1 2011-03-16 00:01:35 reubgr has joined
   2 2011-03-16 00:03:05 <ArtForz> yup, fucking hell
   3 2011-03-16 00:03:48 <ArtForz> mains disconnect relais in UPS is fucked
   4 2011-03-16 00:04:32 theorb has joined
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   6 2011-03-16 00:04:45 theorb is now known as theorbtwo
   7 2011-03-16 00:04:51 <midnightmagic> say someone, say the MM, were to run up the difficulty level by mining well outside of the current hashrate, in essence, grabbing as disproportionately many blocks as possible. once difficulty is up, let the rest of the network slowly work off the high difficulty ratio until it comes down again, and then do it again once the difficulty is low. it strikes me a power-efficient insofar as we ignore time itself as a factor. is there any
   8 2011-03-16 00:04:52 <midnightmagic> thing wrong with this idea?
   9 2011-03-16 00:04:57 <ArtForz> = brownout on at least one phase, UPS tried to disconnect mains and switch to inverter, backfed mains, shut down and tripped breaker
  10 2011-03-16 00:05:15 <ArtForz> midnightmagic: nope, works fine in theory
  11 2011-03-16 00:05:27 <midnightmagic> ArtForz: thank you.
  12 2011-03-16 00:05:37 bitcoinbulletin has joined
  13 2011-03-16 00:05:40 <ZenMondo> does the ratio ever go down?
  14 2011-03-16 00:05:48 <midnightmagic> it looks like it's on its way down now.
  15 2011-03-16 00:05:49 <ArtForz> the what?
  16 2011-03-16 00:05:50 <midnightmagic> ;;bc,stats
  17 2011-03-16 00:05:52 <gribble> Current Blocks: 113671 | Current Difficulty: 76193.9710474 | Next Difficulty At Block: 114911 | Next Difficulty In: 1240 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 3 days, 3 hours, 52 minutes, and 0 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 64651.09826589
  18 2011-03-16 00:06:00 <midnightmagic> oh, sorry. i misread your question.
  19 2011-03-16 00:06:39 <ArtForz> if by ratio you mean difficulty, yes, difficulty can go down, and from the looks of it, it will.
  20 2011-03-16 00:06:46 <luke-jr> thank God
  21 2011-03-16 00:06:47 <luke-jr> :p
  22 2011-03-16 00:06:48 jostmey has joined
  23 2011-03-16 00:06:49 <ZenMondo> Interesting
  24 2011-03-16 00:06:55 * ArtForz thanks God
  25 2011-03-16 00:07:05 <luke-jr> if it went up any more, I'd have to join a pool
  26 2011-03-16 00:07:05 <ArtForz> luke-jr: anything else I can do for you?
  27 2011-03-16 00:07:13 <luke-jr> ArtForz: yes, actually
  28 2011-03-16 00:07:13 <midnightmagic> lol
  29 2011-03-16 00:07:20 <luke-jr> ArtForz: you could shutdown all your miners for a few months
  30 2011-03-16 00:07:38 <luke-jr> I'll even say please
  31 2011-03-16 00:07:38 bitcoinbulletin has quit (Client Quit)
  32 2011-03-16 00:07:53 <midnightmagic> ?! don't suggest that, the independent miners are the only ones putting a confounding factor into the pooled miners' potential to collude.. haha
  33 2011-03-16 00:07:53 <luke-jr> and send you all my bitcoins :o
  34 2011-03-16 00:07:56 <ArtForz> dude, I'm, drunk, not stupid ;)
  35 2011-03-16 00:08:01 <luke-jr> LOL
  36 2011-03-16 00:08:22 <luke-jr> midnightmagic: I'm independent, but if the difficulty went up, I couldn't be anymore
  37 2011-03-16 00:08:39 <midnightmagic> assuming he.. IS independent.. (disapproving look)
  38 2011-03-16 00:11:09 bitcoinbulletin has joined
  39 2011-03-16 00:12:41 <validus> do diff versions of the 6990 have diff stream processes?
  40 2011-03-16 00:13:01 <validus> im seeing one on newegg for 3072 (1536 x 2) Stream Processing Units600126624 , but the rest dont say
  41 2011-03-16 00:14:51 <mizerydearia> So, there have been more than 300 earthquakes in Japan in the last week =/
  42 2011-03-16 00:15:00 <mizerydearia> a couple more today at 6.0+
  43 2011-03-16 00:16:21 ducki2p has joined
  44 2011-03-16 00:16:39 wolfspraul has joined
  45 2011-03-16 00:17:31 Syke has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
  46 2011-03-16 00:17:53 <midnightmagic> validus: that's because they want to sell other models too.
  47 2011-03-16 00:18:06 bitcoinbulletin has quit (Quit: bitcoinbulletin)
  48 2011-03-16 00:18:13 <midnightmagic> validus: but all 6990 have 3072 SPU
  49 2011-03-16 00:18:22 <midnightmagic> validus: as far as I know. I would expect them to.
  50 2011-03-16 00:18:30 <validus> i didnt see it on the details listed on other ones thats why i was curious
  51 2011-03-16 00:18:50 * molecular is in gentoo/libtool/gnome-hell
  52 2011-03-16 00:19:05 doublec has quit (Quit: Leaving)
  53 2011-03-16 00:21:02 <lfm> validus: quite sure they are all the same
  54 2011-03-16 00:21:13 <validus> ok ty
  55 2011-03-16 00:21:23 <ArtForz> so far they are
  56 2011-03-16 00:21:44 <ArtForz> there currently are no non-reference 6990s
  57 2011-03-16 00:21:50 <lfm> they may run slightly different clock speeds if some brave maker does a factory overclock. dunno if there is any on the market tho yet
  58 2011-03-16 00:21:58 <ArtForz> = all exactly the same card, just different stickers
  59 2011-03-16 00:22:21 <ArtForz> and that, mfgs binning the best-OCing cards for "OC editions" and selling the rest as normal
  60 2011-03-16 00:22:40 <ArtForz> which leads to the fun conclusion that buying a non-OC version from a mfg that does that is a bad deal
  61 2011-03-16 00:22:57 <ArtForz> because *on average* you'll get a worse-OCing card
  62 2011-03-16 00:23:30 <midnightmagic> that seems..  a little shady. ha ha.. get it? shady? oh i kill me..
  63 2011-03-16 00:23:59 <ArtForz> I do, too
  64 2011-03-16 00:24:08 * ArtForz kills midnightmagic
  65 2011-03-16 00:24:52 <midnightmagic> paranomasiacs, you knight!
  66 2011-03-16 00:24:56 <ArtForz> bad pun. bad bad pun. no treat for you.
  67 2011-03-16 00:25:46 <ArtForz> hehehe
  68 2011-03-16 00:26:20 <midnightmagic> yeah, i know. i should tell you my great math pun joke! but it requires an image. i'll inkscape it up later and then you can lobby for a ban. :)
  69 2011-03-16 00:27:18 <luke-jr> ok. someone tell me: how do I detect a newly-visible Generated block if I've made 200 transactions since it was generated?
  70 2011-03-16 00:27:29 <luke-jr> not allowed: polling for the entire tx list
  71 2011-03-16 00:28:58 <midnightmagic> factor out the -printblocktree functionality into its own function and rpc call, then make that call and parse the output
  72 2011-03-16 00:36:05 <gavinandresen> luke-jr: listtransactions "" 201 should show it.    I'm thinking listtransactions should show generated blocks before they mature... I might make a patch for that.
  73 2011-03-16 00:36:14 sprash has quit (Quit: Verlassend)
  74 2011-03-16 00:36:56 <da2ce7> G'Morning
  75 2011-03-16 00:37:18 bitcoinbulletin has joined
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  77 2011-03-16 00:37:47 <gavinandresen> Morning?  what, are you in australia or something?
  78 2011-03-16 00:39:31 <Kiba`> hmm
  79 2011-03-16 00:39:52 <Kiba`> gavinandresen: I think it's afternoon over there
  80 2011-03-16 00:41:06 <gavinandresen> 8:40AM in Perth....
  81 2011-03-16 00:41:56 <gavinandresen> Hey Kiba` : you an EconTalk fan?
  82 2011-03-16 00:42:09 <Kiba`> I don't do econTalk
  83 2011-03-16 00:42:32 <luke-jr> gavinandresen: how does my UI know that?
  84 2011-03-16 00:42:55 <luke-jr> I actually tried to do just that (show generated blocks immediately), but for some reason failed
  85 2011-03-16 00:42:57 <da2ce7> gavinandersen, yep I'm in Mebl, Aus
  86 2011-03-16 00:43:12 <gavinandresen> luke-jr: know what?  that you generated a block?  That's why I think listtransactions should show generated blocks before they mature.
  87 2011-03-16 00:43:16 <luke-jr> ok
  88 2011-03-16 00:43:34 <luke-jr> just giving a strong example of why JSON-RPC and polling is not workable :P
  89 2011-03-16 00:43:38 <gavinandresen> da2ce7:  nice, I was born in Melbourne.
  90 2011-03-16 00:44:22 noagendamarket has joined
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  95 2011-03-16 00:58:25 <jgarzik> gavinandresen: you can play with git://github.com/jgarzik/bitcoin.git#autotools
  96 2011-03-16 00:58:32 <jgarzik> gavinandresen: non-GUI and Linux only at present
  97 2011-03-16 00:58:36 knotwork has joined
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  99 2011-03-16 00:58:36 knotwork has joined
 100 2011-03-16 00:58:37 <genjix> can companies issue new shares in the stock market?
 101 2011-03-16 00:58:48 <jgarzik> genjix: the "real" stock market?  yes.
 102 2011-03-16 00:58:57 <genjix> if 1 share entitles a company to 1% of a company, how does that work?
 103 2011-03-16 00:59:07 <gavinandresen> ... but there's a heavily regulated process they must go through
 104 2011-03-16 00:59:09 <gilicorn> AWezom
 105 2011-03-16 00:59:15 <genjix> company issues 100 shares, and then some more...
 106 2011-03-16 00:59:25 <gilicorn> common stock vs. preferred stock
 107 2011-03-16 00:59:32 <gilicorn> different rights
 108 2011-03-16 01:00:41 jostmey has quit (Quit: Page closed)
 109 2011-03-16 01:01:00 jostmeytest has joined
 110 2011-03-16 01:02:52 <luke-jr> genjix: afaik, usually they just double it
 111 2011-03-16 01:03:06 <luke-jr> eg, if they had 100 shares total before, now they have 200 and everyone who held a share has 2x
 112 2011-03-16 01:03:20 <luke-jr> (and they're worth half as much each)
 113 2011-03-16 01:03:37 <genjix> but after you issue a share, you can't go back and change what you wrote...
 114 2011-03-16 01:03:50 <genjix> an issued share is fixed, right?
 115 2011-03-16 01:04:42 <luke-jr> dunno
 116 2011-03-16 01:05:02 <luke-jr> I have a theory.
 117 2011-03-16 01:05:09 <luke-jr> I think OTC may be killing MtGox
 118 2011-03-16 01:05:13 xelister has joined
 119 2011-03-16 01:05:26 <jgarzik> a stock split creates 2,000,000 shares from 1,000,000 shares, where every shareholder receives one additional share, for every share they own.
 120 2011-03-16 01:05:42 <jgarzik> a dilution is simply when a company creates new shares from thin air.  every shareholder's shares are worth just a little bit less.
 121 2011-03-16 01:05:56 <genjix> ok thank
 122 2011-03-16 01:05:58 <genjix> s
 123 2011-03-16 01:06:22 <xelister> I don't get JP.  Main producent of robots and human-like robots and all.  And home of GiTS.  And yet they have only people manually fixing the Fukushima (soon radiation levels at the plant may be leathal for humans).  Why they didnt prepare some robots for *that* tasks
 124 2011-03-16 01:06:28 <molecular> luke-jr, explain
 125 2011-03-16 01:06:52 <luke-jr> molecular: well, if people want to trade, they can just go to OTC and get a better price, without moving the market
 126 2011-03-16 01:06:55 <ArtForz> xelister: because it's *hard*
 127 2011-03-16 01:07:01 <xelister> ArtForz: I know
 128 2011-03-16 01:07:03 <xelister> obviously
 129 2011-03-16 01:07:10 Syke has joined
 130 2011-03-16 01:07:17 <ArtForz> losing a bunch of human workers every few decades is a lot cheaper overall
 131 2011-03-16 01:07:19 <luke-jr> molecular: and as a result, MtGox moves less, and OTC people tend to use it as a point of reference
 132 2011-03-16 01:07:28 <xelister> but you could build some specialized robots e.g. on wheels or spider-like to do specialized task like moving ruble outside,  carrying water
 133 2011-03-16 01:07:34 <ArtForz> sure
 134 2011-03-16 01:07:45 <luke-jr> so inevitably, everyone's price will be "95% of MtGox market" or "105% of MtGox market"
 135 2011-03-16 01:07:52 <xelister> hardest part is to make robot like a human with cool looks and all... why dont they use more automatized vehicles
 136 2011-03-16 01:07:56 <luke-jr> creating an infinite loop that is never filled
 137 2011-03-16 01:08:19 <ArtForz> we've been using robots to inspect/repair chernobyl for over a decade now
 138 2011-03-16 01:08:28 <xelister> ArtForz: I know.  that  is why Im asking :)
 139 2011-03-16 01:08:45 <xelister> I would suspect JP would be the one country to have few such things at standby at own atomic plants
 140 2011-03-16 01:08:52 <xelister> because it is best in this
 141 2011-03-16 01:08:53 <ArtForz> thing is, if you already know the task, building a robot for it is usually quite easy
 142 2011-03-16 01:09:47 <xelister> also.. how the mobile power generators "didnt fit"... they like, missplaced an universal power plug O_o ? didnt had a team of engeeners?  (Im not criticising because probably it is very hard... but asking)
 143 2011-03-16 01:10:04 <ArtForz> I think something got really lost in translation there
 144 2011-03-16 01:10:13 <jgarzik> remotely controlled vehicles are easy.  robots are hard.  :)
 145 2011-03-16 01:10:21 <ArtForz> same difference
 146 2011-03-16 01:10:32 <ArtForz> my only guess is the plant gennys use some really weird voltage/frequency
 147 2011-03-16 01:10:40 <Kiba`> robot's circuits get fried by radiation ya know
 148 2011-03-16 01:10:41 <luke-jr> xelister: my understanding is the plugs were measured in feet diameter
 149 2011-03-16 01:10:50 <ArtForz> iirc they were able to power *some* aux systems with the flown-in generators
 150 2011-03-16 01:10:52 <luke-jr> and the generators were vehicular size
 151 2011-03-16 01:11:00 <ArtForz> Kiba`: not really
 152 2011-03-16 01:11:35 <ArtForz> a micron+ chip can withstand a LOT of radiation
 153 2011-03-16 01:11:38 <Kiba`> hmm
 154 2011-03-16 01:11:42 <Kiba`> the 80s are 30 years ago
 155 2011-03-16 01:11:43 <luke-jr> so yeah… if some multi-foot-diameter plug doesn't fit, you won't easily be able to fix it
 156 2011-03-16 01:11:49 <Kiba`> the 60s is 50 years ago
 157 2011-03-16 01:11:57 <Kiba`> old
 158 2011-03-16 01:12:07 <TheKid> luke-jr: get some speaker cable and solder a quick hack :P
 159 2011-03-16 01:12:10 <genjix> ArtForz: doesn't it depend on the radiation?
 160 2011-03-16 01:12:17 <genjix> how ionising it is
 161 2011-03-16 01:12:33 <luke-jr> TheKid: speaker cable is nowhere near the right gague
 162 2011-03-16 01:12:34 <ArtForz> genjix: well, I was assuming fast+thermal neutron radiation...
 163 2011-03-16 01:12:36 <xelister> also...
 164 2011-03-16 01:12:48 CyanDynamo has quit (Quit: Leaving.)
 165 2011-03-16 01:12:48 <genjix> ok
 166 2011-03-16 01:12:51 <xelister> why they didnt like like use a lot of UPSes ;)
 167 2011-03-16 01:12:59 <xelister> ok Im joking with UPSes, but some battery system
 168 2011-03-16 01:13:04 <luke-jr> they did
 169 2011-03-16 01:13:05 <ArtForz> they did have one
 170 2011-03-16 01:13:05 <genjix> and also circuits would be shielded from alpha particles anyway
 171 2011-03-16 01:13:07 <TheKid> luke-jr: I know, joke
 172 2011-03-16 01:13:07 <luke-jr> it lasted 8 hours
 173 2011-03-16 01:13:09 <ArtForz> it lasted 8 hours
 174 2011-03-16 01:13:11 <xelister> =)
 175 2011-03-16 01:13:20 <luke-jr> ArtForz: copycat
 176 2011-03-16 01:13:29 <xelister> should had planned it for as long as it takes to cool down core
 177 2011-03-16 01:13:33 <ArtForz> yeah
 178 2011-03-16 01:13:34 rlifchitz has quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
 179 2011-03-16 01:13:41 gavinandresen has quit (Quit: gavinandresen)
 180 2011-03-16 01:13:43 <ArtForz> not to mention newer plants have a *way* better system
 181 2011-03-16 01:13:44 <luke-jr> xelister: that's what the generators were for
 182 2011-03-16 01:13:54 <TheKid> xelister, the batteries were oh fuck everything is going wrong level of defense
 183 2011-03-16 01:13:57 <Netsniper> http://www.wunderground.com/global/stations/47595.html
 184 2011-03-16 01:13:58 <ArtForz> small auxiliary turbine+generator sets
 185 2011-03-16 01:14:05 <TheKid> the generators and backups should have kicked on
 186 2011-03-16 01:14:07 <TheKid> but they were swamped
 187 2011-03-16 01:14:22 <ArtForz> hint: if the core is hot, it makes steam, which can be used to drive a small low-pressure turbine...
 188 2011-03-16 01:14:25 <luke-jr> xelister: they only designed these plants for 8.2 magnitude
 189 2011-03-16 01:14:30 <luke-jr> not the 5 times bigger 9.0 mag
 190 2011-03-16 01:15:00 <luke-jr> ArtForz: yeah, that one should have been obvious
 191 2011-03-16 01:15:00 <ArtForz> well, so far it looks like the earthquake didnt really do much damage
 192 2011-03-16 01:15:12 <luke-jr> ArtForz: I concur. Tokyo Tower is still standing
 193 2011-03-16 01:15:12 rlifchitz has joined
 194 2011-03-16 01:15:12 rlifchitz has quit (Changing host)
 195 2011-03-16 01:15:12 rlifchitz has joined
 196 2011-03-16 01:15:17 <luke-jr> which means Yuuki might live
 197 2011-03-16 01:15:24 <Kiba`> lol
 198 2011-03-16 01:15:29 <ArtForz> luke-jr: newer BWRs have exactly that as a backup-backup
 199 2011-03-16 01:15:49 <ArtForz> and batteries as a backup-backup-backup
 200 2011-03-16 01:16:11 <TheKid> luke-jr: I'm pretty sure it was 8.9, and that that was a 7x bigger quake
 201 2011-03-16 01:16:21 <xelister> hmm
 202 2011-03-16 01:16:25 <Kiba`> I trust more nuclear plants more than I trust the cab driver or myself in cars
 203 2011-03-16 01:16:28 <TheKid> might be wrong but that's what my source told me
 204 2011-03-16 01:16:36 <xelister> couldnt they just put all generators underground?
 205 2011-03-16 01:16:42 <xelister> or actually, entire plant underground
 206 2011-03-16 01:16:43 <luke-jr> TheKid: it was upgraded to 9.0, and it's 5x
 207 2011-03-16 01:16:46 <xelister> and seall that with concrete
 208 2011-03-16 01:16:52 <TheKid> luke-jr: good to know :)
 209 2011-03-16 01:16:52 <ArtForz> xelister: hindsight, 50/50
 210 2011-03-16 01:16:55 <xelister> then it would totally ignore any tsunami
 211 2011-03-16 01:17:02 <luke-jr> 6.3x to be exact
 212 2011-03-16 01:17:07 <TheKid> yeah, but waves were never expected to get that high up :P
 213 2011-03-16 01:17:09 <Kiba`> xelister: but they would have to be airtight
 214 2011-03-16 01:17:12 kupo has quit (Changing host)
 215 2011-03-16 01:17:12 kupo has joined
 216 2011-03-16 01:17:12 <TheKid>  /far in
 217 2011-03-16 01:17:16 <ArtForz> the location for the backup gens simply wasnt chosen for a *that* big tsunami
 218 2011-03-16 01:17:19 * xelister Cpt Hindisght They Should Build Landing Platform For Helicopters on that roof \o/.
 219 2011-03-16 01:17:20 <Kiba`> what if some poor operator dude is stuck on the surface?
 220 2011-03-16 01:17:29 <luke-jr> xelister: underground would have been hit worse I bet
 221 2011-03-16 01:17:45 <xelister> well ok
 222 2011-03-16 01:17:46 <TheKid> and nuclear all the way. Considering the crazy power of that earthquake and how absolutely nothing bad for the country happened, as opposed to the exploding oil/gas/coal plants, overturned cars, etc
 223 2011-03-16 01:17:54 <TheKid> the only logical choice
 224 2011-03-16 01:17:56 <xelister> but one idea... wouldnt that be not so hard to do
 225 2011-03-16 01:18:07 <luke-jr> TheKid: Germany shutdown all their nuclear plants, I hear
 226 2011-03-16 01:18:13 <ArtForz> errr... no
 227 2011-03-16 01:18:14 <TheKid> luke-jr: ... why?
 228 2011-03-16 01:18:22 <Kiba`> because they're irrational fucktard?
 229 2011-03-16 01:18:22 <ArtForz> they want to shut down the 5 oldest reactors in the next months
 230 2011-03-16 01:18:29 <luke-jr> TheKid: see Kiba`
 231 2011-03-16 01:18:31 <TheKid> that kinda makes sense
 232 2011-03-16 01:18:37 <TheKid> shutting down the old ones
 233 2011-03-16 01:18:38 <xelister> very thick walled pit under the core of concrete-graffite-lead... if core starts to melt, open the door and drop entire core into such 60m pit and fuck it all =) ?
 234 2011-03-16 01:18:40 <TheKid> the big problem with nuclear
 235 2011-03-16 01:18:47 <Kiba`> but they aren't bringing new one online?
 236 2011-03-16 01:18:49 <ArtForz> because those 5 *dont* have dual-redundant cooling
 237 2011-03-16 01:18:52 <TheKid> is that there's only one company that makes the reactor core containment chamber
 238 2011-03-16 01:18:54 <Kiba`> if the use coals, more people will die every year
 239 2011-03-16 01:18:58 <luke-jr> xelister: IIRC the newer ones have something liek that
 240 2011-03-16 01:19:07 <TheKid> xelister: no, that's what the containment chamber is for
 241 2011-03-16 01:19:17 <TheKid> even in the worst case scenarios, the core just melts and it's like a big glow stick
 242 2011-03-16 01:19:26 <TheKid> but nothing gets out
 243 2011-03-16 01:19:27 <Netsniper> coal plants release more radiation than nuclear plants do
 244 2011-03-16 01:19:29 <xelister> TheKid: so why are people about radiating JP, USA etc
 245 2011-03-16 01:19:36 <ArtForz> as in, if external power and the diesel gens fail, they're fucked
 246 2011-03-16 01:19:37 <xelister> I thought that too
 247 2011-03-16 01:19:41 <TheKid> xelister: what?
 248 2011-03-16 01:19:47 <luke-jr> xelister: because they're trying to use it as anti-nuclear propaganda
 249 2011-03-16 01:19:49 <xelister> and now I read some radiation may travell all over ocean even to USA, how
 250 2011-03-16 01:19:54 <ArtForz> and those gens are damn bitchy things
 251 2011-03-16 01:19:59 <xelister> btw, speaking about americafags,
 252 2011-03-16 01:20:13 <xelister> http://i.imgur.com/dlP8X.jpg  :D  (scroll down)
 253 2011-03-16 01:20:18 <TheKid> xelister, that's bullshit >>
 254 2011-03-16 01:20:22 <ArtForz> at one plant they had 1/2 gens fail to start in 25% of startup tests last year
 255 2011-03-16 01:20:46 <TheKid> the only radiation released was some radioactive noble gases and nitrogen
 256 2011-03-16 01:20:54 <TheKid> which all have half lives in the minutes
 257 2011-03-16 01:20:54 <ArtForz> TheKid: nobody knows
 258 2011-03-16 01:20:57 <TheKid> or tens of minutes
 259 2011-03-16 01:20:59 <ArtForz> probably a lot more shit got released
 260 2011-03-16 01:21:13 <ArtForz> they measured *some* Cs and I
 261 2011-03-16 01:21:24 <xelister> lets make startup to convert radiation into electrical power to radeons, we can get JP to seal few such boxes in the cointainment if all else fails =)
 262 2011-03-16 01:21:28 <TheKid> that just means the core casing is melting
 263 2011-03-16 01:21:31 <ArtForz> yep
 264 2011-03-16 01:21:39 <TheKid> which is in the containment chamber
 265 2011-03-16 01:21:46 <ArtForz> so?
 266 2011-03-16 01:22:03 <ArtForz> you still get that shit into the steam, which you have to vent to keep pressure in check...
 267 2011-03-16 01:22:07 <xelister> so abovementioned in picture scenario can not happen?
 268 2011-03-16 01:22:16 <TheKid> xelister, shouldn't be possible
 269 2011-03-16 01:22:21 <ArtForz> so they probably *are* venting a bit more than noble gases
 270 2011-03-16 01:22:21 <xelister> and in practice?
 271 2011-03-16 01:22:30 <xelister> again, why they are venting?
 272 2011-03-16 01:22:41 <xelister> the blown out parts where not so important, ok..
 273 2011-03-16 01:22:47 <ArtForz> to prevent primary pressure vessel from going *BOOM*
 274 2011-03-16 01:22:49 <xelister> so they where venting to protect which part
 275 2011-03-16 01:22:57 <xelister> the main metall boiler thing?
 276 2011-03-16 01:22:59 <ArtForz> yep
 277 2011-03-16 01:23:06 <ArtForz> and the condensing pool
 278 2011-03-16 01:23:12 <xelister> so it was NOT designed to withstand whatever might happen?
 279 2011-03-16 01:23:22 <ArtForz> nope
 280 2011-03-16 01:23:30 <xelister> which part has no chance of being breached?
 281 2011-03-16 01:23:35 <TheKid> http://bravenewclimate.com/2011/03/13/fukushima-simple-explanation/
 282 2011-03-16 01:23:39 <ArtForz> primary containment below pressure vessel
 283 2011-03-16 01:23:40 <luke-jr> also, on this nuclear crap spreading to US nonsense
 284 2011-03-16 01:23:41 <TheKid> the containment chamber
 285 2011-03-16 01:23:44 <luke-jr> WE NUKED JAPAN TWICE
 286 2011-03-16 01:23:50 <luke-jr> did we see any of that fallout?
 287 2011-03-16 01:23:54 <luke-jr> that was INTENTIONAL ever
 288 2011-03-16 01:23:56 <luke-jr> even*
 289 2011-03-16 01:24:27 <ArtForz> thats several feet of graphite+concrete to catch the core in case it *melts* the primary boiler
 290 2011-03-16 01:24:28 <luke-jr> so even when we intentionally make radioactive explosions in Japan, it doesn't come over here and bug is
 291 2011-03-16 01:24:31 <Kiba`> some guys 70 years ago nuked Japan
 292 2011-03-16 01:24:42 <luke-jr> ArtForz: not in those reactors IIRC
 293 2011-03-16 01:24:51 <xelister> well that would be funny, if somehow the evil part of usa, say the gov would rellocate to WA/OR states and people there would evacuate =)
 294 2011-03-16 01:24:52 <luke-jr> Kiba`: that is irrelevant to my point
 295 2011-03-16 01:24:53 <ArtForz> errr... I think so
 296 2011-03-16 01:25:01 <ArtForz> even the old GE BWRs had core catchers
 297 2011-03-16 01:25:26 <xelister> ArtForz: so primary boiler is ok with being melted, but it will be a disaster if it explodes instead?
 298 2011-03-16 01:25:30 <ArtForz> yep
 299 2011-03-16 01:25:49 <TheKid> but there's no reason for it to explode
 300 2011-03-16 01:25:52 <ArtForz> because a steam explosion of that magnitude woudl probably destroy primary containment
 301 2011-03-16 01:26:19 <TheKid> they can vent off steam, and at this point + the days following today, the core has stopped fission
 302 2011-03-16 01:26:25 <ArtForz> yep
 303 2011-03-16 01:26:28 <ArtForz> from the looks of it, they already magaed to crack primary containment in #2
 304 2011-03-16 01:26:33 <TheKid> so once pressure is at a safe level, there's not enough heat
 305 2011-03-16 01:26:41 <TheKid> to continue making steam + pressure
 306 2011-03-16 01:26:42 <ArtForz> probably somewhere around the condensing pool
 307 2011-03-16 01:26:47 <xelister> ArtForz: url
 308 2011-03-16 01:26:49 <xelister> ?
 309 2011-03-16 01:26:58 <ArtForz> can't remember
 310 2011-03-16 01:27:17 <ArtForz> basically "pressure in condensing pool suddenly dropped from 3 atm to ambient"
 311 2011-03-16 01:27:56 <ArtForz> well, where the fuck did that pressure go?
 312 2011-03-16 01:28:08 <ArtForz> if they were venting steam, it wouldnt be unexpected
 313 2011-03-16 01:28:21 <xelister> http://i.imgur.com/OMf7L.png hah.
 314 2011-03-16 01:28:47 <ArtForz> so somehow the condensing pool (which is *inside* of the hermetically sealed primary containment)... lost pressure
 315 2011-03-16 01:29:34 <ArtForz> my best guess is, they tried to avoid blowing off the roof like in #1 and #3, and vented less steam... bad idea
 316 2011-03-16 01:30:06 <xelister> well it went ok with 1 and 3... why not blow roof again woo hoo
 317 2011-03-16 01:30:14 Syke has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
 318 2011-03-16 01:30:48 <ArtForz> well, having your nukes blow up their tin shacks makes for good pictures and bad PR
 319 2011-03-16 01:31:37 semyazza has joined
 320 2011-03-16 01:31:40 Lachesis has joined
 321 2011-03-16 01:32:03 <Lachesis> so is there still no tool like MSI Afterburner that supports "unofficial" overclocking without a flash on Ubuntu?
 322 2011-03-16 01:32:11 <ArtForz> nope
 323 2011-03-16 01:32:14 Xunie has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
 324 2011-03-16 01:32:17 <xelister> oh well... hopefull next reactors will be even better
 325 2011-03-16 01:32:23 <ArtForz> I wouldnt put it beyond a japanese company to risk running the condensing pool beyond rated pressure to avoid another rather harmless but bad-looking hydrogen explosion
 326 2011-03-16 01:32:51 <ArtForz> well, actually more hydrogen deflagration
 327 2011-03-16 01:33:25 <xelister> man this situation is bad
 328 2011-03-16 01:33:35 <xelister> now I bet fucktards at PL will oppose even more buildint A-plant here
 329 2011-03-16 01:33:43 <xelister> and DE
 330 2011-03-16 01:33:43 <ArtForz> xelister: you bet
 331 2011-03-16 01:33:43 jostmeytest has quit (Quit: Page closed)
 332 2011-03-16 01:33:48 <xelister> what is wrong with idiots?
 333 2011-03-16 01:34:03 <ArtForz> erm... they're idiots, duh
 334 2011-03-16 01:34:09 <Kiba`> it's called being humans
 335 2011-03-16 01:34:15 <Kiba`> and humans are not that good at anaylzing risks
 336 2011-03-16 01:34:19 <xelister> "lets produce 857284414 kg of radioactive and cancerous and toxic CO² etc yearly from coal, instead of building (good!) nuclear plant
 337 2011-03-16 01:34:20 <luke-jr> who you calling human?
 338 2011-03-16 01:34:28 <ArtForz> anti-nuke idiots in .de are pretty much jeering
 339 2011-03-16 01:34:36 <xelister> ArtForz: but they won, right?
 340 2011-03-16 01:34:41 <luke-jr> xelister: CO2 is radioactive?
 341 2011-03-16 01:34:42 <ArtForz> yep
 342 2011-03-16 01:34:44 <xelister> de stoped building.using A-plants?
 343 2011-03-16 01:34:48 <ArtForz> yep
 344 2011-03-16 01:34:56 <xelister> luke-jr: sure
 345 2011-03-16 01:35:00 <ArtForz> fucking pussies
 346 2011-03-16 01:35:02 <luke-jr> xelister: we better stop exhaling
 347 2011-03-16 01:35:08 <xelister> but ecofags, like moralfags need simple thinking
 348 2011-03-16 01:35:24 <xelister> Atom energy? ZOMG RADIATION.. CHERNOBYL... THING OF THE CHILDREN!!!!111
 349 2011-03-16 01:35:46 <TheKid> I like the new chinese design
 350 2011-03-16 01:35:47 <TheKid> it's awesome
 351 2011-03-16 01:35:52 <xelister> Free internet? No black listing by centrall gov? OMG PEDOS EVERYWHERE.. LETS castrate every man to be on the safe side - think of the children
 352 2011-03-16 01:35:55 <TheKid> physically cannot melt down
 353 2011-03-16 01:36:02 <gilicorn> test
 354 2011-03-16 01:36:09 <xelister> humanity pisses me off lol
 355 2011-03-16 01:36:26 <xelister> TheKid: which design?
 356 2011-03-16 01:36:31 <ArtForz> I personally would have zero problem putting me and my families ass right next to a nuke plant
 357 2011-03-16 01:36:36 Syke has joined
 358 2011-03-16 01:36:45 <xelister> I would live on the roof of nuclear power plant.
 359 2011-03-16 01:36:49 <gilicorn> as xelister was typing that: a fire reignited at Tokyo Electric Power Co.'s Fukushima Daiichi 4 reactor.
 360 2011-03-16 01:36:54 <xelister> if they let me power all my computers/radeons from it for free =)
 361 2011-03-16 01:36:56 <ArtForz> damn, that would be cool as hell
 362 2011-03-16 01:37:01 <gilicorn> but everything's fine! as contanments explode in the background
 363 2011-03-16 01:37:10 <xelister> gilicorn: lol... url?
 364 2011-03-16 01:37:21 <gilicorn> not enough the nuclear industry thinks boiling water reactors are particularly safe
 365 2011-03-16 01:37:33 <ArtForz> what? who?
 366 2011-03-16 01:37:39 <gilicorn> http://www.nytimes.com/2011/03/16/world/asia/16nuclear.html?_r=1&hp
 367 2011-03-16 01:38:13 <Kiba`> the problem with nuclear power plants is they aren't exactly cheap
 368 2011-03-16 01:38:24 <luke-jr> depends
 369 2011-03-16 01:38:26 <Kiba`> so they want to starve off commisioning
 370 2011-03-16 01:38:35 <Kiba`> decommisioning*
 371 2011-03-16 01:38:41 <xelister> It is too dangerous for workers to get near the reactor, No. 4, to determine exactly what is happening.
 372 2011-03-16 01:38:42 <xelister> WHAAAAAAAAAAAT ?
 373 2011-03-16 01:38:43 <luke-jr> didn't some kid build one in his backyard once?
 374 2011-03-16 01:38:45 <xelister> what.
 375 2011-03-16 01:38:49 <xelister> They have fucking human robots
 376 2011-03-16 01:38:59 <gilicorn> i mean really, the radiation levels near the plants are at like 1 years dosage per hour. do you really expect emergency personell to go into such environments? controlling the meltdown depoends on thousands of workers sacrificing themselves potentially
 377 2011-03-16 01:39:04 <xelister> they couldnt put there say 1000 of isolated cameras?
 378 2011-03-16 01:39:11 <xelister> (own power for 4 weeks, wifi etc)
 379 2011-03-16 01:39:24 <Kiba`> I don't know
 380 2011-03-16 01:39:29 <Kiba`> wouldn't their electronics get fried?
 381 2011-03-16 01:39:35 <xelister> or put there a stupid radio controller car with a camera
 382 2011-03-16 01:39:43 <gilicorn> if the emergency responders decided to evacuate... there woud've been core meltdown in like 5 hours
 383 2011-03-16 01:39:59 <xelister> did explosions destroyed all monitoring cameras there or what
 384 2011-03-16 01:40:02 <Syke> How big is the area for free txs? Can a miner change it?
 385 2011-03-16 01:40:09 <Kiba`> things is not going well for the nuclear plant it seem
 386 2011-03-16 01:40:30 <ArtForz> shrug, so far doesnt look too bad
 387 2011-03-16 01:40:42 <gilicorn> Mr. Ogoda said a proposed plan to use helicopters to put more cold water into the pool was looking unlikely.  <-- acts of desperation
 388 2011-03-16 01:40:50 <ArtForz> actually it now looks more likely
 389 2011-03-16 01:40:56 <luke-jr> Syke: yes. I don't have any room for free tx
 390 2011-03-16 01:41:06 <xelister> Kiba`: base them on optical fiber to transport the image-light directly ("like mirrors/periscopes") nothing to fry
 391 2011-03-16 01:41:08 <ArtForz> the fire managed to melt the roof of the building above #4s storage pools :P
 392 2011-03-16 01:41:23 <xelister> :|
 393 2011-03-16 01:41:24 <ArtForz> so they now think helicopter dropoffs should work
 394 2011-03-16 01:41:31 <Syke> I'm looking at http://blockexplorer.com/b/113585 It's a 100k block with all free tx.
 395 2011-03-16 01:41:38 <gilicorn> well i hope so
 396 2011-03-16 01:41:45 <ArtForz> Syke: yes, miners can change it at will
 397 2011-03-16 01:41:53 * Kiba` imagine seeing American helicopters flying in and saving the day!
 398 2011-03-16 01:41:57 Kiba` is now known as kiba
 399 2011-03-16 01:42:00 <luke-jr> Syke: there's some people doing free-for-all
 400 2011-03-16 01:42:07 <gilicorn> but in the end.. global catastrophe is averted because of a few thousand firefighters basically.. they couldve decided to leave
 401 2011-03-16 01:42:08 * xelister imagines shooting them with rpgs for the lols
 402 2011-03-16 01:42:17 <Syke> and a block like http://blockexplorer.com/b/113673 is someone like luke-jr
 403 2011-03-16 01:42:31 <luke-jr> not that one :P
 404 2011-03-16 01:42:32 <gilicorn> the guys who went into chernobyl died within a week
 405 2011-03-16 01:42:32 <kiba> global catastrophe, gilicorn?
 406 2011-03-16 01:42:35 <xelister> kiba: like that "breave" USA aircraft carier that got the hell out of there because of a mild radiation cloud =) ?
 407 2011-03-16 01:42:37 <kiba> what are you smoking?
 408 2011-03-16 01:42:47 devon_hillard has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
 409 2011-03-16 01:42:50 noagendamarket has joined
 410 2011-03-16 01:42:57 <ArtForz> actually thats again the 5-byte-nonce miner
 411 2011-03-16 01:43:04 <gilicorn> kiba: hundreds of millions would be poisoned if the reactors melted down
 412 2011-03-16 01:43:11 <ArtForz> bullshit
 413 2011-03-16 01:43:21 <gilicorn> all of japan, radioactive plumes wouldve covered the US west coast
 414 2011-03-16 01:43:22 <ArtForz> it seems most people guess that that is compute4cash
 415 2011-03-16 01:43:34 <ArtForz> gilicorn: still bullshit
 416 2011-03-16 01:43:37 <gilicorn> china, russia wouldve gotten plumed
 417 2011-03-16 01:43:38 <Syke> haha, probably. scumbag.
 418 2011-03-16 01:44:11 <luke-jr> gilicorn: just like they did when the US nuked Japan twice?
 419 2011-03-16 01:44:14 <kiba> I can imagine the movie that will come after this!
 420 2011-03-16 01:44:27 <luke-jr> Syke: https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Free_transaction_relay_policy
 421 2011-03-16 01:44:36 <gilicorn> luke-jr: theres way more fuel in the reactors than 2 h-bombs are you kidding
 422 2011-03-16 01:44:48 <ArtForz> gilicorn: and that suddenly all gets airborne... how?
 423 2011-03-16 01:45:00 <xelister> magic
 424 2011-03-16 01:45:03 <ArtForz> it's a reactor. worst case it... melts and sits in a puddle. OMG!
 425 2011-03-16 01:45:12 <gilicorn> radioactive plume
 426 2011-03-16 01:45:14 <luke-jr> lol
 427 2011-03-16 01:45:16 <xelister> mmm puddl
 428 2011-03-16 01:45:29 <xelister> that puddle could breed new forms of life
 429 2011-03-16 01:45:38 <luke-jr> xelister: like that kind NASA discovered?
 430 2011-03-16 01:45:46 <xelister> yea
 431 2011-03-16 01:45:50 <ArtForz> chernobyl was bad because the damn reactor was a fucking engineering clusterfuck
 432 2011-03-16 01:45:50 <gilicorn> chernobyl: . The disaster released at least 100 times more radiation than the atom bombs dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki, and the radioactive plume spread over millions of square miles affecting Scandinavia and the UK.
 433 2011-03-16 01:46:03 <ArtForz> gilicorn: actually large parts of germany as well
 434 2011-03-16 01:46:04 <gilicorn> im surprised you didn't know this
 435 2011-03-16 01:46:07 <luke-jr> http://www.nasa.gov/topics/universe/features/astrobiology_toxic_chemical.html
 436 2011-03-16 01:46:19 <gilicorn> ArtForz: oh, so why are you asking me to explain how radioactive plumes work
 437 2011-03-16 01:46:28 <ArtForz> because it's bullshit
 438 2011-03-16 01:46:33 <Syke> ah, so the non-standard blocks are really only supported by just a subnet.
 439 2011-03-16 01:46:41 <luke-jr> Syke: yeah
 440 2011-03-16 01:46:44 <ArtForz> a BWR that doesnt *explode* doesnt create a massive radioactive plume
 441 2011-03-16 01:46:44 <Syke> at least for relaying purposes
 442 2011-03-16 01:46:51 <luke-jr> Syke: for both
 443 2011-03-16 01:47:03 <gilicorn> weve had lots of explosions already
 444 2011-03-16 01:47:09 <ArtForz> no, we didnt
 445 2011-03-16 01:47:11 <gilicorn> theres no predicting how the meltdown will happen
 446 2011-03-16 01:47:13 <luke-jr> Syke: I'm hosting a free-relay node to help people more easily use them
 447 2011-03-16 01:47:18 <ArtForz> actually there is
 448 2011-03-16 01:47:22 <gilicorn> there were so far 4 major explosions
 449 2011-03-16 01:47:24 <xelister> ArtForz: it is generally belived actually russian engeeneres had good scientific ideas..?
 450 2011-03-16 01:47:24 bitcoiner has quit (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.6.15/20110303024726])
 451 2011-03-16 01:47:33 <ArtForz> xelister: well... I dunno
 452 2011-03-16 01:47:57 <ArtForz> "hey, let's take a fulyl fueled reactor, shut down all cooling, pull out all control rods and see what happens"
 453 2011-03-16 01:48:24 <ArtForz> oh, it violently explodes? who would've guessed...
 454 2011-03-16 01:48:27 <gilicorn> well my point is that all the emergency personell evacuate (why would they want to die of radiation poinsoning?)
 455 2011-03-16 01:48:36 <gilicorn> so no cooling happens
 456 2011-03-16 01:48:53 <luke-jr> gilicorn: why not?
 457 2011-03-16 01:48:57 <Syke> but then once the block is "solved", the rest of the network accepts it?
 458 2011-03-16 01:49:01 <luke-jr> is it somehow worse than dying in a fire?
 459 2011-03-16 01:49:04 <xelister> hmm
 460 2011-03-16 01:49:09 <xelister> wait
 461 2011-03-16 01:49:09 <ArtForz> luke-jr: ... yes.
 462 2011-03-16 01:49:09 <luke-jr> why don't firemen run away when they're called to work?
 463 2011-03-16 01:49:12 <gilicorn> luke-jr: because they remember what happened to the guys who responded to chernobyl - dead in a week
 464 2011-03-16 01:49:16 <xelister> why just not take out all water from primary?
 465 2011-03-16 01:49:25 <gilicorn> luke-jr: firefighters abandon building all the time
 466 2011-03-16 01:49:28 <gilicorn> when its too dangerous
 467 2011-03-16 01:49:30 <xelister> then it would 'just' melt, definatelly not explode
 468 2011-03-16 01:49:37 <ArtForz> yep
 469 2011-03-16 01:49:43 <xelister> so why not?
 470 2011-03-16 01:49:45 <luke-jr> gilicorn: they don't abandon the fire
 471 2011-03-16 01:49:57 <luke-jr> especially not if it stands to burn down the entire region
 472 2011-03-16 01:50:17 <gilicorn> luke-jr: but standing near a fire is nothing like being cooked with radiation
 473 2011-03-16 01:50:21 <ArtForz> you open all relief valves. all water boils off. core melts. unpressurized pressure vessel melts. melted shit drops to concrete floor of primary containment
 474 2011-03-16 01:50:35 <gilicorn> theres a 20km evacuation zone and radiation levels outside the plant are lifetime dosages
 475 2011-03-16 01:50:36 <luke-jr> gilicorn: doesn't change the principle of putting your life at risk to save others
 476 2011-03-16 01:50:41 <xelister> ArtForz: well sounds fun. So is that the current plan?
 477 2011-03-16 01:50:56 <Syke> small fee required, that's ok. no fee required, that's ok too. Someone creating blocks and refusing to include any txs, that's not cool.
 478 2011-03-16 01:51:09 <gilicorn> luke-jr: yeah firefighters take measured risks.
 479 2011-03-16 01:51:10 <ArtForz> well, so far it looks like they still can keep shit cooled
 480 2011-03-16 01:51:31 <xelister> btw why is primary not builded more like a thermos
 481 2011-03-16 01:51:33 <xelister> isolated
 482 2011-03-16 01:51:35 <gilicorn> being near the reactors now isn't safe for anyone..
 483 2011-03-16 01:51:36 <xelister> that wouldnt help?
 484 2011-03-16 01:52:04 <xelister> or in case of problems, sorround core with thermos like coat dual layered with vacuum inside
 485 2011-03-16 01:52:06 <xelister> between
 486 2011-03-16 01:52:11 <ArtForz> gilicorn: "400 times allowed annual dose" != deadly
 487 2011-03-16 01:52:30 <gilicorn> if fukushima melted down it would be around 20 times the amount of fuel chernobyl released
 488 2011-03-16 01:52:30 <ArtForz> and it's not like the workers are standing outside all the time
 489 2011-03-16 01:53:01 <ArtForz> gilicorn: yes. released onto the floor of the primary conrete containment.
 490 2011-03-16 01:53:05 <gilicorn> ArtForz: its a significantly increased mortality theres no question. however, they are getting a years dose in 1 day.. its much worse
 491 2011-03-16 01:53:06 <xelister> gilicorn: if it just melts down, all the fuel stays where it is... just borrows few meters under the ground and stays there
 492 2011-03-16 01:53:23 <ArtForz> gilicorn: those standards are for workplace safety, not lethality ;)
 493 2011-03-16 01:53:29 <gilicorn> if youre lucky. or it builds up in the containment vessle and the pressure causes an explosion
 494 2011-03-16 01:53:46 <ArtForz> gilicorn: exactly that is what you want to avoid at all costs
 495 2011-03-16 01:53:49 <xelister> gilicorn: if pressure valves are open, all steam will just vent out
 496 2011-03-16 01:54:01 <xelister> ArtForz: but then I would say WBRs are NOT safe.
 497 2011-03-16 01:54:02 <gilicorn> xelister: except they had valves which wouldnt open (they had to break them open)
 498 2011-03-16 01:54:07 <xelister> what if there would be no stuff to do all that
 499 2011-03-16 01:54:13 <xelister> e.g. killed in more massive earthquake
 500 2011-03-16 01:54:19 <xelister> or due to terror/military
 501 2011-03-16 01:54:30 <xelister> just kill these 50 people there
 502 2011-03-16 01:54:34 <gilicorn> anyway, once the melt is exposed it starts to evaporate
 503 2011-03-16 01:54:36 <xelister> and JP is destroyed basically
 504 2011-03-16 01:55:01 <xelister> that must be best ever opportunity for any terrorsits right now.  Chopter in 3 guys with guns, shoot 30 workers - and half japan is unhabitable
 505 2011-03-16 01:55:05 <ArtForz> gilicorn: ... no
 506 2011-03-16 01:55:06 <gilicorn> fukushima has 1760 tons of spent fuel lying around, not even in the ractor
 507 2011-03-16 01:55:20 <ArtForz> that didnt happen even at chernobyl
 508 2011-03-16 01:56:40 <gilicorn> nytimes: about 50 tons of nuclear fuel evaporated and were released by the explosion into the atmosphere as finely dispersed particles of uranium dioxide, highly radioactive radionuclides of iodine-131, plutonium-239, neptunium-139, cesium-137, strontium-90, and many other radioactive isotopes.
 509 2011-03-16 01:56:42 <xelister> Im surprised army is not protecting Fukushima area. or is it?
 510 2011-03-16 01:57:13 <ArtForz> ... note the lack of uranium
 511 2011-03-16 01:57:37 <gilicorn> well like 20 radioactive isotopes
 512 2011-03-16 01:58:22 <ArtForz> most of that looks like isotopes created from activating the cladding and other shit
 513 2011-03-16 01:58:38 <ArtForz> most of the metals also didnt make it very far
 514 2011-03-16 01:59:01 <ArtForz> the vast majority that hit europe were isotopes of lighter elements
 515 2011-03-16 02:00:30 <ArtForz> and to get a decent spread you need to *disperse* shit
 516 2011-03-16 02:00:42 <ArtForz> a fucking huge steam explosion and a big fire work pretty well for that
 517 2011-03-16 02:01:21 <ArtForz> chernobyl didnt *have* primary containment
 518 2011-03-16 02:01:28 <xelister> hmm
 519 2011-03-16 02:01:35 <xelister> ArtForz: perhaps they should had just kept the A plant running
 520 2011-03-16 02:01:42 <TheKid> ArtForz: from what I hear those were the byproducts of nuclear decay
 521 2011-03-16 02:01:45 <xelister> and normally power the pumps
 522 2011-03-16 02:01:57 davex__ has joined
 523 2011-03-16 02:01:58 <ArtForz> it was "pressure vessel sits in flimsy concrete+steel shack"
 524 2011-03-16 02:02:06 <xelister> or keep it running at like 5% power or soemthing
 525 2011-03-16 02:02:09 <gilicorn> a couple earthquakes could easily destroy the primary containment at fuku
 526 2011-03-16 02:02:20 <ArtForz> sure
 527 2011-03-16 02:02:23 <xelister> why is water still boiling, but the reactor is not generating electricity?
 528 2011-03-16 02:02:27 <TheKid> xelister: when shit starts to go down, you shut down the plant
 529 2011-03-16 02:02:36 <xelister> ok but water is still boiling
 530 2011-03-16 02:02:38 <TheKid> xelister: radioactive decay of byproducts
 531 2011-03-16 02:02:40 <xelister> why not make power out of it
 532 2011-03-16 02:02:46 <TheKid> which is ending now mostly
 533 2011-03-16 02:02:47 <xelister> to power pumps
 534 2011-03-16 02:02:49 <gilicorn> the fuel generates heat continuously.. at about 6% of its normal output
 535 2011-03-16 02:02:50 <TheKid> not sure why
 536 2011-03-16 02:02:55 <ArtForz> a 8.7 didnt faze it much, a bunch of 6.somethings should work ...
 537 2011-03-16 02:03:31 <gilicorn> ar eyou seeing the flaming inferno and 20km evacuation zone...
 538 2011-03-16 02:03:43 <TheKid> gilicorn
 539 2011-03-16 02:03:49 <ArtForz> errr... yes.
 540 2011-03-16 02:03:49 <TheKid> the fire is on the outside of the containment chamber
 541 2011-03-16 02:03:57 <TheKid> and it's just regular hydrogen
 542 2011-03-16 02:03:57 <xelister> anyone know why not just keep it making electricity from anyway-boiling water, enough to normally power pumps as in normal operation? (and recharge batteries)?
 543 2011-03-16 02:04:01 <TheKid> from a cooling system
 544 2011-03-16 02:04:14 <ArtForz> fire is at #4, which doesnt even have fuel in the pressure vessel
 545 2011-03-16 02:04:22 <ArtForz> xelister: thats what newer BWRs do
 546 2011-03-16 02:04:23 <xelister> I assume it does not need and external (destroyed by tsunami?) facilities
 547 2011-03-16 02:04:30 <xelister> why olds dont?
 548 2011-03-16 02:04:36 <ArtForz> they have small aux steam turbines
 549 2011-03-16 02:04:44 <kiba> because they are older design and sucks more?
 550 2011-03-16 02:04:47 <ArtForz> *inside* primary containment
 551 2011-03-16 02:04:50 <ArtForz> yep
 552 2011-03-16 02:04:53 <xelister> mhm
 553 2011-03-16 02:04:57 <gilicorn> yeah read the news, the primary containment is damaged
 554 2011-03-16 02:04:58 <xelister> yea but with the old one
 555 2011-03-16 02:05:00 <gilicorn> it could breach at any moment
 556 2011-03-16 02:05:04 <xelister> why not just repair the generator part
 557 2011-03-16 02:05:06 <ArtForz> probably retrofitting there is a huge pain, otherwise they probbably woudl've done it
 558 2011-03-16 02:05:11 <TheKid> ArtForz: how do you know so much about this, just reading stuff or do you have a degree past EE?
 559 2011-03-16 02:05:11 <xelister> enough to feed itself the elctrocity
 560 2011-03-16 02:05:15 <ArtForz> gilicorn: read up
 561 2011-03-16 02:05:16 da2ce7 has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
 562 2011-03-16 02:05:16 <xelister> retrofittig?
 563 2011-03-16 02:05:40 da2ce7 has joined
 564 2011-03-16 02:05:42 <gilicorn> he International Atomic Energy Agency reports that the latest explosions at the Fukushima Daiichi nuclear power plant may have breached the primary containment of one reactor
 565 2011-03-16 02:05:42 <ArtForz> TheKid: reading stuff, being inside a fallout zone from chernobyl also helps increase your interest in nuclear stuff ;)
 566 2011-03-16 02:06:01 <Netsniper> http://www.snopes.com/photos/technology/fallout.asp
 567 2011-03-16 02:06:02 <davex__> ;;bc,stats
 568 2011-03-16 02:06:04 <gribble> Current Blocks: 113681 | Current Difficulty: 76193.9710474 | Next Difficulty At Block: 114911 | Next Difficulty In: 1230 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 3 days, 2 hours, 14 minutes, and 30 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 64568.48264353
 569 2011-03-16 02:06:08 <TheKid> ArtForz: oh? Where do you live?
 570 2011-03-16 02:06:25 Syke has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
 571 2011-03-16 02:06:39 <gilicorn> the primary containment could easily be breached if: the pressure inside the vessel isnt managed (they dont even have accurate gauges, valves are failing , etc) or if theres an aftershock.. or if the hydrogen explosion fractures an already warped containment
 572 2011-03-16 02:06:52 <ArtForz> TheKid: .de
 573 2011-03-16 02:06:52 <gilicorn> and of course if the workers left, the cooling would stop and it would blow up
 574 2011-03-16 02:07:02 <gilicorn> there is nothing safe about it
 575 2011-03-16 02:07:04 <TheKid> gilicorn: the workers left at Chernobyl
 576 2011-03-16 02:07:10 <TheKid> people know not to do that again :P
 577 2011-03-16 02:07:18 <xelister> "let's call it a day, bye"
 578 2011-03-16 02:07:21 bk128 has joined
 579 2011-03-16 02:07:27 <ArtForz> we still have to check game for radiation levels around here ...
 580 2011-03-16 02:07:30 <TheKid> so there's no reason to think that the pressure would go unmanaged
 581 2011-03-16 02:07:37 <gilicorn> would you go to work if it meant getting a years worth of radiation in 1 day...
 582 2011-03-16 02:07:40 <TheKid> aftershock could be a small concern
 583 2011-03-16 02:07:51 <TheKid> gilicorn: considering that is still a small amount of radiation?
 584 2011-03-16 02:07:52 <TheKid> yes
 585 2011-03-16 02:08:03 <TheKid> also, radiation protective suits
 586 2011-03-16 02:08:08 <ArtForz> yep
 587 2011-03-16 02:08:13 <ArtForz> also, that level is *outside*
 588 2011-03-16 02:08:19 <xelister> they really should build mechs to do THAT job
 589 2011-03-16 02:08:34 <xelister> not just some stupid robots to give blowjobs or play valleyball
 590 2011-03-16 02:08:46 <xelister> s/blowjobs/show humanlike skinned tits
 591 2011-03-16 02:08:48 <TheKid> also, a hydrogen explosion would just remove the ability to contain radioactive gas
 592 2011-03-16 02:08:51 <TheKid> from within the containment
 593 2011-03-16 02:08:57 <ArtForz> TheKid: yep
 594 2011-03-16 02:09:03 <TheKid> gilicorn: the nuclear plant is the least of Japan's worries
 595 2011-03-16 02:09:15 <ArtForz> well, a hydrogen explosion *inside* primary containment is BAD
 596 2011-03-16 02:09:17 <TheKid> a shitload of other plants have literally EXPLODED
 597 2011-03-16 02:09:21 <TheKid> ArtForz: well, yeah
 598 2011-03-16 02:09:26 <TheKid> but again, see managing pressure levels
 599 2011-03-16 02:09:31 <xelister> TheKid: what plants?
 600 2011-03-16 02:09:32 <ArtForz> which seems to be what happened at #2
 601 2011-03-16 02:09:36 <TheKid> and there are cars everywhere leaking chemicals from batteries
 602 2011-03-16 02:09:45 <bk128> wow, supposedly 5 workers have died already
 603 2011-03-16 02:09:54 <gilicorn> yes.. and theres been a big drop in new tentacle porn  releases
 604 2011-03-16 02:10:01 <ArtForz> I'm more worried about crap from destroyed petro and chem plants being spread all over the place by the tsunami
 605 2011-03-16 02:10:02 <xelister> bk128: in explosion
 606 2011-03-16 02:10:03 justmoon has joined
 607 2011-03-16 02:10:16 <bk128> reactor 2 explosion?
 608 2011-03-16 02:10:17 <xelister> gilicorn: WHAT
 609 2011-03-16 02:10:28 <xelister> drop in tentacle porn?  we must do something for the humanity.
 610 2011-03-16 02:10:37 * xelister puts on a +3 lead hat
 611 2011-03-16 02:10:40 <ArtForz> bk128: #3 I think
 612 2011-03-16 02:10:51 <gilicorn> i agree the devastation from the quake and tsunami is the major human toll.. i think theyll contain the nuclear threat, thanks to the heroic efforts of the emergency crews
 613 2011-03-16 02:10:57 * ArtForz puts on a robe and wizard hat
 614 2011-03-16 02:11:01 <TheKid> gilicorn: http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=7359275n'
 615 2011-03-16 02:11:01 <xelister> TheKid: what with the chemicals? that is not major concern is it
 616 2011-03-16 02:11:07 da2ce7 has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 617 2011-03-16 02:11:22 <TheKid> chemicals from thousands to millions of car batteries?
 618 2011-03-16 02:11:35 <xelister> TheKid: dunno... ok perhaps..
 619 2011-03-16 02:11:41 <xelister> well ha that is what you get..
 620 2011-03-16 02:11:41 <TheKid> sounds significant to me, though to be fair, that could be less of an issue
 621 2011-03-16 02:11:42 <TheKid> still
 622 2011-03-16 02:11:44 <xelister> for using 'green'
 623 2011-03-16 02:11:48 <TheKid> burning oil refineries and coal plants
 624 2011-03-16 02:11:49 <xelister> hybrids instead of normal cars lol
 625 2011-03-16 02:11:58 <ArtForz> xelister: lol
 626 2011-03-16 02:12:00 <TheKid> gilicorn: nuclear is far cleaner and safer than coal and oil
 627 2011-03-16 02:12:03 <TheKid> and natural gas
 628 2011-03-16 02:12:09 <TheKid> try and prove otherwise
 629 2011-03-16 02:12:17 <ArtForz> you can't
 630 2011-03-16 02:12:24 <xelister> yeap
 631 2011-03-16 02:12:32 <gilicorn> all that spent fuel is really clean
 632 2011-03-16 02:12:40 <gilicorn> and meltdowns are impossible..
 633 2011-03-16 02:12:47 <ArtForz> wo said that?
 634 2011-03-16 02:12:50 dissipate has joined
 635 2011-03-16 02:12:58 <bk128> (sarcasm)
 636 2011-03-16 02:13:01 <xelister> the guy that managed chernobyl plant perhaps
 637 2011-03-16 02:13:05 <TheKid> yeah I never said that
 638 2011-03-16 02:13:08 bt2100 has quit (Quit: Leaving)
 639 2011-03-16 02:13:12 <xelister> "famous last words"
 640 2011-03-16 02:13:33 <xelister> didnt USA fucked up totally with one of its first A-plant thig
 641 2011-03-16 02:13:37 <TheKid> spent fuel is managable relatively easily, compared to, for example, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fly_ash
 642 2011-03-16 02:13:40 ducki2p has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
 643 2011-03-16 02:13:47 <noagendamarket> so if they dont use nuclear whats the alternative
 644 2011-03-16 02:13:51 <TheKid> xelister: yeah one of the first breeders
 645 2011-03-16 02:13:57 <TheKid> was a huge failure :P
 646 2011-03-16 02:14:01 <TheKid> in that it didn't work right
 647 2011-03-16 02:14:01 echelon has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
 648 2011-03-16 02:14:02 <xelister> like, they made reactor... oh wait we have to controll the reaction... *add lead* ... oh shit, now lead/graphite is all on fire O_o< LOLOLOLOL help
 649 2011-03-16 02:14:03 <noagendamarket> pull power out of their ass ?
 650 2011-03-16 02:14:03 <TheKid> not that it was unsafe
 651 2011-03-16 02:14:22 semyazza has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
 652 2011-03-16 02:14:33 <ArtForz> noagendamarket: duh, solar, so much for night lighting ;)
 653 2011-03-16 02:14:35 <TheKid> gilicorn: meltdowns *are* impossible with newer designs
 654 2011-03-16 02:14:45 <TheKid> physically impossible
 655 2011-03-16 02:14:46 <ArtForz> TheKid: well, just really really unlikely
 656 2011-03-16 02:14:52 <xelister> btw, why didnt they simply
 657 2011-03-16 02:14:58 <xelister> just build a huge pits under cores
 658 2011-03-16 02:15:03 <dissipate> we need fusion
 659 2011-03-16 02:15:06 <xelister> and split core in smaller fragments like 8
 660 2011-03-16 02:15:11 <xelister> and drop them into separte holes
 661 2011-03-16 02:15:18 <gilicorn> TheKid: yeah assuming theres no design flaw, and the plant is constructed perfectly, and no mistakes are made in the process, and all the plants operations are done flawlessly, and all the monitoring systems work
 662 2011-03-16 02:15:27 <ArtForz> gilicorn: nope
 663 2011-03-16 02:15:31 <gilicorn> and there are no rolling quake / tsunamis
 664 2011-03-16 02:15:33 <TheKid> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pebble_bed_reactor#Safety_features
 665 2011-03-16 02:15:36 <xelister> its not rocket science... it contains heat radiations and moderates by just phisically removing rods from eachothers proximity
 666 2011-03-16 02:15:48 <ArtForz> yep, melttdown is physically impossible
 667 2011-03-16 02:15:51 <TheKid> gilicorn: no, even if all safety systems fail in a pebble bed reactor it just idles
 668 2011-03-16 02:15:57 <TheKid> and wastes heat
 669 2011-03-16 02:16:03 <ArtForz> note that the german experimental reactor is a fucking disaster anyways :P
 670 2011-03-16 02:16:11 <TheKid> ArtForz: >german
 671 2011-03-16 02:16:20 <TheKid> and you have no idea how much NEs are paid to not fuck up, do you :P
 672 2011-03-16 02:16:31 <TheKid> xelister: again, that's what the containment chamber is for
 673 2011-03-16 02:16:38 <TheKid> it's a big concrete and steel container
 674 2011-03-16 02:16:41 <TheKid> like a giant water bottle
 675 2011-03-16 02:16:43 <ArtForz> the graphite floor of the reactor *cracked* and fuel pebbles got stuck in there and broke up ...
 676 2011-03-16 02:16:46 <TheKid> so that even if the core melts, it's just in that
 677 2011-03-16 02:16:58 <gilicorn> pebble bed is the nuclear industry's latest marketing attempt to assure ppl that inherently unsafe technology can be made safe.. it makes as much sense as "clean coal"
 678 2011-03-16 02:16:59 <ArtForz> now they have shitloads of fun trying to clean up the resulting dust
 679 2011-03-16 02:17:16 <ArtForz> gilicorn: actually for the "no meltdown possible" part... it works.
 680 2011-03-16 02:17:33 <TheKid> it's just a pita when they fuck it up like they did :P
 681 2011-03-16 02:17:37 <TheKid> and
 682 2011-03-16 02:17:39 <TheKid> nuclear is unsafe
 683 2011-03-16 02:17:43 <TheKid> *
 684 2011-03-16 02:17:46 <ArtForz> anything is unsafe
 685 2011-03-16 02:17:58 <TheKid> radioactive waste sucks'
 686 2011-03-16 02:18:09 <TheKid> but as a transition baseload power source, there are no other good options
 687 2011-03-16 02:18:19 <TheKid> once solar or whatever gets efficient I am all for it
 688 2011-03-16 02:18:24 <TheKid> but it's not there yet
 689 2011-03-16 02:18:31 <ArtForz> I kinda like the desertec idea
 690 2011-03-16 02:18:41 <TheKid> desertec?
 691 2011-03-16 02:18:43 <ArtForz> yup
 692 2011-03-16 02:18:46 <gilicorn> lets say the chances of a major meltdown are .0000001 for a given plant in a year... if you have 500 plants running for 100 years and the possible mortality is 500MM ppl - that means you expect there to be 2.5 million deaths
 693 2011-03-16 02:18:46 jwalck- has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
 694 2011-03-16 02:18:49 Syke has joined
 695 2011-03-16 02:19:00 <ArtForz> build a shitload of solar-thermal plants in the northern sahara
 696 2011-03-16 02:19:02 <TheKid> gilicorn, you're missing it
 697 2011-03-16 02:19:07 <TheKid> with pebble bed reactors
 698 2011-03-16 02:19:08 <ArtForz> use HVDC lines to get the energy to europe
 699 2011-03-16 02:19:19 <TheKid> it is *physically impossible* for it to melt down
 700 2011-03-16 02:19:20 <kiba> ArtForz: problem is the political instabilities within these region
 701 2011-03-16 02:19:29 <TheKid> it is *designed* to get as hot as possible
 702 2011-03-16 02:19:33 <xelister> no, wait, it was not USA
 703 2011-03-16 02:19:39 <xelister> it was UK
 704 2011-03-16 02:19:41 <xelister> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windscale_fire
 705 2011-03-16 02:19:55 <TheKid> xelister: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fermi_1
 706 2011-03-16 02:19:57 <ArtForz> kiba: you'll create thousands of (relatively) high-paying jobs for mirror cleaners ;)
 707 2011-03-16 02:19:58 <bk128> building and maintaining that length of transmission lines would be a nightmare
 708 2011-03-16 02:20:00 <TheKid> that's what I was thinking of
 709 2011-03-16 02:20:02 <gilicorn> TheKid: why cant a pebble bed reactor blow up
 710 2011-03-16 02:20:05 <ArtForz> bk128: not really
 711 2011-03-16 02:20:09 <gilicorn> its under enormous pressure
 712 2011-03-16 02:20:27 <bk128> how many miles is it?
 713 2011-03-16 02:20:42 <ArtForz> about 700-1000 iirc
 714 2011-03-16 02:20:57 <ArtForz> theres already plenty HVDC lines not much shorter
 715 2011-03-16 02:21:09 <noagendamarket> they should do that in the middle of australia
 716 2011-03-16 02:21:10 <kiba> ArtForz: if you can get beyond the whole political issue, yeah
 717 2011-03-16 02:21:17 <ArtForz> it's "only" a matter of political crap + financing
 718 2011-03-16 02:21:20 <noagendamarket> but our government is tool retarded
 719 2011-03-16 02:21:35 <noagendamarket> *too
 720 2011-03-16 02:21:40 <TheKid> gilicorn: it can be cooled with inert gasses
 721 2011-03-16 02:21:50 <TheKid> noagendamarket: I am so sorry
 722 2011-03-16 02:21:55 <ArtForz> hell, they even solved base load and night issues
 723 2011-03-16 02:22:10 <TheKid> I watch the stuff your government does and am very glad I don't live in AUS
 724 2011-03-16 02:22:10 <ArtForz> just store heat in molten salt
 725 2011-03-16 02:22:15 <gilicorn> great.. pump a container full of gases until it explodes
 726 2011-03-16 02:22:15 <TheKid> then again, USA isn't much better :P
 727 2011-03-16 02:22:16 <bk128> losses are 3% per 1000km
 728 2011-03-16 02:22:19 <TheKid> but at least I can play Homefront!
 729 2011-03-16 02:22:25 <ArtForz> it's not like you *need* 100% efficiency with solar
 730 2011-03-16 02:23:30 <ArtForz> the area needed is *huge*
 731 2011-03-16 02:23:34 <ArtForz> but not totally crazy
 732 2011-03-16 02:23:52 <emeril> dammit
 733 2011-03-16 02:24:01 <gilicorn> i dont see why the fuel pebbles cant impode under high pressure
 734 2011-03-16 02:24:01 <ArtForz> iirc something like 1000 square miles to power all of europe
 735 2011-03-16 02:24:04 <emeril> also, dammit, this isn't the right window
 736 2011-03-16 02:24:05 <emeril> lol
 737 2011-03-16 02:24:09 <TheKid> gilicorn: seriously?
 738 2011-03-16 02:24:18 <ArtForz> gilicorn: physics
 739 2011-03-16 02:24:39 <TheKid> ^
 740 2011-03-16 02:24:44 <TheKid> graphite is good stuff
 741 2011-03-16 02:24:47 <ArtForz> it's a solid, those don't tend to compress very well
 742 2011-03-16 02:24:48 <TheKid> and the pebbles are mostly graphite
 743 2011-03-16 02:25:15 <gilicorn> enough gaseous volume and the explosion is inevitable
 744 2011-03-16 02:25:20 <ArtForz> what gas?
 745 2011-03-16 02:25:30 <ArtForz> it's ceramics and graphite
 746 2011-03-16 02:25:35 <gilicorn> its filled with helium
 747 2011-03-16 02:25:47 <TheKid> did you take chemistry?
 748 2011-03-16 02:25:53 <TheKid> look at what row helium is in
 749 2011-03-16 02:25:58 <TheKid> er, column
 750 2011-03-16 02:25:59 <TheKid> sorry
 751 2011-03-16 02:26:03 <ArtForz> erm, the pebbles are solid
 752 2011-03-16 02:26:04 <gilicorn> the reactor is filled with helium and water vapor
 753 2011-03-16 02:26:11 da2ce7 has joined
 754 2011-03-16 02:26:14 <TheKid> no
 755 2011-03-16 02:26:17 <gilicorn> what happens if you pump too much gas into it at high pressure
 756 2011-03-16 02:26:26 <TheKid> pebble reactors should be cooled with only inert gasses
 757 2011-03-16 02:26:27 <ArtForz> ... they don't
 758 2011-03-16 02:26:29 <TheKid> gases
 759 2011-03-16 02:26:32 <ArtForz> yep
 760 2011-03-16 02:26:35 <TheKid> to avoid things like that
 761 2011-03-16 02:26:43 <ArtForz> you dont want water vapor in there I think
 762 2011-03-16 02:26:48 <TheKid> man
 763 2011-03-16 02:26:49 <TheKid> ArtForz:
 764 2011-03-16 02:26:53 <TheKid> I like debating science
 765 2011-03-16 02:27:06 echelon has joined
 766 2011-03-16 02:27:10 <ArtForz> any water there would probably disassociate into H+O and *burn* the graphite
 767 2011-03-16 02:27:17 <TheKid> it's like debating politics but instead of just thinking I'm right and making moral arguments, I can make factual arguments and know I'm right
 768 2011-03-16 02:27:24 <ArtForz> TheKid: yup
 769 2011-03-16 02:27:53 <gilicorn> so noew we have graphite vapor at high pressure
 770 2011-03-16 02:27:57 <ArtForz> what?
 771 2011-03-16 02:28:00 <TheKid> what
 772 2011-03-16 02:28:04 <TheKid> graphite vapor?
 773 2011-03-16 02:28:04 <ArtForz> no, we have... helium at high pressure
 774 2011-03-16 02:28:06 <TheKid> are you serious?
 775 2011-03-16 02:28:09 <ArtForz> lol
 776 2011-03-16 02:28:19 <ArtForz> damn, something got WAAAAY too hot
 777 2011-03-16 02:28:24 <da2ce7> ArtForz, the hydrogen exlosion was outside the contament shelter... however in reacter No2 it was so powerfull it caused structual damage to the contament, from the outside.
 778 2011-03-16 02:28:45 <ArtForz> da2ce7: ah, that doesnt sound THAT bad
 779 2011-03-16 02:28:45 <da2ce7> they pipe the steam directly from the reactor to the outside.
 780 2011-03-16 02:28:50 <gilicorn> if youre burning graphite you have carbon vapor gaseous carbon
 781 2011-03-16 02:29:19 <ArtForz> da2ce7: then how the fuck did hydrogen accumulate under the roof of the outer building?
 782 2011-03-16 02:29:22 <gilicorn> so the pressure inside the vessel is exponentially worse
 783 2011-03-16 02:29:23 <TheKid> no oxygen
 784 2011-03-16 02:29:27 <TheKid> no burning
 785 2011-03-16 02:29:42 <TheKid> also
 786 2011-03-16 02:29:48 <TheKid> no
 787 2011-03-16 02:29:53 <TheKid> to whatever you're saying next
 788 2011-03-16 02:29:56 <TheKid> just admit you're wrong
 789 2011-03-16 02:29:57 <TheKid> it's okay
 790 2011-03-16 02:30:02 <TheKid> I promise it doesn't hurt
 791 2011-03-16 02:30:18 <gilicorn> i didnt say graphite would burn.. artforz did
 792 2011-03-16 02:30:24 <gilicorn> so which is it?
 793 2011-03-16 02:30:28 <da2ce7> well there are 3 buildings, the outer-outer is a weather sheleter... that is the part that exploded... that is where the vented gas goes.
 794 2011-03-16 02:30:45 <ArtForz> yep
 795 2011-03-16 02:30:45 <TheKid> gilicorn: where did he say that?
 796 2011-03-16 02:30:47 ducki2p has joined
 797 2011-03-16 02:30:49 <gilicorn> TheKid: you havent proved pressure cant build up in the reactor. there is no proof
 798 2011-03-16 02:30:54 kermit has quit (Quit: Leaving.)
 799 2011-03-16 02:30:58 <gilicorn> TheKid: scroll
 800 2011-03-16 02:31:08 kermit has joined
 801 2011-03-16 02:31:11 <ArtForz> I said you dont want water in your primary loop
 802 2011-03-16 02:31:22 <TheKid> gilicorn: I did
 803 2011-03-16 02:31:22 <TheKid> and
 804 2011-03-16 02:31:29 <gilicorn> TheKid: sorry buddy "pebbles" arent significantly safer than other designs. the latest innovation from nuclear industry isnt going to save us
 805 2011-03-16 02:31:29 <TheKid> yes pressure can build up
 806 2011-03-16 02:31:36 <TheKid> no that won't cause an explosion
 807 2011-03-16 02:31:38 <da2ce7> gilicorn, the burning carbon is a good thing... makes less oxygen in the reactor.
 808 2011-03-16 02:31:40 <ArtForz> gilicorn: proof?
 809 2011-03-16 02:31:47 <TheKid> because they pay people to release the pressure
 810 2011-03-16 02:31:55 <xelister> gilicorn: wikipedia shows experiments proving it is secure.
 811 2011-03-16 02:31:56 <da2ce7> the reacton is now stoped by the boron.
 812 2011-03-16 02:32:00 <xelister> gilicorn: are you here to troll us or what
 813 2011-03-16 02:32:01 <TheKid> or increase it if necessary
 814 2011-03-16 02:32:10 <TheKid> troll or not I like debates
 815 2011-03-16 02:32:12 <ArtForz> because at the temps you're running, any water vapor would disassociate into H+O2 on contact with the pebbles
 816 2011-03-16 02:32:12 <gilicorn> xelister: lol "wikipedia" shows lab experiments
 817 2011-03-16 02:32:15 <gilicorn> xelister: are you serious
 818 2011-03-16 02:32:29 <xelister> gilicorn: read the reference materials, duh
 819 2011-03-16 02:32:31 werdan7 has joined
 820 2011-03-16 02:32:32 <gilicorn> TheKid: you can type lines with more than 5 words
 821 2011-03-16 02:32:36 <ArtForz> the primary reactor only contains helium gas
 822 2011-03-16 02:32:44 <gilicorn> yeah, wiki says pebbles are safe! according to lab experiments!
 823 2011-03-16 02:32:47 <ArtForz> which is pretty damn inert
 824 2011-03-16 02:32:57 <ArtForz> *edit* no, it doesnt
 825 2011-03-16 02:32:59 <ArtForz> ;)
 826 2011-03-16 02:33:02 <xelister> soem guy on the internets say pebbles are unsafe! [citation needed]!
 827 2011-03-16 02:33:19 <xelister> I think I will go with the random guy on the internet citing no sources, he must be right.
 828 2011-03-16 02:33:24 <gilicorn> burden of proof is on you really, ive already told you gas can build up pressure in the vessel and cause an explosion
 829 2011-03-16 02:33:25 <ArtForz> *oblig. xkcd link*
 830 2011-03-16 02:33:39 <da2ce7> you have O from the water... so 2H2O -> H2 + 2O2
 831 2011-03-16 02:33:49 jrabbit has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
 832 2011-03-16 02:33:49 <da2ce7> that burns with the carbon.
 833 2011-03-16 02:33:57 <gilicorn> what if the pressure valves are sealed somehow? by a bunch of pebbles or something. now youre screwed
 834 2011-03-16 02:34:05 <da2ce7> so you have much more H2 than O2. that is a good thing.
 835 2011-03-16 02:34:16 <ArtForz> da2ce7: yes, thats why the primary coolant in a PBR is helium
 836 2011-03-16 02:34:22 <xelister> bunch of angry pebbles sealed the valve! Police is on to them!
 837 2011-03-16 02:34:35 <da2ce7> that means that the hydrogen explosion only happens in the outside of the reactor.
 838 2011-03-16 02:34:38 <gilicorn> graphite is combustible
 839 2011-03-16 02:34:51 <ArtForz> gilicorn: put the relief valves *above* the pebbles? unless you suddenly lose *gravity*, that should work pretty well...
 840 2011-03-16 02:35:07 <gilicorn> Critics also often point out an accident in Germany in 1986, which involved a jammed pebble damaged by the reactor operators when they were attempting to dislodge it from a feeder tube
 841 2011-03-16 02:35:17 <gilicorn> apparently it already happened
 842 2011-03-16 02:35:17 <da2ce7> in a pebel reactor, the graphite is covered in non-reactive serfaces.
 843 2011-03-16 02:35:20 <xelister> ArtForz: what if moon gets really close and reveses gravity
 844 2011-03-16 02:35:36 <ArtForz> xelister: then, I think, a reactor isnt exactly our biggest problem...
 845 2011-03-16 02:35:39 <ArtForz> gilicorn: again, see my earlier stuff
 846 2011-03-16 02:35:51 <da2ce7> so the graphine pebble has to be damaged to burn
 847 2011-03-16 02:35:54 <ArtForz> the german experimental PBR was a fucking disaster
 848 2011-03-16 02:36:00 <da2ce7> and there is no O2 in the ractor anyway.
 849 2011-03-16 02:36:15 <da2ce7> but the reactor in Japan is not a pebel bed.
 850 2011-03-16 02:36:16 <ArtForz> because... it was a prototype
 851 2011-03-16 02:36:17 <gilicorn> so was chernobyl... its not safe even i ntheory, and has to be built flawlessly by contractors
 852 2011-03-16 02:36:24 <ArtForz> no, it's safe in theory
 853 2011-03-16 02:36:38 <ArtForz> chernobyl sure as hell wasnt safe in theory, no BWR is.
 854 2011-03-16 02:37:05 <TheKid> and add to that the fact that chernobyl wasn't manned with trained staff :P
 855 2011-03-16 02:37:06 <da2ce7> the H2 + O2 is from the hot metal.
 856 2011-03-16 02:37:09 <ArtForz> and they arent safe in practice either. thats why they fucking need active cooling to prevent them from melting down.
 857 2011-03-16 02:37:10 <TheKid> and all the security things were bypassed
 858 2011-03-16 02:37:14 <ArtForz> yep
 859 2011-03-16 02:37:34 <gilicorn> the best proof would be an exhaustive simulation of all the major components - but thats computationally infeasible. so a sufficient proof of safety is impossible
 860 2011-03-16 02:37:49 <ArtForz> TheKid: they took a fully fueled reactor, shut down cooling, pulled out all control rods beyond safe limits *overriding safetys* ... and were surprised when shit blew up
 861 2011-03-16 02:38:10 <gilicorn> if you cant simulate it with high fidelity, you cant prove any properties certainly not to a sufficient degree of certainty given the risk of failure
 862 2011-03-16 02:38:13 <xelister> ha thoes russians. Crazy.
 863 2011-03-16 02:38:18 <da2ce7> gilicorn, you just need to design a reactor that is logicaly safe... lol
 864 2011-03-16 02:38:39 <kiba> nuclear subs..hmm
 865 2011-03-16 02:38:50 <gilicorn> da2ce7: sure a logical proof would be nice, but it doesnt exist
 866 2011-03-16 02:38:51 <kiba> nuclear aircraft carriers
 867 2011-03-16 02:39:01 <ArtForz> (leaving out a few parts of the chain of events for dramatic effect and too shortzen things)
 868 2011-03-16 02:39:04 <xelister> maybe Chernobyl's block #4 chief got really drunk and played russian roulette with block #2
 869 2011-03-16 02:39:22 <TheKid> gilicorn: lrn2 theory
 870 2011-03-16 02:39:26 <da2ce7> the reactors in nuclear aircraft carriers are some of the safest ever designed.
 871 2011-03-16 02:39:48 <gilicorn> TheKid: lets see a verifiable proof of pbr's safety..
 872 2011-03-16 02:39:52 <xelister> da2ce7: I suppose.. they are built to being literally shoot at =)
 873 2011-03-16 02:39:53 <ArtForz> but thats effectively the situation they achieved shortly before the reactor decided that *now* was a good time to really start the reaction
 874 2011-03-16 02:39:54 <gilicorn> TheKid: doesnt exist
 875 2011-03-16 02:40:08 <TheKid> gilicorn: if you would think about the design then yes, one exists
 876 2011-03-16 02:40:16 <ArtForz> gilicorn: impossible
 877 2011-03-16 02:40:32 <TheKid> the fact that it is cooled with an inert gas, and designed to get as hot as goddamn possible
 878 2011-03-16 02:40:35 <ArtForz> there is no proof that the universe will not cease to exist in 3 seconds.
 879 2011-03-16 02:40:49 <kiba> 3 seconds had passed
 880 2011-03-16 02:40:52 <gilicorn> handwavy arguments are not a proof. thers no such thing as proof in engineering. you use simulations (but reactors like this are way too copmlicated to simulate with any realism.. and the costs are too high) unfortunately bounded rationality + extremely rare catastrophic events = unacceptable risk. theres really no logic way around it
 881 2011-03-16 02:40:55 <kiba> perhaps you mean the next 3 seconds
 882 2011-03-16 02:40:58 <ArtForz> yeah
 883 2011-03-16 02:41:11 <TheKid> whatever, it's 2240 here
 884 2011-03-16 02:41:13 <TheKid> time to sleep
 885 2011-03-16 02:41:18 <TheKid> night everyone
 886 2011-03-16 02:41:18 <ArtForz> so we better never do anything that takes longer than 3 seconds, or the universe might end before we're done
 887 2011-03-16 02:41:23 <da2ce7> ooh there is no proof that i'm not going to become a God when i die.
 888 2011-03-16 02:42:03 <ArtForz> da2ce7: yup, pretty cool, eh?
 889 2011-03-16 02:42:33 <da2ce7> ArtForz, since there is not proof, it must be true!
 890 2011-03-16 02:42:38 <ArtForz> anyways, "close enough"+50% usually works pretty well in engineering
 891 2011-03-16 02:42:40 <xelister> O_o<  LOLOLOLOLOLOL
 892 2011-03-16 02:42:40 <da2ce7> *no
 893 2011-03-16 02:42:45 <xelister> Chernobyl's reactor..
 894 2011-03-16 02:42:46 <gilicorn> its all about risk - you could prove a plan is fairly safe, the accident rate is around 1 in 1 million miles
 895 2011-03-16 02:42:47 <xelister> it was a
 896 2011-03-16 02:43:03 bt2100 has joined
 897 2011-03-16 02:43:05 <gilicorn> da2ce7: theres no proof of pebble bed safety! it must be true!
 898 2011-03-16 02:43:13 <xelister> POSITIVE-LOOPBACK reacotr (in case of a failure -> auto INCREASING of reactor power) ?  jesus and someone builded that?  lol russians.
 899 2011-03-16 02:43:21 <ArtForz> xelister: yup
 900 2011-03-16 02:43:43 <ArtForz> it was totally. fucking. crazy.
 901 2011-03-16 02:43:44 <da2ce7> yeah, it was one of the most stupid cases of engneering ever.
 902 2011-03-16 02:44:07 <ArtForz> hell, not even automotive engineers are *that* stupid
 903 2011-03-16 02:44:31 <gilicorn> theres no engineering argument that has high enough certainty to outweigh the risk of nuclear catastrophe.
 904 2011-03-16 02:44:42 <gilicorn> its simply beyond any engineering analysis
 905 2011-03-16 02:44:49 <ArtForz> yes, there is
 906 2011-03-16 02:45:03 <gilicorn> ArtForz: confidence intervals please
 907 2011-03-16 02:45:09 <gilicorn> lets see the model
 908 2011-03-16 02:45:11 <ArtForz> by your reasoning, we have to ban automobiles NOW
 909 2011-03-16 02:45:27 <da2ce7> ArtForz, when you crash, the have some Plastic explocive uner your seat, to make sure you die?
 910 2011-03-16 02:45:37 <gilicorn> no, because if an automobile is 99.9999% safe, you expect < 1 death
 911 2011-03-16 02:45:48 <gilicorn> if a nuclear plant is 99.9999% safe you expect a billion deaths
 912 2011-03-16 02:45:55 <gilicorn> much different precision
 913 2011-03-16 02:45:56 <ArtForz> no you don't
 914 2011-03-16 02:46:00 <da2ce7> bullshit
 915 2011-03-16 02:46:05 <gilicorn> heh do the math
 916 2011-03-16 02:46:10 <gilicorn> calculate the expected value
 917 2011-03-16 02:46:14 <ArtForz> contrary to popular myth, radiation isnt THAT deadly
 918 2011-03-16 02:46:49 <Netsniper> "And all you have to do is take iodine pills after exposure!"
 919 2011-03-16 02:46:52 <da2ce7> radiation spreads very quicky... soon becomes low enougth to only slightly cause harm
 920 2011-03-16 02:46:53 <Netsniper> ...
 921 2011-03-16 02:47:01 * kiba decides to ignore the tedious conversationmaker
 922 2011-03-16 02:47:18 <gilicorn> catastrophic failure means 500 million are impacted at once. for a car, catastrophic failure means 1 person is impacted at once (if you discover a design flaw in cars, you can stop driving until its fixed, unlike a nuke accident which unfolds immediately)
 923 2011-03-16 02:47:52 <ArtForz> gilicorn: yet more people are killed in traffic EACH DAY than in the whole fucking history of nuke plants...
 924 2011-03-16 02:47:56 <TheKid> yes, because spotting a design flaw causes the delicate balance that physics had been keeping to collapse and instantly cause a meltdown
 925 2011-03-16 02:48:00 <gilicorn> thats true.. cars are horrible unsafe
 926 2011-03-16 02:48:03 <ArtForz> yep
 927 2011-03-16 02:48:19 * da2ce7 has a bed of Pu 210 :) it is nice and warm
 928 2011-03-16 02:48:22 <ArtForz> yet I see no calls to ban cars until we figure out a way to make em 5 orders of magnitude safer
 929 2011-03-16 02:48:23 <TheKid> had to come back to turn off the binging sound :P
 930 2011-03-16 02:49:04 <gilicorn> TheKid: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_swan_theory
 931 2011-03-16 02:49:07 <da2ce7> *238
 932 2011-03-16 02:49:11 <ArtForz> same flawed risk assessment as with plane crashes
 933 2011-03-16 02:49:13 <gilicorn> The non-computability of the probability of the consequential rare events using scientific methods (owing to the very nature of small probabilities)
 934 2011-03-16 02:49:41 <gilicorn> current engineering methods cannot estimate safety factors with enough precision to make the expected value of nuclear operation neutral
 935 2011-03-16 02:49:55 <da2ce7> gilicorn you are being silly, I delcar you are a troll.
 936 2011-03-16 02:49:58 <da2ce7> :)
 937 2011-03-16 02:50:01 <gilicorn> sorry.. but you are dealing with simulations that are exponential in time/space
 938 2011-03-16 02:50:08 <gilicorn> da2ce7: "delcar" ?
 939 2011-03-16 02:50:20 <kiba> I wonder if gilicorn is the same guy yesterday that argue that spectulators are evil
 940 2011-03-16 02:50:38 <da2ce7> declare
 941 2011-03-16 02:50:45 <ArtForz> speculators are evil. it just depends on the definition of evil :P
 942 2011-03-16 02:51:07 <gilicorn> just calculate the expected value of a nuclear catastrophe
 943 2011-03-16 02:51:08 * da2ce7 thinks everyone knows that he is bad a spelling... but it ain't the end of the world.
 944 2011-03-16 02:51:09 <kiba> ArtForz: I have a sneaking suspicion that he is the same guy
 945 2011-03-16 02:51:11 <ArtForz> if you define "evil" as "being a speculator" ... then they most certainly are ;)
 946 2011-03-16 02:51:25 <ArtForz> gilicorn: "not much"
 947 2011-03-16 02:51:26 <sneak> hi
 948 2011-03-16 02:51:37 <da2ce7> hey sneak
 949 2011-03-16 02:51:45 <gilicorn> lets say the probability of a catastrophic event is 10^-7
 950 2011-03-16 02:51:47 <sneak> wie gehts, ArtForz
 951 2011-03-16 02:51:50 <gilicorn> (per year per plant)
 952 2011-03-16 02:52:12 <kiba> I wish for hot wings right now
 953 2011-03-16 02:52:16 <gilicorn> 100 years, 1000 plants that means you expect 5 million deaths
 954 2011-03-16 02:52:20 <sneak> kiba: i ate like 30 hot wings last month
 955 2011-03-16 02:52:26 <sneak> went to my favorite wing place in nyc
 956 2011-03-16 02:52:28 Spenvo has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
 957 2011-03-16 02:52:38 <gilicorn> great! now if you have an argument for why probability and expected value shouldnt be used that is a philosophical objection
 958 2011-03-16 02:52:40 <kiba> sneak: I can eat 10 extra-hot wings in one sitting
 959 2011-03-16 02:52:40 <da2ce7> yummy
 960 2011-03-16 02:52:44 <kiba> apperantly, it is no longer hot to me
 961 2011-03-16 02:52:47 <ArtForz> yet we didnt have 2 million deaths in 40 years ....
 962 2011-03-16 02:52:53 jrabbit has joined
 963 2011-03-16 02:53:00 * da2ce7 thinks about chickens, and how they are made into yummy food.
 964 2011-03-16 02:53:10 <ArtForz> so the actual values have to be way lower or the gods of probability are fucking with us
 965 2011-03-16 02:53:12 <gribble> it's the same trollish guy from yesterday.
 966 2011-03-16 02:53:16 <xelister> what was the ban about?
 967 2011-03-16 02:53:18 <sneak> da2ce7: they aren't made into
 968 2011-03-16 02:53:22 <sneak> they -are- yummy food
 969 2011-03-16 02:53:29 <da2ce7> :)
 970 2011-03-16 02:53:35 <sneak> someone has obv never had chicken sashimi
 971 2011-03-16 02:53:51 <validus> ignoring ips is <3
 972 2011-03-16 02:54:25 <da2ce7> sneak what do you do? member on the forum?
 973 2011-03-16 02:54:32 <sneak> i eat chicken wings
 974 2011-03-16 02:54:36 <sneak> sometimes i write code
 975 2011-03-16 02:54:51 <validus> chicken gizzards w/ hot sauce is better :P
 976 2011-03-16 02:54:51 <sneak> generally i am just an arrogant self-important prick
 977 2011-03-16 02:55:00 <sneak> running around doing various things that are important to me
 978 2011-03-16 02:55:04 <da2ce7> ooh nice, what type of code
 979 2011-03-16 02:55:13 <sneak> mostly perl, some python, now more and more objC
 980 2011-03-16 02:55:23 <sneak> php when i can't avoid it
 981 2011-03-16 02:55:24 <ArtForz> define sneak: advanced machine to turn chicken wings into code and arguments
 982 2011-03-16 02:55:27 <ArtForz> *ducks*
 983 2011-03-16 02:55:35 <validus> lol
 984 2011-03-16 02:55:39 <da2ce7> lol
 985 2011-03-16 02:55:51 <sneak> ArtForz: i think it was someone at the IAS who said mathemeticians are machines for turning coffee into theorems
 986 2011-03-16 02:55:52 genjix has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
 987 2011-03-16 02:56:02 <ArtForz> yep
 988 2011-03-16 02:56:03 <sneak> also, this machine requires more than just chikkenz
 989 2011-03-16 02:56:12 <sneak> caffeine, h2o, intertrons, boobs
 990 2011-03-16 02:56:21 <sneak> but yeah, with those inputs, output is consistient
 991 2011-03-16 02:56:34 <sneak> my whole life is basically an engineering effort to keep that basic function supplied with pipeline
 992 2011-03-16 02:57:01 <validus> im sure your output keeps going if you catch my drift
 993 2011-03-16 02:57:06 <ArtForz> you forgot C2H6O
 994 2011-03-16 02:57:07 <validus> throne room is best reading time
 995 2011-03-16 02:57:14 <sneak> c2h60?
 996 2011-03-16 02:57:19 <sneak> i forgot lots of things, probably
 997 2011-03-16 02:57:25 <sneak> i take a multivitamin and delegate
 998 2011-03-16 02:57:37 <ArtForz> ethanol
 999 2011-03-16 02:57:46 <da2ce7> it makes you make bad code
1000 2011-03-16 02:57:51 <da2ce7> or dance.
1001 2011-03-16 02:57:54 <ArtForz> see ballmer peak ;)
1002 2011-03-16 02:57:59 <sneak> i'm not a big fan of ethanol
1003 2011-03-16 02:58:04 <sneak> i have a mild allergy to it
1004 2011-03-16 02:58:12 <da2ce7> asian?
1005 2011-03-16 02:58:23 <ArtForz> http://xkcd.com/323/
1006 2011-03-16 02:58:25 <sneak> negative, white american male, 185cm 100kg
1007 2011-03-16 02:58:32 <sneak> aka Privileged Motherfucker(tm)
1008 2011-03-16 02:59:30 <sneak> i think you have to be in some tiny top fraction of humans on earth in the first world to care aboutbitcoin
1009 2011-03-16 02:59:38 <ArtForz> yep
1010 2011-03-16 02:59:45 Diablo-D3 has joined
1011 2011-03-16 02:59:46 <da2ce7> yepo
1012 2011-03-16 02:59:54 <sneak> statistically, most humans are probably more worried about things like food and water
1013 2011-03-16 02:59:58 <da2ce7> most people arround here are good, other than the trolls.
1014 2011-03-16 02:59:59 <kiba> so what if we are privileged motherfuckers?
1015 2011-03-16 03:00:02 <ArtForz> having the luxury to do intellectual stuff is fucking great
1016 2011-03-16 03:00:03 <sneak> if their donkey is gonna die
1017 2011-03-16 03:00:07 <sneak> etc
1018 2011-03-16 03:00:08 <kiba> I don't give a damn
1019 2011-03-16 03:00:16 * da2ce7 sometimes is a troll... but prefers troling IRL
1020 2011-03-16 03:00:20 <ArtForz> kiba: your name is not hoover?
1021 2011-03-16 03:00:27 <bt2100> i'm pretty poor; i found bitcoin because someone on twitter mentioned it.
1022 2011-03-16 03:00:36 <sneak> bt2100: the poorest person on the internet is rich
1023 2011-03-16 03:00:45 <bt2100> sneak: i'll agree with you there
1024 2011-03-16 03:00:50 <validus> i got asked by someoen since i look up internet marketing and ways to make money
1025 2011-03-16 03:00:53 <kiba> ArtForz: well, I think a good goal as privilleged motherfuckers is to increase wealth so that the rest of humanity don't have to worry about food and water
1026 2011-03-16 03:00:53 * da2ce7 is rich
1027 2011-03-16 03:00:57 <validus> with 0 cost investments
1028 2011-03-16 03:00:59 <ArtForz> dunno, never met him
1029 2011-03-16 03:01:01 <validus> its not easy lol
1030 2011-03-16 03:01:04 <da2ce7> ArtForz is richer.
1031 2011-03-16 03:01:33 <sneak> i spent six thousand dollars last month on airfare, hotels, cocaine, whiskey, and steak
1032 2011-03-16 03:01:40 <bt2100> damn man
1033 2011-03-16 03:01:49 <ArtForz> no hookers?
1034 2011-03-16 03:01:49 <bt2100> that's a lot of airfare
1035 2011-03-16 03:01:50 <sneak> in ~8 cities in north america
1036 2011-03-16 03:01:54 <validus> thats a lot of coke
1037 2011-03-16 03:02:00 <validus> your name should be charlie
1038 2011-03-16 03:02:01 <validus> lol
1039 2011-03-16 03:02:05 <sneak> ArtForz: lol if you have blow + hotel + whiskey and still have to pay for it, you're Doing It Wrong
1040 2011-03-16 03:02:12 <validus> true that
1041 2011-03-16 03:02:25 <sneak> i took my Great Annual American Vacation
1042 2011-03-16 03:02:34 <validus> nice where ud go
1043 2011-03-16 03:02:39 <sneak> montreal/boston/dc/nyc/toronto/detroit/sfba
1044 2011-03-16 03:02:42 jaxono has joined
1045 2011-03-16 03:02:49 <da2ce7> nice
1046 2011-03-16 03:02:50 <da2ce7> :)
1047 2011-03-16 03:02:53 <validus> you ride the ferris wheel in the virgin megastore?
1048 2011-03-16 03:03:03 <sneak> huh?
1049 2011-03-16 03:03:05 <sneak> where?
1050 2011-03-16 03:03:06 <validus> nyc
1051 2011-03-16 03:03:08 <validus> its 3 stories
1052 2011-03-16 03:03:10 <sneak> i thought they closed it
1053 2011-03-16 03:03:10 * da2ce7 want to go back to WA state.
1054 2011-03-16 03:03:14 <sneak> the one in union square?
1055 2011-03-16 03:03:16 <validus> oh i havent been there in about 4 years
1056 2011-03-16 03:03:19 <sneak> it's been closed for a while
1057 2011-03-16 03:03:25 <sneak> yeah, that's about when i moved away, but i'm back at least once a year
1058 2011-03-16 03:03:27 <validus> i did get a limo ride for 5 bucks
1059 2011-03-16 03:03:32 <da2ce7> *Washington.
1060 2011-03-16 03:03:52 <sneak> i hailed a limo with a 1cm sheaf of hundreds in the middle of union square on new year's day at 00:30 while it was raining
1061 2011-03-16 03:04:00 <sneak> surrounded by hundreds of people trying to get cabs
1062 2011-03-16 03:04:02 <validus> had 6 other ppl and got off the subway and dude was like cheap cheap limo. how about free.99 thats cheap. he's like about 5 a head for as logn as you want
1063 2011-03-16 03:04:03 <sneak> it was one of my best moments
1064 2011-03-16 03:04:18 <sneak> i raised my arm like a bronze god of capitalism
1065 2011-03-16 03:04:18 <validus> got him to drop us off in central park and pick us up an hour later
1066 2011-03-16 03:04:32 <validus> i wanted to find the pigeon lady from home alone :P
1067 2011-03-16 03:04:37 <sneak> hahaha
1068 2011-03-16 03:04:40 <sneak> i miss new york
1069 2011-03-16 03:04:42 <validus> instead i met a bum named zulu and was playing his violin
1070 2011-03-16 03:04:48 <validus> was great times
1071 2011-03-16 03:05:11 <validus> gave a bum my old pair of shoes to since i just bought new ones
1072 2011-03-16 03:05:29 <validus> but no one knows how to get to howard sterns building. we asked everyone and every cop we saw
1073 2011-03-16 03:05:40 <sneak> oh you were just touristing?
1074 2011-03-16 03:05:44 * sneak lived there for 2 years
1075 2011-03-16 03:05:46 <validus> sort of , i traveled for a living
1076 2011-03-16 03:05:55 <validus> so off of work and off to the city
1077 2011-03-16 03:06:20 <validus> i found nyc one of the easiest cities to get around i ever been to
1078 2011-03-16 03:07:05 <sneak> when you use "to be" in the past tense like that (perfect) you have to use a helper verb, like "have", e.g. "have been"
1079 2011-03-16 03:07:30 <validus> i only worry about my grammar punctuation when im responding on online college, but im working on getting into a better habit
1080 2011-03-16 03:07:39 <sneak> people from the midwest omit the helper verb for "been" and "seen"
1081 2011-03-16 03:07:48 <sneak> drives me up a wall
1082 2011-03-16 03:08:02 <validus> well im in the midwest but i grew up in the south so thats not helping any :P
1083 2011-03-16 03:08:12 <validus> i can speak mumble and slur very well
1084 2011-03-16 03:08:40 <validus> but i have a weird accent now, from traveling so much, it usually just changes to where i'm at
1085 2011-03-16 03:08:49 <sneak> that happens to everyone, given enough time
1086 2011-03-16 03:08:52 <validus> and i know i shoudlnt end a sentence with "at" and i shoudlnt start with but
1087 2011-03-16 03:09:05 <sneak> i speak shitty slang nasally north german now
1088 2011-03-16 03:09:14 <validus> you should have seen my first paper in orientation i had to send to their robot checker it hated me
1089 2011-03-16 03:09:19 <sneak> do not go to the poor gutterpunk city in a country to learn its language
1090 2011-03-16 03:09:42 <validus> you adapt learn and move on, i dont judge someone by what they say or how they say it, it might not be their fault
1091 2011-03-16 03:09:48 <validus> if its by choice thats a different story
1092 2011-03-16 03:10:27 <validus> but i screwed with nyc hardcore and brought out my southern accent , i had so much fun lol
1093 2011-03-16 03:10:57 <validus> like i had on a cowboy hat and i was staring at a building and i said as southern as i could, boyy that building shore is tall. then poked at it like it wasnt real. i swear like 12 people stopped and stared
1094 2011-03-16 03:10:59 <sneak> my new girlfriend pronouces "ice" like "ass", she's from arkansas
1095 2011-03-16 03:11:06 <sneak> HAHAHA
1096 2011-03-16 03:11:17 <validus> was hilarious
1097 2011-03-16 03:11:35 <sneak> new yorkers are easy to troll
1098 2011-03-16 03:11:41 <sneak> google "improv anywhere" for more examples
1099 2011-03-16 03:11:48 <validus> ya i only got into it with 1 person my whole time there
1100 2011-03-16 03:12:00 <validus> i love how you say what you want. it doesnt matter what you say and no one cares
1101 2011-03-16 03:12:11 <sneak> that kind of density dictates certain types of social conformity
1102 2011-03-16 03:12:23 <validus> it makes it hell in selling door to door to
1103 2011-03-16 03:12:26 <sneak> e.g. not giving a shit about what people say, not making too much eye contact, keeping to yourself in public
1104 2011-03-16 03:12:29 <validus> im selling fucking books for 25 fucking dollars, buy one
1105 2011-03-16 03:12:32 <validus> that was my sales pitch
1106 2011-03-16 03:12:35 <validus> it worked great
1107 2011-03-16 03:12:53 <validus> you have approximitely 5 seconds before that door is slamming in your face lol
1108 2011-03-16 03:13:26 <validus> i knocked a cops door and he thought i was lying so he called his buddies and they said i was going to have to kickbox their chief to get ouf it and started measuring my hands trying to scare me
1109 2011-03-16 03:13:48 <validus> like really dude give me a break. just because im from the south doesnt mean im retarded
1110 2011-03-16 03:13:52 Syke has quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
1111 2011-03-16 03:14:02 <sneak> yeah it does
1112 2011-03-16 03:14:05 <sneak> :
1113 2011-03-16 03:14:05 <jaxono> validus: is this the story abot the time you smoked a lot of crack
1114 2011-03-16 03:14:06 <sneak> :P
1115 2011-03-16 03:14:10 <validus> nah im sofistimicated redneck :P
1116 2011-03-16 03:14:22 <validus> ive never touched rock and never will and no one will bring that crapt around me
1117 2011-03-16 03:14:22 <sneak> mint juleps on the porch kinda southerner?
1118 2011-03-16 03:14:38 <sneak> in a white silk suit while the slaves work the plantation?
1119 2011-03-16 03:14:49 <validus> plantation homes are all over where i grew up
1120 2011-03-16 03:14:51 <sneak> monticello style
1121 2011-03-16 03:15:01 <jaxono> j/k validus
1122 2011-03-16 03:15:02 <sneak> i'm down with t.j. culture
1123 2011-03-16 03:15:11 <validus> its ok jaxono: just clarifying i figured you were j/k :P
1124 2011-03-16 03:15:22 <sneak> wtf can i do with a thousand bitcoins
1125 2011-03-16 03:15:31 <validus> like boomhower on king of the hill i can understand everything he says with no problem
1126 2011-03-16 03:15:45 <sneak> validus: yeah everyone can, otherwise the show would flop
1127 2011-03-16 03:15:46 <validus> and the fox censors can't, because i cant believe some of the things i hear
1128 2011-03-16 03:15:56 <validus> nah not everyone
1129 2011-03-16 03:16:00 <validus> i know people that struggle with it
1130 2011-03-16 03:16:01 <sneak> nah, they can too, they just let it slide because it could be argued that's not what he's saying :P
1131 2011-03-16 03:16:12 <validus> but i talk normal now
1132 2011-03-16 03:16:15 a_meteorite has quit (Quit: http://bzfx.net/)
1133 2011-03-16 03:16:16 <validus> unless im really drunk or pissed off
1134 2011-03-16 03:16:20 <validus> then my accent comes out lol
1135 2011-03-16 03:16:31 <sneak> except for the fact that you unknowingly omit adverbs? :P
1136 2011-03-16 03:16:42 <validus> yep
1137 2011-03-16 03:16:54 <validus> i never said my typing is perfect or speech but i do try to correct myself irl if i can
1138 2011-03-16 03:17:24 <validus> in high school before i moved i was passing German with a B and almost failing english
1139 2011-03-16 03:17:29 <validus> and im old now so ....
1140 2011-03-16 03:18:02 <sneak> learning german is hard.  not because of german, but because it's hard to practice.
1141 2011-03-16 03:18:09 <validus> i saved the info from the writing center of excellence of the college papers do's and don'ts because i dont know them
1142 2011-03-16 03:18:17 <sneak> rare to find germans who won't stick to english
1143 2011-03-16 03:18:20 <validus> i have no idea
1144 2011-03-16 03:18:32 <validus> i dont remember most german, i can flirt, ask for beer, and piss someone off
1145 2011-03-16 03:18:41 <sneak> deine mutter sucks cocks in hell
1146 2011-03-16 03:18:50 <validus> dont know how to spell most of it either lol
1147 2011-03-16 03:18:55 <validus> like ich haben schnonen hoden
1148 2011-03-16 03:18:58 <sneak> i have the same problem
1149 2011-03-16 03:19:44 <sneak> also, you seem to have forgotten basic conjugation, but it's ok because it's basically encoded parity information anyway
1150 2011-03-16 03:19:46 <validus> ill get around to learning all the languages i want to
1151 2011-03-16 03:19:50 <sneak> (i.e. redundant)
1152 2011-03-16 03:20:00 <validus> im wanting to start with mandarin then cantonese though, i watch alot of asian films
1153 2011-03-16 03:20:10 <sneak> did somebody say WEABOO?
1154 2011-03-16 03:20:17 * sneak grabs paddle
1155 2011-03-16 03:20:30 <jaxono> note, when you ban someone you disagree with, you admit you can't win the argument by reason, but only by censoring them. instantly discredits your position. so whoever banned me is admitting he's wrong.
1156 2011-03-16 03:20:30 <jaxono> btw, PBR is not really considered "safe": nuclear engineering international: "PBR safety was claimed to be superior to other nuclear systems, with an allegedly 'catastrophe-free' and 'inherently safe' design. [...] There are doubts about whether these claims depict reality." http://www.neimagazine.com/story.asp?storyCode=2052589. PBR has interesting properties as you guys pointed out, but
1157 2011-03-16 03:20:30 <jaxono> ultimately its snakeoil from a nuclear industry desperate to convince people their products are safe. why take the massive risk, when we can convert the globe to pure solar plants that are provably safe in a decade or so?
1158 2011-03-16 03:20:30 <jaxono>  dont agree that the risk is acceptable when we have completely safe and clean alternatives.
1159 2011-03-16 03:20:30 <jaxono> of course ArtForz, TheKid, xelister are brilliant guys and clearly know a lot about physics and nuclear reactor system. they know the details. they are right about the reactions.
1160 2011-03-16 03:20:37 <jgarzik> I hate boost, and I hate C++.  That is all.
1161 2011-03-16 03:20:38 <jaxono> I CANT BE BANNED !! ! !!  ! !! heheheheheheheh
1162 2011-03-16 03:20:46 <validus> the ban from earlier was not out of hate
1163 2011-03-16 03:20:47 <jaxono> laeter:-{}
1164 2011-03-16 03:20:48 jaxono has left ()
1165 2011-03-16 03:20:55 <validus> i bet that was the same person
1166 2011-03-16 03:20:56 <sneak> lol
1167 2011-03-16 03:21:01 <sneak> i bet that guy is german
1168 2011-03-16 03:21:12 <validus> that troll yesterday was absolutely retarded
1169 2011-03-16 03:21:14 <validus> and absurd
1170 2011-03-16 03:21:21 <sneak> jgarzik: c++ is pretty deplorable, i agree
1171 2011-03-16 03:21:23 <Diablo-D3> who?
1172 2011-03-16 03:21:47 <validus> Diablo-D3: that dude from yesterday
1173 2011-03-16 03:22:00 <sneak> i'm surprised someone hasn't reimplemented the basic bitcoin app functionality in something more popular and cross-platform, e.g. java (also yuck, but popular) or python
1174 2011-03-16 03:22:02 <validus> the one if you disagreed with he would insult you then say he didnt then continue on
1175 2011-03-16 03:22:07 <validus> the marxism/communist dude
1176 2011-03-16 03:22:23 <validus> java is really used in so much stuff it can suprise you
1177 2011-03-16 03:22:25 <validus> it suprised me
1178 2011-03-16 03:22:33 <Diablo-D3> I dont remember any dude from yesterday
1179 2011-03-16 03:22:36 <Diablo-D3> validus: also, YES
1180 2011-03-16 03:22:37 <Diablo-D3> JAVA IS USED
1181 2011-03-16 03:22:38 <Diablo-D3> IN
1182 2011-03-16 03:22:40 <Diablo-D3> MY MINER
1183 2011-03-16 03:22:46 <Diablo-D3> *MOCK SURPRISE*
1184 2011-03-16 03:22:48 <sneak> Diablo-D3: caps lock is used in your irc client
1185 2011-03-16 03:22:56 * Diablo-D3 smacks sneak 
1186 2011-03-16 03:23:02 <sneak> to similar detriment as java in your miner
1187 2011-03-16 03:23:02 <validus> miners, cars, console ftps, os's
1188 2011-03-16 03:23:05 <validus> its used everywhere
1189 2011-03-16 03:23:07 <sneak> os's what?
1190 2011-03-16 03:23:12 <validus> java in windows w/ firefox can suck ass though
1191 2011-03-16 03:23:15 <sneak> why did you omit the apostrophe correctly from all the other plurals?
1192 2011-03-16 03:23:17 <validus> solaris
1193 2011-03-16 03:23:22 <validus> its a bad habit
1194 2011-03-16 03:23:25 <Diablo-D3> OSen is the proper plural for OS
1195 2011-03-16 03:23:27 <sneak> then jam it in there for OSes?
1196 2011-03-16 03:23:32 <validus> and i type very quickly and sometimes jsut dont
1197 2011-03-16 03:23:42 <sneak> no, not using an apostrophe is correct
1198 2011-03-16 03:23:48 <sneak> but then you got to oses
1199 2011-03-16 03:24:15 <sneak> plurals don't get apostrophes.  unless they are possessing things, but then it goes on the end, like chatters' channel
1200 2011-03-16 03:24:41 <sneak> rsync done.  reboot time.  bbl
1201 2011-03-16 03:24:59 <validus> ya well word, lets me know of my errors so i fix them there, irc doesnt lol
1202 2011-03-16 03:26:13 <validus> i wonder if re installing sp1 to win7 will fix this sound issue
1203 2011-03-16 03:26:31 <validus> audiodg needs to be exiled from existence
1204 2011-03-16 03:31:32 wolfspraul has quit (Quit: leaving)
1205 2011-03-16 03:32:26 Bth8 has joined
1206 2011-03-16 03:43:13 harbalarga has joined
1207 2011-03-16 03:43:15 <harbalarga> the situation is tragic... (1 hour ago) FUKUSHIMA - Japan suspended operations to prevent a stricken nuclear plant from melting down Wednesday after a surge in radiation made it too dangerous for workers to remain at the facility. Experts say exposure of around 1,000 millisieverts is enough to cause radiation sickness. http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5hr2sPhUE6ja0EMclJeUeGSQAON-g?
1208 2011-03-16 03:43:16 harbalarga has left ()
1209 2011-03-16 03:43:33 TheKid has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1210 2011-03-16 03:44:29 TheKid has joined
1211 2011-03-16 03:44:29 TheKid has quit (Changing host)
1212 2011-03-16 03:44:29 TheKid has joined
1213 2011-03-16 03:45:20 <x6763> hmmm...ignoring by ip didn't seem to work
1214 2011-03-16 03:46:43 <nanotube> x6763: he come from a different host the second time
1215 2011-03-16 03:48:58 <x6763> to me it looks like it was ~jaxono@movl-67-55-177-240.wiatel.net for both jaxono and harbalarga
1216 2011-03-16 03:49:31 <noagendamarket> I take it they are trolls ?
1217 2011-03-16 03:49:36 <x6763> i ignored 67.55.177.240 before he came back as harbalarga
1218 2011-03-16 03:49:42 <validus> harbalarga sounds alot like garblonza
1219 2011-03-16 03:49:55 <validus> or wtfever the guys nick was i turned my ignores off so im not sure
1220 2011-03-16 03:50:04 <validus> thats the only 2 nicks on that isp i see in my channel log
1221 2011-03-16 03:50:05 <x6763> noagendamarket: it's farzong/blarzong/blarzongo/cornharp/hyperions/jaxono/harbalarga
1222 2011-03-16 03:50:14 <validus> so he's on vps's thats right
1223 2011-03-16 03:50:19 <validus> he said t he other day he had friends that gave them to him
1224 2011-03-16 03:50:34 <validus> so ban evading and still trolling
1225 2011-03-16 03:50:36 <x6763> i've ignored all of those nicks, plus 4 ip addresses
1226 2011-03-16 03:50:40 <noagendamarket> thanks x6763
1227 2011-03-16 03:50:45 <validus> thats pretty serious troll to go in off of 4 ips
1228 2011-03-16 03:50:51 <validus> i mean are you really that bored?
1229 2011-03-16 03:50:58 <validus> go fap to something or do something lol
1230 2011-03-16 03:51:01 <x6763> lol
1231 2011-03-16 03:51:06 <noagendamarket> lol
1232 2011-03-16 03:51:44 <noagendamarket> thats what we get for trolling the central banks
1233 2011-03-16 03:51:58 <noagendamarket> we get trolled back :)
1234 2011-03-16 03:52:00 <kiba> satoshi is pretty unique amongst open source founder
1235 2011-03-16 03:52:04 <validus> nah
1236 2011-03-16 03:52:08 <kiba> 1. He's anonymous
1237 2011-03-16 03:52:17 <validus> he just has some weird obstruct views and wants to see it fail here, so he is pushing them onto people
1238 2011-03-16 03:52:22 <validus> if he gets 1 he succeeds
1239 2011-03-16 03:52:23 <kiba> 2. Step down when bitcoin starts to matter
1240 2011-03-16 03:52:48 <validus> not as anonymous as he thinks
1241 2011-03-16 03:52:48 <x6763> http://pastebin.com/Ty9n8YPM
1242 2011-03-16 03:53:24 <noagendamarket> rob hill ?
1243 2011-03-16 03:53:26 <noagendamarket> lol
1244 2011-03-16 03:53:31 <validus> but thats alot of time and effort for no apparent goal
1245 2011-03-16 03:53:33 <x6763> noagendamarket: probably not a real name
1246 2011-03-16 03:53:37 <x6763> but who knows
1247 2011-03-16 03:54:08 <validus> what you do is get the ip. traceroute it to their isp. get the agent # of their isp. do a fake call in. get personal info
1248 2011-03-16 03:54:13 <validus> then scare them with hellow MR. blah
1249 2011-03-16 03:54:17 <x6763> lol
1250 2011-03-16 03:54:31 <validus> or if they are retarded and registered their machine with their actual name just do a simple nmap, espicially in windows since ppl like to name their pc their actual name
1251 2011-03-16 03:54:38 <kiba> is he gilicorn?
1252 2011-03-16 03:54:43 <validus> and that freaks people out to . thats at least what we did in the 90's when we got bored
1253 2011-03-16 03:54:45 <x6763> kiba: not sure
1254 2011-03-16 03:54:52 <noagendamarket> lol
1255 2011-03-16 03:55:01 <validus> just go to any kind of marxism type room and you will find him
1256 2011-03-16 03:55:09 <validus> cept his views are not truly marxism
1257 2011-03-16 03:55:10 * kiba prepare himself for a ritue
1258 2011-03-16 03:55:16 <x6763> kiba: yes, i think he is gilicorn
1259 2011-03-16 03:55:23 <validus> just marxism undertones mixed with some communism
1260 2011-03-16 03:55:29 <validus> disguised as a liberal
1261 2011-03-16 03:55:31 <x6763> kiba: a whois on gilicorn brings up one of the 4 ips i ignored
1262 2011-03-16 03:55:39 <x6763> one of the 4 ips farzong used before
1263 2011-03-16 03:55:52 <kiba> x6763: he's pretty good at spewing nonsense
1264 2011-03-16 03:55:53 <validus> x6763: he said he had vps's gave to him. it could be someone different but if they joined here its probably the same
1265 2011-03-16 03:56:07 <x6763> validus: yeah, i suspect it's the same person
1266 2011-03-16 03:56:17 <validus> arg i really wanna fix this audiodg. *cries*
1267 2011-03-16 03:56:25 <validus> i am truly stumped
1268 2011-03-16 03:57:07 BitterTea has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
1269 2011-03-16 03:58:20 da2ce7 has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
1270 2011-03-16 03:58:22 harkar has joined
1271 2011-03-16 03:58:24 <harkar> lopl
1272 2011-03-16 03:58:27 <harkar> x6763 is tracking my every move! hahahah. he had to ignore me when i brought up the inconvenient history of his hero ludwig von mises.. turns out mises was a prominent fascist
1273 2011-03-16 03:58:27 <harkar> <x6763> blarzong: i recommend you re-read *all* of human action [...]
1274 2011-03-16 03:58:27 <harkar> the manifesto by the same mises who declared that fascism was wonderful: "Fascism and similar movements aiming at the establishment of dictatorships are full of the best intentions and that their intervention has, for the moment, saved European civilization. The merit that Fascism has thereby won for itself will live on eternally in history."
1275 2011-03-16 03:58:27 <harkar> x6, you are really freaking out about this
1276 2011-03-16 03:58:27 <harkar> heh
1277 2011-03-16 03:58:28 harkar has left ()
1278 2011-03-16 03:58:44 <x6763> lmao
1279 2011-03-16 03:58:49 da2ce7 has joined
1280 2011-03-16 03:58:50 <validus> so another vps in the room to
1281 2011-03-16 03:58:53 <validus> pretty gay
1282 2011-03-16 03:59:02 <validus> cant face facts like a man and has to hide and mock people
1283 2011-03-16 04:00:09 dissipate has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
1284 2011-03-16 04:00:15 <validus> and from debates and trolls i seen here. debates go great if you can actually have an argument
1285 2011-03-16 04:00:26 <validus> not just claim troll to anyone who oppose you that was the funniest thing i ever saw but annoying
1286 2011-03-16 04:00:51 <validus> but were making him happy by talking about him so screw that
1287 2011-03-16 04:00:53 <validus> </done>
1288 2011-03-16 04:01:06 charguar has joined
1289 2011-03-16 04:01:15 <charguar> validus, do you want some cheese with your whiiine ?
1290 2011-03-16 04:01:16 <charguar> hahah
1291 2011-03-16 04:01:17 charguar has left ()
1292 2011-03-16 04:01:37 <validus> muenster cheese. mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
1293 2011-03-16 04:01:54 Spenvo has joined
1294 2011-03-16 04:02:07 <x6763> it's sad how he keeps posting the same quote taken out of context, from an economist that i do happen to agree with on a lot of things (but certainly not everything) in attempt to attack or discredit me...i guess i hurt his feelings or something
1295 2011-03-16 04:02:14 <validus> i think im going to get that some baconaiise and a turkey sandwhich and have a mouth orgasm
1296 2011-03-16 04:02:15 <validus> lol
1297 2011-03-16 04:02:22 <x6763> lol
1298 2011-03-16 04:02:39 <validus> i heard baconaiise is awesomesauce on sanwhiches
1299 2011-03-16 04:02:50 <validus> and muenster cheese is just that good
1300 2011-03-16 04:03:07 gargar has joined
1301 2011-03-16 04:03:22 <gargar> when you ban someone you disagree with, you admit you can't win the argument by reason, but only by censoring them. instantly discredits your position.
1302 2011-03-16 04:03:26 <gargar> you banned me haha!
1303 2011-03-16 04:03:34 <gargar> validus: nothing is taken out of context
1304 2011-03-16 04:03:42 <x6763> gargar: i think someone banned you for trolling
1305 2011-03-16 04:03:42 <validus> why you talking to me?
1306 2011-03-16 04:03:48 <validus> im talkinga bout making a sandwhich
1307 2011-03-16 04:03:54 <x6763> gargar: at least that's the reason they gave
1308 2011-03-16 04:03:54 <gargar> mises praised fascism, dictatorship, and was the economist for a mousillini-ite fascist
1309 2011-03-16 04:03:55 <validus> get your echo logs proper
1310 2011-03-16 04:03:58 <gargar> theres nothing out of context
1311 2011-03-16 04:04:11 <validus> anyways ya that entire isp block is going on ignore
1312 2011-03-16 04:04:24 <gargar> validus: do you want some hemmoroid cream?
1313 2011-03-16 04:04:28 <gargar> for that serious butthurt
1314 2011-03-16 04:04:31 <gargar> get this guy some bengay
1315 2011-03-16 04:04:33 <gargar> hahahahah
1316 2011-03-16 04:05:54 <gargar> validus and x6763 are smart guys.. they know their stuff.. mises has some interesting arguments, but he ignores the downside of capitalism (he constructs a fictional utopia and calls it capitalism unfortunately)
1317 2011-03-16 04:06:05 <gargar> of course he was a fascist too
1318 2011-03-16 04:06:12 <gargar> that should tell you what he really thought about freedom
1319 2011-03-16 04:06:23 <validus> hmm i wonder if re installing sp1 will fix this audiodg problem
1320 2011-03-16 04:06:31 <validus> thats the only thing i havent tried
1321 2011-03-16 04:06:36 <gargar> validus: try installing your mom
1322 2011-03-16 04:06:39 <nanotube> x6763: heh thanks for collecting the info. heh. :)
1323 2011-03-16 04:06:53 <gargar> yeah hahaa. this guy is some internet sleuth!
1324 2011-03-16 04:06:59 <gargar> collecting /whois info!!! bahaa
1325 2011-03-16 04:07:07 <gargar> its kind of sad
1326 2011-03-16 04:07:30 <bt2100> uh
1327 2011-03-16 04:07:31 <gargar> oh you mean ill have to login with one of my million other vhosts ? shit
1328 2011-03-16 04:08:05 <x6763> nanotube: no prob...anyone's free to append and republish if they see any benefit in doing so
1329 2011-03-16 04:08:19 <gargar> lol hes obsessed
1330 2011-03-16 04:08:20 <validus> isnt this room logged and displayed anywyas?
1331 2011-03-16 04:08:23 <validus> anyways*
1332 2011-03-16 04:08:32 <x6763> validus: yeah, there's a log somehwere
1333 2011-03-16 04:08:39 <gargar> yeah in the topic
1334 2011-03-16 04:08:49 <gargar> but no worries, x6763 is reposting public logs n'shit
1335 2011-03-16 04:08:55 <gargar> totally awesome sleuthing, jackass
1336 2011-03-16 04:09:04 <validus> then itll be handled in all due time
1337 2011-03-16 04:09:17 <x6763> http://veritas.maximilianeum.ch/bitcoin/irc/logs/
1338 2011-03-16 04:09:19 <gargar> handle your moms
1339 2011-03-16 04:09:31 BitterTea has joined
1340 2011-03-16 04:09:31 BitterTea has quit (Changing host)
1341 2011-03-16 04:09:31 BitterTea has joined
1342 2011-03-16 04:09:36 <validus> just have to suffer till then
1343 2011-03-16 04:09:40 <validus> sup bittertea
1344 2011-03-16 04:09:42 <validus> or use ignore :D
1345 2011-03-16 04:09:44 <gargar> x6763: are you so butthurt that youre now documenting my every entrance on the chan? lol
1346 2011-03-16 04:09:54 <validus> BitterTea: what part of the city you in?
1347 2011-03-16 04:09:58 <gargar> x6763: even tho its already all public and logged on the bitcoin site? lol
1348 2011-03-16 04:10:11 <gargar> that is really pathetic my man
1349 2011-03-16 04:10:33 <gargar> feel free to send zebraporn to 0x6763@gmail.com
1350 2011-03-16 04:10:42 <dirtyfilthy> you're pathetic
1351 2011-03-16 04:10:52 <validus> oh is he still talking?
1352 2011-03-16 04:11:01 <validus> just add to ignore and dont feed em. kinda like the zoo. dont feed the animals
1353 2011-03-16 04:11:07 <dirtyfilthy> yeah you're right, i'll stop feeding the troll
1354 2011-03-16 04:11:08 <validus> its much more peaceful on ignore
1355 2011-03-16 04:11:11 <validus> :)
1356 2011-03-16 04:11:17 <gargar> dirtyfilthy: go back to the peanut gallery, troll
1357 2011-03-16 04:11:24 <dirtyfilthy> ah that's better
1358 2011-03-16 04:11:26 <gargar> dirtyfilthy: is your nick a reference to your mom's snatch?
1359 2011-03-16 04:11:33 <gargar> lol
1360 2011-03-16 04:11:51 <validus> ya can actually have a conversation now
1361 2011-03-16 04:11:53 <validus> without it being interrupted
1362 2011-03-16 04:12:26 <bt2100> hrm need more GPU powerrr dammit
1363 2011-03-16 04:12:30 * bt2100 shops newegg
1364 2011-03-16 04:12:48 <validus> im eyein one of those 6990's
1365 2011-03-16 04:12:55 <validus> but havent decided if i wanna spend it
1366 2011-03-16 04:12:56 <validus> lol
1367 2011-03-16 04:12:58 <bt2100> heh
1368 2011-03-16 04:13:14 <validus> that and a 32 inch 1080ptv is like right at a grand or a lil more
1369 2011-03-16 04:13:15 <bt2100> yeahhh i've been savin, but ya it's hard to part with the dough
1370 2011-03-16 04:13:19 <validus> and i only gave myself 2 grand to build a system
1371 2011-03-16 04:13:19 <jgarzik> first three (3) people to post a bitcoin address will receive free money
1372 2011-03-16 04:13:24 <jgarzik> I'm testing something
1373 2011-03-16 04:13:24 <validus> gotta go through some options
1374 2011-03-16 04:13:27 <nanotube> ;;botsnack
1375 2011-03-16 04:13:27 <gribble> Forget the snack, just send me some bitcoins at 1MgD6rah5zUgEGYZnNmdpnXMaDR3itKYzU :)
1376 2011-03-16 04:13:30 <nanotube> jgarzik: -^
1377 2011-03-16 04:13:30 <nanotube> :)
1378 2011-03-16 04:13:34 <jgarzik> one
1379 2011-03-16 04:13:36 <validus> 1HmxACRTTh6ryRaJoUAjuLYDKzyQdSRUbv
1380 2011-03-16 04:13:38 <jgarzik> two
1381 2011-03-16 04:14:00 <bt2100> 17wt3PdqNBoMAa9mQis3qcEr4biu1cDJtf ?
1382 2011-03-16 04:14:04 <jgarzik> three
1383 2011-03-16 04:14:05 <validus> but a 27 inch monitor is at 339 and a 32 inch 1080p tv is at 330
1384 2011-03-16 04:14:20 <validus> so im going for tv i believe as i dont really need much more than that resolution
1385 2011-03-16 04:15:20 <nanotube> jgarzik: testing multisend? :)
1386 2011-03-16 04:15:45 <bt2100> btw jgarzik thanks for making your miner easy as hell to setup; i'm running it on a handful of b0xen.
1387 2011-03-16 04:19:12 <sneak> hi guys
1388 2011-03-16 04:19:32 <jgarzik> nanotube: yep :)
1389 2011-03-16 04:19:38 <sneak> what is multisend?
1390 2011-03-16 04:19:38 <jgarzik> hitting a snag with accounts, though
1391 2011-03-16 04:19:43 TheKid has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1392 2011-03-16 04:19:57 <luke-jr> sneak: sending to multiple addresses at once
1393 2011-03-16 04:20:08 <luke-jr> sneak: used for, eg, pool payouts
1394 2011-03-16 04:20:23 <sneak> why not just do multiple txns? anticipation of txn fees?
1395 2011-03-16 04:20:36 <jgarzik> there we go.  txid 4a16969aa4764dd7507fc1de7f0baa4850a246de90c45e59a3207f9a26b5036f
1396 2011-03-16 04:20:44 <luke-jr> sneak: more expensive
1397 2011-03-16 04:20:49 <luke-jr> sneak: no anticipation needed
1398 2011-03-16 04:20:54 TheKid has joined
1399 2011-03-16 04:20:54 TheKid has quit (Changing host)
1400 2011-03-16 04:20:54 TheKid has joined
1401 2011-03-16 04:21:14 <nanotube> jgarzik: cool. and... i was never really a big fan of built-in accounts. if i want accounts, i'll just make my own db layer on top of my bitcoin wallet.
1402 2011-03-16 04:21:25 * luke-jr wonders how that will show up in -watch
1403 2011-03-16 04:21:32 <sneak> nanotube: individual accounts are important for anonymity
1404 2011-03-16 04:21:42 <luke-jr> …
1405 2011-03-16 04:21:52 <sneak> or, rather, pseduonymity
1406 2011-03-16 04:21:53 <luke-jr> sneak: the built-in accounting stuff is JUST accounting
1407 2011-03-16 04:22:09 <nanotube> sneak: no, i'm talking about the accounts layer in the bitcoin client.
1408 2011-03-16 04:22:15 <nanotube> sneak: on top of the addressing
1409 2011-03-16 04:22:22 <sneak> i didn't realize there was such a thing
1410 2011-03-16 04:22:37 <nanotube> yea well... it's not useful for a regular end user.
1411 2011-03-16 04:22:45 <nanotube> it is aimed at site operators
1412 2011-03-16 04:22:55 <sneak> this must be new in the last few versions
1413 2011-03-16 04:22:57 <nanotube> ;;bc,blocks
1414 2011-03-16 04:22:57 <gribble> 113696
1415 2011-03-16 04:22:58 <sneak> i haven't upgraded in ages
1416 2011-03-16 04:23:01 <luke-jr> sneak: not really new
1417 2011-03-16 04:23:01 <nanotube> sneak: yes it's pretty new.
1418 2011-03-16 04:23:06 <luke-jr> nanotube: ⁇?
1419 2011-03-16 04:23:13 <nanotube> well, i think it only came with .19
1420 2011-03-16 04:23:18 <nanotube> and we are now on... .20
1421 2011-03-16 04:23:21 <nanotube> so :)
1422 2011-03-16 04:23:21 <nanotube> pretty new
1423 2011-03-16 04:23:38 <luke-jr> O.o
1424 2011-03-16 04:23:40 <sneak> woo, hit the jackpot
1425 2011-03-16 04:23:49 <sneak> my mining box found two blocks when probability said it should have found .2
1426 2011-03-16 04:23:50 <jgarzik> I wonder how long it will take for this sendmany TX to confirm
1427 2011-03-16 04:23:56 <jgarzik> which miners will accept it?  :)
1428 2011-03-16 04:23:59 <nanotube> sneak: nice :)
1429 2011-03-16 04:24:07 <luke-jr> sneak: you can't find .2 blocks
1430 2011-03-16 04:24:14 <sneak> luke-jr: probability says i can
1431 2011-03-16 04:24:16 <nanotube> jgarzik: mm i'm still not seeing it in my client, cuz my client was off at the time of your send... heh.
1432 2011-03-16 04:24:19 <luke-jr> jgarzik: what kind of fees on it?
1433 2011-03-16 04:24:23 <luke-jr> sneak: nope
1434 2011-03-16 04:24:32 <luke-jr> sneak: it is impossible to find .2 blocks
1435 2011-03-16 04:24:33 <jgarzik> maybe if slush or [Tycho] or another pool has upgraded their server...
1436 2011-03-16 04:24:42 <jgarzik> luke-jr: none, so we'll see what happens
1437 2011-03-16 04:24:44 <sneak> luke-jr: that's not what i was saying and you know it
1438 2011-03-16 04:24:51 <luke-jr> jgarzik: might wait for the no-fee miner
1439 2011-03-16 04:24:52 <sneak> hence my statement, "woo, hit the jackpot"
1440 2011-03-16 04:25:24 <luke-jr> how much MH does Theymos have?
1441 2011-03-16 04:25:37 <luke-jr> he accepts non-std tx without fees
1442 2011-03-16 04:25:53 <luke-jr> jgarzik: did you broadcast it on the non-std network?
1443 2011-03-16 04:25:54 <sneak> my bitcoin directory is 177MB now
1444 2011-03-16 04:25:57 <sneak> that seems excessive
1445 2011-03-16 04:25:58 <luke-jr> if not, it might never get into a block
1446 2011-03-16 04:26:04 <luke-jr> sneak: might be debug.log
1447 2011-03-16 04:26:13 <sneak> 135384	blkindex.dat
1448 2011-03-16 04:26:13 <sneak> 187112	blk0001.dat
1449 2011-03-16 04:26:17 <luke-jr> jgarzik: https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Free_transaction_relay_policy
1450 2011-03-16 04:26:24 <lfm> and it is possible to get .2 blocks in a pool
1451 2011-03-16 04:26:39 <sneak> 91mb blk001.dat and 66mb blkindex.dat
1452 2011-03-16 04:26:48 <luke-jr> jgarzik: broadcast to that IP, and it should get in eventually
1453 2011-03-16 04:26:57 <sneak> gui takes forever to start, hangs on 'loading block index...' for a loon gtime
1454 2011-03-16 04:27:13 <sneak> i bet there's a better/faster way of storing this data other than bdb
1455 2011-03-16 04:27:21 <luke-jr> sneak: delete everything but wallet.dat (IIRC)
1456 2011-03-16 04:27:34 <sneak> luke-jr: do you have any idea how long it takes to redownload the chain
1457 2011-03-16 04:27:41 <luke-jr> an hour or so?
1458 2011-03-16 04:27:44 <sneak> hint: it's forEVAR
1459 2011-03-16 04:27:46 <Aciid> sneak: some hours
1460 2011-03-16 04:27:57 <sneak> try it on tor sometime
1461 2011-03-16 04:27:58 <luke-jr> sneak: do it when you go to bed
1462 2011-03-16 04:28:07 <sneak> i never sleep, because sleep is the cousin of death
1463 2011-03-16 04:28:08 <x6763> when i downloaded the block chain a few months ago it took at least a couple hours
1464 2011-03-16 04:28:08 <Aciid> sneak: that is just stupid
1465 2011-03-16 04:28:19 <Aciid> sneak: the blockchain is p2p
1466 2011-03-16 04:28:21 <lfm> sneak dont use tor then
1467 2011-03-16 04:28:36 <luke-jr> tor only *slightly* makes sense when you are sending a tx
1468 2011-03-16 04:28:44 <sneak> i don't want my isp to know i run bitcoin
1469 2011-03-16 04:28:48 <sneak> it has nothing to do with my transactions.
1470 2011-03-16 04:28:56 <sneak> there is more than one kind of privacy, you know.
1471 2011-03-16 04:29:16 * luke-jr tells sneak's ISP
1472 2011-03-16 04:29:23 <luke-jr> there, now there's nothing you can do about that
1473 2011-03-16 04:29:29 <luke-jr> so might as well just give up
1474 2011-03-16 04:29:43 <lfm> sneak you can also fine a .zip download to get a head start on the block chain download process
1475 2011-03-16 04:29:45 <Aciid> sneak: out of all the traffic, I think they wont filter out "omg new trendy never before seen traffic, we must monitor this guy more he surely is a conspiratorist"
1476 2011-03-16 04:29:46 agorist has joined
1477 2011-03-16 04:30:16 <nanotube> Aciid: a little extra paranoia never hurt anyone. :) you never know if /later on/ govt might take interest and ask isp's for logs and crap.
1478 2011-03-16 04:30:18 <sneak> Aciid: all they'd have to do is log packet headers of stuff that ain't 80 or 443 or identified as bittorrent.
1479 2011-03-16 04:30:25 <sneak> disks are -really- cheap.
1480 2011-03-16 04:30:32 <sneak> it's not what they're doing now that i worry about
1481 2011-03-16 04:30:36 agorist has quit (Client Quit)
1482 2011-03-16 04:30:38 <sneak> it's what someone might do with stored data in a year or three
1483 2011-03-16 04:30:47 <sneak> why take a chance?
1484 2011-03-16 04:30:53 <sneak> tor works great.
1485 2011-03-16 04:30:56 <bt2100> good point
1486 2011-03-16 04:31:01 <luke-jr> sneak: you just said it doesn't.
1487 2011-03-16 04:31:01 <nanotube> sneak: and you were complaining about my paranoia with gpg keys on otc just a short while ago, eh? hehe.
1488 2011-03-16 04:31:20 <sneak> nanotube: no, i was complaining about you being a sperglord, i specifically said to continue being paranoid :)
1489 2011-03-16 04:31:20 <lfm> sneak you think your isp logs all your traffic? thats rather amazing
1490 2011-03-16 04:31:26 <sneak> lfm: i said "packet headers"
1491 2011-03-16 04:31:31 <sneak> and i live in a non-free country
1492 2011-03-16 04:31:35 <sneak> there are precedents.
1493 2011-03-16 04:31:48 <lfm> hmmm
1494 2011-03-16 04:31:53 <nanotube> ;;ud sperglord
1495 2011-03-16 04:31:54 <gribble> http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=sperglord | Internet caricature of typical self diagnosed aspergers suffering shutin that has to provide input on everything and anything in the most ...
1496 2011-03-16 04:32:01 <luke-jr> sneak: but they don't mind you using tor?
1497 2011-03-16 04:32:02 <sneak> i think it's well within the realm of possibility for an isp to log metadata, e.g. connects to nonstandard ports (not necessarily traffic)
1498 2011-03-16 04:32:04 <nanotube> heh
1499 2011-03-16 04:32:24 <sneak> tor is encrypted and relatively opaque.  also, most importantly, it's COMMON
1500 2011-03-16 04:32:30 <luke-jr> LOL
1501 2011-03-16 04:32:31 <nanotube> sneak: and there i thought it was just a made-up word. :) how wrong i was.
1502 2011-03-16 04:32:34 <luke-jr> tor. common. sure.
1503 2011-03-16 04:32:42 <justmoon> quick question: what would happen if a miner said "hey guyyys, I got this awesome new valid block here, it's 2 TB with six billion tx, happy downloading"
1504 2011-03-16 04:33:01 <luke-jr> justmoon: the block size limit?
1505 2011-03-16 04:33:08 <justmoon> what is the size limit?
1506 2011-03-16 04:33:09 <sneak> justmoon: they'd have to solve it by doing sha256 on a 2TB block, too
1507 2011-03-16 04:33:11 <luke-jr> 1 MB IIRC
1508 2011-03-16 04:33:15 <sneak> :P
1509 2011-03-16 04:33:16 <luke-jr> sneak: erm, no
1510 2011-03-16 04:33:30 <sneak> err wait no
1511 2011-03-16 04:33:32 <sneak> merkle trees
1512 2011-03-16 04:33:32 <sneak> duh
1513 2011-03-16 04:33:33 <sneak> nm
1514 2011-03-16 04:33:35 * sneak just woke up
1515 2011-03-16 04:33:44 <luke-jr> also, you couldn't verify it without downloading all 2 TB
1516 2011-03-16 04:33:45 <justmoon> luke-jr: thx!
1517 2011-03-16 04:35:03 <sneak> bitcoind doesn't seem to ask for new blocks when it's doing its AddAddress() thing
1518 2011-03-16 04:35:05 <luke-jr> jgarzik: still haven't seen your sendmany tx in -watch; so unless you're doing testnet, it's not on the free relay network
1519 2011-03-16 04:35:10 kiba` has joined
1520 2011-03-16 04:35:20 <sneak> it takes a long time to sync up to the network's current block number
1521 2011-03-16 04:35:35 <sneak> even when running somewhere else and not behind tor
1522 2011-03-16 04:35:37 jwalck has joined
1523 2011-03-16 04:36:08 <lfm> sneak about 1 hour on normal nets
1524 2011-03-16 04:36:20 <sneak> i mean with a recent relaunch
1525 2011-03-16 04:36:25 <sneak> it was synced a few days ago
1526 2011-03-16 04:36:41 <sneak> it sits for 20 minutes logging AddAddress() to debug.log before it starts downloading more blocks
1527 2011-03-16 04:36:44 kiba has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
1528 2011-03-16 04:36:48 <lfm> did you try -rescan?
1529 2011-03-16 04:36:51 <sneak> even with a bunch of connections
1530 2011-03-16 04:36:52 <sneak> what's that?
1531 2011-03-16 04:37:05 <sneak> (no, i did not)
1532 2011-03-16 04:37:08 <lfm> command line switch on newwer versions
1533 2011-03-16 04:37:13 <sneak> oh, i don't have a newer version.
1534 2011-03-16 04:37:32 <lfm> might be worth upgrading then
1535 2011-03-16 04:37:40 x6763- has joined
1536 2011-03-16 04:37:40 <sneak> It Ain't Broke.
1537 2011-03-16 04:37:44 <x6763-> pls send any zoo porn to x6763@gmail.com  if you have something with horses and blondes i'd appreciate it.
1538 2011-03-16 04:37:45 <sneak> just slow.
1539 2011-03-16 04:37:46 <x6763-> thx so much!
1540 2011-03-16 04:37:46 x6763- has left ()
1541 2011-03-16 04:38:07 <sneak> /msg x6763- sorry my horse porn is with brunettes, still want it?
1542 2011-03-16 04:38:08 <sneak> oops
1543 2011-03-16 04:38:54 <x6763> wtf?
1544 2011-03-16 04:39:00 <bt2100> i need more computers; more bitcoins!
1545 2011-03-16 04:39:18 <Aciid> nees more porn
1546 2011-03-16 04:39:32 <bt2100> haha that's good too
1547 2011-03-16 04:39:55 x6763- has joined
1548 2011-03-16 04:39:57 <x6763-> pls send any zoo porn to 0x6763@gmail.com  if you have something with horses and blondes i'd appreciate it. i made a typo before in my email. thx so much!
1549 2011-03-16 04:40:17 <Aciid> sneak: have you tried ipredator?
1550 2011-03-16 04:40:27 <x6763-> im trading mescaline / zoo porn or vhs crush videos if anyone wants them email 0x6763@gmail.com
1551 2011-03-16 04:40:30 <x6763-> thanks!
1552 2011-03-16 04:40:30 x6763- has left ()
1553 2011-03-16 04:40:35 <sneak> Aciid: i don't trust the swedes
1554 2011-03-16 04:40:37 <x6763> what a dumbass
1555 2011-03-16 04:40:51 <sneak> ooh crush videos
1556 2011-03-16 04:40:58 <Aciid> sneak: not any of the VPN providers?
1557 2011-03-16 04:41:22 validus has quit (Quit: ( www.nnscript.com :: NoNameScript 4.22 :: www.esnation.com ))
1558 2011-03-16 04:41:22 <sneak> i do a SOCKS proxy over ssh to one of my colo'd machines sometimes, but it's not a matter of my first-hop isp
1559 2011-03-16 04:41:29 <sneak> i would rather that none of my isps know i run bitcoin.
1560 2011-03-16 04:41:49 <sneak> running a tor node i can play off as "i support egypt, or something"
1561 2011-03-16 04:42:06 <Aciid> I've been thinking of sometimes routing my modem over to my coloc for VPN
1562 2011-03-16 04:42:07 <sneak> the fbi has heard of tor, for example.
1563 2011-03-16 04:42:14 <Aciid> but then I've been thinking that banking wouldnt work
1564 2011-03-16 04:42:20 <sneak> yes it will
1565 2011-03-16 04:42:29 <sneak> at least, if i am correct in assuming that you bank in the usa
1566 2011-03-16 04:42:41 x6763- has joined
1567 2011-03-16 04:42:49 <Aciid> I live in Europe
1568 2011-03-16 04:42:52 <x6763-> how do i delete that request for zoo porn from the log? i dont want this to show up on google
1569 2011-03-16 04:42:54 <x6763-> thx!
1570 2011-03-16 04:42:54 x6763- has left ()
1571 2011-03-16 04:42:57 <Aciid> wtf
1572 2011-03-16 04:43:05 <Aciid> hahahah
1573 2011-03-16 04:43:12 <sneak> i do too, usa banks all politely fail to notice my euro ip address when i log in
1574 2011-03-16 04:43:24 <Diablo-D3> http://whotookspaz.org/randomflash/hey.swf
1575 2011-03-16 04:43:26 <Diablo-D3> the best is the ending.
1576 2011-03-16 04:43:48 <sneak> Diablo-D3: is that the one where the punchline exploits the new flash 0day and takes over your computer?
1577 2011-03-16 04:44:02 <Diablo-D3> sneak: no
1578 2011-03-16 04:44:08 <Aciid> hey.swf sounds like lastmeasure
1579 2011-03-16 04:44:13 <Diablo-D3> the punchline is adam of eternia is gay.
1580 2011-03-16 04:44:28 <sneak> you know what's really super gay?
1581 2011-03-16 04:44:31 <sneak> those men who have sex with other men
1582 2011-03-16 04:44:44 <sneak> that's like, the gayest shit i've ever heard
1583 2011-03-16 04:44:44 <Aciid> lots of engrish people at marketplace nowadays
1584 2011-03-16 04:44:56 <Aciid> sounds like polish kids
1585 2011-03-16 04:45:02 <Aciid> http://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=4505.msg66064#msg66064
1586 2011-03-16 04:45:06 <Aciid> or possible indian
1587 2011-03-16 04:46:41 validus has joined
1588 2011-03-16 04:47:46 <nanotube> x6763: please feel free to give the guy a ban and a kick if he shows up again. :)
1589 2011-03-16 04:47:57 <x6763> wow, i was given ops?
1590 2011-03-16 04:48:07 <x6763> haha, thanks nanotube
1591 2011-03-16 04:48:20 <validus> now i just pray you have insomnia
1592 2011-03-16 04:48:21 <validus> lol
1593 2011-03-16 04:48:43 <x6763> geez, now i'm getting private messages from him
1594 2011-03-16 04:49:01 bk128 has quit (Quit: bk128)
1595 2011-03-16 04:49:35 <x6763> validus: lol, yeah, i'm going to bed soon
1596 2011-03-16 04:50:01 bk128 has joined
1597 2011-03-16 04:50:17 <phantomcircuit> Aciid, lol i love that
1598 2011-03-16 04:50:30 CyanDynamo has joined
1599 2011-03-16 04:50:38 <phantomcircuit> I was recently forced to work with an indian guy in india
1600 2011-03-16 04:50:49 <phantomcircuit> i literally redid 2 weeks of his labor in about 4 hours
1601 2011-03-16 04:50:50 <phantomcircuit> >.>
1602 2011-03-16 04:51:16 <bt2100> i believe you
1603 2011-03-16 04:51:38 <Aciid> I've worked with Indian PHP coders
1604 2011-03-16 04:51:43 <Aciid> jesus..
1605 2011-03-16 04:51:50 <sneak> i've had to translate variable names
1606 2011-03-16 04:51:50 <phantomcircuit> actually it was more like a years worth since his code was shit and mine wasnt
1607 2011-03-16 04:51:52 <sneak> from hindi
1608 2011-03-16 04:52:02 <phantomcircuit> sneak, that's not bad
1609 2011-03-16 04:52:11 <sneak> (it was in broken php code.)
1610 2011-03-16 04:52:23 <sneak> (that i was trying to debug.)
1611 2011-03-16 04:52:33 <Aciid> also manufacturing server had Nulled PHP script zip's
1612 2011-03-16 04:52:36 <validus> thats when you rm -rf and rewrite
1613 2011-03-16 04:52:37 <validus> :P
1614 2011-03-16 04:52:44 <Aciid> "I was like ok"
1615 2011-03-16 04:57:05 <Aciid> http://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=4495.msg65927#msg65927
1616 2011-03-16 04:57:15 <Aciid> where do these keep coming from
1617 2011-03-16 04:58:40 <Aciid> http://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=4494.msg66004#msg66004
1618 2011-03-16 04:58:44 <Aciid> okey im done
1619 2011-03-16 04:59:41 <Aciid> x6763: the guys is now rolling at #bicoin-discussion
1620 2011-03-16 04:59:44 <Aciid> *bitcoin
1621 2011-03-16 04:59:53 <Aciid> 06:55 -!- x6763- [~zyphur@c-76-22-2-29.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined
1622 2011-03-16 04:59:53 <Aciid>           #bitcoin-discussion
1623 2011-03-16 04:59:53 <Aciid> 06:55 < x6763-> lol
1624 2011-03-16 04:59:53 <Aciid> 06:55 < x6763-> nanoboob
1625 2011-03-16 04:59:53 <Aciid> 06:55 < x6763-> hey nanotube, why dont you op greg in here also
1626 2011-03-16 04:59:55 <Aciid> 06:55 < x6763-> lmao
1627 2011-03-16 04:59:58 <Aciid> 06:55 -!- x6763- [~zyphur@c-76-22-2-29.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has left
1628 2011-03-16 05:00:00 <Aciid>           #bitcoin-discussion []
1629 2011-03-16 05:00:27 <nevezen> isn't tor patented tech?
1630 2011-03-16 05:00:46 <Diablo-D3> http://whotookspaz.org/randomflash/Nazi_Vampire_6.swf
1631 2011-03-16 05:00:50 <Diablo-D3> do want this music
1632 2011-03-16 05:01:25 <Aciid> nevezen: its FOSS
1633 2011-03-16 05:02:19 <nevezen> I mean onion routing
1634 2011-03-16 05:02:23 <nevezen> which tor is based off
1635 2011-03-16 05:02:46 <nevezen> patented by the US Navy. :P
1636 2011-03-16 05:08:03 alystair has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
1637 2011-03-16 05:08:18 <x6763> Aciid: i see, thanks
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1641 2011-03-16 05:12:51 <jgarzik> ArtForz: will your node relay/mint sendmany TX's?
1642 2011-03-16 05:14:39 <lfm> i think std client accepts and forwards sendmany txns
1643 2011-03-16 05:21:45 <jgarzik> lfm: nope, sendmany fails the isStandard test
1644 2011-03-16 05:21:52 <jgarzik> lfm: http://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=4254.0
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1658 2011-03-16 05:56:29 <JFK911> ;;bc,stats
1659 2011-03-16 05:56:31 <gribble> Current Blocks: 113708 | Current Difficulty: 76193.9710474 | Next Difficulty At Block: 114911 | Next Difficulty In: 1203 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 2 days, 18 hours, 35 minutes, and 6 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 65221.51159435
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1667 2011-03-16 06:29:46 * da2ce7 *** everyone install flashblock ***
1668 2011-03-16 06:30:20 <da2ce7> unpatched vulnerability found
1669 2011-03-16 06:31:58 LobsterMan has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1670 2011-03-16 06:31:58 su_tesla has joined
1671 2011-03-16 06:34:26 <da2ce7> or noscript
1672 2011-03-16 06:35:22 LobsterMan has joined
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1674 2011-03-16 06:35:22 LobsterMan has joined
1675 2011-03-16 06:38:33 <[Tycho]> ;;bc,gen 1300000
1676 2011-03-16 06:38:34 <gribble> The expected generation output, at 1300000 Khps, given current difficulty of 76193.9710474 , is 17.1611595615 BTC per day and 0.715048315062 BTC per hour.
1677 2011-03-16 06:49:12 <sneak> ;;bc,gen 600000
1678 2011-03-16 06:49:13 <gribble> The expected generation output, at 600000 Khps, given current difficulty of 76193.9710474 , is 7.92053518222 BTC per day and 0.330022299259 BTC per hour.
1679 2011-03-16 06:49:17 Spenvo_ has joined
1680 2011-03-16 06:49:24 <sneak> that is still profitable over electricity, i think
1681 2011-03-16 06:51:32 Spenvo has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
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1686 2011-03-16 07:00:59 <jgarzik> ah hah!  I found python's ternary operator:
1687 2011-03-16 07:01:01 <jgarzik> 'valid_share'   : True if m.group(10) == 'Y' else False,
1688 2011-03-16 07:01:16 <jgarzik> x if a > b else y
1689 2011-03-16 07:03:26 `Jaka is now known as Mango-chnan
1690 2011-03-16 07:04:26 Mango-chnan is now known as Mango-chan
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1699 2011-03-16 07:59:35 <[Tycho]> Trial begins for Bernard Von NotHaus, creator of the Liberty Dollar.
1700 2011-03-16 08:14:02 pogden has joined
1701 2011-03-16 08:15:42 <phantomcircuit> [Tycho], they're actually taking that to trial?
1702 2011-03-16 08:15:56 <phantomcircuit> iirc he has the freaking head of the treasury saying it's legal on tape
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1705 2011-03-16 08:22:44 <[Tycho]> phantomcircuit, that's news.
1706 2011-03-16 08:22:54 defaced has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
1707 2011-03-16 08:23:09 <[Tycho]> http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/18/486.html
1708 2011-03-16 08:24:07 BlueMatt has joined
1709 2011-03-16 08:25:13 <phantomcircuit> [Tycho], iirc that has never actually been enforced except against counterfeiters
1710 2011-03-16 08:25:45 <[Tycho]> Well, may be something is changed now.
1711 2011-03-16 08:26:36 edcba has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
1712 2011-03-16 08:26:36 <[Tycho]> Pretty strict law, you are prosecuted even just for "passing" real money :)
1713 2011-03-16 08:26:58 <phantomcircuit> my guess is that he indeed has committed wire fraud and they're throwing that one in just to fuck with him
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1720 2011-03-16 08:44:55 <[Tycho]> http://www.dgcmagazine.com/blog/index.php/2008/07/16/kidnappers-demand-e-gold-for-safe-return-of-nigerian-soccer-players-brother/
1721 2011-03-16 08:45:18 <Aciid> [Tycho]: wth
1722 2011-03-16 08:45:33 <dirtyfilthy> whoa
1723 2011-03-16 08:45:42 <Aciid> I trust that if the kidnapping progresses to a payment stage, the e-gold techs will be tracking the $10,000 digital payment through their AT&T servers in ‘real time’ on one of those comfortable workstations in their Melbourne, FL offices.
1724 2011-03-16 08:45:48 <Aciid> ... AT&T servers ...
1725 2011-03-16 08:46:05 <Aciid> Bandwith cap reached, can't trace money any further
1726 2011-03-16 08:46:06 <Aciid> =D
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1733 2011-03-16 09:04:45 <xelister> jgarzik: why you hate c++ and boost, it is awesome :)  well visualbasic-minded people (strict/logican thinking challanged) despise c++ as too complex ;) but other then complexity, it may be the primary tool to produce very effective speed-wise, and yet quite secure, and top-level, programs
1734 2011-03-16 09:05:33 <xelister> Aciid: they will have someone pick it up in money and dissapear before they release him?
1735 2011-03-16 09:08:04 JohnnyFusion has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
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1737 2011-03-16 09:11:15 <xelister> YEY exploit in flash !
1738 2011-03-16 09:11:19 * xelister deinstalles flash everywhere
1739 2011-03-16 09:11:25 <xelister> gayness levels drop by 30% \o/
1740 2011-03-16 09:12:51 jedi95 has joined
1741 2011-03-16 09:13:59 <jedi95> ;;bc,estimate
1742 2011-03-16 09:13:59 <gribble> 65494.02625920
1743 2011-03-16 09:14:13 <xelister> ;;bc,stats
1744 2011-03-16 09:14:15 <gribble> Current Blocks: 113729 | Current Difficulty: 76193.9710474 | Next Difficulty At Block: 114911 | Next Difficulty In: 1182 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 2 days, 13 hours, 30 minutes, and 18 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 65494.02625920
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1748 2011-03-16 09:17:11 Spenvo_ is now known as Spenvo
1749 2011-03-16 09:24:25 <mizerydearia> wow, wtf?  is this serious?   http://technews.witcoin.com/p/476/New-York-man-faces-five-years-in-jail-for-linking-to-online-videos
1750 2011-03-16 09:26:21 <mizerydearia> wtf?  http://replay.waybackmachine.org/20100527000200/http://www.channelsurfing.net/
1751 2011-03-16 09:26:31 <mizerydearia> and now channelsurfing.net is pwn3d
1752 2011-03-16 09:27:41 <mizerydearia> The special agent detailed 17 copyrighted sports programs he was able to watch when he "clicked on links" at channelsurfing.net.
1753 2011-03-16 09:44:20 ElectRo` has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
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1757 2011-03-16 09:49:10 <CIA-95> bitcoinj: hearn@google.com * r35 /wiki/GettingStarted.wiki: Example of tracking chain download progress.
1758 2011-03-16 09:52:25 tg has joined
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1760 2011-03-16 10:03:01 BlueMatt has joined
1761 2011-03-16 10:03:22 <BlueMatt> bluematt.me/bitcoin-nightly :)
1762 2011-03-16 10:03:31 <BlueMatt> linux only for now, windows and block chain later
1763 2011-03-16 10:04:06 <TD> cool
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1778 2011-03-16 10:28:43 <FellowTraveler> hi all
1779 2011-03-16 10:28:50 <[Tycho]> Hello.
1780 2011-03-16 10:30:24 <RBecker> ;;bc,blocks
1781 2011-03-16 10:30:25 <gribble> 113740
1782 2011-03-16 10:32:14 [Tycho] has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1783 2011-03-16 10:50:38 devon_hillard has joined
1784 2011-03-16 10:52:45 <sipa> ;;bc,calc 1260000
1785 2011-03-16 10:52:47 <gribble> The average time to generate a block at 1260000 Khps, given current difficulty of 76193.9710474 , is 3 days, 0 hours, 8 minutes, and 42 seconds
1786 2011-03-16 10:53:14 <RBecker> ;;bc,gen 48986
1787 2011-03-16 10:53:15 <gribble> The expected generation output, at 48986 Khps, given current difficulty of 76193.9710474 , is 0.64665889406 BTC per day and 0.0269441205858 BTC per hour.
1788 2011-03-16 10:55:16 <UukGoblin> ;;bc,estimate
1789 2011-03-16 10:55:17 <gribble> 65901.02743509
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1792 2011-03-16 11:07:37 <MagicalTux> ok guys, I'm leaving Tokyo and moving a bit to the south, until things settle down
1793 2011-03-16 11:07:52 <lfm> good luck
1794 2011-03-16 11:08:35 <MagicalTux> things in the north are seriously wrong
1795 2011-03-16 11:08:43 <lfm> we have herd
1796 2011-03-16 11:09:19 <MagicalTux> because of radioactivity they can't put water on the nuclear reactor via helicopter as initially planned, so they are playing games trying to aim with a fire truck
1797 2011-03-16 11:09:24 <MagicalTux> "FLASH: Japan police will attempt to cool no. 4 reactor spent nuclear fuel pool using water cannon truck - TV" (source: @Reuters)
1798 2011-03-16 11:09:38 <sipa> yeah, i read it in the news
1799 2011-03-16 11:10:13 <MagicalTux> so I like, went to the station and bought a ticket to the next available train (tommorow morning)
1800 2011-03-16 11:11:40 <dsg> MagicalTux: Good to hear you're okay
1801 2011-03-16 11:12:21 <MagicalTux> dsg: I was waiting for new reports on the situation, but the current reports are way too bad
1802 2011-03-16 11:12:24 <lfm> will you be online where you are going?
1803 2011-03-16 11:12:32 <MagicalTux> plus, the high winds in Tokyo reminds me of when we have typhoon incoming
1804 2011-03-16 11:12:43 <MagicalTux> lfm: I have a 3G Wifi thingie :)
1805 2011-03-16 11:13:08 validus has joined
1806 2011-03-16 11:13:09 <lfm> sounds fine
1807 2011-03-16 11:13:26 <validus> mornin
1808 2011-03-16 11:13:27 <MagicalTux> I also have the USB version of the 3G thingie, and a Wimax PC
1809 2011-03-16 11:13:40 <MagicalTux> basically there shouldn't be anything stopping me from accessing internet
1810 2011-03-16 11:14:16 <lfm> ok so we will hear from you later then, have good trip
1811 2011-03-16 11:14:19 <TD> MagicalTux: good luck
1812 2011-03-16 11:16:50 <MagicalTux> for info I already stopped any service on japanese servers, my whole network is now on europe/US servers
1813 2011-03-16 11:17:01 <MagicalTux> so even if Japan disappears from the maps, stuff will still work
1814 2011-03-16 11:17:43 <lfm> well we hope that was over-reaction and things get better there
1815 2011-03-16 11:18:23 <validus> i think theres some serious to it but media always over exaggerates and hopes for bad so they get paid more
1816 2011-03-16 11:18:45 <validus> everyone i know thats on a .jp addy ive seen logon at least once so im taking that as a good sign
1817 2011-03-16 11:20:20 <subpar> fair bit of hash power came back on recently...
1818 2011-03-16 11:20:32 <subpar> http://bitcoin.sipa.be/speed-lin-2k.png
1819 2011-03-16 11:20:58 <lfm> not that it isnt very serious and many people already lost, so we understand you want to be carefull
1820 2011-03-16 11:22:41 Bth8 has quit (Quit: Leaving)
1821 2011-03-16 11:22:41 <lfm> do you have people you can stay with where you are going?
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1824 2011-03-16 11:31:32 <MagicalTux> lfm: no :D
1825 2011-03-16 11:32:00 <mizerydearia> wow http://japan.witcoin.com/p/393/#r-842
1826 2011-03-16 11:32:14 <mizerydearia> that's so heroic
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1832 2011-03-16 11:44:55 <lfm> mizerydearia: strange how that road split right down the center line
1833 2011-03-16 11:55:55 sabalaba has joined
1834 2011-03-16 11:59:47 <justmoon> lfm: roads are often made one lane at a time cause that's how wide the steamroller is - I can imagine that creates a seam down the center
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1836 2011-03-16 12:07:05 <mizerydearia> lfm: yeah
1837 2011-03-16 12:10:03 <xelister> http://www.grs.de/sites/default/files/images/Messungen_Japan_16.3_6Uhr_klein.png
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1871 2011-03-16 13:06:21 <molecular> is mm back?
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1879 2011-03-16 13:10:26 <kiba`> hello
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1882 2011-03-16 13:15:42 <davex__> ;;bc,stats
1883 2011-03-16 13:15:44 <gribble> Current Blocks: 113753 | Current Difficulty: 76193.9710474 | Next Difficulty At Block: 114911 | Next Difficulty In: 1158 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 2 days, 7 hours, 52 minutes, and 48 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 65772.85655216
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1888 2011-03-16 13:30:21 <citiz3n> we might see a drop back down in difficulty?
1889 2011-03-16 13:30:25 <citiz3n> that would be a welcome thing :)
1890 2011-03-16 13:31:10 molecular has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
1891 2011-03-16 13:31:29 <sipa> yes
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1895 2011-03-16 13:35:41 <EvanR-work> citiz3n: in the short term maybe
1896 2011-03-16 13:36:06 <EvanR-work> but were going to need way more power to avoid a single guy from making giant changes to the diff
1897 2011-03-16 13:38:27 <citiz3n> i don't follow you
1898 2011-03-16 13:39:12 <citiz3n> the system adjusts the difficulty based on computing power - so it shouldn't matter if it's a single guy
1899 2011-03-16 13:39:16 <citiz3n> or 1,000 little guys
1900 2011-03-16 13:40:37 da2ce7 has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1901 2011-03-16 13:42:35 <EvanR-work> thats the point of being distributed
1902 2011-03-16 13:42:50 <EvanR-work> so that no one person has all the computing power
1903 2011-03-16 13:43:48 <EvanR-work> if it were centralized it would be easy to eliminate that player and demolish the system, or that player can do certain bad things to the network (tm)
1904 2011-03-16 13:47:15 da2ce7 has joined
1905 2011-03-16 13:53:41 <cosurgi> ;;seen ArtForz
1906 2011-03-16 13:53:41 <gribble> ArtForz was last seen in #bitcoin-dev 10 hours, 51 minutes, and 48 seconds ago: <ArtForz> no hookers?
1907 2011-03-16 13:53:59 molecular has joined
1908 2011-03-16 13:54:00 <cosurgi> ;;seen Diablo-D3
1909 2011-03-16 13:54:00 <gribble> Diablo-D3 was last seen in #bitcoin-dev 8 hours, 53 minutes, and 8 seconds ago: <Diablo-D3> do want this music
1910 2011-03-16 13:54:17 <kiba`> ;;seen kiba
1911 2011-03-16 13:54:17 <gribble> kiba was last seen in #bitcoin-dev 9 hours, 58 minutes, and 22 seconds ago: <kiba> x6763: he's pretty good at spewing nonsense
1912 2011-03-16 13:54:23 genjix has joined
1913 2011-03-16 13:54:29 genjix has quit (Changing host)
1914 2011-03-16 13:54:29 genjix has joined
1915 2011-03-16 13:54:36 <EvanR-work> ;;seen EvanR
1916 2011-03-16 13:54:36 <gribble> EvanR was last seen in #bitcoin-dev 19 hours, 53 minutes, and 56 seconds ago: <EvanR> does a typical unit come with enough plugs for both cards
1917 2011-03-16 13:54:54 <cosurgi> anybody has an idea about speed of Nvidia NVS 420 ?
1918 2011-03-16 13:56:12 <Diablo-D3> what
1919 2011-03-16 13:56:17 <Diablo-D3> cosurgi: what
1920 2011-03-16 13:58:55 skeledrew1 has quit (Quit: Instantbird 0.3a2pre)
1921 2011-03-16 13:59:25 <cosurgi> Diablo-D3: hi. I'm pondering a small modificaion in you miner.
1922 2011-03-16 13:59:27 skeledrew has joined
1923 2011-03-16 13:59:38 <cosurgi> Diablo-D3: hold on, I'll dig it up...
1924 2011-03-16 14:00:13 <molecular> ;seen bluematt
1925 2011-03-16 14:00:20 <molecular> ;;seen BlueMatt
1926 2011-03-16 14:00:21 <gribble> BlueMatt was last seen in #bitcoin-dev 3 hours, 56 minutes, and 48 seconds ago: <BlueMatt> linux only for now, windows and block chain later
1927 2011-03-16 14:00:27 <genjix> fuuuu
1928 2011-03-16 14:00:31 <cosurgi> --- a/src/main/resources/DiabloMiner.cl
1929 2011-03-16 14:00:31 <cosurgi> +++ b/src/main/resources/DiabloMiner.cl
1930 2011-03-16 14:00:34 <cosurgi> -    if(H + 0x5be0cd19 == 0) {
1931 2011-03-16 14:00:34 <cosurgi> +    if(H == 0xa41f32e7) {
1932 2011-03-16 14:00:50 <cosurgi> Diablo-D3: it works, on pool at least. Is it faster? :)
1933 2011-03-16 14:01:01 <sipa> i hope the opencl compiler optimizes that away
1934 2011-03-16 14:01:01 <genjix> is that the same?
1935 2011-03-16 14:01:05 <sipa> yes it's the same
1936 2011-03-16 14:01:36 <UukGoblin> that sort of stuff should definitely be optimized
1937 2011-03-16 14:01:48 <UukGoblin> but I wouldn't trust the opencl compiler much
1938 2011-03-16 14:01:53 ducki2p has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1939 2011-03-16 14:01:54 <sipa> ArtForz will know that, i suppose
1940 2011-03-16 14:02:28 <lfm> the change would be clearer if you said "if (H == (-0x5be0cd19)) {
1941 2011-03-16 14:02:51 ducki2p has joined
1942 2011-03-16 14:03:15 kiba` is now known as kiba
1943 2011-03-16 14:04:58 <Diablo-D3> cosurgi: thats not the same.
1944 2011-03-16 14:05:04 <Diablo-D3> er
1945 2011-03-16 14:05:09 <Diablo-D3> hrm
1946 2011-03-16 14:05:15 <sipa> sure it is
1947 2011-03-16 14:05:16 <Diablo-D3> thats sipa's kernel anyhow
1948 2011-03-16 14:05:17 <Diablo-D3> err
1949 2011-03-16 14:05:20 <Diablo-D3> ArtForz's kernel
1950 2011-03-16 14:05:24 <Diablo-D3> bleh need more caff
1951 2011-03-16 14:08:52 sabalaba has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
1952 2011-03-16 14:09:10 <cosurgi> Diablo-D3: ok, think about that and let me know later :) It's the same, and I've found four or five full blocks with it. Yes, your miner, ArtForz's kernel.
1953 2011-03-16 14:09:54 <lfm> cosurgi doesnt the compiler do that optimization for you?
1954 2011-03-16 14:10:02 <cosurgi> lfm: I have no idea.
1955 2011-03-16 14:10:44 <lfm> so you arnt really sure if it is better or not
1956 2011-03-16 14:10:54 <cosurgi> exactly.
1957 2011-03-16 14:11:07 <Diablo-D3> cosurgi: talk to art.
1958 2011-03-16 14:11:15 <cosurgi> Diablo-D3: ok :)
1959 2011-03-16 14:11:24 <UukGoblin> or do a test
1960 2011-03-16 14:11:26 <Diablo-D3> because hes optimized every single line of code
1961 2011-03-16 14:11:33 <UukGoblin> or see if you can get asm output out of the compiler
1962 2011-03-16 14:11:43 <validus> how much bandwidth is needed to run a decent pool?
1963 2011-03-16 14:11:56 <validus> average per say not exact
1964 2011-03-16 14:13:34 <cosurgi> Diablo-D3: btw, do you use DOLOOPS in default setting of your miner?
1965 2011-03-16 14:14:15 <Diablo-D3> cosurgi: read the source
1966 2011-03-16 14:14:22 <Diablo-D3> it triggers on radeon 5xxx, but not other cards
1967 2011-03-16 14:14:36 <sipa> cosurgi: you can give a env flag to the compiler, to dump the generated IL code
1968 2011-03-16 14:14:43 <sipa> you could compare those between the to versions
1969 2011-03-16 14:14:47 <sipa> to see if it makes a difference
1970 2011-03-16 14:14:53 <cosurgi> Diablo-D3: ok, thanks :)
1971 2011-03-16 14:15:09 reubgr has quit (Quit: Page closed)
1972 2011-03-16 14:15:28 <lfm> validus: would depend mainly how many users
1973 2011-03-16 14:15:45 <validus> well what does 1 ghash/s translate to, thatll give me an idea
1974 2011-03-16 14:15:57 <cosurgi> sipa: I'm too lazy. I'm compiling with 'mvn package' and I don't even know how to pass flags to compiler, and dump the code. Probably I would need to modify java source that invokes opencl compiler.
1975 2011-03-16 14:16:06 <sipa> cosurgi: no
1976 2011-03-16 14:16:08 <lfm> validus: you want cpus or gpus or mix?
1977 2011-03-16 14:16:10 <validus> i dont want an exact number im just curious, estimate, average, whatever
1978 2011-03-16 14:16:18 <sipa> cosurgi: just give the env flag when you run the miner
1979 2011-03-16 14:16:25 <sipa> it's compiled again every run
1980 2011-03-16 14:16:32 <validus> well i figured the bandwidth required woudl be going off the k or ghash/s not if its cpu or gpu
1981 2011-03-16 14:16:42 <cosurgi> sipa: what flag?
1982 2011-03-16 14:17:11 <nanotube> validus: well, doing 1ghps with 1000 cpus will take more bw than doing it with 2 gpus
1983 2011-03-16 14:17:16 <lfm> validus: it owuld be mainly number of users. if you have only gpus then it is fewer users to get per ghash/s
1984 2011-03-16 14:17:20 <sipa> cosurgi: GPU_DUMP_DEVICE_KERNEL=3
1985 2011-03-16 14:17:25 <nanotube> validus: since you basically have to distribute more work units for the cpu pool.
1986 2011-03-16 14:17:50 <validus> ok so say one of the pools going now, like slush's or tyco's . approx how much bandwidth?
1987 2011-03-16 14:17:58 <validus> im just trying to get an idea here
1988 2011-03-16 14:18:05 <nanotube> validus: you'd have to ask them :)
1989 2011-03-16 14:18:17 <validus> ok thats fair enough lol
1990 2011-03-16 14:18:35 <nanotube> also, presumably once pushwork is done (or maybe using that modified poclbm with 'long polling', that can be reduced
1991 2011-03-16 14:18:48 <slush> validus: typically one http request per 5-10 seconds
1992 2011-03-16 14:19:04 <validus> per user or for your entire pool?
1993 2011-03-16 14:19:15 <slush> nanotube: with LP it is reduced, but for normal GPU the nonce is still out after few seconds
1994 2011-03-16 14:19:22 <slush> validus: hehe, per GPU
1995 2011-03-16 14:19:27 <validus> ok that helps
1996 2011-03-16 14:19:34 <slush> validus: pool is currently on 500 requests/sec
1997 2011-03-16 14:19:42 <nanotube> slush: hmmm that may be, but can't the gpu just increase the timestamp and keep going, until it gets new data?
1998 2011-03-16 14:19:44 <validus> ya that can generate some bandwidth
1999 2011-03-16 14:19:55 <slush> nanotube: yes, it is next stage
2000 2011-03-16 14:20:02 <nanotube> ah heh ok
2001 2011-03-16 14:24:21 <cosurgi> $ md5sum *
2002 2011-03-16 14:24:25 <cosurgi> 84552580a17c4014a2420e49ef9c7f23  search_Cypress.il
2003 2011-03-16 14:24:25 <cosurgi> 84552580a17c4014a2420e49ef9c7f23  search_Cypress.il1
2004 2011-03-16 14:24:25 <cosurgi> ef351eb6c1c49ee246bce1fc50c424c0  search_Cypress.isa
2005 2011-03-16 14:24:25 <cosurgi> ef351eb6c1c49ee246bce1fc50c424c0  search_Cypress.isa1
2006 2011-03-16 14:24:42 <cosurgi> sipa: apparently it is optimized away.
2007 2011-03-16 14:24:46 <cosurgi> sipa: thanks for hint.
2008 2011-03-16 14:26:25 <lfm> so compiler is not so dumb
2009 2011-03-16 14:29:02 ForceMajeure has joined
2010 2011-03-16 14:34:42 <quellhorst> how do i see the current difficulty and next?
2011 2011-03-16 14:34:54 <quellhorst> and how to compute how long it will take to get a match?
2012 2011-03-16 14:35:05 <UukGoblin> ;;bc,stats
2013 2011-03-16 14:35:07 <gribble> Current Blocks: 113763 | Current Difficulty: 76193.9710474 | Next Difficulty At Block: 114911 | Next Difficulty In: 1148 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 2 days, 4 hours, 59 minutes, and 24 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 66021.57871274
2014 2011-03-16 14:35:25 <quellhorst> oh, difficulty is going down?
2015 2011-03-16 14:35:25 <UukGoblin> quellhorst, ;;bc,calc and ;;bc,gen for the second question
2016 2011-03-16 14:35:53 <UukGoblin> yes, it appears so
2017 2011-03-16 14:36:40 <quellhorst> i can do 626 mhash/s
2018 2011-03-16 14:36:45 <quellhorst> guess people getting out of mining
2019 2011-03-16 14:36:52 <quellhorst> ?
2020 2011-03-16 14:37:55 <quellhorst> ;;bc,calc 626
2021 2011-03-16 14:37:56 <gribble> The average time to generate a block at 626 Khps, given current difficulty of 76193.9710474 , is 16 years, 30 weeks, 0 days, 12 hours, 22 minutes, and 38 seconds
2022 2011-03-16 14:38:05 <quellhorst> ;;bc,calc 626000
2023 2011-03-16 14:38:06 <gribble> The average time to generate a block at 626000 Khps, given current difficulty of 76193.9710474 , is 6 days, 1 hour, 12 minutes, and 44 seconds
2024 2011-03-16 14:40:02 <Aciid> *attention*
2025 2011-03-16 14:40:04 <Aciid> http://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=4521.0
2026 2011-03-16 14:40:06 <Aciid> bitcoin getting weird publicity all over the world
2027 2011-03-16 14:40:09 <Aciid> seems like bitcoin is advertised to be free money
2028 2011-03-16 14:41:19 <validus> even negative publicity will get people to check it out
2029 2011-03-16 14:41:28 <validus> any smart person would check out the details
2030 2011-03-16 14:41:46 <ArtForz> well, it is Free money ;)
2031 2011-03-16 14:41:47 <UukGoblin> every /interested/ smart person
2032 2011-03-16 14:41:53 <Aciid> ArtForz: "free"
2033 2011-03-16 14:42:07 <validus> i spent over an hour in the forums before i even downloaded a nything
2034 2011-03-16 14:42:09 <Aciid> ArtForz: "free" as in terms to those who don't pay for electricity.
2035 2011-03-16 14:42:12 <validus> anything*. arg stupid spacebar
2036 2011-03-16 14:42:33 <ArtForz> Aciid: I said Free, not free ;)
2037 2011-03-16 14:42:49 <ArtForz> ask RMS for the difference
2038 2011-03-16 14:43:05 <Aciid> ArtForz: I only understand free as in beer, sorry.
2039 2011-03-16 14:44:10 <quellhorst> ;;bc,gen
2040 2011-03-16 14:44:10 <gribble> (bc,gen <an alias, 1 argument>) -- Alias for "echo The expected generation output, at $1 Khps, given current difficulty of [bc,diff], is [math calc 50*24*60*60 / (1/((2**224-1)/[bc,diff]*$1*1000/2**256))] BTC per day and [math calc 50*60*60 / (1/((2**224-1)/[bc,diff]*$1*1000/2**256))] BTC per hour.".
2041 2011-03-16 14:44:32 <quellhorst> ;;bc,gen 626600
2042 2011-03-16 14:44:34 <gribble> The expected generation output, at 626600 Khps, given current difficulty of 76193.9710474 , is 8.27167890863 BTC per day and 0.34465328786 BTC per hour.
2043 2011-03-16 14:45:06 <[Tycho]> ;;bc,gen 280000
2044 2011-03-16 14:45:08 <gribble> The expected generation output, at 280000 Khps, given current difficulty of 76193.9710474 , is 3.6962497517 BTC per day and 0.154010406321 BTC per hour.
2045 2011-03-16 14:45:19 <[Tycho]> ;;bc,gen 330000
2046 2011-03-16 14:45:20 <gribble> The expected generation output, at 330000 Khps, given current difficulty of 76193.9710474 , is 4.35629435022 BTC per day and 0.181512264593 BTC per hour.
2047 2011-03-16 14:45:22 <quellhorst> man, at the current difficulty even with gpu miner, its barely covering electric
2048 2011-03-16 14:45:33 <quellhorst> I can see why difficulty is going down
2049 2011-03-16 14:46:21 <quellhorst> i wonder if it would have been better if actually more bitcoins were put into circulation instead of the huge jump in difficulty.
2050 2011-03-16 14:46:29 <quellhorst> because it seems btc prices didn't go up.
2051 2011-03-16 14:46:37 <ArtForz> hyperbole much?
2052 2011-03-16 14:47:11 <[Tycho]> ;;bc,gen 560000
2053 2011-03-16 14:47:12 <gribble> The expected generation output, at 560000 Khps, given current difficulty of 76193.9710474 , is 7.39249950341 BTC per day and 0.308020812642 BTC per hour.
2054 2011-03-16 14:47:14 citiz3n has quit ()
2055 2011-03-16 14:47:17 <ArtForz> a 5970 is ~8kWh/day
2056 2011-03-16 14:48:09 <mizerydearia> I am confused...  How come when I offer to give away bitcoins to random strangers in various irc channels I am met with fierce opposition and ridicule?
2057 2011-03-16 14:48:09 <quellhorst> ArtForz: what is your $/kwh ?
2058 2011-03-16 14:48:23 <ArtForz> quellhorst: about 0.30
2059 2011-03-16 14:48:37 <luke-jr> mizerydearia: it's yours to give away?
2060 2011-03-16 14:48:50 <UukGoblin> that's quite a lot
2061 2011-03-16 14:48:50 <quellhorst> mizerydearia: "First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win."
2062 2011-03-16 14:49:02 <UukGoblin> 0.1155 gbp/kwh for me in london
2063 2011-03-16 14:49:04 slush has quit (Quit: Leaving.)
2064 2011-03-16 14:49:30 <lfm> if you are giving them away they arnt worth much
2065 2011-03-16 14:49:44 wolfspraul has quit (Quit: leaving)
2066 2011-03-16 14:49:49 <ArtForz> so at current diff a 5970 easily covers electricity unless you pay more than 1BTC/kWh
2067 2011-03-16 14:50:10 <quellhorst> mine is $0.1196 per kwh
2068 2011-03-16 14:50:28 <quellhorst> mizerydearia: i'll take some free btc :)
2069 2011-03-16 14:50:29 <ArtForz> like I said, hyperbole much?
2070 2011-03-16 14:50:37 <quellhorst> ArtForz: or bad at math?
2071 2011-03-16 14:50:39 <mizerydearia> quellhorst, you're not random stranger
2072 2011-03-16 14:50:45 <mizerydearia> quellhorst, however.....
2073 2011-03-16 14:50:53 <quellhorst> i'll take candy from non random strangers
2074 2011-03-16 14:50:56 <mizerydearia> I'll give you some witcoins if you create an account ^_^
2075 2011-03-16 14:51:00 <quellhorst> as long as you are in an irc van
2076 2011-03-16 14:51:17 <quellhorst> where is witcoin?
2077 2011-03-16 14:51:23 <mizerydearia> on the Internet?
2078 2011-03-16 14:51:29 <quellhorst> yeah
2079 2011-03-16 14:51:38 <UukGoblin> ha! but where is the internet?
2080 2011-03-16 14:51:49 <mizerydearia> It's accessible via i2p but not only
2081 2011-03-16 14:52:37 <TD> what's the difference between i2p and tor, exactly? i know they have a web page that tries to explain this but it wasn't too helpful
2082 2011-03-16 14:52:40 <mizerydearia> UukGoblin, look for a series of tubes and you will find the Internet
2083 2011-03-16 14:52:47 <mizerydearia> TD, ther is a difference...sec
2084 2011-03-16 14:52:55 <mizerydearia> http://www.i2p2.de/how_networkcomparisons
2085 2011-03-16 14:52:56 <lfm> UukGoblin: where is a voice phone conversation
2086 2011-03-16 14:53:16 <Aciid> http://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=4505.msg66064#msg66064
2087 2011-03-16 14:53:21 <Aciid> Jesus wtf ^
2088 2011-03-16 14:53:37 <UukGoblin> lfm, where is the Universe?
2089 2011-03-16 14:53:56 <mizerydearia> UukGoblin, http://www.burningairlines.com/political/posters/4072YouAreHere.jpg
2090 2011-03-16 14:54:32 <TD>  http://www.i2p2.de/how_networkcomparisons http://www.i2p2.de/how_networkcomparisons
2091 2011-03-16 14:54:37 <TD> oops, sorry
2092 2011-03-16 14:54:38 <TD> copy/paste fail
2093 2011-03-16 14:55:13 <theorbtwo> I'll take some bitcoin, mizerydearia, and I'm a random stranger!
2094 2011-03-16 14:55:31 <luke-jr> me too!
2095 2011-03-16 14:55:45 <theorbtwo> luke-jr may be stranger then me.
2096 2011-03-16 14:55:45 <luke-jr> 1D4t1ny9NsXHzzmhbkvDs1pEfsCNYfua6F <-- see, isn't that address STRANGE⁇
2097 2011-03-16 14:56:07 <TD> mizerydearia: i see, so from a users POV it's basically the same but faster at hidden services, worse/slower at exit to regular net services?
2098 2011-03-16 14:57:00 <mizerydearia> theorbtwo, let me know your witcoin userid ^_^
2099 2011-03-16 14:57:16 <mizerydearia> TD, I have no idea.  Ask ducki2p.  He is the i2p expert.
2100 2011-03-16 14:57:20 <mizerydearia> I am i2p newb
2101 2011-03-16 14:57:26 <ducki2p> sup
2102 2011-03-16 14:57:38 <theorbtwo> Oh, needs to be witcoin, not a random bitcoin address?  Hold on a bit, I'll probably make one...
2103 2011-03-16 15:00:24 <UukGoblin> ah, the biggest change I spotted is the circuit-switched tor vs packet-switched i2p
2104 2011-03-16 15:01:58 satamusic has quit (Quit: Leaving)
2105 2011-03-16 15:02:32 <ducki2p> UukGoblin: tor focusses on outproxying, i2p on internal traffic
2106 2011-03-16 15:02:58 <theorbtwo> mizerydearia: Aha.  Witcoin requires spending a bitcoin before I get a username, which might be why you aren't gettting a very good response.
2107 2011-03-16 15:04:43 <mizerydearia> theorbtwo, Not exactly
2108 2011-03-16 15:04:52 <mizerydearia> the amount you send is funded to your account
2109 2011-03-16 15:04:57 <mizerydearia> you can withdraw at any time
2110 2011-03-16 15:08:09 <mizerydearia> <suzu> how is bitcoin different or better than regular money ?
2111 2011-03-16 15:08:19 <mizerydearia>  I'm not sure how to answer
2112 2011-03-16 15:12:20 <sipa> not controlled by any central entity, guaranteed limited supply, easier to transfer online
2113 2011-03-16 15:13:39 Syke_ has joined
2114 2011-03-16 15:15:10 <mizerydearia> sipa: thanks
2115 2011-03-16 15:16:04 <hippich> imho, depending on the <suzu> background, not controlled by any central entity and limited supply is not relevant. but easy payments online - are what is it.
2116 2011-03-16 15:16:51 <mizerydearia> hippich, also thanks
2117 2011-03-16 15:17:16 Syke has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2118 2011-03-16 15:18:05 <hippich> what i personally like abotu bitcoins (besides limited supply), is a fact hwo easy it's to send money. this really reminds me 1998 when WebMoney just started and numbered bank accounts in montenegro... =))
2119 2011-03-16 15:18:14 <hippich> no questions asked. just money transfer )
2120 2011-03-16 15:18:35 Lachesis has joined
2121 2011-03-16 15:27:57 Lachesis has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2122 2011-03-16 15:30:16 altamic has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2123 2011-03-16 15:31:57 ColdWind_ has quit (Changing host)
2124 2011-03-16 15:31:57 ColdWind_ has joined
2125 2011-03-16 15:32:06 ColdWind_ is now known as coldwind
2126 2011-03-16 15:32:33 <coldwind> anyone interested in operating both with BTCex and Mt. Gox API?
2127 2011-03-16 15:32:48 altamic has joined
2128 2011-03-16 15:32:48 altamic has quit (Changing host)
2129 2011-03-16 15:32:48 altamic has joined
2130 2011-03-16 15:33:04 <coldwind> I'm trying to come up with an unified Python API for both, so it would be useful to hear comments from other people already using them
2131 2011-03-16 15:34:03 <coldwind> also, I could use some extra BTC for testing BTCex properly (I can return them)
2132 2011-03-16 15:35:13 amiller has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2133 2011-03-16 15:38:54 altamic has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2134 2011-03-16 15:39:50 slush1 is now known as slush
2135 2011-03-16 15:39:55 slush has quit (Changing host)
2136 2011-03-16 15:39:55 slush has joined
2137 2011-03-16 15:40:04 <TD> ducki2p: is the freenode/i2p thing a specific bridge or just general outproxying?
2138 2011-03-16 15:41:16 RazielZ has joined
2139 2011-03-16 15:42:59 <mizerydearia> <suzu> the principle of this bitcoin is interresting, but it raises many other questions regarding the ethics and probably many other things I don't even know about
2140 2011-03-16 15:43:13 <mizerydearia> Anyone care to join me in #defocus and help provide better expertise?
2141 2011-03-16 15:43:21 <mizerydearia> I suck at explaining or supporting bitcoin
2142 2011-03-16 15:43:27 glassresistor has joined
2143 2011-03-16 15:45:05 kiba has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
2144 2011-03-16 15:46:07 <coldwind> mizerydearia: there are already shell providers for free and for BTC ;)
2145 2011-03-16 15:46:16 <coldwind> (wrt #defocus discussion, I have no +v there)
2146 2011-03-16 15:46:43 BlueMatt has joined
2147 2011-03-16 15:46:43 BlueMatt has quit (Changing host)
2148 2011-03-16 15:46:43 BlueMatt has joined
2149 2011-03-16 15:47:02 coldwind is now known as ColdWind
2150 2011-03-16 15:47:07 ColdWind is now known as coldwind
2151 2011-03-16 15:47:22 <mizerydearia> hmm
2152 2011-03-16 15:47:28 <coldwind> mizerydearia: http://88.80.16.97 <- free and anonymous shells by telecomix.org
2153 2011-03-16 15:47:41 <coldwind> they have also a hidden Tor service for it
2154 2011-03-16 15:47:48 <coldwind> (and they accept bitcoin donations)
2155 2011-03-16 15:47:53 <mizerydearia> coldwind, wait a bit for voice
2156 2011-03-16 15:47:56 <coldwind> ok
2157 2011-03-16 15:47:58 <mizerydearia> it is timed to prevent spamming
2158 2011-03-16 15:48:02 <coldwind> I guessed so
2159 2011-03-16 15:48:18 <coldwind> anyway, I am at work, so I'm on and off ;)
2160 2011-03-16 15:50:50 gavinandresen has joined
2161 2011-03-16 15:51:28 <gavinandresen> howdy y'all
2162 2011-03-16 15:52:31 <mizerydearia> hiya gasteve
2163 2011-03-16 15:52:32 <mizerydearia> gavinandresen,
2164 2011-03-16 15:52:33 <mizerydearia> blah
2165 2011-03-16 15:52:35 * mizerydearia hides
2166 2011-03-16 15:52:47 <genjix> i just moved a wallet to another computer
2167 2011-03-16 15:52:52 <gavinandresen> I should get a shorter nick
2168 2011-03-16 15:53:04 <mizerydearia> that wouldn't help really
2169 2011-03-16 15:53:06 <genjix> any ideas why the balance doesn't show up after -rescan?
2170 2011-03-16 15:53:09 <BlueMatt> gavinandresen: please do
2171 2011-03-16 15:53:10 <mizerydearia> I just didn't type the v before pushing tab
2172 2011-03-16 15:53:22 <mizerydearia> even if your nick were gavin, it still would have appeared as gasteve
2173 2011-03-16 15:53:32 <sipa> genjix: you overwrote wallet.dat?
2174 2011-03-16 15:53:34 <mizerydearia> therefore the length is unimportant to consider for my mistake
2175 2011-03-16 15:53:39 <genjix> sipa: yeah
2176 2011-03-16 15:53:43 <BlueMatt> gasteve: you need to change your nick ;)
2177 2011-03-16 15:53:47 <mizerydearia> yeah
2178 2011-03-16 15:53:50 <mizerydearia> it's gasteve's fault
2179 2011-03-16 15:53:53 <genjix> but it shows - what my actual balance was
2180 2011-03-16 15:54:14 <sipa> try moving you address book as well?
2181 2011-03-16 15:54:22 <mizerydearia> coldwind, you have voice now
2182 2011-03-16 15:54:31 <sipa> although, i believe it should work
2183 2011-03-16 15:54:31 <genjix> no
2184 2011-03-16 15:54:32 <gavinandresen> I should use my social security number encoded into Tonal for my nick.  That'd be good.
2185 2011-03-16 15:54:35 <genjix> why would that help
2186 2011-03-16 15:54:46 OneFixt has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
2187 2011-03-16 15:54:47 <genjix> gavand
2188 2011-03-16 15:55:05 <genjix> g-rescan
2189 2011-03-16 15:55:12 <welterde> coldwind: last -a  ...
2190 2011-03-16 15:55:16 <sipa> genjix: it makes a difference for recognizing transactions as pay to self or not, but indeed i don't think it influences your balance
2191 2011-03-16 15:55:20 <sipa> at least it shouldn't
2192 2011-03-16 15:55:26 <genjix> weird
2193 2011-03-16 15:55:55 <genjix> it only had 0.05 btc so not too bothered... just kind of strange.
2194 2011-03-16 15:56:01 <sipa> oh wait
2195 2011-03-16 15:56:58 <gavinandresen> genjix:  -rescan aught to catch all transactions to you, it looks at every txout in the block chain for payments to one of your private keys.
2196 2011-03-16 15:57:37 <genjix> oh wait this server doesnt have the block chain
2197 2011-03-16 15:57:44 <gavinandresen> That'd do it
2198 2011-03-16 15:57:47 <genjix> (well not all of it)
2199 2011-03-16 15:57:55 <genjix> been a while since i used this machine :)
2200 2011-03-16 15:57:57 <sipa> still i don't get why it can show your previous balance
2201 2011-03-16 15:58:16 <sipa> that is calculated from the wallet transactions, and those are replaced
2202 2011-03-16 15:58:57 <genjix> well guess we'll have to wait
2203 2011-03-16 15:59:06 <genjix> if it's still a problem after then we can debug
2204 2011-03-16 15:59:20 sabalaba has joined
2205 2011-03-16 15:59:38 <BlueMatt> is there no way to launch bitcoind without it daemonizing?
2206 2011-03-16 15:59:58 <gavinandresen> BlueMatt:  nope.  That needs fixing, imho
2207 2011-03-16 16:00:12 <gavinandresen> (fricking annoying if you want to gdb it)
2208 2011-03-16 16:00:24 BlueMatt has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
2209 2011-03-16 16:01:24 BlueMatt has joined
2210 2011-03-16 16:01:30 <genjix> cant you just comment the part where it forks?
2211 2011-03-16 16:01:37 <molecular> hey BlueMatt, i just got my friggin gentoo box updated, bitcoind is finally compiling, it seems ;)
2212 2011-03-16 16:01:38 <molecular> oops
2213 2011-03-16 16:01:38 <molecular> hey BlueMatt, i just got my friggin gentoo box updated, bitcoind is finally compiling, it seems ;)
2214 2011-03-16 16:01:51 <BlueMatt> ahhhh why does diablo's miner keep making me reisub
2215 2011-03-16 16:01:53 <genjix> BlueMatt: you can get the version before tcatm's patch
2216 2011-03-16 16:02:45 OneFixt has joined
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2218 2011-03-16 16:02:45 OneFixt has joined
2219 2011-03-16 16:02:54 <molecular> BlueMatt, if I can help you test anything (debug.log?), let me know. The testnet-client I started last night sits here with 0 connections, so issue 48 is definitely still unsolved.
2220 2011-03-16 16:03:10 BlueMatt has quit (Client Quit)
2221 2011-03-16 16:03:11 BlueMatt_ has joined
2222 2011-03-16 16:03:17 gavinandresen is now known as gavino
2223 2011-03-16 16:03:25 <BlueMatt_> gavino?
2224 2011-03-16 16:03:31 <molecular> he just arrived in rome?
2225 2011-03-16 16:03:34 <gavino> See: http://skypaint.com/gavin/Gavino.html
2226 2011-03-16 16:03:54 gavino is now known as Gavino
2227 2011-03-16 16:04:17 <Gavino> IRC server tells me gavino and Gavino are registered, though.
2228 2011-03-16 16:04:31 Gavino is now known as gavinO
2229 2011-03-16 16:04:43 <BlueMatt_> ouch that just sounds noobish
2230 2011-03-16 16:04:48 BlueMatt_ is now known as BlueMatt
2231 2011-03-16 16:06:11 <gasteve> what's wrong with my nick?
2232 2011-03-16 16:06:29 <BlueMatt> gasteve: when we type ga and tab-complete it pulls up you instead of gavinandresen/gavin0
2233 2011-03-16 16:06:37 <BlueMatt> gasteve: we were mostly just joking though
2234 2011-03-16 16:06:43 <gasteve> ah ;)
2235 2011-03-16 16:07:01 gavinO is now known as gavinandresen
2236 2011-03-16 16:07:41 <genjix> gavinandresen: haha gavino means gavin-girl in esperanto
2237 2011-03-16 16:07:44 Zarutian has joined
2238 2011-03-16 16:08:00 <genjix> like a girly gavin
2239 2011-03-16 16:08:15 <BlueMatt> who cares about esperanto?
2240 2011-03-16 16:08:33 <gavinandresen> ooh... girlygavin... that'd be a good nick, too
2241 2011-03-16 16:08:51 <BlueMatt> genjix: what did tcatm's patch change that keeps me from keeing bitcoind from forking?
2242 2011-03-16 16:12:10 <BlueMatt> to make a copy of the block chain available on the snapshots server, all I have to do is copy blk* and tar it right?
2243 2011-03-16 16:12:14 <BlueMatt> or is more needed?
2244 2011-03-16 16:12:19 <nanotube> if you use a client that supports it, you can set it to tabcomplete nicks in last-spoke-order.
2245 2011-03-16 16:12:22 <nanotube> mizerydearia: ^
2246 2011-03-16 16:13:23 jeremias_ has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
2247 2011-03-16 16:13:26 <BlueMatt> and are the blockchain files cross-platform?
2248 2011-03-16 16:14:14 <luke-jr> genjix: we need to add language to settings
2249 2011-03-16 16:15:12 <luke-jr> BlueMatt: do you troll everything except SI decimal English?
2250 2011-03-16 16:15:21 <BlueMatt> luke-jr: yep :)
2251 2011-03-16 16:15:32 <luke-jr> BlueMatt: does "white skin" belong in that list too?
2252 2011-03-16 16:16:01 <BlueMatt> luke-jr: I have no problem with blacks either, but those slanty eyed people, man ;)
2253 2011-03-16 16:16:57 <luke-jr> hmm
2254 2011-03-16 16:17:01 osearth has joined
2255 2011-03-16 16:17:10 <luke-jr> "whitelist" and "blacklist" are kindof racist, aren't they? XD
2256 2011-03-16 16:17:13 chaord has joined
2257 2011-03-16 16:17:17 amiller has joined
2258 2011-03-16 16:17:19 <BlueMatt> ha, yea kinda
2259 2011-03-16 16:17:45 <BlueMatt> people just have to keep pushing this white is better idea dont they?
2260 2011-03-16 16:18:44 <luke-jr> s{white}{white/English/decimal}
2261 2011-03-16 16:19:40 <BlueMatt> luke-jr: no only I push the english/decimal is better idea, well ok a lot of other people also push english but who argues about decimal ;)
2262 2011-03-16 16:19:53 osearth_ has quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
2263 2011-03-16 16:21:33 molecular has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
2264 2011-03-16 16:21:51 <BlueMatt> are the blk* databases cross-platform?
2265 2011-03-16 16:22:20 suzu has joined
2266 2011-03-16 16:22:21 <echelon> should be
2267 2011-03-16 16:22:26 <suzu> hi
2268 2011-03-16 16:22:31 <echelon> hu
2269 2011-03-16 16:22:33 <echelon> hi
2270 2011-03-16 16:22:46 <BlueMatt> hi suzu
2271 2011-03-16 16:23:51 <suzu> I spoke with mizerydearia a bit, and I was curious about bitcoin, so if you don't mind I'll stay here a little while to read
2272 2011-03-16 16:24:18 <nanotube> suzu: sure stick around. :)
2273 2011-03-16 16:24:33 <BlueMatt> suzu: sure, if you have questions that are non-development related please as on #bitcoin-discussion.  If you have questions related to buying/selling stuff ask on #bitcoin-otc
2274 2011-03-16 16:24:33 <nanotube> feel free to check out the documentation wiki as well.
2275 2011-03-16 16:24:46 <suzu> ok thx
2276 2011-03-16 16:26:50 <mizerydearia> suzu: woo, and if yuo would like a bitcoin, send me a bitcoin address, or create an account at witcoin and tell me your userid ^_^
2277 2011-03-16 16:26:54 altamic has joined
2278 2011-03-16 16:27:09 <mizerydearia> http://witcoin.com (i can say it here, it's not illegal in this channel)
2279 2011-03-16 16:27:24 <BlueMatt> mizerydearia: where is it illegal?
2280 2011-03-16 16:27:35 <mizerydearia> BlueMatt, #defocus?
2281 2011-03-16 16:27:42 <suzu> ok thanks, I have to read more about all this first
2282 2011-03-16 16:27:50 satamusic has joined
2283 2011-03-16 16:27:51 satamusic has quit (Changing host)
2284 2011-03-16 16:27:51 satamusic has joined
2285 2011-03-16 16:28:48 <mizerydearia> BlueMatt, be careful though...
2286 2011-03-16 16:28:50 gavinandresen is now known as gaa
2287 2011-03-16 16:29:08 <mizerydearia> the few times I have brought up bitcoin in the channel has been met with fierce opposition, rejection and ridicule
2288 2011-03-16 16:29:15 <mizerydearia> s/has/have/
2289 2011-03-16 16:29:47 <luke-jr> that sounds familiar
2290 2011-03-16 16:30:15 <mizerydearia> actually, it may have been rejection, opposition, assault and ridicule, in that particular order
2291 2011-03-16 16:30:23 <gaa> BlueMatt:  the .dat files seem to be compatible between bdb version 4.*, but the db/log.* files change between (e.g.) bdb 4.7 and bdb 4.8
2292 2011-03-16 16:31:00 <BlueMatt> gaa: but I only need to include the blk*.dat files though right?
2293 2011-03-16 16:31:01 <mizerydearia> or maybe ridicule, aggression, withdrawal and rejection
2294 2011-03-16 16:31:44 <gaa> BlueMatt: yup
2295 2011-03-16 16:33:07 <luke-jr> mizerydearia: I get that a lot here.
2296 2011-03-16 16:35:33 midnightmagic_ is now known as midnightmagic
2297 2011-03-16 16:40:11 altamic has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2298 2011-03-16 16:43:49 Lachesis has joined
2299 2011-03-16 16:48:43 jeremias has joined
2300 2011-03-16 16:51:51 <nanotube> gaa: what's with the nick change? :)
2301 2011-03-16 16:53:09 <BlueMatt> nanotube: so that ga(tab) doesnt autocomplete to gasteve
2302 2011-03-16 16:53:59 <luke-jr> …
2303 2011-03-16 16:54:07 dissipate has joined
2304 2011-03-16 16:54:27 <luke-jr> BlueMatt: it still does
2305 2011-03-16 16:55:03 <sipa> hmm, i merged origin/master with my branch in github, is that enough to make a pull request up-to-date?
2306 2011-03-16 16:55:06 <BlueMatt> luke-jr: ga tabs to gaa for me in XChat
2307 2011-03-16 16:55:28 <gaa> I'm just trying it out... see if shorter is sweeter
2308 2011-03-16 16:55:33 <nanotube> BlueMatt: gaa still begins with ga :)
2309 2011-03-16 16:55:44 <gaa> ... but gaa is before gas
2310 2011-03-16 16:55:49 <luke-jr> BlueMatt: broken client is broken
2311 2011-03-16 16:55:59 <nanotube> BlueMatt: on xchat, go to preferences, input box -> last spoke order.
2312 2011-03-16 16:56:10 <luke-jr> gaa: what kind of retarded client assumes alphabetical order?
2313 2011-03-16 16:56:12 <BlueMatt> sipa: a pull request will work even if the branch is out of date as long as none of the lines in the commits conflict
2314 2011-03-16 16:56:25 <sipa> BlueMatt: oh, nice
2315 2011-03-16 16:56:29 <nanotube> gaa: so what's poor gasteve to do now? shorten himself to just 'ga' ? :)
2316 2011-03-16 16:56:31 <gaa> I dunno.  gaa are my initials, so....
2317 2011-03-16 16:56:35 <BlueMatt> sipa: *should*
2318 2011-03-16 16:56:38 <sipa> (they did conflict by the way, but now it's merged)
2319 2011-03-16 16:56:39 <luke-jr> all sane autocompletes either stop where it becomes ambiguous, or choose the more recently used name
2320 2011-03-16 16:56:44 <gaa> ga is already registered, I checked :)
2321 2011-03-16 16:56:50 <nanotube> haha
2322 2011-03-16 16:56:50 BlueMatt is now known as BM
2323 2011-03-16 16:56:51 xelister has joined
2324 2011-03-16 16:56:53 <BM> dam
2325 2011-03-16 16:56:57 BM is now known as BlueMatt
2326 2011-03-16 16:57:03 <luke-jr> gaa: initials are a good reason :P
2327 2011-03-16 16:57:20 noot_ has joined
2328 2011-03-16 16:57:36 <gaa> I could go the other way and be gavinalexanderandresen
2329 2011-03-16 16:57:50 <gaa> nah
2330 2011-03-16 16:58:38 <BlueMatt> that would mean I have to make more room on the side for nicks :(
2331 2011-03-16 17:01:06 <luke-jr> we should change initial block reward to 256 BTC :P
2332 2011-03-16 17:01:24 <BlueMatt> why?
2333 2011-03-16 17:02:59 <luke-jr> 1. total BTC ever is more reasonable
2334 2011-03-16 17:03:08 <luke-jr> 2. divides evenly every time
2335 2011-03-16 17:03:40 <luke-jr> 3. BTC devalued, so doesn't need rebasing soon :P
2336 2011-03-16 17:05:59 <genjix> http://www.epcaconference.com/index.php/2011/2011/news/amir_taaki_bitcoin_org_peer_to_peer_currencies_finally_there
2337 2011-03-16 17:06:06 miner_ has quit (Quit: Leaving)
2338 2011-03-16 17:06:10 <genjix> they asked me for a bio but didnt publish it
2339 2011-03-16 17:06:21 <BlueMatt> nice
2340 2011-03-16 17:06:32 <genjix> guess writing about being expelled for hacking and me smashing the state was too much for them haha
2341 2011-03-16 17:06:55 <BlueMatt> genjix: you did what?
2342 2011-03-16 17:06:56 amiller has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2343 2011-03-16 17:07:02 <cosurgi> genjix: you are going to Amsterdam to give a talk?
2344 2011-03-16 17:07:09 <genjix> yeah
2345 2011-03-16 17:07:16 dissipate has quit (Quit: Leaving)
2346 2011-03-16 17:07:19 <cosurgi> genjix: congrats :)
2347 2011-03-16 17:07:20 <BlueMatt> genjix: wait, from where?
2348 2011-03-16 17:07:21 <genjix> cosurgi: also we're holding a hack meeting
2349 2011-03-16 17:07:26 <genjix> on 4th
2350 2011-03-16 17:07:38 <genjix> anyone can join... we have a studio and there's minimum 4 of us
2351 2011-03-16 17:07:42 <validus> who wants to sneak me in their suitcase
2352 2011-03-16 17:08:07 <genjix> pixxxel.net
2353 2011-03-16 17:08:34 <genjix> won't only be us 4 bitcoiners there but also other media people
2354 2011-03-16 17:08:42 <genjix> if anyone wants to come along :)
2355 2011-03-16 17:08:44 <validus> what convetion is it?
2356 2011-03-16 17:08:48 <validus> convention*
2357 2011-03-16 17:08:52 <validus> or is it just a get together
2358 2011-03-16 17:08:58 <genjix> pixxxel
2359 2011-03-16 17:09:01 <cosurgi> genjix: make sure to find some guys from google :)
2360 2011-03-16 17:09:40 <genjix> i'm talking at the EPCA but am staying with some pixxxel guys... pixxxel wants to organise a hack meeting
2361 2011-03-16 17:09:47 <genjix> on that night I'm there.
2362 2011-03-16 17:10:50 Bosma has joined
2363 2011-03-16 17:22:23 <midnightmagic> ;;bc,stats
2364 2011-03-16 17:22:26 <gribble> Current Blocks: 113777 | Current Difficulty: 76193.9710474 | Next Difficulty At Block: 114911 | Next Difficulty In: 1134 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 2 days, 2 hours, 17 minutes, and 42 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 66063.21540638
2365 2011-03-16 17:23:58 <nanotube> mm looks like hash power is picking up again.
2366 2011-03-16 17:25:15 brunner has joined
2367 2011-03-16 17:25:42 <BlueMatt> yay
2368 2011-03-16 17:26:38 molecular has joined
2369 2011-03-16 17:26:48 su_tesla has quit (Quit: Leaving)
2370 2011-03-16 17:26:49 Bosma has quit (Quit: Colloquy for iPhone - http://colloquy.mobi)
2371 2011-03-16 17:33:57 EvanR has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2372 2011-03-16 17:34:23 OneFixt has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
2373 2011-03-16 17:36:39 <BlueMatt> dam, nightly blockchain copies might be a bit much to serve on my residential connection :(
2374 2011-03-16 17:37:20 <BlueMatt> well Ill keep them up and see what people think - bluematt.me/bitcoin-nightly
2375 2011-03-16 17:37:55 <nanotube> BlueMatt: try sticking it up on sourceforge frs maybe.
2376 2011-03-16 17:38:45 <BlueMatt> nanotube: make a project just to push bitcoin nightlies?
2377 2011-03-16 17:39:04 <nanotube> why not.
2378 2011-03-16 17:41:17 <BlueMatt> seems a bit excessive
2379 2011-03-16 17:41:57 <validus> how big is it bluematt?
2380 2011-03-16 17:42:14 paul0 has joined
2381 2011-03-16 17:42:16 <BlueMatt> 96M currently for lzma compressed 112M for tar.gz
2382 2011-03-16 17:42:28 <validus> whats your home connection on upload?
2383 2011-03-16 17:43:01 <BlueMatt> ~1mbps so...13 minutes to download the chain, which is about as long as it takes to just get it via p2p and check it that way
2384 2011-03-16 17:43:27 <BlueMatt> http://bluematt.me/bitcoin-nightly/
2385 2011-03-16 17:43:41 <BlueMatt> or via ssl if you have CACert trusted
2386 2011-03-16 17:43:46 OneFixt has joined
2387 2011-03-16 17:43:48 <validus> if you dont find a solution i know some people with some vps's
2388 2011-03-16 17:43:53 <validus> they may or may not
2389 2011-03-16 17:43:56 OneFixt has quit (Changing host)
2390 2011-03-16 17:43:56 OneFixt has joined
2391 2011-03-16 17:44:15 <validus> drftpd can do raids on diff ip's to mirror the same but i dont know if it can split files like that i never looked into that part of it
2392 2011-03-16 17:44:31 <validus> if so you could set it up as a chain and have people mirror it as one
2393 2011-03-16 17:44:36 <validus> similiar to p2p
2394 2011-03-16 17:45:00 bk128 has joined
2395 2011-03-16 17:45:38 <BlueMatt> well Ill leave it for now, but if it starts getting any serious traffic Ill have to find a host somewhere
2396 2011-03-16 17:45:43 <validus> with nightly builds trying to run that on p2p would be unproductive
2397 2011-03-16 17:46:00 x6763 has quit (Quit: leaving)
2398 2011-03-16 17:46:04 <validus> i have 2 mbit up i can setup a login/pass for it, wont bother me any
2399 2011-03-16 17:46:06 <validus> ssl or not
2400 2011-03-16 17:46:29 <BlueMatt> validus: well if you want to mirror it, I can set up a sftp/ftp/whatever upload or you can just pull it
2401 2011-03-16 17:47:00 <validus> i only have auth tls enabled atm
2402 2011-03-16 17:47:11 OneFixt has quit (Client Quit)
2403 2011-03-16 17:47:19 OneFixt has joined
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2405 2011-03-16 17:47:19 OneFixt has joined
2406 2011-03-16 17:47:23 <validus> on a ftp server, but i'll help till you can find a better solution, thats no big deal at all
2407 2011-03-16 17:47:45 <validus> its just bandwidth
2408 2011-03-16 17:48:10 OneFixt has quit (Client Quit)
2409 2011-03-16 17:48:25 <validus> im thinking of who i know on alot faster lines
2410 2011-03-16 17:48:28 OneFixt has joined
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2413 2011-03-16 17:48:44 echelon has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
2414 2011-03-16 17:49:08 <validus> and whose awake right now lol
2415 2011-03-16 17:49:58 <BlueMatt> validus: alright, thanks, Ill wait a couple days and see.  I dont mind much but I might have to set up some QoS stuff which is just a PITA
2416 2011-03-16 17:50:14 <BlueMatt> validus: if it starts using my connection a lot Ill ask again
2417 2011-03-16 17:50:16 echelon has joined
2418 2011-03-16 17:50:23 <validus> well im talking to someone now, just give me a few minutes :P
2419 2011-03-16 17:50:53 <lfm> does your isp offer you web space thats faster
2420 2011-03-16 17:51:06 <BlueMatt> lfm: good idea, never thought to check
2421 2011-03-16 17:51:16 <validus> 100 mb is over most isps, but you may get lucky
2422 2011-03-16 17:51:21 <xelister> validus: well
2423 2011-03-16 17:51:24 <xelister> better use freenet
2424 2011-03-16 17:51:33 <validus> no
2425 2011-03-16 17:51:35 <xelister> for block chain initiall download to start with
2426 2011-03-16 17:51:41 <validus> the last thing i need is more stuff open lol
2427 2011-03-16 17:51:46 <xelister> open?
2428 2011-03-16 17:52:47 echelon has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
2429 2011-03-16 17:52:57 brunner has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2430 2011-03-16 17:53:02 <validus> BlueMatt: what kind of user load are you expecting?
2431 2011-03-16 17:53:10 <BlueMatt> validus: probably almost none
2432 2011-03-16 17:53:13 echelon has joined
2433 2011-03-16 17:53:18 <BlueMatt> validus: Im just thinking in terms of download times
2434 2011-03-16 17:54:04 <BlueMatt> validus: but then again your guess is as good as mine
2435 2011-03-16 17:54:35 bitcoinbulletin has joined
2436 2011-03-16 17:55:42 jostmey has joined
2437 2011-03-16 17:56:20 <validus> 10mbit work bluematt?
2438 2011-03-16 17:56:34 <BlueMatt> validus: 10x better than mine so...yea
2439 2011-03-16 17:57:30 <validus> he said give em a second
2440 2011-03-16 17:57:32 <xelister> BlueMatt: your on 1mbit..? where?  ;)
2441 2011-03-16 17:57:56 <validus> BlueMatt: pm
2442 2011-03-16 17:58:18 <BlueMatt> xelister: germany, 16 down 1.6 up but the cable badly needs some shielding so it only goes at 10 and 1 right now
2443 2011-03-16 17:59:04 <ArtForz> BlueMatt: lol, thats *exactly* my speeds ;)
2444 2011-03-16 17:59:21 <BlueMatt> ArtForz: deutsche telekcom :)
2445 2011-03-16 17:59:24 <ArtForz> yup
2446 2011-03-16 17:59:31 <ArtForz> well, 11.6 down/1.2 up
2447 2011-03-16 18:00:12 <BlueMatt> I had 16 working till  I moved the servers, the modem broke and I had to strip together some ghetto wiring... :(
2448 2011-03-16 18:00:15 <lfm> they never (well hardly ever) give you the advertized peak poosible speed
2449 2011-03-16 18:00:15 <validus> i have 18/2
2450 2011-03-16 18:00:17 <validus> and its horrible lol
2451 2011-03-16 18:00:35 <ArtForz> well, I know my line is pretty bad
2452 2011-03-16 18:00:40 <validus> cant afford the 100 for 60/5
2453 2011-03-16 18:00:45 <BlueMatt> lfm: I had 14-15 down reliably for a long time
2454 2011-03-16 18:00:53 <BlueMatt> lfm: and my neighbors get that regularly
2455 2011-03-16 18:01:00 <ArtForz> had to fight for months to get anything > 3/0.25
2456 2011-03-16 18:01:11 <validus> ill hit the max speed in multiple threads but not a single d/l
2457 2011-03-16 18:01:18 <BlueMatt> validus: If I lived literally 100 feet down the street I could get 100/10
2458 2011-03-16 18:01:32 <validus> ya my buddy is dealing with that now. he lives 50 feet from getting high speed
2459 2011-03-16 18:01:36 BitterTe1 has quit (Disconnected by services)
2460 2011-03-16 18:01:42 <BlueMatt> I hit max speed on one download all the time, though I guess living near frankfurt helps
2461 2011-03-16 18:02:02 <validus> routing plays a big role
2462 2011-03-16 18:02:18 <ArtForz> well, at least I got DSL nowadays
2463 2011-03-16 18:02:31 amiller has joined
2464 2011-03-16 18:02:32 <BlueMatt> yea and a ton of traffic goes through frankfurt, and I find pretty good traceroutes to various servers from here
2465 2011-03-16 18:02:50 <validus> but i watched someone send to me at 300kb/s then open 6 more threads at 300 apiece
2466 2011-03-16 18:02:59 <validus> from the same one but they all stopped at 300, was odd lol
2467 2011-03-16 18:03:00 <ArtForz> a few years ago it was 128kbit dual ISDN or analog here
2468 2011-03-16 18:03:02 <BlueMatt> like 4-5 hops to big datacenters in fra
2469 2011-03-16 18:03:27 <BlueMatt> ArtForz: ouch
2470 2011-03-16 18:03:46 <BlueMatt> but hell I really have hardly any use for >10m
2471 2011-03-16 18:04:12 <BlueMatt> aside from serving bitcoin nightlies that is ;)
2472 2011-03-16 18:04:46 <ArtForz> well, I do, downloading the latest season of ... wait, linux isos. yeah. linus isos ;)
2473 2011-03-16 18:04:54 <validus> hehe
2474 2011-03-16 18:05:05 <validus> im burning crapt off cuz i ran out of space again :/
2475 2011-03-16 18:05:36 <ArtForz> I just throw more HDs at it whenever I get beyond 70% or so full
2476 2011-03-16 18:05:44 <BlueMatt> yea linux isos is about all i need it for I can wait 10 min for the latest episode of x and streaming hd movies is fine so...
2477 2011-03-16 18:05:51 <validus> well i have a stack of dvdr's i dont have any other hdds cept for 2 90 gigs
2478 2011-03-16 18:06:06 <BlueMatt> 1tb/2tb drives are so cheap now though
2479 2011-03-16 18:06:06 <validus> my 2 1tb's and a 500 gig are already in here lol
2480 2011-03-16 18:06:48 <BlueMatt> I use mainly just a 3x1tb raid 5 vm server to put media and crap that way I get some redudancy for my mail server and such but still get 2tb of storage :)
2481 2011-03-16 18:06:50 <validus> im definately investing into a fileserver, or finding a good deal on some racks
2482 2011-03-16 18:06:54 <BlueMatt> though performance sucks
2483 2011-03-16 18:07:10 <ArtForz> I used to burn shit on DVDs, but at $90 for a 2TB sata... why bother.
2484 2011-03-16 18:07:15 <BlueMatt> validus: na build a simple one it is really cheap
2485 2011-03-16 18:07:28 <validus> the dvds came with the burner i had to replace
2486 2011-03-16 18:07:34 <validus> so technically its free media
2487 2011-03-16 18:07:54 <validus> and i dont have $90 to drop on a hdd at this exact moment or i already would have
2488 2011-03-16 18:08:05 <BlueMatt> I even built a pc for my router (~$300 pfsense box) if you add a couple tb drives it would be a great fileserver
2489 2011-03-16 18:08:08 <validus> i learn to make do with resources that i have at the time
2490 2011-03-16 18:08:08 <xelister> USA is reported to on purpose infect people with syphilis to conduct medical experiemnts (in 1950's).  The USA gov admited.
2491 2011-03-16 18:08:14 <xelister> god bless usa
2492 2011-03-16 18:08:24 <validus> why must you troll with so much anti usa hate?
2493 2011-03-16 18:08:28 <validus> i mean seriously, take it somewhere else
2494 2011-03-16 18:08:28 <ArtForz> for archiving stuff I probably won't need anymore I have 2 carrierless hotswap sata bays in my fileserver
2495 2011-03-16 18:08:40 <validus> nice artforz
2496 2011-03-16 18:08:41 <BlueMatt> ArtForz: nice
2497 2011-03-16 18:08:44 <xelister> validus: because what I just written. You have trouble reading?
2498 2011-03-16 18:08:57 <validus> ya i realized i need like 10 tb at a minimal which is pretty bad... lol
2499 2011-03-16 18:09:06 <ArtForz> pretty cheap, and works better than crappy usb/esata HD docks
2500 2011-03-16 18:09:13 <BlueMatt> yes xelister its terrible and such the govt fucked up a ton in the past great now stop trolling
2501 2011-03-16 18:09:21 <jgarzik> BlueMatt: I'm getting 118K/s download from your site to my AT&T fibre
2502 2011-03-16 18:09:23 <validus> true artforz
2503 2011-03-16 18:09:23 <midnightmagic> 2TB is about $70CAD up here for a WD green.
2504 2011-03-16 18:09:25 <BlueMatt> and still does
2505 2011-03-16 18:09:30 <BlueMatt> jgarzik: not bad
2506 2011-03-16 18:09:33 <validus> im not wanting to get esata expansion cards and do all that
2507 2011-03-16 18:09:35 <jgarzik> ???
2508 2011-03-16 18:09:40 <validus> i have 2 green drives that work great
2509 2011-03-16 18:09:42 <jgarzik> 16 min to download 118M
2510 2011-03-16 18:09:45 <jgarzik> that's slow :)
2511 2011-03-16 18:09:57 <BlueMatt> jgarzik: yea its slow but that 933 mbps which is close to theoretical so...
2512 2011-03-16 18:10:03 Moredrea1 is now known as Moredread
2513 2011-03-16 18:10:09 <validus> well hopefully this 10mbit box works out
2514 2011-03-16 18:10:17 <validus> connection died for a moment so their testing something
2515 2011-03-16 18:10:19 <validus> least its something
2516 2011-03-16 18:10:21 <BlueMatt> jgarzik: hence the need for a slightly faster box from validus
2517 2011-03-16 18:10:32 <xelister> BlueMatt: well not just in the past.  How is it trolling when thoes are facts
2518 2011-03-16 18:10:33 Bosma has joined
2519 2011-03-16 18:10:41 jostmey has left ()
2520 2011-03-16 18:10:56 <BlueMatt> xelister: because its off topic and designed to elicit a response...oh wait I guess were off topic anyway...
2521 2011-03-16 18:11:00 <ArtForz> 2TB = about 450 DVD-5s, question is, how long do you need to burn 450 DVDs and is the time and hassle really worth the few bucks you save relative to using sata HDs
2522 2011-03-16 18:11:04 midnightmagic has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
2523 2011-03-16 18:11:19 <xelister> BlueMatt: yea we are anyway OT :)  and well... all things written are to have a response, otherwise people are just talking to self...
2524 2011-03-16 18:11:20 Bosma has quit (Client Quit)
2525 2011-03-16 18:11:21 <validus> arforz: i do understand that, but my burner was toast, so i spent 20 bucks and got 100 free dvdr's
2526 2011-03-16 18:11:30 <validus> so i would be wasting $$ if i did not use them
2527 2011-03-16 18:12:08 <validus> i dont even have cd/dvd binders left to put these in, but i much rather have harddrives and i know the cost is less
2528 2011-03-16 18:12:08 <ArtForz> true
2529 2011-03-16 18:12:27 <BlueMatt> I think the only bitcoin channel that is ever on topic is market, and no one but gribble can talk there
2530 2011-03-16 18:12:33 <ArtForz> lol
2531 2011-03-16 18:12:48 <ArtForz> well, -mining is usually also on topic
2532 2011-03-16 18:12:54 <xelister> #bitcoin  seems relattivly on topic
2533 2011-03-16 18:13:01 <BlueMatt> since when is there a -mining
2534 2011-03-16 18:13:08 <xelister> but I newer understand all this chinese nicknames there
2535 2011-03-16 18:13:09 <ArtForz> since... about forever
2536 2011-03-16 18:13:23 <gaa> Yeah, at least February
2537 2011-03-16 18:13:26 <xelister> >_>
2538 2011-03-16 18:14:09 <gaa> Hey, speaking of off-topic:   I'm thinking bitcoind should only fork if given -daemon
2539 2011-03-16 18:14:14 <ArtForz> at least since november
2540 2011-03-16 18:14:17 <BlueMatt> gaa: I agree
2541 2011-03-16 18:14:36 <BlueMatt> gaa: well actually most programs fork by default and have a -nodaemon
2542 2011-03-16 18:15:02 <BlueMatt> gaa: but -daemon on gui and -nodaemon on bitcoind...
2543 2011-03-16 18:15:29 <gaa> I hate double-negatives (so hate -nofoo=0 )
2544 2011-03-16 18:17:04 <gaa> Could do -daemon=1 IS the default, run bitcoind -daemon=0  to not fork
2545 2011-03-16 18:17:21 <BlueMatt> gaa: sure
2546 2011-03-16 18:17:37 <gaa> Anybody else care?
2547 2011-03-16 18:18:56 <BlueMatt> not many other programs use -xxx=0 for boolean flags
2548 2011-03-16 18:20:24 <gaa> yeah, and not many do the weird  -foo instead of --foo and 'no - means rpc command', too....
2549 2011-03-16 18:21:05 <BlueMatt> gaa: true but some do, I cant think of anything that uses -xxx=0 for booleans
2550 2011-03-16 18:21:25 <BlueMatt> ultimately I dont care that much, as long as I can control it Im happy
2551 2011-03-16 18:21:37 <gaa> OK, I'm tired today, but I think I can create a patch that make -daemon=0 do the right thing.
2552 2011-03-16 18:27:01 <coldwind> -daemon / -nodaemon looks more sensible
2553 2011-03-16 18:27:33 Spenvo has joined
2554 2011-03-16 18:28:08 paul0 has quit (Quit: paul0)
2555 2011-03-16 18:28:58 <Lachesis> +1 coldwind
2556 2011-03-16 18:29:03 <jgarzik> submit a patch to GetBoolArg() that accepts true, false, yes and no as other possibilities
2557 2011-03-16 18:29:20 <jgarzik> GetBoolArg() is the place to change
2558 2011-03-16 18:29:32 <BlueMatt> maybe a GetBoolArg that accepts -noxxx and -xxx for all parameters?
2559 2011-03-16 18:29:42 <BlueMatt> not an uncommon thing in other software
2560 2011-03-16 18:29:51 <BlueMatt> or all bool parameters atleast
2561 2011-03-16 18:30:43 <gaa> GetBoolArg("-option", [default]) ... would work.  Logic in init.cpp would still be a little twisted, since default is different for bitcoind and bitcoin
2562 2011-03-16 18:31:29 <gaa> (-option=1 -option=True -option=true -nooption -option etc etc etc could all be done if we can't make up our frickin minds)
2563 2011-03-16 18:32:25 Spenvo has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2564 2011-03-16 18:33:35 TheAncientGoat has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2565 2011-03-16 18:37:53 echelon has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
2566 2011-03-16 18:38:55 <BlueMatt> gaa: welcome to community-driven oss projects ;)
2567 2011-03-16 18:39:05 <BlueMatt> I vote for -nooption and -option
2568 2011-03-16 18:39:44 echelon has joined
2569 2011-03-16 18:39:47 <xelister> more GNU style would be --
2570 2011-03-16 18:39:49 validus has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2571 2011-03-16 18:40:03 <xelister> --option --nooption or even --no-option as usually config use in example
2572 2011-03-16 18:41:26 <BlueMatt> fine with me
2573 2011-03-16 18:46:23 <luke-jr> I've never seen --foo=true/false/yes/no/0/1
2574 2011-03-16 18:46:33 <luke-jr> it's always --option --no[-]option
2575 2011-03-16 18:47:29 <luke-jr> note these changes affect the UPnP branch
2576 2011-03-16 18:47:48 <luke-jr> it uses --upnp vs --noupnp depending on compile-time default
2577 2011-03-16 18:48:17 <BlueMatt> luke-jr: yea Im gonna revert that eventually as I disagree and gavin showed some concern with that
2578 2011-03-16 18:48:29 <luke-jr> …
2579 2011-03-16 18:48:32 <BlueMatt> luke-jr: but until I get around to it/we decide on a central format anyway...
2580 2011-03-16 18:48:46 <luke-jr> concern with what?
2581 2011-03-16 18:48:52 <luke-jr> revert the entire "UPnP optional" change?
2582 2011-03-16 18:49:05 <BlueMatt> no the -noupnp and -upnp depending on gui or not
2583 2011-03-16 18:49:12 <luke-jr> that didn't depend on GUI
2584 2011-03-16 18:49:14 <BlueMatt> and on by default or not still has to be decided
2585 2011-03-16 18:49:25 <luke-jr> on by default is the only sensible default
2586 2011-03-16 18:49:35 <BlueMatt> I agree, but the forum disagree so...
2587 2011-03-16 18:49:49 <luke-jr> I saw one or two people on forum disagree
2588 2011-03-16 18:49:51 <BlueMatt> luke-jr: oh yea sorry its the whole USE_UPNP thing
2589 2011-03-16 18:49:55 <BlueMatt> luke-jr: look at the vote
2590 2011-03-16 18:49:55 <luke-jr> citing fabricated "security" concerns
2591 2011-03-16 18:50:22 <BlueMatt> luke-jr: in any case gavin showed some concern with the different -noupnp and -upnp thing depending on compile flags
2592 2011-03-16 18:50:29 <luke-jr> ?
2593 2011-03-16 18:50:33 <luke-jr> what concern?
2594 2011-03-16 18:50:43 <BlueMatt> well mostly that you should pick a default and stick to it
2595 2011-03-16 18:50:50 <BlueMatt> well that was me
2596 2011-03-16 18:50:51 <luke-jr> why?
2597 2011-03-16 18:51:06 <BlueMatt> he said he doesnt like the USE_UPNP has three "values"
2598 2011-03-16 18:51:10 <luke-jr> these kind of things are best left up to the OS/distributor
2599 2011-03-16 18:51:10 <BlueMatt> on off and unset
2600 2011-03-16 18:51:30 <BlueMatt> luke-jr: ok good point but I agree that USE_UPNP shouldnt really have three values
2601 2011-03-16 18:51:39 <BlueMatt> https://github.com/TheBlueMatt/bitcoin/commit/67fd3014228f3f4a825396275fb0a5c671d8a98a
2602 2011-03-16 18:51:40 <BlueMatt> look ok?
2603 2011-03-16 18:51:48 <BlueMatt> to fix https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/119
2604 2011-03-16 18:51:59 <BlueMatt> or does that need to be in a CRITICAL_BLOCK?
2605 2011-03-16 18:52:01 <luke-jr> USE_UPNP is what the OS/distributor uses to choose
2606 2011-03-16 18:52:37 <BlueMatt> luke-jr: is a three value thing like that common in makefiles, I really have no idea?
2607 2011-03-16 18:52:54 <luke-jr> BlueMatt: usually, it'd be an autotools thing
2608 2011-03-16 18:53:01 <BlueMatt> good point
2609 2011-03-16 18:53:04 <luke-jr> and probably 2 boolean flags
2610 2011-03-16 18:53:12 <BlueMatt> yea that is what I was thinking
2611 2011-03-16 18:53:21 <luke-jr> --enable-upnp and another to change the default
2612 2011-03-16 18:53:28 <BlueMatt> though frankly do we really need autotools?
2613 2011-03-16 18:53:45 <luke-jr> actually, autotools probably would ONLY have --enable-upnp, and default would be an internal thing
2614 2011-03-16 18:54:08 <luke-jr> that is, -DUSE_UPNP=0/1 would work like it does now, but the configure would only set it to 1 (or not set it at all)
2615 2011-03-16 18:54:13 <luke-jr> BlueMatt: yes, we do
2616 2011-03-16 18:54:19 <jgarzik> no, autotools would have --disable-upnp.  it would be built in by default, if detected, because we want to ship it.  but disabled by default at runtime.
2617 2011-03-16 18:54:19 <BlueMatt> why?
2618 2011-03-16 18:54:21 <luke-jr> the current build system SUCKS and doesn't work :P
2619 2011-03-16 18:54:31 <luke-jr> jgarzik: default depends on detected
2620 2011-03-16 18:54:45 <BlueMatt> jgarzik: should my commit be in a CRITICAL_BLOCK or should i pull req it?
2621 2011-03-16 18:55:04 <luke-jr> so really --enable-upnp and --disable-upnp would both be options
2622 2011-03-16 18:55:10 <BlueMatt> luke-jr: Ive never had problems well on linux, it is a pita on windows and no idea about mac
2623 2011-03-16 18:55:13 <luke-jr> (the former erroring if it's missing)
2624 2011-03-16 18:55:15 <jgarzik> luke-jr: wrong
2625 2011-03-16 18:55:27 <jgarzik> luke-jr: the configure script is built with a default
2626 2011-03-16 18:55:59 <jgarzik> BlueMatt: good question...  i guess a critical block is needed, since that might be called from anywhere at any time
2627 2011-03-16 18:56:25 <jgarzik> BlueMatt: need gavin's eye, he ran into some problem with closing/reopening log files due to the strange calling conditions
2628 2011-03-16 18:56:30 <jgarzik> in the same function
2629 2011-03-16 18:56:40 <BlueMatt> gaa: ?
2630 2011-03-16 18:56:42 <jgarzik> so he might be aware of other issues WRT critical_section
2631 2011-03-16 18:56:54 <BlueMatt> maybe the whole thing should be critical then?
2632 2011-03-16 18:57:06 <ArtForz> problem with logging function is that it's called on shutdown, which means the critsects might already have been freed ...
2633 2011-03-16 18:57:08 <luke-jr> jgarzik: the "default" is a code block, which should auto-detect the correct value
2634 2011-03-16 18:57:18 <gaa> No, can't put it in a critical section, that'll core dump on exit
2635 2011-03-16 18:57:56 <BlueMatt> gaa: oh, well what about my commit specifically?
2636 2011-03-16 18:58:00 <gaa> ... and fStartedNewLine won't work multithreaded
2637 2011-03-16 18:58:01 <jgarzik> BlueMatt: see this http://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=4069.msg58951#msg58951
2638 2011-03-16 18:58:06 <jgarzik> that's why
2639 2011-03-16 18:58:09 <BlueMatt> ah
2640 2011-03-16 18:59:49 <BlueMatt> what about JUST the if and such in a critical section and the rest outside?
2641 2011-03-16 19:00:36 validus has joined
2642 2011-03-16 19:01:00 <BlueMatt> oh wait, stupid question
2643 2011-03-16 19:01:02 <BlueMatt> my bad
2644 2011-03-16 19:01:29 <BlueMatt> hm well there doesnt seem to be a better way to do that then?
2645 2011-03-16 19:01:31 <jgarzik> BlueMatt: you could use an atomic of some sort.  I know boost has some: http://www.boost.org/doc/libs/1_39_0/boost/interprocess/detail/atomic.hpp
2646 2011-03-16 19:01:51 <jgarzik> BlueMatt: the processor can _always_ do an atomic operation, no matter what state bitcoin is in
2647 2011-03-16 19:02:00 <BlueMatt> ok, looking into it
2648 2011-03-16 19:03:53 <jgarzik> BlueMatt: for flags, you can do a compare-and-swap or atomically add 1 or -1 depending on state
2649 2011-03-16 19:04:04 <jgarzik> boolean flags, I mean
2650 2011-03-16 19:04:39 <jgarzik> I wish this were the kernel :)  We have atomic test_and_set_bit, etc.
2651 2011-03-16 19:05:04 <BlueMatt> ha we cant all be kernel gurus
2652 2011-03-16 19:05:55 <gaa> actually, maybe fStartedNewLine as is will work just fine in the multithread case. If two threads printf() partial lines they're going to get mixed up anyway, right?
2653 2011-03-16 19:06:05 <jgarzik> it's not about being gurus, it's about having the API sitting around, ready for use :)
2654 2011-03-16 19:06:12 <jgarzik> gaa: true
2655 2011-03-16 19:06:16 <BlueMatt> gaa: it works for me, but...
2656 2011-03-16 19:06:21 <BlueMatt> gaa: there are no guarantees
2657 2011-03-16 19:06:48 <BlueMatt> gaa: I guess you couldnt get any kind of odd hangs or such so getting them jumbled is fine then?
2658 2011-03-16 19:07:06 <gaa> worst case you dump an extra timestamp in the middle of a line or leave one out.  Assuming GetBoolArg can't do bad things in the MP case...
2659 2011-03-16 19:07:28 <gaa> ... which actually might be a bad assumption if we ever allow on-the-fly changing of options
2660 2011-03-16 19:07:34 <BlueMatt> can it? or should there be a f... added?
2661 2011-03-16 19:07:48 <BlueMatt> oh well that would kill on-the-fly stuff
2662 2011-03-16 19:08:27 <jgarzik> multi-threaded mapArg usage
2663 2011-03-16 19:08:35 <gaa> I can imagine changing GetBoolArg in the future to CRITICAL_BLOCK the access to mapArgs.  And then scratch our heads trying to figure out mysterious crashes at shutdown
2664 2011-03-16 19:08:53 <BlueMatt> yea...
2665 2011-03-16 19:08:56 <jgarzik> easy solution: check -logtimestamps in init.cpp
2666 2011-03-16 19:09:09 <jgarzik> never call GetBoolArg in logging.  makes logging faster anyway.
2667 2011-03-16 19:09:10 <gaa> yeah, and set Yet Another Global
2668 2011-03-16 19:09:23 <jgarzik> yep :)
2669 2011-03-16 19:09:31 <genjix> bitcoin should have a borg object
2670 2011-03-16 19:09:39 <BlueMatt> I think its the best way...sadly
2671 2011-03-16 19:09:45 <genjix> with a we_are_one instance
2672 2011-03-16 19:10:51 <jgarzik> on bitcoin and globals:  yeah, bitcoin is a bit grotty in that area.  most big apps have a ton of global variables.  they just organize it a bit better :)
2673 2011-03-16 19:11:08 <Aciid> http://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=4430.msg66126#msg66126
2674 2011-03-16 19:11:09 <genjix> yeah blender has struct G { ... } g;
2675 2011-03-16 19:11:10 <Aciid> im getting fed up
2676 2011-03-16 19:11:14 <Aciid> the community is full of shit
2677 2011-03-16 19:11:18 <jgarzik> I would rather read the command line at startup, in its entirety, and parse into data structures, rather than checking mapArg throughout program runtime
2678 2011-03-16 19:11:33 <Aciid> either it's fucking 12y.olds or trolls
2679 2011-03-16 19:11:49 <gaa> but mapArg IS a data structure....
2680 2011-03-16 19:11:52 <jgarzik> if we have a bazillion flags anyway, might as well wrap them up into a COptions or CConfig in a useful way
2681 2011-03-16 19:12:21 <jgarzik> gaa: an untyped data structure whose value you have to parse each time
2682 2011-03-16 19:12:22 <genjix> cool
2683 2011-03-16 19:12:32 <genjix> why not use Qt config?
2684 2011-03-16 19:12:42 <genjix> it maps to the correct system config per platform
2685 2011-03-16 19:12:50 <BlueMatt> because that would kill bitcoind
2686 2011-03-16 19:12:56 <genjix> so windows registry, linux /etc .config/appname ...
2687 2011-03-16 19:12:59 <genjix> mac and whatever
2688 2011-03-16 19:13:02 <jgarzik> genjix: not applicable to what we've talking about
2689 2011-03-16 19:13:02 <BlueMatt> and we already depend on wx why add qt as well?
2690 2011-03-16 19:13:10 <genjix> get rid of wx
2691 2011-03-16 19:13:17 <jgarzik> let's not get sidetracked, this is talking about internal :)
2692 2011-03-16 19:13:23 <BlueMatt> ok sorry
2693 2011-03-16 19:13:36 <BlueMatt> I agree that globals need organized a ton better
2694 2011-03-16 19:14:25 <jgarzik> BlueMatt: for your patch, I think it sounds like fStartedNewLine is OK as-is, given that the consequences of two threads racing is not bad at all
2695 2011-03-16 19:14:26 <gaa> All righty, I might be too tired for this.... why is bitcoind crashing in boost::detail::openssl_init if I turn off forking at startup?
2696 2011-03-16 19:14:36 <gaa> Very, very worrying....
2697 2011-03-16 19:14:56 <BlueMatt> odd I have forking commented out for testing and I have no problems...
2698 2011-03-16 19:15:05 <gaa> Using ssl for rpc?
2699 2011-03-16 19:15:41 <BlueMatt> oh wait no not set to on...
2700 2011-03-16 19:15:57 <jgarzik> gaa: I just looked at boost SSL stuff last night, trying to get RPC threading going.  FAIL.  It makes me want to use OpenSSL C API + select(2) code from net.cpp, which is known portable to Windows/Lin/OSX
2701 2011-03-16 19:16:20 * jgarzik admits he is not a C++ programmer, and it shows
2702 2011-03-16 19:16:46 <gaa> yeah, I saw your comment earlier today and agree: I hate boost and c++
2703 2011-03-16 19:16:59 <genjix> i hate c
2704 2011-03-16 19:17:01 <genjix> and love boost
2705 2011-03-16 19:17:08 <jgarzik> I had to define a bunch of classes, and it totally didn't work with the existing bitcoin code flow
2706 2011-03-16 19:17:28 <xelister> Ati drivers suck cocks in hell
2707 2011-03-16 19:17:31 <xelister> part #53
2708 2011-03-16 19:17:38 <xelister> aticonfig  --od-setclocks=60,0 --adapter=all
2709 2011-03-16 19:17:40 <xelister> ERROR - Set clocks failed for Adapter 0 - ATI Radeon HD 5900 Series
2710 2011-03-16 19:17:41 <xelister>         Please check that input values were valid
2711 2011-03-16 19:17:43 <xelister> was working fine all the time last week.
2712 2011-03-16 19:17:46 <jgarzik> I actually like how bitcoin uses C++.  The code isn't organized well, but it _behaves_ like python, with proper object lifetime tracking and garbage collection.  So, props to satoshi there.
2713 2011-03-16 19:17:47 <gaa> openssl c API would be OK with me... but you might need to rework all the rpc iostreams stuff.  Which would be ok with me, too
2714 2011-03-16 19:17:50 <xelister> and GET clocks/temps work fine.
2715 2011-03-16 19:17:59 <jgarzik> boost code, OTOH, requires a TON of C++ classes, just to perform one task!!
2716 2011-03-16 19:18:07 * jgarzik is exaggerating -- but only a little
2717 2011-03-16 19:18:12 <xelister> jgarzik: to write own classes??
2718 2011-03-16 19:18:21 <gaa> ... and debugging is a pita  and compiler errors are a nightmare...
2719 2011-03-16 19:18:22 <xelister> jgarzik: or you mean it includes a tone of .h but why care
2720 2011-03-16 19:18:26 <jgarzik> gaa: yep
2721 2011-03-16 19:18:46 werdan7 has quit (Ping timeout: 620 seconds)
2722 2011-03-16 19:18:59 <jgarzik> xelister: I mean, we have to write C++ classes specifically to interface with boost gadgets, just to get SSL going.
2723 2011-03-16 19:19:01 <gaa> Before jumping into bitcoin I hadn't written any significant c++ code in 10 years, and I thought all that would be solved by now
2724 2011-03-16 19:19:14 <xelister> well C is useless language for writting applications, because one have to fuck with hand micromanagment of memory and stuff most of the time... C++ gives you high level with boot and stl *IF* (and only if) you  use it right
2725 2011-03-16 19:19:28 <genjix> yeah try writing video games in C
2726 2011-03-16 19:19:41 <xelister> boost, not boot =)
2727 2011-03-16 19:19:49 <gaa> what is that famous quote about premature optimization?
2728 2011-03-16 19:19:51 <xelister> use boost of c++ gives you the boot?
2729 2011-03-16 19:19:52 <genjix> xelister: i think he's referring to imperative style
2730 2011-03-16 19:20:02 <xelister> me too, but imperative can be lower or higher level
2731 2011-03-16 19:20:08 <xelister> g2g / bbl
2732 2011-03-16 19:20:27 * gaa is so tired he forgot to eat lunch...
2733 2011-03-16 19:21:25 justmoon has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2734 2011-03-16 19:21:50 <jgarzik> gaa: I don't think the rpc iostreams stuff is a big deal.  You have one point where JSON is generated, and one point where HTTP header is input.  If the JSON generation really insists upon an iostream, you can do that to a string, like in python's StringIO.
2735 2011-03-16 19:25:25 <jgarzik> BlueMatt, gaa:  I know it's yet-another-global-flag, but I do think fLogTimestamps should be created, and initialized in init.cpp.  I would rather simplify OutputDebugPrintF() as much as possible, so maybe putting GetBoolArg() in there wasn't the best idea, long term.
2736 2011-03-16 19:25:41 <jgarzik> so I'd pull BlueMatt's current commit + fLogTimestamps change, I think
2737 2011-03-16 19:26:43 <gaa> jgarzik:  agreed.  it's git un-cherry-pick, right?  (or is it nocherry-pick ?)
2738 2011-03-16 19:26:48 <genjix> what's the deal with variable naming in bitcoin?
2739 2011-03-16 19:27:00 <genjix> i see satoshi hasn't stuck to his own guidelines either.
2740 2011-03-16 19:27:16 <gaa> yeah, we should fire him!
2741 2011-03-16 19:27:20 <genjix> can the psz and str suffixes slowly go?
2742 2011-03-16 19:27:26 <genjix> and C for classes.
2743 2011-03-16 19:28:17 <jgarzik> genjix: I would love it if the prefixes went away :)  IMO, you don't need to replicate the [type | usage], every single time you write the variable's name somewhere.
2744 2011-03-16 19:28:31 <genjix> maybe pick a more usual naming scheme: ClassName, FunctionName  variable_name
2745 2011-03-16 19:28:38 <jgarzik> gaa: eh?  once it's in the history, you need git revert to back something out...
2746 2011-03-16 19:29:07 <jgarzik> gaa: I'll just do the change, it's simple enough
2747 2011-03-16 19:29:18 <jgarzik> BlueMatt: ^^
2748 2011-03-16 19:29:35 <BlueMatt> jgarzik: ok have fun
2749 2011-03-16 19:30:42 Ad0 has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2750 2011-03-16 19:31:13 RazielZ has quit ()
2751 2011-03-16 19:33:06 [Tycho] has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2752 2011-03-16 19:37:18 [Tycho] has joined
2753 2011-03-16 19:38:15 Ad0 has joined
2754 2011-03-16 19:39:07 * jgarzik wonders why rpc.cpp compiles so much more slowly than the rest of bitcoin
2755 2011-03-16 19:39:10 Ad0` has joined
2756 2011-03-16 19:39:36 m86 has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
2757 2011-03-16 19:39:38 <jgarzik> fewer LOC than other modules.  maybe it creates a stupid number of templates, or something.  cc1plus sure does eat RAM while building rpc.cpp.
2758 2011-03-16 19:40:02 Ad0` has quit (Client Quit)
2759 2011-03-16 19:40:12 * gaa thinks it is all the boost
2760 2011-03-16 19:40:15 <jgarzik> "make -j2" sends my poor 1G machine into swap :)
2761 2011-03-16 19:40:37 <BlueMatt> try compiling on a 128M vm (my nightly server)
2762 2011-03-16 19:40:46 <BlueMatt> maybe I should kill that stupid 2G minecraft server
2763 2011-03-16 19:41:00 <gaa> monitorreceived branch is even worse (it include boost::xpressive, full regex parsing in a .hpp file)
2764 2011-03-16 19:42:29 <genjix> solution: split rpc.cpp into rpc/
2765 2011-03-16 19:42:47 <genjix> possible idea :)
2766 2011-03-16 19:44:01 <CIA-95> bitcoin: Jeff Garzik master * re2e5f5c / (init.cpp util.cpp util.h):
2767 2011-03-16 19:44:01 <CIA-95> bitcoin: Fix -logtimestamps to only print time prefix once per output line
2768 2011-03-16 19:44:01 <CIA-95> bitcoin: Incorporate BlueMatt's fix to only timestamp upon new line, and
2769 2011-03-16 19:44:01 <CIA-95> bitcoin: move -logtimestamp checking outside OutputDebugPrintF() to better
2770 2011-03-16 19:44:01 <CIA-95> bitcoin: future-proof it. - http://bit.ly/et8ilV
2771 2011-03-16 19:44:31 <jgarzik> gaa: heh, lovely
2772 2011-03-16 19:44:52 <BlueMatt> yay
2773 2011-03-16 19:45:17 <BlueMatt> now to go finish the nightly build script with validus' friend's vps :)
2774 2011-03-16 19:45:21 <BlueMatt> bitcoin.bluematt.me
2775 2011-03-16 19:46:23 larsig has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2776 2011-03-16 19:48:43 bitcoiner has joined
2777 2011-03-16 19:49:17 * jgarzik waits for his pool server to mint another block...  and confirm my sendmany transaction on mainnet :)
2778 2011-03-16 19:49:28 <BlueMatt> yay
2779 2011-03-16 19:49:49 <jgarzik> gonna be a while...  2 Ghps means 1-2 days average
2780 2011-03-16 19:51:00 dishwara has joined
2781 2011-03-16 19:52:43 sethsethseth has quit (Quit: ~ Trillian Astra - www.trillian.im ~)
2782 2011-03-16 19:53:52 JohnnyFusion has joined
2783 2011-03-16 20:02:06 <BlueMatt> ok new nightly build server up currently building new binaries :) bitcoin.bluematt.me
2784 2011-03-16 20:02:43 eao has quit (Quit: Leaving)
2785 2011-03-16 20:03:42 larsig has joined
2786 2011-03-16 20:08:13 eao has joined
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2789 2011-03-16 20:17:49 <genjix> sgornick: http://www.epcaconference.com/index.php/2011/2011/news/amir_taaki_bitcoin_org_peer_to_peer_currencies_finally_there
2790 2011-03-16 20:19:50 <jgarzik> who is Amir Taaki?
2791 2011-03-16 20:22:53 <genjix> me
2792 2011-03-16 20:23:46 gaa has quit (Quit: gaa)
2793 2011-03-16 20:24:06 <jgarzik> genjix: you do Blender stuff?
2794 2011-03-16 20:24:11 <genjix> used to
2795 2011-03-16 20:24:25 <genjix> i was on project apricot, but blender fucked it up and i left.
2796 2011-03-16 20:25:22 <forrestv> hey, i've been thinking about the network issue we discussed and that was discussed on the forum
2797 2011-03-16 20:25:33 <genjix> they handled it in the worst way ever. still makes me distressed.
2798 2011-03-16 20:25:52 <jgarzik> genjix: I've been impressed with how far Blender has come.  Not familiar with P.A., was that one of their movie projects?
2799 2011-03-16 20:26:18 <genjix> sorta, it was the game project
2800 2011-03-16 20:26:23 <jgarzik> ah
2801 2011-03-16 20:26:35 <genjix> actually i was a crystal space dev, we teamed up together for that project.
2802 2011-03-16 20:26:36 <forrestv> kademlia forms connections when it starts, concentrating on nodes close to it's id (distance is defined as (id1 xor id2))
2803 2011-03-16 20:27:00 <forrestv> if id's were forced to be random, people couldn't control the connections formed or target specific nodes
2804 2011-03-16 20:27:00 <genjix> but our toolchain was heavily integrated with blender, and i worked a lot on that.
2805 2011-03-16 20:27:12 JohnnyFusion has quit (Quit: Leaving.)
2806 2011-03-16 20:27:16 <jgarzik> forrestv: seen TANGLE?  http://www.nicemice.net/amc/research/tangle/
2807 2011-03-16 20:27:49 <forrestv> no?
2808 2011-03-16 20:28:21 <jgarzik> genjix: I've been hoping that FOSS would eventually create a Maya-level solution for character animation, especially details like cloth or hair
2809 2011-03-16 20:28:42 <jgarzik> Blender isn't there, but it seems like the best candidate so far
2810 2011-03-16 20:29:08 <[Tycho]> Blender is a nice example of opensource-specific software.
2811 2011-03-16 20:29:13 <jgarzik> forrestv: our ids (network addresses) are as random as anything
2812 2011-03-16 20:29:24 <genjix> don't think much is missing from character animation.
2813 2011-03-16 20:29:26 <jgarzik> forrestv: anything else, and the attacker controls id generation
2814 2011-03-16 20:29:43 <genjix> and you can make cloth and hair now.
2815 2011-03-16 20:29:55 <genjix> it's been there for quite some time.
2816 2011-03-16 20:30:03 <BlueMatt> is it as good as maya?
2817 2011-03-16 20:30:05 <jgarzik> forrestv: we could hash the network address, and use a Kademlia/TANGLE-like distance functions
2818 2011-03-16 20:30:12 <jgarzik> function
2819 2011-03-16 20:30:14 <genjix> BlueMatt: i think it's better personally.
2820 2011-03-16 20:30:25 <jgarzik> genjix: sweet
2821 2011-03-16 20:30:33 <genjix> but it doesn't matter too much. a good artist isn't made by the tools he uses.
2822 2011-03-16 20:30:36 <[Tycho]> Blender's significant difference from Maya and 3D MAX is complete lack of intuitive interface.
2823 2011-03-16 20:30:43 <forrestv> jgarzik, yeah, i was getting to the point about id generation
2824 2011-03-16 20:30:46 <validus> that sounds fun
2825 2011-03-16 20:30:46 <validus> lol
2826 2011-03-16 20:30:51 <genjix> not true. check out the new interface [Tycho]
2827 2011-03-16 20:30:56 <forrestv> the attacker doesn't necessarily have to have control over it
2828 2011-03-16 20:31:00 <genjix> they've revamped everything this release.
2829 2011-03-16 20:31:24 <genjix> jgarzik: the reason blender is so much light years ahead of most foss projects is they found a way to get minimal cash flow into the project.
2830 2011-03-16 20:31:32 <genjix> money goes really faaarrr in OSS
2831 2011-03-16 20:31:38 <genjix> much further than normal
2832 2011-03-16 20:31:48 <genjix> that's why something like linux would be amazing for OSS
2833 2011-03-16 20:31:49 <forrestv> a node could generate a public key pair, then hash its public key to get its id. it would then sign any outgoing packets with its private key
2834 2011-03-16 20:31:55 <genjix> *bitcoin
2835 2011-03-16 20:32:06 <forrestv> making it impossible to create arbitrary ids or imitate other nodes
2836 2011-03-16 20:32:13 <BlueMatt> hence linux kernel is amazing but a lot of userspace programs are a bit more lacking
2837 2011-03-16 20:32:15 <forrestv> (a node would share its public key upon request)
2838 2011-03-16 20:32:43 <BlueMatt> how would we ever get cash flow into bitcoin project?
2839 2011-03-16 20:32:44 <jgarzik> forrestv: you can still spend CPU to get "close" ids, just like proof-of-work spins CPU now
2840 2011-03-16 20:32:56 <jgarzik> forrestv: see gavin's "vanity bitcoin address" patch
2841 2011-03-16 20:33:10 <ZenMondo> BlueMatt: pay them in Bitcoin!
2842 2011-03-16 20:33:18 <genjix> BlueMatt: no need. if bitcoin becomes popular then there will be money.
2843 2011-03-16 20:33:28 <genjix> it is the 'source' after all.
2844 2011-03-16 20:33:39 <BlueMatt> ha fair enough
2845 2011-03-16 20:33:44 <jgarzik> catch 22
2846 2011-03-16 20:33:45 <forrestv> jgarzik, that's true, but be made pretty difficult since it only has to be done once.
2847 2011-03-16 20:33:52 <BlueMatt> though IMHO the devs should post donation addresses more ;)
2848 2011-03-16 20:34:19 <luke-jr> 176dk1fzoYHzdc9i8iaAQN5hSRgzxZB6wT
2849 2011-03-16 20:34:20 <luke-jr> :p
2850 2011-03-16 20:34:27 unping has joined
2851 2011-03-16 20:34:47 <forrestv> and to get it within 1 jump of an existing node, you'd have to do approximately (total number of nodes)/(node's connections) attempts, i think ..
2852 2011-03-16 20:35:38 <genjix> BlueMatt: but im more concerned about oss as a whole :p just a tiny amount of money will massively improve the quality of all projects.
2853 2011-03-16 20:35:52 <genjix> might just be enough to finally crush those other os'es
2854 2011-03-16 20:36:25 <[Tycho]> "finally" ? :)
2855 2011-03-16 20:36:28 <forrestv> BlueMatt, phantomcircuit, see above :P
2856 2011-03-16 20:36:31 <jgarzik> *.appspot.com is sooo slllooowwwwww
2857 2011-03-16 20:36:44 <BlueMatt> genjix: so we get the existing foundations with money to donate further to smaller projects?
2858 2011-03-16 20:36:52 m86 has joined
2859 2011-03-16 20:37:10 <BlueMatt> forrestv: sorry, I cant pretend to understand that like I can sybil attacks ;)
2860 2011-03-16 20:37:20 lyspooner has joined
2861 2011-03-16 20:37:21 <BlueMatt> ...or maybe im just really tired today
2862 2011-03-16 20:37:57 <genjix> i mean because bitcoin increases the liquidity of money
2863 2011-03-16 20:38:02 <BlueMatt> ah no wonder jgarzik recommended tangle he maintains the daemon ;)
2864 2011-03-16 20:38:04 <jgarzik> BlueMatt: all the devs have bitcoin addresses in their forum signatures, appended to every post, AFAIK
2865 2011-03-16 20:38:13 <BlueMatt> gavin doesnt?
2866 2011-03-16 20:38:14 <jgarzik> BlueMatt: yeah slight bias there :)
2867 2011-03-16 20:38:30 <BlueMatt> gavin just has the faucet and clearcoin
2868 2011-03-16 20:38:38 <jgarzik> BlueMatt: sure he does: http://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=4521.msg66274#msg66274
2869 2011-03-16 20:38:47 <BlueMatt> thats faucet
2870 2011-03-16 20:38:58 <jgarzik> BlueMatt: yep, right after the words "help me out"
2871 2011-03-16 20:39:04 <BlueMatt> forrestv: can you explain it in simpler terms?
2872 2011-03-16 20:39:35 <BlueMatt> jgarzik: I see help me out: fund the faucet: 15...sC and use clearcoin
2873 2011-03-16 20:39:50 <jgarzik> BlueMatt: yep
2874 2011-03-16 20:39:58 <BlueMatt> jgarzik: hence not his address
2875 2011-03-16 20:40:28 <jgarzik> BlueMatt: well from the text, it sounds like that's where gavin wants "thanks" bitcoins to go.  But you can always PM or email him and ask...
2876 2011-03-16 20:40:33 * [Tycho] don't have bitcoin address in forum signature :)
2877 2011-03-16 20:41:51 <BlueMatt> forrestv: sorry Im just tired and cant understand technical stuff right now...so your idea is to use a random id to chose network connection order?
2878 2011-03-16 20:42:02 <BlueMatt> forrestv: and what is this about signing the id?
2879 2011-03-16 20:42:20 <tcatm> I fixed the list of unconfirmed transactions on bitcoincharts. It'll even handle chain re-orgs now.
2880 2011-03-16 20:42:39 <jgarzik> I agree w/ phantomcircuit(?) -- we just need to randomly cycle through peers
2881 2011-03-16 20:42:52 <jgarzik> no need to change much else in that regard, unless I'm missing something
2882 2011-03-16 20:43:09 <jgarzik> tcatm: does it show my 'sendmany' TX?  :)
2883 2011-03-16 20:43:22 <tcatm> nope
2884 2011-03-16 20:43:54 <tcatm> I don't have a 32 bit box to compile a new bitcoind. Have to setup a vm for that
2885 2011-03-16 20:44:12 <BlueMatt> tcatm: or download the nightly I generated about 10 minutes ago :)
2886 2011-03-16 20:44:27 <BlueMatt> tcatm: bitcoin.bluematt.me thanks to validus' friend for the bandwidth
2887 2011-03-16 20:44:39 <tcatm> does it include getblockbycount?
2888 2011-03-16 20:44:48 <BlueMatt> oh...no
2889 2011-03-16 20:44:56 <tcatm> can you include that patch? ;)
2890 2011-03-16 20:45:25 <BlueMatt> I dont really want to start generating 20 versions each night and uploading them
2891 2011-03-16 20:45:34 <BlueMatt> that seems inefficient
2892 2011-03-16 20:46:09 <forrestv> BlueMatt, yeah, that's correct. signing the id proves that you generated the public key and private key
2893 2011-03-16 20:46:18 <forrestv> so you can't just forge arbitrary addresses
2894 2011-03-16 20:46:23 larsig has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
2895 2011-03-16 20:46:29 <forrestv> err, not signing the id
2896 2011-03-16 20:46:37 <jgarzik> tcatm: add "-m32" to your CFLAGS, to build 32-bit on 64-bit
2897 2011-03-16 20:46:40 <forrestv> sign packets, though signing anything would work ..
2898 2011-03-16 20:46:43 <jgarzik> CXXFLAGS
2899 2011-03-16 20:49:52 <tcatm> complains about missing header files (stubs-32.h)
2900 2011-03-16 20:50:35 <jgarzik> tcatm: you just need to install a few more 32-bit pkgs.  All Linux distros support -m32 these days.
2901 2011-03-16 20:50:35 riush has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
2902 2011-03-16 20:50:54 <jgarzik> tcatm: unfortunately you are likely !Fedora, so I cannot guess which ones you need :(
2903 2011-03-16 20:51:15 <jgarzik> tcatm: but 32-bit and 64-bit were built to co-exist easily, permitting -m32 and other easy compatibility uses
2904 2011-03-16 20:51:31 <Aciid> ok solution to the forum problem
2905 2011-03-16 20:51:51 <Aciid> people who are from china or think that bitcoin is free money should state so.
2906 2011-03-16 20:52:02 <Aciid> there are now 4 kinds of people on the forum
2907 2011-03-16 20:52:26 * tcatm should figure out how to ask bitcoin for blocks via port 8333
2908 2011-03-16 20:52:26 larsig has joined
2909 2011-03-16 20:52:30 <Aciid> developers, miners, people who think bitcoin equals free money and people from china
2910 2011-03-16 20:52:38 noot_ has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
2911 2011-03-16 20:52:39 <Aciid> + anarchist traders
2912 2011-03-16 20:52:46 <luke-jr> genjix: does Spesmilo support Python 2.5?
2913 2011-03-16 20:52:52 <[Tycho]> libertarians :)
2914 2011-03-16 20:53:09 <Aciid> http://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=4522.msg66268#msg66268
2915 2011-03-16 20:53:09 noot has joined
2916 2011-03-16 20:53:11 <validus> what does being from china have to do with it?
2917 2011-03-16 20:53:12 <Aciid> the fck.
2918 2011-03-16 20:53:23 <jgarzik> BlueMatt, tcatm: A few years ago, Alan Cox used to maintain the "-ac" patchkit.  -ac was a Linux kernel fork, which followed the main tree, but contained useful or interesting beta-quality patches that were not ready or not appropriate for upstream.  For each new kernel release, 2.6.10, 2.6.11, etc. Alan Cox would rediff his patchkit 2.6.10-ac1, 2.6.11-ac1, etc.
2919 2011-03-16 20:53:30 <jgarzik> bitcoin needs something like that
2920 2011-03-16 20:53:39 <Aciid> validus: seems like Nefario knows.
2921 2011-03-16 20:53:40 <jgarzik> someone rolls a set of "useful patches"
2922 2011-03-16 20:53:43 <jgarzik> into a nightly build
2923 2011-03-16 20:53:53 <Aciid> QQ.Com is the gateway thru the great firewall of china
2924 2011-03-16 20:53:56 <jgarzik> gavin's monitor* stuff comes to mind
2925 2011-03-16 20:54:02 <BlueMatt> I would do a list of useful stuff, just not 200 copies of bitcoin
2926 2011-03-16 20:54:09 <Aciid> and theres atleast 2 people now that I've encountered offering weird services from china
2927 2011-03-16 20:54:28 <Aciid> http://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=4505.msg66064#msg66064
2928 2011-03-16 20:54:30 <validus> well i dont know the extent of the service but whats wrong with that
2929 2011-03-16 20:54:31 <Aciid> make that three
2930 2011-03-16 20:54:40 <Aciid> validus: nothing wrong with it, just confusing
2931 2011-03-16 20:54:54 <jgarzik> BlueMatt: yeah, just suggesting two builds instead of one:  bitcoin-0.3.21-g1234abcd.tar.gz and bitcoin-0.3.21-hacks-gefab9243.tar.gz
2932 2011-03-16 20:55:18 <tcatm> BlueMatt: just one build including everything that might be useful and one git snapshot
2933 2011-03-16 20:55:18 <jgarzik> "gHEX" == git commit id
2934 2011-03-16 20:55:20 <BlueMatt> Ill do it if people agree to a list of patches, Ill go ask on the forum post I just made
2935 2011-03-16 20:55:29 <validus> well given by all those comments i woudlnt expect it to make sense
2936 2011-03-16 20:55:32 <validus> lol
2937 2011-03-16 20:55:43 <validus> i would just move on and dismiss if i was the OP
2938 2011-03-16 20:56:35 satamusic has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2939 2011-03-16 20:56:45 <tcatm> jgarzik: I'm on debian. Can't find 32bit boost and stdc++
2940 2011-03-16 20:56:54 <jgarzik> BlueMatt: <disclaimer>I'm blatantly biased here</disclaimer>  hopefully not just a free-for-all patchset, but at least passing a dev sanity check
2941 2011-03-16 20:57:54 <BlueMatt> of course
2942 2011-03-16 20:58:16 <jgarzik> tcatm: I found this, but it's years outdated, it looks like: http://alioth.debian.org/docman/view.php/30192/21/debian-amd64-howto.html#id292205
2943 2011-03-16 20:58:16 <validus> tcatm: you can search aptitude, or just get the source and compile it
2944 2011-03-16 20:58:32 <jgarzik> should be able to install the 32-bit debian pkg on 64-bit, these days
2945 2011-03-16 20:58:44 <BlueMatt> the 12th oldest internet domain will be decommissioned on june 1st, any guesses what it is?
2946 2011-03-16 20:58:53 <validus> sometimes that works sometimes it dont, it depends really
2947 2011-03-16 20:58:54 <jgarzik> at a minimum, chroot will work, into 32-bit environment
2948 2011-03-16 20:58:59 <jgarzik> guaranteed
2949 2011-03-16 20:59:05 <tcatm> ah, chroot might be a good solution
2950 2011-03-16 21:00:19 doublec has joined
2951 2011-03-16 21:00:38 xg0d has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
2952 2011-03-16 21:02:01 <gasteve> sun.com
2953 2011-03-16 21:02:41 <gasteve> they haven't decommissioned google.com yet ;)
2954 2011-03-16 21:02:44 <BlueMatt> jgarzik: tcatm suggest patches here: http://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=4530.0
2955 2011-03-16 21:02:48 <BlueMatt> sun.com, yes
2956 2011-03-16 21:02:55 <BlueMatt> kinda sad to see a company like that go
2957 2011-03-16 21:03:20 <jgarzik> how long until sun.com becomes sold to a domain parking firm?  :)
2958 2011-03-16 21:03:47 <BlueMatt> that would be terrible
2959 2011-03-16 21:04:00 <gasteve> is oracle still going to hold the domain (just not use it)?  I would think that domain would pull in a hefty price tag
2960 2011-03-16 21:04:19 TheKid has joined
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2962 2011-03-16 21:04:19 TheKid has joined
2963 2011-03-16 21:04:25 <BlueMatt> they are currently forwarding it to oracle.com but they are apparently gonna do something more then
2964 2011-03-16 21:04:49 <BlueMatt> dont know what but Id assume they will hold it for the 10$/year and just not have any dns records on it at all
2965 2011-03-16 21:06:10 glassresistor has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
2966 2011-03-16 21:06:21 dishwara has quit (Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org)
2967 2011-03-16 21:08:20 <nanotube> mm look silke a bit of a tx flood going on, bunch of .01's being sent to the same couple of addrs.
2968 2011-03-16 21:08:25 <tcatm> jgarzik: sendmany should now show up in the list.
2969 2011-03-16 21:09:36 <gasteve> sun.com is actually the 12th oldest .com domain..but there were plenty of other .net, .edu, and .org domains that preceded it
2970 2011-03-16 21:09:54 <BlueMatt> ok its close enough
2971 2011-03-16 21:10:39 <jgarzik> BlueMatt: responded
2972 2011-03-16 21:10:41 <jgarzik> tcatm: thanks!
2973 2011-03-16 21:10:58 <tcatm> could you create a sendmany tx to test it?
2974 2011-03-16 21:11:44 <jgarzik> tcatm: what's your node's IP address?  (feel free to PM, if private)  you otherwise won't get it until majority of network upgrades.
2975 2011-03-16 21:11:54 <tcatm> `host bitcoincharts.com`
2976 2011-03-16 21:12:47 <jgarzik> man, this -logtimestamps is so very nice
2977 2011-03-16 21:12:58 <BlueMatt> you wrote it
2978 2011-03-16 21:14:42 <tcatm> is it enabled by default?
2979 2011-03-16 21:14:50 <BlueMatt> no
2980 2011-03-16 21:15:12 <jgarzik> tcatm: sent.  txid d58b73d6dfd38c2d22ce3f91e0c58a7681d45af44861ddb9833d95c2cfdd81db
2981 2011-03-16 21:15:27 <jgarzik> tcatm: satoshi was worried about privacy
2982 2011-03-16 21:15:40 <jgarzik> with log timestamps getting subpoenaed, perhaps
2983 2011-03-16 21:16:06 <tcatm> tx d58b73d6dfd38c2d22ce3f91e0c58a7681d45af44861ddb9833d95c2cfdd81db is visible on bitcoincharts :)
2984 2011-03-16 21:16:18 <jgarzik> yep!  :)
2985 2011-03-16 21:16:20 <lfm> yet there were a few timestamps there already
2986 2011-03-16 21:16:36 <tcatm> we could disable logging by default
2987 2011-03-16 21:16:47 <tcatm> or make it a lot less verbose
2988 2011-03-16 21:16:52 <lfm> maybe when you exit beta
2989 2011-03-16 21:17:04 <jgarzik> tcatm: at a minimum, production bitcoin needs a less-verbose log
2990 2011-03-16 21:17:10 dirtyfilthy has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
2991 2011-03-16 21:17:26 <jgarzik> In that sendmany (d58b73d6dfd38c2d22ce3f91e0c58a7681d45af44861ddb9833d95c2cfdd81db), I sent 0.01, 0.02 and 0.03 BTC.  Paid a 0.01 TX fee.
2992 2011-03-16 21:17:43 <sipa> on testnet or real net?
2993 2011-03-16 21:17:46 <jgarzik> real net
2994 2011-03-16 21:18:09 <jgarzik> sipa: see http://bitcoincharts.com/bitcoin/
2995 2011-03-16 21:18:12 <sipa> i don't see it on blockexplorer
2996 2011-03-16 21:18:54 <sipa> oh, bitcoincharts, i misread
2997 2011-03-16 21:19:23 <tcatm> theymos should add the list of unconfirmed tx to bbe. I think it belongs there
2998 2011-03-16 21:19:50 <jgarzik> tcatm: I bet he would, if we added an RPC for that...
2999 2011-03-16 21:20:13 <tcatm> I already gave him python code that dumps those TX
3000 2011-03-16 21:28:51 lyspooner has quit (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.6.13/20101203075014])
3001 2011-03-16 21:33:51 <BlueMatt> jgarzik: I think you just signed yourself up to write a summary of all your patches ;)
3002 2011-03-16 21:39:41 llama has joined
3003 2011-03-16 21:40:03 <jgarzik> BlueMatt: posted
3004 2011-03-16 21:40:08 larsig has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
3005 2011-03-16 21:40:28 <BlueMatt> thanks, Im looking at making a repo for it now
3006 2011-03-16 21:40:42 <BlueMatt> can people not make bug reports on a forked branch?
3007 2011-03-16 21:40:52 <BlueMatt> on github
3008 2011-03-16 21:41:17 <jgarzik> BlueMatt: I'm currently moving the patches to git branches at jgarzik/bitcoin.  some of them, particularly the new RPC calls, will give you trivial to fix conflicts in common areas where rpc.cpp contains a long list of RPC calls, one per line.
3009 2011-03-16 21:41:20 <jgarzik> BlueMatt: dunno
3010 2011-03-16 21:41:30 <jgarzik> anyway, putting my patches into public git should help merging
3011 2011-03-16 21:41:39 <BlueMatt> thats what Im planning
3012 2011-03-16 21:42:08 <BlueMatt> and because I cant test everything I want bug reports possible
3013 2011-03-16 21:42:09 <phantomcircuit> jgarzik, glad to see that im winning
3014 2011-03-16 21:42:10 <phantomcircuit> xD
3015 2011-03-16 21:42:48 <jgarzik> phantomcircuit: now where's that C++ patch... ?
3016 2011-03-16 21:42:50 * jgarzik grins evilly
3017 2011-03-16 21:43:03 <cosurgi> hmm...
3018 2011-03-16 21:43:14 <cosurgi> I am nervous when I look at this:
3019 2011-03-16 21:43:16 <cosurgi> http://www.taters.net/cgi-bin/btc/matrix.pl?axisinc=0.025
3020 2011-03-16 21:43:20 <phantomcircuit> jgarzik, nothx
3021 2011-03-16 21:43:26 <phantomcircuit> jgarzik, it'll be in my python client though
3022 2011-03-16 21:43:48 <phantomcircuit> currently (significantly) improving storage of block/txs
3023 2011-03-16 21:43:51 <BlueMatt> cosurgi: dam support is very low
3024 2011-03-16 21:44:04 <cosurgi> BlueMatt: what is 'dam' ?
3025 2011-03-16 21:44:17 <cosurgi> people want to buy only $5'000 worth of bitcoins. And we want to sell 50'000
3026 2011-03-16 21:44:25 <BlueMatt> cosurgi: s/dam/damn/
3027 2011-03-16 21:44:34 <BlueMatt> thats what I meant
3028 2011-03-16 21:44:41 doublec has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
3029 2011-03-16 21:45:11 <cosurgi> now, do you mean that taters.net/cgi-bin/btc/matrix.pl script supports very little exchange sites, and providec incomplete information?
3030 2011-03-16 21:45:20 <cosurgi> or, do you mean that bitcoin support is very low?
3031 2011-03-16 21:45:31 <BlueMatt> I meant bitcoin support on mtgox is low
3032 2011-03-16 21:45:40 <cosurgi> ok.
3033 2011-03-16 21:45:50 <BlueMatt> and at the end of the day mtgox determines price for pretty much everyone
3034 2011-03-16 21:46:06 <jgarzik> BlueMatt: OK, the following branches are now up at git://github.com/jgarzik/bitcoin.git - dumpblock getblockbycount pow-fail settxfee xlisttransactions
3035 2011-03-16 21:46:35 <BlueMatt> jgarzik: thanks, I really dont want to make a new repo for this, but if I cant get bug reports I might have to...:(
3036 2011-03-16 21:46:38 <jgarzik> BlueMatt: yes, we need more exchanges.  hopefully MagicalTux taking over mtgox will help it find a more stable legal footing, which is a big part of the difficulty of running an exchange.
3037 2011-03-16 21:47:04 <cosurgi> BlueMatt: but mtgox still has highest volume, according to http://bitcoincharts.com/markets/
3038 2011-03-16 21:47:17 <BlueMatt> cosurgi: yep, thats why it determines price
3039 2011-03-16 21:47:57 <cosurgi> so if mtgox will stop determining price, then what will?
3040 2011-03-16 21:48:05 <BlueMatt> jgarzik: nevermind Im an idiot, I found it
3041 2011-03-16 21:48:14 <jgarzik> BlueMatt: It's totally up to you.  Just noting that merging will probably be easier for you, if you pull from those git branches I just gave you.  But using those patch URLs is alright too...  just trying to make it easy for you, whichever path you choose.  these nightly builds are really a great idea.
3042 2011-03-16 21:48:47 <BlueMatt> jgarzik: thanks, for a noob like me every bit helps ;)
3043 2011-03-16 21:48:57 * jgarzik brb's
3044 2011-03-16 21:51:31 larsig has joined
3045 2011-03-16 21:53:46 noagendamarket has joined
3046 2011-03-16 21:54:51 <[Tycho]> Yay, victory ! :) http://www.h-online.com/open/news/item/No-more-desktop-Linux-systems-in-the-German-Foreign-Office-1191122.html
3047 2011-03-16 21:55:21 <BlueMatt> [Tycho]: yay
3048 2011-03-16 21:58:09 EvanR has joined
3049 2011-03-16 21:58:39 noot has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
3050 2011-03-16 21:58:40 Kiba has joined
3051 2011-03-16 22:01:45 <noagendamarket> ;;bc,stats
3052 2011-03-16 22:01:47 <gribble> Current Blocks: 113797 | Current Difficulty: 76193.9710474 | Next Difficulty At Block: 114911 | Next Difficulty In: 1114 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 1 day, 23 hours, 22 minutes, and 24 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 65761.77859439
3053 2011-03-16 22:03:37 <phantomcircuit> [Tycho], "for example in writing printer and scanner drivers" ur doin itwrong
3054 2011-03-16 22:03:59 <Kiba> helo
3055 2011-03-16 22:04:00 <[Tycho]> Where else you can get linux drivers ?
3056 2011-03-16 22:04:13 <phantomcircuit> [Tycho], for printers? from cups
3057 2011-03-16 22:04:47 midnightmagic has joined
3058 2011-03-16 22:05:08 <ArtForz> sounds pretty weird
3059 2011-03-16 22:05:32 <phantomcircuit> yeah crazy that the printer software includes drivers for practically ever printer ever made
3060 2011-03-16 22:05:35 <phantomcircuit> insanity
3061 2011-03-16 22:06:25 <ArtForz> yep
3062 2011-03-16 22:07:03 <ArtForz> cups has drivers for a crazy number of printers
3063 2011-03-16 22:07:18 <ArtForz> same way, sane supports a crazy number of scanners
3064 2011-03-16 22:07:34 <sipa> and Xorg supports a crazy number of graphic chips
3065 2011-03-16 22:07:43 <ArtForz> I now have THREE flatbed scanners that arent supported in modern windows, but work fine with sane
3066 2011-03-16 22:07:53 TheKid has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
3067 2011-03-16 22:08:36 EvanR has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
3068 2011-03-16 22:09:08 TheKid has joined
3069 2011-03-16 22:09:08 TheKid has quit (Changing host)
3070 2011-03-16 22:09:08 TheKid has joined
3071 2011-03-16 22:09:17 <BlueMatt> jgarzik: what does dumpblock provide that getblockbycount doesn't/which one or both should I pull?
3072 2011-03-16 22:10:32 <ArtForz> also fun, cheap flatbeds runing twice as fast using sane than with their native windows drivers
3073 2011-03-16 22:10:39 <luke-jr> BlueMatt: just from what you just said, I bet dumpblock works with block hashes instead of height
3074 2011-03-16 22:11:01 <luke-jr> BlueMatt: I would look for one that supports either ;)
3075 2011-03-16 22:11:11 <ArtForz> aka stock driver is crippled to avoid duties/fees on "high speed" scanners
3076 2011-03-16 22:11:38 hippich has quit (Quit: http://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.)
3077 2011-03-16 22:11:56 brunner has joined
3078 2011-03-16 22:12:35 <jgarzik> BlueMatt: that's included in my per-patch summary, on the 'nightly build' forum thread
3079 2011-03-16 22:13:04 <BlueMatt> jgarzik: I was confused, hence the ask
3080 2011-03-16 22:13:45 <BlueMatt> jgarzik: well mostly wanted a comment as to whether or not I should pull dumpblock as it appears to just get ready for "thin" client support
3081 2011-03-16 22:14:04 <jgarzik> BlueMatt: they are basically the same thing.  dumpblock is getblockbycount by another name, plus one additional item in the output, "_fulldump"
3082 2011-03-16 22:14:10 <BlueMatt> jgarzik: which I dont plan on doing anything crazy in my patched version so, if thats all it really does just getblockbycount
3083 2011-03-16 22:14:11 <phantomcircuit> ArtForz, it's so much easier to break hardware in software than it is in hardware
3084 2011-03-16 22:14:28 <jgarzik> BlueMatt: I listed both b/c I was hoping to get both pulled into this build.  Let the community comment and choose...
3085 2011-03-16 22:14:31 <BlueMatt> jgarzik: so I think Im just gonna pull getblockbycount then
3086 2011-03-16 22:14:54 <BlueMatt> jgarzik: or just dumpblock if they are the same?
3087 2011-03-16 22:15:21 <jgarzik> BlueMatt: getblockbycount is the past, and has users.  dumpblock is the probable future.
3088 2011-03-16 22:15:53 <BlueMatt> ah
3089 2011-03-16 22:15:55 <BlueMatt> so both it is
3090 2011-03-16 22:16:09 TheKid has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
3091 2011-03-16 22:16:59 TheKid has joined
3092 2011-03-16 22:16:59 TheKid has quit (Changing host)
3093 2011-03-16 22:16:59 TheKid has joined
3094 2011-03-16 22:17:01 Zarutian has quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
3095 2011-03-16 22:22:14 <llama> sugar8me2010
3096 2011-03-16 22:24:48 <ArtForz> hunter2
3097 2011-03-16 22:25:29 <midnightmagic> i gots de password boss now whut
3098 2011-03-16 22:25:44 EvanR has joined
3099 2011-03-16 22:26:08 <llama> lol
3100 2011-03-16 22:26:13 llama has quit (Quit: llama)
3101 2011-03-16 22:27:07 Xunie has joined
3102 2011-03-16 22:27:15 <genjix> hunter2
3103 2011-03-16 22:27:21 <genjix> where's that from? i recognise it.
3104 2011-03-16 22:27:29 <Sthebig> It's my password.
3105 2011-03-16 22:27:45 <Sthebig> Google it. :P
3106 2011-03-16 22:27:57 <niekie> Woo.
3107 2011-03-16 22:28:09 <sipa> bash.org quote
3108 2011-03-16 22:28:14 * niekie just wrote his first crypto software.
3109 2011-03-16 22:28:29 <niekie> Which was just basically porting sample RFC code to PHP.
3110 2011-03-16 22:28:30 <BlueMatt> bash actually read that one earlier today while reading bash
3111 2011-03-16 22:28:49 <phantomcircuit>  /ns identify hunter2
3112 2011-03-16 22:28:49 <niekie> And then adapting it to a specific implementation.
3113 2011-03-16 22:28:52 <phantomcircuit> OH NOSE
3114 2011-03-16 22:29:16 <ArtForz> it's up there with the robe and wizard hat
3115 2011-03-16 22:29:26 <genjix> sipa: ah yeah thanks
3116 2011-03-16 22:29:37 <genjix> yeah i remember now
3117 2011-03-16 22:31:09 <BlueMatt> sorry tcatm, but I just noticed when you fixed uiproject and remade uibase.*, you reverted the change which set the copyright date to 2011 instead of 2010
3118 2011-03-16 22:32:53 dazoe has quit ()
3119 2011-03-16 22:32:58 EvanR has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
3120 2011-03-16 22:34:17 llama has joined
3121 2011-03-16 22:35:11 finnomenon has joined
3122 2011-03-16 22:35:15 <finnomenon> hi
3123 2011-03-16 22:35:29 <finnomenon> are there any CUDA miners that are known to work with freebsd?
3124 2011-03-16 22:37:37 llama has quit (Client Quit)
3125 2011-03-16 22:37:50 <ArtForz> no clue, probably not
3126 2011-03-16 22:38:35 <finnomenon> shame :(
3127 2011-03-16 22:38:40 <finnomenon> I'd like to mine
3128 2011-03-16 22:39:40 <Kiba> why are there so many miners?
3129 2011-03-16 22:40:29 dirtyfilthy has joined
3130 2011-03-16 22:42:01 <sipa> Kiba: because there is money involved?
3131 2011-03-16 22:42:32 <finnomenon> and it's less work than farming gold on WoW, which lots and lots of people have found worth spending time on
3132 2011-03-16 22:43:16 <ArtForz> yup
3133 2011-03-16 22:43:30 <ArtForz> not to mention about as profitable as sl3 bruteforcing
3134 2011-03-16 22:43:48 <genjix> imagine all this work in OSS projects :)
3135 2011-03-16 22:43:53 pogden has joined
3136 2011-03-16 22:44:52 <Kiba> there's no money in oss unless you're a paid lackely of one those corporations that want you to work on open source
3137 2011-03-16 22:44:52 bitcoinbulletin has quit (Quit: bitcoinbulletin)
3138 2011-03-16 22:45:24 <Kiba> http://nsfw.witcoin.com/p/483/Erotic-Lucid-Dreaming
3139 2011-03-16 22:45:29 <Kiba> what do you guys think of this story?
3140 2011-03-16 22:45:35 <BlueMatt> ...odd
3141 2011-03-16 22:47:24 <Kiba> odd?
3142 2011-03-16 22:47:39 <BlueMatt> as in creepy
3143 2011-03-16 22:47:47 <Kiba> why is it creepy?
3144 2011-03-16 22:47:52 <genjix> every lucid dream i ever had was a horrible nightmare
3145 2011-03-16 22:48:02 finnomenon has left ()
3146 2011-03-16 22:48:15 <BlueMatt> I dont know just dreaming and deciding Im gonna have sex today is kinda creepy to me
3147 2011-03-16 22:48:25 <genjix> i almost always try to wake up but find it difficult, then jump up.
3148 2011-03-16 22:48:54 <Kiba> he wasn't dreaming
3149 2011-03-16 22:49:01 <JFK911> ;;bc,stats
3150 2011-03-16 22:49:02 <Kiba> he decided to try experiment with sex in a lucid dream
3151 2011-03-16 22:49:03 <gribble> Current Blocks: 113800 | Current Difficulty: 76193.9710474 | Next Difficulty At Block: 114911 | Next Difficulty In: 1111 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 week, 1 day, 23 hours, 6 minutes, and 7 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 65649.19690623
3152 2011-03-16 22:49:07 <Kiba> then he dreamed
3153 2011-03-16 22:49:18 <genjix> guess i prefer real life :)
3154 2011-03-16 22:49:37 <Kiba> I wonder who wrote it
3155 2011-03-16 22:49:47 <Kiba> I think it is interesting
3156 2011-03-16 22:51:00 xelister has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
3157 2011-03-16 22:52:18 <BlueMatt> good night all, maybe Ill get my bitcoin-patched branch done tomorrow :)
3158 2011-03-16 22:53:54 BlueMatt has quit (Quit: Ex-Chat)
3159 2011-03-16 22:55:13 <ZenMondo> 113800 blocks. The George Lucas fan in me smiles.
3160 2011-03-16 22:55:27 <Kiba> why?
3161 2011-03-16 22:55:49 <bitcoiner> why does the dif decrease ?
3162 2011-03-16 22:55:59 <ZenMondo> Lucas' first film was THX 1138 and he sneaks "1138" in a lot of his movies.
3163 2011-03-16 22:56:43 dwdollar has left ()
3164 2011-03-16 22:57:12 jeremias has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
3165 2011-03-16 22:57:39 <unping> prisoner transfer from cellblock 1138
3166 2011-03-16 22:57:53 <ZenMondo> exactly
3167 2011-03-16 22:58:30 <ZenMondo> when we hit 3263827 I will be happy again. :)
3168 2011-03-16 22:59:47 <sipa> bitcoiner: to attempt to keep the average block creation rate around 1/10min
3169 2011-03-16 23:00:20 <phantomcircuit> i enjoy cookies
3170 2011-03-16 23:00:25 <bitcoiner> ok thanks
3171 2011-03-16 23:00:25 <phantomcircuit> who wants to send me some
3172 2011-03-16 23:03:42 JohnnyFusion has joined
3173 2011-03-16 23:03:59 <lfm> bitcoiner some people stopped mining
3174 2011-03-16 23:11:05 brunner has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
3175 2011-03-16 23:14:55 doublec has joined
3176 2011-03-16 23:17:48 dirtyfilthy has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
3177 2011-03-16 23:20:15 jrabbit has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
3178 2011-03-16 23:20:32 lfm has quit (Quit: bye)
3179 2011-03-16 23:22:10 <CIA-95> DiabloMiner: Patrick McFarland master * r8287d54 / src/main/java/com/diablominer/DiabloMiner/DiabloMiner.java :
3180 2011-03-16 23:22:10 <CIA-95> DiabloMiner: Output Content-Type of application/json, handle errors in JSON-RPC
3181 2011-03-16 23:22:10 <CIA-95> DiabloMiner: response - http://bit.ly/fJVwiO
3182 2011-03-16 23:22:12 <CIA-95> DiabloMiner: Patrick McFarland master * r6cadef0 / src/main/java/com/diablominer/DiabloMiner/DiabloMiner.java : Improve error handling - http://bit.ly/eJAJah
3183 2011-03-16 23:24:46 subpar has joined
3184 2011-03-16 23:26:07 <Kiba> yay!
3185 2011-03-16 23:26:09 <Kiba> HOT WINGS
3186 2011-03-16 23:26:34 Lachesis has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
3187 2011-03-16 23:27:12 sabalaba has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
3188 2011-03-16 23:32:46 jrabbit has joined
3189 2011-03-16 23:36:30 <luke-jr> the BTC spam is pretty in #bitcoin-watch :P
3190 2011-03-16 23:37:48 <TheKid> transaction flood?
3191 2011-03-16 23:39:23 xg0d has joined
3192 2011-03-16 23:39:39 <genjix> is there any overhead to creating accounts?
3193 2011-03-16 23:40:01 <TheKid> on what scale?
3194 2011-03-16 23:40:08 <genjix> idk
3195 2011-03-16 23:40:45 <TheKid> well it takes a very small amount of processing power and a very small amount of disk space
3196 2011-03-16 23:41:39 <BurtyB> I created 10k for a few mb
3197 2011-03-16 23:41:46 <TheKid> so normally not really, but if you're farming account numbers yes it will use significant space and resources
3198 2011-03-16 23:42:28 Lachesis has joined
3199 2011-03-16 23:43:08 <genjix> kk
3200 2011-03-16 23:44:18 <nanotube> TheKid: well you could always farm them and then get rid of the ones you don't want. :)
3201 2011-03-16 23:44:36 <nanotube> genjix: trying to go for vanity accounts? :)
3202 2011-03-16 23:45:42 <genjix> nanotube: no?
3203 2011-03-16 23:46:03 <genjix> just thinking whether for my site, it's worth having getaddressbalance
3204 2011-03-16 23:46:08 <nanotube> ah
3205 2011-03-16 23:46:11 <nanotube> ic :)
3206 2011-03-16 23:46:20 trentzb has joined
3207 2011-03-16 23:46:34 <genjix> got a bunch of sites on/off in my incubator
3208 2011-03-16 23:48:42 quietdad has joined
3209 2011-03-16 23:49:18 <genjix> "facebook is anything but nerd like. It's way too fucking popular. it's programed in a style most of us would never do, and honestly, the site probably offends most of us."
3210 2011-03-16 23:49:35 <genjix> haha so true. I have no idea why plebs like facebook...
3211 2011-03-16 23:49:53 <Kiba> programmed in a style?
3212 2011-03-16 23:50:43 <phantomcircuit> genjix, it makes stalking so much easier
3213 2011-03-16 23:50:47 <phantomcircuit> wait wat i didnt
3214 2011-03-16 23:50:48 <phantomcircuit> nvm
3215 2011-03-16 23:53:34 <genjix> that's a good reason why i dont use it
3216 2011-03-16 23:59:30 Blitzboom_ has joined