1 2011-09-05 00:00:50 xelister has quit (Write error: Broken pipe)
   2 2011-09-05 00:09:17 roconnor has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
   3 2011-09-05 00:10:08 noagendamarket has joined
   4 2011-09-05 00:12:05 theorb has joined
   5 2011-09-05 00:12:20 theorbtwo has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
   6 2011-09-05 00:12:34 theorb is now known as theorbtwo
   7 2011-09-05 00:19:33 Gekz has joined
   8 2011-09-05 00:20:59 <wardearia> It would be AWESOME if bitcoin.org showed developers/contributors similarly to http://git-scm.com/about (yay for suggestion at https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=41456.msg505026#msg505026)
   9 2011-09-05 00:21:22 <wardearia> Including showing number of commits next to each name
  10 2011-09-05 00:30:33 <luke-jr> wardearia: maybe for a dedicated page, but not for the small area on the frontpage
  11 2011-09-05 00:30:45 <luke-jr> wardearia: also, that's very much single-project oriented
  12 2011-09-05 00:30:51 <luke-jr> whereas Bitcoin is a community/distributed thing
  13 2011-09-05 00:43:54 <CIA-101> bitcoin: Con Kolivas adl_support * rc49106c6d894 cgminer/ (adl.c miner.h): Force the speed to high on startup and restore it to whatever the setting was on exit.
  14 2011-09-05 00:43:55 <CIA-101> bitcoin: Con Kolivas adl_support * r7767458e2756 cgminer/main.c: Add temperature to standard output where possible and use more compact output.
  15 2011-09-05 00:53:34 marf_away has quit (Quit: Nettalk6 - www.ntalk.de)
  16 2011-09-05 00:56:55 random_cat has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
  17 2011-09-05 00:58:18 <CIA-101> bitcoin: Luke Dashjr * rb2255e038683 gentoo/net-p2p/bitcoind/ (11 files): net-p2p/bitcoind: Bump rev on 0.3.* because of bitcoin.init.d changes
  18 2011-09-05 00:59:36 copumpkin has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
  19 2011-09-05 01:00:02 copumpkin has joined
  20 2011-09-05 01:04:46 Zarutian has quit (Quit: Zarutian)
  21 2011-09-05 01:08:49 shadders_ has joined
  22 2011-09-05 01:11:32 orkaa has quit (Quit: orkaa)
  23 2011-09-05 01:13:48 <CIA-101> bitcoin: Con Kolivas adl_support * r417223fd6550 cgminer/main.c: Move and print at the same time in curses to avoid random trampling display errors.
  24 2011-09-05 01:14:32 soap_ has joined
  25 2011-09-05 01:19:48 sha256trust has joined
  26 2011-09-05 01:40:39 jackmcbarn has joined
  27 2011-09-05 01:50:41 Diablo-D3 has joined
  28 2011-09-05 01:52:15 MadHackr has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
  29 2011-09-05 01:52:52 MadHackr has joined
  30 2011-09-05 01:53:45 Pinion_ has joined
  31 2011-09-05 01:53:53 Pinion has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
  32 2011-09-05 01:53:54 Pinion_ is now known as Pinion
  33 2011-09-05 01:55:27 wolfspraul has joined
  34 2011-09-05 02:00:01 eoss has quit (Quit: Leaving)
  35 2011-09-05 02:06:57 prax has quit (Quit: Leaving)
  36 2011-09-05 02:22:16 glitch-mod has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
  37 2011-09-05 02:27:40 Stellar has joined
  38 2011-09-05 02:27:49 glitch-mod has joined
  39 2011-09-05 02:42:40 asher^ has joined
  40 2011-09-05 02:47:58 TheSeven has quit (Disconnected by services)
  41 2011-09-05 02:48:15 [7] has joined
  42 2011-09-05 02:50:30 theymos has joined
  43 2011-09-05 02:51:07 sgstair has quit (Quit: .•«UPP»•.)
  44 2011-09-05 02:51:07 thundervat has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
  45 2011-09-05 02:55:15 sgstair has joined
  46 2011-09-05 03:00:09 colzbox has joined
  47 2011-09-05 03:00:57 colzbox has left ()
  48 2011-09-05 03:01:44 shavedspiqre has joined
  49 2011-09-05 03:03:10 <CIA-101> poolserverj: shadders * a6448946e6b1 r38 /etc/lib/lib_non-maven/bitcoin-jsonrpc-0.0.1-SNAPSHOT.jar: dissapeared from 0.2.9 for some reason?
  50 2011-09-05 03:03:11 <CIA-101> poolserverj: shadders * 3741073dc9b7 r39 / (18 files in 8 dirs):
  51 2011-09-05 03:03:11 <CIA-101> poolserverj: - convert blocknum from string to int
  52 2011-09-05 03:03:11 <CIA-101> poolserverj: - refactor common elements to bitcoin-poolserverj-core
  53 2011-09-05 03:03:11 <CIA-101> poolserverj: - fix missing semi-colons in sample sql scripts
  54 2011-09-05 03:11:32 <k9quaint> Diablo-D3: only took you 8 minutes to get banned, not a record but pretty competitive
  55 2011-09-05 03:12:07 eoss has joined
  56 2011-09-05 03:12:07 eoss has quit (Changing host)
  57 2011-09-05 03:12:07 eoss has joined
  58 2011-09-05 03:12:42 <Diablo-D3> k9quaint: I was busy getting food
  59 2011-09-05 03:12:48 <Diablo-D3> cant troll on an empty stomach
  60 2011-09-05 03:12:58 <k9quaint> excuses :P
  61 2011-09-05 03:13:37 <k9quaint> you won't be laughing when RealSolid "outdevelops" all of you!
  62 2011-09-05 03:13:41 * k9quaint shakes fist
  63 2011-09-05 03:14:09 <k9quaint> I am just hoping for some real drama when SC finally melts down
  64 2011-09-05 03:14:18 <Diablo-D3> he couldnt develop his way out of a wet used condom.
  65 2011-09-05 03:14:24 <shadders_> lol
  66 2011-09-05 03:14:37 <k9quaint> to be fair, condoms are made from resilient material
  67 2011-09-05 03:14:48 <Diablo-D3> only for people with small dicks.
  68 2011-09-05 03:14:53 * Diablo-D3 has had more than one break on him
  69 2011-09-05 03:15:10 <k9quaint> which would explain why Realsolid has been so touchy lately
  70 2011-09-05 03:15:12 <shadders_> Diablo-D3: I'm thinking of forming a collective of btc related coders to hardcode their tools to not work with SC... you in?
  71 2011-09-05 03:15:37 eastender has joined
  72 2011-09-05 03:15:41 <Diablo-D3> shadders_: its not even worth my time, honestly.
  73 2011-09-05 03:16:06 <k9quaint> you should make the tools work better with SC instead
  74 2011-09-05 03:16:10 <Diablo-D3> and I dont think bitcoind leaks enough info to the miner to ban alternate pools
  75 2011-09-05 03:16:19 <Diablo-D3> er
  76 2011-09-05 03:16:19 <k9quaint> the easier it is for Realsolid to work, the faster solidcoin will die
  77 2011-09-05 03:16:21 <Diablo-D3> alternate chains
  78 2011-09-05 03:16:42 <shadders_> it's only a couple of lines of code... list addresses if address.startsWith('s') System.exit(1);
  79 2011-09-05 03:16:57 <forrestv> shadders_, miners never even see addresses ..
  80 2011-09-05 03:17:00 <Diablo-D3> yeah but the miner doesnt get those
  81 2011-09-05 03:17:06 <Diablo-D3> it only get the 80 byte header
  82 2011-09-05 03:17:15 <Diablo-D3> I dont think anything useful is leaked into the header
  83 2011-09-05 03:17:29 random_cat has joined
  84 2011-09-05 03:17:40 <theymos> You could reject based on low difficulty.
  85 2011-09-05 03:17:41 wolfspraul has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
  86 2011-09-05 03:17:53 <Diablo-D3> theymos: cant
  87 2011-09-05 03:18:02 <Diablo-D3> since pools use non-1 diffs
  88 2011-09-05 03:18:04 <shadders_> ahh true... psj can implement a new header... daemon: solidcoin
  89 2011-09-05 03:18:09 <theymos> Oh, right.
  90 2011-09-05 03:18:51 egecko has joined
  91 2011-09-05 03:18:59 <shadders_> I'm sure someone can path pushpool as well..
  92 2011-09-05 03:19:04 <shadders_> patch
  93 2011-09-05 03:19:39 wolfspraul has joined
  94 2011-09-05 03:20:04 JackStorm has quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
  95 2011-09-05 03:20:54 JackStorm has joined
  96 2011-09-05 03:29:40 beppu has quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
  97 2011-09-05 03:33:05 jimon has quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
  98 2011-09-05 03:37:12 surikator has quit (Quit: Computer is sleeping. I'm probably not.)
  99 2011-09-05 03:38:30 smtmnyz has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 100 2011-09-05 03:38:49 jimon has joined
 101 2011-09-05 03:53:49 <CIA-101> bitcoin: Con Kolivas adl_support * rd5566f8bd8bc cgminer/main.c: Update the status window only from the watchdog thread, do not rewrite the top status messages and only refresh once all the status window is complete, clearing the window each time to avoid corruption.
 102 2011-09-05 04:02:32 wolfspraul has quit (Quit: Lost terminal)
 103 2011-09-05 04:03:11 smtmnyz has joined
 104 2011-09-05 04:03:43 <CIA-101> bitcoin: Con Kolivas adl_support * ra95dc14b4bf6 cgminer/adl.c: Set a safe starting fan speed if we're automanaging the speeds.
 105 2011-09-05 04:11:09 imsaguy has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
 106 2011-09-05 04:11:14 gfinn has joined
 107 2011-09-05 04:15:30 <CIA-101> poolserverj: shadders * ebf8888bb839 r40 /src/main/java/com/shadworld/poolserver/source/ (WorkExchange.java WorkSource.java): - fix: WorkSource request throttling was only activating for HTTP level failures. TCP failures (e.g. connection refused) would not activate throttling resulting in thousands of requests/sec and high CPU usage.
 108 2011-09-05 04:16:42 gjs278 has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 109 2011-09-05 04:17:13 diki has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
 110 2011-09-05 04:20:15 sacarlson has quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
 111 2011-09-05 04:20:48 Pinion has quit (Quit: Has quit)
 112 2011-09-05 04:35:08 sacarlson has joined
 113 2011-09-05 04:37:47 ThomasV has joined
 114 2011-09-05 04:37:52 ThomasV has quit (Changing host)
 115 2011-09-05 04:37:52 ThomasV has joined
 116 2011-09-05 04:40:42 brooss has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
 117 2011-09-05 04:40:59 brooss has joined
 118 2011-09-05 04:48:37 theymos has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 119 2011-09-05 04:58:41 kreal- has joined
 120 2011-09-05 05:06:11 eoss has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 121 2011-09-05 05:07:35 LightRider has joined
 122 2011-09-05 05:09:31 RazielZ has joined
 123 2011-09-05 05:18:56 Nicksasa has quit (Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net)
 124 2011-09-05 05:19:28 Nicksasa has joined
 125 2011-09-05 05:20:01 BurtyBB has joined
 126 2011-09-05 05:20:25 AStove has joined
 127 2011-09-05 05:21:06 BurtyB has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
 128 2011-09-05 05:23:22 noagendamarket has quit (Quit: Leaving)
 129 2011-09-05 05:31:04 KenArmitt has joined
 130 2011-09-05 05:33:45 <CIA-101> bitcoin: Con Kolivas adl_support * r46d3e3fec9e6 cgminer/adl.c: Put the autotune function into its own fresh thread each time in case the library crashes so it doesn't take out cgminer.
 131 2011-09-05 05:36:57 BurtyBB has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
 132 2011-09-05 05:37:57 ThomasV has quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
 133 2011-09-05 05:39:14 ThomasV has joined
 134 2011-09-05 05:40:45 AnAdorableNick has joined
 135 2011-09-05 05:41:20 BurtyB has joined
 136 2011-09-05 05:45:53 kreal- has quit (Read error: No route to host)
 137 2011-09-05 05:47:28 kreal- has joined
 138 2011-09-05 05:51:08 AnAdorableNick has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 139 2011-09-05 05:52:51 ThomasV has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
 140 2011-09-05 05:53:48 <CIA-101> bitcoin: Con Kolivas adl_support * r6e794a99887a cgminer/adl.c: Revert "Put the autotune function into its own fresh thread each time in case the library crashes so it doesn't take out cgminer."
 141 2011-09-05 05:56:06 eastender has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
 142 2011-09-05 06:00:16 AStove has quit ()
 143 2011-09-05 06:13:43 <CIA-101> bitcoin: Con Kolivas adl_support * r423a35c558c3 cgminer/adl.c: Provide locking around all adl calls to prevent races.
 144 2011-09-05 06:17:37 devon_hillard has joined
 145 2011-09-05 06:23:43 <CIA-101> bitcoin: Con Kolivas adl_support * rd3e8868b0c0f cgminer/adl.c: Ramp up the fan more if we're over target temperature.
 146 2011-09-05 06:23:43 <CIA-101> poolserverj: shadders * b6e335e4f3d0 r41 /: Starting 'protobufs-frontengine' branch
 147 2011-09-05 06:23:43 <CIA-101> poolserverj: shadders * 17d1553c25d0 r42 /: Starting 'main' branch
 148 2011-09-05 06:23:44 <CIA-101> poolserverj: shadders * a194f17c7cb8 r43 / (2 files in 2 dirs): rudimentary protobufs client in place.
 149 2011-09-05 06:23:44 <CIA-101> poolserverj: shadders * aa7186905fde r44 /.hgtags: Added tag 0.2.10 for changeset 17d1553c25d0
 150 2011-09-05 06:31:34 <LightRider> Anyone here familiar with the new glbse system? I'm trying to figure out how to use the new web interface and how to update the bm software
 151 2011-09-05 06:37:48 gjs278 has joined
 152 2011-09-05 06:41:08 dvide has joined
 153 2011-09-05 06:45:37 larsivi has joined
 154 2011-09-05 06:50:43 larsivi has quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
 155 2011-09-05 06:57:32 zamgo has joined
 156 2011-09-05 07:01:00 Habbie_ is now known as Habbie
 157 2011-09-05 07:01:37 danbri has joined
 158 2011-09-05 07:03:32 larsivi has joined
 159 2011-09-05 07:05:41 larsivi has quit (Excess Flood)
 160 2011-09-05 07:06:02 larsivi has joined
 161 2011-09-05 07:17:51 zamgo has quit (Quit: Page closed)
 162 2011-09-05 07:19:39 molecular has quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
 163 2011-09-05 07:19:53 molecular has joined
 164 2011-09-05 07:23:48 <CIA-101> bitcoin: Con Kolivas adl_support * r939a6a59730b cgminer/adl.c: Lower profile settings cannot be higher than higher profile ones so link any drops in settings.
 165 2011-09-05 07:27:51 ThomasV has joined
 166 2011-09-05 07:27:53 ThomasV has quit (Changing host)
 167 2011-09-05 07:27:53 ThomasV has joined
 168 2011-09-05 07:28:20 * ThomasV is still banned from #solidcoin
 169 2011-09-05 07:28:32 <ThomasV> :-(
 170 2011-09-05 07:31:43 Mango-chan has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
 171 2011-09-05 07:33:36 <MagicalTux> ThomasV: I don't think you're missing anything
 172 2011-09-05 07:33:46 <CIA-101> bitcoin: Con Kolivas adl_support * re4a635f91127 cgminer/adl.c: Fix moronic reuse of i variable.
 173 2011-09-05 07:34:02 <ThomasV> MagicalTux: yes, I missed the discussion with gavin
 174 2011-09-05 07:34:38 <ThomasV> (well, I was ont online at that moment, but I *could* have been there)
 175 2011-09-05 07:34:53 <doublec> you didn't miss much
 176 2011-09-05 07:34:56 <Diablo-D3> woah its MagicalTux
 177 2011-09-05 07:35:04 <Diablo-D3> MagicalTux: SEND ME JAPANESE SCHOOLGIRLS
 178 2011-09-05 07:35:13 <MagicalTux> Diablo-D3: 22 million BTC eacg
 179 2011-09-05 07:35:14 <MagicalTux> each*
 180 2011-09-05 07:35:22 <ThomasV> oh doublec, can you un-ban me again :-D
 181 2011-09-05 07:35:23 * Diablo-D3 checks his wallet
 182 2011-09-05 07:35:30 <Diablo-D3> Goddamnit.
 183 2011-09-05 07:35:36 <doublec> ThomasV: I've been de-oped
 184 2011-09-05 07:35:39 * Diablo-D3 is short roughly 22 million BTC
 185 2011-09-05 07:35:44 <ThomasV> omg
 186 2011-09-05 07:35:57 <Diablo-D3> MagicalTux: wait, BTC cant have 22 million.
 187 2011-09-05 07:36:02 <MagicalTux> :D
 188 2011-09-05 07:36:07 <Diablo-D3> you bastard
 189 2011-09-05 07:36:19 <doublec> ThomasV: I closed my exchange and pool and asked to be de-oped
 190 2011-09-05 07:36:28 <doublec> ThomasV: so as to be no longer associated with a nutcase
 191 2011-09-05 07:37:14 <Diablo-D3> heh
 192 2011-09-05 07:37:23 <MagicalTux> solidcoin guy came to me and tried to convince me to accept solidcoins on mtgox
 193 2011-09-05 07:37:45 <doublec> how'd that end up
 194 2011-09-05 07:37:51 <MagicalTux> he didn't convince me
 195 2011-09-05 07:38:12 * ThomasV came to solidcoin channel and tried to borrow solidcoins in order to short sell 
 196 2011-09-05 07:38:13 <doublec> he was telling everyone that mtgox was close. Only needed to reach 2 Thash
 197 2011-09-05 07:38:21 SomeoneWeird has joined
 198 2011-09-05 07:38:43 <MagicalTux> we may implement namecoin once merged mining is running
 199 2011-09-05 07:38:49 TD has joined
 200 2011-09-05 07:39:31 SomeoneWeird has quit (Changing host)
 201 2011-09-05 07:39:32 SomeoneWeird has joined
 202 2011-09-05 07:39:55 <doublec> once he started talking about closing the source and adding ddos code to attack >51% pools I figured the writing was on the wall
 203 2011-09-05 07:40:29 <ThomasV> I find it bad that solidcoin was run by a nutcase. In a sense, the currency failed because of that guy. I was expecting it to fail for other reasons. It is likely that we will see another fork, less dictatorial.
 204 2011-09-05 07:40:48 <doublec> right, it would probably have done well if it wasn't for the personality of realsolid
 205 2011-09-05 07:41:12 <MagicalTux> Starting end of september, dev on QBitcoin will resume
 206 2011-09-05 07:41:13 <ThomasV> doublec: no, I believe that these forks are doomed to fail, even if they are run by angels
 207 2011-09-05 07:41:36 <ThomasV> because of network effects
 208 2011-09-05 07:41:37 <doublec> yea, "done well" in comparison to other chains I guess
 209 2011-09-05 07:41:50 <doublec> it's a low barrier of course given the competition is i0/ixcoin
 210 2011-09-05 07:42:52 <LightRider> Don't feel too bad, I was banned from -politics and I haven't even been there in weeks
 211 2011-09-05 07:43:26 <ThomasV> LightRider: how can someone be banned from -politics
 212 2011-09-05 07:43:40 slush1 has quit (Quit: Leaving.)
 213 2011-09-05 07:44:50 <LightRider> it's become an anti-annarchy
 214 2011-09-05 07:45:24 <LightRider> I imagine, that channel has been getting weirder and weirder for months
 215 2011-09-05 07:45:53 <LightRider> antidisestablishmentarianism?
 216 2011-09-05 07:48:59 <TD> is the forum broke? for some reason i can't post
 217 2011-09-05 07:49:19 danbri has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 218 2011-09-05 07:49:53 asher^ has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 219 2011-09-05 07:50:03 erus` has joined
 220 2011-09-05 07:51:45 nr9 has joined
 221 2011-09-05 07:52:22 ephcon has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
 222 2011-09-05 07:53:46 <CIA-101> bitcoin: Con Kolivas adl_support * r878e30d528d8 cgminer/configure.ac: Bump version to 1.9.9 till completed as version 2.0.
 223 2011-09-05 07:54:05 TD has quit (Quit: TD)
 224 2011-09-05 07:55:10 <LightRider> cgminer performs poorly on p2pool in my experience
 225 2011-09-05 07:55:37 <LightRider> I don't know if that's due to the nature of the pool or the miner
 226 2011-09-05 07:58:09 roconnor has joined
 227 2011-09-05 07:58:16 shadders_ has quit (Quit: Leaving)
 228 2011-09-05 07:58:48 shadders_ has joined
 229 2011-09-05 08:02:31 <SomeoneWeird> LightRider, well it's defs not the miner
 230 2011-09-05 08:06:45 kakobreklaaa has joined
 231 2011-09-05 08:07:06 wtfman is now known as wtfman[away]
 232 2011-09-05 08:09:28 wtfman[away] is now known as wtfman
 233 2011-09-05 08:09:30 kakobrekla has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
 234 2011-09-05 08:10:22 noagendamarket has joined
 235 2011-09-05 08:10:30 noagendamarket has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
 236 2011-09-05 08:10:48 noagendamarket has joined
 237 2011-09-05 08:14:13 d1g1t4l has joined
 238 2011-09-05 08:17:33 asher^ has joined
 239 2011-09-05 08:19:49 larsivi has quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
 240 2011-09-05 08:22:56 ThomasV has quit (Quit: Leaving)
 241 2011-09-05 08:27:28 larsivi has joined
 242 2011-09-05 08:29:59 larsivi has quit (Excess Flood)
 243 2011-09-05 08:30:23 larsivi has joined
 244 2011-09-05 08:30:34 TD has joined
 245 2011-09-05 08:32:52 roconnor has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
 246 2011-09-05 08:37:50 Xunie has joined
 247 2011-09-05 08:37:53 Xunie has quit (Changing host)
 248 2011-09-05 08:37:53 Xunie has joined
 249 2011-09-05 08:42:47 ephcon has joined
 250 2011-09-05 08:49:03 larsivi has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
 251 2011-09-05 08:53:54 larsivi has joined
 252 2011-09-05 08:59:28 marf_away has joined
 253 2011-09-05 09:07:43 ThomasV has joined
 254 2011-09-05 09:21:28 Strom has joined
 255 2011-09-05 09:22:12 Strom- has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
 256 2011-09-05 09:22:39 kakobreklaaa is now known as kakobrekla
 257 2011-09-05 09:33:56 larsivi has quit (Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.)
 258 2011-09-05 09:34:47 larsivi has joined
 259 2011-09-05 09:35:29 Incitatus has joined
 260 2011-09-05 09:40:38 surikator has joined
 261 2011-09-05 09:40:48 BurtyB has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
 262 2011-09-05 09:41:06 BurtyB has joined
 263 2011-09-05 09:43:48 <CIA-101> bitcoin: Con Kolivas * rb6a703..47f1a7 cgminer/ (adl.c miner.h configure.ac main.c): (13 commits)
 264 2011-09-05 09:45:08 Xunie has quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
 265 2011-09-05 09:51:18 iocor has joined
 266 2011-09-05 09:51:47 zeiris has joined
 267 2011-09-05 09:53:42 <CIA-101> bitcoin: Con Kolivas * ra2f6bb77adfe cgminer/Makefile.am: Add new needed text files to distribution.
 268 2011-09-05 09:57:45 zamgo has joined
 269 2011-09-05 09:58:48 SomeoneWeird has quit (Quit: Ex-Chat)
 270 2011-09-05 10:00:03 <phantomcircuit> what the fuck guys
 271 2011-09-05 10:00:16 <phantomcircuit> who changed bitcoin.org so that it only works with javascript enabled?
 272 2011-09-05 10:00:47 Xunie has joined
 273 2011-09-05 10:04:37 <UukGoblin> phantomcircuit, wha? works for me
 274 2011-09-05 10:04:53 <zamgo> looks perfectly suitable without javascript... for text browsers
 275 2011-09-05 10:04:56 <phantomcircuit> there is no style sheet if javascript is disabled
 276 2011-09-05 10:05:07 <UukGoblin> ah
 277 2011-09-05 10:05:13 <UukGoblin> yeah, looks quite good in elinks
 278 2011-09-05 10:05:35 <phantomcircuit> looks ridiculous in firefox with noscript
 279 2011-09-05 10:05:37 <UukGoblin> but I wouldn't notice the difference if there was a stylesheet
 280 2011-09-05 10:05:43 <phantomcircuit> which is almost certainly a more common setup
 281 2011-09-05 10:05:47 shavedspiqre has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 282 2011-09-05 10:06:10 <UukGoblin> fair enough
 283 2011-09-05 10:07:00 iocor has quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
 284 2011-09-05 10:09:23 orkaa has joined
 285 2011-09-05 10:11:15 Daniel0108 has joined
 286 2011-09-05 10:14:53 erle- has joined
 287 2011-09-05 10:16:26 deadlymeaqbj has joined
 288 2011-09-05 10:19:03 pickett has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
 289 2011-09-05 10:23:43 ArdaXi has left ()
 290 2011-09-05 10:24:39 <cjdelisle> haha bitcoin.org looks like dan bernstein's website with noscript on.
 291 2011-09-05 10:25:13 <cjdelisle> and I imagine noscript users are many in this community where you can lose actual money if your browser is exploited
 292 2011-09-05 10:26:43 <Diablo-D3> ha ha, I use elinks!
 293 2011-09-05 10:26:53 Xunie has quit (Quit: Can God microwave a taco so hot that not even *HE* can eat it without burns?)
 294 2011-09-05 10:27:28 <TuxBlackEdo> Diablo-D3, people do use elinks
 295 2011-09-05 10:27:35 <zamgo> lynx
 296 2011-09-05 10:27:59 <Diablo-D3> telnet
 297 2011-09-05 10:28:03 <cjdelisle> I'll be there if ff doesn't quicken up and chrome adblock still doesn't... block the ads.
 298 2011-09-05 10:28:17 <Diablo-D3> I dont have ff speed problems.
 299 2011-09-05 10:28:24 <Diablo-D3> then again, Ive been trying to keep myself under 200 tabs
 300 2011-09-05 10:28:41 <cjdelisle> it's linux+ff only so I hear
 301 2011-09-05 10:29:04 <cjdelisle> just having mtgoxlive in a tab --> death
 302 2011-09-05 10:29:15 <Diablo-D3> are you trying to imply I dont use linux?
 303 2011-09-05 10:29:39 <Diablo-D3> mtgoxlive does nothing strange here.
 304 2011-09-05 10:30:03 <cjdelisle> how would I know if you did or not, I know winx users report no problem
 305 2011-09-05 10:30:29 <Diablo-D3> I have very famously used Debian exclusively for over a decade as my primary desktop OS on multiple computers.
 306 2011-09-05 10:30:36 <Diablo-D3> I do not have anything that runs osx or windows.
 307 2011-09-05 10:30:51 <cjdelisle> same (although not for over a decade)
 308 2011-09-05 10:34:11 <cjdelisle> happy Labor Day btw
 309 2011-09-05 10:34:32 huk has quit ()
 310 2011-09-05 10:34:34 <TuxBlackEdo> Diablo-D3, you are so cool
 311 2011-09-05 10:34:40 <TuxBlackEdo> :P
 312 2011-09-05 10:37:32 T_X has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
 313 2011-09-05 10:38:06 <Diablo-D3> hey man, one day I just said, fuck this bullshit
 314 2011-09-05 10:38:09 <Diablo-D3> and I havent gone back since
 315 2011-09-05 10:38:50 shadders_ has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
 316 2011-09-05 10:39:51 Tamo has joined
 317 2011-09-05 10:40:11 orkaa has quit (Quit: orkaa)
 318 2011-09-05 10:50:43 zamgo has quit (Quit: Page closed)
 319 2011-09-05 10:55:17 BurtyB has quit (Read error: Network is unreachable)
 320 2011-09-05 10:55:35 BurtyB has joined
 321 2011-09-05 10:57:48 shadders_ has joined
 322 2011-09-05 10:57:59 kreal has joined
 323 2011-09-05 10:58:19 kreal- has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
 324 2011-09-05 10:59:39 kreal has quit (Client Quit)
 325 2011-09-05 11:03:24 <dub> I used to run primary linux desktop 15 years ago
 326 2011-09-05 11:03:44 <dub> then I just said, fuck this bullshit, I need a job
 327 2011-09-05 11:03:44 <CIA-101> bitcoin: Con Kolivas * r2155acf1e46a cgminer/main.c: Queue requests ignoring the number of staged clones since they get discarded very easily leading to false positives for pool not providing work fast enough.
 328 2011-09-05 11:04:13 <dub> adn then I thought fuck this bullshit, I'd think I'll play some games
 329 2011-09-05 11:06:19 <phantomcircuit> dub, lol
 330 2011-09-05 11:06:46 <Diablo-D3> all the games I want to play are native anyhow
 331 2011-09-05 11:07:14 <Diablo-D3> and the games I dont want to play, and end up playing anyhow, usually work in wine without fiddling anyhow
 332 2011-09-05 11:09:23 <dub> every tech company I've worked for issued windows workstations
 333 2011-09-05 11:09:35 <Diablo-D3> wow, what shit companies
 334 2011-09-05 11:10:16 <cjdelisle> 0wnable too
 335 2011-09-05 11:10:17 <phantomcircuit> wine has gone to shit recently
 336 2011-09-05 11:10:37 <phantomcircuit> i cant even play counter strike source
 337 2011-09-05 11:10:49 <cjdelisle> I never used wine, I don't game, +1 way to waste time is the last thing I need.
 338 2011-09-05 11:10:55 <dub> damn, life wouldn't be worth living
 339 2011-09-05 11:10:59 <Diablo-D3> I just kill motherfuckers in nexuiz
 340 2011-09-05 11:11:17 <dub> battlefield4eva
 341 2011-09-05 11:11:22 <Diablo-D3> of course, people request that I dont because when I do its often 100+ frags
 342 2011-09-05 11:11:43 <Diablo-D3> I mean, if you dont want me to kill you, then stop dying
 343 2011-09-05 11:12:02 danbri has joined
 344 2011-09-05 11:14:32 <dub> anyway, I have a couple of linux desktops but windows bullshit has its place
 345 2011-09-05 11:15:21 <lianj> yeah, in a vm :P
 346 2011-09-05 11:15:35 <Diablo-D3> yeah along with lion
 347 2011-09-05 11:17:24 devon_hillard has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
 348 2011-09-05 11:18:07 pickett has joined
 349 2011-09-05 11:22:04 MrTiggr is now known as MrTiggrAFK
 350 2011-09-05 11:24:49 KArmitt has joined
 351 2011-09-05 11:25:20 KenArmitt has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
 352 2011-09-05 11:29:10 orkaa has joined
 353 2011-09-05 11:29:34 orkaa_ has joined
 354 2011-09-05 11:33:13 orkaa has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
 355 2011-09-05 11:33:13 orkaa_ is now known as orkaa
 356 2011-09-05 11:34:14 jgarzik has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
 357 2011-09-05 11:35:44 noagendamarket has quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
 358 2011-09-05 11:41:58 WakiMiko_ has joined
 359 2011-09-05 11:44:16 WakiMiko has quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
 360 2011-09-05 11:47:03 jgarzik has joined
 361 2011-09-05 11:47:29 jgarzik is now known as Guest84779
 362 2011-09-05 11:52:16 iera has left ("http://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.")
 363 2011-09-05 11:55:42 Sedra has quit (Quit: ( IRC :: Quit ))
 364 2011-09-05 11:58:27 Sedra has joined
 365 2011-09-05 12:03:06 diki has joined
 366 2011-09-05 12:10:00 danbri_ has joined
 367 2011-09-05 12:10:52 danbri has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
 368 2011-09-05 12:26:07 <CIA-101> bitcoinj: hearn@google.com * r194 /trunk/src/com/google/bitcoin/store/BoundedOverheadBlockStore.java:
 369 2011-09-05 12:26:07 <CIA-101> bitcoinj: Make some fields static/final as a memory optimization. Thanks to Andreas for his suggestions.
 370 2011-09-05 12:26:07 <CIA-101> bitcoinj: Fix a bug that affected Windows machines by always closing files on the exception propagation path.
 371 2011-09-05 12:30:01 Sedra has quit (Quit: ( IRC :: Quit ))
 372 2011-09-05 12:30:50 <edcba> why isn't hearn used finally ?
 373 2011-09-05 12:30:56 <CIA-101> bitcoinj: hearn@google.com * r195 /trunk/src/com/google/bitcoin/store/BoundedOverheadBlockStore.java: Open files in sync mode. This forces use of fsync() at the right times, and may help resolve corruption issues observed on Android devices. Updates issue 66.
 374 2011-09-05 12:31:22 <edcba> ie finally { if (this.file != null) this.file.close(); ?
 375 2011-09-05 12:32:25 Sedra has joined
 376 2011-09-05 12:32:29 <CIA-101> bitcoinj: hearn@google.com * r196 /trunk/src/com/google/bitcoin/store/BoundedOverheadBlockStore.java: Use "d" mode not "s" mode, to avoid needlessly updating file metadata (we don't use it).
 377 2011-09-05 12:32:41 <lfm> whats hearn?
 378 2011-09-05 12:33:12 <UukGoblin> Mike Hearn, aka TD
 379 2011-09-05 12:33:36 <edcba> i didn't know his nick :)
 380 2011-09-05 12:34:56 datagutt has joined
 381 2011-09-05 12:36:16 <lfm> close doesnt set the file pointer to null
 382 2011-09-05 12:37:12 <lfm> so it might double close -> ENOFILE
 383 2011-09-05 12:37:44 <lfm> or null ref some buffer
 384 2011-09-05 12:39:53 deadlymeaqbj has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
 385 2011-09-05 12:40:43 <edcba> indeed didn't see it keeps file open
 386 2011-09-05 12:41:32 deadlymeaqbj has joined
 387 2011-09-05 12:43:47 <CIA-101> bitcoin: Con Kolivas * r2f5f7efd229f cgminer/main.c: No need to use the re-entrant strtok_r and mingw32 doesn't support it anyway.
 388 2011-09-05 12:45:33 deadlymeaqbj has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
 389 2011-09-05 12:45:52 danbri_ has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 390 2011-09-05 12:47:35 deadlymeaqbj has joined
 391 2011-09-05 12:51:59 deadlymeaqbj has quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
 392 2011-09-05 12:54:23 deadlymeaqbj has joined
 393 2011-09-05 12:55:28 Guest84779 has quit (Changing host)
 394 2011-09-05 12:55:29 Guest84779 has joined
 395 2011-09-05 12:55:33 Guest84779 is now known as jgarzik
 396 2011-09-05 12:58:50 piuk has joined
 397 2011-09-05 12:58:55 deadlymeaqbj has quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
 398 2011-09-05 13:00:41 zapnap has joined
 399 2011-09-05 13:00:53 deadlymeaqbj has joined
 400 2011-09-05 13:03:20 piuk has quit (Client Quit)
 401 2011-09-05 13:08:12 MrTiggrAFK is now known as MrTiggr
 402 2011-09-05 13:08:51 larsivi has quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
 403 2011-09-05 13:11:17 danbri has joined
 404 2011-09-05 13:14:19 <TD> edcba: because that method is supposed to keep the file around if it works
 405 2011-09-05 13:14:27 <TD> edcba: we only need to close the file on the exceptional path
 406 2011-09-05 13:14:44 <CIA-101> bitcoinj: hearn@google.com * r197 /trunk/ (3 files in 2 dirs):
 407 2011-09-05 13:14:44 <CIA-101> bitcoinj: When confirming a transaction as sent, move connected newly spent transactions
 408 2011-09-05 13:14:44 <CIA-101> bitcoinj: from unspent->spent. Introduce a method to do this, so as to avoid duplication
 409 2011-09-05 13:14:44 <CIA-101> bitcoinj: with updateForSpends(). Add a getPoolSize() method and use it in unit tests to
 410 2011-09-05 13:14:44 <CIA-101> bitcoinj: verify the pools at various points. Resolves issue 72.
 411 2011-09-05 13:16:31 danbri has quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
 412 2011-09-05 13:19:54 PhilBert has joined
 413 2011-09-05 13:26:23 danbri has joined
 414 2011-09-05 13:26:52 wolfspraul has joined
 415 2011-09-05 13:27:43 <TD> hmm, BlueMatts DNS node is returning AAAA records?
 416 2011-09-05 13:28:05 <TD> interesting
 417 2011-09-05 13:29:00 <CIA-101> bitcoinj: hearn@google.com * r198 /trunk/src/com/google/bitcoin/core/PeerGroup.java: Don't log stack traces for expected network problems. Clean up the logging a bit. Resolves issue 69.
 418 2011-09-05 13:38:03 forloop has joined
 419 2011-09-05 13:38:13 <forloop> !bc,blocks
 420 2011-09-05 13:39:24 copumpkin has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
 421 2011-09-05 13:39:50 copumpkin has joined
 422 2011-09-05 13:39:56 danbri_ has joined
 423 2011-09-05 13:43:21 danbri has quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
 424 2011-09-05 13:44:35 <phantomcircuit> TD, so i understand that bitcoinj can only connect to 1 peer?
 425 2011-09-05 13:50:25 TD has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 426 2011-09-05 13:50:43 TD has joined
 427 2011-09-05 13:51:01 <TD> phantomcircuit: nope
 428 2011-09-05 13:51:13 <TD> phantomcircuit: it can connect to irc/dns, find a bunch of peers, connect to all of them
 429 2011-09-05 13:53:41 p0s has joined
 430 2011-09-05 14:06:53 <asher^> how long is the delay in propogating new blocks over the network usually? is it heavily dependant on the quality/quantity of nodes you are connected to or pretty quick in any case?
 431 2011-09-05 14:07:21 <Tamo> Chickens control most of the blocks
 432 2011-09-05 14:07:31 <Tamo> Tigers share the blocks around
 433 2011-09-05 14:07:36 <Tamo> and monkeys mine the blocks
 434 2011-09-05 14:10:33 KArmitt has quit ()
 435 2011-09-05 14:10:35 <asher^> thanks.
 436 2011-09-05 14:10:44 KenArmitt has joined
 437 2011-09-05 14:12:02 <TD> asher^: a minute or so i guess for it to go everywhere. someone has stats on this, i forgot
 438 2011-09-05 14:12:13 <TD> asher^: lots of nodes are in a kind of semi-broken state where they are not on the full chain
 439 2011-09-05 14:12:15 <TD> so they'll never get it
 440 2011-09-05 14:12:32 <asher^> :-|
 441 2011-09-05 14:18:45 forloop has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
 442 2011-09-05 14:20:56 zapnap has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 443 2011-09-05 14:26:08 T_X has joined
 444 2011-09-05 14:27:03 danbri_ is now known as danbri
 445 2011-09-05 14:27:24 roconnor has joined
 446 2011-09-05 14:32:02 <UukGoblin> !seen gavinandresen
 447 2011-09-05 14:32:03 <TiggrBot> gavinandresen was last seen speaking 24 hours, 13 minutes, 40 seconds ago.
 448 2011-09-05 14:32:03 <spaola> gavinandresen (~gavinandr@pool-72-79-216-148.spfdma.east.verizon.net) was last seen quitting from #bitcoin-dev 23 hours, 47 minutes ago stating (Quit: gavinandresen).
 449 2011-09-05 14:40:01 Matth1a3 has quit (Quit: Leaving.)
 450 2011-09-05 14:40:37 zkandor has joined
 451 2011-09-05 14:46:17 kish has quit (Quit: leaving)
 452 2011-09-05 14:49:07 ThomasV_ has joined
 453 2011-09-05 14:50:55 zertam has joined
 454 2011-09-05 14:56:01 zkandor has left ("Linkinus - http://linkinus.com")
 455 2011-09-05 14:58:20 zertam has quit (Quit: zertam)
 456 2011-09-05 15:07:12 zapnap has joined
 457 2011-09-05 15:09:26 paul0 has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
 458 2011-09-05 15:09:33 DontMindMe has joined
 459 2011-09-05 15:12:27 eoss has joined
 460 2011-09-05 15:12:27 eoss has quit (Changing host)
 461 2011-09-05 15:12:27 eoss has joined
 462 2011-09-05 15:16:15 paul0 has joined
 463 2011-09-05 15:17:16 pickett has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
 464 2011-09-05 15:20:57 surikator has quit (Quit: Computer is sleeping. I'm probably not.)
 465 2011-09-05 15:26:11 orkaa has quit (Quit: orkaa)
 466 2011-09-05 15:27:51 wolfspraul has quit (Quit: leaving)
 467 2011-09-05 15:30:40 eastender has joined
 468 2011-09-05 15:38:59 jostmey has joined
 469 2011-09-05 15:39:38 Matth1a3 has joined
 470 2011-09-05 15:39:44 zapnap has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 471 2011-09-05 15:40:58 KenArmitt has quit ()
 472 2011-09-05 15:41:20 orkaa has joined
 473 2011-09-05 15:42:45 <Matth1a3> so I'm trying to build the current master in win 7 to test some commits and I'm getting many symlink errors in msys when trying to tar xfz openssl - can I just use 7zip instead?
 474 2011-09-05 15:43:59 <UukGoblin> Matth1a3, windows doesn't support symlinks afaik...
 475 2011-09-05 15:44:05 <luke-jr> UukGoblin: it does
 476 2011-09-05 15:44:06 CIA-101 has quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
 477 2011-09-05 15:44:08 <UukGoblin> srsly?
 478 2011-09-05 15:44:20 <luke-jr> UukGoblin: yes, but probably not via POSIX
 479 2011-09-05 15:44:20 <UukGoblin> since... when? :-O
 480 2011-09-05 15:44:28 <luke-jr> I think NT always has
 481 2011-09-05 15:45:12 <luke-jr> maybe just since NTFS
 482 2011-09-05 15:45:16 iocor has joined
 483 2011-09-05 15:45:17 <UukGoblin> hmm
 484 2011-09-05 15:45:20 orkaa_ has joined
 485 2011-09-05 15:45:38 <luke-jr> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NTFS_symbolic_link
 486 2011-09-05 15:45:44 orkaa has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
 487 2011-09-05 15:46:00 <luke-jr> http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/aa363866.aspx says since Vista/2008
 488 2011-09-05 15:46:11 <UukGoblin> ah, that'd be it
 489 2011-09-05 15:46:18 <UukGoblin> I stopped following windows after ~xp
 490 2011-09-05 15:46:22 <UukGoblin> nice to hear, anyway
 491 2011-09-05 15:48:01 CIA-92 has joined
 492 2011-09-05 15:48:26 altamic has joined
 493 2011-09-05 15:49:29 orkaa_ has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
 494 2011-09-05 15:49:54 Daniel0108 has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
 495 2011-09-05 15:50:57 m00p has joined
 496 2011-09-05 15:55:30 erle- has quit (Quit: CETERVM•AVTEM•CENSEO•CVTTENBERC•ESSE•DELENDVM)
 497 2011-09-05 15:55:30 deadlymeaqbj has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 498 2011-09-05 15:59:09 danbri has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 499 2011-09-05 16:00:38 marf_away has quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
 500 2011-09-05 16:02:07 robblesz has quit (Quit: .)
 501 2011-09-05 16:03:33 erus` has quit (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.87 [Firefox 6.0.1/20110830092941])
 502 2011-09-05 16:03:42 robblesz has joined
 503 2011-09-05 16:04:46 orkaa has joined
 504 2011-09-05 16:05:36 orkaa_ has joined
 505 2011-09-05 16:06:07 rotatingslipcre has joined
 506 2011-09-05 16:06:36 Clipse has quit (Quit: Clipse)
 507 2011-09-05 16:06:36 Daniel0108 has joined
 508 2011-09-05 16:09:04 orkaa has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
 509 2011-09-05 16:09:04 orkaa_ is now known as orkaa
 510 2011-09-05 16:09:22 altamic has quit (Quit: altamic)
 511 2011-09-05 16:10:33 sytse has quit (Read error: No route to host)
 512 2011-09-05 16:10:41 sytse has joined
 513 2011-09-05 16:13:18 roconnor_ has joined
 514 2011-09-05 16:13:41 nr9 has quit (Quit: Ex-Chat)
 515 2011-09-05 16:13:59 <phantomcircuit> luke-jr, normal users cant use NTFS symlinks because they override permissions or something ridiculous like that
 516 2011-09-05 16:14:33 roconnor has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
 517 2011-09-05 16:15:33 shadders_ has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
 518 2011-09-05 16:15:39 omegadraconis has joined
 519 2011-09-05 16:15:53 zapnap has joined
 520 2011-09-05 16:23:29 eastender has quit ()
 521 2011-09-05 16:24:09 <CIA-92> bitcoin: Luke Dashjr noncerange * rf28ddfc39063 pushpool-personal/ (msg.c server.c server.h): Implement noncerange extension (DRAFT, please review)
 522 2011-09-05 16:24:17 storrgie has joined
 523 2011-09-05 16:26:22 kish has joined
 524 2011-09-05 16:27:20 AStove has joined
 525 2011-09-05 16:34:02 erus` has joined
 526 2011-09-05 16:34:29 Clipse has joined
 527 2011-09-05 16:38:57 copumpkin has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
 528 2011-09-05 16:39:23 copumpkin has joined
 529 2011-09-05 16:39:38 DontMindMe has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
 530 2011-09-05 16:40:13 Titeuf_87 has joined
 531 2011-09-05 16:40:24 asher^ has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 532 2011-09-05 16:40:25 DontMindMe has joined
 533 2011-09-05 16:41:26 shadders_ has joined
 534 2011-09-05 16:42:36 rotatingslipcre has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 535 2011-09-05 16:43:28 da2ce7 has quit ()
 536 2011-09-05 16:43:48 <CIA-92> bitcoin: Luke Dashjr noncerange * rdb30421b6d59 pushpool-personal/ (msg.c server.c server.h): Implement noncerange extension (DRAFT, please review)
 537 2011-09-05 16:47:11 Lopuz has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
 538 2011-09-05 16:53:01 negativeburrvgb has joined
 539 2011-09-05 17:17:33 Burgundy has joined
 540 2011-09-05 17:17:39 Burgundy has quit (Client Quit)
 541 2011-09-05 17:17:40 <CIA-92> bitcoinj: hearn@google.com * r199 /trunk/ (2 files in 2 dirs): Make PeerGroup remember discovery sources and retry them after a while.
 542 2011-09-05 17:17:50 Burgundy has joined
 543 2011-09-05 17:19:04 danbri has joined
 544 2011-09-05 17:20:23 b4epoche_ has joined
 545 2011-09-05 17:20:46 Lopuz has joined
 546 2011-09-05 17:20:53 imsaguy has joined
 547 2011-09-05 17:21:06 roconnor_ is now known as roconnor
 548 2011-09-05 17:21:28 <iddo> i'm trying to understand merged mining, does it work by concatenating the namecoin block hash to the bitcoin nonce?
 549 2011-09-05 17:21:53 <TD> see https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Alternative_Chains
 550 2011-09-05 17:22:12 jostmey has quit (Quit: Page closed)
 551 2011-09-05 17:22:23 <Diablo-D3> iddo: it requires lots and lots of drugs
 552 2011-09-05 17:22:49 <iddo> so if the bitcoin block gets hashed with enough leading 0s for either namecoin difficulty or both, you need to attach this entire bitcoin block to the namecoin chain
 553 2011-09-05 17:22:53 <iddo> ?
 554 2011-09-05 17:23:49 <iddo> hmm https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Alternative_Chains is a lot to read...
 555 2011-09-05 17:23:51 <TD> the bitcoin block needs to be associated with the namecoin block, yes
 556 2011-09-05 17:23:55 <TD> well it's a complicated topic
 557 2011-09-05 17:23:59 <TD> that article explains everything though
 558 2011-09-05 17:24:17 <phantomcircuit> it's not that complicated
 559 2011-09-05 17:24:26 <phantomcircuit> you just put hte bitcoin block hash into the namecoin block
 560 2011-09-05 17:24:29 <phantomcircuit> shazam
 561 2011-09-05 17:24:32 <TD> no
 562 2011-09-05 17:24:34 <TD> that's not how it works
 563 2011-09-05 17:24:37 <TD> read the article again
 564 2011-09-05 17:24:47 <iddo> so the entire bitcoin block (including all bitcoin transactions) have to be attached to the current namecoin chain, as proof of work?
 565 2011-09-05 17:24:50 <TD> no
 566 2011-09-05 17:24:58 <TD> just the header, the coinbase tx and a merkle branch linking the two
 567 2011-09-05 17:25:04 <TD> really, it's best to just read the article
 568 2011-09-05 17:25:07 * TD -> home
 569 2011-09-05 17:25:12 TD has quit (Quit: TD)
 570 2011-09-05 17:27:26 TheAncientGoat has joined
 571 2011-09-05 17:27:34 <iddo> ok thank, i'll try to read, but it seemed to me that everything in the bitcoin block that gets hashed needs to be attached to the namecoin block as proof of work
 572 2011-09-05 17:29:42 surikator has joined
 573 2011-09-05 17:30:10 <phantomcircuit> iddo, depends on whether you have access to the bitcoin blocks or not
 574 2011-09-05 17:30:16 <phantomcircuit> although i guess this is assuming you do not
 575 2011-09-05 17:31:05 storrgie has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 576 2011-09-05 17:31:22 <iddo> i think you don't have access, because if the leading 0s are only good for the current namecoin difficulty, then this block wouldn't be part of the bitcoin blockchain
 577 2011-09-05 17:31:35 tKM has joined
 578 2011-09-05 17:35:07 <Lopuz> where do you get namecoin?
 579 2011-09-05 17:36:46 orkaa has quit (Quit: orkaa)
 580 2011-09-05 17:36:58 ThomasV_ has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
 581 2011-09-05 17:37:04 QueryTom3000 has joined
 582 2011-09-05 17:38:28 <iddo> maybe the idea behind what TD meant is that we don't hash the entire bitcoin block with changing nonce, but we first calculate hash of the bitcoin block and then add changing nonce to this hash until we get proof of work
 583 2011-09-05 17:38:50 <iddo> is this how bitcoin works?
 584 2011-09-05 17:41:22 Zarutian has joined
 585 2011-09-05 17:45:11 <Lopuz> how much does a domain cost?
 586 2011-09-05 17:48:48 ThomasV_ has joined
 587 2011-09-05 17:49:03 <npouillard> Lopuz: http://dot-bit.org/tools/domainCost.php
 588 2011-09-05 17:49:19 <Lopuz> thanks
 589 2011-09-05 17:50:18 clr_ has joined
 590 2011-09-05 17:52:20 clr_ is now known as c00w
 591 2011-09-05 17:57:38 larsivi has joined
 592 2011-09-05 18:00:54 roconnor has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
 593 2011-09-05 18:06:11 marf_away has joined
 594 2011-09-05 18:07:05 negativeburrvgb has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
 595 2011-09-05 18:08:02 zapnap has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 596 2011-09-05 18:13:21 quellhorst has quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
 597 2011-09-05 18:17:29 invertedstbez has joined
 598 2011-09-05 18:20:21 Dispositions has joined
 599 2011-09-05 18:21:49 <tcatm> ;;seen BlueMatt
 600 2011-09-05 18:21:49 <gribble> BlueMatt was last seen in #bitcoin-dev 3 days, 0 hours, 2 minutes, and 19 seconds ago: <BlueMatt> phantomcircuit: well fair enough
 601 2011-09-05 18:23:57 orkaa has joined
 602 2011-09-05 18:26:28 BTCTrader_ has joined
 603 2011-09-05 18:31:09 paul0 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
 604 2011-09-05 18:31:49 paul0 has joined
 605 2011-09-05 18:31:49 <midnightmagic> looking forward to being vindicated when merged mining arrives..
 606 2011-09-05 18:32:17 <midnightmagic> cooperation assures the success of all these alternate chains, not competition
 607 2011-09-05 18:33:47 <jrmithdobbs> alternate chains are worthless
 608 2011-09-05 18:33:50 <jrmithdobbs> but w/e
 609 2011-09-05 18:34:01 <jrmithdobbs> at least, for use as currency
 610 2011-09-05 18:34:46 <b4epoche_> what's with artfotz reporting bugs in the solidcoin client?
 611 2011-09-05 18:36:02 TiggrBot has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
 612 2011-09-05 18:36:52 Backburn has joined
 613 2011-09-05 18:37:20 <JFK911> lol artfotz
 614 2011-09-05 18:38:12 <BTCTrader_> i want to make a solidcoin fork called s0lidcoin
 615 2011-09-05 18:38:21 ahihi2 has quit ()
 616 2011-09-05 18:38:38 <midnightmagic> alternate chains allow people to experiment without parasitic theft of core bitcoin mining. and then there is a free choice to mine on them and everyone still gets their core bitcoins. it's additive: it costs basically nothing extra to hash as many coin chains as you want.
 617 2011-09-05 18:38:39 <mtrlt> i would start liquidcoin
 618 2011-09-05 18:38:47 <mtrlt> if i could be arsed to
 619 2011-09-05 18:38:54 ahihi2 has joined
 620 2011-09-05 18:38:58 <BTCTrader_> alt chains have a great effect in the market
 621 2011-09-05 18:39:17 <BTCTrader_> they can be used to prove good or bad implementations of features
 622 2011-09-05 18:39:19 ahihi2 has quit (Client Quit)
 623 2011-09-05 18:39:30 ahihi2 has joined
 624 2011-09-05 18:39:53 <midnightmagic> precisely: and if one becomes more popular than bitcoin because it turns out people do like more rapid adaptation to mining changes, then they can continue mining that without splitting mining effort.
 625 2011-09-05 18:40:21 <BTCTrader_> when is unified mining looking to be possible?
 626 2011-09-05 18:40:31 <midnightmagic> block 19200 it'll be turned on for namecoin.
 627 2011-09-05 18:40:37 <BTCTrader_> sweet
 628 2011-09-05 18:40:49 <BTCTrader_> namecoin is the only other one i care about atm
 629 2011-09-05 18:40:51 <midnightmagic> all you need is a bitcoin patch, you don't have to change mainline as far as I can tell
 630 2011-09-05 18:41:05 <midnightmagic> you just need the getauxwork() rpc call.
 631 2011-09-05 18:41:55 <midnightmagic> like..  all the normal bitcoin people out there won't even know you're running getauxwork I don't think.
 632 2011-09-05 18:42:05 <BTCTrader_> nods
 633 2011-09-05 18:42:27 <BTCTrader_> how far away is block 19200?
 634 2011-09-05 18:42:55 orkaa_ has joined
 635 2011-09-05 18:43:17 <jrmithdobbs> like 12 months since namecoin got fucked by drop off of mining i think
 636 2011-09-05 18:43:18 <jrmithdobbs> lol
 637 2011-09-05 18:43:37 <midnightmagic> about a month I think at this rate.
 638 2011-09-05 18:43:38 <TuxBlackEdo> more like 2 months
 639 2011-09-05 18:43:48 <midnightmagic> ah, it's more than 2 hour average?
 640 2011-09-05 18:43:55 strangeranger has joined
 641 2011-09-05 18:44:05 <TuxBlackEdo> Network Speed: 45.02 GH/s | Average Block Time: 2 hours 29 minutes 31 seconds   | Based on 29 Blocks
 642 2011-09-05 18:44:29 <midnightmagic> oh good lord, instant is down to 6600.
 643 2011-09-05 18:44:54 <TuxBlackEdo> Current Difficulty: 94037.961114 | Next Difficulty Estimate: 10628.2973631 | Next Difficulty In: 11 weeks 3 days 4 hours 30 minutes 22 seconds
 644 2011-09-05 18:46:03 <midnightmagic> assuming merged mining happens at 19200, then that's 341 blocks away, @ 2:29 = 35 days i think.
 645 2011-09-05 18:46:07 gavinandresen has joined
 646 2011-09-05 18:46:09 orkaa has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
 647 2011-09-05 18:46:10 orkaa_ is now known as orkaa
 648 2011-09-05 18:46:13 <midnightmagic> oh hey gavin
 649 2011-09-05 18:46:20 <gavinandresen> howdy
 650 2011-09-05 18:46:40 <midnightmagic> is getauxwork() got a chance in heck of making into mainline?
 651 2011-09-05 18:46:51 <gavinandresen> what is getauxwork?
 652 2011-09-05 18:47:21 <midnightmagic> a call to assist namecoin merged mining.
 653 2011-09-05 18:48:25 <gavinandresen> ... and what does it do?  Is there a description somewhere?
 654 2011-09-05 18:48:29 imsaguy has quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
 655 2011-09-05 18:48:55 <phantomcircuit> gavinandresen, just an fyi the bitcoin.org site now looks ridiculous with noscript
 656 2011-09-05 18:49:17 <gavinandresen> phantomcircuit: tell Nils
 657 2011-09-05 18:49:25 <phantomcircuit> tcatm, ^
 658 2011-09-05 18:50:29 c00w has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
 659 2011-09-05 18:50:31 <tcatm> phantomcircuit: I know. I'd like to pre-render the CSS but I didn't have time to figure out how to do that with github pages.
 660 2011-09-05 18:50:47 ashrewdmint has joined
 661 2011-09-05 18:52:18 <tcatm> I just tried it without CSS and it's pretty usable.
 662 2011-09-05 18:52:48 riush has joined
 663 2011-09-05 18:53:31 <midnightmagic> there's some description here: https://github.com/vinced/namecoin/blob/mergedmine/doc/README_merged-mining.md
 664 2011-09-05 18:54:54 <phantomcircuit> tcatm, http://pastebin.com/s3nmrVUg
 665 2011-09-05 18:55:10 zamgo has joined
 666 2011-09-05 18:55:37 <tcatm> phantomcircuit: that's the rendered CSS, yes
 667 2011-09-05 18:55:53 <phantomcircuit> yes
 668 2011-09-05 18:55:58 <tcatm> I'd like to have a jekyll pluging (that works on github) to automatically generate that
 669 2011-09-05 18:56:18 <phantomcircuit> why not just... use that?
 670 2011-09-05 18:56:40 hrngfd has joined
 671 2011-09-05 18:57:08 invertedstbez has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 672 2011-09-05 18:57:09 <tcatm> I'd have to update that everytime I change the source
 673 2011-09-05 18:58:42 <phantomcircuit> what's your plan for future changes?
 674 2011-09-05 18:59:37 <tcatm> making github/jekyll generate the CSS on each push
 675 2011-09-05 19:00:22 TD has joined
 676 2011-09-05 19:02:44 d1g1t4l has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
 677 2011-09-05 19:03:11 Asphodelia has joined
 678 2011-09-05 19:05:00 <gavinandresen> I just submitted two pull requests, would appreciate review/sanity-tests
 679 2011-09-05 19:05:00 surikator has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
 680 2011-09-05 19:05:02 <Matth1a3> has anyone here had great success building the source in windows 7? I am trying to setup a test environment for some commits, and I am running into one issue after the next...
 681 2011-09-05 19:05:10 <gavinandresen> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/492
 682 2011-09-05 19:05:19 <gavinandresen> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/491
 683 2011-09-05 19:05:20 d1g1t4l has joined
 684 2011-09-05 19:05:35 d1g1t4l has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 685 2011-09-05 19:06:17 <gavinandresen> Matth1a3: the official releases are cross-compiled on Linux using mingw
 686 2011-09-05 19:06:28 c00w has joined
 687 2011-09-05 19:06:32 Matth1a3 is now known as alexwaters
 688 2011-09-05 19:06:35 <gavinandresen> (I can't help, I compile linux and mac)
 689 2011-09-05 19:07:06 <alexwaters> i see, np - tried the ec2 image and I am getting connection problems - can't even run the instance after setting up aws
 690 2011-09-05 19:07:47 radiantdormohfr has joined
 691 2011-09-05 19:08:19 <Asphodelia> (https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/FAQ#Why_don.27t_we_use_calculations_that_are_also_useful_for_some_other_purpose.3F) Am I correct in thinking that the main features that would be needed from an alternate proof-of-work algorithm would be cheap verifiability and the ability to include arbitrary data in the proof of work?
 692 2011-09-05 19:08:26 m00p has quit (Disconnected by services)
 693 2011-09-05 19:08:43 <zamgo> re: 492.  so if a blockchain is offered online, one downloads it and does a -rescan on it.  then is it 'safe' as long as the chain ends 120 blocks or more before the last lockin?
 694 2011-09-05 19:09:24 moop has joined
 695 2011-09-05 19:09:39 <TD> Asphodelia: it's more complicated than that
 696 2011-09-05 19:09:41 <kjj> Asphodelia: those two features are necessary, yes.  but not sufficient
 697 2011-09-05 19:11:05 datagutt has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
 698 2011-09-05 19:11:05 <Asphodelia> What other features are necessary?
 699 2011-09-05 19:11:22 <midnightmagic> pseudorandomness so we can modulate the difficulty to acocmmodate fresh mining power.
 700 2011-09-05 19:12:32 <Asphodelia> I don't see how pseudorandomness is involved in difficulty adjustments.
 701 2011-09-05 19:12:50 orkaa has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
 702 2011-09-05 19:13:10 <Asphodelia> Is it in the adjustability of the difficulty, or in deciding what we should adjust it to?
 703 2011-09-05 19:13:34 orkaa has joined
 704 2011-09-05 19:13:38 <kjj> it has to be easy to verify, but hard to do, and the difficulty must be able to scale as needed
 705 2011-09-05 19:14:06 acecake has joined
 706 2011-09-05 19:14:42 <Asphodelia> Okay. So far I have easy verification, data inclusion, and scalable difficulty. Are there any other requirements, or are those sufficient?
 707 2011-09-05 19:15:01 RazielZ has quit (Quit: Leaving)
 708 2011-09-05 19:15:24 <kjj> there are probably a bunch more, but I can't find the thread where it was discussed in depth
 709 2011-09-05 19:15:54 <midnightmagic> Asphodelia: it has to do with being able to moodulate difficulty: if the result is pseudorandom with good distribution, then we can say "anything below X" and reasonably expect that, on average,y% of all results will hit below that line.
 710 2011-09-05 19:15:56 <kjj> but you basically end up with a cryptographic hash
 711 2011-09-05 19:16:11 <Asphodelia> okay
 712 2011-09-05 19:16:19 <midnightmagic> if it were not pseudorandom, then you couldn't set the bar at X and be able to predict on average how many results will be below it.
 713 2011-09-05 19:16:37 <midnightmagic> and therefore couldn't keep block generation at an expected time interval.
 714 2011-09-05 19:16:50 * Asphodelia nods
 715 2011-09-05 19:17:21 xelister has joined
 716 2011-09-05 19:17:29 <gavinandresen> zamgo: ummm...  assuming you are connected to the 'real' bitcoin network, then any blockchain that you download and -rescan is safe.
 717 2011-09-05 19:18:06 <zamgo> ok
 718 2011-09-05 19:18:21 <gavinandresen> zamgo: the attack would be:  attacker gets you to download a bogus chain that ends after the last checkpoint, and then manages to get you to connect only to their nodes, which then agree that the bogus chain is the right one
 719 2011-09-05 19:18:49 <Asphodelia> Is the thread you were thinking of one of these? https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=6558.0 https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=8519.0 https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=6408.0 https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=36242.0
 720 2011-09-05 19:19:04 <xelister> gavinandresen: hi, seeing how other networks are left for months damaged by surge in power, and how testnet was destroyed by me with Artz =)
 721 2011-09-05 19:19:10 <acecake> If the client has a transaction in it's memory pool (i.e. not included in a block yet) will it accept another transaction spending one of the same inputs?
 722 2011-09-05 19:19:29 <xelister> gavinandresen: why not allow more often lowering of target if the current reall spead appears very low
 723 2011-09-05 19:19:52 <xelister> and allow lowering even without waiting even 1 block, e.g. if "there was 72 hours without ANY block mined" etc
 724 2011-09-05 19:20:02 <gavinandresen> xelister: ArtForz has a very good analysis of why asymmetric difficulty adjustment is a really bad idea.
 725 2011-09-05 19:20:16 <xelister> btw, anyone knows what happened to ArtForz ?
 726 2011-09-05 19:20:22 <gavinandresen> xelister: ...although for the testnet, it may not matter.
 727 2011-09-05 19:20:26 <midnightmagic> he's still making posts and doing stuff
 728 2011-09-05 19:20:30 <Asphodelia> Mibs got him
 729 2011-09-05 19:20:35 <midnightmagic> looks like he just got tired of answering questions.
 730 2011-09-05 19:20:56 <phantomcircuit> gavinandresen, whose picture is that you use on github
 731 2011-09-05 19:20:58 <xelister> aw
 732 2011-09-05 19:21:07 <xelister> he was coolest person on this IRC network.
 733 2011-09-05 19:21:23 <gavinandresen> xelister: I was outvoted at the last tesnet reset-- I wanted to change the difficulty re-adjust rules
 734 2011-09-05 19:21:31 <gavinandresen> phantomcircuit: that is me from when I had a goatee
 735 2011-09-05 19:21:37 <kjj> Asphodelia: I don't think that any of those is the one particular thread I was thinking of, but they are all of the same opinion
 736 2011-09-05 19:21:37 <phantomcircuit> lol
 737 2011-09-05 19:21:41 <midnightmagic> this is freenode, i'm pretty sure he would say he is not the coolest person here. :)
 738 2011-09-05 19:21:45 <xelister> gavinandresen: what if government attacks like we did with testnet?
 739 2011-09-05 19:22:05 <phantomcircuit> shadow makes it look like a full mustache
 740 2011-09-05 19:22:07 <xelister> government could order x100 more 5970s then Ati released if they really want
 741 2011-09-05 19:22:10 <xelister> run it for a week
 742 2011-09-05 19:22:33 <xelister> then use it for the actuall purpose given to fatvote^H american public, like a cluster for your protect^H for science
 743 2011-09-05 19:22:41 devon_hillard has joined
 744 2011-09-05 19:22:41 devon_hillard has quit (Changing host)
 745 2011-09-05 19:22:41 devon_hillard has joined
 746 2011-09-05 19:23:14 <Dispositions> xelister: that's only like 70gh/s :3
 747 2011-09-05 19:23:17 <gavinandresen> I dunno.  Maybe we'd hard-code a difficulty reset after a couple of very-long-to-solve blocks.  There are lots of things we COULD do.
 748 2011-09-05 19:23:17 <xelister> nowdays it seems we would be stuck with like... 5 days for 6 confiramtions, for months
 749 2011-09-05 19:23:43 <xelister> gavinandresen: I look at ixicoin  they seem to "paniced", quickly patch and release rules and whoopsie not everyone upgraded
 750 2011-09-05 19:24:01 <zamgo> is a -rescan considered a Intial Block Download?
 751 2011-09-05 19:24:16 <xelister> with bitcoin perhaps we should right now plan such rules, release them, but make them activate only after say 2012-02-01 or something so virtually everyone will upgrade
 752 2011-09-05 19:24:26 <acecake> anyone know about the inputs - i'm trying to implement double spend detection for pi.uk.com/bitcoin. Will the client accept double spending of the same inputs until they are committed to the block chain?
 753 2011-09-05 19:24:36 <gavinandresen> zamgo: no, -rescan scans the blocks you have for transactions to/from you.
 754 2011-09-05 19:24:45 <Dispositions> acecake: no, it'll reject the second one.
 755 2011-09-05 19:24:46 strangeranger has quit (Quit: Page closed)
 756 2011-09-05 19:24:54 <acecake> ok thanks
 757 2011-09-05 19:24:57 <zamgo> ok
 758 2011-09-05 19:24:58 <xelister> btw, gavinandresen
 759 2011-09-05 19:25:08 <xelister> gavinandresen: you owe me 60000 TBTC :-E
 760 2011-09-05 19:25:15 <xelister> :)
 761 2011-09-05 19:25:26 <iddo> xelister: can you explain this attack that you mentioned?
 762 2011-09-05 19:25:49 <gavinandresen> iddo: throw lots of hashing power at the network, drive up difficulty, then go away.
 763 2011-09-05 19:26:10 <xelister> iddo: put huge power on the network so that difficulty adjusts to say 100 milion, it will be very expensive (for gov or other thugs) but just for few days and then turn off the attack
 764 2011-09-05 19:26:14 <Dispositions> that's not really fesiable.
 765 2011-09-05 19:26:15 <iddo> so blocks would take longer than 10mins to complete?
 766 2011-09-05 19:26:22 <xelister> and network is stuck at diff 100 mil for 100 * 2 weeks
 767 2011-09-05 19:26:27 <xelister> brb
 768 2011-09-05 19:27:04 <acecake> Dispositions: I assume if i comment out the validation code in CTransaction::AcceptToMemoryPool() it won't mess up the block chain as the transaction is validated again once included in a block?
 769 2011-09-05 19:27:18 <iddo> ok, so it doesn't attack the security, just slower confirmations
 770 2011-09-05 19:27:49 <phantomcircuit> acecake, yeah
 771 2011-09-05 19:27:59 <Dispositions> ^
 772 2011-09-05 19:28:08 <Dispositions> well unless you generated a block
 773 2011-09-05 19:28:17 <phantomcircuit> it would be rejected
 774 2011-09-05 19:28:17 <Dispositions> but if you aren't mining it won't happen
 775 2011-09-05 19:28:21 erle- has joined
 776 2011-09-05 19:28:26 <acecake> i'm not mining
 777 2011-09-05 19:28:38 <xelister> iddo: well it makes bitcoin useless for most todays purpsoes. a week for tx to go into exchange or any merchant or shop etc
 778 2011-09-05 19:29:20 <Dispositions> maybe gavin should modify the alert system for such forsee issue xelister :P
 779 2011-09-05 19:29:23 <iddo> what's the analysis why it's important to retarget the difficulty after several weeks, instead of e.g. a day?
 780 2011-09-05 19:29:35 <xelister> alert system?
 781 2011-09-05 19:30:07 <gavinandresen> xelister: absolutely, that kind of attack is exactly why there is an alert system
 782 2011-09-05 19:30:24 <Dispositions> https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Protocol_specification#alert
 783 2011-09-05 19:30:41 <Dispositions> afiak satoshi gave the key to gavinandresen
 784 2011-09-05 19:33:05 <zamgo> and, does that same key work on namecoin (at least pre august2011 clients)
 785 2011-09-05 19:33:16 <nexes> Does anyone happen to know if bitcoinj has a means to add a wallet reference to the BlockChain object and have it update the transactions in the wallet? Apparently using addWallet will not update the wallet with transactions from already added blocks.
 786 2011-09-05 19:33:26 <xelister> hey gavinandresen I have an "fbi conference" I need you to attend. take the key =)
 787 2011-09-05 19:33:32 <TD> nexes: see the RefreshWallet example
 788 2011-09-05 19:33:57 <Dispositions> acecake: I'm more interested if you can write a super node that attempts to connect to as much nodes as possible and attempt to monitor double spending on a networking level.
 789 2011-09-05 19:33:59 <TD> nexes: you do indeed have to redownload the block chain
 790 2011-09-05 19:34:08 <TD> Dispositions: you can and it's been done
 791 2011-09-05 19:34:16 <Dispositions> TD: where is this?
 792 2011-09-05 19:34:21 <Dispositions> I know you  can.
 793 2011-09-05 19:34:33 <TD> i could dig up the link. it was called bitcoin radar or something like that
 794 2011-09-05 19:34:42 <Dispositions> k let me google
 795 2011-09-05 19:34:52 Asphodelia has quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
 796 2011-09-05 19:34:56 <TD> in practice bitcoin has much bigger problems with botnets stealing wallets or "legitimately" mining than double spending attacks
 797 2011-09-05 19:35:17 <acecake> Dispositions: We'll My client is already a "leech" that doesn't distribute txs or blocks - i'm connected to 500 other nodes at present
 798 2011-09-05 19:35:28 <Dispositions> acecake: I figure as much
 799 2011-09-05 19:35:36 <Dispositions> here i found it incase some one wants to take a look
 800 2011-09-05 19:35:36 <Dispositions> http://transactionradar.com/
 801 2011-09-05 19:35:57 <nexes> TD: Let me try to explain this a bit better. :) I have bitcoinj running and the chain downloaded, and I'm connected to a local full Bitcoin node already. Now, I have a pre-existing wallet that I'm trying to get all transactions for, but I can't load this wallet on startup, as I was only just given it.
 802 2011-09-05 19:36:13 <TD> ok
 803 2011-09-05 19:36:22 <TD> so, wallets contain transactions
 804 2011-09-05 19:36:23 <TD> and keys
 805 2011-09-05 19:36:54 <nexes> TD: Right. Maybe that's the confusion then. I'm creating a new wallet based on keys that already exist, but I do not know the transactions in advance.
 806 2011-09-05 19:36:57 <TD> if your wallet contains keys but no transactions, you need to redownload the block chain. you can just delete the .blockchain file and rerun your app, it will redownload all the blocks from the start and find transactions relevant to your keys
 807 2011-09-05 19:36:58 <phantomcircuit> gavinandresen, has anybody ever tested the alert system?
 808 2011-09-05 19:37:12 <TD> there isn't any way to avoid downloading the whole chain currently.
 809 2011-09-05 19:37:18 <xelister> nice, an alert system dependent on some 1 person holding the key
 810 2011-09-05 19:37:21 <xelister> this sure do look like
 811 2011-09-05 19:37:25 <xelister> totally retarded idea ;)
 812 2011-09-05 19:37:32 <Dispositions> unfortunately.
 813 2011-09-05 19:37:36 <TD> one of the next things we'll add to bitcoinj is timestamps on the keys. that way when you import them, only the part of the chain since the key was created needs to be redownloaded
 814 2011-09-05 19:37:48 <nexes> TD: Yeah, in my case, re-downloading or re-loading the chain from disk will be way too slow. Bummer..
 815 2011-09-05 19:37:50 <gavinandresen> phantomcircuit: Never been used, as far as I know. I assume Satoshi tested it on a testnet.
 816 2011-09-05 19:37:52 <TD> fortunately bitcoinj can download the chain very fast
 817 2011-09-05 19:37:54 <Dispositions> well, there is talks about multi-sign.
 818 2011-09-05 19:38:00 dedeibel has joined
 819 2011-09-05 19:38:03 <phantomcircuit> gavinandresen, hehe
 820 2011-09-05 19:38:09 <TD> the early parts of the chain go at 500 blocks/second, which is the theoretical maximum pretty much
 821 2011-09-05 19:38:11 <Dispositions> and we can just multi-sign the alert key in the future
 822 2011-09-05 19:38:14 <xelister> fortunatelly we knows no gov or other thugs will ever abuse power to influence, scare, sue or kidnap gavinandresen or anything
 823 2011-09-05 19:38:17 <TD> nexes: why, what do you want to do?
 824 2011-09-05 19:38:34 <Dispositions> well currently the alert key doesn't really do anything.
 825 2011-09-05 19:38:37 <gavinandresen> Oh, yeah, speaking of multi-sig I rewrote my multi-sig proposal:  https://gist.github.com/39158239e36f6af69d6f
 826 2011-09-05 19:38:41 <TD> xelister: the alert system isn't very useful. it doesn't do anything at all for non-gui nodes
 827 2011-09-05 19:38:49 <TD> and it doesn't even give a popup alert for gui nodes.
 828 2011-09-05 19:38:49 alexwaters is now known as matth1a3
 829 2011-09-05 19:38:58 <TD> i think it should be used for every important upgrade actually
 830 2011-09-05 19:39:01 <nexes> TD: I'm running a service where users will provide me their public keys and I need to generate a list of their transactions from that list.
 831 2011-09-05 19:39:01 <xelister> anyway, why not allow very fast readjusting?
 832 2011-09-05 19:39:06 <Dispositions> gavinandresen: nice, clicks
 833 2011-09-05 19:39:08 <xelister> it can be also symmetrical (re ArtzForz)
 834 2011-09-05 19:39:10 <TD> nexes: so a block explorer?
 835 2011-09-05 19:39:35 <nexes> TD: Sort of. It also needs to be able to build and sign transactions.
 836 2011-09-05 19:40:03 <TD> nexes: could you give me more details? what you need is a different BlockStore, that maintains a full chain index in a sql db or something like that.
 837 2011-09-05 19:40:07 * TD wrote bitcoinj
 838 2011-09-05 19:40:14 <nexes> TD: Do you mind if I PM you quick?
 839 2011-09-05 19:40:16 <TD> so i'm interested in your plans for it
 840 2011-09-05 19:40:18 <TD> sure, go ahead
 841 2011-09-05 19:40:26 <xelister> TD: you work for the evil? ;)
 842 2011-09-05 19:40:28 * Dispositions didn't know TD wrote bitcoinj
 843 2011-09-05 19:40:35 <Dispositions> :3 nice work TD
 844 2011-09-05 19:40:35 <TD> i don't just work for the evil
 845 2011-09-05 19:40:39 <TD> i AM the evil. fear me.
 846 2011-09-05 19:40:40 <Dispositions> he is the evil
 847 2011-09-05 19:40:42 <Dispositions> LOL
 848 2011-09-05 19:40:43 <Dispositions> see.
 849 2011-09-05 19:40:51 <Blitzboom> he works for google
 850 2011-09-05 19:40:53 <Blitzboom> so no coincidence
 851 2011-09-05 19:41:02 zapnap has joined
 852 2011-09-05 19:41:09 scn has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
 853 2011-09-05 19:41:32 <kinlo> gavinandresen: do you posses the private key for this alert key?
 854 2011-09-05 19:41:51 <zamgo> Do No Good
 855 2011-09-05 19:41:52 <gavinandresen> kinlo: I'd rather not say who has the alert key-- lookup 'rubber hose cryptography'
 856 2011-09-05 19:42:13 <zamgo> http://xkcd.com/538/
 857 2011-09-05 19:42:20 <kinlo> heh, ok
 858 2011-09-05 19:42:43 <iddo> TD: does bitcoinj simple verification mode stores all the blockchain headers from the genesis block, or would it use checkpoints (and calc your wallet balance till the checkpoint) and trim the earlier chain history?
 859 2011-09-05 19:42:48 <Dispositions> Mmmm, there needs to be some way to fetch old transactions from a super node so there can be a service to just sign transactions
 860 2011-09-05 19:42:54 <xelister> TD: are you proud for serving corportaion that helped to keep order. Like giving up personal data of Chinese blogger so his gov could imprison him :P
 861 2011-09-05 19:43:02 <kinlo> gavinandresen: in any case, a fork could easily be created if the key is breached
 862 2011-09-05 19:43:17 <iddo> assuming no one has hash power to fork the blockchain from a checkpoint
 863 2011-09-05 19:43:19 <gavinandresen> kinlo: yup.  And a m-of-n signature scheme could replace it....
 864 2011-09-05 19:43:20 <TD> iddo: it does the former but could do (and at some point will do) the latter
 865 2011-09-05 19:43:22 <xelister> kinlo: easly created hardly deployed
 866 2011-09-05 19:43:23 <Dispositions> kinlo: it's not a big deal, it currently doesn't do anything.
 867 2011-09-05 19:43:32 <iddo> TD: ok, cool
 868 2011-09-05 19:44:05 <TD> xelister: think you got us confused with yahoo
 869 2011-09-05 19:45:04 <iddo> TD: the Satoshi article talks about doing the former, but i guess the latter is safe if checkpoints are far enough
 870 2011-09-05 19:45:08 <kinlo> I really should continue reading the source
 871 2011-09-05 19:45:31 <kinlo> but I would assume that it could be used to force people to upgrade at a certain point if implemented correctyl
 872 2011-09-05 19:45:49 <Dispositions> gavinandresen: i feel the m-of-n case 2 and 4 is effectively pointless, ther eonly needs 3 with extention, and 5, works ([1..n]) or Z
 873 2011-09-05 19:45:50 <TD> iddo: you need enough block headers to safely handle re-orgs
 874 2011-09-05 19:46:02 <xelister> TD: doubt it. (un?)surprisingly it takes me a while to regoogle it
 875 2011-09-05 19:46:05 <TD> iddo: in theory, a re-org can be arbitrarily deep, all the way back to the genesis block
 876 2011-09-05 19:46:22 <TD> iddo: in practice such a re-org would be computationally infeasible. even one more than only 10 blocks deep is quite unlikely at current speeds.
 877 2011-09-05 19:46:25 <Dispositions> case 2 and 4 is like a shitty lock
 878 2011-09-05 19:46:27 <Dispositions> :3
 879 2011-09-05 19:46:33 <TD> iddo: so if you store, say, 1000 headers, the chances of you ending up stuck is very low
 880 2011-09-05 19:46:53 osmosis has joined
 881 2011-09-05 19:47:01 <gavinandresen> Dispositions: can you add a comment to the gist saying so?
 882 2011-09-05 19:47:05 <TD> iddo: at some point i'll change BOBS so it stores the last X thousand headers in an on-disk ringbuffer and that will reduce the disk size of the mobile apps significantly
 883 2011-09-05 19:47:11 <Dispositions> gavinandresen: of course.
 884 2011-09-05 19:47:17 peck has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
 885 2011-09-05 19:47:19 <iddo> TD: yes, i see, i just meant that in practice even his 4 megabytes per year extreme scenario can be improved, by trimming the chain headers with checkpoints
 886 2011-09-05 19:47:25 Asphodelia has joined
 887 2011-09-05 19:47:36 <gavinandresen> Dispositions: thanks, otherwise it'll drop right out of my brain
 888 2011-09-05 19:48:51 <TD> iddo: yes, exactly. i think we'll get it to where the lightweight clients can use <1mb of storage.
 889 2011-09-05 19:49:10 <TD> iddo: it's a bit fiddly to implement, but we can do it and still get the benefits of independent clients that connect directly to the p2p network
 890 2011-09-05 19:49:14 <TD> no third party services or proxies required
 891 2011-09-05 19:49:35 <TD> iddo: it's only really an issue for mobile clients. apps like MultiBit don't care about disk space as they run on desktops/laptops
 892 2011-09-05 19:50:01 <Asphodelia> kjj: http://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=203.msg3669#msg3669 ?
 893 2011-09-05 19:50:23 <iddo> cool
 894 2011-09-05 19:50:47 <TD> gavinandresen: shouldn't the CHECKSIGs in forms (1) and (2) be CHECKSIGVERIFY?
 895 2011-09-05 19:51:05 <gavinandresen> TD: probably....
 896 2011-09-05 19:51:06 * TD isn't sure why the last one isn't a VERIFY
 897 2011-09-05 19:51:25 <gavinandresen> wait, no.  It's gotta leave a true value on the stack
 898 2011-09-05 19:51:50 <xelister> TD: still searching. want to bet 5 BTC was it (also) google? if yes then -> #bitcoin or pm me :)
 899 2011-09-05 19:52:35 <Dispositions> gavinandresen: when you get a chance, I sent you rather lengthy email :/
 900 2011-09-05 19:52:35 peck has joined
 901 2011-09-05 19:52:59 <TD> gavinandresen: oh yes. i think you're right.
 902 2011-09-05 19:53:06 <TD> not intuitive.
 903 2011-09-05 19:54:05 <TD> gavinandresen: i still like the CHECKMULTISIG form, even if it's got its problems. but this does seem more flexible i agree
 904 2011-09-05 19:54:48 agath has quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
 905 2011-09-05 19:55:58 QueryTom3000 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
 906 2011-09-05 20:01:30 radiantdormohfr has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 907 2011-09-05 20:02:00 <TD> xelister: http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/industry_sectors/media/article728898.ece
 908 2011-09-05 20:02:32 Incitatus has quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
 909 2011-09-05 20:02:42 <xelister> TD: yeap I found that one ofcourse. Quite sure some of the other 70+ arrested where in relation to google.
 910 2011-09-05 20:03:02 <TD> i have no idea. but there's a reason we got out of china ....
 911 2011-09-05 20:03:25 <TD> besides, unfortunately governments are all at it. see the patriot act :(
 912 2011-09-05 20:04:05 <xelister> can chinese disidents, certain-countries black people or gay people etc use Google+?  Because giving real name == prison/death
 913 2011-09-05 20:05:37 <ashrewdmint> Not sure if this is a good place for support, but I can't seem to get bitcoind to work with the default port: https://gist.github.com/737068dae555b8b01553
 914 2011-09-05 20:05:39 <Diablo-D3> I swear I put xelister on ignore
 915 2011-09-05 20:05:47 * Diablo-D3 fixes the problem.
 916 2011-09-05 20:05:50 <ashrewdmint> Nothing else is listening on :8333 that I can tell
 917 2011-09-05 20:05:56 alexwaters has joined
 918 2011-09-05 20:06:08 <ashrewdmint> It's on a brand new Ubuntu VM
 919 2011-09-05 20:06:18 alexwaters has quit (Client Quit)
 920 2011-09-05 20:06:49 <xelister> Diablo-D3: oh you =)
 921 2011-09-05 20:06:51 alexwaters has joined
 922 2011-09-05 20:07:19 <alexwaters> does anyone know who controls the bitcoin.org email accounts?
 923 2011-09-05 20:08:47 <Dispositions> ashrewdmint: netstat it?
 924 2011-09-05 20:08:53 <Dispositions> it's running n etc
 925 2011-09-05 20:08:54 <Dispositions> ?
 926 2011-09-05 20:09:03 osmosis_ has joined
 927 2011-09-05 20:10:48 Asphodelia has left ()
 928 2011-09-05 20:12:09 euphemvfz has joined
 929 2011-09-05 20:14:37 <ashrewdmint> Dispositions: I can't find it. When it complains about not being able to connect to 8333, nothing shows up in ps aux
 930 2011-09-05 20:14:42 <ashrewdmint> (nothing bitcoin related)
 931 2011-09-05 20:15:10 <ashrewdmint> netstat it | grep bitcoin doesn't return anything
 932 2011-09-05 20:15:45 kabo69 has quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
 933 2011-09-05 20:16:18 kabo69 has joined
 934 2011-09-05 20:16:30 TheAncientGoat has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
 935 2011-09-05 20:16:37 <Dispositions> ashrewdmint: you sure it's running, bitcoind I mean
 936 2011-09-05 20:17:02 <ashrewdmint> Well, when the port is set to 8333, it refuses to start (see gist above)
 937 2011-09-05 20:17:13 <ashrewdmint> But at that time bitcoind is not running, not that I can tell
 938 2011-09-05 20:17:32 <ashrewdmint> If I set the port to something else it seems to start
 939 2011-09-05 20:17:43 <ashrewdmint> $ bitcoind -port=8991
 940 2011-09-05 20:17:52 <Dispositions> huh.
 941 2011-09-05 20:17:56 <Dispositions> that's weird :3
 942 2011-09-05 20:18:02 <Dispositions> check if you can connect to 8991 first
 943 2011-09-05 20:18:38 <ashrewdmint> Is there a simple way to do that? I only know a bit of unix
 944 2011-09-05 20:19:30 TheAncientGoat has joined
 945 2011-09-05 20:20:22 <Dispositions> send some json-rpc call to it.
 946 2011-09-05 20:22:36 <ashrewdmint> Ah, have been trying that earlier--I either get a timeout error or a connection refused error. I'll have to keep digging. Thanks.
 947 2011-09-05 20:22:47 <ashrewdmint> I think there's something wrong with my networking
 948 2011-09-05 20:23:43 <Dispositions> huh, even locally?
 949 2011-09-05 20:23:47 <Dispositions> via localhost
 950 2011-09-05 20:23:50 osmosis has quit (Quit: Leaving)
 951 2011-09-05 20:24:28 osmosis_ is now known as osmosis
 952 2011-09-05 20:24:59 <ashrewdmint> Dispositions: I guess I could enter in jsonrpc commands in the terminal, right?
 953 2011-09-05 20:25:07 <Dispositions> ashrewdmint: run ./bitcoind help to see if bitcoind is EVEN up
 954 2011-09-05 20:25:07 <Dispositions> yeah
 955 2011-09-05 20:25:27 <Dispositions> then you can download any one of these examples here and just try it
 956 2011-09-05 20:25:27 <Dispositions> https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/API_reference_(JSON-RPC)
 957 2011-09-05 20:25:29 <Dispositions> remotely
 958 2011-09-05 20:25:45 <ashrewdmint> When I run ./bitcoind, it hangs the terminal, and I can ^C to quit the process
 959 2011-09-05 20:25:48 <ashrewdmint> Is that supposed to happen?
 960 2011-09-05 20:25:55 <ashrewdmint> (It gives no output)
 961 2011-09-05 20:26:38 p0s has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 962 2011-09-05 20:28:36 <Dispositions> ashrewdmint: your bitcoin.conf is all peachy? go pastebin it or something, remove your pw before hand of course.
 963 2011-09-05 20:28:55 <ashrewdmint> Dispositions: I got my conf from the wiki. I will paste it
 964 2011-09-05 20:29:08 <ashrewdmint> Perhaps bad char encoding
 965 2011-09-05 20:29:18 zamgo has left ()
 966 2011-09-05 20:29:21 <Dispositions> i don't remember what ./bitcoind is suppose to show
 967 2011-09-05 20:29:31 <Dispositions> but if you call "./bitcoind help"
 968 2011-09-05 20:29:37 <Dispositions> you should get the help text
 969 2011-09-05 20:29:46 Ramokk has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
 970 2011-09-05 20:30:00 huk has joined
 971 2011-09-05 20:30:30 <tcatm> ashrewdmint: use -daemon
 972 2011-09-05 20:31:29 <ashrewdmint> https://gist.github.com/76a69491dfe4ac0806b1
 973 2011-09-05 20:31:46 <ashrewdmint> tcatm: I thought bitcoind was automatically a daemon, but that makes sense (what you said)
 974 2011-09-05 20:32:25 wardearia has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
 975 2011-09-05 20:33:02 hrngfd has left ("PART #bitcoin-discussion :PART #bitcoin :QUIT :Leaving.")
 976 2011-09-05 20:33:26 hrngfd has joined
 977 2011-09-05 20:33:49 hrngfd has quit (Client Quit)
 978 2011-09-05 20:34:42 sha256trust has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 979 2011-09-05 20:35:03 sha256trust has joined
 980 2011-09-05 20:39:28 boonies4u has joined
 981 2011-09-05 20:39:33 <boonies4u> i need help
 982 2011-09-05 20:39:38 <boonies4u> I think my client is broken
 983 2011-09-05 20:40:58 <tcatm> what's wrong with it?
 984 2011-09-05 20:42:48 <boonies4u> everytime i fill in the required transaction
 985 2011-09-05 20:43:02 <boonies4u> it tells me i need a larger transaction fee
 986 2011-09-05 20:43:07 <boonies4u> required transaction fee*
 987 2011-09-05 20:45:21 AStove has quit ()
 988 2011-09-05 20:48:32 tower has quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
 989 2011-09-05 20:49:12 Joric has joined
 990 2011-09-05 20:49:22 wardearia has joined
 991 2011-09-05 20:49:49 imsaguy has joined
 992 2011-09-05 20:49:49 imsaguy has quit (Changing host)
 993 2011-09-05 20:49:49 imsaguy has joined
 994 2011-09-05 20:53:03 tower has joined
 995 2011-09-05 20:53:52 <Joric> that solidcoin thing is adorable
 996 2011-09-05 20:54:02 <boonies4u> meh
 997 2011-09-05 20:54:18 <boonies4u> Does anybody know why my client won't agree to a fee I need to set?
 998 2011-09-05 20:56:55 <tcatm> boonies4u: how old are your coins (# of confirmations)?
 999 2011-09-05 20:57:11 <boonies4u> the bulk is 40
1000 2011-09-05 21:01:50 Tamo has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1001 2011-09-05 21:02:55 <boonies4u> <<
1002 2011-09-05 21:03:57 TheAncientGoat has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
1003 2011-09-05 21:04:15 c00w has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
1004 2011-09-05 21:04:39 <boonies4u> tcatm: the problem isn't so much the increased fee
1005 2011-09-05 21:04:45 <boonies4u> but, everytime i try to fufill on fee
1006 2011-09-05 21:04:50 <boonies4u> it says i need to pay a bigger one
1007 2011-09-05 21:06:27 <ThomasV_> that's funny ; are you sure it is bitcoin, not solidcoin ?
1008 2011-09-05 21:07:16 <cacheson> boonies4u: are you trying to send your whole balance?  it should just tell you what fee you have to pay, and then you accept or cancel
1009 2011-09-05 21:07:35 <boonies4u> i'm trying to empty my wallet
1010 2011-09-05 21:07:41 <boonies4u> 10.0643 bitcoins
1011 2011-09-05 21:07:59 <boonies4u> 10 btc I received 41 confirms ago
1012 2011-09-05 21:08:35 <cacheson> hm, not sure why the fee required would go up when you try to send less coins
1013 2011-09-05 21:08:45 Joric has quit ()
1014 2011-09-05 21:08:52 <cacheson> maybe it's because the average priority drops, or something?  I don't know exactly how that calculation works
1015 2011-09-05 21:09:02 <cacheson> but I'm pretty sure it tries to spend smaller amounts first
1016 2011-09-05 21:09:12 <boonies4u> basically, when i try to send with the default .0005 fee
1017 2011-09-05 21:09:28 <boonies4u> it gives my an error saying that i need to set it to .0015
1018 2011-09-05 21:09:44 <boonies4u> i then change my fee to .0015 and adjust the sent amount accordingly
1019 2011-09-05 21:09:49 <boonies4u> and it says i need .0045
1020 2011-09-05 21:09:53 <cacheson> boonies4u: ah, there's your problem
1021 2011-09-05 21:10:04 <boonies4u> cacheson: yeah...
1022 2011-09-05 21:10:07 <boonies4u> how do i fix it?
1023 2011-09-05 21:10:15 <cacheson> boonies4u: leave it at 0.0005, it's a fee per kb, not per transaction
1024 2011-09-05 21:10:26 <cacheson> when you increase that, you're telling the client to pay more per kb
1025 2011-09-05 21:10:33 <boonies4u> oh...
1026 2011-09-05 21:10:58 <cacheson> so put it back to .0005, and try to send your balance minus .0015
1027 2011-09-05 21:11:02 <boonies4u> i always thought the fee i set
1028 2011-09-05 21:11:05 <boonies4u> was fee per txn
1029 2011-09-05 21:11:09 <cacheson> nope
1030 2011-09-05 21:11:32 <cacheson> might be worded confusingly in the gui
1031 2011-09-05 21:11:55 Daniel0108 has quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
1032 2011-09-05 21:12:01 euphemvfz has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1033 2011-09-05 21:12:47 <Blitzboom> we have a new bitcoin.org design?
1034 2011-09-05 21:13:40 <boonies4u> yeah, don't know when this was implemented though
1035 2011-09-05 21:14:01 <cacheson> Blitzboom: oo, fancy
1036 2011-09-05 21:14:06 <TD> nice!
1037 2011-09-05 21:14:11 <TD> tcatm: is that your work?
1038 2011-09-05 21:14:22 <tcatm> TD: yes
1039 2011-09-05 21:14:25 <Blitzboom> the menu vanishes when i click on a menu item
1040 2011-09-05 21:14:30 <Blitzboom> hehe, i knew this was tcatm
1041 2011-09-05 21:14:35 <TD> tcatm: really nice. are you going to build a team or are you doing it solo?
1042 2011-09-05 21:14:38 <tcatm> Blitzboom: chrome?
1043 2011-09-05 21:14:40 <boonies4u> cacheson: so how do i calculate how much KBs a txn is?
1044 2011-09-05 21:14:41 <Blitzboom> using chrome
1045 2011-09-05 21:14:43 <Blitzboom> yes
1046 2011-09-05 21:15:05 <tcatm> TD: we're using github pages: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin.github.com
1047 2011-09-05 21:15:16 <cacheson> boonies4u: I don't think you can calculate it in advance with the existing UI
1048 2011-09-05 21:15:17 <Blitzboom> what are you doing?
1049 2011-09-05 21:15:23 <Blitzboom> revamp?
1050 2011-09-05 21:15:31 <boonies4u> cacheson: can i calculate it
1051 2011-09-05 21:15:37 <boonies4u> with my ti?
1052 2011-09-05 21:15:39 <boonies4u> XD
1053 2011-09-05 21:15:51 acecake has quit (Quit: Page closed)
1054 2011-09-05 21:16:15 <cacheson> boonies4u: I mean, maybe you could go through all the transactions you've received on block explorer and add them up
1055 2011-09-05 21:16:34 <boonies4u> and reverse engineer a formula?
1056 2011-09-05 21:16:55 <cacheson> well, no
1057 2011-09-05 21:17:19 <boonies4u> hmmd
1058 2011-09-05 21:17:40 <boonies4u> if an address were to have more activity
1059 2011-09-05 21:17:47 <boonies4u> would it take more KBs to send from?
1060 2011-09-05 21:17:52 <cacheson> I mean, it's not that there isn't any logic to it, it's just complicated, not something that's going to break down into a nice equation
1061 2011-09-05 21:17:59 <boonies4u> oh
1062 2011-09-05 21:18:00 <boonies4u> :/
1063 2011-09-05 21:18:05 <boonies4u> it's not just the balance?
1064 2011-09-05 21:18:09 <boonies4u> per address
1065 2011-09-05 21:18:11 <cacheson> boonies4u: nope
1066 2011-09-05 21:18:26 <boonies4u> well, hopefully this won't be a problem anymore
1067 2011-09-05 21:18:32 <boonies4u> since i know the error shows me total
1068 2011-09-05 21:18:35 <boonies4u> and not per KB
1069 2011-09-05 21:18:40 <cacheson> boonies4u: transactions that draw coins from more sources are larger.  I think there's other stuff that can inflate transaction size too?
1070 2011-09-05 21:19:34 <cacheson> so if you've received lots of small amounts, when you go to spend them the resulting transaction will be larger
1071 2011-09-05 21:19:44 <boonies4u> well, i've been using dailybitcoins.org
1072 2011-09-05 21:19:53 <boonies4u> but i've been receiving to one address
1073 2011-09-05 21:20:09 <cacheson> whereas if you received a single payment of several thousand BTC, sending those would be a very small transaction
1074 2011-09-05 21:20:40 <boonies4u> hmm
1075 2011-09-05 21:20:59 Baksch has joined
1076 2011-09-05 21:22:00 theymos has joined
1077 2011-09-05 21:22:40 transmissvba has joined
1078 2011-09-05 21:24:18 Incitatus has joined
1079 2011-09-05 21:25:35 dedeibel has quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
1080 2011-09-05 21:26:39 <boonies4u> cacheson: http://blockexplorer.com/address/16R8XiGKbs5Zcc31NdSYJ2mPPPerrPXVEZ
1081 2011-09-05 21:26:59 <boonies4u> yeah, i received a bunch of little payments to that address
1082 2011-09-05 21:27:13 <boonies4u> 15Xc
1083 2011-09-05 21:27:18 * cacheson nods
1084 2011-09-05 21:27:37 minimoose has joined
1085 2011-09-05 21:27:42 <boonies4u> luckily, i received .0005 btc at the very least
1086 2011-09-05 21:27:44 <boonies4u> from each of those
1087 2011-09-05 21:30:50 luke-jr has quit (otg!~luke-jr@2001:470:5:265:222:4dff:fe50:4c49|Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net)
1088 2011-09-05 21:31:20 luke-jr_ has joined
1089 2011-09-05 21:31:22 Titeuf_87 has quit (Quit: Ex-Chat)
1090 2011-09-05 21:31:29 luke-jr has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
1091 2011-09-05 21:31:37 luke-jr has joined
1092 2011-09-05 21:33:35 brunner has joined
1093 2011-09-05 21:35:37 <cjdelisle> hey C people, gotta question
1094 2011-09-05 21:36:18 <cjdelisle> arrayOfSomeStruct[x]->srrsyOfOtherStruct[y].value
1095 2011-09-05 21:36:24 <cjdelisle> one memory lookup or 2?
1096 2011-09-05 21:42:37 denisx has joined
1097 2011-09-05 21:43:33 <cjdelisle> erm no that would definitely be 2
1098 2011-09-05 21:43:47 <cjdelisle> arrayOfSomeStruct[x].arrayOfOtherStruct[y].value
1099 2011-09-05 21:43:53 <cjdelisle> that's what I was wondering about
1100 2011-09-05 21:47:15 <boonies4u> cacheson: i think i'm gonna start pointing my collections to an ewallet
1101 2011-09-05 21:47:17 <boonies4u> <<
1102 2011-09-05 21:48:20 peck has quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
1103 2011-09-05 21:48:48 larsivi has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
1104 2011-09-05 21:50:09 transmissvba has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1105 2011-09-05 21:51:08 moop has quit (Quit: Leaving)
1106 2011-09-05 21:51:27 k9quaint has quit (Quit: Leaving)
1107 2011-09-05 21:52:06 erle- has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1108 2011-09-05 21:54:35 ThomasV_ has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
1109 2011-09-05 21:56:03 peck has joined
1110 2011-09-05 21:56:51 ThomasV_ has joined
1111 2011-09-05 22:00:34 oriengny has joined
1112 2011-09-05 22:02:54 <phantomcircuit> cjdelisle, 3
1113 2011-09-05 22:03:14 <iddo> cjdelisle: if the y array is malloc'd pointer field then it has to be 2 lookups, but if the field is an array then the optimizer could make it 1 lookup? though i don't know
1114 2011-09-05 22:03:23 <phantomcircuit> cjdelisle, although possibly only 1 instruction
1115 2011-09-05 22:03:34 <iddo> why 3 ?
1116 2011-09-05 22:04:02 <phantomcircuit> vtable lookup if there is one
1117 2011-09-05 22:05:27 <iddo> isn't that c++ ?
1118 2011-09-05 22:05:41 <cjdelisle> no, it's a structure which contains an array of structures
1119 2011-09-05 22:05:47 <cjdelisle> so it should be possible in 1 lookup
1120 2011-09-05 22:06:52 <iddo> if it's array and not pointers then i guess it could be optimized to 1 lookup, though i don't know what C is actually doing, wait for someone else to answer:)
1121 2011-09-05 22:07:40 <diki> question
1122 2011-09-05 22:07:42 <diki> what is tor?
1123 2011-09-05 22:07:51 erle- has joined
1124 2011-09-05 22:08:01 <theymos> Anonymity network.
1125 2011-09-05 22:08:17 <diki> so it is a proxy?
1126 2011-09-05 22:08:19 <phantomcircuit> cjdelisle, if it's actually c++ than struct/class are actually identical except the default protection level
1127 2011-09-05 22:08:28 <theymos> diki: You can use it like a proxy.
1128 2011-09-05 22:08:36 <diki> ...but?
1129 2011-09-05 22:08:50 <copumpkin> nothing
1130 2011-09-05 22:08:55 <cjdelisle> Naw, it's pure C99, I was just curious about how smart GCC really was. I guess the only way to know for sure is to look at the asm.
1131 2011-09-05 22:08:57 <copumpkin> it's an anonymizing proxy
1132 2011-09-05 22:09:07 <copumpkin> it doesn't provide you confidentiality though
1133 2011-09-05 22:09:13 <copumpkin> so you'll still want to encrypt over it
1134 2011-09-05 22:09:42 <phantomcircuit> cjdelisle, that should be 1 instruction, but it will be at least 2 actual memory lookups
1135 2011-09-05 22:10:26 <upb> it cannot be 1 instruction
1136 2011-09-05 22:10:30 <diki> copumpkin:and how do i encrypt over it?
1137 2011-09-05 22:10:45 <orkaa> diki: traffic is only encrypted at the inner nodes
1138 2011-09-05 22:10:46 <phantomcircuit> upb, there are x86 instructions which do an indirect lookup
1139 2011-09-05 22:10:51 <copumpkin> diki: just use https or whatever
1140 2011-09-05 22:10:56 <cjdelisle> Well it would have to lookup the pointer off the stack but that's kind of a given.
1141 2011-09-05 22:10:56 <orkaa> diki: when it exits at the last node
1142 2011-09-05 22:11:01 boonies4u has left ()
1143 2011-09-05 22:11:02 <upb> phantomcircuit: how do you read values from 2 memory locations (x and y) and add them to a third in one instruction ?
1144 2011-09-05 22:11:04 <phantomcircuit> upb, you give one memory location and it will load the value at that pointer
1145 2011-09-05 22:11:07 <orkaa> the node admin might see your traffic
1146 2011-09-05 22:11:14 <diki> orkaa:sorry i dont get what you are talking about
1147 2011-09-05 22:11:18 <orkaa> if it's not encrypted
1148 2011-09-05 22:11:22 <iddo> cjdelisle: i'm also not sure why your first and second examples would be different, if it's arrays then the optimizer can calc the memory location and do single lookup, in both of your examples, no?
1149 2011-09-05 22:11:27 <orkaa> diki: about the tor network
1150 2011-09-05 22:11:52 <cjdelisle> iddo: the first example SomeStruct points to an array which is elsewhere, that's not what I have.
1151 2011-09-05 22:11:52 <orkaa> it it made of thousand of 'proxy' computers
1152 2011-09-05 22:11:53 <upb> also it involves 2 multilies
1153 2011-09-05 22:11:58 <upb> multiplies
1154 2011-09-05 22:12:08 <upb> so no way its 1 instruction
1155 2011-09-05 22:12:26 <copumpkin> just compile it and see what it generates for you :P
1156 2011-09-05 22:12:29 <phantomcircuit> upb, multilies addS?
1157 2011-09-05 22:12:32 <phantomcircuit> im just talking about
1158 2011-09-05 22:12:33 <diki> orkaa:so basically
1159 2011-09-05 22:12:37 theymos has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1160 2011-09-05 22:12:41 <phantomcircuit>  arrayOfSomeStruct[x]->srrsyOfOtherStruct[y].value
1161 2011-09-05 22:12:43 <diki> i am using someone else's IP while someone uses mine?
1162 2011-09-05 22:12:45 gavinandresen has quit (Quit: gavinandresen)
1163 2011-09-05 22:12:46 <upb> so am i
1164 2011-09-05 22:12:49 <phantomcircuit> im pretty sure that can be done in 1 instruction
1165 2011-09-05 22:12:58 <upb> then you have no idea what youre talking about :)
1166 2011-09-05 22:13:00 <orkaa> diki: you have to allow it
1167 2011-09-05 22:13:09 <orkaa> diki: i don't think it is enabled by default
1168 2011-09-05 22:13:15 <orkaa> but better check it :)
1169 2011-09-05 22:13:20 <cjdelisle> If x, y and the value of the somestruct pointer are in registers then I think it should be possible in 1 memory lookup
1170 2011-09-05 22:13:23 ThomasV_ has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
1171 2011-09-05 22:13:55 surikator has joined
1172 2011-09-05 22:13:57 <phantomcircuit> upb, im guessing you haven't looked at a recent x86 architecture manual
1173 2011-09-05 22:14:00 <cjdelisle> You're adding sizeof(SomeStruct) * x to sizeof(OtherStruct * y) to the pointer location of arrayOfSomeStruct and loading.
1174 2011-09-05 22:14:04 <upb> i have
1175 2011-09-05 22:14:14 <phantomcircuit> there is about 40 different mov instructions
1176 2011-09-05 22:14:20 <orkaa> diki: but if you're one of the inner nodes, you shouldn't care
1177 2011-09-05 22:14:27 <orkaa> all traffic is encrypted anyway
1178 2011-09-05 22:14:34 <cjdelisle> I meant: sizeof(OtherStruct) * y
1179 2011-09-05 22:15:31 <cjdelisle> And I don't really care if it's a few instructions or a lot, I care that it only requires one CAS operation on RAM.
1180 2011-09-05 22:15:35 <upb> you cant do *(&arrayOfSomeStruct + sizeof(SomeStruct*) * x) + sizeof(OtherStruct) * y
1181 2011-09-05 22:15:41 <upb> etc
1182 2011-09-05 22:16:00 <cjdelisle> why not?
1183 2011-09-05 22:16:33 <upb> with mov and lea what you can do is shifts of powers of two times a register
1184 2011-09-05 22:16:41 <upb> and a hardcoded offset
1185 2011-09-05 22:16:46 <upb> and another register
1186 2011-09-05 22:16:55 <upb> cant fit all that into one instruction
1187 2011-09-05 22:17:31 <cjdelisle> Again, I don't care how many *instructions* it takes, I care how many times a row in DRAM has to be opened for reading.
1188 2011-09-05 22:17:43 <upb> oh well i was responding to phantomcircuit :)
1189 2011-09-05 22:18:13 sytse has quit (Read error: No route to host)
1190 2011-09-05 22:18:17 sytse has joined
1191 2011-09-05 22:18:32 <phantomcircuit> cjdelisle, assuming neither x nor y is constant then at least 2 maybe 3 if the cachelines dont work out right
1192 2011-09-05 22:19:30 <cjdelisle> The way I designed my structures: *(((char*) &arrayOfSomeStruct) + sizeof(SomeStruct) * x + sizeof(OtherStruct) * y) would work.
1193 2011-09-05 22:20:10 <cjdelisle> AKA the array of OtherStruct is inside of SomeStruct, it's not a pointer.
1194 2011-09-05 22:20:26 nwtspv has joined
1195 2011-09-05 22:20:56 <cjdelisle> and we can assume that the ArrayOfSomeStruct pointer, x, and y are all in registers when the call happens.
1196 2011-09-05 22:21:02 <cjdelisle> I can only see one lookup
1197 2011-09-05 22:21:52 <cjdelisle> (discointing the pagetable fun which noone can rteally predict)
1198 2011-09-05 22:23:37 mtrlt has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1199 2011-09-05 22:23:56 mtrlt has joined
1200 2011-09-05 22:25:31 tower has quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
1201 2011-09-05 22:29:31 obinine has joined
1202 2011-09-05 22:30:07 kakobrekla has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1203 2011-09-05 22:30:40 obinine has left ()
1204 2011-09-05 22:31:01 Asphodelia has joined
1205 2011-09-05 22:31:38 kakobrekla has joined
1206 2011-09-05 22:31:42 <phantomcircuit> upb, im not counting loading the address from stack btw
1207 2011-09-05 22:31:48 osmosis has quit (Quit: Leaving)
1208 2011-09-05 22:34:07 gjs278 has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1209 2011-09-05 22:34:46 <upb> sure even then you cant do it
1210 2011-09-05 22:35:11 Cokein has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
1211 2011-09-05 22:37:33 dvide has quit ()
1212 2011-09-05 22:39:23 phedny has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
1213 2011-09-05 22:40:25 zeiris is now known as amtal
1214 2011-09-05 22:40:59 Cokein has joined
1215 2011-09-05 22:41:06 Baksch has quit (Quit: Leaving)
1216 2011-09-05 22:41:37 <diki> orkaa:sorry i have no idea what an inner node is
1217 2011-09-05 22:43:28 <cjdelisle> Originally I was basicly wondering if it was as efficient as the horror I linked with addition where there's only one * (other than multiplication)
1218 2011-09-05 22:43:29 <orkaa> diki: this explains it - http://everythingexpress.files.wordpress.com/2010/02/fig1_tor_diagram_2312091.png
1219 2011-09-05 22:44:04 <cjdelisle> Now I'm kinda wondering why a single dereference would take 3 memory lookups, I guess I know less than I thought.
1220 2011-09-05 22:44:19 <orkaa> diki: inner = relay node
1221 2011-09-05 22:44:37 phedny has joined
1222 2011-09-05 22:45:18 <xelister> cjdelisle: you seem pretty low level as for java realted guy ;)
1223 2011-09-05 22:45:48 <cjdelisle> I'm working on C right now and I'm kind of obsessive compulsive about performance/correctness.
1224 2011-09-05 22:46:47 tower has joined
1225 2011-09-05 22:47:06 <xelister> C is good
1226 2011-09-05 22:47:13 <xelister> for loosing time on development =)
1227 2011-09-05 22:47:14 <xelister> use c++
1228 2011-09-05 22:49:29 <cjdelisle> the onyl thing about c++ that I would probably find usefull is try{ }catch
1229 2011-09-05 22:50:07 <copumpkin> just use haskell, both of you
1230 2011-09-05 22:50:33 <xelister> cjdelisle: ctor
1231 2011-09-05 22:51:17 <cjdelisle> Object orianted doesn't really save a lot of time
1232 2011-09-05 22:51:26 <xelister> cjdelisle:
1233 2011-09-05 22:51:27 <xelister> Resource Acquisition Is Initialization: a bad name for the idea of acquiring resources in constructors (generally) and having destructors make sure they're released. Failure to acquire any resources is signaled by throwing an exception. It's better referred to as Scope-Bound Resource Management. http://www.hackcraft.net/raii/
1234 2011-09-05 22:51:30 <cjdelisle> Garbage collection saves time
1235 2011-09-05 22:51:45 <xelister> cjdelisle: then you dont write programs complex enough
1236 2011-09-05 22:51:51 <xelister> and GC is not always optimal
1237 2011-09-05 22:52:01 <cjdelisle> Of course it's not
1238 2011-09-05 22:53:12 <cjdelisle> Ok so you're talking about constructors and destructors as good because you can destroy one object and it will destroy all of the objects in it's fields, correct?
1239 2011-09-05 22:53:23 <xelister> and raii rocks
1240 2011-09-05 22:53:28 <xelister> and operators overload help
1241 2011-09-05 22:53:32 <xelister> and many other things
1242 2011-09-05 22:53:38 <xelister> also real templates
1243 2011-09-05 22:53:56 <xelister> c++ has some downsides but overall it can be really nice
1244 2011-09-05 22:54:23 <xelister> perhaps you where using C++ like C
1245 2011-09-05 22:54:34 <copumpkin> cjdelisle: C++ isn't just about OO
1246 2011-09-05 22:54:34 <cjdelisle> Templates would be nice but slow compile time sucks
1247 2011-09-05 22:54:40 <xelister> then it's like if you would be dating a girl like a friend (no sex) you are missing out on so much :P
1248 2011-09-05 22:54:59 <xelister> cjdelisle: templates can have very good compilation time
1249 2011-09-05 22:55:21 <cjdelisle> re: raii, I wrote a library for that
1250 2011-09-05 22:55:28 <cjdelisle> memory allocator library
1251 2011-09-05 22:55:45 <cjdelisle> you can create "child allocators" and they will be freed when the parent is freed.
1252 2011-09-05 22:55:53 <copumpkin> just write CPS-style C++ and never worry about dellocating memory again
1253 2011-09-05 22:56:03 <copumpkin> CPS, I guess :P
1254 2011-09-05 22:56:34 <cjdelisle> in that case, I'm using C like C++ because I have a bunch of calls like:  allocator->malloc(sizeof(struct something), allocator);
1255 2011-09-05 22:57:17 erus` has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1256 2011-09-05 22:57:40 TD has quit (Quit: TD)
1257 2011-09-05 22:58:44 <cjdelisle> I'd love to learn one of the functional languages but for job prospects... c++ > *
1258 2011-09-05 22:58:52 <cjdelisle> or php
1259 2011-09-05 22:59:29 <xelister> cjdelisle: its not that
1260 2011-09-05 22:59:36 <xelister> cjdelisle: you have to remember to delte? or gc
1261 2011-09-05 22:59:48 <xelister> you can not auto execute code on end of logical block easly
1262 2011-09-05 23:00:49 Cory has quit ()
1263 2011-09-05 23:00:55 <cjdelisle> Naw, if I forget to free an allocator, when it's parent is freed, it goes.
1264 2011-09-05 23:05:42 <luke-jr_> in the past day, bitcoind is the largest growing process on my PC
1265 2011-09-05 23:05:52 <luke-jr_> grew by 141.5 MB
1266 2011-09-05 23:05:55 huk has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
1267 2011-09-05 23:06:27 huk has joined
1268 2011-09-05 23:07:11 <matth1a3> can anyone help with https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/489 or https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/494 please?
1269 2011-09-05 23:08:07 <phantomcircuit> luke-jr_, only?
1270 2011-09-05 23:08:09 <phantomcircuit> ;)
1271 2011-09-05 23:08:11 posterminal has joined
1272 2011-09-05 23:08:18 <posterminal> hi
1273 2011-09-05 23:08:40 <posterminal> anyone here interested in a bitcoin point-of-sale terminal that uses a smart-card?
1274 2011-09-05 23:08:45 ephcon has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1275 2011-09-05 23:09:01 <luke-jr_> posterminal: Wallet protocol
1276 2011-09-05 23:09:19 <luke-jr_> matth1a3: I submitted a bugfix for 489 a while ago
1277 2011-09-05 23:09:37 <posterminal> ya, the card stores teh wallet.dat file... card costs $1... reader costs $40
1278 2011-09-05 23:09:52 <nwtspv> anyone interested in ATMs?
1279 2011-09-05 23:10:18 <posterminal> ya, ATMs are cool... but what if you don't have a smartphone?
1280 2011-09-05 23:10:23 <luke-jr_> posterminal: that's fail
1281 2011-09-05 23:10:28 <posterminal> why?
1282 2011-09-05 23:10:40 <luke-jr_> posterminal: because it's a security hole-- the reader has unlimited access to your wallet
1283 2011-09-05 23:10:47 <posterminal> no it doesn't
1284 2011-09-05 23:10:58 <cjdelisle> lolz this again
1285 2011-09-05 23:10:58 <luke-jr_> posterminal: a sane POS would be a smart device that does its own wallet management
1286 2011-09-05 23:10:59 log0s has joined
1287 2011-09-05 23:11:18 <luke-jr_> posterminal: speaking the Wallet protocol to POS
1288 2011-09-05 23:11:19 forloop has joined
1289 2011-09-05 23:11:33 <luke-jr_> over some short-range wireless link
1290 2011-09-05 23:12:35 forloop has quit (Client Quit)
1291 2011-09-05 23:12:52 <posterminal> so you're worried about somebody making an evil card-reader mod that allows for wallet.dat skimming?
1292 2011-09-05 23:12:58 Cory has joined
1293 2011-09-05 23:13:09 Cory has quit (Changing host)
1294 2011-09-05 23:13:09 Cory has joined
1295 2011-09-05 23:13:17 <luke-jr_> matth1a3: http://luke.dashjr.org/programs/bitcoin/w/bitcoind/luke-jr.git/commitdiff/a687d4f574cb22ec969354dce3237558982e29d3
1296 2011-09-05 23:13:34 <luke-jr_> posterminal: it's basically guaranteed to happen if you do something that stupid
1297 2011-09-05 23:13:50 <CIA-92> bitcoin: Con Kolivas * ra1ba15fb5247 cgminer/ (Makefile.am adl.h): Fix pacakaging missing adl headers and build failure without adl sdk headers installed.
1298 2011-09-05 23:15:21 <posterminal> isn't that the case for debit cards also then?
1299 2011-09-05 23:15:35 <posterminal> get the 4 digit pin = fail
1300 2011-09-05 23:16:03 <luke-jr_> posterminal: sure, credit/debit cards are notoriously stupid
1301 2011-09-05 23:16:09 <luke-jr_> and get stolen all the time
1302 2011-09-05 23:16:18 <luke-jr_> difference is, there's a central authority to reverse it
1303 2011-09-05 23:16:26 iocor has quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
1304 2011-09-05 23:17:20 <posterminal> k so you're saying that any bitcoin POS efforts require a user input on the side of the card? (ie not at teh terminal)
1305 2011-09-05 23:17:37 <luke-jr_> yes
1306 2011-09-05 23:17:39 <posterminal> so smartphones... custom electronic cards with embedded keypads... etc
1307 2011-09-05 23:17:46 <luke-jr_> it can be as simple as a single butotn
1308 2011-09-05 23:17:46 <posterminal> any other way of doing it than a smartphone?
1309 2011-09-05 23:17:47 <luke-jr_> button*
1310 2011-09-05 23:17:51 <luke-jr_> sure
1311 2011-09-05 23:17:53 <posterminal> ok now we're talking
1312 2011-09-05 23:18:05 <posterminal> so something that looks like a debit card and has a keypad built in?
1313 2011-09-05 23:18:11 <luke-jr_> a simple device with a single button and few-digit display to tell you how much you're authorizing
1314 2011-09-05 23:18:32 <posterminal> anyone manufacture cards with built-in display that u know of?
1315 2011-09-05 23:18:48 <luke-jr_> also, it'd be better if it was more like a USB key, so you could sync it at your home PC
1316 2011-09-05 23:18:50 <luke-jr_> without additional hw
1317 2011-09-05 23:19:19 <luke-jr_> first google result: http://asia.cnet.com/crave/usb-flash-drive-with-lcd-display-62100408.htm
1318 2011-09-05 23:20:18 <posterminal> hmm also this: http://www.slashgear.com/mastercard-trialling-smart-credit-cards-with-display-keypads-1089351/
1319 2011-09-05 23:20:24 Xunie has joined
1320 2011-09-05 23:20:29 <luke-jr_> but more importantly, you need a CPU to do the bitcoin code
1321 2011-09-05 23:21:08 <posterminal> ya, usb would be nice i guess
1322 2011-09-05 23:21:19 <posterminal> although doens' tfit in a physical wallet like a card does
1323 2011-09-05 23:21:37 <luke-jr_> it could be made to
1324 2011-09-05 23:21:44 <posterminal> small CPU is OK... smart card has a CPU
1325 2011-09-05 23:21:46 <luke-jr_> Yubikey is fairly thin
1326 2011-09-05 23:22:05 <posterminal> no display
1327 2011-09-05 23:22:09 <luke-jr_> sure
1328 2011-09-05 23:22:12 <luke-jr_> but you could make one
1329 2011-09-05 23:22:17 <luke-jr_> just saying, that's USB
1330 2011-09-05 23:22:21 <luke-jr_> and it can fit decently
1331 2011-09-05 23:23:01 <posterminal> does it have to have a display?
1332 2011-09-05 23:23:01 forloop has joined
1333 2011-09-05 23:23:09 <posterminal> or is just a keypad OK/
1334 2011-09-05 23:24:55 <posterminal> any way to use hashes to send both the correct amount and the hashed version to the display... to prevent display from scamming?
1335 2011-09-05 23:26:51 k9quaint has joined
1336 2011-09-05 23:26:52 denisx has quit (Quit: denisx)
1337 2011-09-05 23:30:22 noagendamarket has joined
1338 2011-09-05 23:30:49 erle- has quit (Quit: CETERVM•AVTEM•CENSEO•CVTTENBERC•ESSE•DELENDVM)
1339 2011-09-05 23:30:49 oriengny has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1340 2011-09-05 23:31:20 <posterminal> k well thanks luke for your input... i'll look into smart cards with displays...
1341 2011-09-05 23:32:01 marf_away has quit (Quit: Nettalk6 - www.ntalk.de)
1342 2011-09-05 23:36:55 devon_hillard has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1343 2011-09-05 23:41:26 undeadslipcre has joined
1344 2011-09-05 23:48:04 denisx has joined
1345 2011-09-05 23:49:30 denisx_ has joined
1346 2011-09-05 23:49:31 denisx has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1347 2011-09-05 23:49:31 denisx_ is now known as denisx
1348 2011-09-05 23:52:10 <ashrewdmint> What are the possible "category" values for transaction responses (JSON/RPC interface)
1349 2011-09-05 23:52:32 <ashrewdmint> I see "category: receive", is there anything else besides maybe "send"?
1350 2011-09-05 23:53:47 <CIA-92> bitcoin: Con Kolivas * r16aff37c6629 cgminer/ (adl.c adl.h): Fix compilation errors on mingw32 to do with order of pulling in headers, curses.h and definition of bool.
1351 2011-09-05 23:53:50 <CIA-92> bitcoin: Con Kolivas * r8d096bd31779 cgminer/ccan/opt/opt.c: Include libgen.h in opt.c to fix win32 compilation warnings.
1352 2011-09-05 23:53:53 <CIA-92> bitcoin: Con Kolivas * rfd23532bdb42 cgminer/adl.c: Make adl attempt to compile only on win32 or linux since there is no support for it on onther platforms, and fix sleep() definition on win32.
1353 2011-09-05 23:54:05 <ashrewdmint> Run, it's the CIA!
1354 2011-09-05 23:54:43 posterminal has quit (Quit: Page closed)
1355 2011-09-05 23:58:39 <phantomcircuit> asherkin, send receive move are the only ones i can think of
1356 2011-09-05 23:59:44 Zarutian has quit (Remote host closed the connection)