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20 2011-08-29 00:27:36 <CIA-101> bitcoin: Con Kolivas * r7d34a6b6e391 cgminer/main.c: Statify tv_sort.
21 2011-08-29 00:27:37 <CIA-101> bitcoin: Con Kolivas * r4969162c0303 cgminer/miner.h: Check for SSE2 before trying to build 32 bit SSE2 assembly version. Prevents build failure when yasm is installed but -msse2 is not specified.
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23 2011-08-29 00:36:17 <baz_> yellowhat: that pastbin url didn't work for me
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25 2011-08-29 00:37:17 <yellowhat> well, it should be working .. but i already got the right hint over at #mtgox - the algorithm just ad to be sha512 and not sha1
26 2011-08-29 00:37:25 <yellowhat> now its working already
27 2011-08-29 00:39:08 <lfm> yay, I got 50.0375 btc yesterday, just found out
28 2011-08-29 00:39:43 <lfm> good ole 5770 strikes again
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31 2011-08-29 00:41:30 <baz_> yellowhat: I'd like to see your authentication code if you could share again please, been trying to get this working myself recently
32 2011-08-29 00:41:56 <yellowhat> well, i still see it at http://pastebin.com/AmMJ14z8
33 2011-08-29 00:42:07 <yellowhat> just replace sha1 with sha512
34 2011-08-29 00:42:30 <baz_> yellowhat: ah thanks, not sure why that didn't work for me last time, but I see now!
35 2011-08-29 00:42:31 <yellowhat> its working now, will post a clean verison in the wiki tomorrow
36 2011-08-29 00:43:07 <baz_> yellowhat: that would be great to put working java code on the wiki!
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40 2011-08-29 00:44:33 <yellowhat> in the current verison there might be some libs missing for you but i can clean that up and revert to vanilla JDK. will post it tomorrow most likely
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43 2011-08-29 00:46:08 <baz_> much appreciated kind sir!
44 2011-08-29 00:46:15 <baz_> apache libs I guess?
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52 2011-08-29 00:57:34 <CIA-101> bitcoin: Con Kolivas * rfa91f6a66487 cgminer/configure.ac: Add some defines to configure.ac to enable exporting of values and packaging, and clean up output.
53 2011-08-29 00:57:35 <CIA-101> bitcoin: Con Kolivas * r807ddd1c2e63 cgminer/configure.ac: Give convenient summary at end of ./configure.
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71 2011-08-29 01:37:19 <FellowTraveler> Anyone here been working with the new libbitcoin ?
72 2011-08-29 01:37:27 <aldiyen_> libbitcoin?
73 2011-08-29 01:37:28 c00w has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
74 2011-08-29 01:38:13 <FellowTraveler> https://gitorious.org/libbitcoin
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77 2011-08-29 01:39:44 <aldiyen_> ahh cool
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87 2011-08-29 02:02:34 <CIA-101> bitcoin: Con Kolivas * r5c7ea9e55bd4 cgminer/ (ccan/opt/helpers.c main.c): Display version information and add --version command line option, and make sure we flush stdout.
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100 2011-08-29 02:32:34 <CIA-101> bitcoin: Con Kolivas * r4cc08fe45906 cgminer/main.c: Enable curses after the mining threads are set up so that failure messages won't be lost in the curses interface.
101 2011-08-29 02:32:35 <CIA-101> bitcoin: Con Kolivas * r510bcc3d7e6f cgminer/main.c: Disable curses after inputting a pool if we requested no curses interface.
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120 2011-08-29 03:42:50 <aldiyen_> is there a specification for getwork requests somewhere?
121 2011-08-29 03:43:55 <cjdelisl1> I think there is on the wiki
122 2011-08-29 03:44:09 <aldiyen_> https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Getwork ?
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124 2011-08-29 03:45:29 <cjdelisl1> ahh hmm I guess so.
125 2011-08-29 03:46:01 <aldiyen_> I was hoping for something that would include more data on the message's expected contents
126 2011-08-29 03:46:02 <asher^> aldiyen the request from the miner, the response, or both?
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128 2011-08-29 03:46:09 <aldiyen_> asher^ both
129 2011-08-29 03:46:10 <cjdelisl1> I didn't read carefully I thought you were talking about the message sent between bitcoind implementations
130 2011-08-29 03:46:22 <asher^> the request is just a json-rpc request with 'getwork' as the method
131 2011-08-29 03:46:45 <asher^> 1 sec ill upload some of my packet captures for you
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133 2011-08-29 03:47:16 <aldiyen_> ah ok
134 2011-08-29 03:47:22 <aldiyen_> thanks
135 2011-08-29 03:49:37 <asher^> http://pastebin.com/vTe69qyz
136 2011-08-29 03:49:52 <asher^> just some samples. they dont all correspond to each other
137 2011-08-29 03:50:13 <aldiyen_> cool
138 2011-08-29 03:50:19 <aldiyen_> I was mainly wondering what the id represented
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140 2011-08-29 03:50:32 <aldiyen_> I was able to find that in the general json-rpc documentation
141 2011-08-29 03:51:05 <asher^> i think its just a way to track which responses are linked to which submissions
142 2011-08-29 03:51:17 <aldiyen_> seems like it
143 2011-08-29 03:51:48 <aldiyen_> although using http as the transport it seems unlikely to really be necessary
144 2011-08-29 03:51:54 <asher^> yeah
145 2011-08-29 03:52:11 <asher^> i see 0, 1, 'json' as well as large integers
146 2011-08-29 03:52:26 <aldiyen_> heh 'json'
147 2011-08-29 03:53:12 <asher^> ya
148 2011-08-29 03:53:39 <aldiyen_> I suppose it is defined as having "any value" :P
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185 2011-08-29 05:42:39 <CIA-101> bitcoin: Con Kolivas * r8f788ec92734 cgminer/main.c: Add an option to break out after successfully mining a number of accepted shares.
186 2011-08-29 05:42:40 <CIA-101> bitcoin: Con Kolivas * raf15955b784c cgminer/main.c: Exit with a failed return code if we did not reach opt_shares.
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192 2011-08-29 06:05:56 <Raccoon> do we have an official QR-Code tag yet?
193 2011-08-29 06:06:15 <Raccoon> or at least a working agreed upon tag?
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198 2011-08-29 06:12:41 <SomeoneWeird> no
199 2011-08-29 06:12:53 <Raccoon> you know this to be true?
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202 2011-08-29 06:17:16 <SomeoneWeird> no official qr afaik
203 2011-08-29 06:17:24 <SomeoneWeird> look at forums.
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205 2011-08-29 06:26:08 <luke-jr> ;;bc,stats
206 2011-08-29 06:26:12 <gribble> Current Blocks: 143004 | Current Difficulty: 1805700.8361937 | Next Difficulty At Block: 143135 | Next Difficulty In: 131 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 22 hours, 40 minutes, and 13 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 1781816.55478199
207 2011-08-29 06:26:14 <luke-jr> Raccoon: tag?
208 2011-08-29 06:26:14 <lfm> just qr encode "bitcoin.org"?
209 2011-08-29 06:26:36 <Raccoon> no no. printing qr-codes with bitcoin send addresses
210 2011-08-29 06:26:46 <luke-jr> Raccoon: yes
211 2011-08-29 06:26:47 <SomeoneWeird> oh
212 2011-08-29 06:26:52 <SomeoneWeird> yes thats been done
213 2011-08-29 06:26:59 <Raccoon> i suppose if the bitcoin client were to register the protocol bitcoi://
214 2011-08-29 06:26:59 <luke-jr> Raccoon: just encode a bitcoin: URI as a QRCode
215 2011-08-29 06:27:04 <Raccoon> er bitcoin:/
216 2011-08-29 06:27:05 <luke-jr> bitcoin:1youraddress
217 2011-08-29 06:27:08 <luke-jr> no slashes
218 2011-08-29 06:27:12 <Raccoon> no slashes?
219 2011-08-29 06:27:16 <Raccoon> let me try
220 2011-08-29 06:27:19 <luke-jr> it's not a URL, it's a URN
221 2011-08-29 06:27:30 <luke-jr> also, you need a client that supports it
222 2011-08-29 06:27:32 <luke-jr> like Spesmilo
223 2011-08-29 06:27:35 <lfm> Raccoon: oh, it would depend on an ap that would then send the amount. whoever makes the app designs the qr code as I understand it
224 2011-08-29 06:27:43 <Raccoon> well, as long as the qr reader launches the same application lookup
225 2011-08-29 06:28:16 <Raccoon> eg: magnet://xyzzy for bittorrent magnet addresses
226 2011-08-29 06:28:38 <luke-jr> Raccoon: https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/URI_Scheme
227 2011-08-29 06:28:43 <lfm> so like a price tag with the store address and amount for an item or even a dynamic display for a total purchase
228 2011-08-29 06:29:02 <Raccoon> the official client supports it?
229 2011-08-29 06:29:13 <lfm> no, the app is yet to be built
230 2011-08-29 06:29:14 <luke-jr> Raccoon: there is no official
231 2011-08-29 06:29:23 <luke-jr> Raccoon: the one on bitcoin.org does not
232 2011-08-29 06:29:26 <Raccoon> there is an official desktop bitcoin client
233 2011-08-29 06:29:29 <Raccoon> look at the topic
234 2011-08-29 06:29:31 <luke-jr> lfm: Spesmilo and various other clients support it
235 2011-08-29 06:29:37 <Raccoon> it can register bitcoi: URIs
236 2011-08-29 06:29:40 <luke-jr> Raccoon: it's not official
237 2011-08-29 06:29:45 <luke-jr> it's just one of many
238 2011-08-29 06:29:57 <luke-jr> happens to be the most popular right now, and the original one
239 2011-08-29 06:29:59 <Raccoon> luke-jr: 0.3.24 is the official bitcoin client
240 2011-08-29 06:30:03 <luke-jr> Raccoon: no
241 2011-08-29 06:30:10 <Raccoon> get over the semantics
242 2011-08-29 06:30:14 <luke-jr> "official" implies authority, which is against the whole point of Bitcoin
243 2011-08-29 06:30:25 <lfm> Raccoon: Spesmilo is an alt UI, not the standard ui
244 2011-08-29 06:30:27 <Raccoon> it is distributed by the project leader
245 2011-08-29 06:30:39 <luke-jr> Raccoon: the project leader of one client
246 2011-08-29 06:30:51 <lfm> what project leader? there are many projectsa
247 2011-08-29 06:30:54 <Raccoon> it standardizes the protocol and changes made
248 2011-08-29 06:31:00 <luke-jr> Raccoon: no, it doesn't.
249 2011-08-29 06:31:13 <luke-jr> the democratic user base does
250 2011-08-29 06:31:16 <Raccoon> anyway, off topic nonsenes
251 2011-08-29 06:31:26 <lfm> not off topic
252 2011-08-29 06:31:28 <Raccoon> does the aformentioned client register bitcoin: uri
253 2011-08-29 06:31:34 <luke-jr> no
254 2011-08-29 06:31:37 <Raccoon> ok
255 2011-08-29 06:31:41 <Raccoon> let me know when it does
256 2011-08-29 06:31:47 <luke-jr> probably never at this rate
257 2011-08-29 06:31:52 <lfm> register?
258 2011-08-29 06:31:55 <Raccoon> then i can start accepting bitcoin payments
259 2011-08-29 06:32:02 <luke-jr> Raccoon: you can start now
260 2011-08-29 06:32:15 <Raccoon> not if the user has to type in anything with his fingers
261 2011-08-29 06:32:18 <luke-jr> Raccoon: Bitbills are doing text QR-Codes with just the address
262 2011-08-29 06:32:20 <lfm> ya, why cant you accept payments?
263 2011-08-29 06:32:21 <luke-jr> users can copy and paste
264 2011-08-29 06:32:30 <Raccoon> [00:22] <luke-jr> users can copy and paste
265 2011-08-29 06:32:33 <Raccoon> lol
266 2011-08-29 06:32:37 <Raccoon> are you sure about that?
267 2011-08-29 06:32:41 <luke-jr> ok, maybe not
268 2011-08-29 06:32:41 <copumpkin> is there a mechanism for attaching messages to transactions (possibly encrypted with the recipient's public key)?
269 2011-08-29 06:32:42 <luke-jr> :|
270 2011-08-29 06:32:50 <luke-jr> copumpkin: not yet
271 2011-08-29 06:32:55 <copumpkin> it's planned?
272 2011-08-29 06:33:00 <lfm> copumpkin: no
273 2011-08-29 06:33:03 <luke-jr> copumpkin: there's a protocol half-baked on the forum, but it's been dead lately
274 2011-08-29 06:33:05 <copumpkin> ah
275 2011-08-29 06:33:08 <lfm> copumpkin: not any more
276 2011-08-29 06:33:10 <luke-jr> copumpkin: care to revive it? it's called signmessage
277 2011-08-29 06:33:12 <Raccoon> i suggested it sometime in like january
278 2011-08-29 06:33:17 <Raccoon> not sure why nobody does it
279 2011-08-29 06:33:29 <lfm> why have messages?
280 2011-08-29 06:33:30 <copumpkin> I don't really care enough about it, but it seems neat
281 2011-08-29 06:33:34 <copumpkin> I suppose most people feel the same way
282 2011-08-29 06:33:38 <copumpkin> or it'd be happening :)
283 2011-08-29 06:33:46 <luke-jr> Raccoon: the developers of the bitcoin.org client are opposed to most features
284 2011-08-29 06:34:00 <imsaguy> derp
285 2011-08-29 06:34:04 <luke-jr> they want bugs fixed first, at least
286 2011-08-29 06:34:05 <lfm> Raccoon: the developers of the bitcoin.org client are opposed to most bloated fluff
287 2011-08-29 06:34:15 <Raccoon> eg, as a place to attach a physical shipping address
288 2011-08-29 06:34:15 <luke-jr> lfm: not everything thinks it's fluff
289 2011-08-29 06:34:33 <imsaguy> Raccoon, that would be a terrible use
290 2011-08-29 06:34:38 <lfm> doesnt matter what proponents of bloated fluff think
291 2011-08-29 06:34:39 <luke-jr> they've been going on about multi-sender transactions lately-- THAT is fluff
292 2011-08-29 06:34:49 <luke-jr> very few people need that
293 2011-08-29 06:34:53 <copumpkin> presumably you'd want to pad the encrypted message so as to reveal less information
294 2011-08-29 06:34:56 <imsaguy> you're already negotiating the transaction outside bitcoin, negotiate the address there
295 2011-08-29 06:35:13 <luke-jr> copumpkin: it doesn't do encryption, just signing
296 2011-08-29 06:35:19 <copumpkin> ah
297 2011-08-29 06:35:26 <luke-jr> imsaguy: that's a hacky workaround
298 2011-08-29 06:35:29 <lfm> copumpkin: just use unique address for each transaction and you shouldnt need messages
299 2011-08-29 06:35:31 <copumpkin> I guess you don't necessarily know the recipient's public key
300 2011-08-29 06:35:33 <luke-jr> imsaguy: easier to send a signed email
301 2011-08-29 06:35:42 <imsaguy> luke-jr, you missed the point
302 2011-08-29 06:35:59 <imsaguy> there's not reason to include shipping addresses as part of the bitcoin transmission
303 2011-08-29 06:36:01 <imsaguy> no*
304 2011-08-29 06:36:01 <luke-jr> imsaguy: a single QR-Code with a fixed address and email makes it much easier for merchants
305 2011-08-29 06:36:11 <luke-jr> imsaguy: I didn't say put it in the transmission
306 2011-08-29 06:36:15 <imsaguy> exactly
307 2011-08-29 06:36:17 <luke-jr> imsaguy: I said email it, signed with the sending key
308 2011-08-29 06:36:30 <imsaguy> my response was to that
309 2011-08-29 06:36:31 <imsaguy> had nothing to do with you
310 2011-08-29 06:36:34 <luke-jr> oh
311 2011-08-29 06:36:59 <imsaguy> <Raccoon> eg, as a place to attach a physical shipping address
312 2011-08-29 06:37:13 <luke-jr> but anyhow, if merchants can print a single thing with an unchanging payment address + email, that would make it a lot easier for them
313 2011-08-29 06:37:41 <imsaguy> they can
314 2011-08-29 06:37:50 <luke-jr> imsaguy: not right now
315 2011-08-29 06:38:06 <luke-jr> without signmessage, people can dispute who paid
316 2011-08-29 06:39:49 <luke-jr> btw, lots of txn spam today
317 2011-08-29 06:42:00 <imsaguy> lol
318 2011-08-29 06:42:12 <imsaguy> especially coming from you
319 2011-08-29 06:42:34 <luke-jr> imsaguy: ?
320 2011-08-29 06:42:48 <luke-jr> Eligius is the only pool actively fighting txn spam
321 2011-08-29 06:43:29 <imsaguy> do you still add prayer's?
322 2011-08-29 06:43:34 <imsaguy> prayers*
323 2011-08-29 06:43:48 <Raccoon> hmm
324 2011-08-29 06:43:49 <imsaguy> 'spam' is relative.
325 2011-08-29 06:43:57 marktraceur has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
326 2011-08-29 06:45:11 <Raccoon> problem with omission of '//' from a bitcoin URI is the syntax validation of many existing applications that check the correctness of links (of any protocol) and will automatically inject '//' or will prepend 'http://' in the absence of '://'
327 2011-08-29 06:45:49 lolwat` has quit (Quit: Leaving)
328 2011-08-29 06:45:52 <imsaguy> google does it with their chrome:// extensions
329 2011-08-29 06:46:02 <luke-jr> Raccoon: that's a bug with those applications
330 2011-08-29 06:46:13 <luke-jr> Raccoon: read the relevant specifications
331 2011-08-29 06:46:23 <luke-jr> // is not supposed to be used for these kind of things
332 2011-08-29 06:46:32 <luke-jr> see mailto: for a common example
333 2011-08-29 06:46:35 <wumpus> it should only add // for protocols like http
334 2011-08-29 06:46:37 <wumpus> exactly
335 2011-08-29 06:46:47 <Raccoon> bugs of popular appliations are met with facilitating compatability, if begrudgingly
336 2011-08-29 06:47:01 <wumpus> I've been trying around a bit with bitcoin: URLs and did not find any issue with programs adding //
337 2011-08-29 06:47:24 <Raccoon> how about [url] BB tags
338 2011-08-29 06:47:36 <wumpus> those completely refuse unknown protocols
339 2011-08-29 06:47:40 <wumpus> out of fear for javascript
340 2011-08-29 06:47:47 <Raccoon> they like to prepend 'http://' if no :// is present
341 2011-08-29 06:47:49 <wumpus> so it's a matter of adding a handler...
342 2011-08-29 06:47:58 <luke-jr> Raccoon: even with //, they refuse it
343 2011-08-29 06:48:02 <wumpus> yes they add http... but no bitcoin://
344 2011-08-29 06:48:04 <Raccoon> no.
345 2011-08-29 06:48:14 * luke-jr wrote a patch for bitcointalk, but they haven't applied it
346 2011-08-29 06:48:15 <wumpus> so making it bitcoin:// would not save you
347 2011-08-29 06:48:19 <Raccoon> some boards will restrict which handlers can be used
348 2011-08-29 06:48:34 <Raccoon> i've used irc:// on some, and they will take foo://
349 2011-08-29 06:48:41 <wumpus> so why would the standard need to be complicated to facilitate some crappy php code anyway
350 2011-08-29 06:48:52 <Raccoon> complicated?
351 2011-08-29 06:49:32 <wumpus> yes, simply change your code, and that standard as simple as possible, which means leave out all unneeded elements.. otherwise you'll never get rid of technical debt
352 2011-08-29 06:50:05 <Raccoon> what's complicated is the debate that the size= value ought be suffixed with X8 instead of left blank
353 2011-08-29 06:50:05 <wumpus> as everyone that did development in a big company probably knows, madness lies that way :-)
354 2011-08-29 06:50:19 <wumpus> Raccoon: yes I'm also against that
355 2011-08-29 06:50:21 <Raccoon> which is nice and all from a hard edge geek prespective
356 2011-08-29 06:50:24 <Raccoon> but in practice
357 2011-08-29 06:50:36 <Raccoon> 99.99999999% of all amounts would be of BTC
358 2011-08-29 06:50:38 <wumpus> I prefer using amount=123.456
359 2011-08-29 06:50:47 <wumpus> simpler to parse and simpler to understand
360 2011-08-29 06:51:03 <Raccoon> and user-forms that fill the values wouldn't need javascript to modify the data
361 2011-08-29 06:51:19 <Raccoon> by default, form input -> ?value=
362 2011-08-29 06:51:41 <wumpus> please do add javascript for validation, though, we're in 2011 now :-)
363 2011-08-29 06:51:45 <Raccoon> you'd have to add complicated string manipulation to place X8 at the end in many cases
364 2011-08-29 06:52:03 <Raccoon> yeah, especially C applications
365 2011-08-29 06:52:25 <Raccoon> not everyone uses a web browser to 'do things'
366 2011-08-29 06:52:35 <Raccoon> especially on tiny things
367 2011-08-29 06:53:06 fnord0 has joined
368 2011-08-29 06:54:29 <luke-jr> Raccoon: it's amount=
369 2011-08-29 06:54:36 <luke-jr> Raccoon: 99% of amounts *today* are BTC
370 2011-08-29 06:54:47 <luke-jr> Raccoon: tomorrow might be mBTC
371 2011-08-29 06:54:49 <Raccoon> today is a good day
372 2011-08-29 06:55:04 <Raccoon> nan
373 2011-08-29 06:55:09 <luke-jr> Raccoon: the thing about URI formats, is that they can't just be changed later :P
374 2011-08-29 06:55:22 dlb76 has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
375 2011-08-29 06:55:36 <Raccoon> they really can be
376 2011-08-29 06:55:42 marktraceur has joined
377 2011-08-29 06:56:14 <luke-jr> Raccoon: and all of a sudden all those 5 BTC payment links become 5 mBTC?
378 2011-08-29 06:56:18 <wumpus> luke-jr: yes, adding an exponent was somehow sane.. but the 8 offset is crazy
379 2011-08-29 06:56:25 <luke-jr> wumpus: ?
380 2011-08-29 06:56:30 <Raccoon> but i dont know of any currency or for that matter any website that accepted a currency with a changed decimal location
381 2011-08-29 06:56:38 <wumpus> luke-jr: the exponent is 8-exp
382 2011-08-29 06:56:43 <wumpus> luke-jr: at least on the wiki page
383 2011-08-29 06:56:44 <luke-jr> Raccoon: there's nothing special about BTC
384 2011-08-29 06:56:47 <luke-jr> wumpus: that's what BTC is
385 2011-08-29 06:57:03 <luke-jr> BTC = 100,000,000 raw bitcoin units
386 2011-08-29 06:57:03 <wumpus> luke-jr: just using 10E3 would have been scientific and more clear
387 2011-08-29 06:57:12 <wumpus> raw bitcon units are only a convention as well
388 2011-08-29 06:57:21 <luke-jr> nope
389 2011-08-29 06:57:23 <wumpus> they can be changed later on
390 2011-08-29 06:57:27 <luke-jr> not really, no
391 2011-08-29 06:57:34 <wumpus> if more subsdivision is needed and we switch to 128 bit numbers
392 2011-08-29 06:57:36 <wumpus> yes it is
393 2011-08-29 06:57:39 <Raccoon> anyway, the addresses need to be human readable
394 2011-08-29 06:57:45 <luke-jr> Raccoon: no, they don't
395 2011-08-29 06:57:49 <luke-jr> they need to be human-writable
396 2011-08-29 06:57:55 <luke-jr> and program-readable
397 2011-08-29 06:57:59 <Raccoon> and 50X8 somehow implies 400 BTC
398 2011-08-29 06:58:06 <luke-jr> Raccoon: huh? no
399 2011-08-29 06:58:11 <Raccoon> no, they need to be human readable.
400 2011-08-29 06:58:15 <wumpus> no, 50X8 would be 50 btc...
401 2011-08-29 06:58:19 <Raccoon> as much as possible
402 2011-08-29 06:58:31 <Raccoon> people get leary about things they can't read
403 2011-08-29 06:58:36 <Raccoon> "it's a virus!"
404 2011-08-29 06:58:43 <Raccoon> especially when money is involved
405 2011-08-29 06:58:59 <vegard> especially when people are involved
406 2011-08-29 06:59:00 <luke-jr> Raccoon: well they won't read a bitcoin address no matter what you do
407 2011-08-29 06:59:04 <wumpus> but I agree it would have been better to just use 50, then use 50E-3 kind of exponents for millibitcoins etc...
408 2011-08-29 06:59:14 <Raccoon> luke-jr: you've never used QR codes before
409 2011-08-29 06:59:20 <Raccoon> let me know when you have
410 2011-08-29 06:59:33 <luke-jr> Raccoon: sure I have
411 2011-08-29 06:59:37 <Raccoon> the first and only thing the user will see is the address
412 2011-08-29 06:59:49 <Raccoon> they will review the address before getting up the courage to press GO
413 2011-08-29 06:59:56 <luke-jr> wumpus: that gives BTC some kind of special treatment
414 2011-08-29 07:00:09 <wumpus> luke-jr: you could also write 50E0
415 2011-08-29 07:00:12 <luke-jr> Raccoon: press go? my reader just opens it
416 2011-08-29 07:00:18 <Raccoon> you're special
417 2011-08-29 07:00:22 <wumpus> luke-jr: if you're against the special treatment :p
418 2011-08-29 07:00:25 <luke-jr> wumpus: that's 50 Satoshis
419 2011-08-29 07:00:36 <wumpus> no, that would be 50 bitcoins.. in sane scientific notation
420 2011-08-29 07:00:40 <luke-jr> Raccoon: and nothign will make bitcoin addresses readable
421 2011-08-29 07:00:44 <wumpus> satoshis are bullshit
422 2011-08-29 07:00:49 <luke-jr> wumpus: BTCs are
423 2011-08-29 07:00:54 <luke-jr> decimal is crap
424 2011-08-29 07:00:59 <Raccoon> luke-jr: not even vanity addresses?
425 2011-08-29 07:01:07 larsivi has joined
426 2011-08-29 07:01:09 <luke-jr> Raccoon: that's a flaw with vanity addresses ;)
427 2011-08-29 07:01:39 <Raccoon> luke-jr: we love you but playing devil's advocate for the mere sake of it is wearing thin.
428 2011-08-29 07:01:47 <Raccoon> i'm glad you don't have any final say in anything
429 2011-08-29 07:03:05 <luke-jr> Raccoon: no, it really is a flaw
430 2011-08-29 07:03:19 <Raccoon> a bug
431 2011-08-29 07:03:24 <luke-jr> you're less likely to notice someone replacing the address out from under you, if you just look for the vanity part
432 2011-08-29 07:03:31 <Raccoon> so the client should reject dictionary words from addresses
433 2011-08-29 07:03:34 <luke-jr> hmm, I guess that might be arguable
434 2011-08-29 07:03:37 Akinava has joined
435 2011-08-29 07:03:44 * Raccoon sighs
436 2011-08-29 07:03:49 <luke-jr> Raccoon: no, then people will just do leet speak
437 2011-08-29 07:04:16 huk has quit ()
438 2011-08-29 07:04:20 <vegard> it would have been nice if the total number of bitcoins were a power of two, though *sigh*
439 2011-08-29 07:04:39 <luke-jr> vegard: why? O.o
440 2011-08-29 07:04:55 <vegard> because it fits in with the "bit" part of bitcoin
441 2011-08-29 07:05:09 <Raccoon> it was satoshi's remark to human readability being superior to computational flattery
442 2011-08-29 07:05:22 cjdelisl1 has quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
443 2011-08-29 07:05:23 <Raccoon> thus, ammount=BTC would have been supported
444 2011-08-29 07:05:48 <luke-jr> Raccoon: it is, kindof
445 2011-08-29 07:06:14 <luke-jr> Raccoon: if you notice, while the spec requires X#, it also specifies implementations should assume X8 for decimal numbers missing a X#
446 2011-08-29 07:06:33 <Raccoon> the latter section says that, but the previous section denies it
447 2011-08-29 07:06:43 <Raccoon> 'NOT BTC"
448 2011-08-29 07:07:17 <luke-jr> Raccoon: because it's not allowed, just tolerated ;P
449 2011-08-29 07:07:33 <Raccoon> it's not tolerated if not allowed
450 2011-08-29 07:07:45 cjdelisle has joined
451 2011-08-29 07:07:52 <luke-jr> Raccoon: don't do much with protocol specifications? :P
452 2011-08-29 07:08:02 danbri has joined
453 2011-08-29 07:08:07 <Raccoon> if something is not allowed, it is validated against
454 2011-08-29 07:08:11 <Raccoon> don't code much/
455 2011-08-29 07:08:27 <luke-jr> Raccoon: HTML is one well-known example of specifying behaviour of invalid content
456 2011-08-29 07:09:07 <luke-jr> ugh, more txn spam
457 2011-08-29 07:09:20 * luke-jr wonders if we can get more pools to filter that crap
458 2011-08-29 07:09:31 <Diablo-D3> HTML is an example of doing every fucking thing wrong
459 2011-08-29 07:09:38 <Diablo-D3> and somehow becoming the most important thing in the process
460 2011-08-29 07:09:48 pixglen has joined
461 2011-08-29 07:09:50 <vegard> luke-jr: blockexplorer link?
462 2011-08-29 07:09:52 <Diablo-D3> its like a Republican plot of some sort, but even they're not evil enough
463 2011-08-29 07:10:00 <luke-jr> vegard: it's not in blocks yet obviously
464 2011-08-29 07:10:03 <luke-jr> vegard: #bitcoin-watch
465 2011-08-29 07:10:12 <Raccoon> ug
466 2011-08-29 07:10:21 <vegard> oh. thanks
467 2011-08-29 07:10:31 <Raccoon> i just spent the last hour trying to find official/recognized QR-Code 'Types'
468 2011-08-29 07:10:41 <Raccoon> i can find generators with all sorts of types
469 2011-08-29 07:10:48 <Raccoon> but no underlying specifications
470 2011-08-29 07:11:00 <Raccoon> http://www.qrstuff.com/ is an example of excessive tag support
471 2011-08-29 07:11:12 <luke-jr> lol
472 2011-08-29 07:11:14 <doublec> heh, someone embedding url's in the blockchain now
473 2011-08-29 07:11:22 <doublec> interesting new spam vector
474 2011-08-29 07:11:24 <luke-jr> doublec: srsly?
475 2011-08-29 07:11:30 <Raccoon> doublec: how so?
476 2011-08-29 07:11:33 mnass_ has joined
477 2011-08-29 07:11:37 <Raccoon> oooh
478 2011-08-29 07:11:40 <doublec> "One of the many ways of doing everything well is to ... http://bit.ly/okwJu8
479 2011-08-29 07:11:49 <luke-jr> oh, that one isn't spam
480 2011-08-29 07:11:55 <luke-jr> just coinbase
481 2011-08-29 07:12:07 wardearia has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
482 2011-08-29 07:12:09 <Raccoon> someone should embed "Bad Words" into the block chain that anti-virus definitions pick up on.
483 2011-08-29 07:12:18 <luke-jr> Raccoon: shhhhh
484 2011-08-29 07:12:19 <doublec> well, I'm saying spammers can start embedding url's
485 2011-08-29 07:12:25 <luke-jr> Raccoon: there's no defense against that
486 2011-08-29 07:12:28 <Raccoon> lol
487 2011-08-29 07:12:30 <doublec> and people will follow out of curiosity
488 2011-08-29 07:12:48 <Raccoon> hmm, what's that one word now
489 2011-08-29 07:13:02 <Raccoon> that causes Nortan Internet Security to immediately delete the file (default settings)
490 2011-08-29 07:13:05 <luke-jr> doublec: hmm, perhaps not a good precedent to set
491 2011-08-29 07:13:11 <Raccoon> it's a good word to use if you want IRC logs deleted
492 2011-08-29 07:13:17 <luke-jr> doublec: the first one is more fun btw
493 2011-08-29 07:13:30 <Raccoon> oh yeah
494 2011-08-29 07:13:34 <Raccoon> "startkeylogger"
495 2011-08-29 07:13:38 <luke-jr> â¦
496 2011-08-29 07:13:45 <Raccoon> (sorry if your log file just disappeared)
497 2011-08-29 07:14:04 <doublec> luke-jr: hehe, nice
498 2011-08-29 07:14:09 <luke-jr> only 34 clicks on the rickroll so far
499 2011-08-29 07:14:15 <doublec> coinbase has become a messaging system
500 2011-08-29 07:14:33 <luke-jr> doublec: it was from the start
501 2011-08-29 07:14:35 joeschmoe has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
502 2011-08-29 07:14:43 molecular has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
503 2011-08-29 07:14:52 <Raccoon> where are you guys talking about?
504 2011-08-29 07:15:02 mnass__ has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
505 2011-08-29 07:15:10 <luke-jr> Raccoon: Satoshi put a place for messages in blocks
506 2011-08-29 07:15:19 molecular has joined
507 2011-08-29 07:15:28 <luke-jr> Raccoon: militant atheists were complaining about prayers, so I rickrolled them
508 2011-08-29 07:15:43 <Raccoon> what were you referencing "first one is more fun btw" and "rickroll"
509 2011-08-29 07:15:54 <Raccoon> where is that visible
510 2011-08-29 07:15:57 <luke-jr> Raccoon: rickroll was the first URI in a coinbase
511 2011-08-29 07:16:02 <luke-jr> strings -n21 ~/.bitcoin/blk0001.dat
512 2011-08-29 07:16:03 <cacheson> says the militant christian fascist
513 2011-08-29 07:16:04 * copumpkin becomes a militant taxationist, and sticks lots of messages reminding people to pay their taxes on btc earnings
514 2011-08-29 07:16:21 <Raccoon> "coinbase"?
515 2011-08-29 07:16:26 * copumpkin laughs evilly
516 2011-08-29 07:16:36 <luke-jr> Raccoon: the part of the block for messages
517 2011-08-29 07:16:53 <Raccoon> why doesn't the client have that field? :p
518 2011-08-29 07:17:02 <luke-jr> why doesn't the client have most fields? -.-
519 2011-08-29 07:17:05 <Raccoon> are they visible on blockexplorer
520 2011-08-29 07:17:06 <copumpkin> the "pay your taxes" field?
521 2011-08-29 07:17:11 <Raccoon> heh
522 2011-08-29 07:17:13 <luke-jr> Raccoon: no, but pident shows them
523 2011-08-29 07:17:26 <luke-jr> copumpkin: actually, some kind of tax calculator might be nice
524 2011-08-29 07:17:36 <luke-jr> but IMO fee control is more important first
525 2011-08-29 07:17:44 <copumpkin> yeah :)
526 2011-08-29 07:18:01 <copumpkin> I was mostly joking as the kind of person this community attracts is generally pretty heavily opposed to the notion of taxation
527 2011-08-29 07:18:50 <luke-jr> copumpkin: at the same time, most prominent people involved with Bitcoin stress that people must pay their taxes ;)
528 2011-08-29 07:19:03 <Diablo-D3> bitcoin tx fees are taxes.
529 2011-08-29 07:19:09 <luke-jr> which makes good sense-- if people abuse it to evade taxes, it's more likely to be made illegal
530 2011-08-29 07:19:14 <luke-jr> Diablo-D3: are not
531 2011-08-29 07:19:19 <Diablo-D3> are too
532 2011-08-29 07:19:23 <copumpkin> it's unclear if that's a "look, we aren't all crazy drug dealers. Lots of us are honest people, I promise" move, though
533 2011-08-29 07:19:23 <Raccoon> ok... this is... weird. google for pident bitcoin
534 2011-08-29 07:19:27 <luke-jr> Diablo-D3: good luck telling the IRS that
535 2011-08-29 07:19:32 <Raccoon> it assumes i meant president, but it doesn't say so
536 2011-08-29 07:19:37 <Diablo-D3> you pay them to the government of bitcoin
537 2011-08-29 07:19:38 <Raccoon> it just does
538 2011-08-29 07:19:53 <imsaguy> good luck telling the irs ANYTHING about bitcoin.
539 2011-08-29 07:19:55 <Diablo-D3> thus, I just ruined bitcoin for everyone in here.
540 2011-08-29 07:19:55 <luke-jr> Raccoon: use doublequotes around pident
541 2011-08-29 07:21:03 <luke-jr> k guys, I'm heading to bed
542 2011-08-29 07:26:07 <Blitzboom> good night, religius
543 2011-08-29 07:28:03 wardearia has joined
544 2011-08-29 07:28:16 <SomeoneWeird> lol
545 2011-08-29 07:31:26 <Raccoon> bitcoin addresses are -always- 34 characters long?
546 2011-08-29 07:31:32 <luke-jr> no
547 2011-08-29 07:31:34 <Raccoon> or is there a chance they can be shorter?
548 2011-08-29 07:31:40 <luke-jr> often shorter
549 2011-08-29 07:31:53 <Raccoon> often is a choice word?
550 2011-08-29 07:32:18 <imsaguy> aka usually
551 2011-08-29 07:32:25 <imsaguy> frequently
552 2011-08-29 07:32:27 <Raccoon> so 34 is a rarity?
553 2011-08-29 07:32:30 <luke-jr> night 4 realz now :P
554 2011-08-29 07:32:36 <imsaguy> haha
555 2011-08-29 07:32:36 <luke-jr> Raccoon: I think 33-34 is common
556 2011-08-29 07:32:41 <imsaguy> see you in 10 luke-jr
557 2011-08-29 07:32:42 <Raccoon> btw
558 2011-08-29 07:32:44 <luke-jr> now lemme go :P
559 2011-08-29 07:32:54 <Raccoon> where can i find a quick app to generate addresses and dump to file
560 2011-08-29 07:33:06 <Raccoon> speedy generate a million addys
561 2011-08-29 07:33:15 <luke-jr> imsaguy: someone brainwashed commented on "overpopulation" in -otc, so I had to point out the whole Texas thing
562 2011-08-29 07:33:28 <luke-jr> Raccoon: bad idea. :P
563 2011-08-29 07:33:32 <imsaguy> I know, I saw
564 2011-08-29 07:33:34 <luke-jr> Raccoon: search vanitygen on forums
565 2011-08-29 07:33:34 <Raccoon> bad why
566 2011-08-29 07:33:42 <luke-jr> Raccoon: blows up your wallet file :P
567 2011-08-29 07:33:49 <Raccoon> outside of the wallet
568 2011-08-29 07:33:51 <imsaguy> 'brainwashed' is a poor choice of word
569 2011-08-29 07:34:15 <luke-jr> imsaguy: perhaps, but I can't think of any other way someone would think of such nonsense
570 2011-08-29 07:34:25 <luke-jr> srsly, I need to get to bedâ¦
571 2011-08-29 07:34:26 <imsaguy> ignorant perhaps, misinformed maybe, not necessarily brainwashed
572 2011-08-29 07:34:32 <imsaguy> no one is holding you
573 2011-08-29 07:34:40 <imsaguy> (or maybe they are ;)
574 2011-08-29 07:34:51 <luke-jr> now I have to find xkcd for you
575 2011-08-29 07:35:05 <luke-jr> http://xkcd.com/386/
576 2011-08-29 07:35:14 <imsaguy> totally
577 2011-08-29 07:39:00 FellowTraveler has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
578 2011-08-29 07:44:50 larsivi has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
579 2011-08-29 07:46:32 <shadders> Anyone know if there's any performance disadvantage to working with a protobufs builder rather than working with the built message? I mean for accessing it's properties etc... not sending it across the wire
580 2011-08-29 07:49:06 lookdang has joined
581 2011-08-29 07:49:47 noagendamarket has joined
582 2011-08-29 07:52:25 <SeriousWorm> shadders: java? I don't think so
583 2011-08-29 07:52:37 nr9 has joined
584 2011-08-29 07:53:12 <SeriousWorm> actually I'm 100% positive they are the same
585 2011-08-29 07:53:45 <SeriousWorm> I just compared the getters from a Builder and its Message in a .java file
586 2011-08-29 07:53:46 <shadders> SeriousWorm: yes java... Need a mutable message when it comes off the wire. But I'll need to change all my handlers to either accept the Message or the Builder so want to make sure before I change it all..
587 2011-08-29 07:54:21 <SeriousWorm> erm
588 2011-08-29 07:54:27 <SeriousWorm> ComplexMessageOrBuilder? :D
589 2011-08-29 07:54:33 Diablo-D3 has quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
590 2011-08-29 07:54:35 <SeriousWorm> (replace Complex with message name)
591 2011-08-29 07:54:49 <SeriousWorm> of course that interface only has getters.
592 2011-08-29 07:55:03 <shadders> which makes it kind of useless..
593 2011-08-29 07:55:22 <SeriousWorm> <shameless plug> btw check out my scala implementation https://github.com/SandroGrzicic/ScalaBuff
594 2011-08-29 07:55:24 <shadders> I've jump through all kinds of hoops to minimize casting already
595 2011-08-29 07:56:07 <SeriousWorm> input proto: https://github.com/SandroGrzicic/ScalaBuff/blob/master/src/test/resources/proto/complex.proto protoc-generated java: https://github.com/SandroGrzicic/ScalaBuff/blob/master/src/test/resources/java/Complex.java
596 2011-08-29 07:56:15 <SeriousWorm> ScalaBuff-generated scala: https://github.com/SandroGrzicic/ScalaBuff/blob/master/src/test/resources/generated/Complex.scala :)
597 2011-08-29 07:56:47 <SeriousWorm> 282 vs 1663 loc
598 2011-08-29 07:57:04 larsivi has joined
599 2011-08-29 07:57:17 <shadders> wow...
600 2011-08-29 07:57:20 agricocb has joined
601 2011-08-29 07:57:28 <shadders> someone was trying to sell me on scala just yesterday...
602 2011-08-29 07:57:33 Phoebus has joined
603 2011-08-29 07:57:35 <shadders> that's a pretty compelling argument...
604 2011-08-29 07:57:40 <SeriousWorm> :)
605 2011-08-29 07:58:03 <shadders> you built a compiler?
606 2011-08-29 07:58:06 <SeriousWorm> yes
607 2011-08-29 07:58:34 <shadders> nice
608 2011-08-29 07:58:53 <SeriousWorm> using google's java libraries just for a few minor things for the compiler.. however all my classes are fully compatible with their generated java classes, they use the google interfaces, extend from abstract classes etc.
609 2011-08-29 07:59:13 <shadders> you got any idea why they use the builder pattern? Why the need for an immutable form of the message?
610 2011-08-29 07:59:42 <SeriousWorm> well it's good practice for messages to be immutable.. and the Builder pattern is actually a pretty good Java pattern
611 2011-08-29 08:00:19 <SeriousWorm> however in my implementation all messages are always immutable.. but they provide all the standard Builder mutators (setters, clearers etc).. however each time you get a NEW copy of the message :)
612 2011-08-29 08:00:30 <SeriousWorm> this is needed for thread safety, etc.
613 2011-08-29 08:01:09 <SeriousWorm> you also get a shiny constructor in which you can set *all* the fields at once.. or just some of the fields via Scala's named parameters
614 2011-08-29 08:01:55 <shadders> hmmm... my issue was that there are fields (e.g. tx time) which can be filled in on either end of the wire. So I want to fill them in on the receiving end to avoid sending them over the wire...
615 2011-08-29 08:02:52 <SeriousWorm> that's rather easily done with my implementation :) but probably needs some extra cruft in the java version
616 2011-08-29 08:04:00 <shadders> Yeah, will just an a beforeBuild() method to my handlers... I'll definately have a good look at yr lib once I get through the scala tuts I'm plodding through...
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618 2011-08-29 08:05:06 <SeriousWorm> sure:) currently I don't support extensions and some other things but that'll be supported soon.. and I need to modify a few sbt's build settings so the runtime can be built separately.. but it's pretty much complete as-is, and should be bug-free
619 2011-08-29 08:05:19 <shadders> it's performance critical so I really don't want to build then newbuilder then merge
620 2011-08-29 08:06:02 <shadders> get it on the protobufs wiki...
621 2011-08-29 08:06:07 <SeriousWorm> soon :)
622 2011-08-29 08:06:20 <SeriousWorm> my mentor and me will announce it, don't worry.. as soon as I complete a few things
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636 2011-08-29 08:42:57 <Matth1a3> anyone awake that can tell me how issues are managed? or where I can read up on that... is there a system in place?
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642 2011-08-29 09:01:15 <Matth1a3> I found this: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2364.0 - but are there any others? I'm looking for etiquette...anything like that
643 2011-08-29 09:02:17 <tcatm> Matth1a3: it's probably best if you contribute patches (use the pull request feature on github)
644 2011-08-29 09:04:12 <Matth1a3> tcatm: is it ok to PM you?
645 2011-08-29 09:05:58 <tcatm> sure
646 2011-08-29 09:06:29 fnord0 has joined
647 2011-08-29 09:12:39 <CIA-101> bitcoin: Con Kolivas * r021b2c0d7a5d cgminer/main.c: The cpu mining work data can get modified before we copy it if we submit it async, and the sync submission is not truly sync anyway, so just submit it sync.
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662 2011-08-29 09:43:50 <lookdang> hey all :)
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670 2011-08-29 09:56:59 <lfm> hi
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674 2011-08-29 10:12:37 <CIA-101> bitcoin: Con Kolivas * r7ebf1d438093 cgminer/NEWS: News update.
675 2011-08-29 10:12:38 <CIA-101> bitcoin: Con Kolivas * rbc5b2cfa9ecb cgminer/README: Readme updates.
676 2011-08-29 10:12:39 <CIA-101> bitcoin: Con Kolivas * r846e5fbc666f cgminer/configure.ac: Bump version to 1.6.1.
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688 2011-08-29 10:45:41 <UukGoblin> is there a way to do a 'sendmany' but without specifying the source address? I'd like to sendmany from multiple sources... is there a way to do it all?
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710 2011-08-29 11:32:40 <gjs278> ;;bc,stats
711 2011-08-29 11:32:43 <gribble> Current Blocks: 143035 | Current Difficulty: 1805700.8361937 | Next Difficulty At Block: 143135 | Next Difficulty In: 100 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 17 hours, 21 minutes, and 40 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 1782333.58010001
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715 2011-08-29 11:38:19 <luke-jr> UukGoblin: there is no source addressâ¦
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718 2011-08-29 11:42:53 <UukGoblin> luke-jr, sendmany <fromaccount> {address:amount,...} [minconf=1] [comment]
719 2011-08-29 11:43:04 <UukGoblin> luke-jr, <fromaccount> is what I mean
720 2011-08-29 11:43:04 <luke-jr> exactly
721 2011-08-29 11:44:20 <UukGoblin> ok, to rephrase: the bitcoins are spread over multiple accounts, and I'd like to send them all to two destination addresses
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726 2011-08-29 11:47:51 <tcatm> UukGoblin: it should work using the default "" account
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729 2011-08-29 11:49:38 <luke-jr> ;;bc,stats
730 2011-08-29 11:49:41 <gribble> Current Blocks: 143040 | Current Difficulty: 1805700.8361937 | Next Difficulty At Block: 143135 | Next Difficulty In: 95 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 16 hours, 29 minutes, and 35 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 1784737.78363585
731 2011-08-29 11:51:34 <UukGoblin> tcatm, it says "insufficient funds"
732 2011-08-29 11:52:03 <tcatm> UukGoblin: move funds from other accounts there
733 2011-08-29 11:52:21 <UukGoblin> tcatm, ah... interesting...
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735 2011-08-29 11:53:34 <UukGoblin> I have an account "test1" with -0.00000001... I'd better not move that
736 2011-08-29 11:53:53 <UukGoblin> tcatm, aha! that worked, thanks very much! :-)
737 2011-08-29 11:54:21 <tcatm> does this guy http://carbonism.deviantart.com/ hang out on IRC?
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742 2011-08-29 12:22:38 <tcatm> ;;seen BlueMatt
743 2011-08-29 12:22:38 <gribble> BlueMatt was last seen in #bitcoin-dev 3 days, 17 hours, 26 minutes, and 21 seconds ago: <BlueMatt> luke-jr: this is coinbase for what, eligius blocks?
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745 2011-08-29 12:29:48 <Lopuz> hei
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819 2011-08-29 14:55:49 <nanotube> tcatm: well, the guy's da nick is 'mad scientist' so it could be Mad7Scientist :)
820 2011-08-29 14:55:52 <nanotube> just a guess though
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823 2011-08-29 14:56:47 <nanotube> though i dunno if that's a nick or just some membership level heh
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870 2011-08-29 15:32:41 <CIA-101> bitcoin: Luke Dashjr original_txn_time * r3cc900d3f7d4 bitcoind-personal/src/ (main.cpp makefile.unix): Show a sent transaction's original time, rather than when it got included in a block
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944 2011-08-29 16:54:35 <Mad7Scientist> So there is another mad scientist?
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973 2011-08-29 18:00:14 <luke-jr> ;;bc,stats
974 2011-08-29 18:00:17 <gribble> Current Blocks: 143068 | Current Difficulty: 1805700.8361937 | Next Difficulty At Block: 143135 | Next Difficulty In: 67 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 11 hours, 44 minutes, and 37 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 1778991.22159587
975 2011-08-29 18:04:38 <gjs278> perfect
976 2011-08-29 18:04:44 <gjs278> this decreasing difficulty is awesome
977 2011-08-29 18:05:26 <jtaylor> if only the price wouldn't suck so much
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980 2011-08-29 18:07:38 <luke-jr> ^
981 2011-08-29 18:14:45 <lookdang> :)
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984 2011-08-29 18:16:18 <copumpkin> decreasing difficulty means longer blocks now :(
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987 2011-08-29 18:17:23 <gjs278> hardly
988 2011-08-29 18:17:42 <gjs278> it's like 4% longer of the 10 minutes it already takes
989 2011-08-29 18:17:50 <gjs278> and once the difficulty adjust hits
990 2011-08-29 18:17:52 <gjs278> its back to 10 minutes
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998 2011-08-29 18:19:12 <copumpkin> well, in practice it's been a lot slower recently
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1038 2011-08-29 19:50:37 <coblee> 2!~chocobo@nat/google/x-ujoatbvozchnpsig|jtaylor: unfortunately the difficulty decrease _is_ due to the price sucking so much right now
1039 2011-08-29 19:51:05 dbosk has joined
1040 2011-08-29 19:51:15 <jtaylor> yes I'm aware that diff follows price not vice versa, but I still like to whine about it ;)
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1043 2011-08-29 19:53:50 <Eliel> coblee|2: I'm finding myself caring less and less if the price drops on the exchange. I've seen enough times that it'll go back up to not worry too much.
1044 2011-08-29 19:54:31 <coblee> 2!~chocobo@nat/google/x-ujoatbvozchnpsig|yeah, a price dip is a good time to invest more into bitcoins
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1047 2011-08-29 19:58:52 <mtrlt> Eliel: but what if it does not? :O
1048 2011-08-29 19:59:24 <Eliel> mtrlt: well, tough luck, I'm not in with more than I can bear to lose.
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1117 2011-08-29 22:37:46 <DontMindMe> What is the maximum amount of BTC addresses in the network?
1118 2011-08-29 22:38:12 <marf_away> 150^2
1119 2011-08-29 22:38:36 <marf_away> no
1120 2011-08-29 22:38:42 <marf_away> 2^150
1121 2011-08-29 22:38:43 <marf_away> ...
1122 2011-08-29 22:38:44 <DontMindMe> 2^150 ?
1123 2011-08-29 22:38:46 <DontMindMe> ah okay
1124 2011-08-29 22:38:47 <Diablo-D3> ........
1125 2011-08-29 22:38:58 <jtaylor> ^^
1126 2011-08-29 22:39:03 <DontMindMe> 150^2 is definitely not enough :P
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1128 2011-08-29 22:39:14 <marf_away> :P
1129 2011-08-29 22:39:30 <jtaylor> using 2 as a base it to the least confusing
1130 2011-08-29 22:39:40 <jtaylor> adresses are base 58, so you should use 58^something
1131 2011-08-29 22:39:50 <Diablo-D3> no addresses arent
1132 2011-08-29 22:39:58 <jtaylor> not?
1133 2011-08-29 22:39:59 <copumpkin> base 58 is just a representation
1134 2011-08-29 22:40:06 <Diablo-D3> no, you're looking at the text representation
1135 2011-08-29 22:40:10 <Diablo-D3> its a standard hash number
1136 2011-08-29 22:40:23 <Diablo-D3> jtaylor: you dont know how uuencoding works?
1137 2011-08-29 22:40:38 <jtaylor> yes but it should coresspond to the number of adresses
1138 2011-08-29 22:40:42 <Diablo-D3> it doesnt.
1139 2011-08-29 22:40:53 <Diablo-D3> the address is the public key of a key pair
1140 2011-08-29 22:40:54 <jtaylor> do adresses ahve different length encoded?
1141 2011-08-29 22:40:56 <jtaylor> didn't know that
1142 2011-08-29 22:41:05 <Diablo-D3> the base 58 uuencoded version is different lenghts
1143 2011-08-29 22:41:11 <Diablo-D3> it chops off the spare zeros
1144 2011-08-29 22:41:17 <iocor> oh you guys
1145 2011-08-29 22:41:18 <jtaylor> interesting
1146 2011-08-29 22:41:34 <Diablo-D3> and btw
1147 2011-08-29 22:41:36 <Diablo-D3> its 2^160
1148 2011-08-29 22:41:38 <Diablo-D3> not 150
1149 2011-08-29 22:43:14 <nanotube> yep it's ripemd160 hash
1150 2011-08-29 22:43:22 <nanotube> which has, unsurprisingly, 160bits
1151 2011-08-29 22:43:44 <copumpkin> we'll probably start running into issues before getting 2^160 addresses though
1152 2011-08-29 22:43:51 <copumpkin> :P
1153 2011-08-29 22:43:58 <Diablo-D3> well
1154 2011-08-29 22:44:02 <Diablo-D3> its not even an address
1155 2011-08-29 22:44:16 <Diablo-D3> I mean, not in that sense
1156 2011-08-29 22:44:57 <Diablo-D3> its just the hash of the public ecdsa key
1157 2011-08-29 22:45:03 <copumpkin> yep
1158 2011-08-29 22:45:11 <nanotube> Diablo-D3: still, bitcoins are sent to addresses
1159 2011-08-29 22:45:20 <copumpkin> I'm just saying we'll start seeing real collisions long before we hit 2^160
1160 2011-08-29 22:45:22 <Diablo-D3> bitcoin could theoretically handle multiple keys going to the same address
1161 2011-08-29 22:45:27 <copumpkin> really?
1162 2011-08-29 22:45:31 <nanotube> so even if the ecdsa keyspace is larger (it is), the relevant number for address collisions is 160bits
1163 2011-08-29 22:45:48 <nanotube> Diablo-D3: yes it could - problem is, in all likelihood it'll be different people's addresses :)
1164 2011-08-29 22:45:52 <luke-jr> ;;bc,stats
1165 2011-08-29 22:45:55 <gribble> Current Blocks: 143095 | Current Difficulty: 1805700.8361937 | Next Difficulty At Block: 143135 | Next Difficulty In: 40 blocks | Next Difficulty In About: 7 hours, 2 minutes, and 0 seconds | Next Difficulty Estimate: 1776169.09557918
1166 2011-08-29 22:46:06 <Diablo-D3> well, a different key cant unlock it
1167 2011-08-29 22:46:09 <nanotube> you probably don't want me to be able to spend your coins, because i happen to have a key that hashes to one of your addresses.
1168 2011-08-29 22:46:23 <Diablo-D3> but yeah, it'd be icky
1169 2011-08-29 22:46:27 <copumpkin> well, you start getting non-negligible probabilities for collisions at or before 2^~80
1170 2011-08-29 22:46:30 <Diablo-D3> however, 2^160 is basically unlimited
1171 2011-08-29 22:46:35 <nanotube> so far, yes :)
1172 2011-08-29 22:47:22 <jtaylor> that probably was said about ip adresses at some point too ;)
1173 2011-08-29 22:47:23 <Diablo-D3> remember, ipv6 is 2^128, and thats enough for an ip address for every atom in the solar system
1174 2011-08-29 22:47:27 <Diablo-D3> jtaylor: HAH
1175 2011-08-29 22:48:21 <nanotube> jtaylor: well, once your refrigerator has a bitcoin address, let's talk again :)
1176 2011-08-29 22:49:16 <luke-jr> nanotube: huh? refrigerators need 1 bitcoin address per purchase
1177 2011-08-29 22:49:32 <luke-jr> everyone knows that
1178 2011-08-29 22:49:37 <nanotube> hehe
1179 2011-08-29 22:49:45 <luke-jr> in the future, mining is just finding addresses with moneys still on them :D
1180 2011-08-29 22:50:02 <copumpkin> quite a long time in the future, though
1181 2011-08-29 22:50:03 <copumpkin> :)
1182 2011-08-29 22:50:40 <nanotube> luke-jr: lol yea
1183 2011-08-29 22:50:47 <DontMindMe> "Refrigerator generated block. +50 BTC. Do you want to buy fresh Milk? (Y/N)"
1184 2011-08-29 22:50:58 <Diablo-D3> Ive almost thought about making an ECDSA miner
1185 2011-08-29 22:51:01 <Diablo-D3> but dear fucking god
1186 2011-08-29 22:51:14 <nanotube> DontMindMe: more like, do you want to buy all the neighboring dairy farm?
1187 2011-08-29 22:51:17 <Diablo-D3> it'd take years to find a working address
1188 2011-08-29 22:51:23 <Diablo-D3> because I cant just find the address
1189 2011-08-29 22:51:32 <copumpkin> Diablo-D3: how would you do ECDSA on a GPU?
1190 2011-08-29 22:51:33 <Diablo-D3> I have to produce a fully working public/private keypair
1191 2011-08-29 22:51:36 <copumpkin> or you mean on a CPU?
1192 2011-08-29 22:51:43 <Diablo-D3> very carefully.
1193 2011-08-29 22:52:04 <copumpkin> implementing large integers sounds like a blast on a GPU, and something they'd be great at doing ;)
1194 2011-08-29 22:52:25 <Diablo-D3> not really
1195 2011-08-29 22:52:33 <Diablo-D3> its not large
1196 2011-08-29 22:52:44 <Diablo-D3> I mean, its large like sha2-256 is
1197 2011-08-29 22:52:47 <Diablo-D3> its not a 256 bit number
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1199 2011-08-29 22:53:12 <copumpkin> but it is bigger than a native word
1200 2011-08-29 22:53:18 <Diablo-D3> and gpus often implement saturation detection for bigint shit anyhow
1201 2011-08-29 22:53:54 <Diablo-D3> copumpkin: ecdsa doesnt use 64 bit ints.
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1203 2011-08-29 22:54:30 <copumpkin> that was my point
1204 2011-08-29 22:54:39 <copumpkin> oh, the sarcasm earlier may not have been obvious
1205 2011-08-29 22:54:50 <Diablo-D3> no, it wasnt obvious
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1211 2011-08-29 23:04:28 <Eliel> copumpkin: with the current bitcoin implementation, it's a practical impossibility to saturate the 160 bit address space badly enough to pose problems. Even with every satoshi on it's own address, the chance of address collision in the whole system is still very close to 0%
1212 2011-08-29 23:04:39 <copumpkin> yeah, sure
1213 2011-08-29 23:04:52 <copumpkin> I was just saying we'd get to non-negligible probabilities a lot quicker than 2^160
1214 2011-08-29 23:05:00 <copumpkin> not that 2^80 is small :)
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1218 2011-08-29 23:08:10 <Eliel> yes, true :)
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1223 2011-08-29 23:14:10 Zagitta_ is now known as Zagitta
1224 2011-08-29 23:15:16 <Eliel> copumpkin: however, for every satoshi to have it's own address would only take in the order of 2^49 addresses.
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1234 2011-08-29 23:43:32 <piuk> If anyone is looking for something to do please test http://pi.uk.com/bitcoin
1235 2011-08-29 23:44:25 <phantomcircuit> i think your math is a bit off
1236 2011-08-29 23:44:25 <phantomcircuit> Investment to control 50% $12,925.71 (theoretical)
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1238 2011-08-29 23:47:56 Rozz has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
1239 2011-08-29 23:48:05 <nanotube> control 50% of what?
1240 2011-08-29 23:48:36 <piuk> It's an estimated cost in hardware to control 50% hashing power, not really meant to mean anything on it's own
1241 2011-08-29 23:48:47 iuknown has joined
1242 2011-08-29 23:51:44 <nanotube> since when can you get 5 Thps of hashing power for 12k usd ?
1243 2011-08-29 23:52:26 <piuk> Ah should have million next to it
1244 2011-08-29 23:53:05 Rozz has joined
1245 2011-08-29 23:54:30 <nanotube> that sounds a bit more reasonable. still on the low side though.
1246 2011-08-29 23:54:54 <phantomcircuit> no that's about right
1247 2011-08-29 23:55:01 <nanotube> seems to be juts the cost of the gpus... then you need to add the rest of the supporting hw?
1248 2011-08-29 23:56:11 sirius has joined
1249 2011-08-29 23:56:23 <phantomcircuit> nanotube, maths time!
1250 2011-08-29 23:56:31 sirius has left ()
1251 2011-08-29 23:56:36 <phantomcircuit> (12 925.71 * 1 000) / 300 = 43085.7 5870s
1252 2011-08-29 23:56:42 <phantomcircuit> (lol that's a lot)
1253 2011-08-29 23:56:53 <nanotube> 43 whats?
1254 2011-08-29 23:56:56 <nanotube> 5850s ?
1255 2011-08-29 23:57:02 <phantomcircuit> 43085.7
1256 2011-08-29 23:57:02 <nanotube> 43k whats, that is
1257 2011-08-29 23:57:07 <phantomcircuit> 5870s
1258 2011-08-29 23:57:12 <nanotube> ah
1259 2011-08-29 23:57:15 <nanotube> ok, how much is one of those?
1260 2011-08-29 23:57:23 <phantomcircuit> ~200-250 USD
1261 2011-08-29 23:57:32 <phantomcircuit> so like 8 mill for gpus alone
1262 2011-08-29 23:57:54 <phantomcircuit> you can fit 3 a bunch of those onto a shit mobo with risers though
1263 2011-08-29 23:58:15 <nanotube> wait wait, shouldn't we be starting from hash rate?
1264 2011-08-29 23:58:21 <nanotube> network hash rate is about 12thps
1265 2011-08-29 23:58:34 <nanotube> a 5870 is 300mhps?
1266 2011-08-29 23:58:49 darkmethod has joined
1267 2011-08-29 23:59:08 <nanotube> ;;calc 12000/0.3
1268 2011-08-29 23:59:09 <gribble> 12Â 000 / 0.3 = 40Â 000
1269 2011-08-29 23:59:24 <nanotube> ;;calc 40000 * 250
1270 2011-08-29 23:59:24 <gribble> 40,000 * 250 = 10,000,000
1271 2011-08-29 23:59:28 mosimo has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1272 2011-08-29 23:59:29 <nanotube> 10m for the gpus