1 2011-05-08 00:00:18 <BlueMatt> luke-jr: as of today, 50 minutes ago
   2 2011-05-08 00:00:21 <BlueMatt> not quite that old afaik
   3 2011-05-08 00:00:41 <luke-jr> BlueMatt: BitDollar isn't that new
   4 2011-05-08 00:00:57 <BlueMatt> no I mean regular bitcoin client but wx ripped out for qt
   5 2011-05-08 00:01:04 <luke-jr> o
   6 2011-05-08 00:01:36 <BlueMatt> would be so nice to get actual packages if we replace wx
   7 2011-05-08 00:06:52 theorbtwo has quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
   8 2011-05-08 00:07:22 LightRider is now known as LightRider|afk
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  10 2011-05-08 00:09:52 <BlueMatt> sipa: can you close #80, #200
  11 2011-05-08 00:10:05 <BlueMatt> jgarzik: ^
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  15 2011-05-08 00:13:02 <Diablo-D3> okay
  16 2011-05-08 00:13:10 <Diablo-D3> who wants to volunteer for testing duty on windows
  17 2011-05-08 00:15:09 <cosurgi> wtf?
  18 2011-05-08 00:15:18 <cosurgi> slush's pool at 30 GHs ??
  19 2011-05-08 00:15:34 <cosurgi> everyone switched to phoenix/deepbit or what?
  20 2011-05-08 00:15:50 <BlueMatt> technical problems with stale work from what I hear
  21 2011-05-08 00:15:50 <lfm> ;;bc,poolstats
  22 2011-05-08 00:15:51 <gribble> {"ghashes_ps": "36.723", "shares": 122776, "active_workers": 2164, "round_duration": "2:25:27", "score": "2987848.9917", "round_started": "2011-05-07 21:45:01", "shares_cdf": "67.36", "getwork_ps": 136}
  23 2011-05-08 00:16:51 lulzplzkthx has joined
  24 2011-05-08 00:18:00 <xelister> Diablo-D3: testing of what
  25 2011-05-08 00:18:05 <cosurgi> ;;bc,lukepool
  26 2011-05-08 00:18:06 <gribble> 24080449.9729
  27 2011-05-08 00:18:30 <Diablo-D3> xelister: I think I might have a launch4j binary
  28 2011-05-08 00:22:53 <xelister> say what?
  29 2011-05-08 00:23:06 <xelister> you want to test new version of ur miner on windows?
  30 2011-05-08 00:23:15 <Diablo-D3> possibly
  31 2011-05-08 00:23:23 <xelister> just push me the sources like a white person
  32 2011-05-08 00:23:31 <Diablo-D3> gotta fix something first
  33 2011-05-08 00:23:40 <xelister> ok.  hmm but not today, I think monday
  34 2011-05-08 00:23:46 <xelister> I will ask my buddy he has access to win
  35 2011-05-08 00:23:50 <xelister> windows on 5970
  36 2011-05-08 00:23:57 <xelister> but rather monday first I think
  37 2011-05-08 00:24:09 <BlueMatt> sipa: can you also close #76
  38 2011-05-08 00:24:16 <xelister> just push what you need tested to git, git log what should we check for
  39 2011-05-08 00:24:50 <rawry> pull request sent <3
  40 2011-05-08 00:26:09 <rawry> hopefully I articulated it a bit better in the pull request than I did earlier
  41 2011-05-08 00:26:22 eternal1 has joined
  42 2011-05-08 00:26:37 <BlueMatt> rawry: wait, so you have to launch it as root to make it clear the bounding set...I think I'd prefer to just not do it at all
  43 2011-05-08 00:26:46 <rawry> BlueMatt: no.
  44 2011-05-08 00:26:46 eternal1 has quit (Client Quit)
  45 2011-05-08 00:26:49 csshih has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
  46 2011-05-08 00:27:01 <rawry> BlueMatt: it JUST needs the cap_setpcap capability.
  47 2011-05-08 00:27:02 <BlueMatt> "For these options to work (if built) the binary must be setuid root (horrible) or setcap cap_setpcap+eip bitcoind;"
  48 2011-05-08 00:27:22 <rawry> setuid root is one (OVERKILL) method of gaining that capability
  49 2011-05-08 00:27:28 csshih has joined
  50 2011-05-08 00:27:32 <BlueMatt> sorry, Im unfamiliar with setcap, its standard in many distros, is it in all?
  51 2011-05-08 00:27:42 <rawry> you can just setcap cap_setpcap+eip bitcoind; and give it just that capability
  52 2011-05-08 00:28:05 <rawry> BlueMatt: ya libcap is available in debian/ubuntu for sure, I think it's in fc if not rhel/centos yet
  53 2011-05-08 00:28:13 <rawry> anything running 2.6.32+
  54 2011-05-08 00:28:24 <rawry> should have it. it's a core system lib/syscall
  55 2011-05-08 00:28:40 <BlueMatt> ah, ok
  56 2011-05-08 00:29:11 bk128 has quit (Quit: bk128)
  57 2011-05-08 00:29:25 <rawry> ps, that USE_PNP:=0; needs to be removed from the makefile so you can actually undefine it (forgot to unpatch that out before committing, lol)
  58 2011-05-08 00:29:37 <BlueMatt> rawry: no
  59 2011-05-08 00:29:46 mmoya has joined
  60 2011-05-08 00:29:50 <rawry> i didn't mean to submit that anyways
  61 2011-05-08 00:29:54 <BlueMatt> please see the other 100 comments on that subject
  62 2011-05-08 00:29:54 <rawry> let me fix that
  63 2011-05-08 00:30:14 <BlueMatt> make -f makefile.unix USE_UPNP= undefines it fime
  64 2011-05-08 00:30:16 <BlueMatt> fine*
  65 2011-05-08 00:30:43 <rawry> but USE_PNP= make; wont :(
  66 2011-05-08 00:30:47 Crshman has joined
  67 2011-05-08 00:30:50 <rawry> err you know what i mean
  68 2011-05-08 00:30:55 <BlueMatt> yea
  69 2011-05-08 00:30:56 <rawry> doesn't matter, will go away with autotools
  70 2011-05-08 00:31:02 <lfm> but can you enable it?
  71 2011-05-08 00:31:04 <BlueMatt> yep :)
  72 2011-05-08 00:31:18 <Crshman> is there a changelog for the client somewhere?
  73 2011-05-08 00:31:29 <BlueMatt> Crshman: github commit log is about it, Im afraid
  74 2011-05-08 00:31:37 <BlueMatt> though the official release notes do cover some stuff
  75 2011-05-08 00:31:43 <Crshman> darn...alright I guess i'll look through the commit messages
  76 2011-05-08 00:31:55 <Crshman> where are the release notes?
  77 2011-05-08 00:32:02 <xelister> AMDOverdriveCtrl FanControll - is it does something cool like reprograms BIOS/kernel/driver whatever to new behaviour of auto-fan,  or is it just controlls fan only as long as  AMDOverdriveCtrl is running?
  78 2011-05-08 00:32:15 <BlueMatt> Crshman: on the forum thread where gavin posted after release
  79 2011-05-08 00:32:20 <Crshman> ah ok
  80 2011-05-08 00:32:21 <Crshman> thanks
  81 2011-05-08 00:32:25 <BlueMatt> I think its just something like "Bitcoin version 0.3.21"
  82 2011-05-08 00:33:59 * citiz3n wonders if staying with slush for today is wise or foolish
  83 2011-05-08 00:34:22 <BlueMatt> if you aren't getting the huge stale blocks, probably fine
  84 2011-05-08 00:36:33 <citiz3n> current round duration: 2:45
  85 2011-05-08 00:36:38 <citiz3n> seems like a very long time
  86 2011-05-08 00:36:49 <BlueMatt> well considering it has almost no hashing power atm...
  87 2011-05-08 00:37:21 <citiz3n> despite the invalid shares and all of that, it shouldn't really make a difference
  88 2011-05-08 00:37:28 <citiz3n> i mean - everyone who stays on slush's would be getting them
  89 2011-05-08 00:37:41 <citiz3n> the connection problems have an impact, for sure
  90 2011-05-08 00:37:49 <citiz3n> when machines stop hasing for a while due to connection problems
  91 2011-05-08 00:38:01 <citiz3n> im gonna see if he's on skype and find out what's going on
  92 2011-05-08 00:38:06 <lfm> citiz3n: it would make a difference how many 50 btcs found maybe
  93 2011-05-08 00:38:23 <Crshman> rpc bug fix....fun I guess I should update
  94 2011-05-08 00:39:23 <rawry> there, a pull without the use_upnp define removed is done, i'm going to go eat dinner.
  95 2011-05-08 00:44:33 redtab has joined
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  98 2011-05-08 00:48:06 devrandom has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
  99 2011-05-08 00:50:25 devrandom has joined
 100 2011-05-08 00:51:52 <x5x> mtgox still down ?
 101 2011-05-08 00:54:30 <[Noodles]> no, https://mtgox.com works fine
 102 2011-05-08 00:56:53 Incitatus has joined
 103 2011-05-08 00:58:12 <x5x> [Noodles], yea that doens't really help people who type mtgox.com into the address bar
 104 2011-05-08 00:58:33  has joined
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 106 2011-05-08 01:00:22  has joined
 107 2011-05-08 01:00:44 <[Noodles]> well, MT mentioned earlier that it might be a wrong proxy-config on the ISP, he's working on it ('..sent angry mails..')
 108 2011-05-08 01:00:48 Netsniper has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
 109 2011-05-08 01:01:10 <[Noodles]> for as long as it takes, https:// works
 110 2011-05-08 01:03:32 <x5x> yea its just disheartening the site has been messed up for so long now
 111 2011-05-08 01:04:00 <[Noodles]> thank our russian friends
 112 2011-05-08 01:04:43  is now known as Netsniper|!~kvirc@adsl-76-252-20-24.dsl.ipltin.sbcglobal.net|Netsniper
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 117 2011-05-08 01:15:17 <forrestv> pools could artificially affect the difficulty rate by putting fake timestamps in blocks and preferring blocks with older timestamps, encouraging others to forge their timestamps too
 118 2011-05-08 01:15:37 <forrestv> err
 119 2011-05-08 01:15:42 <forrestv> i meant more future timestamps, not older
 120 2011-05-08 01:16:50 Netsniper has joined
 121 2011-05-08 01:21:32 <phantomcircuit> forrestv, they could only do so for one difficulty period
 122 2011-05-08 01:23:04 fedorared has left ()
 123 2011-05-08 01:24:21 <rawry> phantomcircuit: why?
 124 2011-05-08 01:27:09 <phantomcircuit> rawry, because there is a limit to how far the timestamp on a block can be from the previous block
 125 2011-05-08 01:27:18 <phantomcircuit> so they'd stack up, but only for a single period
 126 2011-05-08 01:32:53 <lfm> and since most miners use accurate clocks they cant get far off
 127 2011-05-08 01:33:14 afed has quit (Quit: leaving)
 128 2011-05-08 01:33:17 Teslah has joined
 129 2011-05-08 01:37:01 <Diablo-D3> who here is on windows?
 130 2011-05-08 01:37:35 <Diablo-D3> http://adterrasperaspera.com/images/DiabloMiner-test.zip
 131 2011-05-08 01:37:37 <Diablo-D3> someone try that
 132 2011-05-08 01:37:42 <Diablo-D3> run DiabloMiner-Windows.exe
 133 2011-05-08 01:38:32 Netsniper has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
 134 2011-05-08 01:39:02 <phantomcircuit> Diablo-D3, what is that *windows* that you speak of
 135 2011-05-08 01:39:13 <Diablo-D3> phantomcircuit: heh
 136 2011-05-08 01:39:15 <Diablo-D3> seriously
 137 2011-05-08 01:39:17 Netsniper has joined
 138 2011-05-08 01:39:22 <Diablo-D3> its a launch4j binary
 139 2011-05-08 01:39:29 <Diablo-D3> it should make it much easier to use DiabloMiner in windows
 140 2011-05-08 01:41:22 allied has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
 141 2011-05-08 01:41:30 BurningToad has joined
 142 2011-05-08 01:42:27 <sipa> what's wrong with slush' pool?
 143 2011-05-08 01:42:36 <sipa> 41 Ghash/s? :o
 144 2011-05-08 01:43:35 <forrestv> phantomcircuit, what limit is there on distances between timestamps?
 145 2011-05-08 01:43:48 <Diablo-D3> no one uses windows at all?
 146 2011-05-08 01:43:55 <phantomcircuit> forrestv, i forget but there is one
 147 2011-05-08 01:44:10 <phantomcircuit> forrestv, actually it might be the other way
 148 2011-05-08 01:44:17 <forrestv> yeah...
 149 2011-05-08 01:44:28 <forrestv> i think it's just that i can't go backwards
 150 2011-05-08 01:44:31 <forrestv> it*
 151 2011-05-08 01:45:08 <lfm> forrestv: Its a limit to how far off from the average the timestamp is, not the time between blocks
 152 2011-05-08 01:45:09 <forrestv> lfm, but even one person preferring future timestamps would create a slight benefit to make your own generated timestamps in the future
 153 2011-05-08 01:45:18 <forrestv> and that could spread
 154 2011-05-08 01:45:46 <lfm> forrestv: the timestamps are only used to calc new difficulty anyway
 155 2011-05-08 01:45:48 <phantomcircuit> lfm, ah right
 156 2011-05-08 01:46:07 <forrestv> i'm talking about modified clients
 157 2011-05-08 01:46:27 <forrestv> one that would judge based on timestamps and forge timestamps
 158 2011-05-08 01:46:34 <lfm> fooling with it wont gain you anything I can see
 159 2011-05-08 01:46:44 <forrestv> difficulty reduction
 160 2011-05-08 01:46:56 allied has joined
 161 2011-05-08 01:47:06 <lfm> 2 hours outa two weeks? not much advantage
 162 2011-05-08 01:47:25 Aahzmundus has quit (Excess Flood)
 163 2011-05-08 01:47:37 <forrestv> why would it be limited to 2 hours?
 164 2011-05-08 01:47:44 Aahzmundus has joined
 165 2011-05-08 01:47:59 <lfm> if your more than 2 hours from the average youll be rejected
 166 2011-05-08 01:48:12 <forrestv> ah
 167 2011-05-08 01:48:27 <[Noodles]> Diablo-D3: http://paste.pocoo.org/show/384967/
 168 2011-05-08 01:50:04 <Diablo-D3> [Noodles]: thats a fress unpack, right?
 169 2011-05-08 01:50:05 dvide has quit ()
 170 2011-05-08 01:50:11 <[Noodles]> yes
 171 2011-05-08 01:50:31 <Diablo-D3> what version of java did you install?
 172 2011-05-08 01:50:48 EvanR has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
 173 2011-05-08 01:50:50 <[Noodles]> uhmm...
 174 2011-05-08 01:51:36 <[Noodles]> 6.0.240
 175 2011-05-08 01:51:55 <Diablo-D3> [Noodles]: join #bitcoin-mining
 176 2011-05-08 01:52:14 Herodes has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
 177 2011-05-08 01:54:23 <jgarzik> deepbit up to 420 Ghash/sec
 178 2011-05-08 01:54:42 <TheKid> if slush's pool wasn't so damn flaky I wouldn't have decided to switch out permanently
 179 2011-05-08 01:54:45 <phantomcircuit> ;;bc,mtgox
 180 2011-05-08 01:54:46 <gribble> {"ticker":{"high":3.7,"low":3.425,"vol":19483,"buy":3.6501,"sell":3.7099,"last":3.67}}
 181 2011-05-08 01:55:14 <jgarzik> er, make that 450 Ghash/sec
 182 2011-05-08 01:56:21 <sipa> TheKid: what's wrong with it?
 183 2011-05-08 01:56:21 llama has joined
 184 2011-05-08 01:58:23 <phantomcircuit> Diablo-D3, btw there was something about searching the entire nonce space for miners, is that implemented in your miner?
 185 2011-05-08 02:00:49 <jgarzik> is that what we do?  search the nonce space for miners?  "here, miner miner miner"
 186 2011-05-08 02:00:51 * jgarzik runs
 187 2011-05-08 02:00:58 <phantomcircuit> jgarzik, lulz
 188 2011-05-08 02:01:05 <phantomcircuit> i know horrible sentence is horrible
 189 2011-05-08 02:02:22 bk128 has joined
 190 2011-05-08 02:02:36 <jgarzik> mrb_: how many 6990's do you average, per box?  2?  3?
 191 2011-05-08 02:04:13 <Diablo-D3> phantomcircuit: you mean the entire 2^32 space?
 192 2011-05-08 02:04:30 <phantomcircuit> yeah
 193 2011-05-08 02:04:39 <Diablo-D3> mine does 2^31.
 194 2011-05-08 02:05:40 <phantomcircuit> does it stop once it's found a block with diff 1 ?
 195 2011-05-08 02:06:24 AAA_awright has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
 196 2011-05-08 02:06:25 <Diablo-D3> "yes"
 197 2011-05-08 02:06:32 <Diablo-D3> but most likely you're on an LP pool
 198 2011-05-08 02:06:33 <Diablo-D3> so no
 199 2011-05-08 02:06:45 <Diablo-D3> it'll stop when LP returns or it runs out of spae
 200 2011-05-08 02:06:47 <Diablo-D3> *space
 201 2011-05-08 02:07:09 AAA_awright_ has joined
 202 2011-05-08 02:07:59 <xelister> SPACE
 203 2011-05-08 02:08:03 <xelister> the finall frontier
 204 2011-05-08 02:08:15 <Diablo-D3> these are the voyages of the fucking 0.01 transactions
 205 2011-05-08 02:08:29 <xelister> we boldly troll Diablo-D3 as we never did before
 206 2011-05-08 02:08:40 <Diablo-D3> ENGA--wait, what?
 207 2011-05-08 02:08:49 <xelister> oh mr First One
 208 2011-05-08 02:08:56 <xelister> may I see you.... in my "ready room"
 209 2011-05-08 02:09:04 * Diablo-D3 smacks xelister 
 210 2011-05-08 02:09:16 <xelister> "Im READY Will. you may come in"
 211 2011-05-08 02:09:35 <Diablo-D3> and goddamned, Im the one thats balding
 212 2011-05-08 02:09:37 <Diablo-D3> that makes ME captain
 213 2011-05-08 02:09:55 alystair has joined
 214 2011-05-08 02:10:01 alystair has quit (Client Quit)
 215 2011-05-08 02:10:13 <xelister> yea sure whatever, just take the shuttle 1
 216 2011-05-08 02:10:14 alystair has joined
 217 2011-05-08 02:10:16 <xelister> and fly around a bit...
 218 2011-05-08 02:10:23 <xelister> FIRE AT... WILL >__>
 219 2011-05-08 02:10:35 * Diablo-D3 puts on sunglasses
 220 2011-05-08 02:10:38 <Diablo-D3> YEEEAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHh
 221 2011-05-08 02:12:21 Herodes has joined
 222 2011-05-08 02:13:16 <mrb_> jgarzik: 3 per box
 223 2011-05-08 02:13:26 <jgarzik> mrb_: 4U?
 224 2011-05-08 02:13:30 <mrb_> yes
 225 2011-05-08 02:15:03 <subpar> any ideas on this --> http://paste.pocoo.org/raw/384987/
 226 2011-05-08 02:15:25 <subpar> bitcoind had been running fine - stopped and started after deleting debug.log (was 120MB)
 227 2011-05-08 02:18:03 <mrb_> no need to restart. echo -n >debug.log
 228 2011-05-08 02:18:34 <subpar> OK
 229 2011-05-08 02:18:44 <subpar> but that doesn't help me get it started now ;)
 230 2011-05-08 02:18:57 skyewm has joined
 231 2011-05-08 02:19:20 <subpar> Let me rephrase - bitcoind starts but I can't run any commands
 232 2011-05-08 02:20:16 <subpar> well - now it won't even start
 233 2011-05-08 02:20:38 <fetokun> did you update or something?
 234 2011-05-08 02:20:40 <Diablo-D3> weird sounds like one of the db got corrupted
 235 2011-05-08 02:20:52 <subpar> yep
 236 2011-05-08 02:21:11 <fetokun> it happened to me to
 237 2011-05-08 02:21:19 <subpar> fetokun: nope - still using 0.3.21
 238 2011-05-08 02:21:54 <fetokun> try to rename what's inside your database folder
 239 2011-05-08 02:22:24 <fetokun> log.0000XX to "_log.0000XX..."
 240 2011-05-08 02:22:54 <subpar> I blew everything out but the blkindex and wallet
 241 2011-05-08 02:22:57 <subpar> all OK now
 242 2011-05-08 02:24:30 toffoo has quit ()
 243 2011-05-08 02:25:10 <fetokun> nice
 244 2011-05-08 02:29:41 subpar has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
 245 2011-05-08 02:32:36 <xelister> what should be sha1 and md5 fingerprint of SSL cert of mtgox.com ?
 246 2011-05-08 02:35:05 Incitatus has quit (Quit: Leaving)
 247 2011-05-08 02:36:33 subpar has joined
 248 2011-05-08 02:39:41 BlueMatt has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
 249 2011-05-08 02:40:03 <phantomcircuit> xelister, i would expect that it's changed
 250 2011-05-08 02:40:28 <phantomcircuit> xelister, issued on 4/12/11
 251 2011-05-08 02:41:20 <phantomcircuit> sha1 5D 57 02 AF etcetc
 252 2011-05-08 02:42:28 llama has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
 253 2011-05-08 02:42:48 <xelister> thx phantomcircuit
 254 2011-05-08 02:45:28 <luke-jr> jgarzik: fwiw, pushpoold continues to leak with MySQL
 255 2011-05-08 02:46:17 <jgarzik> luke-jr: your trace made it look like libevent-generate http_req was possibly leaking
 256 2011-05-08 02:48:29 fetokun has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
 257 2011-05-08 02:51:02 <phantomcircuit> lol i couldn't even get it to build with mysql
 258 2011-05-08 02:51:03 <phantomcircuit> :|
 259 2011-05-08 02:52:22 LightRider is now known as afk!~LightRide@unaffiliated/lightrider|LightRider
 260 2011-05-08 02:53:34 xelister has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 261 2011-05-08 02:54:45 <sipa> hmmm, 4:49am
 262 2011-05-08 02:54:51 * sipa realises his body needs sleep
 263 2011-05-08 03:01:42 kika has joined
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 267 2011-05-08 03:09:48 <luke-jr> phantomcircuit: rearrange the link order
 268 2011-05-08 03:11:54 <midnightmagic> one possible reason to fill up txn space with small txn. . money remixing?
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 272 2011-05-08 03:13:25 <lfm> midnightmagic: thr expensive way?
 273 2011-05-08 03:14:23 [Noodles] has joined
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 277 2011-05-08 03:18:39 <midnightmagic> yah i guess not..
 278 2011-05-08 03:19:02 <CIA-30> DiabloMiner: Patrick McFarland master * rff33f17 / (6 files in 2 dirs): Removed Windows.bat, now using Launch4j binary, moved -w back to max - http://bit.ly/ljp5Dx
 279 2011-05-08 03:20:00 <kika> jgarzik: would like to test my pushpoold setup?
 280 2011-05-08 03:21:02 MinerTE has joined
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 285 2011-05-08 03:35:57 <yebyen> anyone have experience with virtualbox mining?
 286 2011-05-08 03:36:17 <phantomcircuit> yebyen, i doubt that's possible
 287 2011-05-08 03:36:19 <Diablo-D3> dont bother
 288 2011-05-08 03:36:19 <lfm> yebyen: dont do it, use physical machine
 289 2011-05-08 03:36:21 <yebyen> can you simply check "enable 3d acceleration" and let your opencl clients take advantage of it
 290 2011-05-08 03:36:22 Netsniper has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
 291 2011-05-08 03:36:22 <Diablo-D3> you cant pass the gpu through
 292 2011-05-08 03:36:26 x5x is now known as x5x`brb
 293 2011-05-08 03:36:29  is now known as Netsniper|!~kvirc@adsl-76-252-23-249.dsl.ipltin.sbcglobal.net|Netsniper
 294 2011-05-08 03:36:36 <Diablo-D3> yebyen: 3D acceleration on windows guests works like this
 295 2011-05-08 03:36:52 <yebyen> lfm: i have windows folk who will give me a linux vm, but they dont like the idea of reformatting
 296 2011-05-08 03:37:01 [N00dles] has joined
 297 2011-05-08 03:37:05 <yebyen> they are not using their gpus for anything but aero
 298 2011-05-08 03:37:07 <lfm> yebyen: so mine in  windows
 299 2011-05-08 03:37:11 <Diablo-D3> yebyen: you have a copy of wined3d (wine's d3d libs built on native windows), and it talks to the guests opengl passthrough, which is then passed through to your host....
 300 2011-05-08 03:37:24 <Diablo-D3> yebyen: at no point does the guest windows have access to your card.
 301 2011-05-08 03:38:25 <Diablo-D3> so nope, no gpu mining for you.
 302 2011-05-08 03:39:01 <B0g4r7> Try a Xen DomU.
 303 2011-05-08 03:39:03 <phantomcircuit> yebyen, you can run a miner on windows though
 304 2011-05-08 03:39:11 <Diablo-D3> B0g4r7: meh, pci-e passthrough on xen is a pita
 305 2011-05-08 03:39:28 <lfm> just mine on the native windows machine
 306 2011-05-08 03:39:33 <Diablo-D3> and yeah, just mine natively
 307 2011-05-08 03:39:36 <B0g4r7> Just to initially configure, or always?
 308 2011-05-08 03:39:40 <Diablo-D3> B0g4r7: always
 309 2011-05-08 03:39:55 <Diablo-D3> B0g4r7: mostly the drivers have trouble understanding it
 310 2011-05-08 03:40:00 BitMark has joined
 311 2011-05-08 03:40:24 <yebyen> hmm
 312 2011-05-08 03:40:28 <yebyen> maybe i will do that
 313 2011-05-08 03:40:34 <Diablo-D3> yebyen: my miner works great on windows
 314 2011-05-08 03:40:48 <B0g4r7> Is Windows limited to mining on 4 GPUs?
 315 2011-05-08 03:40:57 <Diablo-D3> B0g4r7: no
 316 2011-05-08 03:41:04 <B0g4r7> Very good.
 317 2011-05-08 03:41:04 <Diablo-D3> get a new enough driver, up to 8 works
 318 2011-05-08 03:41:10 <Diablo-D3> you NEED a 64bit windows though
 319 2011-05-08 03:41:20 <B0g4r7> Can you still use stream 2.1?
 320 2011-05-08 03:41:24 <Diablo-D3> yeah
 321 2011-05-08 03:41:31 <Diablo-D3> you need like 10.11 I think to do it
 322 2011-05-08 03:41:43 <B0g4r7> Cool, I think that's what I have.
 323 2011-05-08 03:41:51 <B0g4r7> and win7 64 bit.
 324 2011-05-08 03:41:55 <yebyen> i will use the gpu on my girlfriend's pc to pay for our groupons
 325 2011-05-08 03:41:56 <yebyen> lol
 326 2011-05-08 03:41:58 <Diablo-D3> you can install 11.4 too and just tell it to not install the sdk
 327 2011-05-08 03:42:02 Herodes has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
 328 2011-05-08 03:42:32 <yebyen> is there any benefit to using gpu miner on gma950?
 329 2011-05-08 03:42:36 <B0g4r7> I had thought that wouldn't work for some reason.
 330 2011-05-08 03:42:41 <yebyen> i guess i can tell you in a few minutes
 331 2011-05-08 03:42:46 <Diablo-D3> yebyen: you cant mine on that.
 332 2011-05-08 03:42:58 <B0g4r7> heh, I can try mining on nvidia ion.
 333 2011-05-08 03:43:08 <yebyen> tell me how it goes
 334 2011-05-08 03:43:09 <Diablo-D3> B0g4r7: about 4mhash/sec.
 335 2011-05-08 03:43:19 <B0g4r7> Which is a step up from gma950.
 336 2011-05-08 03:43:20 <B0g4r7> heh.
 337 2011-05-08 03:43:21 <yebyen> that doesn't sound so good
 338 2011-05-08 03:43:34 <retinal> barely worth the trouble :>
 339 2011-05-08 03:43:36 <Diablo-D3> in comparison, people have 5870s doing 350+
 340 2011-05-08 03:43:43 <Diablo-D3> although thats OC'ed
 341 2011-05-08 03:43:57 <B0g4r7> 5850s look like a good sweet spot.
 342 2011-05-08 03:44:03 <retinal> 350 is around average for stock+BFI_INT
 343 2011-05-08 03:44:10 <B0g4r7> Not in efficiency so much tho.
 344 2011-05-08 03:44:14 <B0g4r7> power wqise
 345 2011-05-08 03:44:20 <Diablo-D3> retinal: rly?
 346 2011-05-08 03:44:25 <yebyen> who is experimenting with bitcoin trading robots?
 347 2011-05-08 03:44:45 <retinal> Diablo-D3: yep, I get 420MH/s at 1010MHz + BFI_INT
 348 2011-05-08 03:44:47 <B0g4r7> I know a guy that wants to.
 349 2011-05-08 03:44:52 <B0g4r7> (yebyen)
 350 2011-05-08 03:45:05 <Diablo-D3> retinal: holy crap
 351 2011-05-08 03:45:07 <lfm> yebyen: I dont think they want people to know who they are
 352 2011-05-08 03:45:17 <yebyen> lfm: i guess they don't
 353 2011-05-08 03:45:17 <Diablo-D3> retinal: and it hasnt burst into flames yet?
 354 2011-05-08 03:45:22 <retinal> Adapter 2 - ATI Radeon HD 5800 Series
 355 2011-05-08 03:45:22 <retinal>             Sensor 0: Temperature - 71.50 C
 356 2011-05-08 03:45:26 <retinal> not even close
 357 2011-05-08 03:45:30 <Diablo-D3> keep going!
 358 2011-05-08 03:45:32 <yebyen> B0g4r7: actually i'm going to build a craps game that runs on incompatible bitcoins
 359 2011-05-08 03:45:34 <retinal> pfft
 360 2011-05-08 03:45:38 <Diablo-D3> retinal: is that with the 300mhz mem hack?
 361 2011-05-08 03:45:39 <retinal> it's between 5970s
 362 2011-05-08 03:45:39 <yebyen> (for legal purposes)
 363 2011-05-08 03:46:00 <retinal> Diablo-D3: nope, 1200MHz memory clock
 364 2011-05-08 03:46:10 <Diablo-D3> retinal: damn, you could get a fair bit more out of that
 365 2011-05-08 03:46:15 <retinal>  Configurable Peak Range : [600-2000]     [1200-2000]
 366 2011-05-08 03:46:17 <retinal> too lazy
 367 2011-05-08 03:46:27 <Diablo-D3> use amdoverdrivectl
 368 2011-05-08 03:46:32 <B0g4r7> I assume that's not using the stock cooler.
 369 2011-05-08 03:46:37 <yebyen> i have a couple of nodes that have been generating for a while with 400k phony bitcoins each
 370 2011-05-08 03:46:38 <retinal> scratch that: very lazy
 371 2011-05-08 03:46:45 <yebyen> 800khash
 372 2011-05-08 03:46:48 <phantomcircuit> yebyen, or you could run the craps server on tor...
 373 2011-05-08 03:46:52 <yebyen> not very good, unless they just compete with each other
 374 2011-05-08 03:47:09 <yebyen> phantomcircuit: or you could buy the craps game from me, and you take the risk :D
 375 2011-05-08 03:47:12 <lfm> yebyen: whats a phony bitcoin?
 376 2011-05-08 03:47:22 <phantomcircuit> yebyen, lulz
 377 2011-05-08 03:47:27 <B0g4r7> a testnet coin?
 378 2011-05-08 03:47:31 <yebyen> pre-testnet
 379 2011-05-08 03:47:35 <yebyen> around version 311
 380 2011-05-08 03:47:42 <lfm> oh ok
 381 2011-05-08 03:47:48 <yebyen> i adjusted the parameters myself, then i think i lost the sources
 382 2011-05-08 03:48:01 <yebyen> so i'll have to figure out how to read the blockchain to learn what all of the params were again ^_^
 383 2011-05-08 03:48:21 <yebyen> i know at least my addresses start with 2G/2H
 384 2011-05-08 03:48:30 <yebyen> i used a pretty high addressversion instead of 0x1
 385 2011-05-08 03:49:59 <yebyen> does testnet isolate your nodes, or does it join "the one testnet" if you're not careful about firewalling?
 386 2011-05-08 03:50:06 <yebyen> i haven't tried it
 387 2011-05-08 03:50:26 amiller has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 388 2011-05-08 03:50:29 <theymos> It joins the official testnet.
 389 2011-05-08 03:50:50 <yebyen> that's no fun
 390 2011-05-08 03:51:23 kika has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
 391 2011-05-08 03:51:23 <theymos> See testnet-in-a-box if you want a separate testnet. http://sourceforge.net/projects/bitcoin/files/Bitcoin/testnet-in-a-box/
 392 2011-05-08 03:52:19 amiller has joined
 393 2011-05-08 03:55:26 <yebyen> thanks
 394 2011-05-08 03:56:34 <yebyen> exactly what i was looking for
 395 2011-05-08 03:58:17 Silverpike has joined
 396 2011-05-08 03:58:40 kika has joined
 397 2011-05-08 03:58:59 <kika> can someone test if can connect their miner to my pushpoold server?
 398 2011-05-08 03:59:18 <kika> IP: 201.254.116.137 port: 8337 ( http json )    username: juan password: juan1234
 399 2011-05-08 03:59:34 BitMark has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
 400 2011-05-08 03:59:38 <Diablo-D3> just a sec
 401 2011-05-08 04:00:18 BitMark has joined
 402 2011-05-08 04:00:46 <Diablo-D3> its slow
 403 2011-05-08 04:01:04 <Diablo-D3> its VERY slow
 404 2011-05-08 04:01:11 <kika> Diablo-D3: did you test it'
 405 2011-05-08 04:01:13 <kika> ?
 406 2011-05-08 04:01:14 <Diablo-D3> yes
 407 2011-05-08 04:01:20 <kika> Diablo-D3: its working for you ?
 408 2011-05-08 04:01:25 <Diablo-D3> its VERY slow
 409 2011-05-08 04:01:43 <kika> Diablo-D3: how many Mhash its working and how many mhash its supposed to be?
 410 2011-05-08 04:01:49 <kika> Diablo-D3: ya thats the problem i had
 411 2011-05-08 04:01:54 <Diablo-D3> it hasnt even gotten to the point of displaying mhash
 412 2011-05-08 04:01:55 <kika> Diablo-D3: i dont know why its slow
 413 2011-05-08 04:02:20 <Diablo-D3> jesus christ, it ran through two nonces before the third execution thread even started
 414 2011-05-08 04:02:37 <Diablo-D3> infact, it just said I was doing over 3 ghash/sec
 415 2011-05-08 04:02:41 <Diablo-D3> because it took so long
 416 2011-05-08 04:03:36 * Diablo-D3 goes back to deepbit
 417 2011-05-08 04:03:48 vorlov has joined
 418 2011-05-08 04:04:17 <kika> Diablo-D3: so basically my pool is slow?
 419 2011-05-08 04:04:27 <Diablo-D3> extremely.
 420 2011-05-08 04:04:45 <kika> Diablo-D3: do you know what can be the problem? jgarzik told his pushpoold isnt slow
 421 2011-05-08 04:04:59 jrabbit has quit (Quit: Reconnecting)
 422 2011-05-08 04:05:01 <kika> Diablo-D3: my outbound network connection is 128kb
 423 2011-05-08 04:05:04 <kika> Diablo-D3: that could the the problem?
 424 2011-05-08 04:05:05 vsviridov has joined
 425 2011-05-08 04:05:16 jrabbit has joined
 426 2011-05-08 04:05:25 <vsviridov> Hello all
 427 2011-05-08 04:05:36 Kicchiri has joined
 428 2011-05-08 04:05:36 ForceDestroyer has quit (Disconnected by services)
 429 2011-05-08 04:05:59 <kika> Diablo-D3: maybe the problem is that the pushpoold is running on a virtual machine?
 430 2011-05-08 04:06:24 <Diablo-D3> probably not
 431 2011-05-08 04:06:28 <Diablo-D3> unless your machine is udder shit
 432 2011-05-08 04:06:39 <kika> Diablo-D3: udder?
 433 2011-05-08 04:06:57 <B0g4r7> 128kbps should work fine for testing.
 434 2011-05-08 04:06:58 <B0g4r7> But it won't scale up to a lot of clients too much before getting overloaded.
 435 2011-05-08 04:08:02 <kika> B0g4r7: i know but i just want to test 1 client first and make sure it be working okay
 436 2011-05-08 04:08:24 drazak has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
 437 2011-05-08 04:08:30 drazak has joined
 438 2011-05-08 04:09:22  has joined
 439 2011-05-08 04:10:17 <vsviridov> Hey guys, I wrote a bit post with ideas on Bitcoin POS Terminals here : http://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=7539.0
 440 2011-05-08 04:10:27 <vsviridov> some suggestions or feedback would be appreciated
 441 2011-05-08 04:10:56 <kika> Diablo-D3: so 3Ghash/s is slow for you?
 442 2011-05-08 04:11:20 <lfm> vsviridov: I havnt seen your posts but bitcoin is not well suited to pos
 443 2011-05-08 04:11:42 <vsviridov> well, read it, you might change your mind :)
 444 2011-05-08 04:12:17 <lfm> so how do you convince people to sit around for an hour while their transactions are confirmed
 445 2011-05-08 04:12:40 <Diablo-D3> kika: no, it means your pool is so slow my mhash meter got stuck
 446 2011-05-08 04:12:57 Netsniper has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
 447 2011-05-08 04:13:13 <lfm> ya blame it on his slow pool
 448 2011-05-08 04:14:12 <kika> Diablo-D3: i dont know what you mean
 449 2011-05-08 04:14:27 <kika> Diablo-D3: i didnt even see your connection on the log
 450 2011-05-08 04:14:46 <Diablo-D3> well, I connected. and it was slow.
 451 2011-05-08 04:15:20 <kika> Diablo-D3: did you ever connected to other pushpoold?
 452 2011-05-08 04:15:24 <Diablo-D3> no
 453 2011-05-08 04:15:34 <kika> Diablo-D3: i see well maybe the software is just slow i dont know
 454 2011-05-08 04:15:53 <kika> Diablo-D3: jgarzik says his software isnt slow but im wondering it
 455 2011-05-08 04:16:03 <kika> jgarzik: ?
 456 2011-05-08 04:16:09 tabsa has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
 457 2011-05-08 04:16:58 <vsviridov> lfm: might work for food-related places, as you're waiting for food to be ready anyway :D
 458 2011-05-08 04:17:25 <vsviridov> besides, they won't have to wait for an hour
 459 2011-05-08 04:17:40 [N00dles] is now known as [Noodles]
 460 2011-05-08 04:17:43 <vsviridov> several confirmations are available in a few minutes, from what i can tell
 461 2011-05-08 04:20:06 <lfm> they might have to wait more than an hour
 462 2011-05-08 04:20:30 <theymos> 0 confirmations is better than the credit card situation.
 463 2011-05-08 04:20:35 <kika> Diablo-D3: deepbit uses http rpc too ?
 464 2011-05-08 04:20:55 <Diablo-D3> yes, and lp.
 465 2011-05-08 04:21:19 <kika> Diablo-D3: how many mhash you get at my pool?
 466 2011-05-08 04:21:35 B0g4r7 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
 467 2011-05-08 04:21:44 <Diablo-D3> kika: effectively 0
 468 2011-05-08 04:21:49 <Diablo-D3> takes too long for getworks to return
 469 2011-05-08 04:22:11 <kika> Diablo-D3: uhmm so you think it might be network connection?
 470 2011-05-08 04:22:18 <Diablo-D3> who knows
 471 2011-05-08 04:23:31 <kika> Diablo-D3: i just restarted it, can you try again?
 472 2011-05-08 04:23:58 B0g4r7 has joined
 473 2011-05-08 04:24:05 <Diablo-D3> kika: isnt connecting
 474 2011-05-08 04:25:04 <kika> Diablo-D3: yes i never got a connection from you so i think there is any problem, the other time you tested it connected'
 475 2011-05-08 04:25:04 <kika> ?
 476 2011-05-08 04:25:16 vsviridov has left ()
 477 2011-05-08 04:25:32 <Diablo-D3> kika: whatever it is, its on your end
 478 2011-05-08 04:25:56 <lfm> kiba cuz Diablo-D3 never makes mistakes
 479 2011-05-08 04:26:03 <kika> Diablo-D3: yes i know ill see how i can fix it because all my friends arent even able to connect using poclbm
 480 2011-05-08 04:26:42 <kika> jgarzik: are you there?
 481 2011-05-08 04:27:02 <Diablo-D3> kika: dunno.
 482 2011-05-08 04:28:46 <jgarzik> kika: yes
 483 2011-05-08 04:30:09 B0g4r7 has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
 484 2011-05-08 04:32:13 eao has joined
 485 2011-05-08 04:33:14 alystair has quit (Quit: ┌(・_・)┘OUTTA HERE└(・o・)┐)
 486 2011-05-08 04:34:13 Jkessler has joined
 487 2011-05-08 04:37:44 kimchi has joined
 488 2011-05-08 04:38:12 orbiting has joined
 489 2011-05-08 04:38:41 n0n0 has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
 490 2011-05-08 04:38:45 <kika> jgarzik: do you know whats going on with my pushpoold?
 491 2011-05-08 04:38:49 eao has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 492 2011-05-08 04:39:10 <jgarzik> kika: no
 493 2011-05-08 04:39:13 <kika> jgarzik: i can give you my IP so you can test, im running pushpoold however no one seems to be able to connect using miners
 494 2011-05-08 04:39:25 <kika> jgarzik: what ports do i need to open other than 8337 ?
 495 2011-05-08 04:39:55 amiller has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 496 2011-05-08 04:40:08 <jgarzik> kika: it's an HTTP proxy.  it accepts connections on the port(s) you specify, and makes outgoing connections to the JSON-RPC endpoint you specify.
 497 2011-05-08 04:40:09 <lfm> how does pushpol work as opposed to getwork? Is there a formal description somewhere
 498 2011-05-08 04:40:18 <jgarzik> lfm: ^^
 499 2011-05-08 04:40:43 <kika> jgarzik: yes i know, i specified to make connections to the json-rpc running at 127.0.0.1 and 8332
 500 2011-05-08 04:40:47 <kika> jgarzik: on localhost i have bitcoind running
 501 2011-05-08 04:40:50 <jgarzik> lfm: when you call getwork, pushpool calls upstream getwork.
 502 2011-05-08 04:40:53 amiller has joined
 503 2011-05-08 04:40:59 <kika> jgarzik: and  bitcoind opens port 8332
 504 2011-05-08 04:41:08 <kika> jgarzik: the rpc user and password are okay
 505 2011-05-08 04:41:40 <kika> jgarzik: however only minerd works for me
 506 2011-05-08 04:42:03 <kika> jgarzik: diablominer and poclbm doesnt seem to be working when i try to connect those miners to pushpoold http json port 8337
 507 2011-05-08 04:42:22 <Diablo-D3> kika: tell jgarzik to take me off ignore
 508 2011-05-08 04:42:22 <kika> jgarzik: do i need to open any other ports on the firewall other than 8337 ?
 509 2011-05-08 04:42:28 <jgarzik> kika: <shrug>  they work for luke-jr's pool
 510 2011-05-08 04:42:42 <luke-jr> no firewall here
 511 2011-05-08 04:42:54 <kika> jgarzik: diablo-d3 is telling me to to take him off from ignore
 512 2011-05-08 04:43:16 <Diablo-D3> kika needs to learn english.
 513 2011-05-08 04:43:19 <kika> luke-jr: i run behind a router so i cant just open all ports, i need to know what ports to open or redirect
 514 2011-05-08 04:43:43 <kika> jgarzik: right now im only opening 8337 to the outside
 515 2011-05-08 04:44:17 lfm has quit (Quit: brb)
 516 2011-05-08 04:44:49 <kika> jgarzik: when a miner connects to pushpoold at 8337, it uses any other ports?
 517 2011-05-08 04:45:41 <jgarzik> kika: define "it"
 518 2011-05-08 04:45:46 lfm has joined
 519 2011-05-08 04:46:05 <kika> jgarzik: pushpoold uses any other ports other than port 8337 to talk to the miner?
 520 2011-05-08 04:46:19 <jgarzik> kika: as I just said, it accepts connections on the port(s) you specify, and makes outgoing connections to the JSON-RPC endpoint you specify.  -You- already know 100% of the network port activity, because you created the configuration file that specified the TCP ports you'll be using.
 521 2011-05-08 04:47:08 <jgarzik> kika: your config file is the only one that can answer that.  your average miner connects to the endpoint you specify, and that's it.
 522 2011-05-08 04:47:38 <kika>                 { "port" : 8336 },                         { "port" : 8337, "protocol" : "http-json" },                 { "host" : "127.0.0.1", "port" : 8338, "protocol" : "binary" }
 523 2011-05-08 04:47:51 <kika> "rpc.url" : "http://127.0.0.1:8332/"
 524 2011-05-08 04:47:55 <kika> jgarzik: thats it
 525 2011-05-08 04:48:11 <jgarzik> kika: it listens on ports 8336, 8337, and 8338, and connects outgoing to port 8332
 526 2011-05-08 04:48:22 <kika> jgarzik: so basically as i understand miners will have to connect to 8337 to talk to pushpoold
 527 2011-05-08 04:48:32 <jgarzik> kika: yes
 528 2011-05-08 04:48:40 <kika> jgarzik: yes i know, so i understand that 8337 needs to be open to the internet
 529 2011-05-08 04:48:46 manu1 has left ()
 530 2011-05-08 04:48:48 <kika> jgarzik: so internet miners can use the pool
 531 2011-05-08 04:48:55 <kika> jgarzik: via http rpc
 532 2011-05-08 04:49:03 <kika> jgarzik: however i dont know that 8336 is used for
 533 2011-05-08 04:49:35 <kika> jgarzik: it uses a different protocol on each of those ports' 8336 8337 and 8338 ?
 534 2011-05-08 04:49:59 <kika> 8337 is http json
 535 2011-05-08 04:50:07 <kika> 8338 is binary
 536 2011-05-08 04:50:12 <kika> what about 8336 ?
 537 2011-05-08 04:50:39 <kika> i dont understand really why poclbm miners arent able to connect to it to port 8337 really
 538 2011-05-08 04:51:07 <Diablo-D3> jgarzik: hey
 539 2011-05-08 04:52:11 <kika> jgarzik: do you know whats wrong?
 540 2011-05-08 04:52:26 <jgarzik> kika: no
 541 2011-05-08 04:52:38 <kika> it has been two weeks since im trying to configure pushpoold to work with poclbm
 542 2011-05-08 04:52:48 <kika> jgarzik: it just works with minerd
 543 2011-05-08 04:52:52 n0n0 has joined
 544 2011-05-08 04:53:02 <kika> and with rpcminer
 545 2011-05-08 04:53:14 <kika> it doesnt work with diablominer or poclbm
 546 2011-05-08 04:53:21 <kika> IP: 201.254.116.137 port: 8337
 547 2011-05-08 04:53:24 <kika> you can try yourself
 548 2011-05-08 04:53:27 <kika> username: juan
 549 2011-05-08 04:53:32 <kika> password: juan1234
 550 2011-05-08 04:53:59 <jgarzik> kika: Sorry, I'm not interested in trying.  It works for other people and other pools.
 551 2011-05-08 04:54:15 <jgarzik> kika: open source means you have the tools necessary to figure out this stuff yourself
 552 2011-05-08 04:54:20 ErryDayImGenerat has joined
 553 2011-05-08 04:54:32 <kika> jgarzik: yes well ill just have to explore more the code i think
 554 2011-05-08 04:56:29 dust- has joined
 555 2011-05-08 04:56:37 <kika> luke-jr: can you help me?
 556 2011-05-08 04:57:25 dust- is now known as [DusT]
 557 2011-05-08 05:00:22 <kika> luke-jr: diablominer and poclbm works on your pushpoold setup'
 558 2011-05-08 05:00:22 <kika> ?
 559 2011-05-08 05:00:50 Cusipzzz has quit (Quit: KVIrc 4.0.2 Insomnia http://www.kvirc.net/)
 560 2011-05-08 05:01:18 eao has joined
 561 2011-05-08 05:06:55 <rawry> stupid russians need to stop so that the mtgox guys can get back to important things
 562 2011-05-08 05:06:55 Kiba has joined
 563 2011-05-08 05:07:01 <rawry> like automated bank xfers
 564 2011-05-08 05:07:18 <lfm> use https://www.mtgox.com
 565 2011-05-08 05:07:27 <rawry> i know
 566 2011-05-08 05:09:03 <Kiba> hello
 567 2011-05-08 05:09:55 <kika> jgarzik: i think your pushpoold just doesnt support diablominer or poclbm
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 571 2011-05-08 05:17:16 <kika> luke-jr: did you test pushpoold with diablominer or poclbm ?
 572 2011-05-08 05:17:21  is now known as Netsniper|!~kvirc@adsl-76-240-192-91.dsl.ipltin.sbcglobal.net|Netsniper
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 579 2011-05-08 05:23:45 <B0g4r7> I b0rked my miner box trying to downgrade to stream 2.1.
 580 2011-05-08 05:24:21 <B0g4r7> ImportError: DLL load failed: The specified procedure could not be found.
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 586 2011-05-08 05:38:14 <Jkessler> you did WHAT to your "miner box" ?
 587 2011-05-08 05:38:17 <Jkessler> no wonder it doesn't work..
 588 2011-05-08 05:39:12 <rawry> that's not what THAT hole is for ...
 589 2011-05-08 05:39:31 <rawry> just cause it fits in the cdrom manual eject mechanism is no excuse.
 590 2011-05-08 05:39:33 <Jkessler> scuzzy ports :P
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 595 2011-05-08 05:58:39 <B0g4r7> gpucaps shows openCL working...
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 621 2011-05-08 06:50:55 <JFK911> ;;bc,stats
 622 2011-05-08 06:50:56 <gribble> Current Blocks: 122605 | Current Difficulty: 109670.13329248 | Next Difficulty At Block: 122975 | Next Difficulty In: 370 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 day, 18 hours, 20 minutes, and 40 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 153762.83695790
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 651 2011-05-08 07:17:49 <wumpus> I thought, wow, my PC is wonderfully silent... at least one good thing to that Slush's pool is malfunctioning :P
 652 2011-05-08 07:18:57 <[Tycho]> :)
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 685 2011-05-08 07:46:11 <gjs278> what the fuck
 686 2011-05-08 07:46:12 <gjs278> 500 ghash
 687 2011-05-08 07:46:15 <gjs278> this is bullshit
 688 2011-05-08 07:46:22 <Diablo-D3> yeah no kidding
 689 2011-05-08 07:46:30 <Diablo-D3> there isnt that much in the whole world
 690 2011-05-08 07:47:15 <gjs278> the price on coins might go up at least if the number 1 trading site could stay online
 691 2011-05-08 07:47:23 <gjs278> 3.66 now
 692 2011-05-08 07:47:37 <gjs278> then mtgox goes down on another ddos and it stays that way
 693 2011-05-08 07:47:47 datathe1st has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
 694 2011-05-08 07:51:38 Fnar has joined
 695 2011-05-08 07:52:17 <[Tycho]> Why would the price go up now ?
 696 2011-05-08 07:53:35 <Diablo-D3> actually
 697 2011-05-08 07:53:38 <Diablo-D3> SHOULD the price go up
 698 2011-05-08 07:53:46 <Diablo-D3> I sorta like the bubble being half inflated here
 699 2011-05-08 07:53:55 <gjs278> that's true
 700 2011-05-08 07:54:08 <random_> well, IF the price is going to go up then it should go up sooner rather than later
 701 2011-05-08 07:54:20 <random_> we need the price to be stable for months to encourage adoption
 702 2011-05-08 07:54:21 <gjs278> the price would go up because everyone is getting less and less coins but the people buying the coins are only buying them because they intend to sell them later
 703 2011-05-08 07:54:29 <Diablo-D3> gjs278: except
 704 2011-05-08 07:54:36 <Diablo-D3> people are already trading based on there being 21 million coins.
 705 2011-05-08 07:54:49 <random_> yeah right...
 706 2011-05-08 07:54:57 <Diablo-D3> the coins already exist
 707 2011-05-08 07:55:01 <Diablo-D3> we just havent named them all yet
 708 2011-05-08 07:55:10 <gjs278> well
 709 2011-05-08 07:55:23 <gjs278> $3.66 a coin isn't what the final value would be when all 21 million are in play I think
 710 2011-05-08 07:55:27 <Diablo-D3> sorta like *ding!* achievement unlocked every ten minutes
 711 2011-05-08 07:55:41 <Diablo-D3> gjs278: except that doesnt imply what you think it does
 712 2011-05-08 07:56:04 <Diablo-D3> in 2 years, the price is going to be higher than it is now no matter if we stop mining right this second or not
 713 2011-05-08 07:56:09 <gjs278> yeah
 714 2011-05-08 07:56:12 <gjs278> that's true
 715 2011-05-08 07:56:16 <gjs278> just the adoption alone will do it
 716 2011-05-08 07:56:19 <random_> 2 years?
 717 2011-05-08 07:56:26 <Diablo-D3> (or, equally, it could bomb and never come back under the same conditions)
 718 2011-05-08 07:56:26 <gjs278> 2 years, 1 year, whatever
 719 2011-05-08 07:56:33 <random_> I don't know about 2 years - this could all disappear in two years...
 720 2011-05-08 07:56:43 <Diablo-D3> random_: you're missing the point
 721 2011-05-08 07:56:44 <gjs278> I don't see why it would
 722 2011-05-08 07:57:05 <random_> no, I get the point
 723 2011-05-08 07:57:15 <random_> I'm just being confrontational...
 724 2011-05-08 07:57:16 <random_> lol
 725 2011-05-08 07:57:49 * Diablo-D3 smacks random_ 
 726 2011-05-08 07:58:06 <edcba> gjs278: it depends on adoption
 727 2011-05-08 07:58:20 <edcba> if there are 21M coins and the whole world uses it...
 728 2011-05-08 07:58:27 <gjs278> the adoption could be solely neckbeards it would still be okay
 729 2011-05-08 07:58:31 <edcba> then one coin will worth a lot more than $3
 730 2011-05-08 07:58:38 <random_> the biggest factor I think is how the governments react to bitcoin
 731 2011-05-08 07:58:52 <gjs278> ron paul will buy all of the bitcoins
 732 2011-05-08 07:59:03 <[Tycho]> I wonder why people think that it would be linked to current volume of fiat currency.
 733 2011-05-08 07:59:38 <Diablo-D3> heh
 734 2011-05-08 07:59:39 <Diablo-D3> dude
 735 2011-05-08 07:59:44 <Diablo-D3> look what happened last time when ron paul got involved
 736 2011-05-08 08:00:02 <phantomcircuit> lol
 737 2011-05-08 08:00:05 <gjs278> ronald paul will be the end of bitcions
 738 2011-05-08 08:00:07 <gjs278> I'm serious
 739 2011-05-08 08:00:09 <gjs278> if bitcoins die
 740 2011-05-08 08:00:10 <phantomcircuit> political smack down
 741 2011-05-08 08:00:13 <gjs278> it was because of ron paul
 742 2011-05-08 08:00:26 <Diablo-D3> Liberty Dollars
 743 2011-05-08 08:00:29 <gjs278> yes
 744 2011-05-08 08:00:34 <Diablo-D3> had a special issue of coins with Ron Paul on them
 745 2011-05-08 08:00:40 <gjs278> and if he somehow became president, he would let anyone print currencies
 746 2011-05-08 08:00:49 <gjs278> and then bitcoin would lose its market share on being alternate currency
 747 2011-05-08 08:00:55 <Diablo-D3> gjs278: no
 748 2011-05-08 08:00:57 <gjs278> to a bunch  ofhippies printing ron paul bucks
 749 2011-05-08 08:00:59 <Diablo-D3> he'd just get rid of the fed
 750 2011-05-08 08:01:07 <Diablo-D3> america's first successful alternate currency
 751 2011-05-08 08:01:07 <gjs278> you never know
 752 2011-05-08 08:01:09 <Diablo-D3> dohohohoho
 753 2011-05-08 08:01:13 <gjs278> yeah
 754 2011-05-08 08:01:17 <Diablo-D3> see, I just made a joke there
 755 2011-05-08 08:01:28 <gjs278> the thing is, ron paul coins are actually still worth something because they're made of silver
 756 2011-05-08 08:01:34 <gjs278> if you have the dollars though
 757 2011-05-08 08:01:36 <gjs278> yeah good luck
 758 2011-05-08 08:01:42 <Diablo-D3> dude
 759 2011-05-08 08:01:49 <Diablo-D3> did anyone actually get any?
 760 2011-05-08 08:01:59 <gjs278> I've seen no fed ron paul coins before
 761 2011-05-08 08:02:00 <Diablo-D3> the FBI ceased most of them
 762 2011-05-08 08:02:12 <Diablo-D3> something like 3 tons of silver
 763 2011-05-08 08:02:12 <gjs278> well if you had like the paper dollars you are fucked
 764 2011-05-08 08:02:19 <gjs278> like at that point your money is gone
 765 2011-05-08 08:02:28 <gjs278> but if you have actual ron paul coins
 766 2011-05-08 08:02:33 <gjs278> you're somewhat better off
 767 2011-05-08 08:03:01 Marcel has joined
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 771 2011-05-08 08:05:46 <gjs278> nothing would make me happier than somehow organizing a translation of every coin where we agree as a group to only sell them to libertarians
 772 2011-05-08 08:06:00 <gjs278> and then once all of the coins are bought up by libertarians, we just part ways and never use the coins again
 773 2011-05-08 08:06:36 <random_> lol - like a government confiscation of bitcoins?
 774 2011-05-08 08:06:48 BitMark has joined
 775 2011-05-08 08:06:49 <Diablo-D3> ... uh
 776 2011-05-08 08:06:49 <random_> like when they closed the gold window?
 777 2011-05-08 08:06:54 <Diablo-D3> I'd like to see that fucking happen
 778 2011-05-08 08:07:02 <gjs278> no, just tricking libertiarns into buying these
 779 2011-05-08 08:07:04 <Diablo-D3> BITCOINS DONT EXIST
 780 2011-05-08 08:07:10 <gjs278> thats all I want to do
 781 2011-05-08 08:07:11 <Diablo-D3> THEY ARE NOT REAL
 782 2011-05-08 08:07:14 <gjs278> exactly
 783 2011-05-08 08:07:18 <Diablo-D3> I CANNOT LIGHT A CIGAR WITH ONE
 784 2011-05-08 08:07:21 <Diablo-D3> TRUST ME, IVE TRIED
 785 2011-05-08 08:07:24 <gjs278> cant swim in them
 786 2011-05-08 08:07:30 TheKid has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
 787 2011-05-08 08:07:30 <Diablo-D3> IT TOOK ME A WEEK TO GET THE BURN MARKS OFF THE CIELING
 788 2011-05-08 08:07:44 <Diablo-D3> scared the shit out of my minature giraffe too
 789 2011-05-08 08:08:54 <phantomcircuit> lololol
 790 2011-05-08 08:09:28 wolfspraul has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
 791 2011-05-08 08:09:33 <wumpus> heh, it wouldn't be the first time the government tries to confiscate things that are not real, such as domain names and intellectual property 
 792 2011-05-08 08:09:35 wolfspraul has joined
 793 2011-05-08 08:09:41 <Diablo-D3> wumpus: but uh
 794 2011-05-08 08:09:49 <Diablo-D3> what are they going to confiscate them off of?
 795 2011-05-08 08:09:53 <gjs278> I'm telling you, if we want to inflate these things, we need to get libertarians on board
 796 2011-05-08 08:09:55 <gjs278> they will buy them
 797 2011-05-08 08:09:56 <wumpus> they will probably be just as succesful :')
 798 2011-05-08 08:10:00 <gjs278> they will do anything to spite the govt
 799 2011-05-08 08:10:05 <gjs278> including spending money on virtual coins
 800 2011-05-08 08:10:08 <Diablo-D3> man
 801 2011-05-08 08:10:16 <Diablo-D3> I should start a religion
 802 2011-05-08 08:10:18 <gjs278> all libertarians are in IT
 803 2011-05-08 08:10:21 <Diablo-D3> the religion of bitcoin
 804 2011-05-08 08:10:24 <gjs278> so it wont even be hard to explain it to them
 805 2011-05-08 08:10:26 <gjs278> they'll get it
 806 2011-05-08 08:10:31 <wumpus> Diablo-D3: dunno, they could probably think of some stupid thing that'll never work but put tons of resources into trying it anyway
 807 2011-05-08 08:10:50 <Diablo-D3> wumpus: AMERICA, FUCK YEAH
 808 2011-05-08 08:10:57 <Diablo-D3> (saving the motherfucking day, yeah)
 809 2011-05-08 08:11:20 <wumpus> yeah LETS DECLARE WAR ON ANOTHER THING
 810 2011-05-08 08:11:23 <Diablo-D3> theres been a resurgence of popularity of this song too
 811 2011-05-08 08:11:31 <wumpus> OR COUNTRY
 812 2011-05-08 08:11:33 <Diablo-D3> ever since the bin laden water skiing accident
 813 2011-05-08 08:11:37 <wumpus> hehe
 814 2011-05-08 08:11:38 <Diablo-D3> its kind of disturbing really
 815 2011-05-08 08:11:53 zyb has joined
 816 2011-05-08 08:12:28 <wumpus> it is
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 823 2011-05-08 08:24:05 <UukGoblin> yay, gribble's back
 824 2011-05-08 08:26:21 <phantomcircuit> ;;bc,mtgox
 825 2011-05-08 08:26:22 <gribble> {"ticker":{"high":3.76,"low":3.45,"vol":21889,"buy":3.637,"sell":3.7098,"last":3.637}}
 826 2011-05-08 08:27:45 AStove has joined
 827 2011-05-08 08:32:38 <random_> so has anyone created a php library to check blocks yet?
 828 2011-05-08 08:32:55 <random_> *verify blocks
 829 2011-05-08 08:33:18 <random_> I'm feeling lazy....
 830 2011-05-08 08:35:17 redtab has quit (Quit: AndroIRC)
 831 2011-05-08 08:35:22 <Aahzmundus> If i make a new wallet, back it up... and then use the original for a while... make more then 100 addresses... and then lost that wallet, will all coin sent to addresses outside the first 100 be in a different... forked wallet that is not backed up?  Or will the blockchain update the old wallet?
 832 2011-05-08 08:36:20 zyb has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 833 2011-05-08 08:36:22 LightRider is now known as LightRider|ak
 834 2011-05-08 08:36:26 LightRider is now known as ak!~LightRide@unaffiliated/lightrider|LightRider|afk
 835 2011-05-08 08:38:31 zyb has joined
 836 2011-05-08 08:38:32 <random_> yep - any addresses you create after that backup will be lost
 837 2011-05-08 08:39:32 <topi`> it seems that everyone has switched to deepbit?
 838 2011-05-08 08:39:46 <Aahzmundus> Is there a way to tell when your wallet ghosts another 100 addresses? filesize?
 839 2011-05-08 08:39:47 zyb has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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 843 2011-05-08 08:43:58 <diki> Can anyone tell me how a 6870 performs at stock in OpenCL?
 844 2011-05-08 08:44:14 <diki> I've learned my lesson in overclocking and will never OC a card
 845 2011-05-08 08:44:20 <gjs278> lol
 846 2011-05-08 08:44:46 <phantomcircuit> lololol
 847 2011-05-08 08:48:22 gjs278 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
 848 2011-05-08 08:48:56 <topi`> diki, my little bro got a stock 6870, it is doing 230 Mhash
 849 2011-05-08 08:49:30 <topi`> slush's pool wasn't responding, so i switched mining to lukejr's pool
 850 2011-05-08 08:49:34 <Aahzmundus> My 5770 does that :P
 851 2011-05-08 08:49:51 gjs278 has joined
 852 2011-05-08 08:49:57 <diki> ;;bc,stats
 853 2011-05-08 08:49:59 <gribble> Current Blocks: 122620 | Current Difficulty: 109670.13329248 | Next Difficulty At Block: 122975 | Next Difficulty In: 355 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 day, 17 hours, 1 minute, and 20 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 153625.63800488
 854 2011-05-08 08:50:01 <topi`> aahz: as well as a stock 5850 :)
 855 2011-05-08 08:50:11 <diki> zomg 1 day and 17 hours...
 856 2011-05-08 08:51:08 <diki> I have to ask, when the difficulty increases will it affect a mining pool's ability to find a block faster, or it will affect every pool miner as well?
 857 2011-05-08 08:51:39 <topi`> it won't affect the pool miners, but the pool will find the right answer more seldom
 858 2011-05-08 08:51:58 <diki> So i will have the same "income" regardless?
 859 2011-05-08 08:52:49 <mtrlt> same income per block, of course
 860 2011-05-08 08:52:59 <mtrlt> but blocks are found more seldom, so absolute income drops
 861 2011-05-08 08:53:21 <mtrlt> unless number of people in the pool rises, but then your payout per block goes down
 862 2011-05-08 08:53:33 <diki> i have a fixed income
 863 2011-05-08 08:53:35 <diki> cause i do PPS
 864 2011-05-08 08:53:52 <mtrlt> they can and will lower the pay
 865 2011-05-08 08:55:05 <mtrlt> if they don't, they will run out of money
 866 2011-05-08 09:02:27 <diki> So this means my half-dead 5850 will barely be able to make 1,5BTC a day
 867 2011-05-08 09:02:32 <diki> or barely 2
 868 2011-05-08 09:03:03 <phantomcircuit> ;;bc,calc 300000
 869 2011-05-08 09:03:04 <gribble> The average time to generate a block at 300000 Khps, given current difficulty of 109670.13329248 , is 2 weeks, 4 days, 4 hours, 8 minutes, and 18 seconds
 870 2011-05-08 09:03:13 <phantomcircuit> diki, yes
 871 2011-05-08 09:03:39 <diki> at least the price of btc should go up
 872 2011-05-08 09:03:46 <diki> or by a small margin at least
 873 2011-05-08 09:04:04 <ArtForz> diki: possible, or maybe it won't
 874 2011-05-08 09:05:34 <ArtForz> price/difficulty has been declining with spikes to the upside for quite some time
 875 2011-05-08 09:05:53 <phantomcircuit> ArtForz, you have a graph of that?
 876 2011-05-08 09:06:07 <ArtForz> http://bitcoin.atspace.com/income.html
 877 2011-05-08 09:06:26 <BlueMatt> lol atspace
 878 2011-05-08 09:06:37 <ArtForz> argh, currently down again
 879 2011-05-08 09:07:08 <ArtForz> shorter term, but more current chart: http://i.imgur.com/R16an.png
 880 2011-05-08 09:07:13 <phantomcircuit> rofl it's like $2/month
 881 2011-05-08 09:07:16 <phantomcircuit> what do you expect
 882 2011-05-08 09:07:30 <phantomcircuit> Unlimited Traffic
 883 2011-05-08 09:07:31 <phantomcircuit> rofl
 884 2011-05-08 09:07:53 <diki> so basically the price might actually fall?
 885 2011-05-08 09:07:57 <phantomcircuit> ArtForz, interesting chart
 886 2011-05-08 09:07:59 <ArtForz> see http://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=7427.0
 887 2011-05-08 09:08:12 <phantomcircuit> diki, what miners can make has been falling
 888 2011-05-08 09:08:30 <phantomcircuit> which is ironically good since it means there isn't actually a bubble
 889 2011-05-08 09:08:56 <ErryDayImGenerat> once difficulty jumps in a day or so i'm interested to see what's oging to happen
 890 2011-05-08 09:09:37 <phantomcircuit> i suspect ArtForz might be the only person with a net profit
 891 2011-05-08 09:09:38 <phantomcircuit> lol
 892 2011-05-08 09:09:46 <phantomcircuit> ;;bc,stats
 893 2011-05-08 09:09:48 <gribble> Current Blocks: 122622 | Current Difficulty: 109670.13329248 | Next Difficulty At Block: 122975 | Next Difficulty In: 353 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 day, 16 hours, 53 minutes, and 21 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 153406.74808122
 894 2011-05-08 09:10:00 <ErryDayImGenerat> heh, i have a profit
 895 2011-05-08 09:10:07 <phantomcircuit> ;;bc,calcd 300000 153406
 896 2011-05-08 09:10:07 <gribble> The average time to generate a block at 300000 Khps, given the supplied difficulty of 153406, is 3 weeks, 4 days, 10 hours, 4 minutes, and 5 seconds
 897 2011-05-08 09:10:55 <diki> ;;bc,calcd 270000 153406.74808122
 898 2011-05-08 09:10:56 <gribble> The average time to generate a block at 270000 Khps, given the supplied difficulty of 153406.74808122, is 4 weeks, 0 days, 5 hours, 51 minutes, and 25 seconds
 899 2011-05-08 09:10:59 zyb has joined
 900 2011-05-08 09:11:03 <ArtForz> ;;gc,gend 1600000 [bc,estimate]
 901 2011-05-08 09:11:05 <gribble> Error: "gc,gend" is not a valid command.
 902 2011-05-08 09:11:08 <ArtForz> ;;bc,gend 1600000 [bc,estimate]
 903 2011-05-08 09:11:09 <gribble> The expected generation output, at 1600000 Khps, given the supplied difficulty of 153464.77496682, is 10.4866110759 BTC per day and 0.436942128164 BTC per hour.
 904 2011-05-08 09:11:17 <ArtForz> not too bad
 905 2011-05-08 09:11:53 <phantomcircuit> nope that would still be 600% roi (excluding up front cost)
 906 2011-05-08 09:12:50 <phantomcircuit> http://www.google.com/search?q=((50+*3.5+USD)%2F(3+weeks%2C+4+days%2C+10+hours%2C+4+minutes%2C+and+5+seconds))%2F(300+Watts+*+0.15USD%2FkWh)
 907 2011-05-08 09:12:51 <phantomcircuit> lol
 908 2011-05-08 09:12:53 <phantomcircuit> <3 google
 909 2011-05-08 09:13:12 Greek_o_nikos has joined
 910 2011-05-08 09:13:19 <ArtForz> well, 1.6Ghps costs me about 0.34 EUR/day to run
 911 2011-05-08 09:14:01 <phantomcircuit> lol
 912 2011-05-08 09:14:03 <Diablo-D3> hahah google calculator
 913 2011-05-08 09:14:10 <Diablo-D3> I abuse the fuck out of that some days
 914 2011-05-08 09:14:16 <phantomcircuit> you're running at significantly reduced costs compared to the rest of us
 915 2011-05-08 09:14:35 <ArtForz> well, I pay for that with higher upfront cost per mhash
 916 2011-05-08 09:16:00 <ArtForz> but assuming GPUs dont magically gain 5x efficiency in the next year, it'll end up cheaper long term
 917 2011-05-08 09:16:08 eao has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 918 2011-05-08 09:18:17 <Diablo-D3> ArtForz: dude
 919 2011-05-08 09:18:18 <Diablo-D3> its AMD
 920 2011-05-08 09:18:26 <Diablo-D3> they're probably like 9001x more efficient
 921 2011-05-08 09:20:25 redMBA has quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
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 925 2011-05-08 09:26:37 <ntosme2> my 600 MH costs me about $1/day
 926 2011-05-08 09:26:55 redMBA has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
 927 2011-05-08 09:28:48 devon_hillard has joined
 928 2011-05-08 09:29:06 <devon_hillard> is the slush pool down?
 929 2011-05-08 09:29:16 <random_> it is broken, yes
 930 2011-05-08 09:30:22 <topi`> alright, i'll start to setup my own pool
 931 2011-05-08 09:31:21 toffoo has joined
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 933 2011-05-08 09:32:49 toffoo has joined
 934 2011-05-08 09:34:38 <gjs278> oh
 935 2011-05-08 09:34:43 <gjs278> thats why deepbit got the ghash
 936 2011-05-08 09:34:44 <gjs278> nevermind
 937 2011-05-08 09:35:47 <mtrlt> ;;bc,eligius
 938 2011-05-08 09:36:10 <gribble> 24080449.9729
 939 2011-05-08 09:36:25 <mtrlt> eligius seems to have picked up some too :)
 940 2011-05-08 09:37:32 <[Tycho]> ;;bc,deepbit
 941 2011-05-08 09:37:35 <gribble> 514801000.0
 942 2011-05-08 09:38:02 <BurtyB> :o
 943 2011-05-08 09:41:45 <devon_hillard> why does the slush pool show a number of invalid blocks in the history?
 944 2011-05-08 09:45:05 <[Tycho]> It's better than hiding them
 945 2011-05-08 09:45:48 <devon_hillard> no, I mean why do invalid blocks happen?
 946 2011-05-08 09:46:08 <BurtyB> someone else won the race
 947 2011-05-08 09:47:22 <[Tycho]> I think that in THIS case they were caused by some internal connectivity problems.
 948 2011-05-08 10:02:10 datathe1st has joined
 949 2011-05-08 10:03:48 mologie has joined
 950 2011-05-08 10:07:01 <diki> i wonder if deepbit can handle all that 512Ghash/s
 951 2011-05-08 10:07:09 <diki> oops, typo, 514
 952 2011-05-08 10:08:24 <Diablo-D3> ALL OVER NI.. wait not yet
 953 2011-05-08 10:11:03 <[Tycho]> diki, why not ? :)
 954 2011-05-08 10:11:50 <[Tycho]> This speed is very good for the pool.
 955 2011-05-08 10:12:18 <sipa> with all due respect, i somehow don't like a monopoolculture :)
 956 2011-05-08 10:12:38 <diki> what is a monopoolculture?
 957 2011-05-08 10:12:47 <sipa> only one big pool :)
 958 2011-05-08 10:12:50 <[Tycho]> Because there will be lower chance to get an invalid block.
 959 2011-05-08 10:12:58 <random_> [Tycho], what kind of utilization are you at?  How much more can you take?
 960 2011-05-08 10:13:12 <sipa> ;;bc,eligius
 961 2011-05-08 10:13:14 <gribble> 23665269.801
 962 2011-05-08 10:13:25 Marcel is now known as HSD!~Marcel|HS@router2.hsdev.com|Marcel
 963 2011-05-08 10:13:40 <[Tycho]> random_, I can't make very good prediction, but I think that I can sustain all the network power.
 964 2011-05-08 10:13:42 <citiz3n> i like deepbit's interface a lot
 965 2011-05-08 10:13:46 <random_> lol
 966 2011-05-08 10:13:55 <citiz3n> i wish the fee were the same as slush's though
 967 2011-05-08 10:13:57 <citiz3n> :D
 968 2011-05-08 10:14:26 <[Tycho]> random_, ...and if it will be not enough, i'll switch one of additional servers to load-balancing :)
 969 2011-05-08 10:14:28 parus has quit (Quit: leaving)
 970 2011-05-08 10:14:48 parus has joined
 971 2011-05-08 10:14:51 <[Tycho]> citiz3n, thanks :) I like my interface too.
 972 2011-05-08 10:14:51 <random_> I bet you're glad that guy challenged you to make your own pool a few months ago!
 973 2011-05-08 10:15:19 Marcel is now known as HS@router2.hsdev.com|Marcel|HSD
 974 2011-05-08 10:15:35 <[Tycho]> citiz3n, actually I think that 1% doesn't really matters when luck jumps like +30% to -30% each hour :)
 975 2011-05-08 10:15:46 <diki> but still, i do hope that i can 1) Make enough monay for the donay(buy a new card) and 2) RMA this one and hope people wont notice i OCed it and tried opening it
 976 2011-05-08 10:15:55 <citiz3n> it's purely psychological
 977 2011-05-08 10:16:08 <sipa> how much fee does deepbit have?
 978 2011-05-08 10:16:14 <citiz3n> 3%
 979 2011-05-08 10:16:54 <citiz3n> well, im gonna run and add some ghash to deepbit
 980 2011-05-08 10:16:59 <[Tycho]> :)
 981 2011-05-08 10:17:00 <citiz3n> adios amigos
 982 2011-05-08 10:17:10 <diki> adios whoever you are
 983 2011-05-08 10:25:45 datathe1st is now known as datathe1st-away
 984 2011-05-08 10:26:27 [DusT] has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
 985 2011-05-08 10:33:44 subpar has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
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 987 2011-05-08 10:53:42 <ahbritto_> [Tycho]: What does a bold total shares mean?
 988 2011-05-08 10:54:04 <[Tycho]> It's a block found by you
 989 2011-05-08 10:54:24 <anarchyx> ;;bs,stats
 990 2011-05-08 10:54:24 <gribble> Error: "bs,stats" is not a valid command.
 991 2011-05-08 10:54:29 <anarchyx> ;;bc,stats
 992 2011-05-08 10:54:34 <gribble> Current Blocks: 122635 | Current Difficulty: 109670.13329248 | Next Difficulty At Block: 122975 | Next Difficulty In: 340 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 day, 15 hours, 34 minutes, and 20 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 153246.27880332
 993 2011-05-08 10:54:59 <RazielZ> Dayum
 994 2011-05-08 10:55:00 <ErryDayImGenerat> that countdown is more exciting than new years for me
 995 2011-05-08 10:55:02 <ahbritto_> Aww. I've only been mining a few days,  :/ Thanks. :)
 996 2011-05-08 10:55:13 <ErryDayImGenerat> i might throw a party
 997 2011-05-08 10:56:34 noagendamarket has joined
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 999 2011-05-08 11:00:18 allied has joined
1000 2011-05-08 11:00:18 allied has quit (Changing host)
1001 2011-05-08 11:00:18 allied has joined
1002 2011-05-08 11:03:43 zyb has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1003 2011-05-08 11:04:55 allied has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
1004 2011-05-08 11:08:34 <diki> Can a manufacterer detect if one has OCed a card even if you RMA it at stock?
1005 2011-05-08 11:08:48 allied has joined
1006 2011-05-08 11:09:11 <BlueMatt> you dont void your warranty if you oc, unless you overvolt (otherwise wtf shitty mfg are you using?)
1007 2011-05-08 11:09:54 <Diablo-D3> diki: yes.
1008 2011-05-08 11:10:02 <BlueMatt> Diablo-D3: since when?
1009 2011-05-08 11:10:10 <Diablo-D3> BlueMatt: undisclosed black box
1010 2011-05-08 11:11:12 <BlueMatt> again, since when?
1011 2011-05-08 11:11:17 * Diablo-D3 shrugs
1012 2011-05-08 11:11:20 <Diablo-D3> for awhile
1013 2011-05-08 11:11:33 <csshih> hmm that's not good. I tried to send someone bitcoins and the little sending box popped up
1014 2011-05-08 11:11:39 <csshih> it's been like this for.. 5minutes?
1015 2011-05-08 11:12:27 <Diablo-D3> csshih: did you forget to press okay?
1016 2011-05-08 11:13:07 <csshih> negative. it's "sending"
1017 2011-05-08 11:13:30 <Diablo-D3> is your client up to sync with blocks?
1018 2011-05-08 11:13:50 <csshih> there was actually a little bar that appeared at the very very top of the screen, barely visible until I dragged it down saying "sending".
1019 2011-05-08 11:13:55 <BlueMatt> killall bitcoin, or if that doesnt work (and you have a recent wallet back) killall -9 bitcoin
1020 2011-05-08 11:13:56 <csshih> 122636?
1021 2011-05-08 11:14:00 <BlueMatt> and open it with -rescan
1022 2011-05-08 11:14:20 <csshih> ah, windows.
1023 2011-05-08 11:14:51 <BlueMatt> well then try to close it normally
1024 2011-05-08 11:15:30 <sipa> which version?
1025 2011-05-08 11:16:03 Intricate has joined
1026 2011-05-08 11:17:26 <csshih> hrm. all good. process ended without trouble.
1027 2011-05-08 11:17:32 <csshih> windows 7 64 bit, also.
1028 2011-05-08 11:17:40 <BlueMatt> bitcoin version?
1029 2011-05-08 11:17:44 <BlueMatt> is what sipa ment
1030 2011-05-08 11:18:53 draaglom has joined
1031 2011-05-08 11:19:21 <csshih> .3.21
1032 2011-05-08 11:19:28 <topi`> sipa: you have so much mhash in your mining cluster, why wouldn't you setup your own mining pool? :)
1033 2011-05-08 11:20:11 <sipa> me?
1034 2011-05-08 11:20:25 <topi`> you :) I know you have a hefty mining setup
1035 2011-05-08 11:20:28 <sipa> eh
1036 2011-05-08 11:20:35 <sipa> i have less than 1.5Ghash/s
1037 2011-05-08 11:20:56 draag has quit (away!~draaglom@78.148.145.110|Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
1038 2011-05-08 11:21:35 <cosurgi> bc,stats
1039 2011-05-08 11:21:38 <cosurgi> ;;bc,stats
1040 2011-05-08 11:21:40 <gribble> Current Blocks: 122639 | Current Difficulty: 109670.13329248 | Next Difficulty At Block: 122975 | Next Difficulty In: 336 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 day, 15 hours, 6 minutes, and 24 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 153247.88076631
1041 2011-05-08 11:21:41 <cosurgi> bc,poolstats
1042 2011-05-08 11:21:44 <cosurgi> ;;bc,poolstats
1043 2011-05-08 11:21:48 <gribble> {"ghashes_ps": "19.310", "shares": 495778, "active_workers": 1922, "round_duration": "13:31:34", "score": "10438734.8026", "round_started": "2011-05-07 21:45:01", "shares_cdf": "98.91", "getwork_ps": 84}
1044 2011-05-08 11:21:50 <cosurgi> arg, sorry.
1045 2011-05-08 11:22:06 <cosurgi> looks like slush is closing business
1046 2011-05-08 11:22:10 Haze- has joined
1047 2011-05-08 11:22:34 <csshih> is that why there was  a huge jump in ghash at deepbit?
1048 2011-05-08 11:22:56 <cosurgi> look at the pie chart: http://bitcoinwatch.com/
1049 2011-05-08 11:23:05 <sipa> cosurgi: i assume so
1050 2011-05-08 11:23:09 <sipa> eh, csshih
1051 2011-05-08 11:23:09 <cosurgi> before Tycho and slush had both about 300GHs.
1052 2011-05-08 11:23:24 <BlueMatt> ;;seen slush
1053 2011-05-08 11:23:24 <gribble> slush was last seen in #bitcoin-dev 4 days, 12 hours, 29 minutes, and 56 seconds ago: <slush> yes
1054 2011-05-08 11:23:33 s0beit has joined
1055 2011-05-08 11:23:33 <cosurgi> now, slush doesn't support phoenix. And phoenix is the fastest miner around, so everyone moves to deepbit
1056 2011-05-08 11:23:40 <topi`> sipa: that's 1000x more hash than I do :)
1057 2011-05-08 11:23:48 <Haze-> anyone in here have experience importing/exporting from china ?
1058 2011-05-08 11:23:50 <sipa> topi`: it's still nothing :)
1059 2011-05-08 11:23:57 <sipa> cosurgi: poclbm is faster for me
1060 2011-05-08 11:24:04 <sipa> i tried lots of different combinations
1061 2011-05-08 11:24:06 <BlueMatt> yea wtf is up with slush's pool?
1062 2011-05-08 11:24:21 <Diablo-D3> woah
1063 2011-05-08 11:24:24 <Diablo-D3> dbitcoin is insane
1064 2011-05-08 11:24:25 <mtrlt> it's totally broken
1065 2011-05-08 11:24:25 <cosurgi> sipa: did you try lowering memclock?
1066 2011-05-08 11:24:30 <sipa> cosurgi: yes
1067 2011-05-08 11:24:31 <Diablo-D3> he UA snoops to enable and disable LP support
1068 2011-05-08 11:24:32 <csshih> Haze-: a little bit
1069 2011-05-08 11:24:33 <BlueMatt> cosurgi: slush supports phoenix just fine, just not long polling
1070 2011-05-08 11:24:36 <Diablo-D3> Im glad no one uses his pool
1071 2011-05-08 11:25:04 <cosurgi> BlueMatt: for me slush's doesn't work with phoenix. I get connection refused on all but single one PC
1072 2011-05-08 11:25:17 <BlueMatt> cosurgi: then you are doing something wrong
1073 2011-05-08 11:25:27 <sipa> you're using a different worker for each?
1074 2011-05-08 11:25:29 <Diablo-D3> isnt slush's pool down anyhow?
1075 2011-05-08 11:25:29 <cosurgi> but now Tycho has almost half of whole power. He can double spend.
1076 2011-05-08 11:25:30 <topi`> what's the relative advantage of long polling? from what I understand, with long polling you get a new block to chew on almost immediately
1077 2011-05-08 11:25:35 <BlueMatt> though right now, slush's pool is down anyway
1078 2011-05-08 11:25:36 <topi`> without waiting that 5 sec interval
1079 2011-05-08 11:25:44 <cosurgi> sipa: the same phoenix on all boxes.
1080 2011-05-08 11:25:51 <BlueMatt> topi`: less stale shares
1081 2011-05-08 11:25:55 <sipa> cosurgi: but the same worker account?
1082 2011-05-08 11:25:56 <cosurgi> sipa: oh, of course a different worker.
1083 2011-05-08 11:25:58 <sipa> ok
1084 2011-05-08 11:26:00 <mtrlt> though slush's statistics say that they have 20Ghash/s :P
1085 2011-05-08 11:26:05 <sipa> that's very strange
1086 2011-05-08 11:26:12 <BlueMatt> cosurgi: the reason you are getting connection refused atm is because slush's pool is down so...
1087 2011-05-08 11:26:34 <BlueMatt> but when it was working phoenix worked fine
1088 2011-05-08 11:26:36 <cosurgi> sipa: can you connect with phoenix to slush pool from two PCs ? Where both PCs have the same external IPp.
1089 2011-05-08 11:26:50 m00p has joined
1090 2011-05-08 11:26:54 <BlueMatt> cosurgi: of course
1091 2011-05-08 11:26:57 <sipa> cosurgi: never tried that, i only have one mining rig
1092 2011-05-08 11:27:07 <topi`> BlueMatt: but if a client rechecks the work every 5 seconds, then the maximum time a client works on a stale share will be 5 seconds, no?
1093 2011-05-08 11:27:20 <sipa> topi`: except that clients cache getworks in advance
1094 2011-05-08 11:27:24 <topi`> I think 5 seconds is nothing when it takes an hour or two for the pool to find the solution
1095 2011-05-08 11:27:25 <cosurgi> ok, I couldn't, several people reported this problem on forums. slush placed a 15 BTC reward for anyone who will fix phoenix.
1096 2011-05-08 11:27:29 <sipa> so it can be more than 5s old data they are working on
1097 2011-05-08 11:27:31 <Diablo-D3> sipa: clients that do that ARE BROKEN
1098 2011-05-08 11:27:34 <BlueMatt> topi`: and you can find a stale block in 5 seconds
1099 2011-05-08 11:27:39 <Diablo-D3> they should be banned from mining
1100 2011-05-08 11:27:41 <topi`> sipa: really? I read the source code for poclbm and found no such cache
1101 2011-05-08 11:27:50 <Diablo-D3> poclbm nor mine do any stupid shit like that
1102 2011-05-08 11:28:09 <sipa> Diablo-D3: at least you did, in some earlier version, no?
1103 2011-05-08 11:28:13 <Diablo-D3> nope
1104 2011-05-08 11:28:14 <Diablo-D3> never.
1105 2011-05-08 11:28:23 <Diablo-D3> its a broken model that can only lead to stale work
1106 2011-05-08 11:28:25 <BlueMatt> topi`: its not when the pool finds a block, but when the network does that you are working on stale shares
1107 2011-05-08 11:28:42 <Diablo-D3> my miner works on multiple getworks in parallel
1108 2011-05-08 11:28:45 <Diablo-D3> it doesnt cache them
1109 2011-05-08 11:28:51 <sipa> well yes
1110 2011-05-08 11:28:54 <BlueMatt> (depending on how the pool works)
1111 2011-05-08 11:29:29 <sipa> Diablo-D3: but the result is that it's possible with an askrate of 5s to be working on >5s old data, at least some versions ago?
1112 2011-05-08 11:29:38 <Diablo-D3> sipa: nope.
1113 2011-05-08 11:29:49 <topi`> Diablo-D3: and how does that work?
1114 2011-05-08 11:29:52 <[Tycho]> Yeah, we should ask miner authors to do some getwork prefetching.
1115 2011-05-08 11:30:00 <Diablo-D3> topi`: how does what work?
1116 2011-05-08 11:30:04 <Diablo-D3> [Tycho]: thats a very bad idea.
1117 2011-05-08 11:30:11 <topi`> Diablo-D3: not working for 5s old data
1118 2011-05-08 11:30:13 <Diablo-D3> [Tycho]: there is no way to detect cached stale work
1119 2011-05-08 11:30:22 <Diablo-D3> topi`: I dont understand
1120 2011-05-08 11:30:31 <tcatm> [Tycho]: = increment nTime in miner?
1121 2011-05-08 11:30:47 <Diablo-D3> [Tycho]: this is why LP was invented
1122 2011-05-08 11:31:00 <Diablo-D3> to only get new work when the work becomes stale
1123 2011-05-08 11:31:07 <Diablo-D3> caching is nonsensical
1124 2011-05-08 11:31:16 <[Tycho]> cosurgi, being a big pool has some other benefits. For example, we can protect network from double spending :)
1125 2011-05-08 11:31:18 <topi`> Diablo-D3: I got plenty of exceptions from your miner when slush's pool started hiccuping, are you interested in these or is it a known bug?
1126 2011-05-08 11:31:32 <Diablo-D3> topi`: are you using my newest one?
1127 2011-05-08 11:31:32 <sipa> [Tycho]: excuse me?
1128 2011-05-08 11:31:38 <topi`> Exception in thread "main" java.lang.NullPointerException at com.diablominer.DiabloMiner.DiabloMiner$DeviceState$ExecutionState$GetWorkParser.doJSONRPC(DiabloMiner.java:855) at com.diablominer.DiabloMiner.DiabloMiner$DeviceState$ExecutionState$GetWorkParser.getWork(DiabloMiner.java:733) at com.diablominer.DiabloMiner.DiabloMiner$DeviceState$ExecutionState$GetWorkParser.<init>(DiabloMiner.java:710)
1129 2011-05-08 11:31:43 <Diablo-D3> topi`: because I think Ive only perfected error detection recently
1130 2011-05-08 11:31:44 <topi`>  t
1131 2011-05-08 11:31:47 <topi`>  com.diablominer.DiabloMiner.DiabloMiner$DeviceState$ExecutionState.<init>(DiabloMiner.java:521)
1132 2011-05-08 11:32:04 <BlueMatt> [Tycho]: I still much prefer many smaller pools
1133 2011-05-08 11:32:04 <topi`> I think all of these exceptions came from doJSONRPC
1134 2011-05-08 11:32:06 <[Tycho]> sipa, if I know that my chain will be longer, I can accept money without confirmations.
1135 2011-05-08 11:32:17 <Diablo-D3> topi`: just make sure you're on my newest one
1136 2011-05-08 11:32:34 <sipa> [Tycho]: that would imply you need to ignore blocks found by others
1137 2011-05-08 11:32:50 <sipa> as you can see a tx, and still slightly later see a block with a conflicting tx
1138 2011-05-08 11:32:56 <[Tycho]> sipa, not always.
1139 2011-05-08 11:33:01 <Diablo-D3> topi`: and your backtrace implies you're not on a new one
1140 2011-05-08 11:33:10 <[Tycho]> sipa, well, that was just an thought.
1141 2011-05-08 11:33:14 <sipa> [Tycho]: if you're the first to find a block afterwards, sure
1142 2011-05-08 11:33:22 <cosurgi> I don;t think that [Tycho] is going to make any conspiracy and such. But also I think that we should move away from [Tycho] just because it is generally speaking safer.
1143 2011-05-08 11:33:36 <sipa> [Tycho]: but please, don't start ignoring other's blocks :)
1144 2011-05-08 11:33:47 <[Tycho]> No, i'm not evil.
1145 2011-05-08 11:33:49 <topi`> Diablo-D3: ok, i need to refresh that. but I was using binaries that someone else compiled from the java source
1146 2011-05-08 11:33:59 <Diablo-D3> topi`: you should be using my binaries.
1147 2011-05-08 11:34:19 <topi`> can't remember what I exactly downloaded.
1148 2011-05-08 11:34:21 <[Tycho]> Also, being big means that i won't have invalid blocks, which is also good.
1149 2011-05-08 11:34:23 <cosurgi> I hope tht slish will be back, and take his half of pool strength, back.
1150 2011-05-08 11:34:29 <cosurgi> *slush
1151 2011-05-08 11:34:36 <topi`> Diablo-D3: if there's a link from bitcoin.it wiki, then I'll find them directly :)
1152 2011-05-08 11:34:40 <sipa> [Tycho]: no none, just less
1153 2011-05-08 11:34:43 <Diablo-D3> topi`: just use the forum thread.
1154 2011-05-08 11:34:47 <sipa> *not
1155 2011-05-08 11:34:51 <topi`> ok.
1156 2011-05-08 11:35:00 <topi`> i prefer wikis over forums though :)
1157 2011-05-08 11:35:23 <[Tycho]> cosurgi, i wonder why he is not awake yet.
1158 2011-05-08 11:35:36 <Diablo-D3> seriously though
1159 2011-05-08 11:35:38 <cosurgi> maybe he went for weekend.
1160 2011-05-08 11:35:52 <Diablo-D3> wtf is wrong with dbitcoin
1161 2011-05-08 11:36:00 <Diablo-D3> he actually UA snoops to enable/disable LP support
1162 2011-05-08 11:36:01 <Diablo-D3> wtf
1163 2011-05-08 11:36:03 <csshih> this will be the first time I'm leaving my mining rig on overnight
1164 2011-05-08 11:36:03 <cosurgi> what is dbitcoin?
1165 2011-05-08 11:36:04 <Diablo-D3> why the fuck have LP at all
1166 2011-05-08 11:36:06 <csshih> wish me luck!
1167 2011-05-08 11:36:09 <Diablo-D3> cosurgi: its a who
1168 2011-05-08 11:36:15 <Diablo-D3> owner of btcmine
1169 2011-05-08 11:36:24 <[Tycho]> His LP support is somewhat strange :)
1170 2011-05-08 11:36:31 <Diablo-D3> his LP support is 100% broken
1171 2011-05-08 11:36:40 <topi`> csshih: why are you afraid of night mining?
1172 2011-05-08 11:36:49 <Diablo-D3> infact, I should add code specifically to error and quit on his pool
1173 2011-05-08 11:36:51 <sipa> ;;bc,eligius
1174 2011-05-08 11:36:52 <gribble> 24939443.4321
1175 2011-05-08 11:36:54 <cosurgi> luke-jr has good LP support. Join him! :)
1176 2011-05-08 11:36:57 <csshih> I built the rig the day before yesterday
1177 2011-05-08 11:36:59 <mtrlt> csshih: night mining pwns because fresh cool air from outside!
1178 2011-05-08 11:37:01 <cosurgi> ;;bc,lukepool
1179 2011-05-08 11:37:02 <gribble> 24939443.4321
1180 2011-05-08 11:37:07 <sipa> cosurgi: indeed, seems to work very well
1181 2011-05-08 11:37:07 <[Tycho]> I don't know if he fixed it now, but some weeks ago he was dropping LP connections with 60 sec. timeout
1182 2011-05-08 11:37:18 <csshih> yesterday, I forgot that windows has a default setting - sleep after 30 minutes of inactivity -_-
1183 2011-05-08 11:37:18 <Diablo-D3> [Tycho]: _dropping_?
1184 2011-05-08 11:37:19 <Diablo-D3> wtf
1185 2011-05-08 11:37:27 <cosurgi> guys, you all need to be strong against [Tycho]'s pool :) join luke-jr !
1186 2011-05-08 11:37:37 <[Tycho]> And asked m0mchil to cut out verbose mode from poclbm to prevent this error from showing.
1187 2011-05-08 11:37:46 <Diablo-D3> fuck him dude
1188 2011-05-08 11:37:49 <mtrlt> csshih: hah, the same happened to me. fortunately i noticed immediately when the fan noise stopped :P
1189 2011-05-08 11:38:01 <Diablo-D3> thats bullshit
1190 2011-05-08 11:38:01 <csshih> hey I went to sleep D:<
1191 2011-05-08 11:38:07 <mtrlt> me too
1192 2011-05-08 11:38:11 <mtrlt> but i'm slow to fall asleep :P
1193 2011-05-08 11:38:16 <csshih> currently home from the dorm, so the comp is in another room
1194 2011-05-08 11:38:17 <Diablo-D3> [Tycho]: and hes running LP on a different port
1195 2011-05-08 11:38:27 <csshih> how much does your setup crank out?
1196 2011-05-08 11:38:33 <Diablo-D3> how the fuck does he think this is supposed to work
1197 2011-05-08 11:38:36 <Diablo-D3> its a URL fragment
1198 2011-05-08 11:38:40 <Diablo-D3> not a fully qualified URL
1199 2011-05-08 11:38:49 <mtrlt> mine? around 1 Ghash
1200 2011-05-08 11:38:49 <[Tycho]> Diablo-D3, may be he was just using some strange software to support LP
1201 2011-05-08 11:39:08 <Diablo-D3> welp, I can just error out on his
1202 2011-05-08 11:39:10 <csshih> 900 here. OC set to more conservative rates until I find out it doesn't crash :D
1203 2011-05-08 11:39:15 <[Tycho]> Initially I tried to use nginx plugin to do the LP stuff, but this was bad idea.
1204 2011-05-08 11:39:18 <csshih> oop
1205 2011-05-08 11:39:19 <mtrlt> hehe
1206 2011-05-08 11:39:20 <Diablo-D3> "detected BTCMine, please use deepbit instead"
1207 2011-05-08 11:39:20 <csshih> 900mhash*
1208 2011-05-08 11:39:32 <csshih> 900ghash would be @_@
1209 2011-05-08 11:39:32 <mtrlt> i've not overclocked my 6990 and i don't plan to :P
1210 2011-05-08 11:39:38 <cosurgi> to use luke-jr pool, you only need to: svn checkout http://svn3.xp-dev.com/svn/phoenix-miner/trunk phoenix
1211 2011-05-08 11:39:42 <mtrlt> but my 5850 is. 725 -> 801 mhz
1212 2011-05-08 11:39:46 <[Tycho]> I hope he fixed that timeout error.
1213 2011-05-08 11:39:46 <csshih> 3x5850s. :P
1214 2011-05-08 11:39:54 <Diablo-D3> cosurgi: you're an idiot, my miner uses LP
1215 2011-05-08 11:40:06 <cosurgi> and: chmod a+x ./phoenix.py ; ./phoenix.py -u http://your-address@pool.bitcoin.dashjr.org:8337/ -k poclbm DEVICE=1 VECTORS AGGRESSION=13 BFI_INT WORKSIZE=64
1216 2011-05-08 11:40:10 <topi`> csshih: how much power is that?
1217 2011-05-08 11:40:26 <cosurgi> Diablo-D3: I'm sorry. phoenix is faster for me. Real sorry. I enjoyed using your miner.
1218 2011-05-08 11:40:31 lumos has joined
1219 2011-05-08 11:40:35 <Diablo-D3> only because of bfi_int
1220 2011-05-08 11:40:37 <Diablo-D3> otherwise its much slower
1221 2011-05-08 11:40:44 <mtrlt> this cheap 10 EUR power meter shows that the 6990 rig is currently taking 460W :o
1222 2011-05-08 11:40:49 <Diablo-D3> and I wish people would quit using AGRESSION
1223 2011-05-08 11:41:00 <Diablo-D3> it makes -f fixed instead of variable
1224 2011-05-08 11:41:03 <topi`> Diablo-D3: what does AGGRESSION control?
1225 2011-05-08 11:41:08 <Diablo-D3> see above.
1226 2011-05-08 11:41:21 <Diablo-D3> just use -f so it can fucking adapt to your desktop
1227 2011-05-08 11:41:24 zyb has joined
1228 2011-05-08 11:41:25 <cosurgi> Diablo-D3: what's wrong with aggresion? it's just like -f, isn't it?
1229 2011-05-08 11:41:28 <topi`> Diablo-D3: how do you control the -f rate dynamically?
1230 2011-05-08 11:41:35 <Diablo-D3> topi`: -f is a length of time
1231 2011-05-08 11:41:41 <topi`> ah, ok
1232 2011-05-08 11:41:41 <csshih> topi` ~900mhash
1233 2011-05-08 11:41:53 <Diablo-D3> the miner increases and decreases kernel run length to match
1234 2011-05-08 11:41:56 <Diablo-D3> AGRESSION makes a fixed size
1235 2011-05-08 11:41:59 <Diablo-D3> and basically fucks you over
1236 2011-05-08 11:42:02 <Diablo-D3> its retarded
1237 2011-05-08 11:42:05 <mtrlt> heh
1238 2011-05-08 11:42:08 <mtrlt> surely seems like it :P
1239 2011-05-08 11:42:13 <csshih> hmmm
1240 2011-05-08 11:42:17 <cosurgi> but it's a dedicated PC. so what's the problem? I want max performance
1241 2011-05-08 11:42:22 <Diablo-D3> if you're going to do dumb shit like that, just use large values with -z on mine
1242 2011-05-08 11:42:26 <topi`> Diablo-D3: I like the way how your miner lends the GPU enough time to handle the desktop user's graphics update needs
1243 2011-05-08 11:42:27 <Diablo-D3> (where large is over 10)
1244 2011-05-08 11:42:37 <Diablo-D3> topi`: thats intentional
1245 2011-05-08 11:42:43 <Diablo-D3> on -f 1000 you can barely tell its there
1246 2011-05-08 11:42:48 <Diablo-D3> (unless you're on nvidia, but fuck that)
1247 2011-05-08 11:42:56 <topi`> :)
1248 2011-05-08 11:42:56 <BlueMatt> Diablo-D3: whether they are being stupid or not, their miner is faster until you add BFI_INT so stop bitching
1249 2011-05-08 11:43:09 <Diablo-D3> BlueMatt: UPS can only deliver so fast, assmunch
1250 2011-05-08 11:43:20 <csshih> wait where are you getting -f and -x from? don't see it in the thread.
1251 2011-05-08 11:43:34 <Diablo-D3> -f is fps, or 1/nths of a second
1252 2011-05-08 11:43:38 <BlueMatt> Diablo-D3: I thought you had amds to test BFI_INT on?
1253 2011-05-08 11:43:42 <Diablo-D3> -z controls the kernl inner loop size
1254 2011-05-08 11:43:44 <Diablo-D3> BlueMatt: 4850.
1255 2011-05-08 11:43:50 <BlueMatt> ah
1256 2011-05-08 11:44:03 <csshih> I think my onboard gfx is a 4850
1257 2011-05-08 11:44:07 <topi`> what's the BFI_INT flag about anyways?
1258 2011-05-08 11:44:09 <Diablo-D3> csshih: no, its not.
1259 2011-05-08 11:44:17 <csshih> oh ok
1260 2011-05-08 11:44:33 <Diablo-D3> topi`: does evil hack to use the BFI_INT hardware instruction which isnt exposed in opencl
1261 2011-05-08 11:46:14 <Diablo-D3> [Tycho]: you seem to have gone wrong somewhere
1262 2011-05-08 11:46:26 <Diablo-D3> http://deepbit.net/help.php
1263 2011-05-08 11:46:45 <Diablo-D3> did you forget to delete the old windows instructions? ;)
1264 2011-05-08 11:48:45 <dbitcoin> Diablo-D3: it's my decision how I handle broken miners (your miner just not tested by me), so more patience please.
1265 2011-05-08 11:48:59 <Diablo-D3> dbitcoin: thats not how the internet works
1266 2011-05-08 11:49:04 <Diablo-D3> theres a specification, follow it
1267 2011-05-08 11:49:59 <dbitcoin> there is no clear specification
1268 2011-05-08 11:50:08 <Diablo-D3> yes there is
1269 2011-05-08 11:50:16 <Diablo-D3> output header with a url fragment in it
1270 2011-05-08 11:50:28 <Diablo-D3> miner either uses it or it doesnt.
1271 2011-05-08 11:51:44 zyb has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1272 2011-05-08 11:52:00 <dbitcoin> we already discuss about this, a month ago.
1273 2011-05-08 11:52:09 <Diablo-D3> then stop doing it wrong
1274 2011-05-08 11:52:14 <Diablo-D3> do not UA snoop to enable LP support
1275 2011-05-08 11:52:17 <dbitcoin> when all  miners support for qualified url, then I switch off UA detection
1276 2011-05-08 11:53:37 Tippenein has joined
1277 2011-05-08 11:53:47 lumos is now known as hymenoptera
1278 2011-05-08 11:54:53 <dbitcoin> jgarzik's cpuminer dos not support this (this fixed only in github version). old poclbm version (before 2011. beta1), also do not support this.
1279 2011-05-08 11:55:20 <ArtForz> aka "everyone has to change their shit to support my weird-ass interpretation of the spec"
1280 2011-05-08 11:55:28 <ArtForz> you don't happen to work for microsoft?
1281 2011-05-08 11:55:32 <Diablo-D3> fine, you know what
1282 2011-05-08 11:56:32 <dbitcoin> Diablo-D3, you probably live in ideal world, but some miners still use outdated software
1283 2011-05-08 11:56:52 <Diablo-D3> your mom uses outdated software.
1284 2011-05-08 11:57:16 <dbitcoin> kids...
1285 2011-05-08 11:57:23 <Diablo-D3> Im older than you!
1286 2011-05-08 11:57:34 <dbitcoin> sure?
1287 2011-05-08 11:58:20 <sipa> dbitcoin: what is the issue precisely?
1288 2011-05-08 11:58:41 <dbitcoin> sipa, no issue for me
1289 2011-05-08 11:58:56 <ArtForz> any other pool sends a url fragment in X-Long-Polling
1290 2011-05-08 11:59:09 <CIA-30> DiabloMiner: Patrick McFarland master * r426e967 / src/main/java/com/diablominer/DiabloMiner/DiabloMiner.java : Add support for BTCMine's broken LP implementation - http://bit.ly/jfEXc6
1291 2011-05-08 11:59:14 <ArtForz> his sends a full URL
1292 2011-05-08 11:59:21 <sipa> i see
1293 2011-05-08 11:59:39 <Diablo-D3> There, your stupidity is now recored for all time.
1294 2011-05-08 11:59:48 <ArtForz> and most miners didnt expect that, just a absolute path
1295 2011-05-08 11:59:59 <dbitcoin> ArtzForz, this discussed before, a month ago
1296 2011-05-08 11:59:59 <BlueMatt> Diablo-D3: dont support that shit, if he wants to break from spec, then just add a if(pool==dbitcoin) exit (1);
1297 2011-05-08 12:00:13 <ArtForz> = everyone has to fix their miners to accomodate his interpretation of the spec
1298 2011-05-08 12:00:30 <Diablo-D3> BlueMatt: nope, now he has no choice but stop being a fag
1299 2011-05-08 12:00:31 <ArtForz> well, the spec *is* not 100% clear
1300 2011-05-08 12:00:36 <dbitcoin> this already supported by all miners
1301 2011-05-08 12:00:40 <Diablo-D3> ArtForz: its quite clear.
1302 2011-05-08 12:00:47 <ArtForz> oh, true
1303 2011-05-08 12:01:03 <Diablo-D3> Header: /fragment
1304 2011-05-08 12:01:15 <ArtForz> it says path, not fully qualified URI
1305 2011-05-08 12:01:29 <Diablo-D3> actually, it doesnt even say path
1306 2011-05-08 12:01:35 <[Tycho]> Well, it's not 100% clear.
1307 2011-05-08 12:01:36 <Diablo-D3> it says exactly /shit/from/root
1308 2011-05-08 12:01:37 <BlueMatt> dbitcoin: I dont care if you are fucking microsoft, you cant create your own spec
1309 2011-05-08 12:01:58 <sipa> is there any agreed and written down specification of long polling then?
1310 2011-05-08 12:02:13 <[Tycho]> My first spec is here: http://j2.deepbit.net/longpolling.php
1311 2011-05-08 12:02:13 <dbitcoin> Because Tycho do not updated his spec.
1312 2011-05-08 12:02:26 <Diablo-D3> can we get dbitcoin kickbanned?
1313 2011-05-08 12:02:31 <ArtForz> so, tycho should change the spec to accomodate your behaviour?
1314 2011-05-08 12:02:35 <ArtForz> you sure you arent microsoft?
1315 2011-05-08 12:03:00 <dbitcoin> this channel logged?
1316 2011-05-08 12:03:06 <ArtForz> yep
1317 2011-05-08 12:03:07 <BlueMatt> yea, see the topic
1318 2011-05-08 12:03:29 <dbitcoin> then, just look at discussion a month ago
1319 2011-05-08 12:03:54 <[Tycho]> My spec don't says if the path should be absolute or relative, because i didn't knew then if someone needed it wrong way. Now if i change it, some software may become a bit incompatible.
1320 2011-05-08 12:03:54 <sipa> dbitcoin: the question is why you need a URL instead of a path there
1321 2011-05-08 12:04:05 <dbitcoin> Tycho, you agreed this this change
1322 2011-05-08 12:04:17 <Diablo-D3> [Tycho]: if its relative, it should just be "foo" not "/foo"
1323 2011-05-08 12:04:21 <ArtForz> sipa: because he has his LP stuff on a different port
1324 2011-05-08 12:04:24 <Diablo-D3> [Tycho]: this is how my software is already handling it
1325 2011-05-08 12:04:49 <[Tycho]> Diablo-D3, do you know what path is used by other pools ?
1326 2011-05-08 12:04:55 <Diablo-D3> [Tycho]: /absolute
1327 2011-05-08 12:05:01 <Diablo-D3> in every case but dickwad's over there
1328 2011-05-08 12:05:10 <Diablo-D3> [Tycho]: oh, and btw, you're the other pools.
1329 2011-05-08 12:05:17 <Diablo-D3> theres no one left
1330 2011-05-08 12:05:19 <[Tycho]> I mean totally other.
1331 2011-05-08 12:05:26 <Diablo-D3> there isnt any other
1332 2011-05-08 12:05:31 <sipa> it doesn't sound unreasonable to me that for some pool it would be easier to run it on a different port, and it also doesn't sound much harder to implement either, i'd say
1333 2011-05-08 12:05:33 <Diablo-D3> and my pool software doesnt do LP yet
1334 2011-05-08 12:05:43 <[Tycho]> Doesn't luke's supports LP ?
1335 2011-05-08 12:05:51 <Diablo-D3> luke's doesnt really exist
1336 2011-05-08 12:05:53 <BlueMatt> dbitcoin: could you point us to the actual previous discussion?
1337 2011-05-08 12:05:55 <BlueMatt> ie link
1338 2011-05-08 12:06:00 <sipa> or time/date
1339 2011-05-08 12:06:22 <[Tycho]> bitcoinpool doesn't exists, but luke's does
1340 2011-05-08 12:06:35 <sipa> anyway, i agree that there may be need for a URL instead of path there, but that still doesn't mean you can unilaterally change the spec
1341 2011-05-08 12:06:37 <Diablo-D3> Im not even sure if luke exists
1342 2011-05-08 12:06:59 <[Tycho]> Also I heard that jgarzik has some pool software but not sure about ut.
1343 2011-05-08 12:07:10 <Diablo-D3> no one can get jgarzik's shit to run right
1344 2011-05-08 12:07:11 <sipa> luke-jr uses jgarzik's pushpoold
1345 2011-05-08 12:07:56 <dbitcoin> sipa, this change already discussed
1346 2011-05-08 12:08:03 <[Tycho]> Well, then we should find out what paths are supported by other miners.
1347 2011-05-08 12:08:25 <Diablo-D3> welp, mine supports all three
1348 2011-05-08 12:08:35 <Diablo-D3> you cant possibly fuck it up now
1349 2011-05-08 12:08:39 <sipa> dbitcoin: in that case i'd like to see the discussion
1350 2011-05-08 12:09:19 <[Tycho]> I remember m0mchil asked me if he needs to support FQ URL
1351 2011-05-08 12:09:31 <Diablo-D3> I mean fuck
1352 2011-05-08 12:09:39 <Diablo-D3> my miner supports https
1353 2011-05-08 12:09:42 <Diablo-D3> HTTPS
1354 2011-05-08 12:09:47 <Diablo-D3> suck my gonads
1355 2011-05-08 12:09:49 <[Tycho]> HTTPS is cool.
1356 2011-05-08 12:09:59 Blitzboom has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
1357 2011-05-08 12:10:06 <[Tycho]> People always ask me to support HTTPS on the site.
1358 2011-05-08 12:10:11 <dbitcoin> sipa: where is url to all history logs? right now only see one page for this month
1359 2011-05-08 12:10:18 <ArtForz> in the mining protocol?
1360 2011-05-08 12:10:31 <[Tycho]> No, for the site itself.
1361 2011-05-08 12:10:36 <ArtForz> well, that does make sense
1362 2011-05-08 12:10:38 <BlueMatt> dbitcoin: you have to manually edit the url, but its there
1363 2011-05-08 12:11:01 <ArtForz> as adding even more latency to the getwork proto doesn't exactly sound like a good idea
1364 2011-05-08 12:11:35 <dbitcoin> support for full url: poclbm, guiminer, phoenix, ufasoft, even jgarzik add this to not released version (see github)
1365 2011-05-08 12:12:04 <dbitcoin> BlueMatt, ok I will try to find this discussion
1366 2011-05-08 12:12:17 <[Tycho]> May be it was jgarzik...
1367 2011-05-08 12:12:18 <ArtForz> and how many supported it before you came up with this... creative... interpretation of the spec?
1368 2011-05-08 12:12:30 Blitzboom has joined
1369 2011-05-08 12:12:30 Blitzboom has quit (Changing host)
1370 2011-05-08 12:12:30 Blitzboom has joined
1371 2011-05-08 12:12:53 <[Tycho]> ArtForz, it happens sometimes.
1372 2011-05-08 12:13:06 <[Tycho]> ArtForz, it's like every pool hits the ufasoft auth problem :)
1373 2011-05-08 12:13:23 <ArtForz> ?
1374 2011-05-08 12:13:24 <dbitcoin> ArtForz, poclbm
1375 2011-05-08 12:13:37 zyb has joined
1376 2011-05-08 12:13:38 <ArtForz> and that was probably by accident
1377 2011-05-08 12:13:59 <[Tycho]> ArtForz, no, i'm sure that m0mchil asked me about this.
1378 2011-05-08 12:14:26 <Diablo-D3> [Tycho]: before you forget it, delete the old windows instructions at help.php
1379 2011-05-08 12:15:21 <[Tycho]> ArtForz, ufasoft uses some special http lib that sends basic auth only AFTER receiving 403 from pool. Every pool author wonders why ufasoft is not working until finds out this :)
1380 2011-05-08 12:15:25 <[Tycho]> Diablo-D3, why ?
1381 2011-05-08 12:15:37 <Diablo-D3> [Tycho]: because they wont work, for one.
1382 2011-05-08 12:15:39 <ArtForz> [Tycho]: that sounds fun
1383 2011-05-08 12:16:06 <ArtForz> so it needs two requests everytime?
1384 2011-05-08 12:16:30 <BitMark> [Tycho]: thats how basic auth works
1385 2011-05-08 12:16:37 <[Tycho]> Not sure about every time.
1386 2011-05-08 12:16:44 <dbitcoin> btw, ufasoft always work in my pool. because I send 403 :)
1387 2011-05-08 12:17:41 <[Tycho]> Diablo-D3, but it may give some hint to OSX users
1388 2011-05-08 12:18:05 <dbitcoin> ufasoft (as I read on forum) already fix auth problem
1389 2011-05-08 12:18:28 <[Tycho]> Last time luke was hit by it, so not sure if it's fixed.
1390 2011-05-08 12:18:29 <BitMark> [Tycho]: though i think the server is supposed to respond with 401 not 403
1391 2011-05-08 12:19:11 <[Tycho]> Ufasoft knows something about programming. He managed to make GPU mining without OpenCL
1392 2011-05-08 12:19:32 <BitMark> [Tycho]: wait so even if the client includes the credentials in the initial request ufasoft still returns 403?
1393 2011-05-08 12:19:33 <dbitcoin> because miners use outdated software
1394 2011-05-08 12:19:52 <[Tycho]> BitMark, yes, that's it.
1395 2011-05-08 12:20:07 <BitMark> oh that is weird
1396 2011-05-08 12:20:15 <[Tycho]> BitMark, not returns, but expects.
1397 2011-05-08 12:20:38 <BitMark> oh this is client side then
1398 2011-05-08 12:20:57 <[Tycho]> BitMark, it doesn't includes the credentials in the first request.
1399 2011-05-08 12:21:09 <BitMark> so you cant force ufasoft to send credentials in first request
1400 2011-05-08 12:21:25 <[Tycho]> Yes.
1401 2011-05-08 12:21:33 <BitMark> even if you give it a url like http://use:pass@pool.com/ ?
1402 2011-05-08 12:21:59 <[Tycho]> Not sure.
1403 2011-05-08 12:22:15 <[Tycho]> It's how his HTTP lib worked.
1404 2011-05-08 12:22:17 <dbitcoin> I hear this is default windows network library problem?
1405 2011-05-08 12:22:56 <[Tycho]> May be.
1406 2011-05-08 12:37:13 Xunie has joined
1407 2011-05-08 12:41:52 <dbitcoin> logs from this channel not indexed by google? this impossible find out something old with current history pages...
1408 2011-05-08 12:42:25 <BlueMatt> cntrl-f is about the only way Im afraid
1409 2011-05-08 12:43:06 <random_> why is the target field so big?
1410 2011-05-08 12:43:40 <random_> smaller numbers = harder target, right?
1411 2011-05-08 12:43:43 <sipa> \o/ block in eligius
1412 2011-05-08 12:44:25 <dbitcoin> BlueMatt, I do not store old logs from this channel
1413 2011-05-08 12:44:38 <diki> i thought a sha256 block was with a header
1414 2011-05-08 12:44:39 <BlueMatt> dbitcoin: I meant cntl-f on the website
1415 2011-05-08 12:44:44 <diki> why are the blocks with zeroes?
1416 2011-05-08 12:45:00 <random_> almost everything in the target field is already 0 so why do we need 32 bits?
1417 2011-05-08 12:45:15 <random_> oh, I get it
1418 2011-05-08 12:45:16 <random_> doh
1419 2011-05-08 12:45:45 tabsa has joined
1420 2011-05-08 12:45:54 <BlueMatt> diki: if you mean the block header hashes, its because thats what mining is, getting the hash of the header to start with x 0-bits
1421 2011-05-08 12:46:20 justmoon has joined
1422 2011-05-08 12:46:26 <dbitcoin> BlueMatt, this about 60 pages... with manual navigation, no way.... I better setup some script :)
1423 2011-05-08 12:46:43 <BlueMatt> dbitcoin: hence why we asked for a specific date ;)
1424 2011-05-08 12:46:53 <BlueMatt> (instead of searching ourselves)
1425 2011-05-08 12:54:06 mologie has quit (Quit: Nettalk6 - www.ntalk.de)
1426 2011-05-08 12:55:22 <x5x> kinda weird the bitcoincharts 27007 trade data stream doesn't show whether its a buy or a sell
1427 2011-05-08 12:55:30 <random_> so will the last 104 bytes of a getwork request ever be anything other than 00000000000000800000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000080020000?
1428 2011-05-08 12:55:54 <sipa> not as long as pool use difficulty-1 shares
1429 2011-05-08 12:55:58 <sipa> but that may change somedat
1430 2011-05-08 12:56:01 <sipa> someday
1431 2011-05-08 12:56:19 WakiMiko_ has joined
1432 2011-05-08 12:56:38 <topi`> what's the value of TARGET for difficulty 1?
1433 2011-05-08 12:56:41 <BlueMatt> x5x: trade == a buy matched a sell, hence its both
1434 2011-05-08 12:57:50 <x5x> good pt
1435 2011-05-08 12:58:03 n0n0 has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
1436 2011-05-08 12:58:46 WakiMiko has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
1437 2011-05-08 13:02:58 <cosurgi> ;;bc,lukepool
1438 2011-05-08 13:02:59 <gribble> 24338148.0107
1439 2011-05-08 13:03:30 <sipa> topi`: 00000000ffff00000000000000000...
1440 2011-05-08 13:04:04 <random_> so then what is ffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff00000000 ?
1441 2011-05-08 13:04:11 <random_> why do the pools send that?
1442 2011-05-08 13:04:20 mmoya has joined
1443 2011-05-08 13:06:01 <sipa> ah, it's encoded the other way around it seems
1444 2011-05-08 13:06:27 <sipa> and that is actuallt difficulty 0.9999847412109375
1445 2011-05-08 13:06:38 <topi`> sipa: so it's like 4 billion tries before it find such a hash
1446 2011-05-08 13:06:45 <sipa> exactly,
1447 2011-05-08 13:06:49 <sipa> on average
1448 2011-05-08 13:06:59 Blitzboom_ has joined
1449 2011-05-08 13:07:57 <random_> man, I'm so confused....
1450 2011-05-08 13:08:14 cosurgiFB has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1451 2011-05-08 13:09:10 Blitzboom has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
1452 2011-05-08 13:09:12 <topi`> random_: read the wikipedia article about "proof-of-work"
1453 2011-05-08 13:09:50 <random_> thanks, reading now
1454 2011-05-08 13:11:24 <topi`> random_: so, if you know that your graphics card does 2.1 Mhash/sec, then you can calculate that at difficulty 1 (2^32) it takes on average 4200 million hashes, i.e. 1952 seconds (half an hour) to find a suitable hash
1455 2011-05-08 13:11:37 <topi`> (2.1 Mhash is what my GeForce 9400M does :)
1456 2011-05-08 13:12:05 <random_> right, so I understand the proof of work article
1457 2011-05-08 13:12:15 <random_> I'm confused about the details of the implementation
1458 2011-05-08 13:12:35 <sipa> bitcoin mining = varying the nonce in a block, until its hash becomes low enough
1459 2011-05-08 13:12:46 <topi`> random_: you hash the 80 bytes of the header millions of times, and at some point you find a hash that is < TAGET
1460 2011-05-08 13:12:49 <topi`> TARGET
1461 2011-05-08 13:12:54 <random_> I guess I don't understand the belowOrEquals function of pcolbm
1462 2011-05-08 13:13:08 lulzplzkthx has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
1463 2011-05-08 13:13:14 lulzplzkthx has joined
1464 2011-05-08 13:13:17 <sipa> it's just a < test on numbers that are encoded as an array of 8 uint32's
1465 2011-05-08 13:13:23 <topi`> when the difficulty gets higher, the value of TARGET will get smaller. see?
1466 2011-05-08 13:13:24 <sipa> a <= test, actually
1467 2011-05-08 13:13:37 <random_> right, I get that
1468 2011-05-08 13:14:13 <random_> but if I read it right, if target = { 2, 2, 2, 2 } and my hash is { 1, 2, 2, 3 } then my hash is too big
1469 2011-05-08 13:14:31 <random_> and beloworequals returns false
1470 2011-05-08 13:14:39 <sipa> yes
1471 2011-05-08 13:14:57 <random_> but 1223 is less than 2222
1472 2011-05-08 13:15:05 <sipa> swap the bytes around
1473 2011-05-08 13:15:12 <sipa> the use of endianness is a mess
1474 2011-05-08 13:15:32 <sipa> sometimes numbers are outputted in big-endian form, sometimes in little-endian
1475 2011-05-08 13:15:39 <ArtForz> no they arent
1476 2011-05-08 13:15:49 <sipa> in getwork they're little endian it seems
1477 2011-05-08 13:16:02 <ArtForz> LE byte and word order everywhere
1478 2011-05-08 13:16:03 <sipa> in the hex output of the application itself it's big endian
1479 2011-05-08 13:16:12 <sipa> yes internally it's LE everywhere
1480 2011-05-08 13:16:15 mmoya has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1481 2011-05-08 13:16:17 <ArtForz> the only weird part is that sha256 internally parses the data words as BE
1482 2011-05-08 13:16:27 <ArtForz> other way around
1483 2011-05-08 13:17:14 <ArtForz> data is already flipped so we don't ahve to flip it again
1484 2011-05-08 13:18:14 <ArtForz> first 4 bytes of data in memory: 01 00 00 00, first 8 chars in "data": "00000001"
1485 2011-05-08 13:19:05 Cusipzzz has joined
1486 2011-05-08 13:19:10 <topi`> the BE order is the natural order of bits, but some implementations benefit from using LE ordering
1487 2011-05-08 13:19:44 <ArtForz> be is a natural order where?
1488 2011-05-08 13:19:56 <topi`> it's natural order for all human languages that are written from left to right :)
1489 2011-05-08 13:20:11 <random_> ok, but if I'm reading belowOrEquals right, if target = { 2, 2, 2, 2 } and my hash is { 1, 3, 2, 2 } then belowOrEquals still returns false
1490 2011-05-08 13:20:12 <ArtForz> yet the least significant bit is in position 0
1491 2011-05-08 13:20:15 <BlueMatt> computers != humans
1492 2011-05-08 13:20:35 <ArtForz> which makes sense, as it's value is 2**0
1493 2011-05-08 13:21:14 <topi`> BlueMatt: but you'll encounter the same byte shuffling problems in languages like python
1494 2011-05-08 13:21:39 <topi`> i'm talking specifically about the belowOrEquals function here :)
1495 2011-05-08 13:21:56 <ArtForz> it's rather simple
1496 2011-05-08 13:21:56 <BlueMatt> ah
1497 2011-05-08 13:22:22 <ArtForz> take the standard output from sha256(), intepret as a LE number of LE words
1498 2011-05-08 13:23:13 skyewm has joined
1499 2011-05-08 13:23:23 <ArtForz> and yes, that means you have to do a byteflip after the last sha256 round, because sha256 is internally BE
1500 2011-05-08 13:23:32 <ArtForz> well, after the final add
1501 2011-05-08 13:23:43 zyb has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1502 2011-05-08 13:27:38 <BlueMatt> does anyone happen to know off hand how bitcoin handles db transactions? or do I have to actually look it up?
1503 2011-05-08 13:28:01 <ArtForz> ?
1504 2011-05-08 13:28:18 <BlueMatt> when does it make a database transaction and when does it commit it?
1505 2011-05-08 13:29:05 <sipa> all the time, i think
1506 2011-05-08 13:29:06 <ArtForz> depends
1507 2011-05-08 13:29:17 <ArtForz> for most stuff it relies on autocommit
1508 2011-05-08 13:29:18 molecular has quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
1509 2011-05-08 13:29:27 <BlueMatt> ah, ok, damn
1510 2011-05-08 13:29:42 <ArtForz> iirc only thing that explicity does a atomic transaction is updating things in wallet
1511 2011-05-08 13:30:05 <diki> i put my cpu with it's powerful 9 mhash/s on solo
1512 2011-05-08 13:30:15 <diki> if i have extreme luck i may find a block faster than 2 years
1513 2011-05-08 13:30:21 <ArtForz> 9 millihashes per second?
1514 2011-05-08 13:30:23 molecular has joined
1515 2011-05-08 13:30:29 <sipa> that's pointless
1516 2011-05-08 13:30:37 <diki> 9 mhash/s it says
1517 2011-05-08 13:30:45 <sipa> it should be 9 Mhash/s ;)
1518 2011-05-08 13:30:47 <BlueMatt> diki: he was joking
1519 2011-05-08 13:30:52 <sipa> but still, both are pointless
1520 2011-05-08 13:30:53 <diki> oh
1521 2011-05-08 13:30:59 echelon_ is now known as echelon
1522 2011-05-08 13:31:08 <diki> like i said, if i have luck
1523 2011-05-08 13:31:10 <diki> i may find a block\
1524 2011-05-08 13:32:56 <diki> zomg i found a block....
1525 2011-05-08 13:33:06 <sipa> yeah right :)
1526 2011-05-08 13:33:07 <diki> just kidding :D
1527 2011-05-08 13:34:07 <diki> it's all a matter of luck
1528 2011-05-08 13:34:15 <diki> i can find it now, never or in a month
1529 2011-05-08 13:34:18 <diki> or tomorrow even
1530 2011-05-08 13:34:35 <diki> or maybe if i reboot my computer and i get the winning header right away
1531 2011-05-08 13:34:44 <pesco> did you know that the chance of walking through a wall unharmed is non-zero?
1532 2011-05-08 13:34:52 <ArtForz> yup
1533 2011-05-08 13:35:04 <diki> i can ride a comet and still come back
1534 2011-05-08 13:35:06 <ArtForz> QM is weird that way ;)
1535 2011-05-08 13:35:28 <diki> Well, still i do have a higher chance of finding a block than getting a roundhouse kick from Chuck Norris
1536 2011-05-08 13:35:44 <BlueMatt> ok, I think crypter is finally ready for a pull now that pw change and old version upgrade is done :)
1537 2011-05-08 13:35:48 <BlueMatt> https://github.com/TheBlueMatt/bitcoin/commit/0f2fec7d2fc7b6e1dac187735402a721b63ca7cf
1538 2011-05-08 13:36:01 <diki> new version of bitcoin?
1539 2011-05-08 13:36:15 <BlueMatt> no, wallet private key encryption
1540 2011-05-08 13:36:32 <BlueMatt> ie upgrade old wallets to encrypt the existing privkeys
1541 2011-05-08 13:36:39 <diki> what does it mean?
1542 2011-05-08 13:36:45 <diki> what will happen to a wallet?
1543 2011-05-08 13:37:03 <BlueMatt> it means if someone takes wallet.dat, they still need a password to spend coins
1544 2011-05-08 13:37:15 <diki> and if the user forgets the password?
1545 2011-05-08 13:37:24 <ArtForz> then they're fucked
1546 2011-05-08 13:37:26 <BlueMatt> *poof* all your coins are gond
1547 2011-05-08 13:37:27 <topi`> BlueMatt: can that be made optional?
1548 2011-05-08 13:37:27 <csshih> :)
1549 2011-05-08 13:37:28 <BlueMatt> gone*
1550 2011-05-08 13:37:30 Props has left ("Leaving")
1551 2011-05-08 13:37:31 <BlueMatt> topi`: -nocrypt
1552 2011-05-08 13:37:35 <topi`> yeah
1553 2011-05-08 13:37:39 <diki> i myself forget the password right after i register to a website/forum etc
1554 2011-05-08 13:37:40 <BlueMatt> its in there
1555 2011-05-08 13:37:52 <diki> sometimes tho
1556 2011-05-08 13:38:03 * sipa wonders if EncryptUnencKeys and ChangeWalletPass can be merged into a single function
1557 2011-05-08 13:38:04 <diki> and when will this new version of bitcoin be ready?
1558 2011-05-08 13:38:16 <sipa> diki: there are continuously changes being made
1559 2011-05-08 13:38:32 mologie has joined
1560 2011-05-08 13:38:38 <diki> right, but when will this specific version with the wallet encryption be ready?
1561 2011-05-08 13:38:40 <ArtForz> probably too late for 0.3.22
1562 2011-05-08 13:38:41 <BlueMatt> diki: the next version should have this + autotools
1563 2011-05-08 13:38:48 <BlueMatt> ArtForz: there is no 0.3.22
1564 2011-05-08 13:38:49 <sipa> diki: when it is
1565 2011-05-08 13:38:49 <BlueMatt> ?
1566 2011-05-08 13:38:57 <sipa> there is no time frame
1567 2011-05-08 13:39:00 <ArtForz> BlueMatt: there is no spoon!
1568 2011-05-08 13:39:10 <sipa> next version may be 0.4.0
1569 2011-05-08 13:39:28 <BlueMatt> if you look at gavin's commit for 0.3.22 version change he says "I hope next version will be 0.4.0 instead"
1570 2011-05-08 13:39:29 <ArtForz> so whats the incompatible protocol change?
1571 2011-05-08 13:39:34 <BlueMatt> only in the wallet
1572 2011-05-08 13:39:46 <BlueMatt> but it stores as ekey so old wallets just cant spend
1573 2011-05-08 13:39:52 <BlueMatt> but they can still open and read properly
1574 2011-05-08 13:40:34 <diki> lol on guiminer i went solo for a bit with the gpu and a message is displayed saying difficulty 1
1575 2011-05-08 13:40:40 <diki> difficulty 1 hashes
1576 2011-05-08 13:41:07 Myckel has quit (Quit: Ik ga weg)
1577 2011-05-08 13:41:13 <diki> what does it mean?
1578 2011-05-08 13:41:36 <ArtForz> what it says on the box
1579 2011-05-08 13:41:59 <sipa> you have to think outside of the box, ArtForz!
1580 2011-05-08 13:41:59 <diki> the difficulty is not 1
1581 2011-05-08 13:41:59 <ArtForz> it's the number of difficulty 1 solutions found
1582 2011-05-08 13:42:08 <diki> it's way higher..
1583 2011-05-08 13:42:09 <sipa> diki: read up on how pools work
1584 2011-05-08 13:42:19 <ArtForz> sipa: there is no box.
1585 2011-05-08 13:42:51 <BlueMatt> just watch the matrix? why the sudden fascination?
1586 2011-05-08 13:43:02 <ArtForz> nah
1587 2011-05-08 13:43:12 <ArtForz> overdoing memes is fun
1588 2011-05-08 13:43:13 <sipa> diki: pools use the number of difficulty-1 blocks submitted (which aren't valid on the network) to know how to distribute the rewards
1589 2011-05-08 13:43:36 <ArtForz> it's also a good way to see how (un)lucky you are
1590 2011-05-08 13:43:48 <BlueMatt> how so?
1591 2011-05-08 13:43:49 <diki> it's also a good way to see how (un)lucky you are <- huh?
1592 2011-05-08 13:44:05 <ArtForz> on average you'd expect a block every [difficulty] difficulty1 results
1593 2011-05-08 13:44:50 <sipa> with a standard deviation of also [difficulty], by the way
1594 2011-05-08 13:44:54 <ArtForz> yep
1595 2011-05-08 13:44:56 Myckel has joined
1596 2011-05-08 13:44:57 Myckel has quit (Changing host)
1597 2011-05-08 13:44:57 Myckel has joined
1598 2011-05-08 13:46:05 <diki> in layman's terms please
1599 2011-05-08 13:46:23 <ArtForz> more = better
1600 2011-05-08 13:47:09 wolfspraul has quit (Quit: leaving)
1601 2011-05-08 13:47:20 <diki> so difficulty 1 hashes means...?
1602 2011-05-08 13:47:42 wolfspraul has joined
1603 2011-05-08 13:47:46 <ArtForz> haches that are <= 0xffff * 2**208
1604 2011-05-08 13:48:25 <diki> so the difficulty from my miner must rise to the current one?
1605 2011-05-08 13:49:42 <ArtForz> ?
1606 2011-05-08 13:50:00 <sipa> ;;bc,hextarget
1607 2011-05-08 13:50:01 <gribble> 00000000000098FA000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
1608 2011-05-08 13:50:14 <diki> zomg so it means i was close to finding a block?
1609 2011-05-08 13:50:20 <diki> darn
1610 2011-05-08 13:50:22 <sipa> no
1611 2011-05-08 13:50:24 <random_> why is that so big?
1612 2011-05-08 13:50:30 <random_> 1b0098fa
1613 2011-05-08 13:50:39 <diki> "Difficulty 1 hashes" are hashes that nearly solved the block, but weren't quite good enough
1614 2011-05-08 13:50:41 <sipa> normally your miner would only report block attempts whose hash is less than 0x00000000000098FA000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
1615 2011-05-08 13:50:52 <diki> that's what i read
1616 2011-05-08 13:50:54 <ArtForz> less or equal
1617 2011-05-08 13:50:58 <luke-jr> EMERGENCY
1618 2011-05-08 13:51:07 <random_> or am I off by a couple bytes there?
1619 2011-05-08 13:51:10 <dbitcoin> ArtForz, someone tested big sized wallet.dat? something like >100Mb? there is any problem for performance?
1620 2011-05-08 13:51:11 <diki> what happened luke
1621 2011-05-08 13:51:13 <luke-jr> everyone on Deepbit plz move to another pool
1622 2011-05-08 13:51:14 <random_> is it 0098fa00?
1623 2011-05-08 13:51:20 <luke-jr> diki: DeepBit has over 50% of the network
1624 2011-05-08 13:51:26 <random_> lol...
1625 2011-05-08 13:51:37 <luke-jr> Bitcoin IS compromised
1626 2011-05-08 13:51:45 AnonX has joined
1627 2011-05-08 13:51:56 <BlueMatt> WHERE IS SLUSH????
1628 2011-05-08 13:52:01 <Cusipzzz> if he tries something stupid, he will only hurt himself.
1629 2011-05-08 13:52:03 <dbitcoin> luke-jr, we all die
1630 2011-05-08 13:52:32 <sipa> he has no reason to abuse his position
1631 2011-05-08 13:52:39 <sipa> but i really don't like ths
1632 2011-05-08 13:52:41 <random_> deepbit has been there for hours now
1633 2011-05-08 13:53:02 <random_> crankin' out the blocks like crazy too
1634 2011-05-08 13:53:12 <luke-jr> sipa: if it wasn't a problem, Satoshi wouldn't have made it one in the paper?
1635 2011-05-08 13:53:18 <diki> users will go there, where they earn more
1636 2011-05-08 13:53:32 <luke-jr> diki: less*
1637 2011-05-08 13:53:37 <sipa> luke-jr: of course there is a problem
1638 2011-05-08 13:53:38 <Cusipzzz> it's a problem if the owner hates money and just wants to fuck with things.
1639 2011-05-08 13:53:43 <diki> why less?
1640 2011-05-08 13:53:49 <jgarzik> diki: higher fees
1641 2011-05-08 13:53:54 <luke-jr> diki: Deepbit has the biggest fees
1642 2011-05-08 13:54:01 <diki> If someone said that i will make 5 btc an hour on their pool(example) id go there
1643 2011-05-08 13:54:10 <BlueMatt> deepbit has what, 3%?
1644 2011-05-08 13:54:11 <luke-jr> diki: no pool has guarantees
1645 2011-05-08 13:54:19 <luke-jr> diki: Eligius has basically no fees
1646 2011-05-08 13:54:20 <random_> well...
1647 2011-05-08 13:54:52 <diki> well i havent noticed any fees
1648 2011-05-08 13:55:09 <BlueMatt> luke-jr: btw, how do you handle payouts when noone has earned 1 btc to be paid out/there arent 50btc to be paid out?
1649 2011-05-08 13:55:15 <BlueMatt> do you hold them like other pools?
1650 2011-05-08 13:55:17 <diki> i earn exactly that much as i calculated with pay per shares
1651 2011-05-08 13:55:20 <luke-jr> diki: ;;bc,gen <hashrate>
1652 2011-05-08 13:55:32 <jgarzik> diki: PPS cost includes 10% fee
1653 2011-05-08 13:55:33 <mtrlt> diki: if you didn't use pay-per-share, you'd get more
1654 2011-05-08 13:55:39 <diki> no i wont
1655 2011-05-08 13:55:41 <diki> i tried it
1656 2011-05-08 13:55:44 <luke-jr> BlueMatt: the pool pockets the change
1657 2011-05-08 13:55:46 <diki> i get 0,05 with proportional
1658 2011-05-08 13:55:48 <mtrlt> tried it for 5 minutes?
1659 2011-05-08 13:55:58 <BlueMatt> luke-jr: and pays out sometimes from regular txes then?
1660 2011-05-08 13:56:07 <luke-jr> BlueMatt: when/if it becomes a problem (it shouldn't, short of bugs), I can manually send from it
1661 2011-05-08 13:56:09 <mtrlt> i've done the math. pay-per-share is a scam, imo
1662 2011-05-08 13:56:30 <BlueMatt> luke-jr: and when the pool should pay out > 50 in a block, it just waits till the next one then?
1663 2011-05-08 13:56:30 <ArtForz> mtrlt: why would it be?
1664 2011-05-08 13:56:31 <diki> dunno i earned 3 bitcoins and a half for 24 hours
1665 2011-05-08 13:56:35 <diki> with PPS
1666 2011-05-08 13:56:37 <luke-jr> diki: how much per day? what hashrate?
1667 2011-05-08 13:56:42 <diki> 270000
1668 2011-05-08 13:56:43 <luke-jr> BlueMatt: yes
1669 2011-05-08 13:56:47 <luke-jr> ;;bc,gen 270000
1670 2011-05-08 13:56:48 <gribble> The expected generation output, at 270000 Khps, given current difficulty of 109670.13329248 , is 2.47627731093 BTC per day and 0.103178221289 BTC per hour.
1671 2011-05-08 13:56:54 <mtrlt> ArtForz: in the sense that you get a lot less money with PPS than with the proper model
1672 2011-05-08 13:56:58 <BlueMatt> diki: what you earned in 24 hours is very different than longterm real output
1673 2011-05-08 13:57:09 <ArtForz> mtrlt: yes, but it's upfront about that, so I don't see the scam
1674 2011-05-08 13:57:09 <jgarzik> mtrlt: sure.  You're paying for that immediacy.
1675 2011-05-08 13:57:13 <mtrlt> ArtForz: in exchange of... nothing
1676 2011-05-08 13:57:24 <jgarzik> mtrlt: you're compensating deepbit for the risk
1677 2011-05-08 13:57:36 <sipa> PPS is a compromise between more income or less variability
1678 2011-05-08 13:57:36 <ArtForz> mtrlt: in exchange of way lower variance
1679 2011-05-08 13:57:55 <mtrlt> hmm
1680 2011-05-08 13:58:15 <mtrlt> the proportional model has low variance already.
1681 2011-05-08 13:58:18 <diki> so you suggest i go proportional?
1682 2011-05-08 13:58:21 <mtrlt> since deepbit is a huge pool
1683 2011-05-08 13:58:24 <luke-jr> diki: go Eligius
1684 2011-05-08 13:58:30 <ArtForz> mtrlt: so people should be allowed to be stupid?
1685 2011-05-08 13:58:34 <BlueMatt> diki: if you want 7% more, yes
1686 2011-05-08 13:58:43 <luke-jr> diki: 10% more w/ Eligius
1687 2011-05-08 13:58:43 <mtrlt> ArtForz: yes of course they should :P
1688 2011-05-08 13:58:44 <ArtForz> *shouldn't
1689 2011-05-08 13:58:44 <topi`> luke-jr: what's the hash rate of Eligius right now?
1690 2011-05-08 13:58:45 <diki> i was there and while i did start making btc faster it slowed down..
1691 2011-05-08 13:58:49 <luke-jr> ;;bc,eligius
1692 2011-05-08 13:58:49 <gribble> 27058293.9648
1693 2011-05-08 13:59:01 <diki> 27 or 27?
1694 2011-05-08 13:59:04 random_ has quit (Quit: Page closed)
1695 2011-05-08 13:59:06 <topi`> luke-jr: and concerning the hash rate of deepbit, isn't the possibility of a hostile takeover rather a theoretical one?
1696 2011-05-08 13:59:06 <diki> *270
1697 2011-05-08 13:59:09 <luke-jr> 27
1698 2011-05-08 13:59:19 <luke-jr> topi`: …
1699 2011-05-08 13:59:20 <ArtForz> the stunt compute4cash pulled was way more of a scam
1700 2011-05-08 13:59:31 <sipa> that was a real scam
1701 2011-05-08 13:59:37 <ArtForz> actually it wasn't
1702 2011-05-08 13:59:37 <mtrlt> hmm what did they do??
1703 2011-05-08 13:59:38 <diki> anything that has cash in its name is scam
1704 2011-05-08 13:59:43 <ArtForz> afaik they did pay their users
1705 2011-05-08 13:59:44 <mtrlt> -?
1706 2011-05-08 13:59:51 <dbitcoin> the real scam is videohal
1707 2011-05-08 13:59:57 <BlueMatt> mtrlt: they didnt mention bitcoin paid out in usd and took ~50%
1708 2011-05-08 14:00:03 <ArtForz> yep
1709 2011-05-08 14:00:04 <mtrlt> lol
1710 2011-05-08 14:00:13 <topi`> luke-jr: I'm thinking of a scheme to "assure" that the network will redirect itself away from power concentrations of >50% hash power
1711 2011-05-08 14:00:17 <BlueMatt> and just said "you are doing hashing for financial institution)
1712 2011-05-08 14:00:18 <ArtForz> and spammed a lot of OCing/gaming forums
1713 2011-05-08 14:00:31 <sipa> topi`: that is very hard
1714 2011-05-08 14:00:32 <mtrlt> how much profit did they make? :P
1715 2011-05-08 14:00:40 <ArtForz> not too much
1716 2011-05-08 14:00:40 <BlueMatt> noone really knows
1717 2011-05-08 14:00:50 <diki> they could be cloaked here...watching
1718 2011-05-08 14:00:51 <ArtForz> iirc someone figured out which blocks they found
1719 2011-05-08 14:00:57 <topi`> luke-jr: since we all have a stake on the btc economy (with our btc wallets), it would make sense for us to make a donation to a pool X which would re-distribute that money to make bigger incentives for its miners
1720 2011-05-08 14:01:09 <topi`> luke-jr: that way the system would self-correct away from pools that reach >50% of total
1721 2011-05-08 14:01:24 <ArtForz> whole thing just sounded too shady to have a lot of people hop on
1722 2011-05-08 14:01:37 <diki> ;;bc,calc 273000
1723 2011-05-08 14:01:38 <gribble> The average time to generate a block at 273000 Khps, given current difficulty of 109670.13329248 , is 2 weeks, 5 days, 23 hours, 16 minutes, and 23 seconds
1724 2011-05-08 14:01:53 <mtrlt> heh
1725 2011-05-08 14:02:31 <ArtForz> = most people thought they were doing something nefarious with all that computing power
1726 2011-05-08 14:02:38 <topi`> the more bitcoins one individual has, the more he is to lose from the risk of a hostile takeover, right?
1727 2011-05-08 14:02:59 <topi`> one buys insurances to mitigate risks, right?
1728 2011-05-08 14:03:06 <diki> ;;bc,deepbit
1729 2011-05-08 14:03:06 <ArtForz> not really
1730 2011-05-08 14:03:08 <gribble> 523513000.0
1731 2011-05-08 14:03:11 <topi`> so why not make an insurance against the hostile takeover?
1732 2011-05-08 14:03:25 <diki> i dont thinhk anyone is taking over anyone
1733 2011-05-08 14:03:25 <ErryDayImGenerat> the hell ar eyou taking over?
1734 2011-05-08 14:03:38 <diki> slush is out so they migrated
1735 2011-05-08 14:03:38 <ErryDayImGenerat> if no one has money to spend
1736 2011-05-08 14:03:43 <ErryDayImGenerat> it's going to be worth less
1737 2011-05-08 14:03:56 <BitMark> slush is out?
1738 2011-05-08 14:04:02 <sipa> slush just found a block
1739 2011-05-08 14:04:10 <sipa> after 16 hours
1740 2011-05-08 14:04:26 <diki> 13 ghash
1741 2011-05-08 14:04:30 <diki> what would you expect
1742 2011-05-08 14:04:40 <topi`> diki: I'm not talking about an *actual* takeover, just a *potential* one
1743 2011-05-08 14:04:43 <sipa> ;;bc,calc 13000000
1744 2011-05-08 14:04:44 <gribble> The average time to generate a block at 13000000 Khps, given current difficulty of 109670.13329248 , is 10 hours, 3 minutes, and 53 seconds
1745 2011-05-08 14:04:47 <topi`> it's like keeping your bike out on the street, unlocked.
1746 2011-05-08 14:05:05 <topi`> and I want to insure my bike against that possibility of theft
1747 2011-05-08 14:05:14 <diki> my bike was stolen...
1748 2011-05-08 14:05:28 <diki> by my father :D
1749 2011-05-08 14:05:34 <sipa> sue him
1750 2011-05-08 14:06:00 xenon481 has joined
1751 2011-05-08 14:06:17 <diki> damn, deepbit went 536
1752 2011-05-08 14:06:27 <BlueMatt> [Tycho]: does deepbit payout the additional decimal places? if not when might we expect that?
1753 2011-05-08 14:06:42 <BlueMatt> ie 1.59784 instead of 1.59
1754 2011-05-08 14:06:55 <diki> what would they do?
1755 2011-05-08 14:07:09 <luke-jr> topi`: except that in this case, the bike is worth millions (billions?) of USD
1756 2011-05-08 14:09:00 Sami345 has joined
1757 2011-05-08 14:09:01 <diki> 541 now
1758 2011-05-08 14:09:32 <Sami345> http://www.bitcoinpool.com/ <-- Has anyone used this?
1759 2011-05-08 14:09:45 <luke-jr> Sami345: join Eligius!
1760 2011-05-08 14:09:50 <topi`> luke-jr: indeed. but do you think that it would be important to have some kind of "extra bounty" to even out the uneven hash power distributino?
1761 2011-05-08 14:10:13 larsivi has joined
1762 2011-05-08 14:10:29 <topi`> what's the keyword for gribble for total network rate?
1763 2011-05-08 14:10:41 <topi`> and can I do arithmetic against deepbit? :)
1764 2011-05-08 14:10:45 <Sami345> luke-jr, what's that
1765 2011-05-08 14:11:01 <topi`> Sami345: it's a pool for division of labor
1766 2011-05-08 14:11:19 finnomenon has left ()
1767 2011-05-08 14:11:24 <Sami345> labor?
1768 2011-05-08 14:11:26 <luke-jr> Sami345: https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Eligius
1769 2011-05-08 14:11:40 <diki> luke, this is what people said on a native forum of mine(same language as mine). "His pool is out for 2 weeks now and he doesnt even have a website"
1770 2011-05-08 14:11:41 <xenon481> Sami345: Eligius is a pool.
1771 2011-05-08 14:11:59 <diki> and they also said "How does he expect us to read JSON files"
1772 2011-05-08 14:12:44 <sipa> warning: job finished, miner is idle
1773 2011-05-08 14:12:45 <sipa> Try using port 80 instead of 8337, and/or setting your router to prioritize port 8337.
1774 2011-05-08 14:12:45 <justmoon> I for one welcome our new deepbit overlords
1775 2011-05-08 14:12:52 <sipa> luke-jr: you support port 80 as well?
1776 2011-05-08 14:13:08 <Cusipzzz> justmoon: lol
1777 2011-05-08 14:13:35 <luke-jr> diki: then translate my post? unlike other pools, I don't *force* people to pay for development of a website. it's optional, you send how much you want to put toward it to that address…
1778 2011-05-08 14:13:38 <luke-jr> sipa: yes
1779 2011-05-08 14:14:07 <sipa> ok, good :)
1780 2011-05-08 14:14:10 <luke-jr> bbl
1781 2011-05-08 14:14:17 Cusipz has joined
1782 2011-05-08 14:14:23 <jgarzik> luke-jr: pushpool should spit out X-Ntime
1783 2011-05-08 14:14:34 <luke-jr> jgarzik: ?
1784 2011-05-08 14:14:40 <diki> i never was forced to pay for anything
1785 2011-05-08 14:14:48 Cusipz has quit (Client Quit)
1786 2011-05-08 14:14:51 <luke-jr> diki: other pools take it out of your payment
1787 2011-05-08 14:14:56 <jgarzik> luke-jr: that HTTP header triggers poclbm to change ntime.  it is not done by defualt, in most miners.
1788 2011-05-08 14:14:59 <topi`> diki: nope, but you still do pay to the pool operators
1789 2011-05-08 14:15:01 <diki> and it's pretty easy to make a JSON reader in php
1790 2011-05-08 14:15:02 Incitatus has joined
1791 2011-05-08 14:15:06 <diki> in fact there are scripts out there
1792 2011-05-08 14:15:45 TheAncientGoat has joined
1793 2011-05-08 14:15:52 <diki> For an example i started building a torrent tracker from scratch
1794 2011-05-08 14:15:57 <diki> a manga reader, a forum
1795 2011-05-08 14:16:02 <sipa> LP + X-Ntime = no need for getwork every N seconds?
1796 2011-05-08 14:16:04 <diki> no one paid me and i didn't expect payment
1797 2011-05-08 14:16:13 luke-jr has joined
1798 2011-05-08 14:16:34 <PSUdaemon> can someone explain how the merkle tree is computed?
1799 2011-05-08 14:16:36 <ArtForz> diki: you have too much spare time
1800 2011-05-08 14:16:40 <PSUdaemon> i can't find documentation on it
1801 2011-05-08 14:16:50 <topi`> diki: I use curl as my JSON reader ;)
1802 2011-05-08 14:16:51 <sipa> PSUdaemon: use the source, luke
1803 2011-05-08 14:16:59 xenon481 has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
1804 2011-05-08 14:17:04 xenon481_ has joined
1805 2011-05-08 14:17:09 <PSUdaemon> sipa: i was afraid someone was going to say that
1806 2011-05-08 14:17:17 <ArtForz> also, about all alternate block chain readers support merkle hash tree building/checking
1807 2011-05-08 14:17:17 <sipa> PSUdaemon: it's basically taking two tx hashes together, and sha256'ing it into a single hash
1808 2011-05-08 14:17:18 <jgarzik> sipa: correct
1809 2011-05-08 14:17:19 <diki> curl is for transmitting data
1810 2011-05-08 14:17:21 Cusipzzz has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
1811 2011-05-08 14:17:24 <diki> it's not a json reader
1812 2011-05-08 14:17:30 <sipa> PSUdaemon: that way you halve the number of tx hashes
1813 2011-05-08 14:17:47 <sipa> PSUdaemon: and you keep doing that until you have only one hash left, that's the merkle root
1814 2011-05-08 14:18:01 <jgarzik> sipa: LP + Ntime is sufficient to create a mode where a miner -never- needs to ask for work.  In the future, mining will involve server pushing a 'work' upon login, and then at each block interval thereafter.
1815 2011-05-08 14:18:07 Cusipzzz has joined
1816 2011-05-08 14:18:10 <PSUdaemon> sipa: double or single sha256?
1817 2011-05-08 14:18:22 <sipa> i believe double (=overkill ftw!)
1818 2011-05-08 14:18:24 <ArtForz> boudle
1819 2011-05-08 14:18:33 <ArtForz> *double
1820 2011-05-08 14:18:45 <ArtForz> jgarzik: which is how it should've worked from the beginning...
1821 2011-05-08 14:19:13 <jgarzik> sipa: only in very rare cases, where a block has not been found for hours, would a miner request work
1822 2011-05-08 14:19:15 <jgarzik> ArtForz: yep
1823 2011-05-08 14:21:28 <diki> who was it that made pooled mining exactly?
1824 2011-05-08 14:22:37 <ArtForz> wasnt the first pool by the guy with the closed source cuda miner?
1825 2011-05-08 14:24:33 <noagendamarket> yes
1826 2011-05-08 14:24:39 <noagendamarket> puddinpop
1827 2011-05-08 14:24:56 <ArtForz> yea
1828 2011-05-08 14:25:07 <diki> and where is he?
1829 2011-05-08 14:25:32 <noagendamarket> probably collecting his 10% that he shoved into the closed source :)
1830 2011-05-08 14:25:55 <ArtForz> probably burst into flames after getting hit by sunlight
1831 2011-05-08 14:26:01 <noagendamarket> lol
1832 2011-05-08 14:26:19 <jgarzik> retiring on the 10,000 BTC I gave him to open source that stuff *headdesk*
1833 2011-05-08 14:26:30 <mtrlt> :D
1834 2011-05-08 14:26:30 <xenon481_> wow
1835 2011-05-08 14:26:35 <mtrlt> nice :)
1836 2011-05-08 14:26:58 <Incitatus> hey
1837 2011-05-08 14:27:06 <Incitatus> i see MTGox is having slowly more volume
1838 2011-05-08 14:27:13 <Incitatus> but whenever i check it's always still down?
1839 2011-05-08 14:27:53 <Incitatus> is there some waek DDOS going on such that people wiht shitty internet can't access it buvt people with good internet can
1840 2011-05-08 14:28:00 <Incitatus> or is it only up when i'm sleeping
1841 2011-05-08 14:28:20 <mtrlt> try https
1842 2011-05-08 14:28:24 <ArtForz> yep
1843 2011-05-08 14:28:29 <ArtForz> use https
1844 2011-05-08 14:28:46 <ArtForz> works fine here
1845 2011-05-08 14:29:19 <diki> damn, new naruto shippuuden movie already announced
1846 2011-05-08 14:29:27 <diki> but prolly next year as always
1847 2011-05-08 14:29:44 <Incitatus> haha thanks
1848 2011-05-08 14:29:52 <Incitatus> that fixed it :D :D :D
1849 2011-05-08 14:30:12 <ArtForz> seems their http firewall/proxy is a bit... overzealous
1850 2011-05-08 14:30:14 pnicholson has joined
1851 2011-05-08 14:31:18 <xenon481_> Slush: Last Active: 	May 06, 2011
1852 2011-05-08 14:31:33 <xenon481_> Has anybody seen him away from the forums for 48 hours?
1853 2011-05-08 14:31:39 <ArtForz> he's probably gone over the weekend
1854 2011-05-08 14:35:59 diki has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1855 2011-05-08 14:37:25 xenon481_ is now known as xenon481
1856 2011-05-08 14:40:17 kermit has quit (Quit: Leaving.)
1857 2011-05-08 14:40:41 diki has joined
1858 2011-05-08 14:43:00 mologie has quit (Quit: Nettalk6 - www.ntalk.de)
1859 2011-05-08 14:44:49 <diki> which are the faster instructions? SSE2 or SSE3 or SSE4?
1860 2011-05-08 14:45:14 <diki> or SSE4.1?
1861 2011-05-08 14:45:20 <Sami345> I am thinking about moving back to pooled mining
1862 2011-05-08 14:45:35 <diki> how much did you make with solo?
1863 2011-05-08 14:45:40 <Diablo-D3> uh\
1864 2011-05-08 14:45:42 <Sami345> 2 blocks found
1865 2011-05-08 14:45:44 <Diablo-D3> diki: that doesnt make any sense
1866 2011-05-08 14:45:48 <Diablo-D3> they're not faster
1867 2011-05-08 14:45:51 <diki> 100 bitcoins not enough?
1868 2011-05-08 14:45:51 <Diablo-D3> they're just more instructions
1869 2011-05-08 14:46:10 <Diablo-D3> each SSE "version" just adds more things
1870 2011-05-08 14:46:12 <Sami345> I have 175 coin currently 75 pooled + 100 solo
1871 2011-05-08 14:46:24 <Diablo-D3> hyperoptimized versions of very specific tasks
1872 2011-05-08 14:46:29 <diki> why do you need more for the next say 1-2 weeks?
1873 2011-05-08 14:46:40 <diki> i say stick with solo if you have nough power
1874 2011-05-08 14:46:45 <diki> hash power i mean
1875 2011-05-08 14:47:04 <Diablo-D3> [Tycho]: goddamnit man
1876 2011-05-08 14:47:19 <Diablo-D3> [08:12:29] <[Tycho]> Diablo-D3, but it may give some hint to OSX users
1877 2011-05-08 14:47:20 <Diablo-D3> no
1878 2011-05-08 14:47:22 <Diablo-D3> no it doesnt
1879 2011-05-08 14:47:25 <diki> 544
1880 2011-05-08 14:47:30 <Diablo-D3> because they just do ./DiabloMiner-OSX.sh
1881 2011-05-08 14:48:24 <diki> you know i recently thought of something interesting to do with a group of people
1882 2011-05-08 14:48:37 <BlueMatt> make a distributed cryptocurrency?
1883 2011-05-08 14:48:40 <diki> we will do some cooperative mining, same principle with pools
1884 2011-05-08 14:48:53 <Diablo-D3> communist mining?
1885 2011-05-08 14:49:02 taco_the_paco has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1886 2011-05-08 14:49:13 <BlueMatt> damn commies
1887 2011-05-08 14:49:17 <diki> Basically what we will do is we will point all the miners to one bitcoin using -server and find a block then we move to another user and help him find a block
1888 2011-05-08 14:49:33 <diki> i see pure win there
1889 2011-05-08 14:49:35 <Diablo-D3> diki: communist mining.
1890 2011-05-08 14:49:39 <Diablo-D3> thats not a new idea.
1891 2011-05-08 14:49:41 <diki> what?
1892 2011-05-08 14:50:01 <Diablo-D3> everyone gets an equal share of the output no matter how much mhash they put in
1893 2011-05-08 14:50:04 <[Tycho]> What ?
1894 2011-05-08 14:50:14 <Diablo-D3> [10:42:06] <Diablo-D3> [08:12:29] <[Tycho]> Diablo-D3, but it may give some hint to OSX users
1895 2011-05-08 14:50:14 <Diablo-D3> [10:42:07] <Diablo-D3> no
1896 2011-05-08 14:50:14 <Diablo-D3> [10:42:09] <Diablo-D3> no it doesnt
1897 2011-05-08 14:50:18 <Diablo-D3> [10:42:17] <Diablo-D3> because they just do ./DiabloMiner-OSX.sh
1898 2011-05-08 14:50:18 <subpar> Diablo-D3: any updates to the nibner since last night?
1899 2011-05-08 14:50:28 <diki> points is we help the user find a block
1900 2011-05-08 14:50:31 <Diablo-D3> subpar: I published the launch4j binary
1901 2011-05-08 14:50:33 <diki> then the user helps us
1902 2011-05-08 14:50:43 <subpar> same link ?
1903 2011-05-08 14:50:47 <diki> And there is no communist mining until i see it added to the wiki
1904 2011-05-08 14:50:49 <Diablo-D3> subpar: no, in the main file
1905 2011-05-08 14:50:58 <Diablo-D3> diki: theres a forum thread about it
1906 2011-05-08 14:51:00 Marcel has left (HSD!~Marcel|HS@router2.hsdev.com|)
1907 2011-05-08 14:51:09 <diki> link?
1908 2011-05-08 14:51:15 <Diablo-D3> I AM NOT FUCKING GOOGLE
1909 2011-05-08 14:51:19 <Diablo-D3> DO I LOOK LIKE GOOGLE?
1910 2011-05-08 14:51:21 <subpar> yes you are
1911 2011-05-08 14:51:22 <[Tycho]> Oh, you are still talking about that help page
1912 2011-05-08 14:51:23 <diki> we can make you into one
1913 2011-05-08 14:51:26 <Diablo-D3> [Tycho]: yes
1914 2011-05-08 14:51:39 <Diablo-D3> [Tycho]: seriously, windows was the only platform that sucked, now its all good
1915 2011-05-08 14:51:43 <subpar> I see the .zip as a l4j.ini file
1916 2011-05-08 14:51:45 <diki> Actually your username does look like google's logo
1917 2011-05-08 14:51:51 <sipa> lol
1918 2011-05-08 14:52:09 <Diablo-D3> subpar: I hope you mean *has
1919 2011-05-08 14:52:16 <subpar> has
1920 2011-05-08 14:52:19 <subpar> yes
1921 2011-05-08 14:52:26 <Diablo-D3> [Tycho]: and fix your front page, my miner does LP =P
1922 2011-05-08 14:52:28 <subpar> my typing = suck
1923 2011-05-08 14:52:49 <subpar> I wasn't sure if anything new since ~ 12 hours ago
1924 2011-05-08 14:53:02 <Diablo-D3> subpar: no, I think you saw that one before you left to bed
1925 2011-05-08 14:53:24 <subpar> K - yep - was still short of poclbm adn phoenix for now
1926 2011-05-08 14:53:36 <Diablo-D3> yeah because of no bfi_int
1927 2011-05-08 14:53:41 <subpar> understood
1928 2011-05-08 14:53:49 <Diablo-D3> poclbm and mine both beat phoenix with bfi_int off
1929 2011-05-08 14:53:51 <[Tycho]> There is nothing on my main page that says that it doesn't
1930 2011-05-08 14:54:00 <subpar> but even without BFI_INT best i got was 165 versus phoenix at 192
1931 2011-05-08 14:54:01 <Diablo-D3> [Tycho]: yeah, but you list those two and not mine
1932 2011-05-08 14:54:07 <[Tycho]> Ok
1933 2011-05-08 14:54:11 <subpar> phoenix w/out...
1934 2011-05-08 14:54:29 <subpar> so still 20% short
1935 2011-05-08 14:54:39 <Diablo-D3> subpar: I also suspect pheonix has broken mhash accounting
1936 2011-05-08 14:54:52 <subpar> I know you feel that way...
1937 2011-05-08 14:55:01 <subpar> poclbm is the same as well
1938 2011-05-08 14:55:02 <Diablo-D3> well that isnt it, poclbm doesnt and does bfi_int
1939 2011-05-08 14:55:28 <Diablo-D3> and poclbm with bfi_int off is like 1-2% slower than mine
1940 2011-05-08 14:55:48 <diki> maybe i should try your miner
1941 2011-05-08 14:58:06 taco_the_paco has joined
1942 2011-05-08 14:58:38 <diki> diablo what is kernel loops?
1943 2011-05-08 14:59:29 <Diablo-D3> what does it sound like.
1944 2011-05-08 14:59:34 <subpar> seems you can't turn off BFI_INT with Kiv;s gui
1945 2011-05-08 14:59:46 Blitzboom_ is now known as Blitzboom
1946 2011-05-08 14:59:55 <Diablo-D3> btw, bfi_int should make my miner like over 9000 khash/sec
1947 2011-05-08 14:59:56 Blitzboom has quit (Changing host)
1948 2011-05-08 14:59:56 Blitzboom has joined
1949 2011-05-08 14:59:58 <Diablo-D3> even on a ti-89
1950 2011-05-08 15:00:21 <diki> sounds like chinese?
1951 2011-05-08 15:00:26 <diki> how should i know how many loops
1952 2011-05-08 15:00:55 <BlueMatt> anyone have a problem with the current crypter branch...pull request time?
1953 2011-05-08 15:01:02 <Diablo-D3> diki: it already does the right thing by default.
1954 2011-05-08 15:01:21 <Diablo-D3> diki: -z 10 on radeon 5/6xxx, -z 0 on everything else
1955 2011-05-08 15:01:58 <Diablo-D3> BWAHAHHAHAHA
1956 2011-05-08 15:02:05 <BlueMatt> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/203
1957 2011-05-08 15:02:06 <Diablo-D3> I now have -1 reputation on the forums
1958 2011-05-08 15:03:01 <diki> why do you have host and url together?
1959 2011-05-08 15:03:04 <diki> what is the difference?
1960 2011-05-08 15:03:32 <Diablo-D3> diki: use one or the other, not both.
1961 2011-05-08 15:03:54 <diki> i am using them but it says localhost is not a protocol
1962 2011-05-08 15:03:59 <diki> *it
1963 2011-05-08 15:04:06 <Diablo-D3> localhost isnt a protocol.
1964 2011-05-08 15:04:19 <Diablo-D3> --url expects ... a url.
1965 2011-05-08 15:04:20 <diki> hosts file altho points to 127.0.0.1
1966 2011-05-08 15:04:26 <noagendamarket> Diablo-D3 everyone has -1
1967 2011-05-08 15:04:29 <sipa> BlueMatt: you could have edited the author field
1968 2011-05-08 15:04:31 <diki> i used -host
1969 2011-05-08 15:04:38 <sipa> now it says jgarzic added some commits :)
1970 2011-05-08 15:04:43 <Diablo-D3> diki: paste entire command line.
1971 2011-05-08 15:05:49 <sipa> BlueMatt: pass cNewWalletCrypter by reference
1972 2011-05-08 15:05:58 <Diablo-D3> noagendamarket: wait, why?
1973 2011-05-08 15:06:17 <noagendamarket> because its a retarded voting system
1974 2011-05-08 15:06:28 <Diablo-D3> how do I even vote?
1975 2011-05-08 15:06:31 <noagendamarket> the trolls are the only ones voting
1976 2011-05-08 15:06:42 <Diablo-D3> and fucking [Tycho] has +10/-1
1977 2011-05-08 15:06:47 <noagendamarket> lol
1978 2011-05-08 15:07:23 <noagendamarket> I foresee bad shit happening because voting is never a good solution
1979 2011-05-08 15:07:33 <Diablo-D3> seriously how do I vote
1980 2011-05-08 15:07:44 <Diablo-D3> I wanna downmod entire fucking threads
1981 2011-05-08 15:07:49 <diki> doesnt work tho i do DiabloMiner-Windows.exe -D 0 -g 5 -l http://127.0.0.1 -u userhere -p pass -z 10 -w 128 -r 8332
1982 2011-05-08 15:07:59 <Diablo-D3> diki: now what did I fucking say
1983 2011-05-08 15:08:07 <Diablo-D3> -l OR -o -r, NOT BOTH
1984 2011-05-08 15:08:19 <Diablo-D3> and why the fuck are you throwing in a shitload of args dude
1985 2011-05-08 15:08:23 <noagendamarket> theres a + or - under the usernames
1986 2011-05-08 15:08:23 <diki> then i can't specify the port
1987 2011-05-08 15:08:50 <diki> doesnt work man
1988 2011-05-08 15:08:55 <Diablo-D3> diki: -o localhost -r 8332. THIS IS NOT ROCKET SCIENCE
1989 2011-05-08 15:09:09 <Diablo-D3> noagendamarket: where?
1990 2011-05-08 15:09:17 IncitatusOnWater has joined
1991 2011-05-08 15:10:16 <noagendamarket> theres blue links there
1992 2011-05-08 15:10:18 <diki> sorry man, it just doesnt work
1993 2011-05-08 15:10:38 alystair has joined
1994 2011-05-08 15:10:47 <Diablo-D3> diki: dude, it fucking works.
1995 2011-05-08 15:11:24 <Diablo-D3> $ ./DiabloMiner-Linux.sh -u diablo -p dikiisanidiot -o localhost -r 8332 -w 64 -f 1000
1996 2011-05-08 15:11:29 <Diablo-D3> [5/8/11 11:05:56 AM] Started
1997 2011-05-08 15:11:29 <Diablo-D3> [5/8/11 11:05:56 AM] Connecting to: http://localhost:8332/
1998 2011-05-08 15:11:33 <Diablo-D3> sure looks like working to me!
1999 2011-05-08 15:11:34 dvide has joined
2000 2011-05-08 15:11:49 <diki> it sats connection to, and then 0/0khash/s
2001 2011-05-08 15:11:53 <diki> i'd say it doesnt
2002 2011-05-08 15:11:55 <noagendamarket> heh customer relations ftw
2003 2011-05-08 15:11:58 <mtrlt> :P
2004 2011-05-08 15:12:18 <Diablo-D3> diki: how about not using -D 0
2005 2011-05-08 15:12:30 Incitatus has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2006 2011-05-08 15:12:34 <diki> i am using device 0
2007 2011-05-08 15:12:40 <Diablo-D3> DiabloMiner selects all viable devices automatically.
2008 2011-05-08 15:12:53 <Diablo-D3> and -D doesnt do what you think it does.
2009 2011-05-08 15:13:23 <ArtForz> and people wonder why I never release any complete programs...
2010 2011-05-08 15:13:39 <Diablo-D3> ArtForz: I am debating this as well
2011 2011-05-08 15:13:41 <noagendamarket> :)
2012 2011-05-08 15:13:43 <justmoon> ArtForz: lol
2013 2011-05-08 15:13:56 <topi`> lol
2014 2011-05-08 15:13:59 <sipa> ArtForz: you don't want to play support line? :)
2015 2011-05-08 15:14:00 <diki> removing -D 0 helped
2016 2011-05-08 15:14:03 <ArtForz> being frontline helldesk for your lusers
2017 2011-05-08 15:14:10 <diki> however i am getting way less mhash/s
2018 2011-05-08 15:14:12 <diki> no vectors?
2019 2011-05-08 15:14:16 <Diablo-D3> no vectors
2020 2011-05-08 15:14:17 <topi`> this # is getting more and more entertaining :)
2021 2011-05-08 15:14:18 <Diablo-D3> and honestly
2022 2011-05-08 15:14:19 <noagendamarket> they are called "users" for a reason
2023 2011-05-08 15:14:24 <Diablo-D3> if the fucking driver sucks that much dick without vectors
2024 2011-05-08 15:14:26 <Diablo-D3> fuck the whole thing
2025 2011-05-08 15:14:36 Fnar has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2026 2011-05-08 15:14:48 <topi`> ;;bc,eligius
2027 2011-05-08 15:14:49 <gribble> 27187142.9837
2028 2011-05-08 15:14:56 hymenoptera has quit (Quit: Leaving)
2029 2011-05-08 15:15:46 <Diablo-D3> seriously, if I flip out and start killing people because they see flashy buttons and start jamming them, this is why.
2030 2011-05-08 15:15:48 <ArtForz> did 1st level helldesk back in university, not ruining my nerves and any remaining hope for humanity for free
2031 2011-05-08 15:15:55 <topi`> it seems eligius is only 2% of the total hash rate
2032 2011-05-08 15:16:25 <noagendamarket> Diablo-D3 you should charge consultancy fees :)
2033 2011-05-08 15:16:38 <Diablo-D3> noagendamarket: well, I basically got most of a 5850 out of it
2034 2011-05-08 15:16:50 <topi`> ;;bc,deepbit
2035 2011-05-08 15:16:51 <gribble> 534397000.0
2036 2011-05-08 15:16:56 <noagendamarket> well thats something
2037 2011-05-08 15:17:01 <diki> you got a 5850 too?
2038 2011-05-08 15:17:14 Marcel has joined
2039 2011-05-08 15:17:28 <da2ce7> lol, if deepbit starts rejecting other blocks... they can make more money
2040 2011-05-08 15:17:35 <Diablo-D3> it was paid for by BTC donations by people who go "hey diablo, we can read the fucking manual"
2041 2011-05-08 15:17:38 <topi`> da2ce7: indeed.
2042 2011-05-08 15:17:43 <da2ce7> but then we will just ddos it.
2043 2011-05-08 15:17:52 <genjix> what's a good pcmcia card for wifi in ubuntu?
2044 2011-05-08 15:17:57 <Diablo-D3> except xel, I dont know what the fuck his problem is
2045 2011-05-08 15:17:59 <genjix> any intel one should do, right?
2046 2011-05-08 15:18:08 <topi`> da2ce7: since I've invested money on BTC, it's in my best interests to see that deepbit does NOT have >50% of all hash power
2047 2011-05-08 15:18:12 <topi`> but oh well
2048 2011-05-08 15:18:29 <Diablo-D3> Sigh.
2049 2011-05-08 15:18:30 <topi`> genjix: the intel cards will work. find a pcmcia wifi howto :)
2050 2011-05-08 15:18:32 <da2ce7> topi` it is no issue providing they behave themselves.
2051 2011-05-08 15:18:32 <[Tycho]> da2ce7, how you can make money by rejecting blocks ?
2052 2011-05-08 15:18:39 <Diablo-D3> Trying to make [Tycho] do something is impossible.
2053 2011-05-08 15:18:40 <genjix> thanks topi` ;)
2054 2011-05-08 15:18:48 Fnar has joined
2055 2011-05-08 15:18:53 <da2ce7> Tycho, you need to wait till the dificulty drops.
2056 2011-05-08 15:19:00 <topi`> da2ce7: what IF their system/password is compromised and some 3rd party guy comes in and starts doing tricks?
2057 2011-05-08 15:19:12 <da2ce7> topi` we ddos it.
2058 2011-05-08 15:19:13 <[Tycho]> Diablo-D3, i fixed the help page just immediately
2059 2011-05-08 15:19:18 <noagendamarket> Tycho because then more of your own blocks get in
2060 2011-05-08 15:19:29 <da2ce7> if a pool missbehaves, it is very easy to take it down
2061 2011-05-08 15:19:34 <Diablo-D3> [Tycho]: do you have a server side cache or something?
2062 2011-05-08 15:19:37 <Diablo-D3> because Im not seeing it
2063 2011-05-08 15:19:55 <[Tycho]> I'm talking about the previous update
2064 2011-05-08 15:20:02 <topi`> da2ce7: it's been AGES since I used pcmcia wifi cards
2065 2011-05-08 15:20:02 <Diablo-D3> yeah but you halfassed it
2066 2011-05-08 15:20:15 <da2ce7> topi?
2067 2011-05-08 15:20:28 <topi`> da2ce7: oh sorry ;) I meant genjix
2068 2011-05-08 15:20:40 <genjix> yeah well my wifi card SUCKS
2069 2011-05-08 15:20:51 <Diablo-D3> [Tycho]: just fix it by the time I get up tommorow
2070 2011-05-08 15:20:52 * da2ce7 needs to go to sleep
2071 2011-05-08 15:20:54 <Diablo-D3> Im going to bed
2072 2011-05-08 15:20:59 <da2ce7> productive day today
2073 2011-05-08 15:21:00 <topi`> genjix: find a net cafe?
2074 2011-05-08 15:21:01 <Diablo-D3> night all
2075 2011-05-08 15:21:17 <da2ce7> Sleep well Diablo
2076 2011-05-08 15:21:17 <genjix> but i want to know something i can walk into the shop and buy (a pcmcia card) and know it will work good
2077 2011-05-08 15:21:18 malnilion has quit (Quit: Leaving)
2078 2011-05-08 15:21:29 <genjix> any suggestions?
2079 2011-05-08 15:21:46 <[Tycho]> genjix, are you using a Mac ?
2080 2011-05-08 15:21:50 <genjix> no ubuntu
2081 2011-05-08 15:21:59 m00p has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2082 2011-05-08 15:22:00 <[Tycho]> Oh... Not sure what is worse :)
2083 2011-05-08 15:22:02 <da2ce7> ;;google linux pcmcia wireless card
2084 2011-05-08 15:22:03 <gribble> Linux & Wireless LANs: <http://www.hpl.hp.com/personal/Jean_Tourrilhes/Linux/>; SUPPORTED.CARDS - Linux PCMCIA Information: <http://pcmcia-cs.sourceforge.net/ftp/SUPPORTED.CARDS>; PCMCIA - Linux Wireless: <http://linuxwireless.org/en/users/Devices/PCMCIA>
2085 2011-05-08 15:22:06 <tcatm> genjix: no atheros chip
2086 2011-05-08 15:22:22 <genjix> ok cool. is intel a safe bet to buy?
2087 2011-05-08 15:22:36 <topi`> genjix: somebody recommended D-link DWL-650  for ubuntu
2088 2011-05-08 15:22:56 <ArtForz> dwl-650 = not bad
2089 2011-05-08 15:23:28 <genjix> well if i go to a small computer shop, i doubt they'll sell specific models, so i can only look for something generic i suppose
2090 2011-05-08 15:23:28 <ArtForz> I just got a bunch of $8.99 RTL8185 based noname cards
2091 2011-05-08 15:23:32 <andrew12> hm
2092 2011-05-08 15:24:02 <andrew12> anyone have any idea how to make a supybot (or a gribble) not allow registrations? (cc: nanotube)
2093 2011-05-08 15:24:20 pnicholson has quit (Quit: pnicholson)
2094 2011-05-08 15:25:31 <noagendamarket> what if deepbit gets ddosed too ?
2095 2011-05-08 15:25:40 * andrew12 should ask #supybot
2096 2011-05-08 15:25:54 <noagendamarket> we could be on insane diff for a long long time
2097 2011-05-08 15:26:04 <ArtForz> noagendamarket: nelson laugh
2098 2011-05-08 15:26:18 <noagendamarket> :)
2099 2011-05-08 15:26:32 <ArtForz> wouldn't take long for a few more pools to pop up I bet
2100 2011-05-08 15:26:44 <noagendamarket> the same entity would just ddos them too
2101 2011-05-08 15:26:50 <ArtForz> not to mention big miners would just keep on mining solo
2102 2011-05-08 15:26:54 <Cusipzzz> there is a perverse incentive to ddos all public pools....
2103 2011-05-08 15:27:00 <noagendamarket> agreed
2104 2011-05-08 15:27:07 <ArtForz> yep
2105 2011-05-08 15:27:14 <ArtForz> part of the cost of running a pool
2106 2011-05-08 15:27:18 <Cusipzzz> ya
2107 2011-05-08 15:27:48 <rawry> bandwidth is cheap anyways
2108 2011-05-08 15:27:48 <noagendamarket> maybe private pools would start operating
2109 2011-05-08 15:27:58 Diablo-D3 has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2110 2011-05-08 15:28:12 <rawry> the pools just need to find decent hosting that have good ddos prevention/mitigation
2111 2011-05-08 15:28:24 <noagendamarket> that costs money
2112 2011-05-08 15:28:35 <rawry> (eg, somewhere with a netzentry or similar box that auto null-routes)
2113 2011-05-08 15:28:36 <noagendamarket> and pool users dont like spending it
2114 2011-05-08 15:28:57 <rawry> noagendamarket: not really, my bitcoind box sits in such a place.
2115 2011-05-08 15:29:08 IncitatusOnWater has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2116 2011-05-08 15:30:06 <ArtForz> which won't help much
2117 2011-05-08 15:31:03 <ArtForz> you dont even need a DDoS to pretty much kill a bitcoin node dead
2118 2011-05-08 15:31:32 wolfspraul has quit (Quit: leaving)
2119 2011-05-08 15:32:19 TheKid has joined
2120 2011-05-08 15:32:19 TheKid has quit (Changing host)
2121 2011-05-08 15:32:19 TheKid has joined
2122 2011-05-08 15:32:44 <xenon481> Just spam it with requets.
2123 2011-05-08 15:32:47 <ArtForz> a single connection and a few dozen kB/s are plenty
2124 2011-05-08 15:33:09 <TheKid> anyone know what is going on with slush's pool?
2125 2011-05-08 15:33:26 <Cusipzzz> ddos...give him another day or so.
2126 2011-05-08 15:33:40 <TheKid> ah
2127 2011-05-08 15:33:44 <noagendamarket> it exposes a real weakness in bitcoin
2128 2011-05-08 15:33:47 <ArtForz> ddos and he's probably gone over the weekend
2129 2011-05-08 15:33:57 <TheKid> eh, I could solo mine
2130 2011-05-08 15:34:05 <TheKid> but a lot of people don't have that ability I suppose
2131 2011-05-08 15:34:15 <ArtForz> they do, they just don't have the patience
2132 2011-05-08 15:34:30 <TheKid> luke-jr: you there? I'm curious about something with your pool
2133 2011-05-08 15:34:35 <TheKid> ArtForz: that's what I mean :)
2134 2011-05-08 15:34:42 <ArtForz> unwilling != unable
2135 2011-05-08 15:34:48 <noagendamarket> the nsa has lots of patience
2136 2011-05-08 15:34:48 <noagendamarket> lol
2137 2011-05-08 15:35:34 <ArtForz> "I can't be arsed to do that" != "I can't do that"
2138 2011-05-08 15:35:46 <da2ce7> I don't recomend ddos unless a pool missbehaves.
2139 2011-05-08 15:36:16 <da2ce7> ofcouse it would be inpossible to ddos a btcfn pool
2140 2011-05-08 15:36:26 <ArtForz> a what?
2141 2011-05-08 15:36:35 <noagendamarket> freenet pool
2142 2011-05-08 15:36:41 <Cusipzzz> agree. but there are incentives for people to ddos all public pools all the time, misbehave or no....and people respond to incentives, lol
2143 2011-05-08 15:37:04 <da2ce7> BtcFn - http://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=7181.0
2144 2011-05-08 15:37:04 <Haze-> anyone here have any experience importing/exporting from china
2145 2011-05-08 15:37:16 <da2ce7> The BtcFn (Bitcoin Freenet) project is to transport BitCoin (blockchain, TXes and seeds) over Freenet, (and other like services).
2146 2011-05-08 15:37:29 <TheKid> Haze-: if dealextreme counts, then yes :P
2147 2011-05-08 15:37:35 <da2ce7> well you could build a pool that works on freenet.
2148 2011-05-08 15:37:49 <ArtForz> unless freenet latencies dropped by 2 orders of magnitude recently... good luck with that
2149 2011-05-08 15:38:12 <da2ce7> ArtForz, you can have low latency freenet, just it isn't used atm
2150 2011-05-08 15:38:52 <da2ce7> *but not used, not implmented.
2151 2011-05-08 15:39:05 <ArtForz> yeah
2152 2011-05-08 15:39:11 `2Fast2BCn has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2153 2011-05-08 15:39:12 alystair has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2154 2011-05-08 15:39:16 alystair has joined
2155 2011-05-08 15:39:21 <ArtForz> because low latency freenet would be trivially vulnerable to timing attacks
2156 2011-05-08 15:39:29 `2Fast2BCn has joined
2157 2011-05-08 15:39:46 <noagendamarket> the answer is private pools ?
2158 2011-05-08 15:39:54 <TheKid> how would that help?
2159 2011-05-08 15:39:58 <TheKid> they'd still have a server to ddos
2160 2011-05-08 15:40:14 <xenon481> but they wouldn't be known to the public
2161 2011-05-08 15:40:17 <noagendamarket> not if they dont know the address
2162 2011-05-08 15:40:22 <xenon481> security through obfuscation
2163 2011-05-08 15:40:24 <TheKid> eh
2164 2011-05-08 15:40:24 <tabsa> it seems that bitcoin mining incentives gravitate mining pools toward 50%+ hash rate, the biggest pool will get the most rewards right?
2165 2011-05-08 15:40:26 <da2ce7> well any latency more than 5 seconds you start to run into issues
2166 2011-05-08 15:40:44 <da2ce7> tabsa, no
2167 2011-05-08 15:40:46 <TheKid> trivial to get into a private pool I'm sure, then some ddoser just offers enough money and bam
2168 2011-05-08 15:40:51 <da2ce7> unless it missbehaves...
2169 2011-05-08 15:40:52 <TheKid> server address acquired
2170 2011-05-08 15:41:07 <xenon481> Depends on the level of privacy.
2171 2011-05-08 15:41:25 chmod755 has joined
2172 2011-05-08 15:41:27 <da2ce7> TheKid, how about a pool running on a private tor service?
2173 2011-05-08 15:41:33 <da2ce7> that would be resistant to ddos
2174 2011-05-08 15:41:51 <TheKid> maybe
2175 2011-05-08 15:42:01 <TheKid> I think many servers would be the best way
2176 2011-05-08 15:42:09 <TheKid> at least given my 5 minutes of thought on it :P
2177 2011-05-08 15:42:21 <da2ce7> of course, you have  distrubuted pool system
2178 2011-05-08 15:42:33 <TheKid> 20+ pool servers that rotate connections, and are all in different geographical places
2179 2011-05-08 15:42:36 <da2ce7> where the servers share the rewards throogh something like Open Transactions.
2180 2011-05-08 15:42:41 <noagendamarket> host as pool on ec2 ?
2181 2011-05-08 15:43:09 <rawry> noagendamarket: ec2 doesn't help at all
2182 2011-05-08 15:43:11 <rawry> why would it
2183 2011-05-08 15:43:20 <da2ce7> Best Pool: mine for Open Transactions btc-cash
2184 2011-05-08 15:43:31 <da2ce7> that would make your earnings untraceable like normal mining
2185 2011-05-08 15:43:31 <rawry> only solution to the bandwidth ddos is to have enough bandwidth to take it and something in place to mitigate it
2186 2011-05-08 15:43:54 <rawry> no idea what could be done about request spamming doses, that's a deeper issue
2187 2011-05-08 15:43:58 <noagendamarket> fucking griefers
2188 2011-05-08 15:44:14 <ArtForz> griefing is fun
2189 2011-05-08 15:45:29 alystair has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2190 2011-05-08 15:45:47 <noagendamarket> its probably the same people downvoting on the forum
2191 2011-05-08 15:45:50 * da2ce7 wonders how long till deep bit gets taken down
2192 2011-05-08 15:46:00 <TheKid> I hate soloing
2193 2011-05-08 15:46:05 <TheKid> but I'll do it if deepbit goes down
2194 2011-05-08 15:46:19 * noagendamarket thinks well be in deep shit
2195 2011-05-08 15:46:22 <da2ce7> TheKid, just Luke-jr's pool
2196 2011-05-08 15:46:27 rawry is now known as jrmithdobbs
2197 2011-05-08 15:46:27 <da2ce7> it is by-far the best
2198 2011-05-08 15:46:32 <TheKid> we should host a mining pool in google's data center :P
2199 2011-05-08 15:46:32 <jrmithdobbs> that'll make this less confusing
2200 2011-05-08 15:46:34 <da2ce7> I'm thinking that all this stuff is teaching the bitcoin community how to be resiliant to attack
2201 2011-05-08 15:46:42 <noagendamarket> yes
2202 2011-05-08 15:46:57 <da2ce7> it is now MUCH harder to take down mtgox
2203 2011-05-08 15:47:54 `2Fast2BCn has joined
2204 2011-05-08 15:49:12 kermit has joined
2205 2011-05-08 15:49:17 <diki> does it matter if an address has a changed letter from capital to small character?
2206 2011-05-08 15:49:27 <ArtForz> yes
2207 2011-05-08 15:49:43 AStove has quit ()
2208 2011-05-08 15:49:45 <nanotube> andrew12: defaultcapability add -user.register
2209 2011-05-08 15:50:04 <sipa> diki: in an address?
2210 2011-05-08 15:50:16 `2Fast2BCn has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
2211 2011-05-08 15:51:12 <eps> isn't mtgox down right now
2212 2011-05-08 15:51:32 mologie has joined
2213 2011-05-08 15:51:38 <ArtForz> works fine here
2214 2011-05-08 15:51:56 <ArtForz> use https
2215 2011-05-08 15:52:11 <eps> ahh fair enough
2216 2011-05-08 15:52:59 Xunie has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2217 2011-05-08 15:57:29 <RBecker> ;;view
2218 2011-05-08 15:57:51 <gribble> #1932 Fri May  6 15:01:02 2011 RBecker SELL 7.0 BNC Hosting - 1 Month @ 5 btc (ZNC, IPv6 Connectivity, any IRC network. One user. Contact RB14060@gmail.com or RBecker.)
2219 2011-05-08 15:57:51 <gribble> #1943 Fri May  6 19:09:08 2011 RBecker SELL 1.0 netbook @ 21.857 btc (Asus Eee PC 900a, 8.1" Screen, 4GB SSD, Email RB14060@gmail.com or contact RBecker)
2220 2011-05-08 15:58:48 bacon has joined
2221 2011-05-08 16:02:48 TheAncientGoat has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2222 2011-05-08 16:06:03 <diki> pay per share is the best
2223 2011-05-08 16:06:09 <diki> proportional gave me 0.02
2224 2011-05-08 16:06:51 <ArtForz> whatever, your loss
2225 2011-05-08 16:06:57 c0ldfront has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2226 2011-05-08 16:07:07 coldfront has joined
2227 2011-05-08 16:07:16 <diki> how is it my loss?
2228 2011-05-08 16:07:22 <diki> proportional = 0,02
2229 2011-05-08 16:07:27 <diki> pps=0.10 or 0,10
2230 2011-05-08 16:07:30 <diki> *0.12
2231 2011-05-08 16:08:46 <diki> i understand if i was at 600 mhash/s but i am only at 270
2232 2011-05-08 16:09:51 <sipa> jgarzik: does xf2.org's pool have any significant usage?
2233 2011-05-08 16:10:30 coldfront has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2234 2011-05-08 16:10:44 <mtrlt> diki: for how long did you test proportional?
2235 2011-05-08 16:10:48 coldfront has joined
2236 2011-05-08 16:10:58 <jgarzik> sipa: not at present.  ~3 Ghps
2237 2011-05-08 16:11:24 <jgarzik> sipa: that's total for the members pool + all private pools, though I just had a couple private pool customers show up today
2238 2011-05-08 16:11:35 <sipa> i see
2239 2011-05-08 16:12:02 <andrew12> nanotube: thanks!
2240 2011-05-08 16:12:19 <diki> i tested proportional for an hour
2241 2011-05-08 16:12:25 <diki> just enough to se deepbit update me
2242 2011-05-08 16:12:29 <diki> result = 0.02
2243 2011-05-08 16:12:29 <ArtForz> lol
2244 2011-05-08 16:12:41 <ArtForz> yes, thats a totally valid sample size. oh, wait...
2245 2011-05-08 16:13:01 <sipa> diki: you realize that the purpose of pools is exactly to reduce the variance in income?
2246 2011-05-08 16:13:16 <diki> and?
2247 2011-05-08 16:13:21 <sipa> and that pps is better than proportional at this
2248 2011-05-08 16:13:24 <sipa> but at a cost
2249 2011-05-08 16:13:24 vorlov has joined
2250 2011-05-08 16:13:36 <diki> and what would that be?
2251 2011-05-08 16:13:43 <ArtForz> *headdesk*
2252 2011-05-08 16:13:44 <sipa> the cost?
2253 2011-05-08 16:13:48 <diki> 10%?
2254 2011-05-08 16:13:51 <sipa> 10% instead of 3% fee
2255 2011-05-08 16:13:54 <diki> i didnt even feel them
2256 2011-05-08 16:13:55 <ArtForz> idiot fails at basic math, news at 11
2257 2011-05-08 16:14:01 <Cusipzzz> *double faceplam*...when 1 facepalm is just not enough.
2258 2011-05-08 16:14:19 <noagendamarket> lol
2259 2011-05-08 16:14:21 <nanotube> andrew12: np :) hope that means you're making some btc :D
2260 2011-05-08 16:14:21 <diki> i've calculated X shares * cost for shares = X btc and that is what i got
2261 2011-05-08 16:14:30 <sipa> diki: you'd need to run for many days before the random variation becomes less than that difference in fee
2262 2011-05-08 16:14:43 <diki> days? the new difficulty is coming
2263 2011-05-08 16:14:49 <diki> i'd rather stock up
2264 2011-05-08 16:14:58 <sipa> sure, that's a very reasonable argument pro pps
2265 2011-05-08 16:15:06 <ArtForz> stock up? with 270 Mhps? lol.
2266 2011-05-08 16:15:18 <diki> they would have been 340 if i hadnt crapped my card
2267 2011-05-08 16:15:24 <sipa> but don't claim pps has higher income than proportional, it doesn't claim so, and it doesn't
2268 2011-05-08 16:15:34 <sipa> it only has less risk of low income
2269 2011-05-08 16:15:58 <diki> from 29th of april to this minute i've earned 20BTC from deepbit
2270 2011-05-08 16:16:09 <diki> and a few other from slush and eligius
2271 2011-05-08 16:16:16 <[Tycho]> sipa, at the second half of today it surely does.
2272 2011-05-08 16:16:34 <sipa> [Tycho]: of course, on short periods of time it sometimes will and sometimes won't
2273 2011-05-08 16:16:40 <sipa> but on average, it's 7% lower :)
2274 2011-05-08 16:16:53 <ArtForz> *gasp* THAT much? I'm like totally impressed
2275 2011-05-08 16:17:04 <diki> tell me yours please on prop
2276 2011-05-08 16:17:36 <ArtForz> sorry, out of sarcasm tags
2277 2011-05-08 16:17:55 <diki> i've tried it before tho
2278 2011-05-08 16:17:58 <diki> most i got was 0.05
2279 2011-05-08 16:18:00 <diki> that sucks
2280 2011-05-08 16:18:07 <diki> cause i am getting double more with pps
2281 2011-05-08 16:18:10 <sipa> diki: in total? around 1200 BTC spread over 4 months
2282 2011-05-08 16:18:10 <mtrlt> 19:07 < diki> i tested proportional for an hour
2283 2011-05-08 16:18:16 <mtrlt> an hour isn't enough ..
2284 2011-05-08 16:18:22 <diki> and your gpu?
2285 2011-05-08 16:18:43 Aahzmundus has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2286 2011-05-08 16:18:43 <sipa> diki: with proportional you can be lucky or unlucky, with pps you'll earn slightly less, but have a much more constant income
2287 2011-05-08 16:18:45 <mtrlt> it's better to calculate expected values with math :)
2288 2011-05-08 16:19:01 Aahzmundus has joined
2289 2011-05-08 16:19:10 <sipa> so sure it's possible that you earned 1/2 of what you expected in one our
2290 2011-05-08 16:19:11 <mtrlt> and variances if you can.. i can't :P
2291 2011-05-08 16:19:14 <diki> with my part in the pool being 0,05 or 0,04 i dont think lucky will ever come
2292 2011-05-08 16:19:29 <mtrlt> luck in this context doesn't depend on your part of the pool
2293 2011-05-08 16:19:46 <sipa> diki: luck is defined here as the ratio of what you earned over what you'd have earned on average
2294 2011-05-08 16:19:58 <mtrlt> yea, that
2295 2011-05-08 16:20:17 Kiba has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2296 2011-05-08 16:20:23 <diki> i've turned on prop again
2297 2011-05-08 16:20:36 <mtrlt> now wait 24 hours or something :P
2298 2011-05-08 16:20:47 <diki> but if i earn less than 0.05 again, im deleting that part of html with greasemoney or something
2299 2011-05-08 16:20:55 <diki> *greasemonkey
2300 2011-05-08 16:21:02 <sipa> haha
2301 2011-05-08 16:21:06 <mtrlt> heh
2302 2011-05-08 16:21:27 <tcatm> anyone know of scripts/plugins that show market info from bitcoincharts in a browser?
2303 2011-05-08 16:21:49 <ArtForz> doesnt market info from bitcoincharts kinda already show in a browser?
2304 2011-05-08 16:22:21 <tcatm> yes, but I got one IP who queries the API 20 times a second (with a firefox useragent)
2305 2011-05-08 16:22:33 <ArtForz> whoa
2306 2011-05-08 16:22:35 <Cusipzzz> not me, i use lynx :)
2307 2011-05-08 16:22:39 <ArtForz> thats a bit... excessive
2308 2011-05-08 16:23:03 <tcatm> yep, especially as I offer the telnet :27007 interface for realtime data
2309 2011-05-08 16:23:21 * sipa already felt bad for querying mtgox once per minute for statistics
2310 2011-05-08 16:24:11 <tcatm> bitcoincharts can take > 8000 API requests/s, but if other users use that script it could easily hit that limit
2311 2011-05-08 16:24:14 * diki feels bad for querying Google once per year as it will know all my secrets
2312 2011-05-08 16:24:21 * diki *blushes*
2313 2011-05-08 16:24:39 coldfront has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2314 2011-05-08 16:25:11 * EvanR googles diki's penis size
2315 2011-05-08 16:25:23 <nanotube> tcatm: can always block it :)
2316 2011-05-08 16:25:33 * diki says you will only find info about lingeries
2317 2011-05-08 16:26:16 <EvanR> why?
2318 2011-05-08 16:26:24 <tcatm> nanotube: yep. I'd still prefer to find out the cause and tell him to use the telnet interface :)
2319 2011-05-08 16:27:39 <nanotube> tcatm: well yes... but unless you subpoena someone somewhere for the guy's IRL id, it would be pretty hard. :)
2320 2011-05-08 16:27:48 <nanotube> tcatm: well, maybe he's shown up on IRC with that IP. can't hurt to check
2321 2011-05-08 16:27:55 <tcatm> The funny thing is: Even when he does 20 request/s he'll only get new data every second because of caching.
2322 2011-05-08 16:28:04 <nanotube> heh
2323 2011-05-08 16:28:22 <tcatm> I already checked all IPs in -dev, -otc and #bitcoin
2324 2011-05-08 16:29:06 B0g4r7 has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
2325 2011-05-08 16:29:22 <Cusipzzz> proxies/vpn ftw...always keep my spam scripts to other IPs...i mean my surfing...yeah
2326 2011-05-08 16:29:23 <Cusipzzz> :)
2327 2011-05-08 16:32:40 <tcatm> looks like mentioning it here worked. down to 3 request/s from multiple IPs :)
2328 2011-05-08 16:33:17 chmod755 has quit (Quit: Leaving.)
2329 2011-05-08 16:34:26 <Cusipzzz> o.O
2330 2011-05-08 16:34:49 <mtrlt> :D
2331 2011-05-08 16:35:58 dissipate has joined
2332 2011-05-08 16:39:08 <diki> So you guys said it will eventually balance out...prop i mean
2333 2011-05-08 16:39:40 <diki> The question is why not balance it out  NAO!!!
2334 2011-05-08 16:40:18 <mtrlt> because you're impatient :P
2335 2011-05-08 16:43:11 warpi has joined
2336 2011-05-08 16:45:58 zyb has joined
2337 2011-05-08 16:46:13 <andrew12> hm. bitcoind won't compile? http://pastebin.com/VKT7LD2S
2338 2011-05-08 16:47:55 Haze- has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2339 2011-05-08 16:48:07 <andrew12> oh
2340 2011-05-08 16:48:08 <diki> fatal error: iostream.h: No such file or directory
2341 2011-05-08 16:48:19 <andrew12> nevermind i think i figured it out
2342 2011-05-08 16:49:10 <andrew12> i havent compiled bitcoin since i was tracking debian squeeze. i think when i changed to wheezy i missed some of the packages or something :P
2343 2011-05-08 16:49:23 <diki> ;;bc,mtgox
2344 2011-05-08 16:49:23 <gribble> {"ticker":{"high":3.9,"low":3.55,"vol":17698,"buy":3.8401,"sell":3.85,"last":3.895}}
2345 2011-05-08 16:49:35 noagendamarket has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2346 2011-05-08 16:49:52 dissipate has left ("Leaving")
2347 2011-05-08 16:50:03 <diki> ;;sell
2348 2011-05-08 16:50:03 <gribble> (sell <amount> <thing> [at|@] <priceperunit> <otherthing> [<notes>]) -- Logs a sell order for <amount> units of <thing, at a price of <price> per unit, in units of <otherthing>. Use the optional <notes> field to put in any special notes. <price> may include an arithmetical expression, and {mtgox(ask|bid|last)} to index price to mtgox ask, bid, or last price. May also include expression of (1 more message)
2349 2011-05-08 16:50:56 <diki> ;;sell 5 BTC @ 3,5 USD only web of trust
2350 2011-05-08 16:50:56 <gribble> Error: '3,5' is not a valid price input.
2351 2011-05-08 16:51:00 <diki> ;;sell 5 BTC @ 3.5 USD only web of trust
2352 2011-05-08 16:51:01 <gribble> Error: For identification purposes, you must be identified via GPG to use the order book.
2353 2011-05-08 16:51:06 <diki> darn
2354 2011-05-08 16:51:09 <diki> ;;auth diki
2355 2011-05-08 16:51:09 <gribble> Request successful for user diki. Your challenge string is: 8fb1c054519da08c3e6ab12ae96d879710ae94326b0dd4004b4c8b586aaae582
2356 2011-05-08 16:52:17 <andrew12> nope, that didn't help
2357 2011-05-08 16:52:20 <andrew12> :\
2358 2011-05-08 16:52:49 <andrew12> it probably has to do with a change in g++
2359 2011-05-08 16:53:04 <ArtForz> missing boost -dev libs?
2360 2011-05-08 16:53:05 <andrew12> so iostream.h isn't the same as iostream anymore
2361 2011-05-08 16:53:10 <andrew12> ArtForz: i don't think so
2362 2011-05-08 16:53:17 <ArtForz> weird
2363 2011-05-08 16:53:21 <andrew12> i have libboost-all-dev installed
2364 2011-05-08 16:53:39 <ArtForz> as bitcoind compiles nearly fine on debian sid here
2365 2011-05-08 16:53:40 <topi`> andrew12: I had the same problem on my debian-unstable
2366 2011-05-08 16:53:40 <andrew12> 'already at the newest version'
2367 2011-05-08 16:53:49 <andrew12> this is wheezy though
2368 2011-05-08 16:54:03 <andrew12> topi`: how did you get it fixed? or did you? :P
2369 2011-05-08 16:54:17 <diki> ;;gpg verify http://paste.pocoo.org/show/385257/
2370 2011-05-08 16:54:17 <gribble> Error: In order to authenticate, you must be present in one of the following channels: #bitcoin-otc
2371 2011-05-08 16:54:21 <topi`> i think i had libboost 1.43 and i should have had 1.46
2372 2011-05-08 16:54:55 <andrew12> hmm
2373 2011-05-08 16:54:56 <andrew12> "libboost1.46-dev set to manually installed."
2374 2011-05-08 16:55:47 <andrew12> gonna try removing libboost1.46-dev
2375 2011-05-08 16:55:51 <andrew12> then reinstalling
2376 2011-05-08 16:56:28 <andrew12> same error
2377 2011-05-08 16:57:50 <andrew12> why do you guys think this has anything to dowh boost?
2378 2011-05-08 16:58:13 <andrew12> do with*
2379 2011-05-08 16:58:51 <topi`> my problems were related with libboost versions
2380 2011-05-08 16:58:52 <topi`> definitely
2381 2011-05-08 16:59:09 <topi`> when I installed enough of *boost*-dev packages, then it eventually compiled
2382 2011-05-08 16:59:13 <andrew12> haha
2383 2011-05-08 16:59:24 * andrew12 apt-get install boost*-dev
2384 2011-05-08 16:59:43 <andrew12> jk
2385 2011-05-08 17:00:51 kimchi has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2386 2011-05-08 17:02:03 <andrew12> ah i think i found it
2387 2011-05-08 17:02:05 <andrew12> libboost1.46-all-dev
2388 2011-05-08 17:02:44 <andrew12> nope...
2389 2011-05-08 17:05:06 <andrew12> E: Package 'libdb4.7++-dev' has no installation candidate
2390 2011-05-08 17:05:44 <topi`> i manually installed libdb4.7++-dev
2391 2011-05-08 17:05:50 <andrew12> i'll do that then
2392 2011-05-08 17:06:55 NickelBot has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2393 2011-05-08 17:06:57 NickelBot5 has joined
2394 2011-05-08 17:07:19 NickelBot5 is now known as NickelBot
2395 2011-05-08 17:08:54 knotwork__ has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2396 2011-05-08 17:10:53 kcsrnd has quit (Changing host)
2397 2011-05-08 17:10:53 kcsrnd has joined
2398 2011-05-08 17:12:41 <BlueMatt> sipa: frankly, the patch was written by you and jgarzik, not so much by me so I think Ill leave jgarzik's name on there (plus Im too lazy to bother with making a new commit with mine)
2399 2011-05-08 17:13:00 <BlueMatt> and I suppose C++ copies for params then?
2400 2011-05-08 17:13:22 eao has joined
2401 2011-05-08 17:15:51 fimp has joined
2402 2011-05-08 17:18:02 FabianB_ has joined
2403 2011-05-08 17:18:46 FabianB has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2404 2011-05-08 17:18:47 <BlueMatt> sipa: nevermind, stupid me...oh well CCrypter now password as reference in ChangeWalletPass
2405 2011-05-08 17:18:58 <BlueMatt> s/password/passed/
2406 2011-05-08 17:19:17 B0g4r7 has joined
2407 2011-05-08 17:19:52 Marcel has left (HSD!~Marcel|HS@router2.hsdev.com|)
2408 2011-05-08 17:20:02 Marcel has joined
2409 2011-05-08 17:21:28 knotwork__ has joined
2410 2011-05-08 17:22:36 <luke-jr> TheKid: ?
2411 2011-05-08 17:27:47 <dinox> ;;getrating ErryDayImGenerat
2412 2011-05-08 17:27:48 <gribble> Error: This user has not yet been rated.
2413 2011-05-08 17:28:09 <ErryDayImGenerat> need an ing at the end
2414 2011-05-08 17:29:36 <nanotube> ;;ident ErryDayImGenerat
2415 2011-05-08 17:29:36 <gribble> Nick 'ErryDayImGenerat', with hostmask 'ErryDayImGenerat!~that@ool-44c4a592.dyn.optonline.net', is identified as user ErryDayImGenerating, with GPG key id 1278C1E1B2BAED71, and key fingerprint 972C38AF1404E354F33FAD031278C1E1B2BAED71.
2416 2011-05-08 17:29:40 <nanotube> dinox: ^
2417 2011-05-08 17:30:51 <dinox> nanotube: thanks :)
2418 2011-05-08 17:31:12 <BlueMatt> correct me if I'm wrong, but the "this tx needs fee" dialog is only for txes which would never be confirmed by nonmodified mines correct?
2419 2011-05-08 17:31:17 <BlueMatt> miners*
2420 2011-05-08 17:32:07 <tcatm> luke-jr: just got my first payments from your pool. works great :)
2421 2011-05-08 17:32:12 <nanotube> BlueMatt: not sure if it's 'never' or just "not until your inputs age"
2422 2011-05-08 17:32:26 <andrew12> ;;bc,calc 5000
2423 2011-05-08 17:32:27 <luke-jr> tcatm: how is it, relative to bc,gen?
2424 2011-05-08 17:32:27 <gribble> The average time to generate a block at 5000 Khps, given current difficulty of 109670.13329248 , is 2 years, 51 weeks, 3 days, 8 hours, 18 minutes, and 47 seconds
2425 2011-05-08 17:32:27 <BlueMatt> nanotube: ah, ok
2426 2011-05-08 17:32:36 <luke-jr> jgarzik:     "target" : "000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000fa98000000000000" -- why not difficulty 1?
2427 2011-05-08 17:32:44 <luke-jr> waut
2428 2011-05-08 17:32:50 <luke-jr> my bad, that's REAL difficulty :P
2429 2011-05-08 17:32:56 <tcatm> luke-jr: sample size too small
2430 2011-05-08 17:33:07 <andrew12> ;;bc,calcd 5000 25
2431 2011-05-08 17:33:07 <gribble> The average time to generate a block at 5000 Khps, given the supplied difficulty of 25, is 5 hours, 57 minutes, and 54 seconds
2432 2011-05-08 17:34:32 Blitzboom has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
2433 2011-05-08 17:36:44 <topi`> ;;bc,calcd 2100 1
2434 2011-05-08 17:36:44 <gribble> The average time to generate a block at 2100 Khps, given the supplied difficulty of 1, is 34 minutes and 5 seconds
2435 2011-05-08 17:37:10 Blitzboom has joined
2436 2011-05-08 17:37:11 Blitzboom has quit (Changing host)
2437 2011-05-08 17:37:11 Blitzboom has joined
2438 2011-05-08 17:37:23 <andrew12> ;;bc,calc 5000 1
2439 2011-05-08 17:37:24 <gribble> Error: invalid syntax (<string>, line 1)
2440 2011-05-08 17:37:28 <andrew12> ;;bc,calcd 5000 1
2441 2011-05-08 17:37:29 <gribble> The average time to generate a block at 5000 Khps, given the supplied difficulty of 1, is 14 minutes and 18 seconds
2442 2011-05-08 17:37:36 <topi`> i've had 7 accepts from lukejr's pool for the past 2 hours, so thats much less than 34 minutes interval
2443 2011-05-08 17:39:01 <andrew12> hmm
2444 2011-05-08 17:39:22 <andrew12> brb
2445 2011-05-08 17:42:31 <topi`> luke-jr: I suppose I will get my first payout from eligius only after i've crossed the magical 1.0 BTC limit? how about lowering the limit for us poor 2 Mhash/s guys?
2446 2011-05-08 17:42:40 <topi`> it'll take me like MONTHS to cross that
2447 2011-05-08 17:42:59 <topi`> ;;bc,calc 2100
2448 2011-05-08 17:43:00 <gribble> The average time to generate a block at 2100 Khps, given current difficulty of 109670.13329248 , is 7 years, 5 weeks, 6 days, 1 hour, 30 minutes, and 26 seconds
2449 2011-05-08 17:43:02 <luke-jr> topi`: as soon as the message signing feature gets standardized, it will be configurable
2450 2011-05-08 17:43:17 <luke-jr> topi`: in general, people spend amounts that would make a lower payout expensive
2451 2011-05-08 17:43:44 <topi`> so 7/50 = 0.14 years would be needed for me to generate 1.0 btc
2452 2011-05-08 17:44:11 <topi`> why is a lower payout expensive?
2453 2011-05-08 17:45:06 <luke-jr> because you have to pay a fee if you spend lots of pocket change
2454 2011-05-08 17:45:11 <luke-jr> ;;bc,gen 2000
2455 2011-05-08 17:45:11 AStove has joined
2456 2011-05-08 17:45:13 <gribble> The expected generation output, at 2000 Khps, given current difficulty of 109670.13329248 , is 0.0183427948958 BTC per day and 0.000764283120658 BTC per hour.
2457 2011-05-08 17:45:48 Cusipzzz has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
2458 2011-05-08 17:46:32 Xunie has joined
2459 2011-05-08 17:50:26 <lulzplzkthx> I'm having trouble installing Black Market, becuase of M2Crypto, has anybody had this problem / able to help? "import __m2crypto", "ImportError: DLL load failed: The operating system cannot run %1". I have the OpenSSL DLL's, and have reinstalled m2Crypto twice.
2460 2011-05-08 17:54:26 <BlueMatt> the solution: use linux ;)
2461 2011-05-08 17:54:37 <andrew12> heh
2462 2011-05-08 17:54:51 <BlueMatt> more realistically: use google as I have no fucking idea
2463 2011-05-08 17:55:17 <andrew12> lol
2464 2011-05-08 17:55:34 <genjix> i wrote that client but never tested it on windows :p
2465 2011-05-08 17:55:41 <EvanR> more realistically use linux
2466 2011-05-08 17:56:18 [DusT] has joined
2467 2011-05-08 17:56:28 eao has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
2468 2011-05-08 17:56:32 <genjix> lulzplzkthx: you need M2Crypto for python (which is a wrapper around OpenSSL)... maybe look into easy_install for python
2469 2011-05-08 17:56:46 lyspooner has joined
2470 2011-05-08 17:56:56 <lulzplzkthx> genjix: I have installed it though. More than once.
2471 2011-05-08 17:57:10 <lulzplzkthx> BlueMatt: I would except for my ClickPad hates Linux, and Google couldn't find it.
2472 2011-05-08 17:57:52 <BlueMatt> well it probably either doesnt work on win32 then, or the problem lies in location of ddls/PATH enviroment variable being set/handled correctly by python
2473 2011-05-08 17:58:34 eao has joined
2474 2011-05-08 17:58:47 <lulzplzkthx> I'm on 64-bit, and have 64-bit OpenSSL libraries, but 32-bit M2Crypto I just realized. I think that's my problem.
2475 2011-05-08 18:02:16 skyewm has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2476 2011-05-08 18:02:39 n0n0 has joined
2477 2011-05-08 18:03:26 hendi has joined
2478 2011-05-08 18:05:42 Cusipzzz has joined
2479 2011-05-08 18:09:44 <andrew12> woo, 6Mhash
2480 2011-05-08 18:10:20 lovecastle has joined
2481 2011-05-08 18:10:26 fimp has quit (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep)
2482 2011-05-08 18:11:02 ArtForzZz has joined
2483 2011-05-08 18:11:14 <andrew12> o/ ArtForzZz
2484 2011-05-08 18:11:38 <luke-jr> cosurgi: we're past 30 GH
2485 2011-05-08 18:11:38 <luke-jr> ;;bc,eligius
2486 2011-05-08 18:11:39 <gribble> 33114197.8522
2487 2011-05-08 18:11:50 <Blitzboom> ;;bc,calc [bc,eligius]
2488 2011-05-08 18:11:52 <gribble> The average time to generate a block at 33114197.8522 Khps, given current difficulty of 109670.13329248 , is 3 hours, 57 minutes, and 4 seconds
2489 2011-05-08 18:11:57 <Blitzboom> that’s better
2490 2011-05-08 18:13:51 <cosurgi> luke-jr: great :) I'll be back soon. I'm testing tycho's if he has the same problem with getowrks
2491 2011-05-08 18:13:55 ArtForz has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2492 2011-05-08 18:14:09 <BlueMatt> luke-jr: when can I get a "Payout now" button on your pool?
2493 2011-05-08 18:14:28 <luke-jr> BlueMatt: when message signing is standardized
2494 2011-05-08 18:14:58 <BlueMatt> arg
2495 2011-05-08 18:17:03 <forrestv> is there any alternative to getblockbycount when using the stock bitcoind?
2496 2011-05-08 18:21:19 <tcatm> forrestv: what are you trying to do?
2497 2011-05-08 18:21:52 <forrestv> tcatm, write a pool server
2498 2011-05-08 18:22:14 <tcatm> what do you need getblockcount for?
2499 2011-05-08 18:23:48 <forrestv> good point, though i might need it later
2500 2011-05-08 18:24:06 <forrestv> looking at data stored in the block chain
2501 2011-05-08 18:24:21 n0n0 has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
2502 2011-05-08 18:24:35 gjs278 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2503 2011-05-08 18:25:46 <topi`> luke-jr: what's that message signing all about?
2504 2011-05-08 18:25:47 gjs278 has joined
2505 2011-05-08 18:26:08 <molecular> is there a way to avoid writing "self." all the time in python?
2506 2011-05-08 18:26:13 <luke-jr> topi`: it allows you to sign an arbitrary message with your address
2507 2011-05-08 18:26:33 <luke-jr> topi`: since addresses are accounts on my pool, I can verify changes to settings that way
2508 2011-05-08 18:26:42 <topi`> molecular: you could assign it to shorter, but don't do it (for the sake of understandability)
2509 2011-05-08 18:26:54 <luke-jr> molecular: #define s self
2510 2011-05-08 18:27:17 <molecular> topi`, thanks, will keep using self. then
2511 2011-05-08 18:27:47 <topi`> molecular: I agree that it's a PITA to repeat the 'self' a zillion times, but it would just confuse ppl who thought they knew python if it were something else
2512 2011-05-08 18:28:17 devon_hillard has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2513 2011-05-08 18:28:33 <molecular> in modula or something other weird one could at least do something like: "with self { ... }"
2514 2011-05-08 18:28:40 <topi`> when you write the code you could write like S.id = foo and then use search-replace (or a macro processor) to change that to self.
2515 2011-05-08 18:29:01 <topi`> the "with" syntax is also new for python 2.7
2516 2011-05-08 18:29:02 <molecular> pipe it through sed in release script ;)
2517 2011-05-08 18:29:14 <molecular> topi`, ah, really?
2518 2011-05-08 18:29:31 <topi`> oh, "with" only goes into try/finally clauses
2519 2011-05-08 18:29:37 <topi`> I had to read the PEP to be sure ;)
2520 2011-05-08 18:29:41 <topi`> http://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0343/
2521 2011-05-08 18:29:59 <tcatm> molecular: "self" in python makes a lot of sense. it wouldn't work without it.
2522 2011-05-08 18:30:58 <molecular> i'm not really deep into python.. so I'll just take it as a given and use self
2523 2011-05-08 18:32:04 x5x is now known as x5x`brb
2524 2011-05-08 18:32:12 Marcel has left (HSD!~Marcel|HS@router2.hsdev.com|)
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2530 2011-05-08 18:43:06 <nanotube> tcatm: well technically, you could call 'self' any other name. since methods take the argument explicitly, you could do def somemethod(me, somearg) instead of 'self' and it'd work just as well. :)
2531 2011-05-08 18:43:24 <nanotube> just have to remember to refer to it as 'me' in the method. :)
2532 2011-05-08 18:43:59 <andrew12> or you could pretend to be using java and use "this" instead of "self"
2533 2011-05-08 18:44:03 <tcatm> yes. but you need a variable for "self"
2534 2011-05-08 18:45:16 <forrestv> def method(_, a, b):
2535 2011-05-08 18:46:18 <genjix> cool _ looks nice
2536 2011-05-08 18:46:54 <andrew12> or you could use ruby and not even bother with self at all :P
2537 2011-05-08 18:47:38 RazielZ has quit (Quit: Leaving)
2538 2011-05-08 18:48:28 Xunie has quit (Quit: Can God microwave a taco so hot that not even *HE* can eat it without burns?)
2539 2011-05-08 18:48:29 <topi`> andrew12: how do you separate in-object variables from the others in ruby then?
2540 2011-05-08 18:48:40 <tcatm> andrew12: and lose some features :)
2541 2011-05-08 18:48:50 <andrew12> @variables are instance variables
2542 2011-05-08 18:49:09 <topi`> bah, more syntactic sugar
2543 2011-05-08 18:49:18 <tcatm> #define @ self. ?
2544 2011-05-08 18:49:24 <andrew12> no... lol
2545 2011-05-08 18:49:37 fimp has joined
2546 2011-05-08 18:49:38 <andrew12> one sec
2547 2011-05-08 18:51:47 <andrew12> http://codepad.org/e7sAxLYP
2548 2011-05-08 18:52:17 * molecular feels ashamed for starting language war
2549 2011-05-08 18:52:49 <andrew12> if you just want to be able to set variables for everything you can use openstruct
2550 2011-05-08 18:52:53 <tcatm> andrew12: looks like #define @ self.
2551 2011-05-08 18:53:17 <molecular> wouldn you have to write "@.var" (with a colon?)
2552 2011-05-08 18:53:43 <jrmithdobbs> wtf is the equiv of /stats p on freenode? they've sure fucked their rfc compliance even further since last time i got glined
2553 2011-05-08 18:53:52 <tcatm> yep, but that's just syntatic sugar
2554 2011-05-08 18:54:03 <andrew12> http://codepad.org/TDsSa8sS
2555 2011-05-08 18:54:09 <andrew12> molecular: no
2556 2011-05-08 18:54:23 <molecular> got it, but that (#define @ self.) is just preposterous
2557 2011-05-08 18:54:37 <andrew12> i have no idea what you mean by #define @ self.
2558 2011-05-08 18:54:50 <andrew12> wait
2559 2011-05-08 18:54:53 <andrew12> no
2560 2011-05-08 18:55:07 <molecular> it doesn't work as expected, though
2561 2011-05-08 18:55:59 <andrew12> http://codepad.org/z4O6Nt0l
2562 2011-05-08 18:56:04 <ArtForzZz> well, now I know why that guy doesn't want to release source: http://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=7017.0
2563 2011-05-08 18:56:43 <tcatm> ArtForzZz: redirects getwork?
2564 2011-05-08 18:56:48 <ArtForzZz> written in LiveCode
2565 2011-05-08 18:56:59 skyewm has joined
2566 2011-05-08 18:57:02 <tcatm> livewhat?
2567 2011-05-08 18:57:10 <ArtForzZz> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RunRev
2568 2011-05-08 18:57:18 <ArtForzZz> basically crossplatform hypercard
2569 2011-05-08 18:58:41 vorlov has quit (Quit: vorlov)
2570 2011-05-08 18:58:57 <ArtForzZz> extracting the source (well, really de-tokenizing it) would be trivial, but then I'd probably need brain bleach
2571 2011-05-08 18:59:20 <jrmithdobbs> lol, ya that's nasty
2572 2011-05-08 19:00:10 * tcatm tried to find sample code for that language but couldn't find any. I guess I shouldn't look further..
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2586 2011-05-08 19:22:32 <LobsterMan> ;;bc,stats
2587 2011-05-08 19:22:34 <gribble> Current Blocks: 122712 | Current Difficulty: 109670.13329248 | Next Difficulty At Block: 122975 | Next Difficulty In: 263 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 day, 5 hours, 57 minutes, and 10 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 153812.67676439
2588 2011-05-08 19:22:38 <topi`> I still prefer python's approach to use "self" to refer to local vars, so its meaning is easily understandable, entirely unlike some special markup that needs to be known beforehand.
2589 2011-05-08 19:23:40 <topi`> 08/05/2011 21:02:48, 24c13dd1, invalid or stale
2590 2011-05-08 19:23:40 <topi`> 08/05/2011 21:02:48, long poll: new block 00002cb06e54a34c
2591 2011-05-08 19:24:00 <topi`> I guess this block was stale because the long poll did not notice the new block in time? (using lukejr's pool)
2592 2011-05-08 19:24:03 <anarchyx> is there a way to config the pcie multiplier through linux? i got the asus p6t7 but cant find the multiplier setting
2593 2011-05-08 19:24:12 <anarchyx> want to set them all to 1x
2594 2011-05-08 19:24:42 <ArtForzZz> nope
2595 2011-05-08 19:24:45 <JuanDaugherty> is there some chart someplace of btc traded for currency, the actual transaction not the bid/ask designation in bt transactions?
2596 2011-05-08 19:25:22 <ArtForzZz> I was quite surprised, there is *no* provisions for forcing smaller link widths in the PCIe spec
2597 2011-05-08 19:25:40 <JuanDaugherty> and/or a stmnt about cashin/cashout
2598 2011-05-08 19:25:49 <anarchyx> strange
2599 2011-05-08 19:25:53 <ArtForzZz> at least you can force a 5GT/s gen2 link to 2.5GT gen1 speeds
2600 2011-05-08 19:26:32 <ArtForzZz> but no way to override link width autoneg
2601 2011-05-08 19:26:45 <anarchyx> btw ArtForz how come your cost per G/hash is so low.. do you still have the heating combo going? :)
2602 2011-05-08 19:26:52 <ArtForzZz> nope
2603 2011-05-08 19:26:58 <anarchyx> maybe now its airconditioning? :P
2604 2011-05-08 19:27:01 <ArtForzZz> adding ASIC miners
2605 2011-05-08 19:27:07 skyewm has joined
2606 2011-05-08 19:27:13 <ArtForzZz> ~25Mh/J
2607 2011-05-08 19:27:30 vorlov has quit (Quit: vorlov)
2608 2011-05-08 19:27:34 <anarchyx> interesting..
2609 2011-05-08 19:27:43 <anarchyx> so you just custom make them now?
2610 2011-05-08 19:27:56 <ArtForzZz> yep
2611 2011-05-08 19:28:01 <ArtForzZz> more than a 10x reduction in power consumption compared to the equivalent in GPUs
2612 2011-05-08 19:28:05 <ArtForzZz> and a lot more dense
2613 2011-05-08 19:28:14 <phantomcircuit> ArtForzZz, you should concentrate the heat and run it through a turbine
2614 2011-05-08 19:28:15 <phantomcircuit> xD
2615 2011-05-08 19:28:16 <ArtForzZz> 6.4Ghps in 2U
2616 2011-05-08 19:28:25 * phantomcircuit ignores the laws of thermodynamics
2617 2011-05-08 19:28:33 <anarchyx> do you have any public designs or looking for partnership investments?
2618 2011-05-08 19:28:46 * ArtForzZz hands phantomcircuit maxwell's demon
2619 2011-05-08 19:29:03 <phantomcircuit> LAWS ARE FOR SQUARES
2620 2011-05-08 19:29:10 <phantomcircuit> YOU'RE NOT A SQUARE RIGHT?!
2621 2011-05-08 19:30:53 <ArtForzZz> anarchyx: not really, the only obvious "next step up" would be std cell ASICs, and there we're in the $M NRE range
2622 2011-05-08 19:31:32 <lulzplzkthx> lol heat -> turbine
2623 2011-05-08 19:31:39 jrmithdobbs has quit (Quit: leaving)
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2626 2011-05-08 19:32:16 <ArtForzZz> currently I'm experimenting with FPGAs
2627 2011-05-08 19:32:34 <ArtForzZz> not quite as fast or efficient, but reprogrammable
2628 2011-05-08 19:32:50 jrmithdobbs has joined
2629 2011-05-08 19:33:07 <phantomcircuit> ArtForzZz, what's the point of reprogrammable?
2630 2011-05-08 19:33:12 <topi`> ArtForzZz: at what clocks do the fastest FPGAs run nowadays?
2631 2011-05-08 19:33:19 <ArtForzZz> topi`: pretty fast
2632 2011-05-08 19:33:23 <topi`> when I was programming them at the university, we got 80mhz fpgas
2633 2011-05-08 19:33:27 <gjs278> in case he puts a 1 where a 0 should be on accident
2634 2011-05-08 19:33:29 <topi`> from xiling
2635 2011-05-08 19:33:31 <topi`> xilinx
2636 2011-05-08 19:33:35 <phantomcircuit> gjs278, heh
2637 2011-05-08 19:33:43 <ArtForzZz> I'm getting ~160MHz out of cheap spartan6s
2638 2011-05-08 19:33:50 <ArtForzZz> well, "cheap"
2639 2011-05-08 19:34:01 <ArtForzZz> ~ $150 for the chip
2640 2011-05-08 19:34:02 <phantomcircuit> and how many hash operations / cycle
2641 2011-05-08 19:34:03 <jrmithdobbs> ArtForzZz: how many hash/s you get off those asics?
2642 2011-05-08 19:34:09 <ArtForzZz> phantomcircuit: 0.5
2643 2011-05-08 19:34:13 <ArtForzZz> so 80Mhps
2644 2011-05-08 19:34:23 <ArtForzZz> at 4.2W
2645 2011-05-08 19:34:25 <jrmithdobbs> ArtForzZz: what's the cost per?
2646 2011-05-08 19:34:26 <phantomcircuit> isn't a spartan6 like 3 grand?
2647 2011-05-08 19:34:26 <topi`> that means it's massively pipelined?
2648 2011-05-08 19:34:32 <ArtForzZz> yep
2649 2011-05-08 19:34:40 <topi`> so you get a hash out every second cycle?
2650 2011-05-08 19:34:42 <phantomcircuit> so you're investing long term
2651 2011-05-08 19:34:46 <phantomcircuit> id rather have a 5870
2652 2011-05-08 19:34:54 <phantomcircuit> i can still play civ5 with it
2653 2011-05-08 19:34:55 <phantomcircuit> xD
2654 2011-05-08 19:34:56 <xenon481> Electricity -> Mining -> Heat -> Water -> Turbine -> Electricity Repeat
2655 2011-05-08 19:35:03 <xenon481> Infinity!
2656 2011-05-08 19:35:06 <xenon481> =-D
2657 2011-05-08 19:35:12 <lulzplzkthx> Water?
2658 2011-05-08 19:35:14 <phantomcircuit> i should get solar panels here
2659 2011-05-08 19:35:16 <lulzplzkthx> Why water, just use the heat.
2660 2011-05-08 19:35:24 <xenon481> Water cooling
2661 2011-05-08 19:35:26 <phantomcircuit> san francisco is dumb as shit and will subsidize the hell out of them
2662 2011-05-08 19:35:32 <lulzplzkthx> Water cooling would ruin the heat
2663 2011-05-08 19:35:39 <jrmithdobbs> ArtForzZz: we're looking to get initial investment back and then are going to get an ee friend involved and attempt an fpga implementation
2664 2011-05-08 19:35:39 <lulzplzkthx> The heat you need to spin the turbine
2665 2011-05-08 19:35:40 <phantomcircuit> but they dont subsidize the battery system, but if i had constant load...
2666 2011-05-08 19:35:42 <jrmithdobbs> (not a joke)
2667 2011-05-08 19:35:45 <BlueMatt> phantomcircuit: yay for exploiting govt stupidity :)
2668 2011-05-08 19:35:50 <jrmithdobbs> ArtForzZz: will be fun
2669 2011-05-08 19:35:54 <ArtForzZz> jrmithdobbs: for the ASICs, 200Mhps each, about $300 ea. including support components,PCBs,case,...
2670 2011-05-08 19:36:07 <ArtForzZz> for the FPGA stuff: have fun. the tools are *awful*
2671 2011-05-08 19:36:24 <jrmithdobbs> ArtForzZz: we know, he works with them already on a daily basis at his day job, heh
2672 2011-05-08 19:36:31 <ArtForzZz> yep
2673 2011-05-08 19:36:36 <topi`> ArtForzZz: potentially you could put many, many asics on one circuit board
2674 2011-05-08 19:36:40 <xenon481> lulzplzkthx, no the water would pull the heat from the GPUs, thus both cooling them and providing motion for the turbine.
2675 2011-05-08 19:37:02 <ArtForzZz> jrmithdobbs: actually for this they're even more awful than usual
2676 2011-05-08 19:37:06 <topi`> ArtForzZz: what kind of a bus would you choose for the asics? I am thinking of a SPI bus but maybe something faster
2677 2011-05-08 19:37:29 <ArtForzZz> I basically used SPI w/ 40 bit words
2678 2011-05-08 19:37:32 Marcel has joined
2679 2011-05-08 19:37:35 <jrmithdobbs> ArtForzZz: oh ya? we hadn't thought about asics until I saw you mentioning them, we may reeval plans ;P
2680 2011-05-08 19:37:37 <topi`> right
2681 2011-05-08 19:37:53 <jrmithdobbs> pretty similar upfront costs tbqh
2682 2011-05-08 19:37:59 <lulzplzkthx> xenon481: Why not use the water for a hydroelectric setup?
2683 2011-05-08 19:38:02 <ArtForzZz> to what?
2684 2011-05-08 19:38:09 <xenon481> that's what it is
2685 2011-05-08 19:38:20 <jrmithdobbs> ArtForzZz: asic vs fpga in hardware costs
2686 2011-05-08 19:38:20 <ArtForzZz> similar upfront costs for ASIC and FPGA? on what planet?
2687 2011-05-08 19:38:29 <lulzplzkthx> I see. Well that's different than the contentrated heat plan.
2688 2011-05-08 19:38:31 <lulzplzkthx> :P
2689 2011-05-08 19:38:40 <jrmithdobbs> ArtForzZz: for what we'd have to pay the guy doing it it is for us.
2690 2011-05-08 19:39:00 <ArtForzZz> still sounds realllly weird
2691 2011-05-08 19:39:01 <jrmithdobbs> we don't have expertise in hardware stuff ourselves :(
2692 2011-05-08 19:39:18 <jrmithdobbs> i may well have done the math wrong
2693 2011-05-08 19:39:32 <jrmithdobbs> anyways, just sayin thanks for the idea
2694 2011-05-08 19:39:35 <ArtForzZz> unless you'Re talking about some stone-age ASIC process
2695 2011-05-08 19:40:16 <ArtForzZz> any modern process has NRE in the $M range
2696 2011-05-08 19:40:54 phantomcircuit has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
2697 2011-05-08 19:41:36 <jrmithdobbs> oh wow, ya was way off on the math
2698 2011-05-08 19:41:42 <jrmithdobbs> haha
2699 2011-05-08 19:42:39 <jrmithdobbs> ya we'll be sticking with fpga initially then, lol
2700 2011-05-08 19:43:19 <ArtForzZz> yep, FPGA has another huge benefit, you can incrementally improve the design even after you have hardware
2701 2011-05-08 19:44:44 <ArtForzZz> I think for the FPGAs I spent more time forcing map/place to not be stupid than actually writing HDL
2702 2011-05-08 19:46:15 <ArtForzZz> letting map auto-place a large pipelined core usually == horrible placement
2703 2011-05-08 19:46:51 <ArtForzZz> just loves painting itself into a corner
2704 2011-05-08 19:48:14 <ArtForzZz> FPGA tools simply arent designed for dealing with a large pipelined engine taking up 70% of the chip
2705 2011-05-08 19:48:45 <ArtForzZz> and doing more smaller engines doesn't really improve things much either
2706 2011-05-08 19:48:53 Teslah has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
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2710 2011-05-08 19:52:55 <fabianhjr> jgarzik: Hi, how are you?
2711 2011-05-08 19:53:05 <fabianhjr> Any trend right now?
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2721 2011-05-08 20:15:23 <CIA-30> bitcoin: Chris Howie * rdd782a10f11f mining-proxy/htdocs/ (4 files in 3 dirs): Fix errors caused by using the same query parameter multiple times http://tinyurl.com/4xtouq9
2722 2011-05-08 20:22:40 <diki> i have to ask...but how exactly does the miner know if a hash is a valid block?
2723 2011-05-08 20:22:46 <diki> in fact how is a block defined?
2724 2011-05-08 20:22:57 <BlueMatt> there is no block
2725 2011-05-08 20:23:11 <lfm> there is a "target" hash that the hash of the block needs to be below
2726 2011-05-08 20:23:12 <diki> ok the winning hash that gives you 50 btc
2727 2011-05-08 20:23:39 warpi has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2728 2011-05-08 20:23:46 <diki> more elaboration?
2729 2011-05-08 20:24:37 Aahzmundus has joined
2730 2011-05-08 20:24:38 <lfm> the miner hashes the 80 byte block header which produces a 32 byte hash. the hash is compared to the target and if it is below then it is good.
2731 2011-05-08 20:25:10 <lfm> each attempt increments the nonce till a good hash is found
2732 2011-05-08 20:26:09 <lfm> the target is defined based on the difficulty
2733 2011-05-08 20:26:43 skyewm has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2734 2011-05-08 20:27:04 <lfm> ya follow?
2735 2011-05-08 20:28:51 fabianhjr has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
2736 2011-05-08 20:28:56 <lfm> the block header has fields for the hash of the previous block and a hash of the transactions to be included in the block and a timestamp and the nonce
2737 2011-05-08 20:29:29 <genjix> da2ce7: hey
2738 2011-05-08 20:29:34 <genjix> da2ce7: around?
2739 2011-05-08 20:29:51 <lfm> ;;seen da2ce7
2740 2011-05-08 20:29:51 <gribble> da2ce7 was last seen in #bitcoin-dev 4 hours, 42 minutes, and 52 seconds ago: <da2ce7> it is now MUCH harder to take down mtgox
2741 2011-05-08 20:30:28 chmod755 has joined
2742 2011-05-08 20:30:56 <genjix> thanks lfm :)
2743 2011-05-08 20:31:19 <genjix> chmod755: XD I always use this permission all the time
2744 2011-05-08 20:31:23 <genjix> chmod 755 myfile
2745 2011-05-08 20:31:40 <molecular> ;;seen MagicalTux
2746 2011-05-08 20:31:40 <diki> 777
2747 2011-05-08 20:31:40 <gribble> MagicalTux was last seen in #bitcoin-dev 4 days, 5 hours, 57 minutes, and 59 seconds ago: <MagicalTux> well, just a simple crappy bitcoin protocol implementation in php
2748 2011-05-08 20:31:58 <molecular> uh, who's running mtgox again?
2749 2011-05-08 20:32:07 <chmod755> molecular: MagicalTux
2750 2011-05-08 20:32:21 <molecular> ah, ok, then I msged the right guy about the trading api, phew.
2751 2011-05-08 20:32:27 <chmod755> diki: 7777?
2752 2011-05-08 20:32:39 <genjix> well jed still owns the bank accounts afaik
2753 2011-05-08 20:32:51 TD has joined
2754 2011-05-08 20:37:14 devon_hillard has joined
2755 2011-05-08 20:37:45 hendi has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2756 2011-05-08 20:38:14 fimp has quit (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep)
2757 2011-05-08 20:38:59 <jrmithdobbs> diki: basically, it's a lottery. first person with a resultant hash under the target wins.
2758 2011-05-08 20:43:20 knotwork_ has joined
2759 2011-05-08 20:43:23 <diki> i really want to make my school's computers a farm. im gonna have to count on a USB drive and autoplay
2760 2011-05-08 20:43:36 <jrmithdobbs> diki: that is illegal. do not do it.
2761 2011-05-08 20:43:45 <diki> may be illegal in the USA
2762 2011-05-08 20:43:54 <diki> but here i can do whatever i want...and no one will complain
2763 2011-05-08 20:44:02 <jrmithdobbs> diki: it's illegal in any country that has any computer law at all
2764 2011-05-08 20:44:14 <diki> Believe me, nothing will happen ;)
2765 2011-05-08 20:44:31 <diki> the pcs are shit anyway
2766 2011-05-08 20:44:32 <jrmithdobbs> diki: and even without draconian computer laws it is still theft/theft of services based on power consumption alone
2767 2011-05-08 20:44:39 <jrmithdobbs> they will care hwen their power bill quadruples
2768 2011-05-08 20:44:45 <diki> they pack a dual core intel and a 8400 nvidia
2769 2011-05-08 20:44:47 <jrmithdobbs> they will notice.
2770 2011-05-08 20:45:07 NickelBot has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
2771 2011-05-08 20:45:10 <diki> they migh see a virus, they wont see bitcoin
2772 2011-05-08 20:45:14 <diki> it will be silent
2773 2011-05-08 20:45:23 <diki> >:)
2774 2011-05-08 20:45:29 <jrmithdobbs> you will get caught, you are stupid for doing this, you have been warned.
2775 2011-05-08 20:45:58 <diki> all i need to do is plug in a USB in each PC
2776 2011-05-08 20:46:02 NickelBot has joined
2777 2011-05-08 20:46:06 <diki> autoplay will take care of the rest..if it's enabled
2778 2011-05-08 20:46:12 bacon has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2779 2011-05-08 20:46:16 <jrmithdobbs> uh huh, and each of those pcs needs to connect back to your bitcoind which is traceable
2780 2011-05-08 20:46:24 knotwork__ has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2781 2011-05-08 20:46:27 <jrmithdobbs> so, you will get caught. do not do this.
2782 2011-05-08 20:46:39 <diki> might be, but....most people would reinstall windows
2783 2011-05-08 20:47:13 <jrmithdobbs> doesn't matter. still illegal. still stupid. you will be caught. it is only a factor of time.
2784 2011-05-08 20:47:50 <diki> And why so concerned about me?
2785 2011-05-08 20:47:59 <jrmithdobbs> i'm not.
2786 2011-05-08 20:48:19 <jrmithdobbs> diki: someone seems to ask this about 2-3 times every 24 hours.
2787 2011-05-08 20:48:35 skyewm has joined
2788 2011-05-08 20:48:51 <diki> about?
2789 2011-05-08 20:48:55 <jrmithdobbs> diki: ps: you also just admitted guilt on a public website by discussing it in here. seriously, do not do it.
2790 2011-05-08 20:49:22 <jrmithdobbs> diki: running miners on machines they are not authorized to
2791 2011-05-08 20:49:37 <diki> They are asking, i have the ability to do it
2792 2011-05-08 20:50:15 <lfm> besides nvidia 8400 are so slow you couls beat em with pancil and paper
2793 2011-05-08 20:50:30 <diki> combined they might do something
2794 2011-05-08 20:50:41 <diki> either way, they increase my chance
2795 2011-05-08 20:50:47 <lfm> combined they might beat a ball point
2796 2011-05-08 20:50:50 <jrmithdobbs> diki: you need so many of them that they WILL notice the power usage jump
2797 2011-05-08 20:50:53 <jrmithdobbs> seriously
2798 2011-05-08 20:51:03 <BurtyB> computer misuse for personal financial gain... oh dear
2799 2011-05-08 20:51:06 <Aahzmundus> diki: you would get better results picking up an old 4850 on ebay then getting a crappy computer lab mining
2800 2011-05-08 20:51:21 <jrmithdobbs> BurtyB: fraud, theft of services, unauthorized computer access ... the list goes on and on ;P
2801 2011-05-08 20:51:40 <diki> In the US one might get caught for stuff like this...but here people dont just care
2802 2011-05-08 20:52:03 <jrmithdobbs> diki: also, remember, your packets are crossing internatial borders. you are not only liable in your country of origin.
2803 2011-05-08 20:52:03 <lfm> diki if they dont care then ask em if its ok
2804 2011-05-08 20:52:06 <Aahzmundus> Where is it that energy costs arent an issue?
2805 2011-05-08 20:52:56 <diki> How about this. A small application will monitor for a command from me, in which it will: stop the miner and set a timeframe in which it will run
2806 2011-05-08 20:53:05 <diki> a remote command
2807 2011-05-08 20:53:17 <jrmithdobbs> Aahzmundus: he seems to think they don't in bulgaria
2808 2011-05-08 20:53:20 <ErryDayImGenerat> your using public resources for personal gain
2809 2011-05-08 20:53:36 <lfm> diki better to use a deam man switch, they wont run unless they see a command from you every day
2810 2011-05-08 20:53:37 <ErryDayImGenerat> stealing from the gov't, basically
2811 2011-05-08 20:53:42 <BurtyB> diki why not just ask for permissions and wait for them to say no.. it would save you all the hastle of thinking how to get away with it befor getting caught
2812 2011-05-08 20:53:47 <Aahzmundus> so they have fusion in bulgaria?
2813 2011-05-08 20:54:12 <diki> Mice and keyboards sometimes get snatched from those PCs...no one was caught. Not that i did it tho
2814 2011-05-08 20:54:39 <BurtyB> diki a few quid for a kb/mouse is nothing vs the electric costs
2815 2011-05-08 20:54:42 <jrmithdobbs> diki: stealing cheap mice/keyboards and increasing power costs by a factor of 4 are very different things.
2816 2011-05-08 20:54:49 <lfm> diki so the fact that theives exist means its ok for you to be a theif?
2817 2011-05-08 20:55:03 bk128 has quit (Quit: bk128)
2818 2011-05-08 20:55:09 <diki> Im no thief. The thing is those PCs are more energy efficient even at load
2819 2011-05-08 20:55:16 <diki> there are no powerful cards
2820 2011-05-08 20:55:19 <diki> or CPUs
2821 2011-05-08 20:55:26 <ErryDayImGenerat> quit trying to justify stealing
2822 2011-05-08 20:55:27 <jrmithdobbs> BurtyB: i love people who have never run datacenters' thoughts on computer power consumption (or lack thereof, usually)
2823 2011-05-08 20:55:31 <ErryDayImGenerat> that's not why this is here
2824 2011-05-08 20:55:33 <lfm> diki you want to steal electric power and the use of the machines
2825 2011-05-08 20:55:37 <BurtyB> oh how I larf... efficient doesnt mean it's not going to cost them shedloads more
2826 2011-05-08 20:55:50 <diki> The school is going down anywya
2827 2011-05-08 20:55:53 <diki> *anyway
2828 2011-05-08 20:55:59 <ErryDayImGenerat> my toilet is flush efficient it's still 2 gallons a flush
2829 2011-05-08 20:56:01 <diki> I predict it will bankrupt in a few years
2830 2011-05-08 20:56:23 <lfm> diki so you should speed up the bankrupcy?
2831 2011-05-08 20:56:31 <jrmithdobbs> diki: whether you agree or not this is, at the least, theft and/or theft of services, you've been warned. good luck.
2832 2011-05-08 20:56:37 <diki> yeah...why not
2833 2011-05-08 20:56:51 alystair has joined
2834 2011-05-08 20:56:59 <lfm> diki dont kidd yourself, it is theft
2835 2011-05-08 20:57:02 <diki> hardly any students...
2836 2011-05-08 20:57:02 <ErryDayImGenerat> and eventually diki, you will die- does that make it okay to steal from you?
2837 2011-05-08 20:57:16 <jrmithdobbs> or kill you
2838 2011-05-08 20:57:19 <jrmithdobbs> for that matter
2839 2011-05-08 20:57:31 <jrmithdobbs> if you're gonna throw the straw man at least go for the full embelishment!
2840 2011-05-08 20:58:39 <lfm> your rationalizations wont save you if they catch you
2841 2011-05-08 20:59:37 zyb has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
2842 2011-05-08 20:59:47 <diki> if they catch me, the most they would do is...give me the equivalent of an F grade and/or pay the electricity bills
2843 2011-05-08 21:00:04 <ArtForzZz> lol
2844 2011-05-08 21:01:06 <lfm> diki well we warned you. you decide for yourself of course
2845 2011-05-08 21:01:19 <molecular> diki, hehe. what's an F-grade compared to having BTC?
2846 2011-05-08 21:01:28 <genjix> diki: full steam ahead imo
2847 2011-05-08 21:01:38 <genjix> mining protects the bitcoin network
2848 2011-05-08 21:01:54 <lfm> the machines he described will be lucky to find anything ever
2849 2011-05-08 21:01:57 <diki> and the bitcoin network protects the miner :P
2850 2011-05-08 21:02:25 <molecular> lfm, so? people play the lottery, too
2851 2011-05-08 21:02:36 <genjix> am i correct in thinking that just keeping a non-mining client open helps protect the network?
2852 2011-05-08 21:02:50 <ArtForzZz> not much really
2853 2011-05-08 21:02:57 <ArtForzZz> we have plenty of nodes
2854 2011-05-08 21:02:57 <lfm> ya he might get caught and not get any btc
2855 2011-05-08 21:03:01 <genjix> because it will help protect against bad blocks/tx being propagated
2856 2011-05-08 21:03:13 <luke-jr> who wants to modify the wx client to allow overriding the default fees?
2857 2011-05-08 21:03:18 <genjix> kk
2858 2011-05-08 21:03:20 <ArtForzZz> well, if the node werent there it also wouldnt propagate them ...
2859 2011-05-08 21:03:42 <genjix> yeah but another 'bad' node might hold the connection instead
2860 2011-05-08 21:03:49 <ArtForzZz> really, 99% of nodes run the same code currently
2861 2011-05-08 21:03:54 <genjix> i'm honest therefore i am
2862 2011-05-08 21:04:03 <ArtForzZz> if an attacker can sibyl that easily, a few 100 won't make a difference
2863 2011-05-08 21:04:05 <diki> If i am going to put anything into production i will of course test it first. It won't be put usb drive and start mining away with gui open, no it will be a hidden process
2864 2011-05-08 21:04:09 <jrmithdobbs> genjix: i ran the math on what it would take to use ec2 instances to "control" the network a week ago or so
2865 2011-05-08 21:04:10 <jrmithdobbs> genjix: it's hilarious prohibitive
2866 2011-05-08 21:04:22 <genjix> jrmithdobbs: link to that math?
2867 2011-05-08 21:04:25 <genjix> i want to see it
2868 2011-05-08 21:04:31 <ArtForzZz> jrmithdobbs: he's talking about a sybil attack
2869 2011-05-08 21:04:31 <diki> turned on/off based on time via a registry call or some kind of pause
2870 2011-05-08 21:04:50 <jrmithdobbs> genjix: i threw it away afterwards because of how hilarious it was
2871 2011-05-08 21:04:58 <genjix> yep i'm talking about lessening a sybil attack
2872 2011-05-08 21:05:08 <jrmithdobbs> genjix: talking ~150billion to be able to do it within an hour iirc
2873 2011-05-08 21:05:22 <ArtForzZz> genjix: again, it's simply a war of resources
2874 2011-05-08 21:05:30 <genjix> ok
2875 2011-05-08 21:05:31 <jrmithdobbs> genjix: because you need 80% of nodes and you need to be able to gen blocks to take advantage of it
2876 2011-05-08 21:05:48 <ArtForzZz> except getting a few 100k IPs is a lot easier than getting a few Thps
2877 2011-05-08 21:06:04 BurtyBB has joined
2878 2011-05-08 21:06:24 <genjix> one of my fears for bitcoin is a malicious entity dumping say 5 billion to destroy bitcoin when it's an 1 billion economy
2879 2011-05-08 21:06:39 <diki> it's in the millions i believe, but not billions
2880 2011-05-08 21:06:50 <genjix> not sure how feasible that is. but im assured it's highly illegal
2881 2011-05-08 21:06:52 <jrmithdobbs> genjix: well, like i said, it'd take in the range of $150 billion usd right now, while the market is worth what, 6mil?
2882 2011-05-08 21:07:12 <genjix> oh really? have you got a link to those calculations?
2883 2011-05-08 21:07:13 <ArtForzZz> actually if you can pull off a large-scale sybil attack, you wouldnt need too much hashpower
2884 2011-05-08 21:07:24 fetokun has quit (Ping timeout: 259 seconds)
2885 2011-05-08 21:08:00 <jrmithdobbs> genjix: you can do them yourself, you need 80% of the network (total nodes is ~9k right now) and you need to be able to reliably generate blocks quickly, so each one of those nodes needs in the range of 256-512Thash/s capability to take advantage
2886 2011-05-08 21:08:14 <ArtForzZz> nope
2887 2011-05-08 21:08:22 <ArtForzZz> you'd only need a few 100Gh/s total, at max
2888 2011-05-08 21:08:32 <jrmithdobbs> ArtForzZz: why?
2889 2011-05-08 21:08:36 <genjix> total nodes is not 9k. that's a magnitude figure
2890 2011-05-08 21:08:42 <ArtForzZz> if you can seperate the large miners into their own islands, yo udon't have to deal with the combined hashrate of the network
2891 2011-05-08 21:09:16 <phantomcircuit> genjix, total nodes on the network at any given moment is about 4.5k
2892 2011-05-08 21:09:39 <devon_hillard> invalid blocks arise when someone else has produced the same block within a few minute window (the time it takes the network to verify and accept it) ?
2893 2011-05-08 21:09:44 <genjix> right. so saying there's 9k users of bitcoin is inaccurate
2894 2011-05-08 21:09:45 <phantomcircuit> also a sybil attack against the mainline client would currently not be super difficult
2895 2011-05-08 21:09:59 <ArtForzZz> phantomcircuit: yep
2896 2011-05-08 21:10:13 <phantomcircuit> you'd need about 15k ips and the ability to sustain ~100mbps of traffic
2897 2011-05-08 21:10:18 <phantomcircuit> which is really pretty trivial
2898 2011-05-08 21:10:21 <ArtForzZz> yep
2899 2011-05-08 21:10:32 <ArtForzZz> a lot more trivial than trying to outhash the network
2900 2011-05-08 21:10:46 <genjix> how about if you made a bitcon client that always selected one host which is acentralised/trusted out of all it's connections?
2901 2011-05-08 21:10:46 <ArtForzZz> way easier to play a game of divide and conquer
2902 2011-05-08 21:10:46 <phantomcircuit> the fix for it is equally trivial though
2903 2011-05-08 21:10:56 <lyspooner> so with the market cap of BTC at 20mm when is a sybil attack worth the effort/risk?
2904 2011-05-08 21:10:56 <phantomcircuit> rotate peers ever couple of minutes
2905 2011-05-08 21:11:02 <jrmithdobbs> i see what you're saying
2906 2011-05-08 21:11:14 <phantomcircuit> lyspooner, it would probably be worth it now
2907 2011-05-08 21:11:50 <phantomcircuit> but the attack would be super obvious
2908 2011-05-08 21:11:50 <ArtForzZz> one practical problem, how to benefit from it
2909 2011-05-08 21:11:52 <jrmithdobbs> can't the bad blocks be blacklisted and/or backed out?
2910 2011-05-08 21:11:53 <ArtForzZz> yep
2911 2011-05-08 21:12:05 <jrmithdobbs> that's where my numbers came from
2912 2011-05-08 21:12:12 <ArtForzZz> it'd be rather trivial to detect, so it's pretty much a one-shot stunt
2913 2011-05-08 21:12:14 <jrmithdobbs> destroying it to the point where it's infeasible to back out is *hard*
2914 2011-05-08 21:12:15 <phantomcircuit> jrmithdobbs, sure but can that happen before they cash out? who knows
2915 2011-05-08 21:12:19 <lyspooner> is a sybil attack used to take down the system or exploit it? or both? or neither?
2916 2011-05-08 21:12:35 <phantomcircuit> lyspooner, you should wikipedia sybil attack
2917 2011-05-08 21:12:36 <phantomcircuit> :P
2918 2011-05-08 21:12:38 <genjix> lyspooner: make it unusable afaik
2919 2011-05-08 21:12:49 <genjix> possibly exploit it
2920 2011-05-08 21:12:50 <phantomcircuit> genjix, no that's wrong
2921 2011-05-08 21:12:54 <ArtForzZz> well, not quite unusable
2922 2011-05-08 21:12:59 <phantomcircuit> sybil is a network fragmentation attack
2923 2011-05-08 21:13:00 <lyspooner> i did, but someone sybil attacked my wikipedia and i can't trust it
2924 2011-05-08 21:13:09 <ArtForzZz> it's basically a large-scale MITM
2925 2011-05-08 21:13:28 <phantomcircuit> bitcoin is secure if >50% of the processing power is controlled by miners playing by the rules
2926 2011-05-08 21:13:30 <genjix> phantomcircuit: how is that wrong? if you cannot get any blocks then your bitcoin is unusable
2927 2011-05-08 21:13:33 <ArtForzZz> have enough nodes under your control (and take out other nodes) so everyone is *only* connected to your nodes
2928 2011-05-08 21:13:48 <phantomcircuit> if you can segment the network you can trivially control >50% of the network connected to a single set of peers
2929 2011-05-08 21:13:49 <genjix> my other fear for bitcoin is the MAX_BLOCK_SIZE limit
2930 2011-05-08 21:13:58 <jrmithdobbs> ArtForzZz: doesn't even have to be everyone, just the majority
2931 2011-05-08 21:14:02 <genjix> i did the calculations and the limit is by far too small
2932 2011-05-08 21:14:18 <genjix> MAX_BLOCK_SIZE = 1000000 bytes
2933 2011-05-08 21:14:22 <ArtForzZz> jrmithdobbs: really only has to be the guy you want to send "selective" data to
2934 2011-05-08 21:14:23 <jrmithdobbs> it's like 8 txn/s
2935 2011-05-08 21:14:25 <phantomcircuit> jrmithdobbs, doesn't have to be the majority, just has to be your intended target
2936 2011-05-08 21:14:27 <genjix> Average transaction = ~200 bytes (conservative lower limit)
2937 2011-05-08 21:14:45 <genjix> Average number of tx per block = 1000000 / 200 = 5000
2938 2011-05-08 21:14:47 <phantomcircuit> like if you could isolate mtgox from the rest of the network... you could trivially double spend all over the place
2939 2011-05-08 21:14:48 <ArtForzZz> genjix: so how many tx/s are we doing now on average?
2940 2011-05-08 21:14:50 <jrmithdobbs> genjix: that's a known intentional artificial limit
2941 2011-05-08 21:14:50 <genjix> Each block has an interval of ~10 mins
2942 2011-05-08 21:14:58 <genjix> that means 5000 confirmed tx / 10 mins OR 500 tx / min OR
2943 2011-05-08 21:14:59 <genjix> 8 tx / s
2944 2011-05-08 21:15:03 <diki> ;;bc,calc 279000
2945 2011-05-08 21:15:04 <gribble> The average time to generate a block at 279000 Khps, given current difficulty of 109670.13329248 , is 2 weeks, 5 days, 12 hours, 57 minutes, and 58 seconds
2946 2011-05-08 21:15:07 <ArtForzZz> 0.01 ?
2947 2011-05-08 21:15:07 <genjix> Visa must do thousands of tx a second or maybe more.
2948 2011-05-08 21:15:13 <Aahzmundus> its set that way to reduce spam
2949 2011-05-08 21:15:26 <Aahzmundus> its not a limit that cant be delt with to my understanding
2950 2011-05-08 21:15:26 lumos has joined
2951 2011-05-08 21:15:29 <genjix> yeah but that neccessitates a future upgrades to the entire network
2952 2011-05-08 21:15:29 <phantomcircuit> genjix, it can be changed if it ever becomes a problem
2953 2011-05-08 21:15:36 <jrmithdobbs> genjix: you posted that thread i take it?
2954 2011-05-08 21:15:40 <ArtForzZz> yep
2955 2011-05-08 21:15:46 <jrmithdobbs> genjix: just read the responses in your thread, it's all covered there
2956 2011-05-08 21:15:49 <genjix> how many people now use ipv4, improved smtp, ...
2957 2011-05-08 21:15:50 <ArtForzZz> changing it requires everyone to upgrade
2958 2011-05-08 21:16:09 <ArtForzZz> yes, let's open the door for massive spamming, what could possibly go wrong
2959 2011-05-08 21:16:11 <genjix> and all the old banks running 80s cobol software
2960 2011-05-08 21:16:16 <jrmithdobbs> yes we got your argument
2961 2011-05-08 21:16:27 <jrmithdobbs> most in here probably already read your thread
2962 2011-05-08 21:16:38 <ArtForzZz> so, whats your "proper" block size?
2963 2011-05-08 21:16:39 <phantomcircuit> genjix, it's just a matter of increasing a singular constant
2964 2011-05-08 21:16:39 <genjix> jrmithdobbs: yep i was reading the links. some good ideas but didn't see any solutions
2965 2011-05-08 21:17:13 <phantomcircuit> ArtForzZz, the average transaction is a couple hundred bytes right
2966 2011-05-08 21:17:16 <ArtForzZz> yep
2967 2011-05-08 21:17:24 <ArtForzZz> about 270 bytes avg iirc
2968 2011-05-08 21:17:41 <jrmithdobbs> genjix: as was said in your thread, there's plenty of time to sort it out and a network-wide upgrade enforcement at blck XXXXXX is doable given enough notice
2969 2011-05-08 21:17:58 <phantomcircuit> and the current limit is 1MB right?
2970 2011-05-08 21:18:04 <ArtForzZz> yep
2971 2011-05-08 21:18:08 <genjix> phantomcircuit: grep for MAX_BLOCK_SIZE
2972 2011-05-08 21:18:29 <phantomcircuit> genjix, im on a shitty laptop with the worlds slowest hdd
2973 2011-05-08 21:18:30 <phantomcircuit> so
2974 2011-05-08 21:18:32 <phantomcircuit> nothx :P
2975 2011-05-08 21:18:35 <jrmithdobbs> genjix: any nodes that don't upgrade just wont have their blocks validated after the cut off point
2976 2011-05-08 21:18:38 <genjix> jrmithdobbs: so yep it involves changing a small constant and all vendors running bitcoin should beware of a future upgrade
2977 2011-05-08 21:18:51 <lyspooner> if you can convince a country to move its clock one hour backwards and forwards, you can convince them to download a new bitcoin client
2978 2011-05-08 21:18:54 <jrmithdobbs> genjix: once your blocks stop validating you stop seeing returns. anyone mining *will* upgrade that portion of the code in a timely matter
2979 2011-05-08 21:19:01 <genjix> lyspooner: hehe good point
2980 2011-05-08 21:19:03 <jrmithdobbs> genjix: because there is financial incentive to do so
2981 2011-05-08 21:19:11 <genjix> right. ok
2982 2011-05-08 21:19:21 <phantomcircuit> jrmithdobbs, the problem isn't the miners, it's everybody else
2983 2011-05-08 21:19:21 <genjix> guess that fear is somewhat alleviated.
2984 2011-05-08 21:19:24 <ArtForzZz> there'll probably be quite a few more breaking upgrades before the 1MB limit becomes a problem
2985 2011-05-08 21:19:31 mmoya has joined
2986 2011-05-08 21:19:53 <genjix> like removing IsStandard? XD
2987 2011-05-08 21:20:07 <genjix> curious to know what other breaking upgrades you propose.
2988 2011-05-08 21:20:11 <phantomcircuit> genjix, yeah that's only 7 transactions/second
2989 2011-05-08 21:20:24 <jrmithdobbs> phantomcircuit: as long as the miners continue the network will survive and old clients just wont be useful
2990 2011-05-08 21:20:33 <ArtForzZz> like replacing the flat flood network with something a bit smarter
2991 2011-05-08 21:20:53 <genjix> hmm that can be done in a non-breaking way i think
2992 2011-05-08 21:20:58 <genjix> or backwards compatible
2993 2011-05-08 21:21:03 <phantomcircuit> ArtForzZz, lol the flat flood network is hilariously unscalable
2994 2011-05-08 21:21:18 <phantomcircuit> genjix, yeah you just run 2 mechanisms side by side
2995 2011-05-08 21:21:34 <genjix> right.
2996 2011-05-08 21:21:53 <genjix> allow the dumb clients to still function. maybe punish them with reduced bandwidth
2997 2011-05-08 21:21:59 <phantomcircuit> but yes 7 transactions/second is orders of magnitude too small
2998 2011-05-08 21:22:06 <ArtForzZz> for what?
2999 2011-05-08 21:22:12 <jrmithdobbs> for real currency usage
3000 2011-05-08 21:22:18 <jrmithdobbs> outside of exchanges
3001 2011-05-08 21:22:21 <ArtForzZz> for the current tx volume, it's orders of magnitude too large
3002 2011-05-08 21:22:29 <genjix> paypal does thousands of tx per second
3003 2011-05-08 21:22:36 <genjix> but yep it's a long way away
3004 2011-05-08 21:22:41 <phantomcircuit> ArtForzZz, sure, im saying it's orders of magnitude too small for the potential future expansion
3005 2011-05-08 21:22:59 <ArtForzZz> phantomcircuit: I wouldnt even be too sure about that
3006 2011-05-08 21:23:05 <jrmithdobbs> genjix: things like portable currency usage for in person txns will have to be fixed before it's really an issue though
3007 2011-05-08 21:23:08 <genjix> OTOH there's only a few clients right now
3008 2011-05-08 21:23:26 <genjix> jrmithdobbs: a friend of mine had a good point today that bitcoin will only be a base level system
3009 2011-05-08 21:23:27 <jrmithdobbs> genjix: paypal didn't reach those levels until they started issuing cards, for instance
3010 2011-05-08 21:23:35 <genjix> people will use layers on top
3011 2011-05-08 21:23:37 <phantomcircuit> indeed the hardest part is going to be synchronizing all fo the block validation rules between clients
3012 2011-05-08 21:23:37 <ArtForzZz> I dont think bitcoin will ever be used by "normal people" on a large scale
3013 2011-05-08 21:23:38 <ArtForzZz> yep
3014 2011-05-08 21:24:15 <genjix> and it's possible to make txs expire so all is well and good
3015 2011-05-08 21:24:39 <lyspooner> bitcoin is the best interstellar money i know of, speaking of what kind of "people" might use it
3016 2011-05-08 21:24:41 <genjix> (if we hit the roof and it's difficult to expand the block size, then simply use expirable txs)
3017 2011-05-08 21:25:08 <phantomcircuit> http://www.nytimes.com/2011/05/08/technology/08parking.html?ref=technology
3018 2011-05-08 21:25:09 <phantomcircuit> lol
3019 2011-05-08 21:25:21 <phantomcircuit> that is such a waste of money
3020 2011-05-08 21:25:30 <phantomcircuit> the city spent 12 million USD on oracledb
3021 2011-05-08 21:25:33 <jrmithdobbs> lyspooner: too much latency to reliably start transactions from pluto ;p
3022 2011-05-08 21:25:37 <ArtForzZz> there'll be instant payment services (aka banks) built on top, transactions inside those systems don't have to touch the bitcoin network at all, and even a few tx/s would be enough for clearing between them
3023 2011-05-08 21:25:41 <BitMark> phantomcircuit: making me log in
3024 2011-05-08 21:25:49 <phantomcircuit> BitMark, i can fix that one sec
3025 2011-05-08 21:26:00 <genjix> ArtForzZz: sounds good.
3026 2011-05-08 21:26:06 <phantomcircuit> BitMark, http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=2&sqi=2&ved=0CBwQFjAB&url=https%3A%2F%2Fprofiles.google.com%2Framana.nitr%2Fposts%2FEfogcHCRMBV&ei=KQnHTYyrHoLUtQPNldGVAQ&usg=AFQjCNF1QeY4Z1k9eLCW6sYZvM6yFkA_oA
3027 2011-05-08 21:26:18 <ArtForzZz> so yeah, long term 1MB probably won't be enough
3028 2011-05-08 21:26:43 <ArtForzZz> 100MB probably will be
3029 2011-05-08 21:26:55 <ArtForzZz> btw, getting users to upgrade their clients is rather simple
3030 2011-05-08 21:27:05 <jrmithdobbs> but what if someone does come up with a good method of using btc directly at POS?
3031 2011-05-08 21:27:21 <jrmithdobbs> then 100MB wont
3032 2011-05-08 21:27:29 <forrestv> just submitted https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/205 to make json-rpc http header processing case-insensitive, if anyone wants to look
3033 2011-05-08 21:27:39 <phantomcircuit> jrmithdobbs, then we're talking about serious scalability issues
3034 2011-05-08 21:27:51 <phantomcircuit> jrmithdobbs, 100MB/10minutes
3035 2011-05-08 21:27:53 <genjix> 1 TB blocksize XD
3036 2011-05-08 21:27:55 <jrmithdobbs> phantomcircuit: well, i meant in relation to this topic ;P
3037 2011-05-08 21:28:03 <molecular> forrestv, why case-insensitive?
3038 2011-05-08 21:28:05 <jrmithdobbs> phantomcircuit: but ya there's that too
3039 2011-05-08 21:28:05 mologie has quit (Quit: Nettalk6 - www.ntalk.de)
3040 2011-05-08 21:28:16 <genjix> i await that day when we have petabyte usb sticks
3041 2011-05-08 21:28:17 <jrmithdobbs> molecular: because http is supposed to be case-insensitive
3042 2011-05-08 21:28:23 <forrestv> molecular, because rfc 2616 requires it? :p
3043 2011-05-08 21:28:31 <jrmithdobbs> molecular: implementing it any other way is out of spec.
3044 2011-05-08 21:28:36 <phantomcircuit> jrmithdobbs, although that's still only 5 TB/year
3045 2011-05-08 21:28:48 <phantomcircuit> jinx x10
3046 2011-05-08 21:28:49 <ArtForzZz> genjix: you can already have them, they're just rather unwieldy ;)
3047 2011-05-08 21:28:50 <forrestv> and cost me an hour of debugging
3048 2011-05-08 21:29:08 <jrmithdobbs> haha, i bet
3049 2011-05-08 21:29:13 <genjix> :)
3050 2011-05-08 21:29:33 <phantomcircuit> i wonder what the largest (by volume) flash drive you can buy is
3051 2011-05-08 21:29:43 <jrmithdobbs> 64GB last i looked
3052 2011-05-08 21:29:50 <ArtForzZz> lol?
3053 2011-05-08 21:29:53 <ArtForzZz> currently 1T or so
3054 2011-05-08 21:29:55 <jrmithdobbs> i've got a 32GB one. very handy.
3055 2011-05-08 21:30:05 <molecular> jrmithdobbs, you didn't make them case-insensitive, you made them lower-case, no?
3056 2011-05-08 21:30:17 <phantomcircuit> jrmithdobbs, ArtForzZz i meant by physical volume
3057 2011-05-08 21:30:19 <jrmithdobbs> ArtForzZz: they gotten that big in that small a form factor?
3058 2011-05-08 21:30:36 <phantomcircuit> molecular, seriously/
3059 2011-05-08 21:30:37 <phantomcircuit> ?
3060 2011-05-08 21:30:41 <gjs278> you could make a flash drive 24tb just enclose 8 3tb  drives and put a usb cord at the end
3061 2011-05-08 21:30:42 <genjix> christ. my home directory is 300mb... why do people need all that space?
3062 2011-05-08 21:30:58 <ArtForzZz> gjs278: but then it's a spinning rust drive, not flash :P
3063 2011-05-08 21:31:03 spirals has quit (Quit: Ex-Chat)
3064 2011-05-08 21:31:09 <jrmithdobbs> genjix: my 32GB stick has several linux distro mirrors on it for consulting work
3065 2011-05-08 21:31:10 <phantomcircuit> genjix, i have a media server that's currently at 97% of capacity
3066 2011-05-08 21:31:15 <phantomcircuit> NEED MORE STORAGE!!!
3067 2011-05-08 21:31:35 <gjs278> http://img135.imageshack.us/img135/1516/screenshotrz.png these are my totals
3068 2011-05-08 21:31:36 <molecular> phantomcircuit, jrmithdobbs sorry, didn't see "boost::to_lower(strHeader);"
3069 2011-05-08 21:31:37 <jrmithdobbs> genjix: it's basically a netboot installer on a stick, ha
3070 2011-05-08 21:31:39 <forrestv> molecular, it converts them to lower-case upon reading so they can be matched case-insensitively
3071 2011-05-08 21:31:41 <genjix> rm -fr porn
3072 2011-05-08 21:31:53 <molecular> forrestv, yea, sorry, missed that ;)
3073 2011-05-08 21:32:03 <ArtForzZz> 7.9T/8.6T used on my data array :/
3074 2011-05-08 21:32:30 <phantomcircuit> jrmithdobbs, i have a full mirror the anl gentoo mirror on a flash drive
3075 2011-05-08 21:32:30 <gjs278> try dling 7.9tb on a 250gb capped comcast connection
3076 2011-05-08 21:32:32 <phantomcircuit> it's huge
3077 2011-05-08 21:32:46 <phantomcircuit> gjs278, business class
3078 2011-05-08 21:32:49 <phantomcircuit> be a boss
3079 2011-05-08 21:32:55 <ArtForzZz> gjs278: most of that was with 0.768M ADSL ;)
3080 2011-05-08 21:32:58 <jrmithdobbs> phantomcircuit: i have rhel/centos full mirrors and a partial debian mirror ;P
3081 2011-05-08 21:33:10 <gjs278> at least they won't cap the .768m adsl
3082 2011-05-08 21:33:14 <gjs278> well
3083 2011-05-08 21:33:18 <gjs278> if you have at&t they will now
3084 2011-05-08 21:33:35 <jrmithdobbs> never got the media hoarding guys
3085 2011-05-08 21:33:44 <phantomcircuit> can someone explain to me why named uses 15MB of ram to serve dns ??
3086 2011-05-08 21:33:55 <phantomcircuit> gjs278, what's the att cap?
3087 2011-05-08 21:34:01 <gjs278> 150gb
3088 2011-05-08 21:34:03 <jrmithdobbs> phantomcircuit: you want a real answer or is that facetious?
3089 2011-05-08 21:34:13 <phantomcircuit> jrmithdobbs, no im serious
3090 2011-05-08 21:34:16 <phantomcircuit> i just dont get it
3091 2011-05-08 21:34:26 <gjs278> uverse gets 250
3092 2011-05-08 21:34:33 <phantomcircuit> named uses more ram than dovecot imapd
3093 2011-05-08 21:34:39 <jrmithdobbs> phantomcircuit: most of that huge growth came past 9.2 with all the dnssec implementation
3094 2011-05-08 21:35:01 <phantomcircuit> so they have like the worlds stupidest implementation or something?
3095 2011-05-08 21:35:13 <jrmithdobbs> phantomcircuit: the world's only, just about
3096 2011-05-08 21:35:19 <phantomcircuit> /dev/mapper/tank-home   99G   91G  2.8G  98% /home
3097 2011-05-08 21:35:21 <phantomcircuit> hehe
3098 2011-05-08 21:35:31 <gjs278> motherboard raid?
3099 2011-05-08 21:35:35 <jrmithdobbs> there's a couple other dnssec implementations but they're out of spec
3100 2011-05-08 21:35:42 <phantomcircuit> gjs278, lvm
3101 2011-05-08 21:35:46 <gjs278> gotcha
3102 2011-05-08 21:35:52 <phantomcircuit> Free  PE / Size       13793 / 53.88 GiB
3103 2011-05-08 21:36:08 <jrmithdobbs> phantomcircuit: i don't know details but that's where the huge spike came from. never bothered a code read because it's fucking boring code ;P
3104 2011-05-08 21:36:27 <phantomcircuit> yeah no kidding
3105 2011-05-08 21:36:52 <jrmithdobbs> and that's coming from someone that actually understood most of the djb dnscache code at one point
3106 2011-05-08 21:36:56 <jrmithdobbs> lol
3107 2011-05-08 21:37:12 <devon_hillard> "NVIDIA suffers massive GPU market share slide" year on year -28% loss
3108 2011-05-08 21:37:22 <phantomcircuit> lolol
3109 2011-05-08 21:37:26 <jrmithdobbs> wow lol
3110 2011-05-08 21:37:27 <phantomcircuit> geee i wonder why
3111 2011-05-08 21:37:31 <jrmithdobbs> fucked themselves, they deserve it.
3112 2011-05-08 21:38:06 <ArtForzZz> well, "massive"
3113 2011-05-08 21:38:39 <ArtForzZz> dwon from 22.5% to 20% total units sold
3114 2011-05-08 21:39:24 <ArtForzZz> and most of that went to intel
3115 2011-05-08 21:39:35 <devon_hillard> http://www.zdnet.com/blog/hardware/nvidia-suffers-massive-gpu-market-share-slide/12631
3116 2011-05-08 21:39:36 <ArtForzZz> = IGPs are getting "good enough"
3117 2011-05-08 21:39:56 <phantomcircuit> ArtForzZz, yeah i have an intel integrated whatever
3118 2011-05-08 21:40:00 <devon_hillard> RIP SiS, they had a discrete card they were hawking for $30-40
3119 2011-05-08 21:40:05 <phantomcircuit> it can play counter strike source at about 60fps
3120 2011-05-08 21:40:05 <phantomcircuit> so
3121 2011-05-08 21:40:07 <phantomcircuit> whatever
3122 2011-05-08 21:41:21 <jrmithdobbs> games are for children anyways ;P
3123 2011-05-08 21:41:30 <phantomcircuit> psh
3124 2011-05-08 21:41:33 <phantomcircuit> BOOM HEADSHOT
3125 2011-05-08 21:41:40 <gjs278> it owns
3126 2011-05-08 21:41:41 <gjs278> iT OWNS
3127 2011-05-08 21:41:42 <phantomcircuit> honestly i play better when fairly intoxicated
3128 2011-05-08 21:41:49 <phantomcircuit> it makes absolutely no idea
3129 2011-05-08 21:42:04 <phantomcircuit> a game of hand eye coordination should not get easier as your bac increases
3130 2011-05-08 21:43:46 <devon_hillard> so any idea when the PSN is going back up?
3131 2011-05-08 21:44:12 <phantomcircuit> judging by the hand waving and complete crap coming out of them
3132 2011-05-08 21:44:14 <devon_hillard> $1bn damages and counting
3133 2011-05-08 21:44:16 <phantomcircuit> sometime around never
3134 2011-05-08 21:44:47 <devon_hillard> this could be the most damage from a hacking attack
3135 2011-05-08 21:44:56 <phantomcircuit> possible
3136 2011-05-08 21:45:01 Cusipzzz has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
3137 2011-05-08 21:45:11 Cusipzzz has joined
3138 2011-05-08 21:45:33 Cusipzzz has quit (Client Quit)
3139 2011-05-08 21:46:05 <devon_hillard> outside, perhaps, that Iranian centrifuge worm
3140 2011-05-08 21:46:56 <ArtForzZz> for total economic damage, the big 'doze worms of the late 90s/early 00s probably also get close
3141 2011-05-08 21:47:33 <phantomcircuit> lol that one worm that was supposed to delete another worm
3142 2011-05-08 21:47:37 <phantomcircuit> what was the one called?
3143 2011-05-08 21:47:46 <phantomcircuit> that was a disaster probably cost about a billion bucks
3144 2011-05-08 21:47:52 <ArtForzZz> wasnt that nimda?
3145 2011-05-08 21:48:06 <phantomcircuit> iono i was like 13 at the time
3146 2011-05-08 21:48:21 <phantomcircuit> that infected like every win xp box on the planet though
3147 2011-05-08 21:48:22 <phantomcircuit> lol
3148 2011-05-08 21:49:17 <lulzplzkthx> I want to speed up downloading the blocks on a new computer, can I just copy over the database files from one that already has them?
3149 2011-05-08 21:49:21 <lulzplzkthx> And if so, exactly which files are those?
3150 2011-05-08 21:49:54 <ArtForzZz> welchia?
3151 2011-05-08 21:50:45 <[Tycho]> How bitcoiners call the event of chain forking ?
3152 2011-05-08 21:50:52 <lulzplzkthx> Yes.
3153 2011-05-08 21:50:54 <lulzplzkthx> lol
3154 2011-05-08 21:51:09 <phantomcircuit> lulzplzkthx, yes you can
3155 2011-05-08 21:51:13 <lulzplzkthx> phantomcircuit: Which files?
3156 2011-05-08 21:51:21 <lyspooner> the #bitcoin-otc channel is getting all upset about deepbit>50, but you guys are all calm in here.  i'm sure tycho's heard it all before.  can someone ease our worries
3157 2011-05-08 21:51:22 <phantomcircuit> lulzplzkthx, windows or linux?
3158 2011-05-08 21:51:29 <lulzplzkthx> Windows -> Linux
3159 2011-05-08 21:51:37 <lulzplzkthx> I have FTP to a local server, want to copy the blocks over.
3160 2011-05-08 21:51:44 <ArtForzZz> [Tycho]: I dont think there's a good name for it other than "chain fork" or "chain split"
3161 2011-05-08 21:51:48 <phantomcircuit> lulzplzkthx, oh uh yeah dont do windows -> linux
3162 2011-05-08 21:51:53 <lulzplzkthx> Why? :\
3163 2011-05-08 21:52:05 <phantomcircuit> well actually you might as well try it
3164 2011-05-08 21:52:15 <phantomcircuit> the odds are high that the bdb db will break doing that
3165 2011-05-08 21:52:25 <phantomcircuit> lyspooner, what?
3166 2011-05-08 21:52:28 <lulzplzkthx> Hmm.
3167 2011-05-08 21:52:37 <lulzplzkthx> I'll just let it download then.
3168 2011-05-08 21:52:46 <phantomcircuit> lulzplzkthx, on windows it's in like application data or some other ridiculous folder
3169 2011-05-08 21:52:53 <lulzplzkthx> I know where it is on Windows.
3170 2011-05-08 21:52:57 <lulzplzkthx> And i konow where it is on Linux.
3171 2011-05-08 21:53:03 <lulzplzkthx> I just don't know exactly which files.
3172 2011-05-08 21:53:11 <lyspooner> phantomcircuit: they are saying that with deepbit controlling 50 percent of the hashrate that bitcoin is unstable and therefore worthless
3173 2011-05-08 21:53:20 <lulzplzkthx> __db.00#? database/*?
3174 2011-05-08 21:53:27 <lulzplzkthx> blk0001.dat?
3175 2011-05-08 21:53:41 <phantomcircuit> lulzplzkthx, yeah copy those to ~/.bitcoin on the linux box
3176 2011-05-08 21:53:43 dissipate has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
3177 2011-05-08 21:53:50 <lulzplzkthx> All of them?
3178 2011-05-08 21:54:17 <gjs278> all of them
3179 2011-05-08 21:54:56 <ArtForzZz> lyspooner: the sky is falling! sell!
3180 2011-05-08 21:55:02 <gjs278> anyone concerned about deepbit having over 50% should just make another pool for me to mine on
3181 2011-05-08 21:55:21 <lyspooner> nah, i'm just not talented enough economically or technically to describe to an entire channel why i think everything's ok
3182 2011-05-08 21:55:38 <[Tycho]> http://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=7622.0
3183 2011-05-08 21:55:40 <gjs278> I've been with deepbit since I started
3184 2011-05-08 21:55:45 <ArtForzZz> and I simply can't be arsed :P
3185 2011-05-08 21:56:32 * molecular is hacking up a text-mode trading client for mtgox: http://i.imgur.com/95aVV.png <- this is combined display of market depth and own buy/sell orders (number at the outside of the lines) including accumulated volume for each price.
3186 2011-05-08 21:56:40 <lyspooner> can't bitcoin blockchain monitoring be profitable?
3187 2011-05-08 21:56:43 chmod755 has left ("Leaving.")
3188 2011-05-08 21:56:44 <jrmithdobbs> lyspooner: it doesn't become an issue until 80%
3189 2011-05-08 21:56:50 <jrmithdobbs> lyspooner: of nodes controlled
3190 2011-05-08 21:57:05 <jrmithdobbs> lyspooner: *not* just cycles controlled
3191 2011-05-08 21:57:19 <jrmithdobbs> lyspooner: deepbit is only a few actual bitcoin nodes
3192 2011-05-08 21:57:23 <jrmithdobbs> no matter the hashrate
3193 2011-05-08 21:57:26 <jrmithdobbs> that's the gist of it
3194 2011-05-08 21:58:26 <jrmithdobbs> lyspooner: and if they're so worried tell them to start their own pools.
3195 2011-05-08 21:58:55 kakazza has joined
3196 2011-05-08 21:59:20 Incitatus has joined
3197 2011-05-08 21:59:33 <lulzplzkthx> I think copying the blocks over worked.
3198 2011-05-08 21:59:35 <jrmithdobbs> molecular: drop the curses/term redrawing stuff and make it all commandline switch based and that'd actually be useful
3199 2011-05-08 21:59:39 <lulzplzkthx> bitcoind getinfo says "122736"
3200 2011-05-08 21:59:45 <lulzplzkthx> Is that a sure sign it worked?
3201 2011-05-08 22:00:10 <phantomcircuit> lulzplzkthx, try starting it with -rescan
3202 2011-05-08 22:01:53 <lulzplzkthx> started fine it appears
3203 2011-05-08 22:02:02 <lulzplzkthx> and bitcoind getinfo still says 122736. No connections yet though.
3204 2011-05-08 22:02:14 <molecular> jrmithdobbs, there's no curses invovled. redrawing occurs when you hit <ret>. so you want something scriptable to use mtgox api?
3205 2011-05-08 22:02:16 <anarchyx> ;;bc,stats
3206 2011-05-08 22:02:18 <gribble> Current Blocks: 122738 | Current Difficulty: 109670.13329248 | Next Difficulty At Block: 122975 | Next Difficulty In: 237 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 day, 2 hours, 51 minutes, and 36 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 154127.38825817
3207 2011-05-08 22:02:44 <jrmithdobbs> molecular: ya, term redrawing is a pet peeve of mine
3208 2011-05-08 22:02:51 <jrmithdobbs> molecular: patched that shit out of poclbm too
3209 2011-05-08 22:03:02 <molecular> jrmithdobbs, initial incentive to do this thing was insane loading time of web-page "mtgox / trade data / market depth"
3210 2011-05-08 22:03:05 <phantomcircuit> luke-jr, rofl @ sold all
3211 2011-05-08 22:03:24 <lulzplzkthx> So my thing isn't able to find connections. :\
3212 2011-05-08 22:03:26 <jrmithdobbs> molecular: a one shot run is more useful than something that uses readline to run something shell-like imho
3213 2011-05-08 22:03:27 <lulzplzkthx> And I even had an addnode.
3214 2011-05-08 22:03:42 <lulzplzkthx> it's been quite a bit now, and i thought maybe it was being slow, but i just opened it up on this pc and had 9 connections <10 secds
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3216 2011-05-08 22:04:03 <molecular> jrmithdobbs, then I need a generic <anything/>-caller on a prompt
3217 2011-05-08 22:04:04 <jrmithdobbs> molecular: just suggestions, didn't mean to be so harsh btw, haha
3218 2011-05-08 22:04:15 <molecular> jrmithdobbs, n harm!
3219 2011-05-08 22:04:18 <lulzplzkthx> Oay, I addnoded myself and that worked.
3220 2011-05-08 22:04:19 <molecular> *no
3221 2011-05-08 22:04:47 <molecular> jrmithdobbs, I doubt you have use for what your proposing... can easily do that using wget/curl/...
3222 2011-05-08 22:05:06 <lulzplzkthx> Will Bitcoin connect to others if addnode is used?
3223 2011-05-08 22:05:31 <jrmithdobbs> jrmithdobbs: i could see it being useful, i don't know how much use I personally have for it, no, that's why i apologized for being so harsh :)
3224 2011-05-08 22:05:35 <jrmithdobbs> erm
3225 2011-05-08 22:05:37 <jrmithdobbs> molecular: ^
3226 2011-05-08 22:05:43 <molecular> jrmithdobbs, other than that: is the market depth / your own bids/asks display working for you?
3227 2011-05-08 22:06:22 jrabbit has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
3228 2011-05-08 22:06:30 <molecular> jrmithdobbs, can you see I'm seeling 2 BTC for 3.9499?
3229 2011-05-08 22:06:35 <jrmithdobbs> molecular: so long as it's actually paying attention to the term size and will resize to get rid of the cutoff it looks good
3230 2011-05-08 22:06:44 jrabbit has joined
3231 2011-05-08 22:06:51 <molecular> jrmithdobbs, it's just stdout printing
3232 2011-05-08 22:07:10 <molecular> jrmithdobbs, not considering any termsize. requirements currently: min widht: about 60
3233 2011-05-08 22:07:20 <luke-jr> phantomcircuit: quite serious. I have like 24 BTC left
3234 2011-05-08 22:07:59 <jrmithdobbs> molecular: the middle combined label is confusing and i'd put a space between the divider on each side
3235 2011-05-08 22:08:04 <lulzplzkthx> I'm having issues with Bitcoin connecting on Linux. I ran bitcoind and have had no connections and it's been quite a while. I did addnode=192.168.2.3 (my PC) and it worked, but found no new connections. This PC is a laptop, so I need it to find more connections. Help
3236 2011-05-08 22:08:08 <luke-jr> phantomcircuit: when Deepbit's monopoly is broken, I'll reconsider
3237 2011-05-08 22:08:17 <jrmithdobbs> molecular: other than that it looks good
3238 2011-05-08 22:08:26 <jrmithdobbs> molecular: my eyes want to read that middle column as one big number
3239 2011-05-08 22:08:33 <jrmithdobbs> if you get what I'm saying
3240 2011-05-08 22:08:47 <Incitatus> perhaps a thread should be made
3241 2011-05-08 22:08:57 <molecular> jrmithdobbs, about the middle combinde label ("accumulated"): is it clear without the label what is displayed?
3242 2011-05-08 22:08:59 <phantomcircuit> luke-jr, make your pool more reliable :P
3243 2011-05-08 22:09:03 <Incitatus> proposing that it is in deeppit\s best interest to de monopolize
3244 2011-05-08 22:09:09 <Incitatus> due to BTC confidence
3245 2011-05-08 22:09:25 <Incitatus> it would not be altruistically for htem, although Bitcoin would obviously be helped
3246 2011-05-08 22:09:27 <molecular> jrmithdobbs, so you want "more space" to the middle "|"?
3247 2011-05-08 22:09:38 <Incitatus> but even the individual miners would ultimately be rewarded
3248 2011-05-08 22:09:44 <jrmithdobbs> molecular: ya, as in "int | int" instead of "int|int"
3249 2011-05-08 22:09:57 gasteve has quit (Quit: gasteve)
3250 2011-05-08 22:10:06 <Incitatus> what do you think luke-jr
3251 2011-05-08 22:10:10 Aahzmundus is now known as Aahzmundus|AFK
3252 2011-05-08 22:11:17 <molecular> jrmithdobbs, like so: http://i.imgur.com/Zw1Gf.png ?
3253 2011-05-08 22:11:24 <lulzplzkthx> Could my issue with no connections be that I have two computers on the same network with the usual onnection port forwarded to one of them?
3254 2011-05-08 22:11:34 <jrmithdobbs> molecular: ya MUCH more legible
3255 2011-05-08 22:11:41 <[Tycho]> "<phantomcircuit> luke-jr, rofl @ sold all" - when did he said that ?
3256 2011-05-08 22:11:52 <phantomcircuit> [Tycho], in bitcoin-otc
3257 2011-05-08 22:11:55 <jrmithdobbs> molecular: first time i read it i didn't realise they were two seperate columns
3258 2011-05-08 22:11:59 <molecular> jrmithdobbs, must say that was a valuable hint
3259 2011-05-08 22:12:04 <phantomcircuit> ;;bc,calc 1000000
3260 2011-05-08 22:12:06 <gribble> The average time to generate a block at 1000000 Khps, given current difficulty of 109670.13329248 , is 5 days, 10 hours, 50 minutes, and 29 seconds
3261 2011-05-08 22:12:15 <Incitatus> btw, how mcuh did luke-jr have???
3262 2011-05-08 22:12:19 <molecular> jrmithdobbs, it also looks much better visually
3263 2011-05-08 22:12:22 lumos has quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
3264 2011-05-08 22:12:31 <[Tycho]> phantomcircuit, is it logged ? Can you give me a link ?
3265 2011-05-08 22:12:33 <jrmithdobbs> molecular: agreed
3266 2011-05-08 22:13:20 <molecular> jrabbit, well: thanks! what's your address for donations?
3267 2011-05-08 22:13:44 <phantomcircuit> [Tycho], i have no idea
3268 2011-05-08 22:14:18 <molecular> jrmithdobbs, ^ uh, sorry, called you "jrabbit"
3269 2011-05-08 22:14:31 <jrmithdobbs> molecular: sec let me gen one
3270 2011-05-08 22:14:37 Aahzmundus is now known as AFK!~random@cable-207-138-216-146.dynamic.hbci.com|Aahzmundus
3271 2011-05-08 22:16:19 IncitatusOnWater has joined
3272 2011-05-08 22:16:26 <luke-jr> phantomcircuit: my pool is no problem
3273 2011-05-08 22:16:49 <phantomcircuit> http://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=6956.0
3274 2011-05-08 22:16:56 Incitatus has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
3275 2011-05-08 22:16:56 <phantomcircuit> that seems ridiculously suspicious to me
3276 2011-05-08 22:17:05 <phantomcircuit> especially since there is no legal way to sell steam games
3277 2011-05-08 22:17:12 <luke-jr> phantomcircuit: nonsense
3278 2011-05-08 22:17:24 <luke-jr> phantomcircuit: doctrine of first sale; they can't forbid you from reselling
3279 2011-05-08 22:17:29 <luke-jr> at least in the US
3280 2011-05-08 22:17:38 <phantomcircuit> luke-jr, yes but i mean there is literally no mechanism to do it
3281 2011-05-08 22:19:14 <phantomcircuit> not to mention the prices being offered scream stolen credit cards
3282 2011-05-08 22:19:22 Marcel has left (HSD!~Marcel|HS@router2.hsdev.com|)
3283 2011-05-08 22:19:32 <luke-jr> phantomcircuit: uh, I give you the code for the game.
3284 2011-05-08 22:19:33 Marcel has joined
3285 2011-05-08 22:19:43 <luke-jr> phantomcircuit: I bought it off NewEgg
3286 2011-05-08 22:20:04 <phantomcircuit> oh
3287 2011-05-08 22:20:09 <phantomcircuit> hm interesting
3288 2011-05-08 22:21:38 lyspooner has quit (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86.1 [Firefox 3.6.17/20110420140830])
3289 2011-05-08 22:22:50 <phantomcircuit> http://sldoubler.com/
3290 2011-05-08 22:22:51 <phantomcircuit> rofl
3291 2011-05-08 22:22:52 <phantomcircuit> oh wow
3292 2011-05-08 22:22:56 <phantomcircuit> a real pyramid scheme
3293 2011-05-08 22:22:57 <phantomcircuit> nice
3294 2011-05-08 22:24:05 diki has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
3295 2011-05-08 22:24:09 Aahzmundus has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
3296 2011-05-08 22:24:32 Aahzmundus has joined
3297 2011-05-08 22:25:55 TD has quit (Quit: TD)
3298 2011-05-08 22:27:20 <lolcat> Mining must be profitable now rigth?
3299 2011-05-08 22:27:40 <jrmithdobbs> nope move along
3300 2011-05-08 22:27:52 <jrmithdobbs> ;)
3301 2011-05-08 22:28:05 <[Tycho]> :)
3302 2011-05-08 22:28:26 <Cusipzzz> no money in mining, everyone is solid.
3303 2011-05-08 22:28:49 <lolcat> Huh?
3304 2011-05-08 22:28:58 ezl has joined
3305 2011-05-08 22:29:59 <lolcat> Radeon HD 5850
3306 2011-05-08 22:30:14 <lolcat> Would it take 10 days and 8 houres to get a bitcoin?
3307 2011-05-08 22:30:18 <phantomcircuit> lolcat, they're trying to maintain their mining share obviously
3308 2011-05-08 22:30:26 <lolcat> To get 50 bitcoins?
3309 2011-05-08 22:30:29 <phantomcircuit> lolcat, that sounds about right
3310 2011-05-08 22:30:38 <lolcat> How many mhash is it?
3311 2011-05-08 22:31:06 <lolcat> Because it is cheap, so me and two friends thougth we were going to throw it in some old box and see if we can make it pay itself off...
3312 2011-05-08 22:31:25 <ArtForzZz> probably
3313 2011-05-08 22:31:32 <ArtForzZz> http://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?topic=7427.0
3314 2011-05-08 22:31:45 <phantomcircuit> lolcat, https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Mining_hardware_comparison
3315 2011-05-08 22:32:06 <ArtForzZz> so currently mining is quite profitable
3316 2011-05-08 22:32:21 <phantomcircuit> ;;bc,calc 250000
3317 2011-05-08 22:32:22 <gribble> The average time to generate a block at 250000 Khps, given current difficulty of 109670.13329248 , is 3 weeks, 0 days, 19 hours, 21 minutes, and 58 seconds
3318 2011-05-08 22:32:51 <ArtForzZz> but notice it looks like we already passed a peak in $/difficulty
3319 2011-05-08 22:33:12 csshih has joined
3320 2011-05-08 22:33:52 <lolcat> What is SL3 unlock time?
3321 2011-05-08 22:34:02 AStove has quit ()
3322 2011-05-08 22:34:20 <phantomcircuit> lolcat, my calculations say it would be paid off in ~30 days assuming your electricity is 0.15 USD/kWh
3323 2011-05-08 22:34:28 <phantomcircuit> and you purchase the card for 200USd
3324 2011-05-08 22:35:01 <IncitatusOnWater> cusipzzz: very funny
3325 2011-05-08 22:35:02 <genjix> Cusipzzz: move up imo
3326 2011-05-08 22:35:10 <IncitatusOnWater> to where they respect ur raises
3327 2011-05-08 22:35:19 <lolcat> phantomcircuit: I don't pay for electricity...
3328 2011-05-08 22:35:24 <Cusipzzz> genjix: move up where they respect my Ghs?
3329 2011-05-08 22:35:29 <phantomcircuit> lolcat, then roughyl cut that time in half
3330 2011-05-08 22:35:46 <IncitatusOnWater> cusipzzz: do you post on LP? I am Steal City from LP
3331 2011-05-08 22:35:59 <lolcat> 15 days? That sounds like a crazy investment... 100% earning in a month...
3332 2011-05-08 22:36:00 gasteve has joined
3333 2011-05-08 22:36:19 <Cusipzzz> IncitatusOnWater: nah, used to slum 2+2 bbv, lol
3334 2011-05-08 22:36:38 <IncitatusOnWater> u play on PS or FTP?
3335 2011-05-08 22:36:53 <phantomcircuit> lolcat, yup
3336 2011-05-08 22:37:09 <lolcat> phantomcircuit: So how much am I looking to earn each month in $ if the price stays where it is?
3337 2011-05-08 22:37:45 <Cusipzzz> IncitatusOnWater: both, sadly. more ftp, ugh
3338 2011-05-08 22:37:50 <ArtForzZz> "less and less" is a good guess
3339 2011-05-08 22:37:51 <phantomcircuit> lolcat, (50*3.5USD)/(3 weeks, 0 days, 19 hours, 21 minutes, and 58 seconds) * 30 days
3340 2011-05-08 22:38:12 <IncitatusOnWater> ah i used to live wiht fazi cusipzzz
3341 2011-05-08 22:38:15 <IncitatusOnWater> big ftper
3342 2011-05-08 22:38:25 <IncitatusOnWater> I'm TheDonald4Realz on FTP, didn't play too much on FTP tho
3343 2011-05-08 22:38:30 <IncitatusOnWater> but had good results
3344 2011-05-08 22:38:35 <ArtForzZz> and in ~24h difficulty will jump up 50%
3345 2011-05-08 22:38:42 <Cusipzzz> IncitatusOnWater: american? think they'll pay ?
3346 2011-05-08 22:38:54 <phantomcircuit> ArtForzZz, well if he isn't paying for electricity...
3347 2011-05-08 22:38:59 <phantomcircuit> ;;bc,stats
3348 2011-05-08 22:39:00 <gribble> Current Blocks: 122742 | Current Difficulty: 109670.13329248 | Next Difficulty At Block: 122975 | Next Difficulty In: 233 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 1 day, 2 hours, 28 minutes, and 17 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 153977.44014212
3349 2011-05-08 22:39:14 <phantomcircuit> ;;bc,calcd 250000 153977.44014212
3350 2011-05-08 22:39:15 <gribble> The average time to generate a block at 250000 Khps, given the supplied difficulty of 153977.44014212, is 4 weeks, 2 days, 14 hours, 48 minutes, and 32 seconds
3351 2011-05-08 22:39:27 <IncitatusOnWater> no idea, i don't have much on FTP these days so not a big deal, but i got $$$ on UB :(
3352 2011-05-08 22:39:37 noagendamarket has joined
3353 2011-05-08 22:39:44 <phantomcircuit> ArtForzZz, still 171.473157 U.S. dollars/month
3354 2011-05-08 22:39:49 <ArtForzZz> yep
3355 2011-05-08 22:40:49 <ArtForzZz> for a few weeks if you're lucky
3356 2011-05-08 22:40:50 IncitatusOnWater is now known as Incitatus
3357 2011-05-08 22:41:35 <phantomcircuit> sure but he'll have 100%+ ROI within a month
3358 2011-05-08 22:41:38 <ArtForzZz> yep
3359 2011-05-08 22:42:08 <ArtForzZz> with free power it's really a no-brainer
3360 2011-05-08 22:42:12 <lolcat> phantomcircuit: ROI?
3361 2011-05-08 22:42:19 <ArtForzZz> return on investment
3362 2011-05-08 22:42:33 <lolcat> Well that is pretty good
3363 2011-05-08 22:42:40 <lolcat> I belive 10% a year is a fair investment
3364 2011-05-08 22:42:58 <lolcat> Would the profitability be a lot higher with a better gpu?
3365 2011-05-08 22:43:12 <ArtForzZz> but like I said, I very much doubt the current level of $/difficulty will hold for long
3366 2011-05-08 22:43:31 <jrmithdobbs> aye
3367 2011-05-08 22:43:56 <jrmithdobbs> ArtForzZz: but value has held for goin on a week and it's a p good bet it will through the next diff cycle at the least
3368 2011-05-08 22:44:02 <jrmithdobbs> err goin on 2 weeks
3369 2011-05-08 22:44:06 <ArtForzZz> yep
3370 2011-05-08 22:44:12 <jrmithdobbs> probably the next few
3371 2011-05-08 22:44:14 <ArtForzZz> but beyond that it's rather shaky
3372 2011-05-08 22:44:34 <ArtForzZz> the feb-mar spike lasted less than a month
3373 2011-05-08 22:44:55 kcsrnd has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
3374 2011-05-08 22:45:03 <ArtForzZz> well, really early feb
3375 2011-05-08 22:45:07 Jkessler has joined
3376 2011-05-08 22:45:19 <jrmithdobbs> just cash out early and often until you break even and you're set
3377 2011-05-08 22:45:44 <ArtForzZz> yep, and keep the rest
3378 2011-05-08 22:45:52 <lolcat> First time I hit a block I have gotten my investment back
3379 2011-05-08 22:46:09 <ArtForzZz> bitcoin value loves to jump up whenever we get major media coverage
3380 2011-05-08 22:46:29 <lolcat> ArtForzZz: But we get major media coverage next month
3381 2011-05-08 22:46:31 <lolcat> err
3382 2011-05-08 22:46:32 <lolcat> tomorrow
3383 2011-05-08 22:46:39 <lolcat> Or today?
3384 2011-05-08 22:47:02 <ArtForzZz> you mean the forbes article everyone currently trading knew about for weeks?
3385 2011-05-08 22:47:38 <jrmithdobbs> ya that's not news
3386 2011-05-08 22:47:53 <jrmithdobbs> if anything it's going to spike value
3387 2011-05-08 22:47:58 <ArtForzZz> yep
3388 2011-05-08 22:48:09 <jrmithdobbs> making it even more profitable for 1-2 diff levels
3389 2011-05-08 22:48:27 <jrmithdobbs> giving people who know what they're doing enough time/return to beef up infrastructure and get this shit going in earnest
3390 2011-05-08 22:48:34 <ArtForzZz> it'll bring in a lot of new demand, which is why every miner with 2 brain cells has been hoarding btc
3391 2011-05-08 22:48:50 inductor has quit (Quit: leaving)
3392 2011-05-08 22:49:10 <anarchyx> ive never sold any btc
3393 2011-05-08 22:49:12 <jrmithdobbs> ya, after you recoup initial investment (except mr asic there, ha) there's zero reason to sell right now really
3394 2011-05-08 22:49:17 <anarchyx> i believe in it too much
3395 2011-05-08 22:50:00 <lolcat> If I could get it going so I earn enough to get a new GPU each month, then I would make it profitable
3396 2011-05-08 22:50:15 <lolcat> Everything after the first block is profit with the 5850
3397 2011-05-08 22:50:25 <jrmithdobbs> ArtForzZz: had a fun talk with my ee friend earlier, thinking we can do some fun stuff with 2xfpga pcie1x cards;P
3398 2011-05-08 22:50:43 <ArtForzZz> yup
3399 2011-05-08 22:50:58 <jrmithdobbs> and um, that's basically what he does at work right now, haha
3400 2011-05-08 22:51:06 <ArtForzZz> but don't expect miracles, price/perf on FPGAs is atrocious
3401 2011-05-08 22:51:18 <jrmithdobbs> aye, this is long term
3402 2011-05-08 22:51:38 <jrmithdobbs> once gpu/cycle/watt becomes prohibitive
3403 2011-05-08 22:51:42 <ArtForzZz> yup
3404 2011-05-08 22:52:38 <lolcat> Can I mine a lot on 2000 watts?
3405 2011-05-08 22:52:44 <ArtForzZz> ... not really
3406 2011-05-08 22:52:57 <ArtForzZz> good GPUs get about 2Mh/J
3407 2011-05-08 22:53:03 <ArtForzZz> so thats about 4Ghash
3408 2011-05-08 22:53:32 kimchi has joined
3409 2011-05-08 22:53:32 <lolcat> ;bc,calc 4000000
3410 2011-05-08 22:53:38 <lolcat> ;;bc,calc 4000000
3411 2011-05-08 22:53:38 <gribble> The average time to generate a block at 4000000 Khps, given current difficulty of 109670.13329248 , is 1 day, 8 hours, 42 minutes, and 37 seconds
3412 2011-05-08 22:54:14 <lolcat> $150 a day
3413 2011-05-08 22:54:40 * lolcat wonders how much power he can use before he blows a fuse
3414 2011-05-08 22:54:54 <ArtForzZz> only one way to find out ;)
3415 2011-05-08 22:54:57 kimchi has quit (Client Quit)
3416 2011-05-08 22:55:13 <kakazza> btw. do different models of GFX cards perform differently? GRAM, frequency,... are all the same. Just one is from saphire, the other from XFX.
3417 2011-05-08 22:55:29 <lolcat> Can you mine on Nvidia? Oo
3418 2011-05-08 22:55:43 <kakazza> Yes?
3419 2011-05-08 22:56:05 <ArtForzZz> sure, but compared to nvidia even FPGAs look like a bargain on price/perf
3420 2011-05-08 22:56:29 <lolcat> We have a shop here with a 30 day return policy
3421 2011-05-08 22:56:40 <kakazza> lolcat ;p
3422 2011-05-08 22:56:47 <lolcat> We considered buying a computer each, mining and returing at the end of the month...
3423 2011-05-08 22:56:52 <ArtForzZz> ahh, good old buy-lending ;)
3424 2011-05-08 22:57:13 <lolcat> They had two of the best mining cards
3425 2011-05-08 22:57:16 <kakazza> 30 days of 24/7 100% load. 'yay'
3426 2011-05-08 22:57:50 <lolcat> More like 28 but still
3427 2011-05-08 22:58:04 <ArtForzZz> btw, longer-term chart of $/Mhash: http://bitcoin.atspace.com/income.html
3428 2011-05-08 22:58:59 <lolcat> Could I earn in a better GPU within a month?
3429 2011-05-08 22:59:05 <ArtForzZz> yep
3430 2011-05-08 22:59:09 <jrmithdobbs> lolcat: not prof with 1/ea at current diff
3431 2011-05-08 22:59:22 <lolcat> jrmithdobbs: I don't understand
3432 2011-05-08 22:59:33 <jrmithdobbs> lolcat: if you plan on being able to do it more than once
3433 2011-05-08 22:59:39 kermit has quit (Quit: Leaving.)
3434 2011-05-08 22:59:45 <ArtForzZz> thats the weird thing, if 1 gpu pays off in a month, so do 10
3435 2011-05-08 22:59:46 <jrmithdobbs> lolcat: restocking fees will eat most of the profit
3436 2011-05-08 23:00:09 <kakazza> restocking?
3437 2011-05-08 23:00:20 <jrmithdobbs> kakazza: he was saying buy/run for a month/return
3438 2011-05-08 23:00:42 LightRider has quit (afk!~LightRide@unaffiliated/lightrider|Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
3439 2011-05-08 23:00:44 <lolcat> If I could have one gpu that is twice as expencive, loose 50% value, and earn its own value in, then I would have made a fair profit.
3440 2011-05-08 23:00:49 <lolcat> jrmithdobbs: No restocking fees.
3441 2011-05-08 23:01:16 <ArtForzZz> or just ebay the GPUs "like new" after a few months (use intake filters) ;)
3442 2011-05-08 23:01:19 <lolcat> jrmithdobbs: I am more considering getting just the gpu, sticking it in an OLD box with a pci x16, and letting it run
3443 2011-05-08 23:01:33 <jrmithdobbs> ArtForzZz: that's our plan, ebay them and upgrade them
3444 2011-05-08 23:01:36 <jrmithdobbs> haha
3445 2011-05-08 23:01:52 <jrmithdobbs> btc is going to destroy gpu aftermarket pretty sure
3446 2011-05-08 23:02:25 <jrmithdobbs> lolcat: oh. if only expenditure is the gpu, then ya
3447 2011-05-08 23:02:30 Marcel has left (HSD!~Marcel|HS@router2.hsdev.com|)
3448 2011-05-08 23:02:38 <ArtForzZz> well, it's sure gonna make buying used GPUs even more risky
3449 2011-05-08 23:02:39 <kakazza> Where's the calculator where you can input your price of electricity, hash performance and so on?
3450 2011-05-08 23:02:40 <jrmithdobbs> (but you're not thinking big enough)
3451 2011-05-08 23:02:46 <lolcat> yes, the box is allready there
3452 2011-05-08 23:02:48 <jgarzik> BlueMatt: ?
3453 2011-05-08 23:02:48 <ArtForzZz> yep
3454 2011-05-08 23:02:57 <lolcat> We have at least 2kw to use, times 3
3455 2011-05-08 23:03:01 <ArtForzZz> but "already got 1 box" doesn't scale
3456 2011-05-08 23:03:50 <jrmithdobbs> but 300/box sans gpus does
3457 2011-05-08 23:03:55 <lolcat> ArtForzZz: If a non used box can earn something, then it is better than what it is doing now. I don't have infinite space, or infinite power. But I have a few KW I can use for free, and no point in wasting it.
3458 2011-05-08 23:04:11 <jrmithdobbs> and if you if you make wise choices 300-450/box + gpus is all you need
3459 2011-05-08 23:04:22 <ArtForzZz> jrmithdobbs: depends on the GPUs
3460 2011-05-08 23:04:40 <lolcat> 2x ATI Radeon HD 5970 would that generate fast? That was in the box we considered "borrowing"
3461 2011-05-08 23:04:50 stufi has joined
3462 2011-05-08 23:04:51 <ArtForzZz> about 1.4Ghps OCed
3463 2011-05-08 23:05:11 <lolcat> ;;bc,calc 1400000
3464 2011-05-08 23:05:12 <gribble> The average time to generate a block at 1400000 Khps, given current difficulty of 109670.13329248 , is 3 days, 21 hours, 27 minutes, and 29 seconds
3465 2011-05-08 23:05:15 <jrmithdobbs> ArtForzZz: i'm talking double slot cards at 4x per box, it's doable
3466 2011-05-08 23:05:37 <ArtForzZz> 4 per box? how on earth do you want to cool that?
3467 2011-05-08 23:05:46 <jrmithdobbs> ;P
3468 2011-05-08 23:05:48 <stufi> does anyone know a linux command i can use to detect with a process gets killed and re open it when that happens?
3469 2011-05-08 23:05:55 <stufi> *if a process
3470 2011-05-08 23:06:04 <ArtForzZz> unless you go custom heatsinks or start fucking with risers
3471 2011-05-08 23:06:09 <lolcat> 24/4= 6. 6*50= 300. 300*3,5= 1050
3472 2011-05-08 23:06:21 <jrmithdobbs> ArtForzZz: 5850s + extenders
3473 2011-05-08 23:06:41 <jrmithdobbs> have to be willing to get your hands dirty and hack up some pcie1x connectors
3474 2011-05-08 23:06:50 <ArtForzZz> yep
3475 2011-05-08 23:06:53 <jrmithdobbs> but cooling isn't much of an issue
3476 2011-05-08 23:07:02 <ArtForzZz> true, 5850s arent too bad
3477 2011-05-08 23:07:23 <jrmithdobbs> and the rainbow tables guys have done all the research/grunt work for you
3478 2011-05-08 23:07:26 <lfm> stufi init
3479 2011-05-08 23:07:28 <ArtForzZz> also slower than 2*5970
3480 2011-05-08 23:07:44 <jrmithdobbs> ArtForzZz: but less power and less than half the cost
3481 2011-05-08 23:07:45 <gasteve> stufi: check out daemontools: http://cr.yp.to/daemontools.html
3482 2011-05-08 23:07:51 <ArtForzZz> less power? don't think so
3483 2011-05-08 23:07:54 <stufi> gasteve: let me see
3484 2011-05-08 23:08:01 <jrmithdobbs> ArtForzZz: i'll double check but i think so, yes
3485 2011-05-08 23:08:26 <ArtForzZz> 5850 has the same cypresses as 5870 and 5970, but with 10% disabled shader cores
3486 2011-05-08 23:08:36 <yebyen> what's the average time to a solved block with a 5850? (or anyone who wants to say a length of time based on any MH/s i guess)
3487 2011-05-08 23:08:48 <ArtForzZz> 5850 and 5970 have same core V, 5970 cypresses are selected for low power
3488 2011-05-08 23:09:32 <jrmithdobbs> you can defer power costs for a year tho
3489 2011-05-08 23:09:40 <ArtForzZz> 5850 is really half a 5970 with 10% shaders disabled
3490 2011-05-08 23:10:24 <ArtForzZz> same voltages/clocks/...
3491 2011-05-08 23:10:30 <stufi> gasteve: that wont help me i think i need to monitor if a process crashses, and if it crashes, i need to openn it     again
3492 2011-05-08 23:10:56 <gasteve> supervise does that
3493 2011-05-08 23:11:28 <gruez> can i overvolt a 5850?
3494 2011-05-08 23:13:16 <gruez> I'm thinking of buying a Sapphire 5850 xtreme
3495 2011-05-08 23:13:34 <gjs278> get the gigabyte 5850
3496 2011-05-08 23:13:38 <gjs278> it's already oc'd to 765
3497 2011-05-08 23:13:46 <kakazza> Do you guys all solo or do you pool? (I heard people pool <8GHash/s?
3498 2011-05-08 23:13:46 <gjs278> and it has not one, not three, but two fans
3499 2011-05-08 23:13:53 Guest67157 has quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
3500 2011-05-08 23:14:07 <ArtForzZz> if those are the sapphires with the fan with flattened blade ends, have fun...
3501 2011-05-08 23:14:23 <gjs278> sapphires have that stupid fucking design with the people on it
3502 2011-05-08 23:14:25 <gjs278> that is my only reason
3503 2011-05-08 23:14:27 <gjs278> for never getting it
3504 2011-05-08 23:14:28 <ArtForzZz> those fans are the cheapest piece of chinese crap I've ever seen
3505 2011-05-08 23:14:30 <gjs278> because it looks dumb
3506 2011-05-08 23:15:00 <TheKid> gjs278: that's why I bought visiontek
3507 2011-05-08 23:15:07 <gjs278> seriously
3508 2011-05-08 23:15:08 <TheKid> no design, just plain black :)
3509 2011-05-08 23:15:19 <gjs278> asus has been my card of choice
3510 2011-05-08 23:15:19 <ArtForzZz> sleeve bearing, sitting right over the hottest part of the hatsink... uhhh...
3511 2011-05-08 23:15:23 <gjs278> for the same plain black stuff
3512 2011-05-08 23:15:53 <gruez> why is the "sapphires with the fan with flattened blade ends" bad?
3513 2011-05-08 23:15:58 <gruez> any specifics?
3514 2011-05-08 23:16:15 <lolcat> So my best bet is a 5850?
3515 2011-05-08 23:16:28 <ArtForzZz> <ArtForzZz> those fans are the cheapest piece of chinese crap I've ever seen <ArtForzZz> sleeve bearing, sitting right over the hottest part of the hatsink... uhhh...
3516 2011-05-08 23:16:30 <gjs278> 5870s are more powerful, if you can get a used 5870 for like $180 you're set
3517 2011-05-08 23:16:40 <gjs278> otherwise you can maybe get a 5850 for 150
3518 2011-05-08 23:16:51 <gruez> ArtForzZz: http://www.bjorn3d.com/Material/revimages/video/Sapphire_5850_Xtreme/s3.gif
3519 2011-05-08 23:16:56 <stufi> jgarzik: if i run pushpoold without run blkmond, what could happen? it will still work ?
3520 2011-05-08 23:16:59 <[Tycho]> kakazza, i'm mining in a pool and would recommend you too.
3521 2011-05-08 23:17:08 <gruez> is that the one you're talking about?
3522 2011-05-08 23:17:09 <ArtForzZz> nope, thats a different one
3523 2011-05-08 23:17:31 james has joined
3524 2011-05-08 23:17:40 <ArtForzZz> thoguh it doesnt look much more confidence-inspiring
3525 2011-05-08 23:17:46 <gjs278> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125318&Tpk=gigabyte%205850 $154 dollars
3526 2011-05-08 23:17:51 <gjs278> with rebate
3527 2011-05-08 23:17:57 james is now known as Guest67169
3528 2011-05-08 23:18:00 <gruez> ArtForzZz: but sapphire cards are so much cheaper
3529 2011-05-08 23:18:04 <gruez> where i live, anyways
3530 2011-05-08 23:18:06 <gjs278> how much is the sapphire card
3531 2011-05-08 23:18:08 <gjs278> where do you live
3532 2011-05-08 23:18:21 <gruez> sapphire $130
3533 2011-05-08 23:18:25 <gruez> xfx: $150
3534 2011-05-08 23:18:35 <gjs278> all of the cards will basically get you the exact same speed the only big difference will be how loud and efficient their cooling is
3535 2011-05-08 23:18:35 <gruez> other brands: $200+
3536 2011-05-08 23:19:13 <jrmithdobbs> shitty fans can be pretty easily and cheaply compensated for
3537 2011-05-08 23:19:20 <lolcat> Should I join a mining pool?
3538 2011-05-08 23:19:22 <jrmithdobbs> it all depends on how dirty you're willing to get hackingit all together
3539 2011-05-08 23:19:28 <gjs278> a 5850 will get you about 2 coins a day
3540 2011-05-08 23:19:30 <gjs278> so factor that in
3541 2011-05-08 23:19:42 <gruez> gjs278: 2*3.5 = $7
3542 2011-05-08 23:19:47 <gjs278> yeah
3543 2011-05-08 23:19:48 <lolcat> 5870 will get me?
3544 2011-05-08 23:19:52 skyewm has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
3545 2011-05-08 23:19:53 devon_hillard has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
3546 2011-05-08 23:19:57 <gjs278> hmm
3547 2011-05-08 23:20:02 <gjs278> not sure the exact 5870 rate
3548 2011-05-08 23:20:04 <ArtForzZz> jrmithdobbs: been there, done that, got the t-shirt.
3549 2011-05-08 23:20:13 <gjs278> my asus 5870 does 401 mhash
3550 2011-05-08 23:20:15 <gjs278> so
3551 2011-05-08 23:20:20 <gjs278> figure that on some calculator
3552 2011-05-08 23:20:30 <gjs278> the 5850 does about 300 mhash
3553 2011-05-08 23:20:35 <lolcat> $7 a day will pay in $200 in about a month
3554 2011-05-08 23:20:35 <jgarzik> stufi: it will work, but no new-block notification
3555 2011-05-08 23:20:44 <kakazza> 2 coins a day in a pool?
3556 2011-05-08 23:20:46 <jrmithdobbs> don't oc the sapphire 5850s without fan/cooling mods and they're fine
3557 2011-05-08 23:20:46 <gruez> are some brands better than others in terms of overclocking?
3558 2011-05-08 23:20:48 <gjs278> yes
3559 2011-05-08 23:20:57 draaglom has joined
3560 2011-05-08 23:21:00 <gruez> besides cooling capacity
3561 2011-05-08 23:21:01 <gjs278> 2 coins a day in deepbit
3562 2011-05-08 23:21:09 <stufi> jgarzik: seems people is able to connect poclbm miners to port 8336 but not port 8337 at my pushpoold, do you have idea why ?
3563 2011-05-08 23:21:10 <gjs278> for a 5850 at 765 core
3564 2011-05-08 23:21:15 <jrmithdobbs> gjs278: for like 16 more hours
3565 2011-05-08 23:21:16 <jrmithdobbs> anyways
3566 2011-05-08 23:21:17 <jrmithdobbs> haha
3567 2011-05-08 23:21:19 <kakazza> I see. How can you be paid out? Paypal?
3568 2011-05-08 23:21:44 <gjs278> you trade someone the coins for paypal
3569 2011-05-08 23:21:57 Aahzmundus has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
3570 2011-05-08 23:22:00 <kakazza> So deepbit only pays the BTC, right?
3571 2011-05-08 23:22:03 <gjs278> yes
3572 2011-05-08 23:22:05 <gjs278> they only pay you btc
3573 2011-05-08 23:22:07 <kakazza> Thanks. :)
3574 2011-05-08 23:22:21 <gruez> all pools pay in btc
3575 2011-05-08 23:22:21 Aahzmundus has joined
3576 2011-05-08 23:22:23 <gruez> unless....
3577 2011-05-08 23:22:32 <gruez> i setup a pool that pays using paypal
3578 2011-05-08 23:22:33 <gruez> :p
3579 2011-05-08 23:22:38 <gruez> @ mtgox rate
3580 2011-05-08 23:22:39 <gjs278> you'd have so many fees on that
3581 2011-05-08 23:22:41 <kakazza> ;p
3582 2011-05-08 23:22:44 <gjs278> because paypal would make you go business
3583 2011-05-08 23:23:04 <kakazza> Do you guys use your normal account tied to your real name and so on?
3584 2011-05-08 23:23:05 draag has quit (away!~draaglom@78.148.146.46|Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
3585 2011-05-08 23:23:18 <gruez> kakazza: always a "proxy" account
3586 2011-05-08 23:23:31 <kakazza> Doesn't Paypal block those?
3587 2011-05-08 23:23:33 <jrmithdobbs> don't use paypal if you like keeping your money
3588 2011-05-08 23:23:37 <jrmithdobbs> no matter the topic
3589 2011-05-08 23:23:37 <kakazza> haha
3590 2011-05-08 23:23:46 <kakazza> What do you recommend?
3591 2011-05-08 23:23:52 <jrmithdobbs> not paypal
3592 2011-05-08 23:23:57 <lolcat> I see in the EU mtgox pays out money to bank accounts for a 2% fee
3593 2011-05-08 23:24:02 <lolcat> Wich isn't bad
3594 2011-05-08 23:24:16 <lolcat> Considering I bougth all my coins for $45
3595 2011-05-08 23:24:28 * lolcat has approx 200
3596 2011-05-08 23:24:36 <jrmithdobbs> wonder what it takes to open an eu bank account as a non-citizen
3597 2011-05-08 23:24:44 <jrmithdobbs> or member citizen
3598 2011-05-08 23:24:48 <jrmithdobbs> or however that's phrased
3599 2011-05-08 23:24:55 <lolcat> jrmithdobbs: Difficult here I think.
3600 2011-05-08 23:25:40 <jrmithdobbs> i don't care about hiding identity. not tax evading.
3601 2011-05-08 23:25:47 <gjs278> 2% fee is horrible
3602 2011-05-08 23:25:55 <jrmithdobbs> (and fuck you guys who are, jfyi)
3603 2011-05-08 23:25:57 <gjs278> don't pay that blood money
3604 2011-05-08 23:26:08 <gruez> gjs278: bank transfer isn't free
3605 2011-05-08 23:26:19 <lolcat> gjs278: My bitcoins is worth 14x as much they used to. A 2% fee still has me making tons.
3606 2011-05-08 23:26:22 <gjs278> I've sent money between my paypal and back and have never paid a fee
3607 2011-05-08 23:26:23 kermit has joined
3608 2011-05-08 23:26:31 <gjs278> from my bank account
3609 2011-05-08 23:26:44 <phantomcircuit> gjs278, that's ACH
3610 2011-05-08 23:26:49 <phantomcircuit> which is totally different
3611 2011-05-08 23:27:16 <gjs278> amazon has taken money from my bank account and didn't charge a fee. if that's ACH too, that's all I'm ever willing to use
3612 2011-05-08 23:27:26 <gjs278> everyone in bitcoins wants their cut and I'm not paying into it
3613 2011-05-08 23:27:38 <lolcat> gjs278: You don't use mtgox?
3614 2011-05-08 23:27:40 <gjs278> no
3615 2011-05-08 23:27:41 <jrmithdobbs> not a whole lot of choice right now
3616 2011-05-08 23:27:45 <gruez> gjs278: ffs, it's 2%
3617 2011-05-08 23:27:47 <gjs278> I use mtgox as my price guide
3618 2011-05-08 23:27:52 <gjs278> but I never ever cash out on mtgox
3619 2011-05-08 23:27:53 <lolcat> mtgox much be rich
3620 2011-05-08 23:28:09 <jrmithdobbs> lolcat: he already sold it off, so yes, i'm sure he is
3621 2011-05-08 23:28:13 <lolcat> 0,65% of 17000 is a lot...
3622 2011-05-08 23:28:18 <kakazza> heh
3623 2011-05-08 23:28:23 <gjs278> enjoy putting your money into mtgox usd and then watching the site get ddossed because he just pcokets all of the money instead of actually increasing his capacity
3624 2011-05-08 23:28:33 <gjs278> and then not being able to access it when you need it
3625 2011-05-08 23:28:47 <jrmithdobbs> i would never leaving it sitting there
3626 2011-05-08 23:28:51 <gjs278> yeah
3627 2011-05-08 23:28:53 <jrmithdobbs> giving people free interest is stupid
3628 2011-05-08 23:28:55 <gjs278> it has to be in and out
3629 2011-05-08 23:29:39 <gruez> idea: make a bitcoin bank that gives interest
3630 2011-05-08 23:29:52 <jrmithdobbs> but: gamers with spare gpus aren't exactly brilliant
3631 2011-05-08 23:29:53 <jrmithdobbs> ;P
3632 2011-05-08 23:29:59 <kakazza> hah
3633 2011-05-08 23:30:05 <gruez> jrmithdobbs: that's why they're gamers
3634 2011-05-08 23:30:07 <gruez> :p
3635 2011-05-08 23:30:09 <lolcat> Is there a way to get bitcoin loans?
3636 2011-05-08 23:30:17 <gjs278> loan real money
3637 2011-05-08 23:30:19 <phantomcircuit> lolcat, yeah work out a loan with someone
3638 2011-05-08 23:30:19 <gjs278> buy bitcoins
3639 2011-05-08 23:30:25 <jrmithdobbs> haha
3640 2011-05-08 23:30:28 xenon481 has quit (Quit: Page closed)
3641 2011-05-08 23:30:34 <gjs278> http://img815.imageshack.us/img815/5129/screenshotwqi.png
3642 2011-05-08 23:31:15 <lolcat> I was thinking
3643 2011-05-08 23:31:26 <lolcat> If I take out a mortage, then put all the money in bitcoins.
3644 2011-05-08 23:31:29 <gjs278> http://img41.imageshack.us/img41/5852/screenshotrw.png
3645 2011-05-08 23:31:36 <lolcat> And wait 6 months.
3646 2011-05-08 23:31:37 <gjs278> yeah this is the guy I'm going to give 2% to
3647 2011-05-08 23:31:43 <lolcat> Wouldn't I be insanly rich?
3648 2011-05-08 23:31:45 <jrmithdobbs> lolcat: then you are retarded
3649 2011-05-08 23:31:48 <gruez> gjs278: use https://
3650 2011-05-08 23:31:50 <jrmithdobbs> lolcat: and i hope you lose your house
3651 2011-05-08 23:31:58 <lolcat> I don't have a house
3652 2011-05-08 23:31:59 <gjs278> there we go
3653 2011-05-08 23:32:05 <gruez> lolcat: lol
3654 2011-05-08 23:32:32 <jrmithdobbs> gjs278: wtf, that 'your cache administrator is root' is not confidence inspiring
3655 2011-05-08 23:32:51 <gjs278> it's local
3656 2011-05-08 23:33:12 <gjs278> squid is actually ran as squid
3657 2011-05-08 23:33:21 <gjs278> but I want all of the mail sent to the root account
3658 2011-05-08 23:33:23 <gruez> why have a cache server?
3659 2011-05-08 23:33:36 <gjs278> I use it for the other machines in my room too
3660 2011-05-08 23:33:46 <jrmithdobbs> gjs278: ok that's your squid message, haha
3661 2011-05-08 23:34:25 <gjs278> I've got all of my 80 connections setup to run through it, saves bandwidth when I have to do updates on multiple machines
3662 2011-05-08 23:35:50 <gruez> saving bandwidth?
3663 2011-05-08 23:35:51 <gruez> pfft
3664 2011-05-08 23:35:55 <gjs278> 250gb cap
3665 2011-05-08 23:35:58 <gjs278> from comcast
3666 2011-05-08 23:36:00 <gruez> lol
3667 2011-05-08 23:36:02 <gruez> 250 gb
3668 2011-05-08 23:36:06 <gjs278> yeah
3669 2011-05-08 23:36:09 <jrmithdobbs> haha
3670 2011-05-08 23:36:11 <gruez> lot of bandwidth
3671 2011-05-08 23:36:13 <gjs278> closest I've been is 248gb
3672 2011-05-08 23:36:22 <gjs278> and I basically had to stop doing everything for 3 days
3673 2011-05-08 23:36:24 <gruez> download less pr0n
3674 2011-05-08 23:36:30 <gjs278> my job is porn though
3675 2011-05-08 23:36:35 <jrmithdobbs> i dunno, i easily to 2-4GB off my phone a month
3676 2011-05-08 23:36:37 <gjs278> I have to
3677 2011-05-08 23:36:41 <jrmithdobbs> i could see exceeding 250gb p quick
3678 2011-05-08 23:36:49 <gjs278> I had to do a movie project
3679 2011-05-08 23:36:56 <gjs278> which required dling a fuckton of movies to constantly check them
3680 2011-05-08 23:37:02 <jrmithdobbs> haha
3681 2011-05-08 23:37:52 <phantomcircuit> gjs278, business class isn't limited, you should be able to buy it even at residential addresses
3682 2011-05-08 23:37:56 <gjs278> yeah
3683 2011-05-08 23:37:58 <kakazza> You constantly check porn? what?
3684 2011-05-08 23:37:58 <gjs278> so much though
3685 2011-05-08 23:38:01 <gjs278> like $65 more
3686 2011-05-08 23:38:04 <gjs278> for the 50/10
3687 2011-05-08 23:38:15 <gjs278> just to remove the cap
3688 2011-05-08 23:38:21 <gjs278> if comast had like a $10 for 50gb policy
3689 2011-05-08 23:38:29 <gjs278> I'd maybe use $30? more at the most ever
3690 2011-05-08 23:38:48 <gjs278> they won't send two residential lines to a house, that would be great
3691 2011-05-08 23:39:02 AnonX has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
3692 2011-05-08 23:39:18 <gjs278> I would get the 22/5 and beat the hell out of line 1, flip over to line 2
3693 2011-05-08 23:39:25 <gjs278> and it would cost less than 50/10 would
3694 2011-05-08 23:40:01 <gruez> gjs278: or use both
3695 2011-05-08 23:40:05 <gruez> with load balancer
3696 2011-05-08 23:40:08 <gruez> for 2x speed
3697 2011-05-08 23:40:12 <phantomcircuit> gjs278, sure they will you just tell them that it's an apartment
3698 2011-05-08 23:40:27 <gruez> 2 story apartment
3699 2011-05-08 23:40:40 LightRider has joined
3700 2011-05-08 23:42:13 <gjs278> yeah I've seen the load balancer routers
3701 2011-05-08 23:42:33 <gjs278> that would be cool for usenet with maxing out the separate connections
3702 2011-05-08 23:43:17 <phantomcircuit> lol i load balance my dsl and my neighbours comcast using my dd-wrt
3703 2011-05-08 23:43:19 mmoya has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
3704 2011-05-08 23:43:24 <phantomcircuit> who needs wifi when you can steal interwebz?
3705 2011-05-08 23:43:35 <jrmithdobbs> gjs278: multi-wan routing is a pita when you don't control bgp though
3706 2011-05-08 23:43:44 <genjix> phantomcircuit: sshhh :p
3707 2011-05-08 23:43:50 <jrmithdobbs> gjs278: eg, linux requires 20 bajillion patches to do multi-wan routing with nat
3708 2011-05-08 23:43:55 <phantomcircuit> genjix, lol
3709 2011-05-08 23:44:08 <gjs278> well
3710 2011-05-08 23:44:15 <gjs278> they sell routers that do it at the router level
3711 2011-05-08 23:44:26 <gjs278> I don't think it would be much more complicated than that
3712 2011-05-08 23:44:47 <jrmithdobbs> you're paying $200 more for them to apply the patches for you
3713 2011-05-08 23:44:50 <jrmithdobbs> just so you know ;P
3714 2011-05-08 23:45:16 <gjs278> probably
3715 2011-05-08 23:45:18 <phantomcircuit> well if it takes me more than 2 hours to applythe patches...
3716 2011-05-08 23:45:32 Jkessler has quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
3717 2011-05-08 23:45:40 <gjs278> I spend hours on optimizations that  don't matter
3718 2011-05-08 23:45:54 <gjs278> like why did I spend time overclocking my ram am I crazy how was 1600 not fast enough
3719 2011-05-08 23:45:59 <jrmithdobbs> phantomcircuit: nah, that's the easiest part, haha
3720 2011-05-08 23:46:30 skyewm has joined
3721 2011-05-08 23:46:35 <gjs278> I got it to 1754 and nothing changed except my ownage leve
3722 2011-05-08 23:47:53 <jrmithdobbs> and expected lifetime of the hardware ;P
3723 2011-05-08 23:47:57 <phantomcircuit> ;;bc,calc 250000
3724 2011-05-08 23:47:58 <gribble> The average time to generate a block at 250000 Khps, given current difficulty of 109670.13329248 , is 3 weeks, 0 days, 19 hours, 21 minutes, and 58 seconds
3725 2011-05-08 23:48:05 <molecular> hey python gurus: httplib or httplib2?
3726 2011-05-08 23:49:36 <genjix> urlib
3727 2011-05-08 23:49:45 <genjix> urllib
3728 2011-05-08 23:50:43 <gjs278> well
3729 2011-05-08 23:50:47 <gjs278> I didn't change the voltage
3730 2011-05-08 23:50:54 <gjs278> so hopefully no ill effect will take place
3731 2011-05-08 23:51:02 <jgarzik> stufi: no
3732 2011-05-08 23:52:50 BitterTea has joined
3733 2011-05-08 23:52:50 BitterTea has quit (Changing host)
3734 2011-05-08 23:52:50 BitterTea has joined
3735 2011-05-08 23:52:51 <stufi> Aahzmundus: thanks!
3736 2011-05-08 23:52:51 <stufi> jgarzik: 8336 and 8337 use the same protocol ? and do the same? or they are used for different things at pushpoold?
3737 2011-05-08 23:55:30 <jgarzik> stufi: it depends on your config
3738 2011-05-08 23:55:42 <jgarzik> stufi: your config specifies the protocol
3739 2011-05-08 23:56:16 <afed> is there a problem with using excessively new drivers with sdk 2.1?
3740 2011-05-08 23:56:24 <stufi> jgarzik: "port" : 8336
3741 2011-05-08 23:56:24 <stufi> jgarzik: "port" : 8337, "protocol" : "http-json"
3742 2011-05-08 23:56:27 gjs278 has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
3743 2011-05-08 23:56:31 <stufi> jgarzik: whats the default protocol?
3744 2011-05-08 23:57:22 <stufi> jgarzik: which procotol do i need to use for miners like poclbm and diablominer to be able to connect to it ?
3745 2011-05-08 23:57:39 <yebyen> it is a real bitch to add listings to an amazon store
3746 2011-05-08 23:58:12 <jgarzik> stufi: default is binary (BDP)
3747 2011-05-08 23:58:21 <jgarzik> stufi: poclbm and diablominer use http-json
3748 2011-05-08 23:59:13 <stufi> jgarzik:  "host" : "127.0.0.1", "port" : 8338, "protocol" : "binary"     <<---- that means it will listen on 8338 and accept only connections from localhost?