_cz1: use listreceivedbyaddress 0 false
780 2010-12-19 12:18:32 <MT`AwAy> er
781 2010-12-19 12:18:34 <MT`AwAy> slush_cz1: use listreceivedbyaddress 0 true
782 2010-12-19 12:18:35 <slush_cz1> which is used by 'sendtoaddress'
783 2010-12-19 12:18:39 RichardG has joined
784 2010-12-19 12:18:43 <genjix> why is MagicalTax always away? XD
785 2010-12-19 12:18:48 <genjix> but here.
786 2010-12-19 12:19:15 <slush_cz1> wow, so weird.
787 2010-12-19 12:19:18 <slush_cz1> thanks
788 2010-12-19 12:19:40 <genjix> slush_cz1: do bitcoind getaccountaddress ""
789 2010-12-19 12:20:03 <genjix> oh wait, not the same :p
790 2010-12-19 12:20:20 <slush_cz1> i see
791 2010-12-19 12:20:38 <MT`AwAy> slush_cz1: I think you'll have a listaddresses or something similar soon
792 2010-12-19 12:20:55 <slush_cz1> but rpc is definitely obscure
793 2010-12-19 12:21:12 <slush_cz1> thanks guys, I see it now
794 2010-12-19 12:26:44 <genjix> MT`AwAy: how can i transfer the pastecoin.com name to jgarzik ?
795 2010-12-19 12:27:09 <MT`AwAy> genjix: ask him to create an accoun on https://www.kalyhost.com/register.html
796 2010-12-19 12:27:16 <genjix> ok
797 2010-12-19 12:27:22 <MT`AwAy> account*
798 2010-12-19 12:27:59 xelister has joined
799 2010-12-19 12:30:48 TD_ has joined
800 2010-12-19 12:31:20 <MT`AwAy> https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Original_Bitcoin_client/API_Calls_list
801 2010-12-19 12:32:21 <slush_cz1> MT`AwAy: thx
802 2010-12-19 12:34:18 <slush_cz1> http://blockexplorer.com/block/000000000001586a97a0b7d5065a89c89dd1107f0d8857e805b2aaa0f224a969
803 2010-12-19 12:34:24 <slush_cz1> its my block
804 2010-12-19 12:34:36 <slush_cz1> but I don't see "To" address in my client
805 2010-12-19 12:34:43 <MT`AwAy> it's a bit lonely in there, slush_cz1
806 2010-12-19 12:35:46 <slush_cz1> i see :)
807 2010-12-19 12:35:53 Cusipzzz has joined
808 2010-12-19 12:36:39 <genjix> ;;bc,help
809 2010-12-19 12:36:40 <gribble> Alias bc,bcm, Alias bc,blocks, Alias bc,btcex, Alias bc,calc, Alias bc,diff, Alias bc,estimate, Alias bc,help, Alias bc,markets, Alias bc,mtgox, Alias bc,nexttarget, Alias bc,stats, Alias bc,timetonext, and Alias bc,totalbc
810 2010-12-19 12:36:45 <genjix> ;;bc,blocks
811 2010-12-19 12:36:46 <gribble> 98374
812 2010-12-19 12:36:47 <slush_cz1> has every generation own address?
813 2010-12-19 12:38:38 <MT`AwAy> slush_cz1: in theory yep
814 2010-12-19 12:38:47 <slush_cz1> definitely not see any generated blocks using RPC
815 2010-12-19 12:38:49 <MT`AwAy> I don't think however that the pool recycles addresses
816 2010-12-19 12:39:16 noagendamarket has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
817 2010-12-19 12:40:19 <da2ce7> slush_cz1, should be about 1GHash/sec
818 2010-12-19 12:40:50 <slush_cz1> wow, what gpu?
819 2010-12-19 12:41:02 <slush_cz1> I see hashrate is rising fast
820 2010-12-19 12:41:10 <da2ce7> one of my computers is dedicated to it. Um 2x 5970
821 2010-12-19 12:41:25 <ArtForz> only 1gh from 2 5970s?
822 2010-12-19 12:41:42 <ArtForz> even stock they should be doing close to 1.1
823 2010-12-19 12:42:02 <ArtForz> well, 1.07 or so stock
824 2010-12-19 12:42:22 <da2ce7> well i'm taking into account they generate a block so often it takes ages for them to get up to speed.
825 2010-12-19 12:42:30 <da2ce7> yeah, stock speed, as I cannot overclock and keep it stable.
826 2010-12-19 12:42:37 <da2ce7> one of the gpu's is dogey.
827 2010-12-19 12:44:58 <da2ce7> hoever I have got them stable at 1.0V insted of the stock. so saving a bit of power while i'm at it.
828 2010-12-19 12:45:03 <da2ce7> *however
829 2010-12-19 12:45:19 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|ha, i have figured it out
830 2010-12-19 12:45:32 <slush_cz1> I'm running my 5970 on original voltag and 820 mhz
831 2010-12-19 12:45:48 <ArtForz> yeah
832 2010-12-19 12:45:50 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|i have to write rpcuser and rpcpass in the config directory and then start bitcoin without --rpcuser and without --rpcpass
833 2010-12-19 12:45:52 <slush_cz1> its pretty stable
834 2010-12-19 12:46:01 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|like this: ~ % bitcoin --rpcallowip=127.0.0.1 -datadir=/home/chris/temp/bitcoindata -server
835 2010-12-19 12:46:04 <ArtForz> most of my 5970s can do 820 or more at stock V
836 2010-12-19 12:46:17 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|then this works: % python2.7 poclbm.py --user=chris --pass=12345 -d 0
837 2010-12-19 12:46:22 <slush_cz1> ArtForz: I know, I have problem with cooling
838 2010-12-19 12:46:23 <da2ce7> yeah, one of my gpu's is fucked, I need to replace the card, it won't even let the system get into windows if it is over 70C
839 2010-12-19 12:46:39 <da2ce7> but ironicaly it is stable at 1.00V/
840 2010-12-19 12:46:41 <slush_cz1> ArtForz: Card can do a lot more, but there is 32oC in room
841 2010-12-19 12:46:46 <ArtForz> yeah, so far I had 2 more-or-less DOA 5970s
842 2010-12-19 12:46:53 <Diablo-D3> da2ce7: turnt he voltage up?
843 2010-12-19 12:47:02 <da2ce7> nope down. made it stable
844 2010-12-19 12:47:07 <da2ce7> up makes it cook more
845 2010-12-19 12:47:07 <Diablo-D3> no I mean
846 2010-12-19 12:47:13 <ArtForz> one had core 2 15°C hotter than core 1
847 2010-12-19 12:47:15 <Diablo-D3> turn it down
848 2010-12-19 12:47:20 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|is 26434 khash/s ok for hd 4670?
849 2010-12-19 12:47:47 <Diablo-D3> Cdh|2: should be closer to 36
850 2010-12-19 12:48:00 <da2ce7> yep, that is like it! my good gpu runs at 80C my bad one was running at 95C untill it died.
851 2010-12-19 12:48:01 <ArtForz> yeah, see http://pastebin.com/AvymGnMJ
852 2010-12-19 12:48:08 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|poclbm is using 80-100% cpu...
853 2010-12-19 12:48:14 <Diablo-D3> Cdh|2: use sdk 2.1 not 2.2
854 2010-12-19 12:48:20 <ArtForz> da2ce7: yep, thats a bad card, RMA time
855 2010-12-19 12:48:30 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|2.3 at the moment
856 2010-12-19 12:48:38 <Diablo-D3> but there is no 2.3!
857 2010-12-19 12:48:43 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|yes it is
858 2010-12-19 12:48:44 <ArtForz> Diablo-D3: there is
859 2010-12-19 12:48:50 <Diablo-D3> christ, when did that come out
860 2010-12-19 12:48:56 <ArtForz> 15th
861 2010-12-19 12:49:01 <slush_cz1> da2ce7: Watch also VDCC temperature
862 2010-12-19 12:49:03 <ArtForz> and so did cat 10.12
863 2010-12-19 12:49:03 <Diablo-D3> fucking hell, and it still has the cpu bug?
864 2010-12-19 12:49:07 <ArtForz> yep
865 2010-12-19 12:49:09 <slush_cz1> it is much higher than gpu for me
866 2010-12-19 12:49:10 <Diablo-D3> fucking shit
867 2010-12-19 12:49:16 <Diablo-D3> what the fuck are they doing
868 2010-12-19 12:49:22 <ArtForz> and multiGPU perf still fucked
869 2010-12-19 12:49:25 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|http://developer.amd.com/gpu/ATIStreamSDK/downloads/Pages/default.aspx :)
870 2010-12-19 12:49:30 <Diablo-D3> goddamnit AMD
871 2010-12-19 12:49:33 <Diablo-D3> Cdh|2: use 2.1
872 2010-12-19 12:49:39 <ArtForz> yes, VDDC temps are a lot higher than core temps
873 2010-12-19 12:49:39 <Diablo-D3> 0% cpu usage, and it runs much faster
874 2010-12-19 12:49:48 <da2ce7> yeah, it is a ASUS one also :P but I'm just wating for my 3rd card to come before I swap it out, it is stable now I have undervolted it.
875 2010-12-19 12:49:53 <ArtForz> < 110°C VDDC should be fine long-term though
876 2010-12-19 12:50:07 <slush_cz1> my gpus are under 80oC, but VDCC is on 100. It is my internal limit.
877 2010-12-19 12:50:16 <ArtForz> and hitting that without overvolting is kinda hard
878 2010-12-19 12:50:20 <slush_cz1> Worked also on 115, but it is definitely hight :)
879 2010-12-19 12:50:30 <Diablo-D3> >85 == shit fries]
880 2010-12-19 12:50:39 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|ok, 2.1 then... *downloading*
881 2010-12-19 12:50:50 <ArtForz> Diablo-D3: VDDC temp
882 2010-12-19 12:50:52 <Diablo-D3> Cdh|2: and my miner should perform better than m0's
883 2010-12-19 12:51:13 <Diablo-D3> ArtForz: but there isnt a vddc meter though, is there?
884 2010-12-19 12:51:21 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|then i will try it
885 2010-12-19 12:51:24 <ArtForz> on windows there is
886 2010-12-19 12:51:32 <slush_cz1> Diablo-D3: I'm using GPU-Z on Win
887 2010-12-19 12:51:34 <da2ce7> how do you check the VDDC temp, afterburner dosn't have it.
888 2010-12-19 12:51:47 <ArtForz> gpu-z or rivatuner should work
889 2010-12-19 12:51:49 <da2ce7> ah gup-z
890 2010-12-19 12:51:50 <Diablo-D3> my 4850 is probably slowly frying itself
891 2010-12-19 12:52:04 <ArtForz> who cares, if it craps out ebay it
892 2010-12-19 12:52:09 <slush_cz1> :-D
893 2010-12-19 12:52:16 <Diablo-D3> ebay it? feh, I'd just toss it
894 2010-12-19 12:52:25 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|oh wow, java
895 2010-12-19 12:52:30 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|i'd like my card to fry
896 2010-12-19 12:52:43 <slush_cz1> Cdh|2: My first opinion was the same, but it works
897 2010-12-19 12:52:47 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|then i have an excuse for buying a nvidia card
898 2010-12-19 12:52:55 <ArtForz> at least everyone else seems to operate that way, so far 100% of used cards I bought on ebay were broken in some way
899 2010-12-19 12:52:55 <Diablo-D3> ArtForz: I'll just have to figure out how to remove the damned heatsinks though
900 2010-12-19 12:52:56 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|because catalyst on linux sucks
901 2010-12-19 12:53:06 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|every new release introduces more bugs
902 2010-12-19 12:53:10 <Diablo-D3> catalyst on linux is a shitload better than nvidia's shit
903 2010-12-19 12:53:20 <Diablo-D3> and no, I wouldnt say more bugs
904 2010-12-19 12:53:28 <Diablo-D3> theres been two fucked releases in the past year
905 2010-12-19 12:53:31 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|warcraft3 freezes every 2-3 hours
906 2010-12-19 12:53:40 <Diablo-D3> 10.5 and 10.9
907 2010-12-19 12:53:42 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|half life 2 freezes when you look at water in the wrong angle
908 2010-12-19 12:53:47 <Diablo-D3> Cdh|2: bullshit
909 2010-12-19 12:53:55 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|no
910 2010-12-19 12:53:56 <Diablo-D3> I play hl2 with everything on or up, it runs smoothly.
911 2010-12-19 12:54:05 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|i have tried with different settings and it happens everytime
912 2010-12-19 12:54:22 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|i have made a video http://dl.dropbox.com/u/13721560/hl2-3.mkv
913 2010-12-19 12:54:22 <Diablo-D3> using newest wine?
914 2010-12-19 12:54:29 <ArtForz> oh, btw, bought components for my new main box
915 2010-12-19 12:54:44 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|~ % pacman -Q wine
916 2010-12-19 12:54:45 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|wine 1.3.9-1
917 2010-12-19 12:54:48 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|~ % pacman -Q catalyst-2.6.36-ARCH
918 2010-12-19 12:54:49 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|catalyst-2.6.36-ARCH 10.12-1
919 2010-12-19 12:54:50 <Diablo-D3> hrm, weird.
920 2010-12-19 12:54:55 <Diablo-D3> works fine for me.
921 2010-12-19 12:54:59 <genjix> ;;bc,blocks
922 2010-12-19 12:55:01 <gribble> 98377
923 2010-12-19 12:55:04 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|doesn't work for me
924 2010-12-19 12:55:06 <ArtForz> Phenom II X6 1100T, Asus M4A87TD EVO, 16GB ECC DDR3-1333
925 2010-12-19 12:55:14 <Diablo-D3> well, its clearly not a cat bug if it doesnt happen for me
926 2010-12-19 12:55:22 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|i have tested a nvidia 8800gt in the same pc and it run perfectly fine
927 2010-12-19 12:55:58 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|unfortunately it has a memory defect... but on average i can play half life 2 longer with it before encountering an error than with the perfectly fine hd 4670
928 2010-12-19 12:56:01 <ArtForz> yeah, kinda cheap board, but *shrug* I'm not planning on gaming on it
929 2010-12-19 12:56:07 <Diablo-D3> also, even if you bought an nvidia card, what are you going to do with it when X removes all the legacy driver APIs/
930 2010-12-19 12:56:19 <da2ce7> yeah the vddc are 100C and 100C, on my other card they are 96C, and 94C
931 2010-12-19 12:56:28 <Diablo-D3> nvidia has already said they refuse to support gallium
932 2010-12-19 12:56:37 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|then i hope the open source driver will be competitive in performance and opengl compliance
933 2010-12-19 12:56:48 <Diablo-D3> so once that transition happens, nvidia can no longer claim they support linux
934 2010-12-19 12:56:51 <ArtForz> well, radeonhd is slowly getting there
935 2010-12-19 12:56:58 <ArtForz> noveau... not so much
936 2010-12-19 12:57:10 <Diablo-D3> ArtForz: no, radeonhd is dead
937 2010-12-19 12:57:17 <ArtForz> not quite
938 2010-12-19 12:57:18 <Diablo-D3> everything merged back into radeon
939 2010-12-19 12:57:34 <ArtForz> most changes and devs got merged back into radeon
940 2010-12-19 12:57:44 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|even warcraft3 is still laggy with xf86-video-ati-git and mesa 7.10
941 2010-12-19 12:57:56 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|with lib32-mesa and wine
942 2010-12-19 12:58:05 craiova has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
943 2010-12-19 12:58:30 <Diablo-D3> Cdh|2: but you probably didnt use any of the gallium stuff
944 2010-12-19 12:58:35 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|and it needs a 8 mb dx 8.1 card
945 2010-12-19 12:58:57 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|with r600g i have no mouse pointer in menus and it crashes sometimes
946 2010-12-19 12:59:01 <da2ce7> after the 5970's dry up, lets hope the 6990 is going to be good.
947 2010-12-19 12:59:11 <Diablo-D3> Cdh|2: yes, and who cares what mesa classic does?
948 2010-12-19 12:59:15 <Diablo-D3> its broken and old
949 2010-12-19 12:59:16 <ArtForz> well.. at least it shouldnt end up slower than 5970
950 2010-12-19 12:59:35 <ArtForz> except we'll have to use craptastic sdk3.3
951 2010-12-19 12:59:35 <Diablo-D3> ArtForz: you have 2.3? try testing that 68xx you ahve
952 2010-12-19 12:59:36 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|but r600g is not working right yet
953 2010-12-19 12:59:59 <da2ce7> hmm, prob not going to be as good hash/timepower
954 2010-12-19 13:00:22 <ArtForz> Diablo: did, a bit faster than 2.2, about what you'd expect with a 6800-alike 5xxx and 2.1
955 2010-12-19 13:00:23 <Diablo-D3> Cdh|2: so, essentially, you're bitching about a brand new beta piece of software?
956 2010-12-19 13:00:35 <ArtForz> except again 100% cpu and compeltely suck perf with > 1 GPU
957 2010-12-19 13:00:38 <Diablo-D3> ArtForz: so it beat 2.2?
958 2010-12-19 13:00:42 <ArtForz> yes
959 2010-12-19 13:00:45 <Diablo-D3> hrrrm.
960 2010-12-19 13:00:54 <Diablo-D3> thats an improvement, at least
961 2010-12-19 13:01:00 <Diablo-D3> does 2.3 do anything for 5xxx?
962 2010-12-19 13:01:12 <ArtForz> faster than 2.2, still slower than 2.1 for 5770 and 5970
963 2010-12-19 13:01:14 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|no, i say, that i can not play the only to games i use to play with catalyst whereas with nvidia they work fine
964 2010-12-19 13:01:28 <Diablo-D3> Cdh|2: yes, but basically, no one cares what you think.
965 2010-12-19 13:01:35 <ArtForz> and same multiGPU suckages as 2.2
966 2010-12-19 13:01:39 <Diablo-D3> nvidia is going bankrupt, they've already admitted they dont care about supporting linux
967 2010-12-19 13:01:41 <Keefe> guess i'm lucky. both used 5970's i got thru ebay have worked fine so far for mining (haven't tried anything else), and 3 of 4 cores OC better than the new 5970 i bought months ago
968 2010-12-19 13:01:45 <Diablo-D3> so your only choice is AMD
969 2010-12-19 13:01:47 <Diablo-D3> like it or not.
970 2010-12-19 13:02:23 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|it's not a choice if with a defect nvidia card i get a better experience than with a perfectly fine amd card
971 2010-12-19 13:03:12 <da2ce7> diablo-d3, do you have a link to a article that Nvidia is going bankrupt, from memory their last finincal results wern't too bad.
972 2010-12-19 13:03:18 <ArtForz> *shrug* I dont play 3d games under linux
973 2010-12-19 13:03:34 <Diablo-D3> da2ce7: their primary business is 3D cards... and their new gtx 5xx are about as fast as radeon 5xxx and 68xx
974 2010-12-19 13:03:41 <ArtForz> I'm fucking happy if simple video overlay works with dualhead
975 2010-12-19 13:03:42 <Diablo-D3> why would anyone buy a defective card.
976 2010-12-19 13:04:01 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|~/DiabloMiner (git)-[master] % java -cp target/libs/*:target/DiabloMiner-0.0.1-SNAPSHOT.jar -Djava.library.path=target/libs/natives/linux com.diablominer.DiabloMiner.DiabloMiner $@
977 2010-12-19 13:04:01 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|Exception in thread "main" java.lang.NoClassDefFoundError: com/diablominer/DiabloMiner/DiabloMiner
978 2010-12-19 13:04:06 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|something wrong with classpath?
979 2010-12-19 13:04:13 <Diablo-D3> Cdh|2: did you grab it from git?
980 2010-12-19 13:04:18 <ArtForz> because their core business is Quadro and Tesla
981 2010-12-19 13:04:40 <Diablo-D3> ArtForz: not really; their core business is whatever makes them the most money
982 2010-12-19 13:04:42 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|the (git)-[master] prompt is zsh telling me i am in the master branch :)
983 2010-12-19 13:04:46 <ArtForz> Fermi was never designed as a gaming GPU
984 2010-12-19 13:04:55 <ArtForz> that would've been 3xx
985 2010-12-19 13:05:01 <Diablo-D3> ArtForz: they sell a thousand or ten thousand game gpus for every scientific gpu
986 2010-12-19 13:05:07 <ArtForz> and it failed so hard they completely scrapped the design
987 2010-12-19 13:05:08 <da2ce7> cause ATI's cards use stream level paralisim, tasks that are liner at the stream level the 5xx still wins.
988 2010-12-19 13:05:14 <Diablo-D3> Cdh|2: this is why the binary is provided; if you wish to build it, run mvn package
989 2010-12-19 13:05:41 <Diablo-D3> da2ce7: except thats technically bad coding.
990 2010-12-19 13:05:51 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|oh ok
991 2010-12-19 13:05:57 <ArtForz> so nvidia has the best GPU for tasks that dont work well on GPUs... yay!
992 2010-12-19 13:05:58 <genjix> ;;bc,blocks
993 2010-12-19 13:05:58 <gribble> 98379
994 2010-12-19 13:06:04 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|i thought the shell script would build it
995 2010-12-19 13:06:06 <Diablo-D3> yeah, what ArtForz said
996 2010-12-19 13:06:16 <Diablo-D3> Cdh|2: there is no shell script...?
997 2010-12-19 13:06:25 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|DiabloMiner-Linux.sh
998 2010-12-19 13:06:29 <Diablo-D3> oh, no.
999 2010-12-19 13:06:32 <Diablo-D3> that just runs it
1000 2010-12-19 13:06:39 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|ok thanks :)
1001 2010-12-19 13:06:44 <Diablo-D3> either download the binary zip, or build it.
1002 2010-12-19 13:07:36 <da2ce7> lol, :P I guess so, unless you are doing some eng stuff like chain annalyis, where each task is inderpdant, however the steams need to be completed in a linear manner... for most tasks, I guess their design sucks.
1003 2010-12-19 13:07:40 <Diablo-D3> Cdh|2: btw, for most optimum performance, add -w 64 to the command line
1004 2010-12-19 13:07:53 <Diablo-D3> and probably -f 120 as well so X performance doesnt shit itself
1005 2010-12-19 13:08:34 <da2ce7> but the ecc memory is good if you are doing mission critical stuff.
1006 2010-12-19 13:08:44 <ArtForz> if you have a data-parallel task without much incoherent branching, wide SIMD beats bunch-of-independent-units every time
1007 2010-12-19 13:08:52 <Diablo-D3> ecc memory is good if you suspect something is fucked
1008 2010-12-19 13:09:13 <Diablo-D3> s/incoherent/fucking long/
1009 2010-12-19 13:09:40 <Diablo-D3> no ops are not your friend >_>
1010 2010-12-19 13:09:48 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|yep, it too has 100% cpu with stream sdk 2.3, will install 2.1 then
1011 2010-12-19 13:09:50 <ArtForz> yup
1012 2010-12-19 13:09:58 <Diablo-D3> Cdh|2: yes, its a stream sdk "bug"
1013 2010-12-19 13:10:10 <Diablo-D3> Cdh|2: 2.2 and 2.3 will use 100% cpu per executing thread
1014 2010-12-19 13:10:17 <ArtForz> nvidias design is simpler, but it doesnt realy scale that well
1015 2010-12-19 13:10:20 <Diablo-D3> Cdh|2: 2.1 doesnt.
1016 2010-12-19 13:10:25 <Diablo-D3> Cdh|2: it'll do it on any opencl app
1017 2010-12-19 13:10:38 <da2ce7> :P I dont' worry about the 100% cpu useage, don't slow down the computer noticabley.
1018 2010-12-19 13:10:51 <Diablo-D3> da2ce7: it slows down mining, however
1019 2010-12-19 13:11:00 <da2ce7> hmm how much?
1020 2010-12-19 13:11:01 <Diablo-D3> 2.3 would probably pwn 2.1 if the cpu bug was gone
1021 2010-12-19 13:11:01 <ArtForz> ATIs arch is harder to make full use of, but can reach way higher perf/mm², perf/$ and perf/W
1022 2010-12-19 13:11:33 <ArtForz> and for some tasks GPUs simply arent useful
1023 2010-12-19 13:12:04 <da2ce7> I'm getting 255xxx on each, with 100% cpu... at stock clocks.
1024 2010-12-19 13:12:25 <ArtForz> thats still kinda bad
1025 2010-12-19 13:12:28 <Diablo-D3> da2ce7: until the stream sdk removes needing to reflect opencl traffic through X, the cpu shit will be an issue
1026 2010-12-19 13:12:52 <slush_cz1> ArtForz: My card with stock settings had < 500mhash
1027 2010-12-19 13:12:58 <ArtForz> I get ~ 270Mh each stock
1028 2010-12-19 13:13:09 <Diablo-D3> I should see what 2.3 does on my box
1029 2010-12-19 13:13:16 <slush_cz1> around 460 by default
1030 2010-12-19 13:13:29 <slush_cz1> da2ce7: Try to play with miner parameters
1031 2010-12-19 13:13:39 <da2ce7> artforz, :O that quite fast each
1032 2010-12-19 13:13:43 <ArtForz> yep
1033 2010-12-19 13:14:11 <ArtForz> 330Mh/s @ 880
1034 2010-12-19 13:14:20 <Diablo-D3> I get roughly 75.3 on 2.1 -f 1
1035 2010-12-19 13:15:15 <da2ce7> slush_cz1, you are able to just look up my profile, or dose your design make it clumsy to look up any individual user?
1036 2010-12-19 13:15:35 <slush_cz1> da2ce7: What do you need?
1037 2010-12-19 13:15:49 <Diablo-D3> Enabled DRMDMA for Evergreen GPUs, as well as AMD Radeon™ HD 6870 and AMD Radeon™ HD 6850 devices.
1038 2010-12-19 13:15:52 <Diablo-D3> poh nice
1039 2010-12-19 13:16:27 <ArtForz> 323.3@860, 319.5@850, 315.8@840, 312.0@830, 308.3@820, 300.8@800
1040 2010-12-19 13:16:38 <da2ce7> slush_c1, no just wondering, cause then you could see who the big generator are. :P
1041 2010-12-19 13:17:05 <slush_cz1> Oh, another hacker (tired)
1042 2010-12-19 13:17:29 <slush_cz1> da2ce7: I see tail -f log and can grep individual user/worker
1043 2010-12-19 13:17:51 <slush_cz1> log report me some unusual behavior
1044 2010-12-19 13:17:52 <Diablo-D3> I get about 68 on 2.2 -f 1
1045 2010-12-19 13:18:04 <slush_cz1> like submitting work which was not asked before :-D
1046 2010-12-19 13:18:05 <Diablo-D3> with 25% cpu use in the miner, 85% in X
1047 2010-12-19 13:18:23 Daviey has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1048 2010-12-19 13:18:58 Daviey has joined
1049 2010-12-19 13:19:05 <slush_cz1> da2ce7: And also see your four workers rocks
1050 2010-12-19 13:19:44 <slush_cz1> > Oh, another hacker (tired)
1051 2010-12-19 13:19:44 <slush_cz1> this was not to you, da2ce7
1052 2010-12-19 13:20:07 <da2ce7> nope
1053 2010-12-19 13:20:25 <da2ce7> I would have done it under my own name, I need to make a 'naughty' cpu miner.
1054 2010-12-19 13:21:25 <da2ce7> :D
1055 2010-12-19 13:22:02 <Diablo-D3> now trying 2.3
1056 2010-12-19 13:22:24 <slush_cz1> trying my miner with -f 1 was not good idea. It freeze my VNC :)
1057 2010-12-19 13:22:30 <Diablo-D3> slush_cz1: lol
1058 2010-12-19 13:22:56 <Diablo-D3> 70 on 2.3 -f1, with miner using 25% cpu, X using 100%
1059 2010-12-19 13:23:00 <Diablo-D3> 2.1 still wins
1060 2010-12-19 13:25:05 <Diablo-D3> so 2.3 does improve shit
1061 2010-12-19 13:25:13 <Diablo-D3> but until they fix the fucking bug, bleh
1062 2010-12-19 13:25:48 matsh has joined
1063 2010-12-19 13:27:05 <matsh> Is this thing on?
1064 2010-12-19 13:27:48 <DerrikeG> In the least, I am.
1065 2010-12-19 13:27:49 <genjix> it's on.
1066 2010-12-19 13:28:18 <matsh> OKI, I have a question
1067 2010-12-19 13:28:20 <DerrikeG> slush_cz1: I can't fathom how a typo is hard to correct. Do you use a template engine of some sort? Not have access to the code?
1068 2010-12-19 13:29:01 <genjix> MT`AwAy: can i have permission to edit the sidebar? can we upload an irc web chat interface like http://pastecoin.com/cgi-bin/irc.cgi ?
1069 2010-12-19 13:29:10 <matsh> I'm maintaining the Java API project, soon to release it new 0.3.18 release, which can call all functions on the 0.3.18 bitcoin client
1070 2010-12-19 13:29:12 <slush_cz1> DerrikeG: using ORM which translate it. Of course I can hardcode fix everywhere, but I'd like to make it cleaner.
1071 2010-12-19 13:29:22 <slush_cz1> Today there will be larger outages, so I will rename it
1072 2010-12-19 13:29:46 <matsh> During that time I have done numerous small real transactions, each time sending 0.01 Bitcoin to EFF:s address
1073 2010-12-19 13:29:49 <MT`AwAy> genjix: I'm not enbling perl, but isn't freenode's interface enough ?
1074 2010-12-19 13:29:50 <DerrikeG> Oh, I see.
1075 2010-12-19 13:30:19 <genjix> MT`AwAy: we want something so some beginner can just click and start chatting.
1076 2010-12-19 13:30:24 <slush_cz1> DerrikeG: I have to rename database column, so have to stop application
1077 2010-12-19 13:30:27 <MT`AwAy> genjix: for the sidebar you can submit your changes in the discussions
1078 2010-12-19 13:30:43 <MT`AwAy> genjix: then what about mibbit?
1079 2010-12-19 13:30:49 <genjix> MT`AwAy: how about i edit it and if you don't like it then just revert
1080 2010-12-19 13:30:56 <genjix> mibbit is closed source :p
1081 2010-12-19 13:30:59 <matsh> I've done about 30 or so 0.01 Bitcoin calls, and it struck me, what happens if someone does millions of tiny meaningless transactions between two of their own accounts, to just bog down the network with junk?
1082 2010-12-19 13:31:26 <MT`AwAy> genjix: you can edit it ?
1083 2010-12-19 13:31:36 <MT`AwAy> (and who cares if it's not opensource, as long as users can use it?)
1084 2010-12-19 13:31:37 <genjix> no, but i want permission to :p
1085 2010-12-19 13:31:55 <TD_> matsh: the client has anti-DoS measures in it
1086 2010-12-19 13:32:05 TD has quit (Disconnected by services)
1087 2010-12-19 13:32:05 TD_ is now known as TD
1088 2010-12-19 13:32:11 <TD> and satoshi is adding more
1089 2010-12-19 13:32:35 <slush_cz1> DerrikeG: I know it looks weird, but I'm agains code hacking. This is not funcional problem, just cosmetic. I'm working on large system in my job where original developers solved everything by monkey patching and hacking. For example same variable have quadrillion different names. This is the same problem. I don't work this way.
1090 2010-12-19 13:32:52 <matsh> TD_ How can it tell what is DDoS and what is legitimate?
1091 2010-12-19 13:32:55 <MT`AwAy> genjix: how do I give you permission to edit the sidebar and only the sidebar? :D
1092 2010-12-19 13:33:22 <TD> heuristics i presume. same reason there's an artificial limitation of 0.01 coins for a transaction
1093 2010-12-19 13:33:28 <genjix> MT`AwAy: i dont know... why not just give me permissions? im obviously not a vandal and i promise not to delete anything.
1094 2010-12-19 13:33:35 <TD> ultimately a DoS attack on BitCoin is an attack on the entire economy though
1095 2010-12-19 13:33:42 <TD> other than random griefing there isn't a whole lot of motive for it
1096 2010-12-19 13:33:45 <TD> it's not like internet DoS
1097 2010-12-19 13:33:50 <DerrikeG> slush_cz1: Yeah, I can see why you wouldn't want to do that, but I would have left that bit of display code to a template engine
1098 2010-12-19 13:34:26 <MT`AwAy> genjix: you need to be at least administrator to edit the sidebar :p
1099 2010-12-19 13:34:27 <matsh> BTW, I've tried to get myself a wiki-account, but no success
1100 2010-12-19 13:34:40 <MT`AwAy> genjix: if I put you administrator, you'll have to patrol the users edits too
1101 2010-12-19 13:34:54 <genjix> why will i have to patrol users edits?
1102 2010-12-19 13:34:57 <slush_cz1> DerrikeG: Form is generated automatically
1103 2010-12-19 13:34:58 <MT`AwAy> :D
1104 2010-12-19 13:35:07 <genjix> i just want to write articles and make things nicer.
1105 2010-12-19 13:35:07 <slush_cz1> DerrikeG: Don't worry, i will fix it soon
1106 2010-12-19 13:35:09 <MT`AwAy> genjix: because it's one of the roles of administrators
1107 2010-12-19 13:35:11 <MT`AwAy> :D
1108 2010-12-19 13:35:12 <MT`AwAy> well
1109 2010-12-19 13:35:23 <genjix> how about i edit the sidebar then give it up after.
1110 2010-12-19 13:35:30 <genjix> cmon you're boring me here.
1111 2010-12-19 13:35:40 <MT`AwAy> genjix: here you are
1112 2010-12-19 13:35:45 <genjix> kk
1113 2010-12-19 13:35:47 <DerrikeG> Haha, it doesn't bother me too much. (Although I would push for aligning the textboxes.)
1114 2010-12-19 13:35:50 <genjix> ill tell you once im finished.
1115 2010-12-19 13:38:34 <matsh> Is it possible to get a wiki-account? Is my email blocked someway?
1116 2010-12-19 13:38:50 <MT`AwAy> matsh: you didn't get the email confirmation ?
1117 2010-12-19 13:39:43 <slush_cz1> DerrikeG: :-) I have web design. In next version I probably remove site entirely and open only telnet interface for checking rewards. No web design, no textbox aligning, not problem
1118 2010-12-19 13:39:57 <slush_cz1> hate
1119 2010-12-19 13:40:05 <MT`AwAy> matsh: I see no recent account creation
1120 2010-12-19 13:40:05 <slush_cz1> have => hate
1121 2010-12-19 13:40:51 <slush_cz1> DerrikeG: Just kidding. But I don't see those are real problems. I stll work on backend improvements. Aligning boxes have absolutely low priority
1122 2010-12-19 13:41:13 <genjix> MT`AwAy: https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Main_Page
1123 2010-12-19 13:41:17 <genjix> here's how it should look.
1124 2010-12-19 13:41:31 <genjix> simple, clean, easy-to-navigate for new users.
1125 2010-12-19 13:41:45 <matsh> No, no email versification, but maybe my email is blocked someway. Perhaps I should use gmail address...
1126 2010-12-19 13:41:47 <MT`AwAy> hey, the toolbox
1127 2010-12-19 13:42:10 <MT`AwAy> matsh: you're getting an error message?
1128 2010-12-19 13:42:18 <MT`AwAy> genjix: gah you removed the toolbox~
1129 2010-12-19 13:42:21 <genjix> MT`AwAy: if you install the vector extension for show/hide toolbox
1130 2010-12-19 13:42:27 <genjix> then we can put it back
1131 2010-12-19 13:42:28 <matsh> I think I have an account named matshenricson but not sure I ever got an email confirmation for that
1132 2010-12-19 13:42:41 <MT`AwAy> genjix: url on meta?
1133 2010-12-19 13:42:43 <genjix> MT`AwAy: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/MediaWiki
1134 2010-12-19 13:42:47 <genjix> like on the left
1135 2010-12-19 13:42:50 <DerrikeG> slush_cz1: Yeah. Web design is one of my things so I naturally want to help with it.
1136 2010-12-19 13:43:18 <MT`AwAy> mathnot in the log
1137 2010-12-19 13:43:19 <genjix> then we can have a Download section and put them there :)
1138 2010-12-19 13:43:23 <MT`AwAy> matsh: not in the log
1139 2010-12-19 13:43:33 <matsh> I got invalid password, so I tried to get the wiki to send me a new one
1140 2010-12-19 13:43:37 <MT`AwAy> genjix: I need the url for the extension you're talking about
1141 2010-12-19 13:43:50 <MT`AwAy> matsh: for info if you registered on the dokuwiki, it's not the same accounts
1142 2010-12-19 13:44:08 <matsh> OK; thanks
1143 2010-12-19 13:44:16 <matsh> I'll try something else.
1144 2010-12-19 13:44:22 <MT`AwAy> so you'll have to register again, sorry for that
1145 2010-12-19 13:44:43 <genjix> MT`AwAy: http://mwusers.com/forums/showthread.php?8425-Hide-Toolbox
1146 2010-12-19 13:45:17 <genjix> hide it for non-logged in users.
1147 2010-12-19 13:45:34 <MT`AwAy> :o
1148 2010-12-19 13:45:43 <MT`AwAy> no extension then?
1149 2010-12-19 13:46:22 <genjix> fine, I put it back
1150 2010-12-19 13:46:27 <genjix> but trust me- it is ugly
1151 2010-12-19 13:48:05 akem has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1152 2010-12-19 13:48:09 <genjix> MT`AwAy: how do you make it so that it doesn't show index.php?title= ?
1153 2010-12-19 13:48:10 <da2ce7> http://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=2361.0
1154 2010-12-19 13:48:12 <da2ce7> :D :D
1155 2010-12-19 13:48:19 <genjix> http://poker.bitcoinvegas.com/wiki/index.php?title=Main_Page
1156 2010-12-19 13:48:27 <genjix> http://poker.bitcoinvegas.com/wiki/
1157 2010-12-19 13:48:28 <genjix> how?
1158 2010-12-19 13:48:29 <MT`AwAy> genjix: that's explained on mediawiki
1159 2010-12-19 13:48:34 <genjix> link?
1160 2010-12-19 13:48:36 <MT`AwAy> http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Short_URL
1161 2010-12-19 13:48:58 <genjix> thanks
1162 2010-12-19 13:53:10 altamic has joined
1163 2010-12-19 13:53:11 <matsh> Got myself an account on the wiki now, works fine. Thanks.
1164 2010-12-19 13:56:49 <MT`AwAy> :)
1165 2010-12-19 13:58:09 gavinandresen has joined
1166 2010-12-19 13:59:08 joe_1 has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
1167 2010-12-19 14:00:18 matsh has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
1168 2010-12-19 14:00:50 * Cdh 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|managed to install amd stream 2.1 now :)
1169 2010-12-19 14:00:57 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|[19.12.10 14:57:57] Added ATI RV730 (#1) (8 CU, local work size of 64)
1170 2010-12-19 14:00:57 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|37360 khash/sec
1171 2010-12-19 14:01:05 <Diablo-D3> thats closer to relaity
1172 2010-12-19 14:01:11 <Diablo-D3> *reality
1173 2010-12-19 14:02:42 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|graphics look a bit laggy now, but even flash video still works fine
1174 2010-12-19 14:02:52 <Diablo-D3> try -f 120
1175 2010-12-19 14:02:59 <Diablo-D3> keep adding 60 until shit is smooth
1176 2010-12-19 14:03:02 <Diablo-D3> and flash may be unfixable
1177 2010-12-19 14:03:17 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|no, flash works fine :)
1178 2010-12-19 14:03:27 matsh has joined
1179 2010-12-19 14:03:43 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|but minimizing windows and stuff
1180 2010-12-19 14:03:51 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|or scrolling
1181 2010-12-19 14:05:55 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|will the generated bitcoins automatically show up in the gui "Balance"?
1182 2010-12-19 14:06:56 <da2ce7> I found that a -f that isn't a mutiple of 60 works best for my system, but most think that it is silly.
1183 2010-12-19 14:08:13 <da2ce7> Cdh|2, yep after they hava one block confirming them
1184 2010-12-19 14:09:04 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|ok thank you all
1185 2010-12-19 14:10:22 <da2ce7> well anyway, goodnight guys, Hope my latest bounty is a lots of fun! :P We cannot be all serious in the silly season!!!
1186 2010-12-19 14:13:28 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net| GPU load : 99% < unfortunately i have no thermal sensor...
1187 2010-12-19 14:14:13 <ArtForz> huh?
1188 2010-12-19 14:14:27 <ArtForz> old 4-series card ?
1189 2010-12-19 14:14:56 TD has quit (Quit: TD)
1190 2010-12-19 14:14:59 <ArtForz> s/old/small/
1191 2010-12-19 14:15:04 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|bought the card from ebay and the seller put a zalman fan on it which gets connected to the mainboard and has an external potentiometer instead of the card
1192 2010-12-19 14:15:17 TD has joined
1193 2010-12-19 14:15:20 <ArtForz> yeah
1194 2010-12-19 14:15:43 <ArtForz> so... you dont get a core temp reading because of a 3rd party fan ?!?
1195 2010-12-19 14:16:28 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|i think
1196 2010-12-19 14:16:41 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|ERROR - Get temperature failed for the Default Adapter - ATI Radeon HD 4600 Series
1197 2010-12-19 14:17:04 <ArtForz> yeah, 46xxs dont have a core temp sensor I think :/
1198 2010-12-19 14:17:42 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|i had a 4650 before and it had one... but it was very loud so i got the 4670 with pretty silent fan
1199 2010-12-19 14:18:13 <ArtForz> weird
1200 2010-12-19 14:18:44 <Diablo-D3> [09:13:58] <ArtForz> so... you dont get a core temp reading because of a 3rd party fan ?!?
1201 2010-12-19 14:18:46 <Diablo-D3> erm, what?
1202 2010-12-19 14:18:52 <Diablo-D3> I mean, I can see the rpm reading is borked
1203 2010-12-19 14:19:15 dwdollar1 has left ()
1204 2010-12-19 14:19:15 <Diablo-D3> my 4850 has no fan plugged into the fan header, I get temp readings
1205 2010-12-19 14:19:24 <Diablo-D3> (rpm reads 0)
1206 2010-12-19 14:19:49 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|then for the 46xx the only sensor is maybe in the fan and gets read through the fan connector on the card
1207 2010-12-19 14:19:55 <ArtForz> I'd have to check, but I am pretty sure reading 46xx and 47xx (except 4770) had no temp sensor
1208 2010-12-19 14:20:07 <ArtForz> that ... doesnt make any sense
1209 2010-12-19 14:20:14 <Diablo-D3> Cdh|2: fans dont HAVE temp sensors
1210 2010-12-19 14:20:23 <Diablo-D3> its probably that your card just doesnt have a temp sensor
1211 2010-12-19 14:20:27 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|not? oh ok.
1212 2010-12-19 14:20:50 <ArtForz> iirc temp sensor on radeons is on-die
1213 2010-12-19 14:22:14 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|but 4670 is the middle-class performance card, how can it not have a temp sensor?
1214 2010-12-19 14:22:50 <ArtForz> errr... 4670 is more in the upper value segment
1215 2010-12-19 14:23:22 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|that would be 4770 i believe
1216 2010-12-19 14:23:42 <ArtForz> 48xx was performance, 48xx x2 enthusiast
1217 2010-12-19 14:23:52 <Diablo-D3> 48xx is top, 47xx is middle, 46xx is shit
1218 2010-12-19 14:25:15 <ArtForz> well, not shit
1219 2010-12-19 14:25:51 TD_ has joined
1220 2010-12-19 14:25:56 TD has quit (Disconnected by services)
1221 2010-12-19 14:25:56 TD_ is now known as TD
1222 2010-12-19 14:26:01 <ArtForz> shit would be 43xx/45xx
1223 2010-12-19 14:26:35 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|http://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=1721.msg21339#msg21339 hm... -v is not in the help message
1224 2010-12-19 14:27:10 <sjaak> !newpool
1225 2010-12-19 14:27:18 <RichardG> New pooled miner (mining.bitcoin.cz:8332) status: Round started 19/Dec/2010 15:22:41, 60 active workers, 227 shares contributed, 5768979 khash/s
1226 2010-12-19 14:27:23 <ArtForz> they were pretty much only useful for putting "discrete gaming GPU" sticker on a $299 whitebox
1227 2010-12-19 14:30:10 matsh has quit (Quit: Page closed)
1228 2010-12-19 14:30:12 DerrikeG has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1229 2010-12-19 14:30:33 genjix has left ()
1230 2010-12-19 14:30:59 <ArtForz> 4670 = half a 4770
1231 2010-12-19 14:31:18 <ArtForz> and 4770 < half a 4870
1232 2010-12-19 14:32:19 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|in price too
1233 2010-12-19 14:32:41 <ArtForz> yup
1234 2010-12-19 14:33:49 <ArtForz> of course it's all pretty much obsolete hardware anyways
1235 2010-12-19 14:34:31 <helmut> ArtForz: do you happen to know how to get a raw version of the genesis transaction? (raw == byte string)
1236 2010-12-19 14:34:50 <ArtForz> sec
1237 2010-12-19 14:34:57 <helmut> ArtForz: yes, it is in main.cpp, but when I reimplement it, I get a different hash
1238 2010-12-19 14:35:08 <TD> helmut: what are you reimplementing, exactly?
1239 2010-12-19 14:35:09 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|well, it's always hard
1240 2010-12-19 14:35:20 <helmut> TD: construction of genesis transaction
1241 2010-12-19 14:35:21 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|i read that for 68xx there isn't even support on linux
1242 2010-12-19 14:35:27 <ArtForz> wtf
1243 2010-12-19 14:35:36 delta9 has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
1244 2010-12-19 14:35:42 <TD> i'm having trouble with hashes not matching in my client reimplementation too
1245 2010-12-19 14:35:43 <ArtForz> 68xx works fine with cat 10.11 and 10.12 and sdk 2.2 or 2.3
1246 2010-12-19 14:35:52 <helmut> TD: query?
1247 2010-12-19 14:35:55 <TD> i'm starting to suspect there might be some kind of bug in the hHash() function
1248 2010-12-19 14:36:00 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|then it maybe was 69xx... something like that
1249 2010-12-19 14:36:06 <TD> probably not, it's hard to imagine
1250 2010-12-19 14:36:13 <ArtForz> 69xx works with cat 10.12 and sdk 2.3
1251 2010-12-19 14:36:22 <TD> i need to build the official client and debug it :(
1252 2010-12-19 14:38:32 <ArtForz> should be 01000000010000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000ffffffff4d04ffff001d0104455468652054696d65732030332f4a616e2f32303039204368616e63656c6c6f72206f6e206272696e6b206f66207365636f6e64206261696c6f757420666f722062616e6b73ffffffff0100f2052a01000000434104678afdb0fe5548271967f1a67130b7105cd6a828e03909a67962e0ea1f61deb649f6bc3f4cef38c4f35504e51ec112de5c384df7ba0b8d578a4c702b6bf11d5fac00000000 ... I think
1253 2010-12-19 14:39:28 <ArtForz> sec
1254 2010-12-19 14:40:04 <ArtForz> yeah, that should be it
1255 2010-12-19 14:43:52 altamic has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
1256 2010-12-19 14:44:07 <helmut> ArtForz: thank you very much again
1257 2010-12-19 14:44:47 gavinandresen has quit (Quit: gavinandresen)
1258 2010-12-19 14:49:46 <helmut> ArtForz: indeed it is different than mine, very subtle, didn't find the difference yet
1259 2010-12-19 14:56:23 Tester has joined
1260 2010-12-19 14:57:40 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|maybe amd just doesn't put much work in 4xxx drivers anymore and rather makes newer cards work...
1261 2010-12-19 14:58:57 Zarutian has joined
1262 2010-12-19 15:00:14 Tester has quit (Client Quit)
1263 2010-12-19 15:00:26 <helmut> ArtForz: I somehow used sequence=0 instead of -1. now it matches. thank you very much.
1264 2010-12-19 15:01:23 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|yay: amdcccle: malloc.c:4636: _int_malloc: Assertion `victim->fd_nextsize->bk_nextsize == victim' failed.
1265 2010-12-19 15:02:21 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|seems to be a bit hypocritical to me to flame about nvidia drivers being buggy when amd is no better
1266 2010-12-19 15:03:40 * helmut uses nouveau. it's rock solid.
1267 2010-12-19 15:04:22 gavinandresen has joined
1268 2010-12-19 15:06:05 <Kiba> I dreamt of ESR and bitcoin
1269 2010-12-19 15:08:35 <ArtForz> equivalent series resistance?
1270 2010-12-19 15:08:35 <helmut> is there any non-mainline implementation that can verify transactions right now?
1271 2010-12-19 15:09:03 [Noodles] has joined
1272 2010-12-19 15:09:24 <MT`AwAy> gah
1273 2010-12-19 15:09:29 <MT`AwAy> kiba fixed the page while I was fixing it
1274 2010-12-19 15:09:30 <MT`AwAy> xD
1275 2010-12-19 15:09:33 <helmut> hi MT
1276 2010-12-19 15:09:45 <MT`AwAy> ah no
1277 2010-12-19 15:09:48 <MT`AwAy> just changed one thing
1278 2010-12-19 15:09:50 <MT`AwAy> hi helmut
1279 2010-12-19 15:10:09 <xelister> Cdh|2: Ati is worse
1280 2010-12-19 15:10:24 <xelister> Cdh|2: Ati drivers crap out x10 more (hangs, glitches) then nvidia
1281 2010-12-19 15:10:32 <xelister> (comparing the binary drivers)
1282 2010-12-19 15:11:56 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|yes
1283 2010-12-19 15:12:07 <Cdh> 2!~cdh@p57B44CB1.dip.t-dialin.net|vaapi even <defunct>'ed my X once
1284 2010-12-19 15:13:14 AAA_awright_ has joined
1285 2010-12-19 15:14:50 <helmut> is the first transaction in a block always the one assigning the generated coins?
1286 2010-12-19 15:15:16 AAA_awright has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
1287 2010-12-19 15:16:10 <Kiba> MT`AwAy: the recent change page had disappeared
1288 2010-12-19 15:17:29 <MT`AwAy> Kiba: genjix removed the link
1289 2010-12-19 15:17:44 <MT`AwAy> he said that it may mislead new users
1290 2010-12-19 15:18:12 <Kiba> that's BS
1291 2010-12-19 15:18:17 <MT`AwAy> I think too
1292 2010-12-19 15:18:35 <Kiba> I can't edit pages!
1293 2010-12-19 15:18:55 <Kiba> RecentChange should be renamed Latest Wiki Changes
1294 2010-12-19 15:19:01 <Kiba> err
1295 2010-12-19 15:19:04 <Kiba> I can't patrol pages!
1296 2010-12-19 15:19:19 <MT`AwAy> ok
1297 2010-12-19 15:19:21 <MT`AwAy> I'll re-add it
1298 2010-12-19 15:19:52 <Kiba> I had alway expects RecentChange to be on every wiki
1299 2010-12-19 15:19:59 <Kiba> it confuses wiki users like me
1300 2010-12-19 15:20:06 akem has joined
1301 2010-12-19 15:20:14 akem has quit (Changing host)
1302 2010-12-19 15:20:14 akem has joined
1303 2010-12-19 15:20:14 <MT`AwAy> done
1304 2010-12-19 15:20:21 <MT`AwAy> Kiba: it's back
1305 2010-12-19 15:22:00 darrob has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
1306 2010-12-19 15:26:34 darrob has joined
1307 2010-12-19 15:29:53 puddinpop has joined
1308 2010-12-19 15:38:22 altamic has joined
1309 2010-12-19 15:43:53 <MT`AwAy> https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Main_Page <- here, we got a nice "simple search" input box on topright
1310 2010-12-19 15:44:27 davout has joined
1311 2010-12-19 15:45:01 <altamic> hey davout
1312 2010-12-19 15:46:23 <davout> hey man
1313 2010-12-19 15:46:37 <davout> whats up?
1314 2010-12-19 15:50:11 <helmut> I fear without help, I have to give up on tx verify. is there just any documentation apart from the source?
1315 2010-12-19 15:50:29 <ArtForz> not that I know of
1316 2010-12-19 15:51:04 <helmut> can you tell me what IsCoinBase means?
1317 2010-12-19 15:51:14 <ArtForz> exactly what it says
1318 2010-12-19 15:51:32 <helmut> if that was clear I would not have asked.
1319 2010-12-19 15:51:41 <ArtForz> coinbase = first tx in block, generation + fees to block generator
1320 2010-12-19 15:52:23 <helmut> so coinbase = first tx in block is a requirement?
1321 2010-12-19 15:52:39 <ArtForz> iirc yes
1322 2010-12-19 15:53:06 <helmut> now IsCoinBase cannot possibly know where inside a block it is. it just checks for prevtxhash == 0
1323 2010-12-19 15:53:25 <MT`AwAy> when you generate coins, there is no "in"
1324 2010-12-19 15:53:30 <MT`AwAy> it's the only case where there is no "in"
1325 2010-12-19 15:53:36 <ArtForz> yep
1326 2010-12-19 15:53:40 <gavinandresen> yep
1327 2010-12-19 15:53:41 <MT`AwAy> so there's no previous transaction
1328 2010-12-19 15:53:45 <helmut> so let me conclude:
1329 2010-12-19 15:53:47 <MT`AwAy> and only one such transaction per block is allowed
1330 2010-12-19 15:53:57 <gavinandresen> yep, and it has to be the first transaction.
1331 2010-12-19 15:54:02 <ArtForz> iirc it *has* to be first tx in block
1332 2010-12-19 15:54:05 <helmut> a tx is coinbase iff tx is first transaction in block iff prevtxhash == 0
1333 2010-12-19 15:54:10 <helmut> is this correct?
1334 2010-12-19 15:54:30 <altamic> davout: I am onto a ruby gem for bitcoin
1335 2010-12-19 15:54:31 <gavinandresen> ummm... it is only a VALID coinbase iff tx is first.
1336 2010-12-19 15:55:12 <slush_cz1> davout: We tried few ideas to improve mining on m0mchils and 5970 and it looks m0mchil has some bug regards to submitting task
1337 2010-12-19 15:55:13 <MT`AwAy> helmut: not sure it has to be the first tx, it is because that's how the bitcoin client behaves
1338 2010-12-19 15:55:23 <gavinandresen> (you could try to put coinbase transactions as the second/third/whatever in a block, but then your block will be rejeceted)
1339 2010-12-19 15:55:25 <helmut> this is why I ask.
1340 2010-12-19 15:55:33 <MT`AwAy> only the sourcecode knows
1341 2010-12-19 15:55:50 <slush_cz1> davout: Looks like it send again and again when submit fail for some reason. I don't solve the reasson itself, but flooding.
1342 2010-12-19 15:55:57 <helmut> well I'll simply reject tx with coinbase not being first tx then
1343 2010-12-19 15:56:27 <slush_cz1> I don't solve the reasson itself, but flooding. => I'm not talking avout reason itself, I keep in mind deadlock, flooding
1344 2010-12-19 15:56:29 <MT`AwAy> helmut: it's not "tx with coinbase" but "tx is coinbase"
1345 2010-12-19 15:56:34 <MT`AwAy> :p
1346 2010-12-19 15:58:35 <helmut> MT`AwAy: correct
1347 2010-12-19 15:58:50 johnyh has joined
1348 2010-12-19 16:03:50 <davout> altamic: nice, what will it be for ? do you want my bitcoind handling code back ? closed the source after accidentaly commiting passwords to my repo
1349 2010-12-19 16:04:17 <davout> slush: so you're saying a bug in momchils miner makes the miner flood your server sometimes ?
1350 2010-12-19 16:04:47 <ArtForz> probably retrying without delay?
1351 2010-12-19 16:04:58 <altamic> davout: it should act as a node
1352 2010-12-19 16:05:14 <davout> altamic: you're writing a full client ??
1353 2010-12-19 16:05:20 <altamic> http://a.yfrog.com/img612/6339/jwj.png
1354 2010-12-19 16:06:19 <slush_cz1> davout: Yes, BitLex told same bug it is doing against origial bitcoind
1355 2010-12-19 16:06:28 <davout> slush: yea
1356 2010-12-19 16:06:37 <davout> slush: saw that in the forum thread
1357 2010-12-19 16:06:58 <davout> slush: did momchil have a look at this problem ?
1358 2010-12-19 16:07:02 <slush_cz1> davout: So I'm waiting to m0mchil, maybe he explain this a little
1359 2010-12-19 16:07:04 Zarutian has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
1360 2010-12-19 16:07:19 <slush_cz1> davout: It is few minutes old information. Did not talk with m0mchil about
1361 2010-12-19 16:07:20 <davout> altamic: thats really cool!! are you planning on opening the source ?
1362 2010-12-19 16:07:28 <altamic> for sure
1363 2010-12-19 16:07:28 <davout> slush: ok
1364 2010-12-19 16:07:52 <altamic> i am trying to add behavoiur to each model
1365 2010-12-19 16:08:00 <helmut> altamic: maybe we should have joined efforts :-/
1366 2010-12-19 16:08:29 <altamic> I am too ignorant
1367 2010-12-19 16:08:29 <davout> helmut: writing a client too ?
1368 2010-12-19 16:08:46 <davout> altamic: need help ?
1369 2010-12-19 16:09:07 <altamic> at the moment bundler makes me crazy
1370 2010-12-19 16:09:14 <helmut> davout: yes
1371 2010-12-19 16:09:23 <altamic> http://pastie.org/1389976
1372 2010-12-19 16:09:38 <helmut> davout: I can download chain, verify chain, verify merkle, store tx. next step: verify tx
1373 2010-12-19 16:11:06 <davout> altamic: do you want your client to be standalone ?
1374 2010-12-19 16:11:07 asdf58 has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1375 2010-12-19 16:11:25 <davout> finally a ruby client coming around, yay!
1376 2010-12-19 16:11:32 <davout> git repos please :)
1377 2010-12-19 16:12:06 xelister has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1378 2010-12-19 16:12:49 <altamic> davout: I am really slow
1379 2010-12-19 16:12:57 <altamic> since I am writing specs
1380 2010-12-19 16:12:58 <helmut> davout: I'm using python :-p
1381 2010-12-19 16:13:18 <helmut> altamic: can you join in at git://github.com/bitcoin/netspec ?
1382 2010-12-19 16:13:34 <altamic> nice
1383 2010-12-19 16:14:14 Zarutian has joined
1384 2010-12-19 16:14:14 <altamic> I am michelangelo-altamore
1385 2010-12-19 16:14:17 <altamic> on github
1386 2010-12-19 16:14:40 <MT`AwAy> ok
1387 2010-12-19 16:14:41 <altamic> I guess you should add me
1388 2010-12-19 16:15:31 <davout> helmut: damn, pÅython, i should have known it, it was too beautiful to be believed, two ruby clients at the same time XD
1389 2010-12-19 16:15:53 <MT`AwAy> altamic: done
1390 2010-12-19 16:15:54 <davout> altamic: what kind of spec ?
1391 2010-12-19 16:16:08 <davout> altamic: rspec?
1392 2010-12-19 16:16:12 <altamic> no minitest
1393 2010-12-19 16:16:16 <altamic> that is compatible
1394 2010-12-19 16:16:20 <MT`AwAy> altamic: https://github.com/bitcoin/netspec
1395 2010-12-19 16:16:24 <altamic> minitest >>>>> rspec
1396 2010-12-19 16:16:33 <MT`AwAy> (the file is synced with mediawiki)
1397 2010-12-19 16:17:58 <davout> altamic: i don't use rspec anyway, a couple of unit test to keep the important stuff working and then, coding
1398 2010-12-19 16:18:20 <altamic> davout: rspec is overrated
1399 2010-12-19 16:18:20 * davout is checking minitest out
1400 2010-12-19 16:20:08 * davout davout thinks it would totally blend
1401 2010-12-19 16:21:19 <davout> altamic: minitest looks nice and simple
1402 2010-12-19 16:21:56 omglolbbq has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
1403 2010-12-19 16:22:33 <altamic> it's a product of a genius
1404 2010-12-19 16:22:41 <altamic> namely Ryan davis
1405 2010-12-19 16:22:47 <altamic> Davis
1406 2010-12-19 16:27:04 brentl has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
1407 2010-12-19 16:28:46 <davout> altamic: i like the skip method :)
1408 2010-12-19 16:29:06 <davout> altamic: so you've started by coding a full minitest suite ?
1409 2010-12-19 16:29:28 <altamic> I've told you
1410 2010-12-19 16:29:42 <altamic> I've got 2 problems
1411 2010-12-19 16:30:18 <altamic> I've still not able to undestand how the C++ code works effectively
1412 2010-12-19 16:30:52 <altamic> so I could build run/debug/run/debug
1413 2010-12-19 16:31:22 <altamic> but it overwhelms me
1414 2010-12-19 16:31:48 <altamic> so I'm trying to talk with a live bitcoin node
1415 2010-12-19 16:32:04 <altamic> if I happen to get something that has a sense
1416 2010-12-19 16:32:09 <helmut> altamic: feel free to bug me with questions. I can probably answer some.
1417 2010-12-19 16:32:10 <altamic> I write down a spec
1418 2010-12-19 16:32:29 <altamic> helmut: thank you
1419 2010-12-19 16:33:14 <altamic> the 2nd problem is that I am too slow
1420 2010-12-19 16:33:37 <helmut> too slow for what?
1421 2010-12-19 16:33:54 <altamic> carrying out the process
1422 2010-12-19 16:34:30 <altamic> I am not satisfied with myself
1423 2010-12-19 16:34:47 <altamic> BTW this can be physcological
1424 2010-12-19 16:35:24 <altamic> since I am not sure how things work
1425 2010-12-19 16:35:28 DerrikeG has joined
1426 2010-12-19 16:35:30 akem has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1427 2010-12-19 16:35:56 <jb55> hey guys, I wrote a simple bitcoin client api wrapper in node.js for anyone interested in writing some node.js bitcoin apps: https://github.com/jb55/node-bitcoin
1428 2010-12-19 16:36:59 omglolbbq has joined
1429 2010-12-19 16:37:21 <altamic> jb55: great
1430 2010-12-19 16:38:02 <jb55> think I'm going to try writing a pool server with it
1431 2010-12-19 16:38:57 <jb55> and maybe a site that lists pool servers and their number of clients, etc
1432 2010-12-19 16:41:17 omglolbbq has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
1433 2010-12-19 16:49:38 gavinandresen has quit (Quit: gavinandresen)
1434 2010-12-19 16:53:16 gavinandresen has joined
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1441 2010-12-19 17:05:03 omglolbbq has joined
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1443 2010-12-19 17:14:17 maximi89 has joined
1444 2010-12-19 17:15:48 AAA_awright has joined
1445 2010-12-19 17:17:31 AAA_awright_ has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
1446 2010-12-19 17:29:55 Tester has joined
1447 2010-12-19 17:31:54 Tester has quit (Client Quit)
1448 2010-12-19 17:32:11 paul0 has joined
1449 2010-12-19 17:46:56 <helmut> uhm. is there any definition about what happens when a real block contains a garbled transaction?
1450 2010-12-19 17:47:18 <DerrikeG> Define garbled
1451 2010-12-19 17:47:25 <ArtForz> it's invalid
1452 2010-12-19 17:48:14 <ArtForz> clients simply ignore blocks containing invalid transactions, see the 0.3.8 overflow TX
1453 2010-12-19 17:48:18 gavinandresen has quit (Quit: gavinandresen)
1454 2010-12-19 17:48:39 <helmut> so if my client has a different idea of invalid then my client will enter a different world?
1455 2010-12-19 17:49:59 <ArtForz> yup
1456 2010-12-19 17:51:18 <MT`AwAy> helmut: unless your client prevails, in which case the original client will be in a different world :p
1457 2010-12-19 17:51:29 <MT`AwAy> all a matter of who's right :p
1458 2010-12-19 17:51:53 <helmut> I wonder what I can verify.
1459 2010-12-19 17:52:06 AAA_awright_ has joined
1460 2010-12-19 17:52:22 <helmut> the block chain probably contains a pile of strange transactions
1461 2010-12-19 17:52:24 <MT`AwAy> also this will lead to new kinds of attacks: if you know merchant X use client Xc which is not widely used, have it split to a different chain by sending it a transaction the normal bitcoin would ignore p
1462 2010-12-19 17:52:26 <MT`AwAy> (refuse)
1463 2010-12-19 17:53:14 <MT`AwAy> and wait for someone with that client to generate a block
1464 2010-12-19 17:53:45 AAA_awright has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
1465 2010-12-19 17:53:47 <helmut> well my client is not indended to generate blocks.
1466 2010-12-19 17:53:56 <ArtForz> actually the main block chain only contains about 3 strange transactions
1467 2010-12-19 17:53:59 * MT`AwAy has started plotting a line with rrdtool based on node count, dunno how it'll look like
1468 2010-12-19 17:54:11 <ArtForz> and those are only strange because they have unusual txout scripts
1469 2010-12-19 17:54:24 <helmut> ArtForz: manually crafted by someone?
1470 2010-12-19 17:54:29 <ArtForz> probably
1471 2010-12-19 17:55:03 <ArtForz> there might be a boatload of invalid blocks, hard to tell as no normal client will store or forward them
1472 2010-12-19 17:55:51 <MT`AwAy> :)
1473 2010-12-19 17:56:50 <helmut> so if we now discover a bug in bitcoin
1474 2010-12-19 17:57:02 <helmut> and fixing this bug would make an old transaction invalid
1475 2010-12-19 17:57:18 <helmut> then we cannot deploy this fix, correct?
1476 2010-12-19 18:00:29 <ArtForz> yep
1477 2010-12-19 18:00:34 <TD> it could be gated on the point in the block chain where deployment of the fix began, maybe?
1478 2010-12-19 18:00:34 <jgarzik> [Noodles]: any chance you have time to verify cpuminer 0.3 speed is roughly similar to 0.2.1 speed?
1479 2010-12-19 18:00:44 <ArtForz> yes
1480 2010-12-19 18:01:11 <ArtForz> thats how we deal with txouts containing craploads of sig checks
1481 2010-12-19 18:01:15 testinggenjix has joined
1482 2010-12-19 18:01:20 <testinggenjix> hddd
1483 2010-12-19 18:01:32 testinggenjix has quit (Client Quit)
1484 2010-12-19 18:01:41 <helmut> they are valid before some date?
1485 2010-12-19 18:01:41 <ArtForz> basically "tx like this is invalid after block X"
1486 2010-12-19 18:01:48 <ArtForz> yep
1487 2010-12-19 18:02:18 <jgarzik> in theory we could restart a new block chain at any point > block 74000. like last time, -eventually- everybody would switch to new chain, invalidating tons of existing transactions.
1488 2010-12-19 18:02:38 <ArtForz> yep
1489 2010-12-19 18:03:20 <ArtForz> 0.3.8 was a non-event because the invalid tx was caught and the bug fixed well before the 120-block delay for generations
1490 2010-12-19 18:04:01 <ArtForz> = new chain starting from the last block before the invalid block overtook the bad chain before any generated coins in the bad chain could be spent
1491 2010-12-19 18:04:26 <[Noodles]> i'm ready, where is it?
1492 2010-12-19 18:05:06 <jgarzik> [Noodles]: is that for me?
1493 2010-12-19 18:05:13 <[Noodles]> uuhm, yep ^.^
1494 2010-12-19 18:05:25 <TD> helmut: i have an ECDSA signature, whether it's correct or not is an open question :-)
1495 2010-12-19 18:05:27 <[Noodles]> if noone else wants it
1496 2010-12-19 18:05:39 <jgarzik> [Noodles]: same place as always: http://yyz.us/bitcoin/cpuminer-installer-0.3.zip
1497 2010-12-19 18:06:00 <TD> get a bumload of warnings from dexopt though. i think i'll have to move my copy of bouncy castle to some alternative package name, sad face
1498 2010-12-19 18:06:15 <jgarzik> base URL, where new files appear, is the expected http://yyz.us/bitcoin/
1499 2010-12-19 18:13:13 <[Noodles]> jgarzik: seems working, 2400khash/core using 4way
1500 2010-12-19 18:13:20 Abhish has joined
1501 2010-12-19 18:13:53 <jgarzik> [Noodles]: great,thanks
1502 2010-12-19 18:18:38 <Kiba> oh god
1503 2010-12-19 18:18:58 <Kiba> Man Economy and the State's first fricking chapter is 79 fricking pages
1504 2010-12-19 18:19:18 <Kiba> that's a lot of ideas to absorb
1505 2010-12-19 18:19:34 <DerrikeG> Kiba: Make yourself pictures and notes.
1506 2010-12-19 18:19:34 <x6763> Kiba: Man, Economy and State is an excellent book
1507 2010-12-19 18:20:05 <Kiba> my impression that this isn't some...
1508 2010-12-19 18:20:16 <Kiba> let say...super long chapter that say little of something
1509 2010-12-19 18:20:47 <Kiba> loooooooooooooots of ideas
1510 2010-12-19 18:20:55 <Kiba> x6763: did you read the whole book?
1511 2010-12-19 18:21:04 <x6763> Kiba: yes
1512 2010-12-19 18:21:08 <Kiba> jesus.
1513 2010-12-19 18:21:13 <x6763> it's not light reading
1514 2010-12-19 18:21:18 <x6763> took me a while
1515 2010-12-19 18:21:33 <x6763> i'm in the middle of Human Action right now
1516 2010-12-19 18:21:50 <x6763> which is a bit more difficult to read
1517 2010-12-19 18:25:20 <Kiba> one thing for sure
1518 2010-12-19 18:25:39 <Kiba> it isn't your fluffy, lightly detailed, unsystematic economic textbook
1519 2010-12-19 18:26:01 <nanotube> jgarzik: so... your cpu miner just stops cold with "json rpc call failed" sometimes... would be nice if it would at retry if a call fails...
1520 2010-12-19 18:26:07 <Kiba> my macroecon textbook is more like a bunch of concepts smashed together
1521 2010-12-19 18:26:21 <jgarzik> nanotube: http://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=1925.msg31675#msg31675
1522 2010-12-19 18:26:26 AAA_awright_ is now known as AAA_awright
1523 2010-12-19 18:26:30 <Kiba> with no overall cohorency
1524 2010-12-19 18:26:49 <x6763> Kiba: yeah, i've never taken a college econ course, but i've looked at a couple of mainstream econ textbooks, and they seemed like a joke
1525 2010-12-19 18:26:56 <nanotube> jgarzik: oooh nice. what is the retry interval?
1526 2010-12-19 18:26:59 * nanotube clones git
1527 2010-12-19 18:27:10 <nanotube> er... pulls from git, into his already existing clone, that is. :)
1528 2010-12-19 18:31:03 akem has joined
1529 2010-12-19 18:35:11 <EvanR> ok git
1530 2010-12-19 18:35:18 <EvanR> well he gave me a tarball
1531 2010-12-19 18:35:39 <EvanR> whas the repo
1532 2010-12-19 18:36:06 <nanotube> http://github.com/jgarzik/cpuminer
1533 2010-12-19 18:36:17 <slush_cz1> jgarzik: Thats great! Thanks for patching!
1534 2010-12-19 18:36:20 <EvanR> git clone ...
1535 2010-12-19 18:36:38 <EvanR> fine, ill look it up myself
1536 2010-12-19 18:36:51 <nanotube> git clone https://github.com/jgarzik/cpuminer.git
1537 2010-12-19 18:37:07 <EvanR> nope
1538 2010-12-19 18:37:10 <nanotube> or git://github.com/jgarzik/cpuminer.git
1539 2010-12-19 18:37:11 <slush_cz1> pool crossed 70 workers right now. Not bad
1540 2010-12-19 18:37:12 <EvanR> same problem
1541 2010-12-19 18:37:23 <nanotube> slush_cz1: nice
1542 2010-12-19 18:37:24 <EvanR> autogen.sh doesnt work on my machine
1543 2010-12-19 18:37:33 <nanotube> EvanR: why not?
1544 2010-12-19 18:37:37 <EvanR> he gave me a special tarball with autoconf already generated
1545 2010-12-19 18:37:42 <nanotube> ah
1546 2010-12-19 18:37:48 <nanotube> well... maybe you should install automake? :)
1547 2010-12-19 18:37:50 <EvanR> configure.ac:48: error: possibly undefined macro: AC_MSG_ERROR
1548 2010-12-19 18:37:56 <EvanR> my automake works fine
1549 2010-12-19 18:38:22 <EvanR> If this token and others are legitimate, please use m4_pattern_allow.
1550 2010-12-19 18:40:36 <nanotube> EvanR: mmm interesting... dunno what's up with that.
1551 2010-12-19 18:41:32 <EvanR> says i need autoconf 2.5x 2.57 or later
1552 2010-12-19 18:41:34 redengin has joined
1553 2010-12-19 18:41:46 <EvanR> i have 2.65
1554 2010-12-19 18:42:02 <EvanR> bigger versions dont mean better apparently ;)
1555 2010-12-19 18:42:39 <nanotube> EvanR: are you on lenny?
1556 2010-12-19 18:43:09 <EvanR> slackware
1557 2010-12-19 18:43:42 <nanotube> hmm... well i have on debian lenny autoconf 2.65-2~bpo50+1 and it works... so dunno if it has to do with version or something else.
1558 2010-12-19 18:44:59 <jgarzik> slackware is always weird, in strange ways.
1559 2010-12-19 18:45:42 <EvanR> never had a problem like this
1560 2010-12-19 18:46:20 <nanotube> jgarzik: i'm running the git head of minerd now... will let you know if it does or does not keep dying with jsonrpc errors. :)
1561 2010-12-19 18:46:32 <EvanR> i ran each of the commands in autogen.sh manually and didnt get an error
1562 2010-12-19 18:46:34 <EvanR> now ill try configure
1563 2010-12-19 18:46:47 <EvanR> k error
1564 2010-12-19 18:46:52 <EvanR> deleting and trying again
1565 2010-12-19 18:47:03 <EvanR> ./configure: line 4274: syntax error near unexpected token `,'
1566 2010-12-19 18:47:09 <EvanR> ./configure: line 4274: `LIBCURL_CHECK_CONFIG(, 7.10.1, ,'
1567 2010-12-19 18:47:12 <EvanR> i hate autotools
1568 2010-12-19 18:48:39 Abhish has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
1569 2010-12-19 18:48:47 <EvanR> yeah autoconf gives me the m4 error
1570 2010-12-19 18:48:50 <EvanR> :(
1571 2010-12-19 18:54:03 <EvanR> jgarzik: so that tarball you gave me was just a distribution of the latsest git?
1572 2010-12-19 18:55:18 bertodsera has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1573 2010-12-19 18:56:33 <jgarzik> EvanR: the tarballs posted at http://yyz.us/bitcoin/ are generated using autotools' "make distcheck" target from the git repo
1574 2010-12-19 18:56:47 <jgarzik> thus creating configure script, so that you don't need autogen.sh.
1575 2010-12-19 18:56:53 <EvanR> right
1576 2010-12-19 18:57:28 <jgarzik> EvanR: LIBCURL_CHECK_CONFIG message means you are missing libcurl's autoconf magic macros
1577 2010-12-19 18:58:09 <EvanR> where are those supposed to by
1578 2010-12-19 18:58:16 <EvanR> ill check for their existence
1579 2010-12-19 18:59:35 <jgarzik> EvanR: who knows where slackware puts them. slackware likes to be different -- which means when it breaks, you get to keep both pieces :)
1580 2010-12-19 18:59:50 Abhish has joined
1581 2010-12-19 19:00:03 * jgarzik has /usr/share/aclocal/libcurl.m4
1582 2010-12-19 19:00:07 <jgarzik> YMMV.
1583 2010-12-19 19:01:26 <EvanR> yeah im missing libcurl.m4
1584 2010-12-19 19:01:31 * EvanR reinstalls
1585 2010-12-19 19:02:05 bertodsera has joined
1586 2010-12-19 19:03:02 <EvanR> (the package comes with slackware, why is it missing autoconf headers >_<)
1587 2010-12-19 19:03:30 <EvanR> er macros
1588 2010-12-19 19:10:50 AAA_awright_ has joined
1589 2010-12-19 19:11:33 AAA_awright has quit (Disconnected by services)
1590 2010-12-19 19:11:40 AAA_awright_ is now known as AAA_awright
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1596 2010-12-19 19:20:45 <xelister> Yet another country wants to 'protect the children' by blocking all internet porn — not just child porn, all porn.
1597 2010-12-19 19:20:57 <xelister> waaat?
1598 2010-12-19 19:21:18 <nanotube> which country is that
1599 2010-12-19 19:21:24 <tcatm> uk?
1600 2010-12-19 19:22:24 slush_cz1 is now known as slush_cz
1601 2010-12-19 19:22:28 <xelister> the second most faggotry semi-imperium
1602 2010-12-19 19:22:54 <DerrikeG> my cinemax, nooo
1603 2010-12-19 19:22:58 <xelister> interestingly, both Freenode and Freenet have unfortunatelly ties / are under UK law (or UK+USA law = totally sucks)
1604 2010-12-19 19:22:59 <Cusipzzz> lol
1605 2010-12-19 19:26:12 Dr_Pangloss has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
1606 2010-12-19 19:26:18 <xelister> which is sad
1607 2010-12-19 19:27:36 twobitcoins has quit (Quit: Leaving)
1608 2010-12-19 19:31:18 <EvanR> freenet? uk blocking all porn?
1609 2010-12-19 19:31:23 <EvanR> this cant be real
1610 2010-12-19 19:32:17 <xelister> belive it baby
1611 2010-12-19 19:32:21 <EvanR> :|
1612 2010-12-19 19:32:55 <xelister> and please think about the children. Children that will grow as slaves in 'nanny'-state... Tell all friends to fight with this idiocity.
1613 2010-12-19 19:33:29 <RichardG> I'm starting to work on bitcoin.it
1614 2010-12-19 19:33:34 <RichardG> will create a stub template
1615 2010-12-19 19:34:53 <xelister> porn in UK, under the fucked up law by old pricks and impotent catholic idiots, will be legal, if you opt-in into it. Yet another area of controll. Perhaps nexct you will need ID card to see porn? Worn on child porn ends, now it is time for normal porn. Next perhaps sex (between adults) will need some ID card or chip? Already sex (by and for adults) is frowned upon on geyphones (eyePhones) so why not. And NEXT, they will come to start war on...
1616 2010-12-19 19:34:54 <xelister> YOU ;)
1617 2010-12-19 19:34:57 <RichardG> ported from wikipedia.
1618 2010-12-19 19:35:13 <xelister> *worn->war
1619 2010-12-19 19:35:29 <RichardG> ...NOT.
1620 2010-12-19 19:35:33 <RichardG> can't seem to create pages
1621 2010-12-19 19:37:05 <RichardG> or edit anything to be precise
1622 2010-12-19 19:37:07 <RichardG> way to go >_<
1623 2010-12-19 19:37:13 warner has joined
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1627 2010-12-19 19:41:32 MJD has joined
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1629 2010-12-19 19:44:14 tg has joined
1630 2010-12-19 19:44:39 <T_X> jgarzik: do know how I could get ./configure to recognise a manual, local build of the libcurl, without installing libcurl system wide?
1631 2010-12-19 19:45:57 <T_X> I have a libcurl-gnutls.so.4.1.1 in the cpuminer folder, is there a way to use that one for the cpuminer build?
1632 2010-12-19 19:46:17 twobitcoins has joined
1633 2010-12-19 19:48:07 <Kiba> xelister: people are more comfortable with good feeling sex than simple violence
1634 2010-12-19 19:48:16 <Kiba> are uncomfortable*
1635 2010-12-19 19:48:26 <RichardG> nevermind, email confirmation.
1636 2010-12-19 19:54:51 <xelister> Kiba: it is ok to go and murder some children (sorry, 'colleteral damage' while looking for the Weapons of Maaaaas Destruuuction®), but no efforts are too much from letting people have sex&fun
1637 2010-12-19 19:55:11 <xelister> *are too much for stopping people from
1638 2010-12-19 19:56:33 <Kiba> I find impegating ladies hot.
1639 2010-12-19 19:56:44 AAA_awright_ has joined
1640 2010-12-19 19:57:03 <Kiba> perhaps their real fear is overpopulation
1641 2010-12-19 19:57:08 RazielZ has quit ()
1642 2010-12-19 19:58:19 <xelister> if only someone would invent methods to controll birth, we could call them birth controll
1643 2010-12-19 19:58:54 <Kiba> Catholics think condoms is dumb
1644 2010-12-19 19:58:55 <xelister> well, untill then, we can stop all this Affricans from having 4 kids (3 of them with HIV), and the immigrants from heaving 8 children (of them 9 registered in sociall care for money bonuses)
1645 2010-12-19 19:58:57 <xelister> no... wait..
1646 2010-12-19 19:59:01 <xelister> <_<
1647 2010-12-19 19:59:06 AAA_awright has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
1648 2010-12-19 19:59:29 <Kiba> people don't like strangers
1649 2010-12-19 19:59:32 MattDrollette has quit (Quit: Leaving.)
1650 2010-12-19 19:59:34 AAA_awright_ is now known as AAA_awright
1651 2010-12-19 19:59:53 <xelister> obviously porn is main reason for huge newborns-per-adult counts for i.e. Affrican people, imigrants, and poor & rural social groups
1652 2010-12-19 20:00:01 <xelister> internet porn specificially
1653 2010-12-19 20:00:25 <Kiba> children viewing porns!
1654 2010-12-19 20:00:32 <Kiba> omg, children having sex!
1655 2010-12-19 20:00:35 <Kiba> and have children!
1656 2010-12-19 20:00:39 <xelister> with no internet porn, birth rate, and ACTUALL RAPE RATE, and btw ACTUALL RAPE ON CHILDREN RATE will jump, like with number of alcoholics during prohibition
1657 2010-12-19 20:00:50 <xelister> erm. typos
1658 2010-12-19 20:01:04 <Kiba> seriously
1659 2010-12-19 20:01:07 <xelister> with no internet porn, birth rate ---> the ACTUALL RAPE RATE, and also ACTUALL RAPE ON CHILDREN RATE - will jump up A LOT\. Like with number of alcoholics during prohibition
1660 2010-12-19 20:01:10 <slush_cz> xelister: INteresting, but little bit offtopic, isn't it? :)
1661 2010-12-19 20:01:13 <Kiba> parents don't want children to ask strange question
1662 2010-12-19 20:01:14 <Kiba> about...
1663 2010-12-19 20:01:15 <Kiba> sex
1664 2010-12-19 20:01:21 <xelister> slush_cz: aawwww, mooom
1665 2010-12-19 20:01:22 finn has joined
1666 2010-12-19 20:01:41 <xelister> slush_cz: but since you bring up your pooled CPU MINER <_<, I remembere,
1667 2010-12-19 20:01:43 <xelister> Tired of POOLED MINING with no result? GET PAID NOW! Doing usefull stuff:) Send pic of "Xelister and bitcoin rock! :*" pen-written: 0.01 BTC on hand; If ur cute girl: 0.05; 0.10 on back or above breasts; 1.00 on them(>18yo!). ~50 BTC for nice girls(PM me). Not faked! 3 nice foto >1MPix. FaceVisible=x2. | Ugly or male? No probl! Ask sister ;) -or- Email Adobe/MS/US gov/China why they're fags(0.03). Real offer:) PM before!
1668 2010-12-19 20:01:56 <Kiba> if they can censor porn, they don't have to worry about strange question
1669 2010-12-19 20:01:59 <slush_cz> :-D
1670 2010-12-19 20:02:08 <xelister> now I should add there some remark about >18yo,notInUK or smth
1671 2010-12-19 20:02:12 MattDrollette has joined
1672 2010-12-19 20:02:45 <xelister> seriously cpu miners, send me picture of your damn hand and you WILL get 0.01 BTC now instead of in few months
1673 2010-12-19 20:03:14 <xelister> :}
1674 2010-12-19 20:03:15 * Kiba once view porn as a 7 years old
1675 2010-12-19 20:03:32 <Kiba> the only problem is that the adults don't explain what porn and sex is after I watch it..
1676 2010-12-19 20:03:37 <xelister> as did many kids
1677 2010-12-19 20:03:48 <Kiba> so we get...misconception
1678 2010-12-19 20:04:58 <xelister> why governemnts, especially oppresive ones
1679 2010-12-19 20:05:02 <xelister> actually have this problem with porn?
1680 2010-12-19 20:05:14 <slush_cz> Kiba: Don't tell it anybody because others will decide that porn in childhood produces antigovernment people :-)
1681 2010-12-19 20:05:18 <slush_cz> (bitcoiners)
1682 2010-12-19 20:05:32 <xelister> do they just want to take away something that all normal people like (while starting first with child porn, then ''child`` porn, and now all porn)
1683 2010-12-19 20:05:50 <xelister> so that they can tech people to take their place
1684 2010-12-19 20:06:11 <Kiba> http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100601181334AA2HKut
1685 2010-12-19 20:06:13 <Kiba> ROFL
1686 2010-12-19 20:06:14 <xelister> slush_cz: most children seen pornographic images
1687 2010-12-19 20:06:28 * xelister 's arbitrary impression
1688 2010-12-19 20:06:29 <slush_cz> xelister: I know. I did it too :-)
1689 2010-12-19 20:06:46 <Kiba> we don't know shit what it means and might try to imitate it
1690 2010-12-19 20:06:53 <xelister> seriously, who here did, and who did not seen any naked boobie, other sexual parts, or very sexual pose (or sexual act) before age of 15 years old?
1691 2010-12-19 20:06:55 <Kiba> might be better if adults are open and honest about it
1692 2010-12-19 20:06:55 * xelister seen
1693 2010-12-19 20:07:11 <xelister> Kiba: seen? not seen?
1694 2010-12-19 20:07:15 <Kiba> seen!
1695 2010-12-19 20:07:25 <xelister> slush_cz: seen?
1696 2010-12-19 20:07:29 <slush_cz> of course
1697 2010-12-19 20:07:35 * xelister (if not then it may explain why you CPU mine lol)
1698 2010-12-19 20:07:43 <slush_cz> funny
1699 2010-12-19 20:07:44 <slush_cz> :)
1700 2010-12-19 20:07:47 <xelister> nanotube: seen?
1701 2010-12-19 20:08:00 <xelister> Grantt: seen?
1702 2010-12-19 20:08:13 <xelister> Diablo-D3: seen?
1703 2010-12-19 20:08:16 <xelister> ArtForz: seen?
1704 2010-12-19 20:09:19 <slush_cz> oh, don't spam. Not important
1705 2010-12-19 20:09:20 <AAA_awright> "seen"?
1706 2010-12-19 20:09:48 <Diablo-D3> [03:05:07] <xelister> seriously, who here did, and who did not seen any naked boobie, other sexual parts, or very sexual pose (or sexual act) before age of 15 years old?
1707 2010-12-19 20:09:53 <xelister> slush_cz: if governments taking your basic rights to make everyone `criminal` is not important, then what is?
1708 2010-12-19 20:09:57 <Kiba> did ya watch pron when ya a kid?
1709 2010-12-19 20:10:00 <Diablo-D3> I lost my virginity around that time, does that qualify?
1710 2010-12-19 20:10:08 <Kiba> wow
1711 2010-12-19 20:10:08 <xelister> Diablo-D3: yea.. :>
1712 2010-12-19 20:10:14 <xelister> btw Diablo-D3 congrats
1713 2010-12-19 20:10:20 <Diablo-D3> also, Im going to bed, night all
1714 2010-12-19 20:10:21 <Kiba> did ya fuck a MILF?
1715 2010-12-19 20:10:35 <xelister> AAA_awright: so, seen?
1716 2010-12-19 20:10:47 wizeman_ has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1717 2010-12-19 20:10:52 <AAA_awright> Actually I just won't ask
1718 2010-12-19 20:11:05 <xelister> you mean, you will not reply?
1719 2010-12-19 20:11:11 <AAA_awright> hm?
1720 2010-12-19 20:11:14 MattDrollette1 has joined
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1722 2010-12-19 20:11:26 <Kiba> when a girl have sex with an older man, she is abused! When a boy score an older woman, he's lucky!
1723 2010-12-19 20:11:30 <Kiba> DOUBLE standard
1724 2010-12-19 20:11:41 <xelister> Kiba: OH NOEZ SEXUAL DISCRIMINATION
1725 2010-12-19 20:11:45 <xelister> lets make there a paritet lol
1726 2010-12-19 20:12:03 <xelister> that reminds me, they really should do partitets in borthles lol :>
1727 2010-12-19 20:12:07 <Kiba> well, having authority and having sex with your students could be considered an abuse of power
1728 2010-12-19 20:12:10 <RichardG> created [[OpenCL miner]] and [[Cpu-miner]]
1729 2010-12-19 20:12:20 <RichardG> will improve [[Cpu-miner]] now
1730 2010-12-19 20:12:26 <Kiba> cooooooooonflict of interests
1731 2010-12-19 20:12:49 <xelister> paritet (what is EN?) == 50% of male and 50% of female eployees
1732 2010-12-19 20:13:03 <xelister> ^--- form of political (over-)corretness
1733 2010-12-19 20:13:42 MattDrollette has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
1734 2010-12-19 20:13:48 <xelister> ^--- well it can make some sense, in /some/ cases. But idiot politicians tend to over use it
1735 2010-12-19 20:14:40 <RichardG> https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Cpu-miner
1736 2010-12-19 20:14:56 Diablo-D3 has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
1737 2010-12-19 20:17:48 wizeman has joined
1738 2010-12-19 20:20:30 wizeman_ has joined
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1740 2010-12-19 20:24:25 <xelister> funny, first few posters here are moral fags http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100601181334AA2HKut
1741 2010-12-19 20:24:31 <xelister> is such moral faggotry popular in USA?
1742 2010-12-19 20:26:06 <DerrikeG> They don't go to that site.
1743 2010-12-19 20:28:05 <slush_cz> Looks like those people on yahoo are from Moon.
1744 2010-12-19 20:28:16 <slush_cz> Try to explain children that he is doing illegal stuff :-D
1745 2010-12-19 20:29:40 <DerrikeG> "if you watch porn when you are young you will become a murder and rapist and probably eat dirt and go blind"
1746 2010-12-19 20:30:55 <slush_cz> !pool
1747 2010-12-19 20:30:56 <RichardG> Pooled miner (91.121.29.91:8335) status (last updated 28mins 26secs ago): 54 clients, 67747 khash/s, next block est. 1wk 1day 23hrs 45mins 44secs
1748 2010-12-19 20:35:04 <nanotube> doublec: you still have your miner running?
1749 2010-12-19 20:35:14 <nanotube> doublec: s/miner/pool/
1750 2010-12-19 20:35:59 Granttt has joined
1751 2010-12-19 20:36:42 <Kiba> xelister: there are 300 million people in the US
1752 2010-12-19 20:36:47 <Kiba> of course there's lot of faggotry
1753 2010-12-19 20:37:57 TD has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
1754 2010-12-19 20:38:06 TD has joined
1755 2010-12-19 20:38:45 <RichardG> a question, I see you all talk about it, but
1756 2010-12-19 20:38:52 <RichardG> does bitcoin REALLY support IPv6
1757 2010-12-19 20:39:26 Grantt has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
1758 2010-12-19 20:45:36 Sherpa has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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1765 2010-12-19 21:20:50 popey_ is now known as popey
1766 2010-12-19 21:21:02 popey has quit (Changing host)
1767 2010-12-19 21:21:02 popey has joined
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1770 2010-12-19 21:27:18 phuzion has joined
1771 2010-12-19 21:39:41 <TD_> does anyone know if there's a block explorer for the test net> ?
1772 2010-12-19 21:40:17 <tcatm> TD_: http://blockexplorer.com/testnet
1773 2010-12-19 21:40:37 <TD_> thanks
1774 2010-12-19 21:40:39 <TD_> hmm
1775 2010-12-19 21:41:29 <xelister> speaking of USA and idiots,
1776 2010-12-19 21:41:34 <xelister> `` she posted a sonogram of our daughter on her Facebook page. Someone actually reported the sonogram (all black and orange of course) because it contained a picture of her "naughty bits" ''
1777 2010-12-19 21:42:37 <Kiba> naughty bit?
1778 2010-12-19 21:43:11 <Kiba> I don't like the word prudish
1779 2010-12-19 21:43:17 <EvanR> claiming that bitcoins are not currency is a little difficult when the h1 element on bitcoin.org contains the words "Bitcoin P2P Virtual Currency" ;)
1780 2010-12-19 21:43:17 <Kiba> because it suggest that they're wise
1781 2010-12-19 21:48:45 <xelister> yea, Kiba
1782 2010-12-19 21:48:47 <EvanR> xelister: are you a dedicated feed to sex-related press/law snafus?
1783 2010-12-19 21:49:13 <Kiba> xelister likes to be outraged
1784 2010-12-19 21:49:21 <Kiba> he get off from being outraged
1785 2010-12-19 21:49:31 <EvanR> how do you FIND so much of this so fast?
1786 2010-12-19 21:49:41 <xelister> EvanR: apparently US/UK gov is (when not bussy making up reasons for opressing foreign countries, e.g. by military invasions)
1787 2010-12-19 21:49:44 <Kiba> Google Alert
1788 2010-12-19 21:49:50 <EvanR> lol
1789 2010-12-19 21:50:16 <Kiba> laws should be predictable
1790 2010-12-19 21:50:20 <Kiba> not changed everywhere
1791 2010-12-19 21:50:26 <Kiba> by an overpaternitstic government
1792 2010-12-19 21:50:27 <xelister> EvanR: tweets, slashdot.org, guardian, registered
1793 2010-12-19 21:50:54 <xelister> and IRC and friends from other freedom and good related IRC channels/technlogies
1794 2010-12-19 21:51:13 <Kiba> I find it more interesting to be in involed in bitcoin
1795 2010-12-19 21:51:16 <xelister> #freenet is also interesting project about freedom
1796 2010-12-19 21:51:24 <Kiba> rather than listening to another dose of bad news
1797 2010-12-19 21:51:26 <Kiba> and moar bad news
1798 2010-12-19 21:51:42 <xelister> bitcoin is being discussed a lot in freedom circles nowdays. in I2p, in freenet. That is a good news ;)
1799 2010-12-19 21:51:56 <Kiba> MT`AwAy: wants to do an interview for your project?
1800 2010-12-19 21:52:08 <Kiba> QBitcoin I mean
1801 2010-12-19 21:53:09 <xelister> Kiba: well, don't get anxiety. Do something. Like, tell friend about this facts... that way 1) you talk to someone 2) probably you will teach someone 3) you will confirm your own ideology with other people 4) one more person to protect freedom (voting, lobbying, etc)
1802 2010-12-19 21:54:12 <Kiba> I don't vote or lobby
1803 2010-12-19 21:54:24 <xelister> why dont vote?
1804 2010-12-19 21:54:32 <Kiba> because democracy tend toward sucide
1805 2010-12-19 21:54:45 <Kiba> I rather let democracy commit sucide than make it temporary last longer
1806 2010-12-19 21:54:54 <xelister> you not voting will not change your country to monoarhy or something
1807 2010-12-19 21:55:17 <Kiba> xelister: it's an inevitable conclusion of democracy
1808 2010-12-19 21:55:44 <xelister> if more people that like freedom will do as you do, you think it will end up, soon (before someone arrests you for taking out your ID-Chip implant), with randomly transforming into some better socieity then democracy?
1809 2010-12-19 21:55:49 <Kiba> it's not that government is corrupt..it's represent the people.
1810 2010-12-19 21:55:58 <Kiba> xelister: naw.
1811 2010-12-19 21:56:09 <xelister> all the evil (e.g. US, UK, China gov) needs to win, is for good people to do nothing
1812 2010-12-19 21:56:23 <Kiba> good people who vote are not contributing anything
1813 2010-12-19 21:56:36 <EvanR> run for office
1814 2010-12-19 21:56:50 <Kiba> with office, I have to deal with politics and make sure I represent the people
1815 2010-12-19 21:57:03 <Kiba> or I get voted out of office
1816 2010-12-19 21:57:08 <EvanR> you know if people did that wed be in better shape
1817 2010-12-19 21:57:26 <Kiba> not everybody can be politically educated or sophisticated
1818 2010-12-19 21:57:37 <Kiba> some people just don't have time for that sort of stuff
1819 2010-12-19 21:57:46 <xelister> make 51% voting population understand (that censorship, porn crazy, wars, killing of children, etc are BAD), and you will have a good government -> win (if there is no good candidate, then make few of them run for the office)
1820 2010-12-19 21:57:54 <Kiba> we shouldn't expect an obligation of them to make sure that they're thinking right
1821 2010-12-19 21:57:59 <EvanR> sounds like the argument for the republic
1822 2010-12-19 21:58:02 <Kiba> xelister: it's an impossiblity
1823 2010-12-19 21:58:22 <Kiba> there's a reason we have specialization and division of labor
1824 2010-12-19 21:58:39 <EvanR> in school we dont
1825 2010-12-19 21:58:43 <Kiba> we don't know everything, we can't know everything, we shouldn't be expected
1826 2010-12-19 21:58:50 <Kiba> EvanR: and they're usually half ass
1827 2010-12-19 21:58:50 <EvanR> which is where people should be learning enough to run the government
1828 2010-12-19 21:59:10 <xelister> what?
1829 2010-12-19 21:59:11 <Kiba> technocracy assume that if you have a well educated government, they will do right.
1830 2010-12-19 21:59:25 <Kiba> that's one half of the equation. You need proper incentives.
1831 2010-12-19 21:59:30 <xelister> you don't need to have 51% of friends to be lawyers to write the actuall better law and implement it
1832 2010-12-19 21:59:38 <xelister> just make them vote for the good principles
1833 2010-12-19 21:59:51 <EvanR> this is an unusal faith in democracy
1834 2010-12-19 21:59:56 <Kiba> how do you incentivizes the population to choose good government officials?
1835 2010-12-19 21:59:58 <xelister> unless you have a better way of seing a good change in your lifespan?
1836 2010-12-19 22:00:10 <Kiba> see? it's an impossiblity. You can't expect the people not to vote themsleves money.
1837 2010-12-19 22:00:10 <xelister> Kiba: start by talking to 3 real life friends
1838 2010-12-19 22:00:19 * Kiba sighs
1839 2010-12-19 22:00:21 <EvanR> xelister: you are only interested in your life span?
1840 2010-12-19 22:00:33 <EvanR> youre almost as bad as politicians who are only interested in their office term
1841 2010-12-19 22:00:36 <Kiba> bitcoin is one of the better way
1842 2010-12-19 22:00:45 <xelister> EvanR: who said *only*
1843 2010-12-19 22:00:46 <Kiba> you don't need to convince them of an political idealogy, educate them about economics
1844 2010-12-19 22:00:56 <xelister> ideal solution would fix things fast (and permanently - also for the children etc)
1845 2010-12-19 22:00:58 <Kiba> and so on
1846 2010-12-19 22:01:03 <Kiba> all you need to do is reach critical mass
1847 2010-12-19 22:01:03 <EvanR> xelister: i figured you meant, at least
1848 2010-12-19 22:01:11 <xelister> Kiba: economics too. but also ideals like freedom
1849 2010-12-19 22:01:16 <Kiba> then they will start accepting bitcoin
1850 2010-12-19 22:01:20 <Kiba> xelister: I am an anarchist....
1851 2010-12-19 22:01:25 <Kiba> you're talking to the wrong person.
1852 2010-12-19 22:01:32 <xelister> Kiba: well, move to some good country then
1853 2010-12-19 22:01:33 <EvanR> what do you think of property rights?
1854 2010-12-19 22:01:39 <xelister> btw, isn't denmark friendly to anarchists etc?
1855 2010-12-19 22:01:41 <Kiba> property right should be like bitcoin
1856 2010-12-19 22:01:47 <Kiba> predictable and unmmutable
1857 2010-12-19 22:01:48 <EvanR> that would be great
1858 2010-12-19 22:01:51 <Kiba> no exceptions
1859 2010-12-19 22:01:54 <EvanR> how do you accomplish that?
1860 2010-12-19 22:01:56 <xelister> indeed Kiba
1861 2010-12-19 22:01:58 <Kiba> I don't know.
1862 2010-12-19 22:01:59 <xelister> good laws are simple laws
1863 2010-12-19 22:02:22 <Kiba> whenever a problem break out
1864 2010-12-19 22:02:25 <EvanR> we can use physical locks and keys to protect physical items
1865 2010-12-19 22:02:30 <Kiba> everyone said "DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT"
1866 2010-12-19 22:02:35 <Kiba> then we get silly laws added to it
1867 2010-12-19 22:02:40 <Kiba> laws become more complex
1868 2010-12-19 22:02:47 <Kiba> and that mean the rule of laws is lost
1869 2010-12-19 22:02:57 <xelister> Kiba: talk to mother fucking 3 friends and explain to them why law needs to be simple :>
1870 2010-12-19 22:03:14 <EvanR> at the bar, most people there are law students. they dont like me ;)
1871 2010-12-19 22:04:08 <EvanR> xelister: what would you say is the minimum working law?
1872 2010-12-19 22:04:22 <Kiba> minimum working law is needless complexity
1873 2010-12-19 22:04:25 <xelister> EvanR: I don't know, its a complex question. it should involve,
1874 2010-12-19 22:04:51 <Kiba> it prevents teenagers from earning bitcoins
1875 2010-12-19 22:05:05 <EvanR> what?
1876 2010-12-19 22:05:06 <xelister> that things that affect only X people in meaningfull way, and all X people agree to do so (freely, under informated consent, not under untypical pressure, etc) - are always legal
1877 2010-12-19 22:05:43 <Kiba> EvanR: minimum wage, child labor, etc
1878 2010-12-19 22:05:48 <Kiba> it infantized teenagers
1879 2010-12-19 22:06:00 <EvanR> fine, thats obviously not included in what i was asking about
1880 2010-12-19 22:06:11 <EvanR> minimal set of laws
1881 2010-12-19 22:06:12 <xelister> Kiba: what do you mean by above?
1882 2010-12-19 22:06:18 <xelister> bbl
1883 2010-12-19 22:06:27 redengin has joined
1884 2010-12-19 22:06:29 <EvanR> the constitution of bitcoinia
1885 2010-12-19 22:06:42 <Kiba> EvanR: the consitution of bitcoinia will arise naturally
1886 2010-12-19 22:06:42 <EvanR> that doesnt require lawyers to interpret
1887 2010-12-19 22:06:44 <Kiba> through agreement
1888 2010-12-19 22:07:00 <Kiba> one of such first agreement is bitcoin
1889 2010-12-19 22:07:09 redengin has quit (Client Quit)
1890 2010-12-19 22:07:11 <Kiba> we agree through using bitcoin that there should only be 21 million bitcoins
1891 2010-12-19 22:08:28 <EvanR> bitcoins is an idealized situation. we dont have to worry about the environment, theft (via violence), greed...
1892 2010-12-19 22:08:30 <Kiba> the markets will provide us with abritation services, ways to make contracts and so on.
1893 2010-12-19 22:08:39 <EvanR> taking more resources than you should
1894 2010-12-19 22:08:45 <Kiba> humans are greedy, it's just channeling
1895 2010-12-19 22:08:55 <Kiba> them into proper incentives
1896 2010-12-19 22:08:57 <Kiba> that's the challenge
1897 2010-12-19 22:09:07 <EvanR> how do you factor environmental damage into the market
1898 2010-12-19 22:09:16 <Kiba> EvanR: property right
1899 2010-12-19 22:09:29 <Kiba> say somebody pollute your part of the river, you get to sue people upstream
1900 2010-12-19 22:09:45 <EvanR> suit? wait, legal system? ;)
1901 2010-12-19 22:10:12 <EvanR> you could charge for polluting the river
1902 2010-12-19 22:10:22 <Kiba> property right is the way to ensure tradegy of the common didn't happen
1903 2010-12-19 22:10:28 <Kiba> EvanR: That could be worked out...
1904 2010-12-19 22:10:37 <Kiba> you could work out collective use agreement...I don't know.
1905 2010-12-19 22:11:32 <EvanR> in bitcoinia, as far as i can tell, when someone breaks an agreement (doesnt pay), you eat it and i guess they lose reputation
1906 2010-12-19 22:11:58 <slush_cz> !newpool
1907 2010-12-19 22:12:00 <RichardG> New pooled miner (mining.bitcoin.cz:8332) status: Round started 19/Dec/2010 22:04:39, 76 active workers, 356 shares contributed, 4591616 khash/s
1908 2010-12-19 22:12:01 <EvanR> but you cant stop them from polluting the river without help
1909 2010-12-19 22:12:30 <EvanR> i just noticed my miner got json_rpc_call failed
1910 2010-12-19 22:12:35 <EvanR> and stopped
1911 2010-12-19 22:13:47 <Kiba> EvanR: boycott
1912 2010-12-19 22:14:22 <EvanR> property right seems to be important here
1913 2010-12-19 22:14:31 <DerrikeG> Burn the houses down
1914 2010-12-19 22:14:43 <Kiba> unnecesary violence
1915 2010-12-19 22:15:37 <DerrikeG> Tenderly deconstruct the houses*
1916 2010-12-19 22:16:38 <Kiba> "that dude pollute the river, don't do business with him!"
1917 2010-12-19 22:16:52 <EvanR> id say if they could pollute your river without your consent, you could get all your friends to stand in the factory and non violently disrupt their operation
1918 2010-12-19 22:16:57 <Kiba> explusion from club, etc
1919 2010-12-19 22:17:05 <EvanR> obviously they dont obey property right to exclude
1920 2010-12-19 22:17:23 <Kiba> EvanR: you don't do that..you could simply not do business with them
1921 2010-12-19 22:17:35 <EvanR> you dont have any power on your own
1922 2010-12-19 22:17:36 <Kiba> the factory wouldn't be able to get its good transported
1923 2010-12-19 22:17:45 <Kiba> and their workers would demand the employer to DO SOMETHING ABOUT
1924 2010-12-19 22:17:54 <Kiba> EvanR: your friends can help you, right?
1925 2010-12-19 22:17:55 <EvanR> transported?
1926 2010-12-19 22:18:03 <EvanR> they dont buy from them anyway
1927 2010-12-19 22:18:06 <EvanR> all they care about is the river
1928 2010-12-19 22:18:15 <nanotube> Kiba: reality check: most people don't have time to stand around boycotting $place 24/7
1929 2010-12-19 22:18:21 <Kiba> the transporters could be incentivized not to transport goods somehow
1930 2010-12-19 22:18:26 <EvanR> how?
1931 2010-12-19 22:18:32 <nanotube> Kiba: reality check #2: business can hire security guys to clear a path to the factory
1932 2010-12-19 22:18:44 <EvanR> security guys cant touch you
1933 2010-12-19 22:18:47 <EvanR> property rights
1934 2010-12-19 22:19:02 <Kiba> hmm
1935 2010-12-19 22:19:09 <Kiba> yeah, finding non-violent solutions can be hard
1936 2010-12-19 22:19:16 <nanotube> EvanR: but neither can you touch them.
1937 2010-12-19 22:19:19 <EvanR> i suggested standing on the factory floor
1938 2010-12-19 22:19:32 <EvanR> nanotube: yeah, theyd have to block the factory for us to stop us getting in ;)
1939 2010-12-19 22:19:33 <nanotube> EvanR: you can't get into the factory - property rights.
1940 2010-12-19 22:19:39 <EvanR> nanotube: i discounted that.
1941 2010-12-19 22:19:41 <Kiba> doesn't other people get affected by the river?
1942 2010-12-19 22:19:47 <EvanR> they factory is polluting Kiba's river
1943 2010-12-19 22:19:48 <Kiba> like other people who live downstream
1944 2010-12-19 22:20:02 <EvanR> yes they do
1945 2010-12-19 22:20:08 <nanotube> i'm just saying, at the end of the day, it's easier for a large player to marshal resources, than for a lot of small players to.
1946 2010-12-19 22:20:17 <nanotube> as a result, large players can rape the small players.
1947 2010-12-19 22:20:25 <EvanR> literally
1948 2010-12-19 22:20:30 <Kiba> the state is a large player
1949 2010-12-19 22:20:32 <nanotube> this has been the case throughout all history.
1950 2010-12-19 22:20:35 <Kiba> and can rape the small player
1951 2010-12-19 22:20:38 <EvanR> if no one gives a shit about other peoples property rights
1952 2010-12-19 22:20:55 <EvanR> in bitcoinia we have alternative physics where property rights are automatically enforced
1953 2010-12-19 22:21:00 <nanotube> yes, unfortunately the state has been coopted by large players. but still it does a fairly decent job protecting the small player, as compared to absence of state.
1954 2010-12-19 22:22:02 <EvanR> Kiba: property rights have problems too, what if i 'own' all the land on earth?
1955 2010-12-19 22:22:23 <EvanR> not only am i incredibly rich for charging rent, no one can compete in a market
1956 2010-12-19 22:22:43 <Kiba> hmm
1957 2010-12-19 22:22:53 <EvanR> looks like there needs to be a way to limit ownership to where theres 'enough for everyone'
1958 2010-12-19 22:23:22 <Kiba> that's a dangerous direction for consideration of only hypothetical scenerio
1959 2010-12-19 22:23:30 <EvanR> yes
1960 2010-12-19 22:23:40 <EvanR> but i could in principle buy all the land incrementally
1961 2010-12-19 22:23:43 <EvanR> getting richer and richer
1962 2010-12-19 22:23:51 <EvanR> thats what the phone company was like
1963 2010-12-19 22:23:58 <Kiba> well, you would need labor to transform your land, EvanR
1964 2010-12-19 22:24:07 <Kiba> you need to make enough money to employ labor
1965 2010-12-19 22:24:17 <EvanR> yes or its already improved and i just bought it, being rich as i am
1966 2010-12-19 22:24:27 <jgarzik> T_X: you pass various environment variables to config, to get it to find libs in non-standard directories
1967 2010-12-19 22:24:32 <Kiba> it is assuming that you can respond to all
1968 2010-12-19 22:24:38 <EvanR> either way i can afford it especially since the land is making mega money
1969 2010-12-19 22:24:38 <Kiba> competitive force
1970 2010-12-19 22:24:49 <jgarzik> T_X: e.g. LDFLAGS=-L/my/local/dir/to/libcurl
1971 2010-12-19 22:24:49 <EvanR> id hire managers
1972 2010-12-19 22:24:51 <Kiba> it's assuming away market dynamics
1973 2010-12-19 22:24:57 <T_X> jgarzik: I somehow managed with some nasty code fiddeling now
1974 2010-12-19 22:24:59 <Kiba> EvanR: managers can be corrupt
1975 2010-12-19 22:25:00 <Kiba> jackass
1976 2010-12-19 22:25:03 <Kiba> and inefficent
1977 2010-12-19 22:25:16 <Kiba> if your company move too slow, it will be outcompeted
1978 2010-12-19 22:25:21 <jgarzik> or corrupt and efficient
1979 2010-12-19 22:25:24 <EvanR> i could establish a sub economy where i get a cut of all transactions
1980 2010-12-19 22:25:28 edcba has joined
1981 2010-12-19 22:25:35 <jgarzik> corruption is just government getting into business
1982 2010-12-19 22:25:37 <Kiba> that is assuming that people want to use your services
1983 2010-12-19 22:25:43 <EvanR> called tax
1984 2010-12-19 22:25:49 <jgarzik> politicians selling a service
1985 2010-12-19 22:25:57 <EvanR> Kiba: they have to, they need a place to live / work / drive
1986 2010-12-19 22:26:04 <EvanR> operate factories
1987 2010-12-19 22:26:06 <EvanR> pollute
1988 2010-12-19 22:26:07 <EvanR> etc
1989 2010-12-19 22:26:09 <EvanR> and i own it
1990 2010-12-19 22:26:22 <Kiba> what if other big company have the same goal as you?
1991 2010-12-19 22:26:27 <EvanR> that would be good
1992 2010-12-19 22:26:28 <T_X> jgarzik: firstly, I've been removing the LIBCURL_CHECK_CONFIG line in ./configure, then hitting ./configure --prefix=/home/user/cpuminer/usr/ (with libcurl stuff being in ~/cpuminer/usr/[lib/include/...]
1993 2010-12-19 22:26:38 <EvanR> but at some point one of us will buy the other
1994 2010-12-19 22:26:39 <Kiba> they would try to outcompete you too
1995 2010-12-19 22:26:47 <Kiba> well
1996 2010-12-19 22:26:47 <EvanR> or merge
1997 2010-12-19 22:26:49 <Kiba> in history
1998 2010-12-19 22:26:57 <T_X> jgarzik: and then editing the #include in two source files for libcurl...
1999 2010-12-19 22:26:58 <Kiba> cartels don't tend to last
2000 2010-12-19 22:27:18 <Kiba> supposed monopolies really aren't monopolies
2001 2010-12-19 22:27:22 <Kiba> monopolies that are get ignored
2002 2010-12-19 22:27:27 <T_X> jgarzik: actually, I had expected the --prefix in configure to be enough, but somehow that alone did not work as expected
2003 2010-12-19 22:27:34 <EvanR> we have a new breed of cartel/monopoly, we dont know how long they will last
2004 2010-12-19 22:27:43 <EvanR> disney, kraft foods, viacom
2005 2010-12-19 22:27:48 <Kiba> Standard Oil was never successful in taking complete utter control...eventually tehy lose out
2006 2010-12-19 22:28:00 <jgarzik> T_X: --prefix is for output (minerd), not input (build libs)
2007 2010-12-19 22:28:06 <Kiba> EvanR: because the government grant them copyright monopoly
2008 2010-12-19 22:28:08 <Kiba> of course
2009 2010-12-19 22:28:10 <EvanR> yes
2010 2010-12-19 22:28:26 <EvanR> well kraft isnt in intellectual property business
2011 2010-12-19 22:29:00 <T_X> jgarzik: hmm, not sure, that one had worked for me for other programs and libs so far, I think. look at the Makefile, the default --libdir is also using [prefix]/lib then
2012 2010-12-19 22:29:10 <altamic> jgarzik: economy is an ecosystem. Finding parasites is subjective to the observer. But one thing is certain: fractional reserve banking is equivalent to economic parasitism.
2013 2010-12-19 22:29:28 <T_X> jgarzik: I think --prefix should be for all, libs, header files etc.
2014 2010-12-19 22:29:37 <EvanR> ron paul wants to return to gold, is he insane?
2015 2010-12-19 22:29:50 <Kiba> Ron Paul wants monentary freedom, not gold.
2016 2010-12-19 22:30:07 <EvanR> he says the dollar should be backed by gold
2017 2010-12-19 22:30:11 <EvanR> among other things
2018 2010-12-19 22:30:20 <Kiba> that's rather sound
2019 2010-12-19 22:30:26 <EvanR> o_O
2020 2010-12-19 22:30:36 <RichardG> anyone here has a bitcoind compile for CentOS newer than 0.3.12
2021 2010-12-19 22:30:52 <Kiba> EvanR: why not?
2022 2010-12-19 22:30:59 <EvanR> gold was a big problem
2023 2010-12-19 22:31:06 <Kiba> why is it a big problem?
2024 2010-12-19 22:31:19 <Kiba> the problem is that the government can print money whenever it wants
2025 2010-12-19 22:31:33 <EvanR> the countries ran out of gold at various times
2026 2010-12-19 22:31:35 <utsl> the first great depression was caused by not enough money
2027 2010-12-19 22:31:35 <jgarzik> Fine tuning of the installation directories:
2028 2010-12-19 22:31:36 <jgarzik> --libdir=DIR object code libraries [EPREFIX/lib]
2029 2010-12-19 22:31:43 <jcw9> There isn't enough gold in the world to back the dollar
2030 2010-12-19 22:31:43 <jgarzik> T_X: libdir is install dir
2031 2010-12-19 22:31:46 <Kiba> EvanR: why do they ran out of gold?
2032 2010-12-19 22:31:48 <utsl> that's why the gold standard was abandoned
2033 2010-12-19 22:31:50 <Kiba> jcw9: nonsense.
2034 2010-12-19 22:31:54 <EvanR> Kiba: bankrupted
2035 2010-12-19 22:31:59 <jgarzik> T_X: it appears in Makefile because makefile executes install instructions
2036 2010-12-19 22:32:09 <Kiba> EvanR: of course, governments alway get themsleves bankrupted sooner or later
2037 2010-12-19 22:32:13 <jgarzik> T_X: libdir is never added to link flags
2038 2010-12-19 22:32:15 <EvanR> if theres no money, then the wealth of your country cant be traded
2039 2010-12-19 22:32:26 <EvanR> so money doesnt mean wealth
2040 2010-12-19 22:32:26 <T_X> jgarzik: ah! okay
2041 2010-12-19 22:32:27 <jcw9> There isn't enough gold that has been mined
2042 2010-12-19 22:32:38 <Kiba> jcw9: there isn't enough bitcoin!
2043 2010-12-19 22:32:51 <Kiba> 21 million!
2044 2010-12-19 22:32:56 <Kiba> how will we ever do economic calculation?
2045 2010-12-19 22:33:01 <EvanR> depends on how much stuff costs
2046 2010-12-19 22:33:06 <Kiba> dude
2047 2010-12-19 22:33:10 <Kiba> just mince the gold further
2048 2010-12-19 22:33:13 <jcw9> The dollar is an existing standard
2049 2010-12-19 22:33:16 <jgarzik> Installation directories:
2050 2010-12-19 22:33:16 <jgarzik> --prefix=PREFIX install architecture-independent files in PREFIX
2051 2010-12-19 22:33:20 <EvanR> pennies were the smallest
2052 2010-12-19 22:33:30 <EvanR> no micing
2053 2010-12-19 22:33:45 <jgarzik> T_X: you might have the odd configure script out there that adds a "-L${prefix}" on its own, but that is -not- standard autoconf/automake behavior.
2054 2010-12-19 22:33:52 <Kiba> how about the government get out of this...money business
2055 2010-12-19 22:33:53 <nanotube> jcw9: well, it's an existing standard, but it's pretty shitty since it keeps inflating.
2056 2010-12-19 22:33:59 <jgarzik> T_X: GNU people will yell at you for that :)
2057 2010-12-19 22:34:02 <Kiba> and let the free market decide what should be money
2058 2010-12-19 22:34:08 <jgarzik> T_X: breaks cross-compiling, for one thing
2059 2010-12-19 22:34:23 <EvanR> screw GNU
2060 2010-12-19 22:34:41 enoxice has joined
2061 2010-12-19 22:34:44 <jcw9> Inflation can be handy for preventing people from sitting on wealth :) but sure
2062 2010-12-19 22:34:57 <Kiba> what's wrong with sitting on wealth?
2063 2010-12-19 22:34:58 <jcw9> I mean, don't all modern currencies inflate over the long term timescale?
2064 2010-12-19 22:35:05 <Kiba> except bitcoin
2065 2010-12-19 22:35:07 <Kiba> bitcoin doesn't inflate
2066 2010-12-19 22:35:08 <jcw9> yes
2067 2010-12-19 22:35:10 <EvanR> lol
2068 2010-12-19 22:35:39 <EvanR> unless you can directly enjoy the wealth, then its useless to you and everyone
2069 2010-12-19 22:35:41 <EvanR> if you dont trade it
2070 2010-12-19 22:35:50 <Kiba> that's the whole point of money
2071 2010-12-19 22:35:50 <nanotube> jcw9: yes they do, because govts have figured out that inflation is a nice way to impose a hidden tax on the population.
2072 2010-12-19 22:35:51 <EvanR> or rent it
2073 2010-12-19 22:35:54 <Kiba> so you can buy stuff and consume it
2074 2010-12-19 22:36:03 <EvanR> yeah but then you arent sitting on it anymore
2075 2010-12-19 22:36:07 <Kiba> every human being on earth don't make mone yfor the sake of money
2076 2010-12-19 22:36:11 <Kiba> they make it to consume stuff
2077 2010-12-19 22:36:16 <EvanR> yes
2078 2010-12-19 22:36:19 <Kiba> EvanR: it's called Time Preference
2079 2010-12-19 22:36:29 <Kiba> they will, eventually
2080 2010-12-19 22:36:31 <DerrikeG> What happens when bitcoins bzip deflate? The entire economy would compress.
2081 2010-12-19 22:36:40 <EvanR> not if it depreciates ;)
2082 2010-12-19 22:36:41 <nanotube> DerrikeG: haha
2083 2010-12-19 22:37:01 <Kiba> for every miser
2084 2010-12-19 22:37:08 <Kiba> there's a gold digger out there
2085 2010-12-19 22:37:41 <Kiba> it will get spent eventually
2086 2010-12-19 22:37:46 <Kiba> unless they happen to lose their keys
2087 2010-12-19 22:38:00 theymos has joined
2088 2010-12-19 22:38:03 <jcw9> Did you guys see the article about "ghost cities" in china
2089 2010-12-19 22:38:09 <EvanR> or if it is destroyed another way, or if its worthless by the time you want to trade it
2090 2010-12-19 22:38:19 <Kiba> bitcoins aren't lost
2091 2010-12-19 22:38:21 <Kiba> they're
2092 2010-12-19 22:38:23 <Kiba> err
2093 2010-12-19 22:38:26 <Kiba> aren't destroyed
2094 2010-12-19 22:38:27 <EvanR> forgotten ;)
2095 2010-12-19 22:38:28 <Kiba> lost forever
2096 2010-12-19 22:38:43 <jcw9> http://www.businessinsider.com/pictures-chinese-ghost-cities-2010-12
2097 2010-12-19 22:38:54 <Kiba> the blockchain is like
2098 2010-12-19 22:39:10 <Kiba> a big endless series of vault, most of them empty
2099 2010-12-19 22:40:08 <Kiba> maybe
2100 2010-12-19 22:40:17 <Kiba> the wallet should be renamed to keychains
2101 2010-12-19 22:40:29 <Kiba> or keyrings
2102 2010-12-19 22:41:19 <EvanR> non violent protests, ill have to read about that after i go grocery shopping. before i only read about economics
2103 2010-12-19 22:41:41 <Kiba> join the Austrian School study group at the bitcoin forum
2104 2010-12-19 22:41:46 <Kiba> you might learn something
2105 2010-12-19 22:43:00 <EvanR> is that different from mainstream economics
2106 2010-12-19 22:43:02 <DerrikeG> jcw9: That is pretty neat. The Dantu image is weird.
2107 2010-12-19 22:43:56 cosurgi has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
2108 2010-12-19 22:45:08 <Kiba> EvanR: of course it is
2109 2010-12-19 22:45:33 <Keefe> what's the situation with fractional btc cents? (thousandths and smaller)
2110 2010-12-19 22:45:42 <Kiba> but if you want to understand how some of your fellow bitcoiners think, this is it
2111 2010-12-19 22:46:01 <Kiba> Keefe: I think bitcoin nodes accept them but you can't send them
2112 2010-12-19 22:46:20 <Keefe> i recently tried to send someone 52.482 btc with bitcoind command line, but it seems it got rounded to 52.48
2113 2010-12-19 22:46:37 <Keefe> ah
2114 2010-12-19 22:46:38 <tcatm> You could send them but official client rounds to 0.01 BTC
2115 2010-12-19 22:47:04 <EvanR> is there a patch to allow that?
2116 2010-12-19 22:47:05 <Keefe> so the rounding occurred before my client broadcasted the tx
2117 2010-12-19 22:47:18 <Keefe> it's not just a display rounding
2118 2010-12-19 22:47:19 <Kiba> I don't think it do that
2119 2010-12-19 22:47:23 <Kiba> it's just display
2120 2010-12-19 22:47:25 <utsl> Man, if Bhutan could endorse the bitcoin as a legal currency, BTC could be a totally legit currency code
2121 2010-12-19 22:47:32 <Kiba> ROFL
2122 2010-12-19 22:47:35 <EvanR> Keefe: check the bitcoin block viewer?
2123 2010-12-19 22:47:40 <tcatm> It's even worse: If a normal client has to use a smaller fraction coin to send an higher amount the fractional amount will become a fee the miner gets.
2124 2010-12-19 22:47:48 <Keefe> i did, but it could be rounding its display also
2125 2010-12-19 22:47:58 <Keefe> http://blk.bitcoinwatch.com/b?h=97754
2126 2010-12-19 22:48:06 <Keefe> last tx
2127 2010-12-19 22:48:28 <EvanR> Keefe: thats not a display thing
2128 2010-12-19 22:48:32 <EvanR> thats the real data
2129 2010-12-19 22:48:48 <EvanR> so you didnt send fractions of a cent
2130 2010-12-19 22:49:00 <Keefe> if so, then the rounding occurred in my client before broadcasting the tx to the net
2131 2010-12-19 22:49:18 <EvanR> but i did hear in here at one point that subcent transfers get 'eaten' somehow by the network. i dont know if thats true
2132 2010-12-19 22:49:42 <tcatm> http://blockexplorer.com/t/3Q9hLe9vRn That's the transaction.
2133 2010-12-19 22:49:51 <tcatm> Keefe: Yes, your client did the rounding.
2134 2010-12-19 22:50:29 <tcatm> sendtoaddress [..] <amount> is a real and is rounded to the nearest 0.01
2135 2010-12-19 22:54:15 cosurgi has joined
2136 2010-12-19 22:54:22 <EvanR> so much for divisible to eight decimal places ;)
2137 2010-12-19 22:54:49 <EvanR> you know this 'feature' could be affecting the market price
2138 2010-12-19 22:56:29 <tcatm> Another decimal place would be useful as one bitcoin is now worth about $0.20
2139 2010-12-19 22:56:32 <nanotube> Keefe: you can patch your client to not do the rounding if you really want.
2140 2010-12-19 22:56:46 noagendamarket has joined
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2142 2010-12-19 22:57:04 noagendamarket has joined
2143 2010-12-19 22:57:14 <nanotube> Keefe: but you'd be running into the problem of eventually having to send any remainders <0.01 as fees.
2144 2010-12-19 22:57:52 <nanotube> (e.g., if you end up with say, 1.005 coins... and send someone 1btc... you won't get the .005 as change, because getting it would require .01 fee and would be more expensive than just letting it go out as fees)
2145 2010-12-19 23:01:04 <davout> is it just the standard client that prevents sending <0.01 for free ?
2146 2010-12-19 23:01:31 <davout> (as change)
2147 2010-12-19 23:02:05 <nanotube> well it's the standard fee structure that prevents those from being included into the block, too.
2148 2010-12-19 23:02:31 <nanotube> if there are no miners willing to include it in the block.. it'll never get in the chain.
2149 2010-12-19 23:03:06 <da2ce7> G'morning
2150 2010-12-19 23:03:08 <da2ce7> :P
2151 2010-12-19 23:03:17 <nanotube> hey
2152 2010-12-19 23:03:50 <da2ce7> the client should be able to send transactions to 0.001, it will teach people about transaction fees.
2153 2010-12-19 23:06:03 <nanotube> heh
2154 2010-12-19 23:09:19 <noagendamarket> howdy
2155 2010-12-19 23:09:20 <da2ce7> oh yeah, from the above convo. I have no issue about useing violence in defence. For example, using a gun to protect yourself from murder. Law would say that once ones rights have been activly infringed upon, the minimum violence nessecary should be used to activly recover those rights. (such as prossicuting the owner of the poluting company). But this needs to be shown at trial.
2156 2010-12-19 23:09:20 <da2ce7> The commnity must each voluntary put in the resorces for the police, and corts, (and jails). If taxaction is used, then it is inmoral, and the propsed collective action isn't bennifical.
2157 2010-12-19 23:23:04 RichardG has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
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2163 2010-12-19 23:38:24 <TD_> phew
2164 2010-12-19 23:38:36 <TD_> got a java app that can walk and parse the block chain, finally
2165 2010-12-19 23:38:47 <TD_> or at least very nearly can parse. just need to implement reading the scripts.
2166 2010-12-19 23:39:59 <xelister> nice, TD_
2167 2010-12-19 23:40:01 <xelister> you go girl
2168 2010-12-19 23:41:39 <x6763> TD_: nice...yesterday i wrote some clojure code that can pull any block header out of the blk0001.dat file...it doesn't parse the transactions yet, though, or do anything else, for that matter
2169 2010-12-19 23:41:49 TD has quit (Disconnected by services)
2170 2010-12-19 23:41:49 TD_ is now known as TD
2171 2010-12-19 23:42:00 <TD> ah, lisp :)
2172 2010-12-19 23:42:12 <TD> i have an app that talks the wire protocol to a node and downloads the block chain
2173 2010-12-19 23:43:10 <TD> it can understand everything except who a transaction is sending coins to, mostly because that's inside one of these crazy scripts. the enum that defines the opcodes is 139 lines long :(
2174 2010-12-19 23:43:30 <TD> i think i'm going to cheat
2175 2010-12-19 23:43:33 <x6763> haha
2176 2010-12-19 23:44:23 <x6763> i haven't spent anytime learning about the transaction scripts yet
2177 2010-12-19 23:44:33 hawste has joined
2178 2010-12-19 23:45:00 <x6763> i'm probably going to work on some networking code next, before anything else at this point, now that i have somewhat of an understanding of the block structure
2179 2010-12-19 23:45:48 <TD> i wonder how many clients bitcoin is going to end up with at this rate
2180 2010-12-19 23:45:56 <TD> i'm doing java. you're doing clojure. helmut is doing python.
2181 2010-12-19 23:46:42 <x6763> yeah, there's a lot of client code being written...satoshi's code is so hard to understand
2182 2010-12-19 23:46:59 <x6763> i'm mostly interested in doing DNS with Bitcoin or something like it
2183 2010-12-19 23:47:17 <x6763> although i've become very interested in using Bitcoin as a currency, as well
2184 2010-12-19 23:47:36 <TD> i wouldn't say satoshis code is that hard to understand, it's just a really complicated system overall
2185 2010-12-19 23:47:56 <TD> that said .... i'd have coded it a bit differently :)
2186 2010-12-19 23:48:49 <x6763> well, it's hard for me to understand, in part because i don't do much with c++
2187 2010-12-19 23:49:08 <TD> ah yeah. that'd make it harder.
2188 2010-12-19 23:49:21 <TD> i use c++ as part of my job. even so, satoshi doesn't just use c++ .... he uses it cleverly
2189 2010-12-19 23:49:35 <x6763> cool
2190 2010-12-19 23:49:52 <Kiba> Satoshi is one hell of a hacker
2191 2010-12-19 23:50:16 <Kiba> at least for coming up with the concept and merging them together
2192 2010-12-19 23:50:49 <TD> yes
2193 2010-12-19 23:51:07 sgtstein has left ()
2194 2010-12-19 23:51:34 <x6763> my background is mostly python, and in the last year or so, clojure...i've come to love REPLs
2195 2010-12-19 23:51:36 <TD> he clearly knows his stuff, the code makes that clear. the rather difficult state of the client feels more to do with it growing over time without being reorganized
2196 2010-12-19 23:51:59 <TD> it could use being split up into lots of smaller files
2197 2010-12-19 23:52:19 <da2ce7> yes, I think that Satoshi is growing to be a bit of a (well deserved) hero in this community
2198 2010-12-19 23:53:33 <nanotube> x6763: have you seen http://privwiki.dreamhosters.com/wiki/Bitcoin_DNS_System_Proposal
2199 2010-12-19 23:54:03 <jgarzik> he knows C++ very well, which unfortunately implies key things like file formats or network protocol are hidden behind magical statements such as "filein >> *this;" (which reads a block from disk)
2200 2010-12-19 23:54:04 <x6763> i've seen it and have it bookmarked...i haven't read through it yet
2201 2010-12-19 23:54:34 <jgarzik> makes it very difficult to trace, and compiler errors trend towards a page-per-error, with template fun :)
2202 2010-12-19 23:54:46 <nanotube> heh
2203 2010-12-19 23:55:34 <jgarzik> other C++ programmers think the code is organized quite poorly, even if he uses a lot of C++ features correctly
2204 2010-12-19 23:55:35 <TD> jgarzik: yes, the custom serialization is a pain. i talked to him last year about that, he said something like if he'd known about protocol buffers he'd have used them but now it's too late
2205 2010-12-19 23:55:40 hawste has quit ()
2206 2010-12-19 23:55:57 <jgarzik> both boost and STL are all the rage these days
2207 2010-12-19 23:55:59 eureka^ has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
2208 2010-12-19 23:56:01 <TD> in particular the network is effectively little endian from this point on as the client just scrapes off the wire
2209 2010-12-19 23:56:11 <jgarzik> yes
2210 2010-12-19 23:56:40 <jgarzik> given the numbers of end-node (host) machines out there on the Internet, "network byte order" should really be little endian today anyway.
2211 2010-12-19 23:56:41 <TD> the java client is an exercise in pain ...... no unsigned types, endianness moves around depending on which part of the protocol you're in, a custom varint format :-)
2212 2010-12-19 23:56:45 <jgarzik> IMHO, of course.
2213 2010-12-19 23:56:46 <TD> good times
2214 2010-12-19 23:57:13 <TD> oh well
2215 2010-12-19 23:57:19 <TD> fortunately it's not a very big protocol
2216 2010-12-19 23:57:25 <jgarzik> yeah
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2218 2010-12-19 23:58:08 <TD> and probably won't get much bigger, seeing as the core system basically works. it seems likely the interesting stuff from now on will be in the form of alternative clients and integrations into other systems
2219 2010-12-19 23:58:14 <jgarzik> getting the recursive, versioned serialization right the main thing for key data structures and protocol commands.
2220 2010-12-19 23:58:32 <jgarzik> s/the/is the/