1 2012-03-14 00:00:36 <pingdrive> i try though and i think your impression is worng
2 2012-03-14 00:01:34 <gmaxwell> It's not about being well informed or notâ it's about the attitude you take towards things you don't know.
3 2012-03-14 00:01:35 <[Prayer]> does anyone else here think c++ is just a fad and that eventually everyone will go back to straight c?
4 2012-03-14 00:02:12 <gmaxwell> C is not really a replacement for C++ (as much as I complain about C++).
5 2012-03-14 00:02:21 <luke-jr> [Prayer]: that happened a while ago
6 2012-03-14 00:02:46 * BlueMatt prefers to stay out of religious debates
7 2012-03-14 00:02:52 <gmaxwell> If you said "go to [D, Java, etc]" then sure, and lots of people have done that (well, at least the Java part).
8 2012-03-14 00:02:56 <Joric> linus torvalds is a fad
9 2012-03-14 00:03:00 <luke-jr> gmaxwell: any chance you'd be willing to audit that BIP 16 backport?
10 2012-03-14 00:03:05 <Diablo-D3> gmaxwell: dude
11 2012-03-14 00:03:07 <[Prayer]> I've resisted learning c++ for close to 20 years... only to come upon a project I'm very interested in that's using it :/
12 2012-03-14 00:03:07 <Diablo-D3> fuck all the Javas
13 2012-03-14 00:03:09 <Diablo-D3> C forever
14 2012-03-14 00:03:17 <Diablo-D3> and fuck C++
15 2012-03-14 00:03:21 <luke-jr> [Prayer]: there's more than one implementation fwiw
16 2012-03-14 00:03:22 <BlueMatt> [Prayer]: bitcoinj?
17 2012-03-14 00:03:26 <Diablo-D3> gmaxwell: I dont see what the fuck people see in that abortion of a language
18 2012-03-14 00:03:27 <Diablo-D3> seriously
19 2012-03-14 00:03:33 <luke-jr> [Prayer]: none C yet afaik tho
20 2012-03-14 00:03:33 <[Prayer]> java? seriously?
21 2012-03-14 00:03:41 <luke-jr> [Prayer]: if you implement it in C, that'd be cool
22 2012-03-14 00:03:43 <forsetifox> Great. Diablo is here now.
23 2012-03-14 00:03:45 <gmaxwell> [Prayer]: if you mean bitcoinâ bitcoin only uses a fairly small amount of C++. It's not too incomprehensible to someone with a solid C background.
24 2012-03-14 00:03:45 <BlueMatt> Diablo-D3: damn you switched fast
25 2012-03-14 00:03:48 <[Prayer]> hrrm... maybe visual basic 3.0 :)
26 2012-03-14 00:03:53 <Diablo-D3> bluematt: Ive coded C for 15 years!
27 2012-03-14 00:03:56 <luke-jr> gmaxwell: I disagree.
28 2012-03-14 00:03:58 <BlueMatt> now you hate java with a pasion?
29 2012-03-14 00:04:07 <Diablo-D3> I dont hate java as a language
30 2012-03-14 00:04:07 <luke-jr> [Prayer]: at least GAMBAS -.-
31 2012-03-14 00:04:14 <pingdrive> aight... there is truth in what you saying
32 2012-03-14 00:04:17 <Diablo-D3> I hate the java community with a pasion
33 2012-03-14 00:04:20 <[Prayer]> gmaxwell, it's comprehensible enough... but so far, I've had to relearn all about function overloading
34 2012-03-14 00:04:22 <Diablo-D3> seriously, fuck them
35 2012-03-14 00:04:26 <Diablo-D3> with a rocket powered chainsaw
36 2012-03-14 00:04:30 <[Prayer]> and there's some other stuff that's not clicking yet... but I'll get there
37 2012-03-14 00:04:39 <Joric> dive into python! http://dump.bitcheese.net/files/amefezo/dive-into-python.png
38 2012-03-14 00:04:46 <Diablo-D3> fuck python too
39 2012-03-14 00:04:47 <BlueMatt> Diablo-D3: Im interested to hear how you think such a thing would work...
40 2012-03-14 00:04:49 <luke-jr> ugh Python
41 2012-03-14 00:04:53 <[Prayer]> btw, what's with the mixed use of #ifndef and #if !defined() ?
42 2012-03-14 00:04:54 <Diablo-D3> bluematt: how what could work
43 2012-03-14 00:05:05 <BlueMatt> a rocket powered chainsaw?
44 2012-03-14 00:05:07 <luke-jr> [Prayer]: the former only works for a single macro
45 2012-03-14 00:05:12 <Diablo-D3> bluematt: just a sec
46 2012-03-14 00:05:22 <luke-jr> BlueMatt: you had to ask?
47 2012-03-14 00:05:35 <BlueMatt> probably a bad idea now that I think about it...
48 2012-03-14 00:05:39 <Diablo-D3> http://miotd.com/2011/05/10/miscellaneous-chainsaw-katana/
49 2012-03-14 00:05:42 <Diablo-D3> er wait, wrong thing
50 2012-03-14 00:05:42 <[Prayer]> luke, you make it too easy... but thanks :)
51 2012-03-14 00:05:44 * Diablo-D3 tries again
52 2012-03-14 00:06:18 <luke-jr> [Prayer]: cgminer is written in C, and needs a lot of cleanup too :p
53 2012-03-14 00:06:24 <Diablo-D3> http://miotd.com/2009/11/17/miscellaneous-holy-shit-a-rocket-chainsaw/
54 2012-03-14 00:06:25 <Diablo-D3> bam
55 2012-03-14 00:06:39 <BlueMatt> that didnt explain much...
56 2012-03-14 00:06:45 Samuel has quit (Quit: Page closed)
57 2012-03-14 00:07:00 roconnor has joined
58 2012-03-14 00:07:15 <[Prayer]> the last serious coding I did, was with javascript in an HTA, and that was like 5 years ago
59 2012-03-14 00:07:28 <[Prayer]> such a sad state my mind is in right now
60 2012-03-14 00:07:40 <BlueMatt> I dont think its grammatically correct to have "javascript" and "serious coding" in the same sentence
61 2012-03-14 00:07:52 <Diablo-D3> javascrupt can go fuck itself
62 2012-03-14 00:07:53 <[Prayer]> BlueMatt, my point exactly :)
63 2012-03-14 00:07:57 <Diablo-D3> bluematt: oh, you can
64 2012-03-14 00:08:03 <Diablo-D3> it just requires js5 that now has namespaces
65 2012-03-14 00:08:15 <Diablo-D3> or just use it in a non-browser context
66 2012-03-14 00:08:18 <Diablo-D3> the problem is
67 2012-03-14 00:08:23 <Diablo-D3> THE LANGUAGE IS FUCKING FAIL
68 2012-03-14 00:08:31 <Diablo-D3> IF I WANTED TO CODE LIKE THAT, I'D FUCKING USE SMALLTALK
69 2012-03-14 00:08:33 <Diablo-D3> OR LISP
70 2012-03-14 00:08:33 <[Prayer]> but, it was the right tool for that particular job at that particular time
71 2012-03-14 00:08:46 * sipa grabs some chips
72 2012-03-14 00:08:47 <Diablo-D3> I MEAN, FUCK, SOMEONE WROTE A LISP VARIANT THAT USES JSON INSTEAD OF S EXPRESSIONS
73 2012-03-14 00:08:51 <Diablo-D3> SHOVE THAT IN YOUR PIPE AND SMOKE IT
74 2012-03-14 00:09:12 <luke-jr> someone wrote a Python-to-Javascript compiler
75 2012-03-14 00:09:18 <forsetifox> Heh.
76 2012-03-14 00:09:20 <sipa> are there scripts for auto-kicking people that overuse capitals?
77 2012-03-14 00:09:25 <luke-jr> sipa: yes
78 2012-03-14 00:09:35 <sipa> too bad i'm no op here
79 2012-03-14 00:09:36 <Diablo-D3> SOMEONE WROTE AN _EVERYTHING_ TO JAVASCRIPT COMPILER
80 2012-03-14 00:09:37 <[Prayer]> sipa: I had one on an eggdrop bot like 15 years ago
81 2012-03-14 00:09:46 <Diablo-D3> ITS CALLED EMSCRIPTEN
82 2012-03-14 00:09:48 <luke-jr> I wrote a MOO-to-Perl compiler.
83 2012-03-14 00:09:54 <luke-jr> in Perl.
84 2012-03-14 00:09:55 <[Prayer]> does anyone use eggdrop anymore?
85 2012-03-14 00:10:00 <luke-jr> no.
86 2012-03-14 00:10:05 * Diablo-D3 DESTROYS WORLDS AND DROPS BOMBS LIKE A BOMB DROPPING MOTHERFUCKER
87 2012-03-14 00:10:07 <luke-jr> it's all Supybot now.
88 2012-03-14 00:10:51 <[Prayer]> I feel old
89 2012-03-14 00:11:05 <Diablo-D3> dude
90 2012-03-14 00:11:09 <Diablo-D3> I was once an oper on efnet
91 2012-03-14 00:11:10 <mod6> i've had many eggdrops.
92 2012-03-14 00:11:15 <Diablo-D3> I can out old you every day of the week
93 2012-03-14 00:11:24 <[Prayer]> does anyone use that 38 floppy disk distro of slackware anymore?
94 2012-03-14 00:11:36 <mod6> i remember it, if that counts :)
95 2012-03-14 00:11:41 <Diablo-D3> no, but I installed debian using the two floppy method
96 2012-03-14 00:11:46 <[Prayer]> Diablo-D3: there too... #FreeBSD for a few years
97 2012-03-14 00:11:58 <luke-jr> How do you patch KDE 2 on FreeBSD?
98 2012-03-14 00:12:06 <mod6> portupgrade?
99 2012-03-14 00:12:07 <luke-jr> oh wait, this isn't #anime
100 2012-03-14 00:12:13 <sipa> hmm, upgrade!
101 2012-03-14 00:12:15 <[Prayer]> dunno, I dun use KDE
102 2012-03-14 00:12:26 <luke-jr> meme fail
103 2012-03-14 00:12:32 <luke-jr> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/How_does_one_patch_KDE2_under_FreeBSD%3F
104 2012-03-14 00:12:54 <[Prayer]> heck, I hardly use X anymore.. when I do, it's whatever ubuntu is using
105 2012-03-14 00:13:02 <[Prayer]> gnome or some crap?
106 2012-03-14 00:13:33 <mod6> haha, i didn't realize that was a joke.
107 2012-03-14 00:14:52 <[Prayer]> 2004... that was in the middle of my decade long break from IRC
108 2012-03-14 00:15:18 <mod6> i was tired of irc by then too, haha.
109 2012-03-14 00:16:30 <mod6> although, i cant even think of the idea of say quitting this for facebook.
110 2012-03-14 00:16:36 <mod6> i'd rather stab myself in the face.
111 2012-03-14 00:17:00 Turingi has quit (Quit: Leaving)
112 2012-03-14 00:17:02 <[Prayer]> I have a facebook somewhere... think I logged into sometime last year
113 2012-03-14 00:17:05 <[Prayer]> or maybe the year before?
114 2012-03-14 00:17:53 <mod6> im so used to IRC now, that I'm actually surpised to see younger guys on here.
115 2012-03-14 00:18:00 <mod6> its pretty awesome really.
116 2012-03-14 00:18:25 <BlueMatt> hey, if a technology is useful and nothing has come around to seriously replace it, why not keep using it?
117 2012-03-14 00:18:41 * BlueMatt ponders if #bitcoin-dev was one big google hangout...
118 2012-03-14 00:19:01 <mod6> hah. good point.
119 2012-03-14 00:19:10 <mod6> and yeah, that would be insane.
120 2012-03-14 00:19:41 <sipa> mod6: how old are you then, if I may ask?
121 2012-03-14 00:19:54 <mod6> early 30s.
122 2012-03-14 00:20:06 <mod6> old enough to remember the turbo button.
123 2012-03-14 00:20:13 <sipa> haha
124 2012-03-14 00:20:35 <sipa> GWBASIC's LIST was unusable on turbo... too fast :)
125 2012-03-14 00:20:44 * gmaxwell old enough to remember the PCAT the turbo was needed for compatiblity with!
126 2012-03-14 00:20:49 <mod6> BLAZIN'
127 2012-03-14 00:21:31 <forsetifox> I remember building PC's in cardboard boxes. =3
128 2012-03-14 00:22:05 <gmaxwell> forsetifox: yea, it's called bitcoin mining
129 2012-03-14 00:22:08 <gmaxwell> ;)
130 2012-03-14 00:22:28 <BlueMatt> forsetifox: you remember? I did that like last week
131 2012-03-14 00:22:31 <forsetifox> Aren't those plastic boxes? =P
132 2012-03-14 00:22:54 <BlueMatt> pc cases are for the 1%, cardboard boxes ftw
133 2012-03-14 00:22:55 <[Prayer]> plastic melts
134 2012-03-14 00:23:14 <forsetifox> Logging into a BBS and bowing before the sysop because he could display millions of colors on his monitor. LOLz
135 2012-03-14 00:23:39 twmz_ has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
136 2012-03-14 00:23:41 <forsetifox> Stupid modem config strings.
137 2012-03-14 00:23:51 twmz_ has joined
138 2012-03-14 00:23:52 <mod6> Oh hEll FucK no!
139 2012-03-14 00:23:58 * mod6 remembers starman
140 2012-03-14 00:24:04 <forsetifox> Loom. =)
141 2012-03-14 00:24:05 pickett has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
142 2012-03-14 00:24:16 <forsetifox> My first optical disc game.
143 2012-03-14 00:24:17 <[Prayer]> what kind of hash rate would I get out of an AMD 486dx2/80?
144 2012-03-14 00:24:29 twmz_ has quit (Client Quit)
145 2012-03-14 00:24:37 twmz_ has joined
146 2012-03-14 00:24:38 <forsetifox> DX2. Heh.
147 2012-03-14 00:24:38 <mod6> omg. 0
148 2012-03-14 00:24:45 <forsetifox> Like .1 on litecoin?
149 2012-03-14 00:24:53 <mod6> after 2 years.
150 2012-03-14 00:24:59 <[Prayer]> good thing I didn't hang on to that one then :)
151 2012-03-14 00:25:10 <mod6> yeah, it was ok to let that one go :)
152 2012-03-14 00:25:26 * BlueMatt remembers his first computer...1.86 GHz Intel...
153 2012-03-14 00:25:38 <[Prayer]> wow, young'n
154 2012-03-14 00:25:43 <mod6> GHz!
155 2012-03-14 00:25:46 <BlueMatt> dont remember the damn processor though...I need to go look that up..
156 2012-03-14 00:25:47 <BlueMatt> .
157 2012-03-14 00:26:13 <BlueMatt> still boots too
158 2012-03-14 00:26:19 ubnutustudent has quit (Quit: Leaving)
159 2012-03-14 00:26:41 <[Prayer]> I have a few pentium 233mmx chips if anyone wants
160 2012-03-14 00:27:07 <[Prayer]> or was that 133?
161 2012-03-14 00:27:10 * [Prayer] forgets
162 2012-03-14 00:27:19 <forsetifox> Our first computer was a Epson. Top Gun, Thexder, Bards Tale.
163 2012-03-14 00:27:32 <forsetifox> All in CGA. Oh yeah.
164 2012-03-14 00:27:40 <[Prayer]> I played bards tale on apple IIc
165 2012-03-14 00:27:40 <mod6> ... I had this Packard Bell in 94 that was 100Mhz, 256Mb Ram& 1Gb HD.
166 2012-03-14 00:28:00 <luke-jr> that sounds rather uneven
167 2012-03-14 00:28:05 <luke-jr> 100 MHz was like 8 MB RAM days
168 2012-03-14 00:28:06 BitByBit has joined
169 2012-03-14 00:28:15 <mod6> yeah, that was probably right luke-jr
170 2012-03-14 00:28:21 <forsetifox> 1 GB HD. LOLz
171 2012-03-14 00:28:25 <[Prayer]> 256mb in 1994 would have been something like $20k
172 2012-03-14 00:28:25 <mod6> i coudn't even remember, i just remember 100Mhz & 1Gb.
173 2012-03-14 00:28:41 <BlueMatt> oh, no wait, I did have a computer before then win3.1 16mb ram, nfc what proccessor
174 2012-03-14 00:28:46 <[Prayer]> first BSD server had 32MB in 1995, that was like $2000
175 2012-03-14 00:28:51 <forsetifox> OS2 Warp!
176 2012-03-14 00:29:00 <luke-jr> ironically, modern OS really don't do much more than Win 3.11 did
177 2012-03-14 00:29:00 <[Prayer]> os2 makes me sad
178 2012-03-14 00:29:06 pickett has joined
179 2012-03-14 00:29:08 <luke-jr> yet require like 100 times the RAM
180 2012-03-14 00:29:11 <mod6> yeah. werd. i cant even remember now since 256Mb seems like nothing today.
181 2012-03-14 00:29:35 <mod6> christ, my phone has 8g. :)
182 2012-03-14 00:29:37 <luke-jr> mod6: and in 10 years, 256 GB will seem like nothing ;)
183 2012-03-14 00:30:00 <sipa> My first PC had 40 MB hard disk, 2 MiB RAM, and a 33MHz 80386 CPU.
184 2012-03-14 00:30:12 <mod6> yeah, no doubt. The next 10 years are going to be interesting :)
185 2012-03-14 00:30:12 * [Prayer] bows to sipa
186 2012-03-14 00:30:29 <[Prayer]> except my first computer was a TI99/4a
187 2012-03-14 00:30:35 <[Prayer]> with a 19" black and white tv
188 2012-03-14 00:31:02 <mod6> TI99 oh sure.
189 2012-03-14 00:31:02 <luke-jr> does Z80 count, or does it have to be 8086-family?
190 2012-03-14 00:31:13 <mod6> z80 for sure that counts.
191 2012-03-14 00:31:20 <[Prayer]> sinclair would count :)
192 2012-03-14 00:31:26 <mod6> processor type shouldnt matter. only that it had a processor.
193 2012-03-14 00:32:14 <luke-jr> I just bought a 250 GB PATA HD
194 2012-03-14 00:32:15 <[Prayer]> I remember wanting an apple so damned bad... and $2000 seemed like a steal compared to the $8k IBM wanted for the PC Jr.
195 2012-03-14 00:32:36 <[Prayer]> but, at age 14, both were otu of reach
196 2012-03-14 00:33:04 <mod6> yeah $2000 was nothing to sneeze at back in those days either.
197 2012-03-14 00:33:19 <BlueMatt> luke-jr: WHY???
198 2012-03-14 00:33:39 <luke-jr> BlueMatt: it's the exact same model as one that click-of-death'd on me a year ago
199 2012-03-14 00:33:42 <[Prayer]> 1984... coming out of a pretty serious recession... ya, $2k was huge money
200 2012-03-14 00:33:50 <luke-jr> BlueMatt: hoping to swap the PCB and recover old data
201 2012-03-14 00:33:54 <BlueMatt> luke-jr: what machine are you still running that uses pata
202 2012-03-14 00:33:58 <BlueMatt> oh
203 2012-03-14 00:34:02 <BlueMatt> well have fun with that one...
204 2012-03-14 00:34:03 <luke-jr> BlueMatt: none, I'll need to borrow one
205 2012-03-14 00:34:23 * [Prayer] has a p3 mb he could sell for a few btc
206 2012-03-14 00:34:30 <[Prayer]> dual pata :)
207 2012-03-14 00:34:39 * luke-jr has a quad-CPU P3 mb, but it doesn't have PATA
208 2012-03-14 00:34:47 <BlueMatt> does pcb swapping usually ever work, I was under the impression it usually had to be of a similar mfg run, not just model number?
209 2012-03-14 00:34:55 <[Prayer]> eh... get a usb adapter :)
210 2012-03-14 00:34:59 <luke-jr> BlueMatt: I mean the full model number ;)
211 2012-03-14 00:35:05 <BlueMatt> ahhh
212 2012-03-14 00:35:29 <luke-jr> WD2500BB-00DWA0
213 2012-03-14 00:35:34 <luke-jr> I put a watch on ebay a while back
214 2012-03-14 00:35:37 <luke-jr> it finally came up with one
215 2012-03-14 00:35:57 <luke-jr> cost me about $40
216 2012-03-14 00:36:29 <mod6> ahh the ole WD
217 2012-03-14 00:36:47 * luke-jr wouldn't buy WD again
218 2012-03-14 00:36:53 <mod6> remember maxtor? i got zhoutonged by maxtor many times.
219 2012-03-14 00:36:59 <luke-jr> I used to buy WD just for their longer warrantiesâ¦
220 2012-03-14 00:37:13 <luke-jr> but then when I finally had to use it, they claimed the drive was sold without one
221 2012-03-14 00:37:25 <mod6> heh, of course they did. :)
222 2012-03-14 00:37:41 <mod6> why does it always seem to work out that way?
223 2012-03-14 00:39:11 stochastic_ has left ("Leaving")
224 2012-03-14 00:39:20 * BlueMatt always bitches on newegg product pages when a mfg doesnt want to help, they get so careful about their reputation there...
225 2012-03-14 00:41:31 <mod6> Yeah, I'm sure they're pretty responsive to that.
226 2012-03-14 00:42:33 Zarutian has quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
227 2012-03-14 00:42:56 <mod6> if someone had an issue with my software/product and they didn't get help, so they complained on a public site -- I'd work 12x as hard to fix the problem.
228 2012-03-14 00:43:14 <word> I've rma'd a couple of hd's with WD, both bought from newegg, they both went fine. iirc they even will send you the new one right away as long as you provide a cc they can put a 'hold' on for the price while they wait for the old one
229 2012-03-14 00:43:15 <BlueMatt> esp on newegg, you know the enthusiast crowd takes their purchases very seriously
230 2012-03-14 00:43:24 <mod6> *nod*
231 2012-03-14 00:44:06 <word> this was a few years ago though, i think warranty policies recently changed on hard drives, was big news for a couple days
232 2012-03-14 00:44:46 <mod6> everyone keeps saying the sky is falling with storage since the asian floods have destroyed so much of the hardware.
233 2012-03-14 00:45:07 <Diablo-D3> thats old news mod6
234 2012-03-14 00:45:13 <Diablo-D3> two of the factories are back up and running
235 2012-03-14 00:45:17 <word> prices are still up though
236 2012-03-14 00:45:31 JRWR has quit (Quit: BTC Welcome: 19QtYzmENUmqRhvjEvHsz785rqZ5RRcZG4)
237 2012-03-14 00:45:50 <[Prayer]> mod6: disasters in asia are major
238 2012-03-14 00:45:51 <mod6> right. i knew that was at least, months ago. I'm not trying to spread any rumors by any means.
239 2012-03-14 00:46:03 <[Prayer]> took 54 weeks to get fiber that used to take 16-20 weeks
240 2012-03-14 00:46:20 <mod6> ahh.
241 2012-03-14 00:46:57 <[Prayer]> there is a serious impact on all things that have been commoditized and are mass-produced in asia
242 2012-03-14 00:47:53 <mod6> :/
243 2012-03-14 00:49:11 <etotheipi_> FYI, I use Newegg for *everything*... except HDDs
244 2012-03-14 00:49:30 <etotheipi_> you'd think they would know how to wrap a HDD for shipping
245 2012-03-14 00:49:40 <mod6> no bueno?
246 2012-03-14 00:49:41 <[Prayer]> I need to find a new hdd distributor that mixes their batches
247 2012-03-14 00:49:55 <etotheipi_> there's way too many reviews of people who got whole batches of dead drives because of poor packaging
248 2012-03-14 00:49:58 <[Prayer]> sites like newegg will gladly sell you 6 drives from the same damned batch
249 2012-03-14 00:49:59 <etotheipi_> and I"m one of them
250 2012-03-14 00:50:11 <mod6> :(
251 2012-03-14 00:50:28 <etotheipi_> I buy all HDDs from amazon... get everything else from Newegg (because they are awesome)
252 2012-03-14 00:50:29 <[Prayer]> set up a nice new array that fails 3 days after you get all your data transferred
253 2012-03-14 00:50:29 <mod6> do you have a spacific vendor for your storage ten?
254 2012-03-14 00:50:31 <mod6> *then
255 2012-03-14 00:50:32 <BlueMatt> [Prayer]: if you ever find one, Id love to know...
256 2012-03-14 00:50:36 <Diablo-D3> [Prayer]: dude
257 2012-03-14 00:50:38 <Diablo-D3> it aint batches
258 2012-03-14 00:50:42 <Diablo-D3> dont buy the same manuf
259 2012-03-14 00:50:46 <word> etotheipi_: my drive was DOA but i went for the retail box for that reason, so idk if it's packaging, maybe they handle things to roughly
260 2012-03-14 00:50:55 <Diablo-D3> I mix seagate samsung and hitachi drives frequently
261 2012-03-14 00:51:28 <BlueMatt> etotheipi_: usually I never think twice about where I get hdds from, wherever is the cheapest because they are just so damn commoditized...
262 2012-03-14 00:51:32 <[Prayer]> it's batches and oem, mixing both is great when new capacities first come out and production is still low
263 2012-03-14 00:51:39 <BlueMatt> for everything else, there's newegg
264 2012-03-14 00:52:02 <BlueMatt> (tm)
265 2012-03-14 00:52:12 <[Prayer]> WD was cool with me last time. I RMAd a bunch of green 2tb disks, and instead of reburbs, they sent me new sata3 drives
266 2012-03-14 00:52:29 <etotheipi_> newegg is awesome for customer service, I agree
267 2012-03-14 00:52:50 <etotheipi_> but I feel like I'm always going to be RMA'ing my HDDs from them, so why bother?
268 2012-03-14 00:53:10 roconnor has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
269 2012-03-14 00:53:15 <word> i had a problem with a raidmax case once, the fancy lil LEDs on the front of the case were borked, and didnt want to rma the whole thing since i got all my stuff in it already, so i emailed them and they sent a new string of LEDs that i could hot glue on myself.
270 2012-03-14 00:53:16 <etotheipi_> (I'm exaggerating a bit, but amazon seems to actually know how to wrap a HDD)
271 2012-03-14 00:53:22 <Diablo-D3> etotheipi_: nope
272 2012-03-14 00:53:30 <Diablo-D3> amazon frequently tries to use the fucking dvd boxes
273 2012-03-14 00:53:35 <Diablo-D3> with zero packing inside
274 2012-03-14 00:53:37 <Diablo-D3> fucking morons
275 2012-03-14 00:53:48 <Diablo-D3> newegg is one of the few companies Ill buy hds from
276 2012-03-14 00:53:49 <etotheipi_> last time I ordered and amazon HDD I was impressed
277 2012-03-14 00:54:01 <etotheipi_> haha... we'll we've had completely different experiences then
278 2012-03-14 00:54:15 <Diablo-D3> newegg buys white box drives, then double wraps them in bubble wrap
279 2012-03-14 00:54:46 <[Prayer]> just like diff people have diff experience with the mfgs... I didn't buy WD for close to 10 years
280 2012-03-14 00:54:59 <Diablo-D3> I still refuse to buy WD
281 2012-03-14 00:55:02 <Diablo-D3> drives are shit
282 2012-03-14 00:55:10 <[Prayer]> I was on IBM, then Seagate
283 2012-03-14 00:55:28 <[Prayer]> seagate pissed me off about 4 years ago, and I've been buying mostly WD since
284 2012-03-14 00:55:32 <Diablo-D3> hitachi gst = ibms old hd division
285 2012-03-14 00:55:45 <[Prayer]> but WD's failure rate on the 500GB platters are starting to get old
286 2012-03-14 00:56:11 <[Prayer]> I haven't used ibm/hitatchi for a while
287 2012-03-14 00:56:13 <Diablo-D3> sure its 500gb platters?
288 2012-03-14 00:56:26 <Diablo-D3> because WD doesnt make those anymore AND quad platter drives from any manuf of any patter size should always be avoided
289 2012-03-14 00:56:28 <[Prayer]> loved IBM for SCA though
290 2012-03-14 00:56:38 DBordello has joined
291 2012-03-14 00:56:44 <Diablo-D3> the only exception to that rule is samsung's 4 platter 3.5" 5400rpm drives
292 2012-03-14 00:57:00 <[Prayer]> it's been the 500's 1TB and 2TB... I actually can't recall the 2tb specs
293 2012-03-14 00:57:06 <forsetifox> Seagate drives run really hot. Not sure if it's all of them.
294 2012-03-14 00:57:15 <DBordello> etotheipi_, how does armory communicate with the local client? In my case, it doesn't. Is it attempting to connect on the local port, or does it need the path to the block chain?
295 2012-03-14 00:57:20 <Diablo-D3> forsetifox: its all of them
296 2012-03-14 00:57:32 <Diablo-D3> [Prayer]: 2TB = 4 platter
297 2012-03-14 00:57:35 <Diablo-D3> no wonder it failed
298 2012-03-14 00:57:55 da2ce7 has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
299 2012-03-14 00:58:57 splatster has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
300 2012-03-14 00:59:24 <[Prayer]> 's ok... just gonna take me that much longer to rebuild my library
301 2012-03-14 00:59:32 splatster has joined
302 2012-03-14 01:00:27 gjs278 has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
303 2012-03-14 01:01:02 <[Prayer]> speaking of libraries... I read something about Bram Cohen working on p2p content distribution... aka, world's largest tivo
304 2012-03-14 01:02:26 * sipa haz a non-bdb bitcoind wallet
305 2012-03-14 01:02:28 <sipa> HAH
306 2012-03-14 01:02:37 <BlueMatt> not like any major media companies will ever touch anything with a p2p mark stamped on it
307 2012-03-14 01:02:40 <BlueMatt> sipa: NICE!
308 2012-03-14 01:02:45 * BlueMatt wants codezzz
309 2012-03-14 01:03:27 <forsetifox> I heard Stewie's voice in my head when Sipa said "HAH".
310 2012-03-14 01:03:29 <sipa> BlueMatt: it's a binary logfile, append-only, with built-in checksums
311 2012-03-14 01:03:35 <[Prayer]> blue, if commercials are integrated into the player forcing people to watch or fast-forward, they wouldn't see it as being any worse than tivo
312 2012-03-14 01:03:39 <BlueMatt> nice
313 2012-03-14 01:03:50 gjs278 has joined
314 2012-03-14 01:03:53 <BlueMatt> [Prayer]: except for "p2p"
315 2012-03-14 01:03:58 <BlueMatt> (which they hate with a passion)
316 2012-03-14 01:04:12 mcorlett is now known as mcorlette
317 2012-03-14 01:04:13 <[Prayer]> blue, because they can't figure out how to make money on it
318 2012-03-14 01:04:20 DBordello has quit (Quit: Leaving)
319 2012-03-14 01:04:44 <[Prayer]> if the networks were to release their shows (with commercials) a day early as a torrent, they could have their cake and eat it too
320 2012-03-14 01:05:06 <[Prayer]> there would be very little reason for people to rip it and cut hte commercials. not many people care that much about their libraries
321 2012-03-14 01:05:28 plutonic has joined
322 2012-03-14 01:05:38 <[Prayer]> and the torrent it self will actually tell them how many people have grabbed it, and they can add those numbers straight into their ratings
323 2012-03-14 01:05:50 <BlueMatt> yes, but no matter how nice the tech is, anything that has p2p on it is repulsive to most content industries
324 2012-03-14 01:05:54 <BlueMatt> look at bittorrent flash streaming
325 2012-03-14 01:06:05 <BlueMatt> its just as secure as anything else and cuts down on bw by a shitton
326 2012-03-14 01:06:10 dwon has joined
327 2012-03-14 01:06:35 <BlueMatt> but most content industry wont touch it because its p2p
328 2012-03-14 01:06:51 <[Prayer]> yup... and if the media industry would have offered it first... they could have kept their advertising intact
329 2012-03-14 01:07:20 <BlueMatt> also, the content industries arent gonna do that kinda thing, they just wont shift that fast to "protect their existing revenue models"
330 2012-03-14 01:07:26 <BlueMatt> they even use that exact wording
331 2012-03-14 01:07:52 <[Prayer]> that's what I'm saying.. they have blinders on
332 2012-03-14 01:08:17 <BlueMatt> yea, thats my point, even if bram cohen makes something really awesome, they wont touch it
333 2012-03-14 01:09:51 <Diablo-D3> wait
334 2012-03-14 01:09:54 <Diablo-D3> that name sounds familiar
335 2012-03-14 01:10:00 <BlueMatt> he mad bittorrent
336 2012-03-14 01:10:03 <BlueMatt> e
337 2012-03-14 01:10:04 <Diablo-D3> oh that guy
338 2012-03-14 01:10:12 <BlueMatt> the autistic guy
339 2012-03-14 01:10:15 <Diablo-D3> hes cool in my book
340 2012-03-14 01:10:17 <[Prayer]> self-diagnosed
341 2012-03-14 01:10:24 <BlueMatt> really?
342 2012-03-14 01:10:28 <Diablo-D3> I dont think so
343 2012-03-14 01:10:29 <BlueMatt> didnt know that
344 2012-03-14 01:10:30 <[Prayer]> as I understand it
345 2012-03-14 01:10:35 <Diablo-D3> hes been getting help for years for it iirc
346 2012-03-14 01:10:53 <[Prayer]> oh... not autistic... aspergers
347 2012-03-14 01:10:54 <BlueMatt> anyway, hes pretty good, but he doesnt have a good track record with content industries...
348 2012-03-14 01:11:01 Eliel has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
349 2012-03-14 01:11:02 <Diablo-D3> [Prayer]: aspergers is a form of autism
350 2012-03-14 01:11:05 <[Prayer]> which most genius-level hackers probably border on
351 2012-03-14 01:11:13 <BlueMatt> yep
352 2012-03-14 01:11:15 <Diablo-D3> vs "autism autism" which is conners autism (pronounced kanners)
353 2012-03-14 01:11:45 <Diablo-D3> below DSM levels of aspergers is commonly called "geeks disease"
354 2012-03-14 01:12:06 <Diablo-D3> or what people like I call, "posers"
355 2012-03-14 01:12:20 <[Prayer]> I made the mistake of getting married 4 years ago... I have to settle for sudoku and other logic puzzles to get my peace
356 2012-03-14 01:12:31 <[Prayer]> no time for serious geekery anymore :(
357 2012-03-14 01:12:37 <BlueMatt> heh
358 2012-03-14 01:12:38 <Diablo-D3> you married the wrong chick
359 2012-03-14 01:12:43 <Diablo-D3> I will only marry a geek
360 2012-03-14 01:13:00 <Diablo-D3> I dont care how ugly or fat or american she is
361 2012-03-14 01:13:09 <BlueMatt> look at gmaxwell, I guess its not technically marriage, but she works for fucking wikipedia, so he gets to work on bitcoin all the time :)
362 2012-03-14 01:13:11 <[Prayer]> lolz
363 2012-03-14 01:13:37 <Diablo-D3> gmaxwell gets around
364 2012-03-14 01:13:43 <[Prayer]> I had a chance at a pretty cute geek, but she had some issues :/
365 2012-03-14 01:13:48 <Diablo-D3> he shacks up with monty from xiph to get that shit done
366 2012-03-14 01:13:51 <BlueMatt> (sorry if that wasnt public info, but he does use her nick on here...)
367 2012-03-14 01:14:09 <[Prayer]> how many devs do bitcoin full time?
368 2012-03-14 01:14:13 <sipa> BlueMatt: my 'logdb' branch
369 2012-03-14 01:14:14 <BlueMatt> 0
370 2012-03-14 01:14:25 <[Prayer]> how many would if the money were available?
371 2012-03-14 01:14:44 <BlueMatt> I dont know, if we hired outside probably quite a few
372 2012-03-14 01:14:45 <Diablo-D3> 0
373 2012-03-14 01:14:54 <Diablo-D3> bitcoin itself is basically finished
374 2012-03-14 01:14:55 <BlueMatt> otherwise, I think all you get is me over the summers...
375 2012-03-14 01:15:02 <BlueMatt> maybe gavin
376 2012-03-14 01:15:08 <Diablo-D3> 0.6 will probably jump to 0.9 and stay there about 10 years
377 2012-03-14 01:15:14 <BlueMatt> though he deserves to be paid for what he does now anyway...
378 2012-03-14 01:15:17 <[Prayer]> I can't believe it's finished... it's not usable yet
379 2012-03-14 01:15:24 <sipa> lol, finished
380 2012-03-14 01:15:25 <Diablo-D3> its very usable
381 2012-03-14 01:15:27 <[Prayer]> Dos wasn't finished until about windows 3
382 2012-03-14 01:15:29 <sipa> hardly
383 2012-03-14 01:15:29 <BlueMatt> finished? why are we still not at 1.0 then?
384 2012-03-14 01:15:35 <[Prayer]> even then, it stuck around for a few more generations
385 2012-03-14 01:15:40 <luke-jr> [Prayer]: FYI, Diablo-D3 is a troll. Just ignore him. :p
386 2012-03-14 01:15:50 <Diablo-D3> Im a troll and a major bitcoin contributor
387 2012-03-14 01:15:53 <[Prayer]> diablo: tel your grandmother it's usable :)
388 2012-03-14 01:16:03 <Diablo-D3> [Prayer]: sure, she'd probably agree
389 2012-03-14 01:16:16 <Diablo-D3> the problem isnt bitcoin, its all the associated software
390 2012-03-14 01:16:18 <[Prayer]> Diablo: then you come from a long line of geeks indeed
391 2012-03-14 01:16:18 <BlueMatt> you have a damn smart grandmother...
392 2012-03-14 01:16:19 <Diablo-D3> ie, its missing
393 2012-03-14 01:16:36 <Diablo-D3> bluematt: no, she hates computers and thinks Im wasting my time on this monopoly money generator
394 2012-03-14 01:16:38 <[Prayer]> diablo: experienced coders lost 2600 bitcoins last year
395 2012-03-14 01:16:45 <BlueMatt> well, ok bitcoin-proper is pretty well covered
396 2012-03-14 01:16:50 <Diablo-D3> [Prayer]: I know, that was hilarious
397 2012-03-14 01:16:54 <sipa> BlueMatt: there is no transactionality implemented yet, so if things go wrong, the wallet could end up in a weird state
398 2012-03-14 01:16:57 <BlueMatt> satoshi client...not so much...
399 2012-03-14 01:17:04 <Diablo-D3> sipa: thats because bdb sucks
400 2012-03-14 01:17:09 <BlueMatt> its not bdb
401 2012-03-14 01:17:09 <sipa> BlueMatt: and there is too little error handling, and no conversion
402 2012-03-14 01:17:16 <sipa> Diablo-D3: i just replaced bdb
403 2012-03-14 01:17:20 <BlueMatt> sipa: ah, so caveat emptor...
404 2012-03-14 01:17:29 <Diablo-D3> like I said, we'll jump from 0.6 to 0.9 and stay there a decade
405 2012-03-14 01:17:33 <sipa> still, if you want to hammer it, be my guest
406 2012-03-14 01:17:34 <Diablo-D3> the REAL issue however
407 2012-03-14 01:17:35 <Diablo-D3> is
408 2012-03-14 01:17:46 <Diablo-D3> we have no shit that uses bitcoin
409 2012-03-14 01:17:57 <Diablo-D3> like, we need a paypal-quality merchant transaction frontend
410 2012-03-14 01:18:04 chrisb__ has quit (Quit: Leaving)
411 2012-03-14 01:18:08 <BlueMatt> yep, and no legal precedent for anyone wanting to try either
412 2012-03-14 01:18:10 <[Prayer]> seroiusly though, what if the money were available to form a Bitcoin Foundation and have paid developers and other employees?
413 2012-03-14 01:18:10 <sipa> if bitcoin development stops after 0.6, armory and others will quickly take over
414 2012-03-14 01:18:21 <Diablo-D3> [Prayer]: probably
415 2012-03-14 01:18:24 <Diablo-D3> at least gavin
416 2012-03-14 01:18:34 <BlueMatt> [Prayer]: then at least gavin and maybe hire a few others to join
417 2012-03-14 01:18:47 <Diablo-D3> I think we need only one actually fulltime
418 2012-03-14 01:18:51 <BlueMatt> other than that, I dont know of anyone who would jump at the opportunity to quit their dayjob...
419 2012-03-14 01:18:54 <Diablo-D3> what we need is fulltimers on OTHER projects
420 2012-03-14 01:19:01 <Diablo-D3> which is the point Im trying to get across
421 2012-03-14 01:19:02 <[Prayer]> exactly
422 2012-03-14 01:19:03 <sipa> BlueMatt: i don't have a day job for the moment ;)
423 2012-03-14 01:19:10 <BlueMatt> oh, well then gavin and sipa
424 2012-03-14 01:19:18 <[Prayer]> develop and promote the technology, currency, and related services
425 2012-03-14 01:19:25 <Diablo-D3> merchants wont accept bitcoin because they cant plug it into their fucking shopping basket checkout thingy frameworks
426 2012-03-14 01:20:10 <luke-jr> what Bitcoin needs is a killer merchant app :p
427 2012-03-14 01:20:18 <BlueMatt> yep
428 2012-03-14 01:20:21 da2ce7 has joined
429 2012-03-14 01:20:21 <luke-jr> free POS terminals or something
430 2012-03-14 01:20:25 <luke-jr> that only work with Bitcoin
431 2012-03-14 01:20:25 <Diablo-D3> thats what I said luke
432 2012-03-14 01:20:27 <[Prayer]> or a killer service built on the same technology
433 2012-03-14 01:20:28 <BlueMatt> a drop-in paypal replacement which takes cc/bitcoin/etc
434 2012-03-14 01:20:37 <Diablo-D3> luke-jr: not yet
435 2012-03-14 01:20:40 <Diablo-D3> because POS terminals are dead
436 2012-03-14 01:20:40 <BlueMatt> bitpal.com with the same api
437 2012-03-14 01:20:50 <Diablo-D3> its all going to be POS terminals that do nearfield communications with a cell phone
438 2012-03-14 01:20:51 <BlueMatt> s/paypal/bitpal/ everywhere and poof
439 2012-03-14 01:20:52 <[Prayer]> grain was currency... you could store it for years, and you can eat it
440 2012-03-14 01:21:02 <[Prayer]> gold could be turned into jewlery and has other uses
441 2012-03-14 01:21:06 <luke-jr> BlueMatt: I bet you could get bitcoin.org for it ;p
442 2012-03-14 01:21:09 <luke-jr> .com*
443 2012-03-14 01:21:11 <[Prayer]> bitcion doesn't do anything by itself :(
444 2012-03-14 01:21:15 <Diablo-D3> gold's biggest use is industrial, [Prayer]
445 2012-03-14 01:21:18 <BlueMatt> luke-jr: if you want to pay out the ass...
446 2012-03-14 01:21:25 <BlueMatt> but I would say focusing on bitcoin kills it
447 2012-03-14 01:21:31 <Diablo-D3> the gold that becomes monetary gold is about half a percent of the gold mined every year
448 2012-03-14 01:21:31 <luke-jr> BlueMatt: sounds like TH's deal was mostly equity
449 2012-03-14 01:21:33 <BlueMatt> focus on payment, accept bitcoin
450 2012-03-14 01:21:41 <Diablo-D3> most of the non-monetary gold becomes electronics
451 2012-03-14 01:21:44 <Diablo-D3> the rest is jewlery
452 2012-03-14 01:22:08 <luke-jr> BlueMatt: if it's a real killer app, a trivial limitation like requirign Bitcoin is no problem
453 2012-03-14 01:22:16 <luke-jr> if it's "just" a paypal replacement, then maybe
454 2012-03-14 01:22:27 <BlueMatt> true
455 2012-03-14 01:22:42 <BlueMatt> seems like for now the only app we get is silkroad
456 2012-03-14 01:22:46 <BlueMatt> damn shame its illegal
457 2012-03-14 01:22:53 <Diablo-D3> I want to see the rise of bitcoin banks
458 2012-03-14 01:22:54 <Diablo-D3> I mean, hell
459 2012-03-14 01:22:59 <Diablo-D3> you know what I would happily provide?
460 2012-03-14 01:23:07 <Diablo-D3> the FDC insurance of bitcoin banks.
461 2012-03-14 01:23:10 iocor has quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
462 2012-03-14 01:23:25 <BlueMatt> thats a no-win industry...but have fun
463 2012-03-14 01:23:36 * BlueMatt plots making a bank and stealing the money...
464 2012-03-14 01:23:40 <Diablo-D3> any bank that belongs to it must provide me their entire holding logs once a month
465 2012-03-14 01:23:50 <Diablo-D3> and have to pay 0.25% of their balances a month.
466 2012-03-14 01:24:19 <Diablo-D3> in turn, any bank that fails to meet it loses their insurance and gets a front page posting on major bitcoin websites telling people to transfer their money out
467 2012-03-14 01:24:41 <[Prayer]> diablo: one problem... that insurance isn't needed unless the currency is fractional reserve
468 2012-03-14 01:24:49 <Diablo-D3> [Prayer]: not at all
469 2012-03-14 01:24:50 <Diablo-D3> break ins.
470 2012-03-14 01:25:28 <[Prayer]> and you're going to generate new coins to replace them?
471 2012-03-14 01:25:33 <BlueMatt> site closings/disapearings
472 2012-03-14 01:25:42 <Diablo-D3> [Prayer]: nope
473 2012-03-14 01:25:50 <Diablo-D3> you think banks dont pay into FDIC?
474 2012-03-14 01:25:52 <Diablo-D3> you're silly
475 2012-03-14 01:26:00 <[Prayer]> I know they do
476 2012-03-14 01:26:07 <Diablo-D3> bitcoin banks will as well
477 2012-03-14 01:26:09 <[Prayer]> because they're on a fractional reserve
478 2012-03-14 01:26:22 <[Prayer]> they don't have enough cash to pay everyone's account if the call came
479 2012-03-14 01:26:45 <[Prayer]> you advocating for introducing fractional reserve banking to bitcoin?
480 2012-03-14 01:26:51 <Diablo-D3> FDIC also covers actual theft of currency
481 2012-03-14 01:27:41 <[Prayer]> oh... just plain old theft...
482 2012-03-14 01:28:29 <[Prayer]> well, I guess if you do loans and CDs... I wouldn't trust any bank that didn't make their margins known publicly
483 2012-03-14 01:28:40 <Diablo-D3> exactly, it'd require transparency
484 2012-03-14 01:28:43 JRWR has joined
485 2012-03-14 01:28:43 <[Prayer]> or any bank that played the ponies
486 2012-03-14 01:28:48 <Diablo-D3> the moment the transparency stops the bank is effectively closed
487 2012-03-14 01:29:26 <[Prayer]> I hate to suggest it, but why not a p2p banking system that's owned by everyone and controlled by noone
488 2012-03-14 01:29:35 mcorlette is now known as mcorlett
489 2012-03-14 01:29:48 <[Prayer]> anyone who wants to put money away can also choose to loan it out
490 2012-03-14 01:30:07 <luke-jr> sounds like Bitcoin
491 2012-03-14 01:30:10 <[Prayer]> basically, a contract, which p2sh would already support
492 2012-03-14 01:30:30 <luke-jr> â¦
493 2012-03-14 01:30:42 <Diablo-D3> heh
494 2012-03-14 01:30:46 * Diablo-D3 shrugs
495 2012-03-14 01:30:53 <Diablo-D3> the whole point of a bank is instant movement of money
496 2012-03-14 01:31:03 <[Prayer]> that's one purpose
497 2012-03-14 01:31:06 <[Prayer]> they also do loans
498 2012-03-14 01:31:09 <[Prayer]> and savings accounts
499 2012-03-14 01:31:16 <rasengan> One problem that I seem to come across, again and again is the difficulty in sending money internationally. It's a real problem, and one that bitcoin is already set to solve once the use is more widespread.
500 2012-03-14 01:31:40 <[Prayer]> if bitcoin takes away the movement of money, why not something else to allow p2p loans?
501 2012-03-14 01:31:52 <[Prayer]> cut out the middle man
502 2012-03-14 01:32:04 <luke-jr> loans are just legal
503 2012-03-14 01:32:10 <luke-jr> you send money to A
504 2012-03-14 01:32:11 <luke-jr> A sends it back
505 2012-03-14 01:32:18 <Diablo-D3> [Prayer]: loans could be done
506 2012-03-14 01:32:23 <Diablo-D3> but it'd require a large scale operation
507 2012-03-14 01:32:28 <Diablo-D3> and non-anonyminity
508 2012-03-14 01:32:37 <Diablo-D3> I'd rather provide, say, an investment middleman
509 2012-03-14 01:33:03 Samuel has joined
510 2012-03-14 01:33:05 <da2ce7> Diablo-D3: with a reputation system, loans can even be taken out by anon idenities.
511 2012-03-14 01:33:18 <Diablo-D3> da2ce7: no
512 2012-03-14 01:33:24 <Diablo-D3> because I want to view their credit reports and such
513 2012-03-14 01:33:36 <luke-jr> da2ce7: that's part of the problem with the current financial system -.-
514 2012-03-14 01:34:05 <sipa> da2ce7: I wouldn't load any money to an identity that can just vanish, without any ability to sue anyone for it
515 2012-03-14 01:34:20 <Diablo-D3> hrm
516 2012-03-14 01:34:27 <Diablo-D3> I should actually start offering some sort of backed bitcoin currency
517 2012-03-14 01:34:27 <sipa> well, any serious amount of money
518 2012-03-14 01:34:30 <Diablo-D3> it'd be interesting to try it
519 2012-03-14 01:34:55 <da2ce7> Diablo-D3: I'm quite happy to help finance a VPN provider upstart company, who's owerns are anon... Yes they are anon... however they are already running a proffitable business... why distroy their reputation?
520 2012-03-14 01:35:43 <luke-jr> da2ce7: explain how ripping you off ruins their reputation with customers (the ones who pay them)?
521 2012-03-14 01:36:24 <Diablo-D3> da2ce7: that'd be hilarious
522 2012-03-14 01:36:27 <da2ce7> luke-jr: becasue if they run with the money, then people are less liekly to trust them in the future.
523 2012-03-14 01:36:30 <Diablo-D3> vpn over tor or something
524 2012-03-14 01:36:37 <Diablo-D3> using special software to keep the tunnel up at all costs
525 2012-03-14 01:37:04 plutonic has quit (Quit: plutonic)
526 2012-03-14 01:38:08 <da2ce7> when you are anon... the only thing you have is your reputation.
527 2012-03-14 01:38:36 graingert has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
528 2012-03-14 01:41:08 <[Prayer]> but anon can blow the rep, then start over... you have no idea of Bob is really Tom or not
529 2012-03-14 01:41:29 <userbfj> samuel: hi
530 2012-03-14 01:41:43 <Samuel> Hi userbfj
531 2012-03-14 01:42:01 <userbfj> any new mockup?
532 2012-03-14 01:42:25 <userbfj> samuel: any new mockup?
533 2012-03-14 01:42:41 <Samuel> Did you see this one? http://cl.ly/3r3r0Y1x1u2U2G0P470G
534 2012-03-14 01:42:51 <userbfj> samuel: will see
535 2012-03-14 01:43:55 <mod6> Samuel: that looks awesome.
536 2012-03-14 01:44:03 <Samuel> Thanks
537 2012-03-14 01:44:09 <da2ce7> [Prayer]: but an anon don't get a good rep from nothing... they normaly have to work for it :)
538 2012-03-14 01:44:09 <BlueMatt> have to say I kinda like the implemented one a bit better
539 2012-03-14 01:44:15 <BlueMatt> but that may just be the big bitcoin logo
540 2012-03-14 01:44:18 <BlueMatt> seems too much to me
541 2012-03-14 01:44:40 <luke-jr> da2ce7: so they earn the loan they rip you off on, is that your point?
542 2012-03-14 01:44:52 erska has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
543 2012-03-14 01:45:36 <Samuel> I just thought your balance is the main attraction of the app, so why not have it big and easy to read at all times? But your right, most users will like the design we have been working on
544 2012-03-14 01:45:38 <userbfj> samuel: do you have the last screenshot from tcatm?
545 2012-03-14 01:45:48 erska has joined
546 2012-03-14 01:46:05 <da2ce7> luke-jr: er... no.. but I wouldn't loan an anon entity more than I think that their reputation is worth. It would be more profitable for them to remain honest, than to scam.
547 2012-03-14 01:46:13 <Samuel> userbfj: No, seems like he deletes his old ones so I have no idea
548 2012-03-14 01:47:20 <userbfj> samuel: will see if i find it
549 2012-03-14 01:47:27 <Samuel> Ok
550 2012-03-14 01:47:40 <BlueMatt> his last screenshot: http://188.138.99.157/stuff/qtvert14.png
551 2012-03-14 01:48:34 <[Prayer]> da2ce7: nobody would be required to do anything... if you want positive id and insurance on the loan, you do that. if luke wants to invest in an anonymous venture, that's his choice
552 2012-03-14 01:48:52 <Samuel> BlueMatt: thanks
553 2012-03-14 01:48:58 <forsetifox> http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/122231-solar-panels-made-with-ion-cannon-are-cheap-enough-to-challenge-fossil-fuels
554 2012-03-14 01:49:18 <[Prayer]> BlueMatt, that's sexy
555 2012-03-14 01:49:50 <BlueMatt> /nod
556 2012-03-14 01:50:09 <[Tycho]> TX icons are WAY too big
557 2012-03-14 01:50:09 <Samuel> There need some font-choice changes and better icons (working on some now) but it's coming along :D
558 2012-03-14 01:50:33 <BlueMatt> yea, the recent tx stuff is out of place and could use some help...
559 2012-03-14 01:50:37 <luke-jr> Samuel: font is an OS config
560 2012-03-14 01:50:45 <BlueMatt> Id like to see a XX% count on the progress bar for sync
561 2012-03-14 01:50:57 <BlueMatt> but for the most part its damn nice
562 2012-03-14 01:50:59 <luke-jr> someone should test http://luke.dashjr.org/programs/bitcoin/files/bitcoin-eligius_miner/20120313c-bitcoin-0.6.0.eligius_miner-win32-setup.exe
563 2012-03-14 01:50:59 <Samuel> luke-jr: Does that mena you can change the font?
564 2012-03-14 01:51:00 <[Prayer]> Samuel: I like the layout... how about user-selectable windows?
565 2012-03-14 01:51:06 <[Tycho]> Make them adequate and you can fit twice more TXes
566 2012-03-14 01:51:12 <luke-jr> Samuel: it means you change your font in your OS settings
567 2012-03-14 01:51:22 <sipa> BlueMatt: i'd prefer "%i more blocks" in the progress bar
568 2012-03-14 01:51:29 <forsetifox> You made a bitcoin miner Luke?
569 2012-03-14 01:51:29 <luke-jr> sipa++
570 2012-03-14 01:51:35 <luke-jr> forsetifox: yes and no
571 2012-03-14 01:51:46 <userbfj> samuel: on sidebar, what you think remove the border
572 2012-03-14 01:51:48 <luke-jr> forsetifox: I contributed to cgminer, and integrated cgminer with Bitcoin-Qt
573 2012-03-14 01:51:48 <BlueMatt> sipa: whatever, some number
574 2012-03-14 01:51:49 <sipa> the progress bar is really confusing, both when it resets and not
575 2012-03-14 01:51:59 <BlueMatt> /nod
576 2012-03-14 01:52:01 <Samuel> luke-jr: Well the default font for the titles (Wallet, recent trans.) is a bit un-suitable
577 2012-03-14 01:52:04 <forsetifox> Ah.. interesting. So cgminer will have a front-end now?
578 2012-03-14 01:52:12 h4ckm3th32nd has joined
579 2012-03-14 01:52:19 <luke-jr> Samuel: default is an OS thing
580 2012-03-14 01:52:21 <userbfj> samuel: and the selected menu have a courve
581 2012-03-14 01:52:29 <luke-jr> forsetifox: if you use that Bitcoin-Qt :p
582 2012-03-14 01:52:39 <forsetifox> Yeah, I do.
583 2012-03-14 01:52:47 <luke-jr> forsetifox: no, I mean the exact build I linkedâ¦
584 2012-03-14 01:53:02 <Samuel> userbfj: What kind of curve?
585 2012-03-14 01:53:18 minimoose has quit (Quit: minimoose)
586 2012-03-14 01:53:23 Cablesaurus has quit (Quit: There's nothing dirtier then a giant ball of oil)
587 2012-03-14 01:53:27 <userbfj> samuel: let me see if i find a screenshot
588 2012-03-14 01:53:32 <Samuel> Ok
589 2012-03-14 01:53:58 <[Prayer]> only mines with eligius?
590 2012-03-14 01:54:03 <luke-jr> [Prayer]: yes
591 2012-03-14 01:54:24 <[Prayer]> why not settable for any pool?
592 2012-03-14 01:54:29 <[Prayer]> or does that come later?
593 2012-03-14 01:54:39 <luke-jr> because I have no interest in doing the work for that.
594 2012-03-14 01:54:40 <luke-jr> :p
595 2012-03-14 01:54:45 <[Prayer]> heh... figures
596 2012-03-14 01:54:50 <luke-jr> only Eligius can "just work"
597 2012-03-14 01:54:58 <luke-jr> other pools require registration etc
598 2012-03-14 01:55:03 <[Prayer]> ah
599 2012-03-14 01:55:12 <[Prayer]> so a framework would have to be built to support multiple pools
600 2012-03-14 01:55:21 <luke-jr> with this, you just check the "Generate Coins" box and wait for it to come in
601 2012-03-14 01:55:36 <[Tycho]> This way he wants to get more users :)
602 2012-03-14 01:55:40 <[Tycho]> Evil luke-jr
603 2012-03-14 01:56:05 <[Prayer]> what would it take to set up a low-hashrate subpool for p2pool?
604 2012-03-14 01:56:19 <luke-jr> [Prayer]: a lot. :p
605 2012-03-14 01:56:24 <[Prayer]> for the 24Mh/s folks like me :(
606 2012-03-14 01:56:33 <luke-jr> oh, you mean in general, or integrated?
607 2012-03-14 01:56:37 <luke-jr> [Prayer]: no reason not to use Eligius
608 2012-03-14 01:56:45 <[Prayer]> I'm on slush atm...
609 2012-03-14 01:56:58 <[Prayer]> thought about deepbit, but saw how big and scary it is
610 2012-03-14 01:56:58 <luke-jr> [Prayer]: Eligius supports the same kind of decentralized mining as p2pool
611 2012-03-14 01:56:59 <forsetifox> "sign message" What is this madness?
612 2012-03-14 01:57:08 <luke-jr> forsetifox: ?
613 2012-03-14 01:57:13 <[Prayer]> hmm... might give it a shot then
614 2012-03-14 01:57:18 <userbfj> samuel: the courve, geek.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/11/n800os2k8_01.jpg
615 2012-03-14 01:57:19 <sipa> forsetifox: it allows you to sign messages!
616 2012-03-14 01:57:22 <forsetifox> File -> Sign Message. Heh.
617 2012-03-14 01:57:24 <sipa> with an address
618 2012-03-14 01:57:34 <[Prayer]> how do I know I can trust fils on that site though?
619 2012-03-14 01:57:54 <sipa> [Prayer]: ?
620 2012-03-14 01:57:54 <forsetifox> This sign message thing is gonna get sooooo many ascii penii.
621 2012-03-14 01:57:56 <luke-jr> [Prayer]: ?
622 2012-03-14 01:57:58 <[Prayer]> lolz
623 2012-03-14 01:58:09 <[Prayer]> yankin yer chain man
624 2012-03-14 01:58:23 <Samuel> userbfj: Ah, I see. Thats a nice UI element but we would have to see if it is do-able
625 2012-03-14 01:58:56 * [Prayer] goes off to back up his wallet 'n stuff
626 2012-03-14 01:59:16 <forsetifox> luke-jr: There's nothing that tells me what the miner is doing. >.>
627 2012-03-14 01:59:21 <userbfj> samuel: i would like to not have the sidebar border and add this kind of courve
628 2012-03-14 01:59:31 <luke-jr> forsetifox: there's an icon in the statusbar
629 2012-03-14 01:59:37 <[Prayer]> (gotta protect that 0.05btc I have stuffed away)
630 2012-03-14 01:59:38 <forsetifox> The picks come up and disappear.
631 2012-03-14 01:59:47 <sipa> hmmm, a github-backup package on hackage
632 2012-03-14 01:59:49 * sipa tries
633 2012-03-14 01:59:51 <userbfj> samuel: i don't like may lines
634 2012-03-14 01:59:53 <luke-jr> forsetifox: if it disappears, cgminer doesn't like your GPU :P
635 2012-03-14 02:00:00 <userbfj> many
636 2012-03-14 02:00:01 <luke-jr> forsetifox: or it's buggy
637 2012-03-14 02:00:08 <luke-jr> forsetifox: can you pastebin your debug.log
638 2012-03-14 02:00:26 <Samuel> userbfj: Yes, I agree. But like before we'll have to see if tcatm can do it
639 2012-03-14 02:01:08 dvide has joined
640 2012-03-14 02:01:29 <userbfj> samuel: my english is bad, so if you can explaing this to tcatm, wil be good
641 2012-03-14 02:01:31 <sipa> wow, github-backup includes all forks
642 2012-03-14 02:01:42 sacarlson has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
643 2012-03-14 02:01:42 <forsetifox> http://pastebin.com/hFZ108vu
644 2012-03-14 02:01:45 <[Prayer]> hmm... ok, so I click generate, and nothing apparent happens?
645 2012-03-14 02:01:48 <Samuel> userbfj: For sure!
646 2012-03-14 02:02:11 <userbfj> samuel: not working on other parts of the gui?
647 2012-03-14 02:02:16 <luke-jr> sipa: :o
648 2012-03-14 02:02:29 <userbfj> samuel: thanks
649 2012-03-14 02:02:53 <Samuel> userbfj: We are going at tcatm's pase, so right now I think we are focusing on the Overview tab
650 2012-03-14 02:02:56 <luke-jr> forsetifox: can you confirm it installed cgminer.exe to your bitcoin dir, and that it runs?
651 2012-03-14 02:03:49 <forsetifox> Yeah. It runs. Asking for an URL.
652 2012-03-14 02:03:55 <luke-jr> hmmm
653 2012-03-14 02:03:57 <userbfj> samuel: could you creatr a mockup with my last idea?
654 2012-03-14 02:04:26 <userbfj> samuel: no sidebar border and the courves
655 2012-03-14 02:04:39 <Samuel> userbfj: Sure, working on transaction incoming, outgoing icons at the moment
656 2012-03-14 02:05:06 <userbfj> samuel: ok will let you free
657 2012-03-14 02:05:22 <Samuel> Ok
658 2012-03-14 02:05:40 <[Prayer]> luke, I get 'CreateProcess failed' in the debug log
659 2012-03-14 02:06:01 <[Prayer]> also an entry about cpu... not gpu
660 2012-03-14 02:08:14 a_meteorite has joined
661 2012-03-14 02:08:17 <[Prayer]> oh well, I'll check back tomorrow sometime
662 2012-03-14 02:09:25 Eliel has joined
663 2012-03-14 02:12:22 <luke-jr> forsetifox: http://luke.dashjr.org/tmp/code/a.exe
664 2012-03-14 02:12:36 <luke-jr> forsetifox: try that in the same dir, at a command prompt, please
665 2012-03-14 02:13:07 JRWR has quit (Disconnected by services)
666 2012-03-14 02:13:13 temp42123 has joined
667 2012-03-14 02:13:27 <forsetifox> Stick it in the daemon directory?
668 2012-03-14 02:14:15 <forsetifox> Application has failed to start because libgcc_s_sjlj-1.dll was not found.
669 2012-03-14 02:16:10 temp42123 has quit (Client Quit)
670 2012-03-14 02:17:30 <luke-jr> forsetifox: redownload
671 2012-03-14 02:17:46 <forsetifox> The a.exe or the other one?
672 2012-03-14 02:18:07 <luke-jr> a.exe
673 2012-03-14 02:19:33 sacarlson has joined
674 2012-03-14 02:19:42 barmstrong has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
675 2012-03-14 02:20:12 <forsetifox> CreateProcess failed. The specified image file did not conta.. in a resource section. cgminer: --cpu-threads: uncrecognized option.
676 2012-03-14 02:20:41 <luke-jr> O.o
677 2012-03-14 02:21:25 <luke-jr> forsetifox: ok, new a.exe to try
678 2012-03-14 02:21:57 JRWR has joined
679 2012-03-14 02:22:25 <forsetifox> That works.
680 2012-03-14 02:22:37 <forsetifox> 19Mhash? Heh.
681 2012-03-14 02:22:48 <luke-jr> hmm
682 2012-03-14 02:22:52 <forsetifox> 14-37
683 2012-03-14 02:23:11 <luke-jr> forsetifox: no error at the start?
684 2012-03-14 02:23:43 <forsetifox> http://imgur.com/u92Qz
685 2012-03-14 02:23:46 <forsetifox> No error.
686 2012-03-14 02:24:29 <luke-jr> I see one ;P
687 2012-03-14 02:25:22 has quit (Clown|!Clown@static-87-79-93-140.netcologne.de|)
688 2012-03-14 02:25:48 <forsetifox> Hm.. thought that was from the previous run.
689 2012-03-14 02:27:04 <Samuel> userbfj: http://cl.ly/13043y0U3J3F0E201G3d I went with a point instead of a curve because the app dosen't have many curves in it and it wouldn't fit in with the rest of the design.
690 2012-03-14 02:27:45 <BlueMatt> is that a modification of tcatm's screen, or code running?
691 2012-03-14 02:28:05 <Samuel> BlueMatt: a modification, I can't code.
692 2012-03-14 02:28:53 <BlueMatt> I like the lack of the border line, though Im not sure about the triangle cutout...
693 2012-03-14 02:29:03 <BlueMatt> as an idea its great, in practice...
694 2012-03-14 02:29:20 <Samuel> userbfj suggested it
695 2012-03-14 02:29:39 <Samuel> I'm not to sure about it either, doesn;t really fit in
696 2012-03-14 02:29:42 <userbfj> samuel: the courve will be betteg in my opnion
697 2012-03-14 02:29:48 <BlueMatt> like the new tx icons, though ofc smaller
698 2012-03-14 02:30:15 <userbfj> samuel: the no borders is good
699 2012-03-14 02:30:15 <luke-jr> I'd get rid of the Overview completely, and move Transactions to the top
700 2012-03-14 02:30:22 <Samuel> Yeah I don't like them so big as well, but I matched the size of the old ones
701 2012-03-14 02:30:48 <BlueMatt> yea
702 2012-03-14 02:30:52 <Samuel> juke-jr: I agree, there is not much use to the tab
703 2012-03-14 02:31:18 <BlueMatt> I dont like the default as tx list, but I agree there isnt much use for an overview tab
704 2012-03-14 02:31:36 <userbfj> samuel: i think is good keep the overview tab
705 2012-03-14 02:31:53 <BlueMatt> I like having an overview tab, but its largely pointless as it sits...
706 2012-03-14 02:32:08 <Samuel> userbfj: unless we add more elements to it its only adding unwanted space
707 2012-03-14 02:32:10 barmstrong has joined
708 2012-03-14 02:32:13 <userbfj> when be possible have many wallets
709 2012-03-14 02:32:47 <userbfj> informations of thw wallet
710 2012-03-14 02:32:59 <Samuel> userbfj: Like multiple wallets in one app?
711 2012-03-14 02:33:05 <userbfj> like total of address ondeaddress book
712 2012-03-14 02:33:12 <userbfj> yes
713 2012-03-14 02:33:28 <BlueMatt> again, we can add an overview tab if we add features which require it
714 2012-03-14 02:33:31 <BlueMatt> for now...
715 2012-03-14 02:33:43 <Samuel> Yes, definitely
716 2012-03-14 02:33:44 <BlueMatt> make a decision based on what we have, not what we may or will have
717 2012-03-14 02:33:48 <userbfj> date of wallet creation
718 2012-03-14 02:34:00 <userbfj> most used address
719 2012-03-14 02:34:11 <userbfj> ...
720 2012-03-14 02:34:18 <Samuel> So your kinda talking statistics? Hmmm
721 2012-03-14 02:34:25 <userbfj> hum
722 2012-03-14 02:34:30 <luke-jr> should be buried away somewhere IMO
723 2012-03-14 02:34:40 <userbfj> maybe you are correct
724 2012-03-14 02:35:02 <luke-jr> perhaps the Overview can be replaced with a webkit tab loading the wiki :P
725 2012-03-14 02:35:13 <Samuel> yeah, I was think that could be in the settings or preferences or somewhere, that info isn't referred to that often
726 2012-03-14 02:35:39 Clipse has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
727 2012-03-14 02:35:55 <Samuel> luke-jr: I always thought Wiki-intergration would be awesome
728 2012-03-14 02:36:10 <userbfj> samuel: i still like white background
729 2012-03-14 02:36:14 <luke-jr> only problem I see is making sure it doesn't make phishing easy
730 2012-03-14 02:36:16 <userbfj> for all
731 2012-03-14 02:36:20 <luke-jr> userbfj: colours are your OS settings
732 2012-03-14 02:36:33 <BlueMatt> except for how often the wiki goes down...
733 2012-03-14 02:36:33 <userbfj> hum
734 2012-03-14 02:37:13 <luke-jr> fine, integrated Tor+SilkRoad
735 2012-03-14 02:37:15 <luke-jr> <.<
736 2012-03-14 02:37:19 <Samuel> luke-jr: so we're basically making this app to fit around one's OS?
737 2012-03-14 02:37:30 <luke-jr> Samuel: that's what apps are supposed to do.
738 2012-03-14 02:37:58 <Samuel> Not all, I wasn't saying it was a bad idea. Its fine with me
739 2012-03-14 02:38:42 <userbfj> samuel: i think i don't like separation of sidebar with the pages
740 2012-03-14 02:38:58 <Samuel> userbfj: explain that a bit more
741 2012-03-14 02:38:59 <userbfj> the color much different
742 2012-03-14 02:39:33 gringles has joined
743 2012-03-14 02:39:33 <Samuel> userbfj: So you think the light blue should also be gray?
744 2012-03-14 02:40:16 <BlueMatt> luke-jr: ...
745 2012-03-14 02:40:18 <userbfj> samuel: could you make a fast mockup with something white or near white
746 2012-03-14 02:40:24 <userbfj> just to see
747 2012-03-14 02:40:53 <userbfj> samuel: maybe i'm crazy
748 2012-03-14 02:41:21 booo has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
749 2012-03-14 02:42:03 localhost has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
750 2012-03-14 02:42:41 <userbfj> samuel: just the overview tab white
751 2012-03-14 02:43:29 <userbfj> samuel: maybe i don't know what i want
752 2012-03-14 02:43:48 Samuel has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
753 2012-03-14 02:44:00 <luke-jr> BlueMatt: â¦
754 2012-03-14 02:46:28 pickett has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
755 2012-03-14 02:48:29 pickett has joined
756 2012-03-14 02:54:07 pingdrive has quit (Quit: Leaving)
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762 2012-03-14 03:02:09 Joric has quit ()
763 2012-03-14 03:04:36 <Raccoon> DO IT NOW. You like Bitcoin? You should know about Croptography! Take the (absolutely) FREE Stanford University Online Cryptography Class and know a thing or two. Lectures started today. Sign up and watch them. https://www.coursera.org/crypto/auth/welcome
764 2012-03-14 03:04:44 userbfj has quit (Quit: Leaving)
765 2012-03-14 03:04:45 <[Tycho]> Spam ?
766 2012-03-14 03:04:49 JRWR has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
767 2012-03-14 03:05:25 <Raccoon> PS. He talks about bitcoin. :)
768 2012-03-14 03:05:31 <Raccoon> no.
769 2012-03-14 03:06:19 <luke-jr> BlueMatt: CBlockStore still a pain to merge? :P
770 2012-03-14 03:07:35 OneFixt has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
771 2012-03-14 03:07:58 OneFixt has joined
772 2012-03-14 03:11:17 Flargles_ has joined
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774 2012-03-14 03:17:10 h4ckm3th32nd has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
775 2012-03-14 03:18:37 <BlueMatt> luke-jr: shouldnt be, its up to date on master
776 2012-03-14 03:18:44 <BlueMatt> luke-jr: I literally just rebased it like an hour ago
777 2012-03-14 03:18:50 twobitcoins_ has quit (Quit: Leaving)
778 2012-03-14 03:19:15 <BlueMatt> a pain to merge onto random branches, probably
779 2012-03-14 03:19:38 <Diablo-D3> people need to use git flow more
780 2012-03-14 03:19:43 <BlueMatt> meaning?
781 2012-03-14 03:19:56 <luke-jr> BlueMatt: that's what I mean :P
782 2012-03-14 03:20:04 <BlueMatt> then yea probably
783 2012-03-14 03:20:12 * Diablo-D3 bets no one in here uses git flow :<
784 2012-03-14 03:20:16 <BlueMatt> you have a better way to move big chunks of code between files?
785 2012-03-14 03:20:19 <BlueMatt> Diablo-D3: meaning?
786 2012-03-14 03:20:42 <Diablo-D3> blueMatt: meaning you need to learn to use google.
787 2012-03-14 03:21:35 <BlueMatt> oh, its a command, I thought you mean git workflow or some recommended way of using git
788 2012-03-14 03:21:46 <Diablo-D3> its a command that enforces a specific workflow
789 2012-03-14 03:21:50 <BlueMatt> ah
790 2012-03-14 03:22:06 <Diablo-D3> the workflow it enforces, btw, is basically the ultimate recommended practices for git
791 2012-03-14 03:22:24 <BlueMatt> mmm, so a lot of branching a merging on top of branches...
792 2012-03-14 03:22:45 forsetifox has quit (Quit: Page closed)
793 2012-03-14 03:23:19 <Diablo-D3> a lot of topic specific branching done in ways that are enforced to be named in ways that make sense, with rebased merging back into shit
794 2012-03-14 03:23:26 <Diablo-D3> it also manages release branches
795 2012-03-14 03:23:31 <Diablo-D3> and it also makes master useful
796 2012-03-14 03:23:31 da2ce7 has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
797 2012-03-14 03:23:40 <BlueMatt> mmm, fun
798 2012-03-14 03:23:48 <Diablo-D3> I use it for shit
799 2012-03-14 03:23:54 <Diablo-D3> even on projects that dont use git flow
800 2012-03-14 03:24:11 <Diablo-D3> and the best part
801 2012-03-14 03:24:13 <Diablo-D3> I can apt-get it.
802 2012-03-14 03:24:36 <Diablo-D3> even automatically installs git flow completion which isnt part of the main project
803 2012-03-14 03:24:55 <BlueMatt> nice
804 2012-03-14 03:25:02 <luke-jr> git flow is automated daggy fixes?
805 2012-03-14 03:25:33 <Diablo-D3> luke-jr: no, with git flow, you dont make them to begin with
806 2012-03-14 03:26:09 <BlueMatt> we do a pretty good job with feature branching, not so much with branching releases, though luke is doing pretty well with that...
807 2012-03-14 03:27:21 <Diablo-D3> http://nvie.com/posts/a-successful-git-branching-model/
808 2012-03-14 03:27:30 <Diablo-D3> thats how git flow works, but that was written before git flow was invented
809 2012-03-14 03:27:34 <Diablo-D3> git flow enforces that model
810 2012-03-14 03:29:23 <luke-jr> BlueMatt: it'd be better if bugfixes got branched from the commit introducing the bug <.<
811 2012-03-14 03:29:33 <Diablo-D3> nope
812 2012-03-14 03:29:38 <Diablo-D3> because then you cant merge them properly
813 2012-03-14 03:30:03 <BlueMatt> agree with Diablo here
814 2012-03-14 03:30:12 <BlueMatt> everything should branch off something recent so that it is mergeable
815 2012-03-14 03:30:14 <BlueMatt> imho
816 2012-03-14 03:30:23 <Diablo-D3> git flow handles bug fix branches
817 2012-03-14 03:30:24 <BlueMatt> even if its not as "sane" it maintains merger sanity
818 2012-03-14 03:30:34 <luke-jr> on the contrary, you can ONLY merge them properly if they're branched from the commit that introduced them
819 2012-03-14 03:30:41 <freewil> yeah sometimes i will reference the commit hash is the commit message, github nicely links that
820 2012-03-14 03:30:54 <Diablo-D3> luke-jr: committing into master (and develop in git flow land) is a sin
821 2012-03-14 03:30:54 <luke-jr> if there's a conflict somewhere, you can always resolve it at that point with an extra merge
822 2012-03-14 03:31:19 <BlueMatt> which is a pain
823 2012-03-14 03:31:19 <Diablo-D3> also, merges that produce the merge message are inherently wrong
824 2012-03-14 03:31:22 <luke-jr> but most of the time, a bugfix will merge cleanly
825 2012-03-14 03:31:24 <Diablo-D3> always fucking rebase.
826 2012-03-14 03:31:31 <luke-jr> Diablo-D3: no u
827 2012-03-14 03:31:31 <Diablo-D3> git flow rebases habitually
828 2012-03-14 03:31:36 <luke-jr> rebasing destroys history
829 2012-03-14 03:31:37 JRWR has joined
830 2012-03-14 03:31:39 <Diablo-D3> are you gay, luke?
831 2012-03-14 03:31:40 <Diablo-D3> seriously
832 2012-03-14 03:31:48 <Diablo-D3> you must suck dicks like a chain smoker smokes
833 2012-03-14 03:32:01 <Diablo-D3> I have never met someone so fucking retarded in quite some time
834 2012-03-14 03:32:11 TheSeven has quit (Disconnected by services)
835 2012-03-14 03:32:14 <Diablo-D3> you should have your commit rights pulled and told to fuck off before you cause any more damage
836 2012-03-14 03:32:33 <BlueMatt> damn Diablo-D3
837 2012-03-14 03:32:43 <luke-jr> BlueMatt: it's only a "pain" because git log has stupid defaults :p
838 2012-03-14 03:32:47 [7] has joined
839 2012-03-14 03:33:11 <luke-jr> bzr log hides the 2nd parent by default, so just giving proper commit messages to merges makes it nice
840 2012-03-14 03:33:43 <luke-jr> ie, like git log --first-parent
841 2012-03-14 03:38:19 <luke-jr> otoh, --no-merges might look even better
842 2012-03-14 03:38:49 <BlueMatt> wait, if the new bip16 eval date is on mar 15, havent we already missed 50%?
843 2012-03-14 03:38:57 <BlueMatt> (over the past week on mar 15)
844 2012-03-14 03:39:28 <BlueMatt> can we just say fuck it and move on with rollout on april 1st?
845 2012-03-14 03:39:36 <luke-jr> ^
846 2012-03-14 03:39:38 * BlueMatt is tired of waiting to release 0.6
847 2012-03-14 03:39:54 * luke-jr hopes CBlockStore gets merged 1st after 0.6 final
848 2012-03-14 03:40:08 * BlueMatt agrees (largely because hes tired of rebasing)
849 2012-03-14 03:40:13 word has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
850 2012-03-14 03:40:22 <BlueMatt> every other commit fails....
851 2012-03-14 03:40:26 <luke-jr> that, and it also gives it a full merge window to get testing
852 2012-03-14 03:40:33 <BlueMatt> yea, absolutely
853 2012-03-14 03:40:45 <luke-jr> hmm
854 2012-03-14 03:40:48 vigilyn has quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
855 2012-03-14 03:40:52 <luke-jr> it's going to make backports a pain for me, isn't it? :D
856 2012-03-14 03:40:58 <BlueMatt> yep
857 2012-03-14 03:41:11 <BlueMatt> its actually not as bad as it seems
858 2012-03-14 03:41:26 <BlueMatt> though it will fail to automatically backport, almost all code has a very clear equivalent
859 2012-03-14 03:41:36 <BlueMatt> actually, all code does
860 2012-03-14 03:41:44 <BlueMatt> cblockstore looks bigger than it really is
861 2012-03-14 03:44:33 <BlueMatt> luke-jr: did you ever get around to writing that automatic nonstd tx stealer?
862 2012-03-14 03:44:50 <BlueMatt> actually, I guess not since I would have lost coins earlier today
863 2012-03-14 03:44:58 <BlueMatt> you really should get on that ;)
864 2012-03-14 03:45:11 forsetifox has joined
865 2012-03-14 03:47:00 <luke-jr> BlueMatt: yes, it's online
866 2012-03-14 03:47:10 <luke-jr> BlueMatt: not sure why it missed that
867 2012-03-14 03:47:26 <luke-jr> it's very dumb though
868 2012-03-14 03:47:30 <BlueMatt> is it not a proxy in front of the eligius relay thing?
869 2012-03-14 03:47:33 <forrestv> nonstd tx stealer?
870 2012-03-14 03:47:33 <luke-jr> just tries any number of OP_1s
871 2012-03-14 03:47:37 <forrestv> ah
872 2012-03-14 03:47:48 <luke-jr> BlueMatt: no, I run it locally
873 2012-03-14 03:47:49 <BlueMatt> oh, thats a fail, you should just chain txouts and see if it still spends right
874 2012-03-14 03:47:56 <BlueMatt> s/chain/change/
875 2012-03-14 03:48:04 <BlueMatt> if its still valid, you stole the coins :)
876 2012-03-14 03:48:05 <luke-jr> BlueMatt: meh, lazy
877 2012-03-14 03:48:11 <BlueMatt> yea, but that is simpler
878 2012-03-14 03:48:19 <luke-jr> is that what happened with the fake BIP 16?
879 2012-03-14 03:48:29 <BlueMatt> fake? you mean semi-valid?
880 2012-03-14 03:48:33 <BlueMatt> its in the chain
881 2012-03-14 03:48:35 <luke-jr> simpler, but you have to find the block
882 2012-03-14 03:48:53 <luke-jr> mine doesn't wait for another person to try to spend it
883 2012-03-14 03:49:31 <BlueMatt> ah, well you should do that one and put it as a proxy in front of eligius (since everyone sends nonstd txes to eligus anyway)
884 2012-03-14 03:49:46 <luke-jr> doesn't seem as likely to pay off
885 2012-03-14 03:50:00 <BlueMatt> meh, you would have gotten a few bitcent today
886 2012-03-14 03:50:01 userhg has joined
887 2012-03-14 03:50:09 <luke-jr> I'm used to more income than that :p
888 2012-03-14 03:50:37 <BlueMatt> hey, thats a few bitcent you wouldnt have otherwise had ;)
889 2012-03-14 03:51:04 <BlueMatt> why wont bitcoin-qt start in valgrind???
890 2012-03-14 03:51:34 <BlueMatt> in fucking QtCore...
891 2012-03-14 03:52:11 * Diablo-D3 ponders
892 2012-03-14 03:52:21 <Diablo-D3> I wonder what the memory bandwidth of a radeon with underclocked memory is
893 2012-03-14 03:53:50 <BlueMatt> arg valgrind bug..now I have to backport...
894 2012-03-14 03:53:52 <BlueMatt> fuck
895 2012-03-14 03:59:20 <BlueMatt> can we make bitcoin-qt.pro default to debug build and just not release as such?
896 2012-03-14 04:06:36 <gjs278> over 9000 memory bandwidth
897 2012-03-14 04:06:54 <BlueMatt> ITS OVER 9k!!!!!!
898 2012-03-14 04:06:56 <BlueMatt> 1111one
899 2012-03-14 04:06:59 * Diablo-D3 is about to try something very stupid
900 2012-03-14 04:07:03 * Diablo-D3 is going to kill people if it works
901 2012-03-14 04:07:15 <BlueMatt> ...
902 2012-03-14 04:08:07 userhg has quit (Quit: Leaving)
903 2012-03-14 04:08:44 SomeoneWeirdzzzz is now known as SomeoneWeird
904 2012-03-14 04:09:09 skeledrex has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
905 2012-03-14 04:09:17 <[Tycho]> "luke-jr: just tries any number of OP_1s" - strange way of solving txes :)
906 2012-03-14 04:10:19 <[Tycho]> BlueMatt: you created strange txes today ?
907 2012-03-14 04:10:35 <BlueMatt> to steal your like .03 BTC
908 2012-03-14 04:10:42 skeledrew has joined
909 2012-03-14 04:10:49 <BlueMatt> only spent
910 2012-03-14 04:11:24 skeledrew has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
911 2012-03-14 04:11:44 skeledrew has joined
912 2012-03-14 04:11:48 <[Tycho]> Hmm, may be I really should create some kind of automatic solver... Sadly strange TXes happen so rarely those days :(
913 2012-03-14 04:13:13 <BlueMatt> sadly? thats a good thing
914 2012-03-14 04:13:23 <BlueMatt> well I suppose unless you want to steal them
915 2012-03-14 04:13:51 <[Tycho]> Why it's good ? That's one of the funnies parts of the blockchain.
916 2012-03-14 04:18:22 <Diablo-D3> _ahaha_
917 2012-03-14 04:18:24 <Diablo-D3> I murdered it
918 2012-03-14 04:18:31 <Diablo-D3> 1.6 mhash
919 2012-03-14 04:18:31 mizerydearia has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
920 2012-03-14 04:18:47 [Tycho]_ has joined
921 2012-03-14 04:20:35 <Diablo-D3> oh wait made it too big
922 2012-03-14 04:25:11 <[Tycho]> 40m without a block again...
923 2012-03-14 04:25:41 <forrestv> everyone must have stopped mining!
924 2012-03-14 04:25:42 minimoose has joined
925 2012-03-14 04:25:53 <Graet> yes yes thats it!
926 2012-03-14 04:27:29 * Diablo-D3 ponders
927 2012-03-14 04:28:10 <luke-jr> Diablo-D3: they're joking.
928 2012-03-14 04:28:15 <Diablo-D3> 512mb divided by 4 gives me 128mb, divided by 4 gives 32 million hashes
929 2012-03-14 04:28:22 <Diablo-D3> thats not quite big enough
930 2012-03-14 04:29:49 <Diablo-D3> actually maybe it is
931 2012-03-14 04:29:59 <Diablo-D3> thats like 10 fps on my card
932 2012-03-14 04:30:03 has joined
933 2012-03-14 04:31:08 h4ckm3th32nd has joined
934 2012-03-14 04:31:48 kilope has joined
935 2012-03-14 04:32:04 LemonLoaf has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
936 2012-03-14 04:32:06 <Diablo-D3> oh wait, except sizes that big are slow
937 2012-03-14 04:38:07 twobitcoins has joined
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939 2012-03-14 04:38:08 twobitcoins has joined
940 2012-03-14 04:38:54 kilope has quit (Quit: Page closed)
941 2012-03-14 04:39:11 <freewil> twobitcoins, FYI: * twobitcoins (~twobitcoi@ip98-163-231-30.no.no.cox.net) has joined #bitcoin-dev
942 2012-03-14 04:39:11 <freewil> * twobitcoins has quit (Changing host)
943 2012-03-14 04:39:11 <freewil> * twobitcoins (~twobitcoi@unaffiliated/twobitcoins) has joined #bitcoin-dev
944 2012-03-14 04:39:57 <Diablo-D3> lol
945 2012-03-14 04:39:58 <Diablo-D3> dm is using
946 2012-03-14 04:40:00 <Diablo-D3> 100% cpu
947 2012-03-14 04:40:33 <Diablo-D3> huh
948 2012-03-14 04:41:05 <Diablo-D3> 300 mhash given the amount of reand and writing I'm doing
949 2012-03-14 04:41:07 <Diablo-D3> 303
950 2012-03-14 04:44:20 <Diablo-D3> oh wait, sorry, I broke it
951 2012-03-14 04:44:24 ForceMajeure has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
952 2012-03-14 04:46:01 <Diablo-D3> so my clever idea, it didnt work
953 2012-03-14 04:46:02 <Diablo-D3> oh well
954 2012-03-14 04:46:22 <[Tycho]> Wow, 1h reached...
955 2012-03-14 04:50:20 <BlueMatt> damn, miners are getting unlucky...
956 2012-03-14 04:51:23 <[Tycho]> And the queue is at 600+ again
957 2012-03-14 04:53:04 twmz has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
958 2012-03-14 04:53:35 twmz has joined
959 2012-03-14 04:53:57 <luke-jr> BlueMatt: Eligius will find the next block soon
960 2012-03-14 04:54:30 <BlueMatt> why are you so confident?
961 2012-03-14 04:54:41 <luke-jr> I'm prayin.
962 2012-03-14 04:54:56 <[Tycho]> MM did it
963 2012-03-14 04:55:25 <BlueMatt> must've been
964 2012-03-14 04:55:38 <[Tycho]> But this doesn't counts since no TXes inside
965 2012-03-14 04:58:01 <[Tycho]> I wonder if I should do something about MM
966 2012-03-14 04:58:13 <BlueMatt> like?
967 2012-03-14 04:58:36 <[Tycho]> Check if only my node is used for relaying.
968 2012-03-14 05:00:30 dub has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
969 2012-03-14 05:00:33 <[Tycho]> Well, at least poolhoppers are fooled by those blocks :)
970 2012-03-14 05:00:52 rodrigorcm-afk has joined
971 2012-03-14 05:00:53 <luke-jr> Eligius upgraded to today's next-test, with BIP 16
972 2012-03-14 05:01:16 forsetifox has quit (Quit: Page closed)
973 2012-03-14 05:01:32 <luke-jr> hmm
974 2012-03-14 05:01:37 <Graet> LOL [Tycho] ftw :)
975 2012-03-14 05:01:38 <luke-jr> next-test doesn't build for win32
976 2012-03-14 05:02:03 forsetifox has joined
977 2012-03-14 05:02:03 <Graet> maybe thats someones devious ploy behind all this
978 2012-03-14 05:02:20 <BlueMatt> [Tycho]: have you moved all your mining to bip16 now?
979 2012-03-14 05:02:36 <[Tycho]> Graet: for example - mine ? :)
980 2012-03-14 05:02:42 <[Tycho]> BlueMatt: almost.
981 2012-03-14 05:02:48 <BlueMatt> why does tycho care about pool hoppers?
982 2012-03-14 05:03:01 <BlueMatt> [Tycho]: so you are doing it tonight?
983 2012-03-14 05:03:02 <Graet> [Tycho], you get accused of so much man, i thought i wouldnt ;)
984 2012-03-14 05:03:07 <Graet> but is it?
985 2012-03-14 05:03:08 <Graet> lmao
986 2012-03-14 05:03:22 <BlueMatt> heh, [Tycho] has a secret mining facility where he is MM
987 2012-03-14 05:03:28 <Graet> hehe
988 2012-03-14 05:03:29 <BlueMatt> no wonder all the blocks are relayed by him
989 2012-03-14 05:03:35 <gringles> [Tycho]'s pool rox
990 2012-03-14 05:04:05 <Graet> i think i'll start relaying ozcoins blocks thru deepbit too, see if we can help ad to the confusion\
991 2012-03-14 05:04:07 <Graet> <.<
992 2012-03-14 05:04:09 <Graet> >.>
993 2012-03-14 05:04:21 <BlueMatt> heh
994 2012-03-14 05:04:38 <BlueMatt> I think we should get luke-jr to start relaying eligius blocks through deepbit
995 2012-03-14 05:04:42 <BlueMatt> just to really fuck with people
996 2012-03-14 05:04:45 <Graet> hehe
997 2012-03-14 05:04:48 <luke-jr> Graet: Eligius did that when our IPv4 was DDoS'd⦠<.<
998 2012-03-14 05:04:53 <BlueMatt> hah
999 2012-03-14 05:04:54 <Graet> why not just ALL the pools
1000 2012-03-14 05:04:55 gribble has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
1001 2012-03-14 05:04:57 twobitcoins_ has joined
1002 2012-03-14 05:04:59 <BlueMatt> ofc
1003 2012-03-14 05:05:11 <luke-jr> hey, I could only connect within the same dc!
1004 2012-03-14 05:05:12 <BlueMatt> lets get EVERYONE to relay through one really random ip
1005 2012-03-14 05:05:17 <[Tycho]> BlueMatt: his blocks are very different.
1006 2012-03-14 05:05:18 <BlueMatt> really obscure
1007 2012-03-14 05:05:42 <BlueMatt> lets just confuse the shit out of blockchain.info
1008 2012-03-14 05:05:58 nanotube has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
1009 2012-03-14 05:07:22 <Graet> luke-jr, you could have uewd our eu nod too ;)
1010 2012-03-14 05:07:36 dr_nix has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
1011 2012-03-14 05:07:36 <Graet> BlueMatt, - i like yoyr style :)
1012 2012-03-14 05:07:38 <Graet> lets :P
1013 2012-03-14 05:07:46 <BlueMatt> now we just have to convince miners...
1014 2012-03-14 05:08:01 <Graet> hehe
1015 2012-03-14 05:08:15 <Graet> well enough jocularity, gotta go do some irl stuff :(
1016 2012-03-14 05:08:18 <Graet> l8rs guys
1017 2012-03-14 05:08:25 <BlueMatt> see ya
1018 2012-03-14 05:08:45 twobitcoins has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
1019 2012-03-14 05:10:21 <luke-jr> Graet: well, I didn't stop bitcoind from connecting whereever it could :p
1020 2012-03-14 05:10:48 <luke-jr> OK, Windows build failure in next-test blamed on mndrix
1021 2012-03-14 05:10:54 <luke-jr> mndrix: fix ur crap! :P
1022 2012-03-14 05:12:45 <BlueMatt> commit?
1023 2012-03-14 05:14:28 dub has joined
1024 2012-03-14 05:14:35 andytoshi has joined
1025 2012-03-14 05:14:54 <luke-jr> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/917
1026 2012-03-14 05:15:00 <captain^k> mod6: eventually, yeah
1027 2012-03-14 05:15:03 dr_nix has joined
1028 2012-03-14 05:15:37 <captain^k> mod6: I then installed 0.6.0 rc3 and started with a new wallet once I got it out of the old one
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1053 2012-03-14 05:45:57 <mod6> captain^k: ahh, cool man. glad it worked out :)
1054 2012-03-14 05:46:29 jrmithdobbs has quit (Quit: quit)
1055 2012-03-14 05:47:24 splatster has quit (Quit: Thisishowitypewhenmyspacebarisbroken)
1056 2012-03-14 05:48:18 <jm9000> BlueMatt, are you here?
1057 2012-03-14 05:48:47 <BlueMatt> yea
1058 2012-03-14 05:51:21 <jm9000> Hey I got kind of a noob question for you. That BIP to add a pong message. Why exactly is there a ping/pong in the first place? Why bother checking if a host is stale (especially on mobile devices where transmissions are costly)? Why not just make the request, and if it times out then assume the connection is stale?
1059 2012-03-14 05:52:19 <jm9000> Actually, maybe that wasn't a BIP, just a change that was made.
1060 2012-03-14 05:54:41 <BlueMatt> pending change
1061 2012-03-14 05:55:22 sgornick has quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
1062 2012-03-14 05:55:24 <BlueMatt> because a node may be overloaded and thus the connection may be fine, so you may want to keep it, but you may not want to continue asking it for blocks or whatever because you know its not gonna respond quickly
1063 2012-03-14 05:57:52 <BlueMatt> arg...wtf valgrind+wine was working fine now it just refuses to start at all...
1064 2012-03-14 05:57:59 <BlueMatt> oh well Ill try again tomorrow...
1065 2012-03-14 05:58:01 <BlueMatt> gnight all
1066 2012-03-14 05:58:18 jrmithdobbs has joined
1067 2012-03-14 05:58:33 <mod6> night
1068 2012-03-14 05:59:18 <jm9000> Interesting, thanks.
1069 2012-03-14 06:01:08 Z0rZ0rZ0r has quit (Quit: Leaving.)
1070 2012-03-14 06:03:35 BlueMatt has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
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1083 2012-03-14 06:38:03 <zeiris> So, if I don't shutdown bitcoin cleanly (such as during a power loss) it comes out with: EXCEPTION: 22DbRunRecoveryException
1084 2012-03-14 06:38:06 <zeiris> DbEnv::open: DB_RUNRECOVERY: Fatal error, run database recovery
1085 2012-03-14 06:38:22 <zeiris> Is there a way to recover, short of deleting the entire downloaded blockchain and starting from scratch?
1086 2012-03-14 06:40:46 twobitcoins has joined
1087 2012-03-14 06:43:41 imsaguy2 has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1088 2012-03-14 06:44:19 archo47 has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
1089 2012-03-14 06:55:46 imsaguy2 has joined
1090 2012-03-14 07:01:08 <captain^k> zeiris: possibly
1091 2012-03-14 07:02:26 PsiliPharm has joined
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1115 2012-03-14 08:27:09 <t7> at what point does the blockchain become 'too big'?
1116 2012-03-14 08:27:15 <t7> 2gb? 5 10 ?
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1121 2012-03-14 08:45:26 <[Tycho]> What is minimum fee for 999 bytes TX in standard bitcoind ?
1122 2012-03-14 08:46:57 <gmaxwell> 0. (assuming it has high enough priority to be free)
1123 2012-03-14 08:49:10 <gmaxwell> (otherwise 0.0005)
1124 2012-03-14 08:50:22 <gmaxwell> (999/1000 = 0)
1125 2012-03-14 08:50:56 ThomasV has joined
1126 2012-03-14 09:02:08 wasabi1 has joined
1127 2012-03-14 09:02:24 <[Tycho]> Will it be 0.001 for 1000 bytes ?
1128 2012-03-14 09:05:00 k9quaint has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
1129 2012-03-14 09:05:37 <gmaxwell> Yes.
1130 2012-03-14 09:06:10 <gmaxwell> (again, if it's not zeroâ it usually is, depends on the inputs)
1131 2012-03-14 09:07:31 <[Tycho]> I'm talking about non-free zone.
1132 2012-03-14 09:07:32 <[Tycho]> Thanks.
1133 2012-03-14 09:14:07 rodrigorcm-afk has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
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1137 2012-03-14 09:29:46 <kish> sipa, problem solved yet?
1138 2012-03-14 09:38:40 TD has quit (Quit: TD)
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1152 2012-03-14 10:46:24 <t7> ;;hrlp
1153 2012-03-14 10:46:25 <gribble> Error: "hrlp" is not a valid command.
1154 2012-03-14 10:47:00 <t7> !facts
1155 2012-03-14 10:47:00 <gribble> To see a nice sortable web view of all factoids, click here: http://gribble.dreamhosters.com/viewfactoids.php?db=%23bitcoin-dev || To see a list of the most popular factoids, run !rank || To search factoids, run !factoids search <yoursearchterm>
1156 2012-03-14 10:56:57 HobGoblin has joined
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1159 2012-03-14 10:57:23 HobGoblin is now known as Guest58816
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1164 2012-03-14 11:50:38 danbri has joined
1165 2012-03-14 11:59:01 <t7> can someone paste the http request for https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/API_reference_%28JSON-RPC%29 curl example please
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1179 2012-03-14 12:40:52 bitcoin-otc-uk has joined
1180 2012-03-14 12:41:38 Wack0 has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
1181 2012-03-14 12:42:26 copumpkin has quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
1182 2012-03-14 12:43:47 <user_> tcatm: hi
1183 2012-03-14 12:44:22 iocor has quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
1184 2012-03-14 12:44:53 Wack0 has joined
1185 2012-03-14 12:49:04 denisx has joined
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1188 2012-03-14 12:55:40 <t7> it takes 3 seconds to get a responce from bitcoind in my webserver
1189 2012-03-14 12:55:49 <t7> but from the console it takes less than 1 seconds
1190 2012-03-14 12:56:05 <upb> bitcoind is not webscale
1191 2012-03-14 12:59:20 Joric_ has quit ()
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1195 2012-03-14 13:12:49 <t7> lol
1196 2012-03-14 13:16:17 <t7> is the rpc any faster?
1197 2012-03-14 13:16:27 denisx_ has joined
1198 2012-03-14 13:19:32 denisx has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
1199 2012-03-14 13:19:32 denisx_ is now known as denisx
1200 2012-03-14 13:19:33 <lianj> did you not use the rpc?
1201 2012-03-14 13:19:47 <t7> no just started a bitcoind process
1202 2012-03-14 13:19:52 <t7> with whatever args
1203 2012-03-14 13:20:01 <t7> then read the stdout
1204 2012-03-14 13:20:15 <lianj> try the rpc
1205 2012-03-14 13:20:31 Qvex23 has joined
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1208 2012-03-14 13:21:42 datagutt has joined
1209 2012-03-14 13:23:00 <t7> should have written this in node
1210 2012-03-14 13:23:06 <t7> no silly parsing todo
1211 2012-03-14 13:24:56 gavinandresen has joined
1212 2012-03-14 13:25:28 <Qvex23> !facts
1213 2012-03-14 13:25:28 <gribble> To see a nice sortable web view of all factoids, click here: http://gribble.dreamhosters.com/viewfactoids.php?db=%23bitcoin-dev || To see a list of the most popular factoids, run !rank || To search factoids, run !factoids search <yoursearchterm>
1214 2012-03-14 13:27:18 archo47 has joined
1215 2012-03-14 13:27:44 <archo47> hey i have a problem installing mcafee internet security 2012, everytime i try to do it, my computer starts freezing after reboot
1216 2012-03-14 13:28:23 <denisx> archo47: wrong channel
1217 2012-03-14 13:28:40 <upb> t7: what do you mean by parsing
1218 2012-03-14 13:28:50 <t7> parsing the json
1219 2012-03-14 13:28:51 <upb> there are json libs for a whole bunch of languages
1220 2012-03-14 13:29:07 <t7> also creating http request in java is about 500 LOC
1221 2012-03-14 13:29:17 <upb> so you dont need to invent any regexp/strstr 'parsing' crap
1222 2012-03-14 13:29:18 Qvex23 has left ()
1223 2012-03-14 13:29:19 <archo47> denisx: oh, what hchannel should i try?
1224 2012-03-14 13:29:40 <denisx> archo47: #windows
1225 2012-03-14 13:29:57 <archo47> ohps my mistake
1226 2012-03-14 13:30:00 <archo47> i thought i was there
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1243 2012-03-14 14:13:12 <gribble> New news from bitcoinrss: sipa opened issue 937 on bitcoin/bitcoin <https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/937>
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1251 2012-03-14 14:35:12 datagutt_ is now known as datagutt
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1259 2012-03-14 14:56:02 <t7> well using rpc has managed to shave a whopping .5 of a second off
1260 2012-03-14 14:56:11 <t7> so responce is still 2.5 :|
1261 2012-03-14 14:58:27 <luke-jr> t7: try the threading patch
1262 2012-03-14 14:59:01 <luke-jr> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/568
1263 2012-03-14 14:59:14 bitcoin-otc-uk has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
1264 2012-03-14 15:02:24 <lianj> webserver is also a pretty generic term
1265 2012-03-14 15:02:48 <t7> play framework application
1266 2012-03-14 15:03:02 iocor has quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
1267 2012-03-14 15:04:25 <t7> im just gonna implement a loading screen
1268 2012-03-14 15:04:33 <lianj> sure its not how you handle the fetching from within there?
1269 2012-03-14 15:04:40 <luke-jr> t7: Also, please comment on how much (if at all) that patch helps, on the pullreq.
1270 2012-03-14 15:04:50 <t7> lianj: 99% i did put a timer inside the method to make sure
1271 2012-03-14 15:05:03 <luke-jr> t7: if you can use keepalive, that should massively improve performance.
1272 2012-03-14 15:05:08 iocor has joined
1273 2012-03-14 15:05:32 andytoshi has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
1274 2012-03-14 15:05:33 <lianj> t7: you do fork out or use some http connection class they provide?
1275 2012-03-14 15:05:45 <lianj> ofc what luke-jr said too
1276 2012-03-14 15:06:03 sacarlson has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
1277 2012-03-14 15:06:17 iocor has quit (Client Quit)
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1279 2012-03-14 15:09:14 <t7> wtf its down to 12ms now
1280 2012-03-14 15:09:17 <t7> what did i do
1281 2012-03-14 15:09:41 <lianj> git diff :P
1282 2012-03-14 15:09:42 <luke-jr> lol
1283 2012-03-14 15:10:56 <luke-jr> sipa: ping
1284 2012-03-14 15:10:59 k9quaint has joined
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1287 2012-03-14 15:11:43 <luke-jr> sipa: d68dcf7 (sipa/minireorg, origin-pull/930/head) Limit the impact of reorganisations on the database
1288 2012-03-14 15:11:51 <luke-jr> sipa: no reason to hold 0.5.3 back for this, I presume?
1289 2012-03-14 15:13:08 <sipa> it's a general improvement, but mostly for people whose database qas messed up by rc1
1290 2012-03-14 15:13:20 <sipa> so, indeed
1291 2012-03-14 15:13:51 <luke-jr> OK, let's go ahead and rename rc4 to final then
1292 2012-03-14 15:13:56 <luke-jr> unless there's anything else I'm missing
1293 2012-03-14 15:14:10 <luke-jr> tcatm: ping
1294 2012-03-14 15:14:34 <t7> i wonder if there are any organisations using bitcoin to move money overseas. I guess bitcoin -> money and back is still an issue
1295 2012-03-14 15:14:38 <tcatm> luke-jr: pong
1296 2012-03-14 15:14:47 bitvampire has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
1297 2012-03-14 15:14:49 <luke-jr> tcatm: will you be around for pullreq on website?
1298 2012-03-14 15:14:50 <luke-jr> nanotube: ping
1299 2012-03-14 15:15:29 <tcatm> luke-jr: Yep. I'll probably be around for the next few hours.
1300 2012-03-14 15:16:05 bitvampire has joined
1301 2012-03-14 15:19:10 SomeoneWeird is now known as SomeoneWeirdzzzz
1302 2012-03-14 15:19:11 <t7> should i be able to crash bitcoin-qt from the daemon or json rpc?
1303 2012-03-14 15:19:17 <t7> because it does every now and then
1304 2012-03-14 15:20:43 cande has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1305 2012-03-14 15:25:34 <Raccoon> Happy Pi Day! 3.14
1306 2012-03-14 15:26:31 <luke-jr> t7: know why?
1307 2012-03-14 15:26:46 <luke-jr> nanotube: http://luke.dashjr.org/programs/bitcoin/files/bitcoin-0.5.3/ is ready for uploading; binaries identical to rc4
1308 2012-03-14 15:30:07 Davincij15 has quit ()
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1311 2012-03-14 15:38:12 <gribble> New news from bitcoinrss: luke-jr opened pull request 17 on bitcoin/bitcoin.org <https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin.org/pull/17>
1312 2012-03-14 15:38:29 <luke-jr> ^ that's still pending on uploads
1313 2012-03-14 15:39:20 danbri has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1314 2012-03-14 15:40:25 mrsy has joined
1315 2012-03-14 15:40:28 <luke-jr> sipa: wanna push the tag to github?
1316 2012-03-14 15:42:07 cande has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
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1319 2012-03-14 15:48:29 <tcatm> luke-jr: Is pull/17 ready to be merged?
1320 2012-03-14 15:49:20 merde has joined
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1322 2012-03-14 15:51:23 datagutt is now known as datagutt|afk
1323 2012-03-14 15:52:45 <t7> http://tomcumming.co.uk :3
1324 2012-03-14 15:53:16 <luke-jr> tcatm: not until nanotube uploads the files to SF
1325 2012-03-14 15:53:28 <luke-jr> (or anyone else, I guess)
1326 2012-03-14 15:53:37 <t7> my name looks like a porn video
1327 2012-03-14 15:55:38 cande has joined
1328 2012-03-14 15:56:28 <tcatm> luke-jr: kk. just highlight me here once it's ready and I'll merge it
1329 2012-03-14 15:57:03 datagutt is now known as afk!~datagutt@unaffiliated/datagutt|datagutt|reallya
1330 2012-03-14 15:57:07 datagutt is now known as reallya!~datagutt@unaffiliated/datagutt|datagutt|afk
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1344 2012-03-14 16:27:32 <forsetifox> luke-jr !
1345 2012-03-14 16:30:08 <forsetifox> The bitcoin client you had me test yesterday corrupted my wallet. =/
1346 2012-03-14 16:30:32 archo48 has quit (Client Quit)
1347 2012-03-14 16:30:35 <BlueMatt> hah
1348 2012-03-14 16:30:50 <BlueMatt> hope you had a backup...
1349 2012-03-14 16:30:54 <forsetifox> Nope.
1350 2012-03-14 16:30:58 <BlueMatt> oh, shit
1351 2012-03-14 16:31:06 <BlueMatt> well to bitcointools you go
1352 2012-03-14 16:31:22 <forsetifox> But there isn't much in there. With all the corrupted wallets I've seen in the past days I decided to keep my bitcoins on Gox.
1353 2012-03-14 16:31:46 <BlueMatt> "all the corrupted wallets I've seen in the past days" running on what builds?
1354 2012-03-14 16:32:16 <forsetifox> 0.6.0beta can open it but not the 0.5.4 (I think).
1355 2012-03-14 16:32:26 <BlueMatt> hmmm...
1356 2012-03-14 16:32:33 beingcasual has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1357 2012-03-14 16:32:35 <BlueMatt> also, we dont have a 0.5.4
1358 2012-03-14 16:32:40 <BlueMatt> we barely have a 0.5.3...
1359 2012-03-14 16:32:46 <gavinandresen> The 0.6 release notes clearly state that 0.6 wallets are incompatible with earlier releases.
1360 2012-03-14 16:33:13 <forsetifox> luke-jr didn't say anything about that. >.>
1361 2012-03-14 16:33:35 <forsetifox> Is there a way to get version number from the bitcoin client without running it?
1362 2012-03-14 16:33:48 <BlueMatt> does right click->properties not show it?
1363 2012-03-14 16:34:01 <gavinandresen> mmmm.... wait.... reading release notes.....
1364 2012-03-14 16:34:22 <forsetifox> Right click the exe and hit details says it was modifed 1.29.2011
1365 2012-03-14 16:34:22 marf_away has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
1366 2012-03-14 16:34:30 <forsetifox> That's MY bitcoin client.
1367 2012-03-14 16:34:33 <BlueMatt> I thought it stored a version in there...
1368 2012-03-14 16:34:36 <BlueMatt> or maybe thats only the setup exde
1369 2012-03-14 16:34:38 <BlueMatt> exe*
1370 2012-03-14 16:34:57 <gavinandresen> (#%@!@#$)(*!#@$ .... release notes don't say that 0.6 wallets may be incompatible with earlier releases.... gotta fix that)
1371 2012-03-14 16:35:03 <jm9000> 0.6.0rc3 is giving me an assertion error on start
1372 2012-03-14 16:35:05 <forsetifox> Oh, it's in the readme. Heh.
1373 2012-03-14 16:35:12 <BlueMatt> jm9000: care to elaborate?
1374 2012-03-14 16:35:13 <forsetifox> 0.5.3 beta.
1375 2012-03-14 16:35:26 <jm9000> Yep.
1376 2012-03-14 16:35:41 <jm9000> http://i.imgur.com/6BMwO.png
1377 2012-03-14 16:35:55 <jm9000> I'm trying to isolate and see if my block chain was corrupted or something.
1378 2012-03-14 16:36:12 <jm9000> Will take a while. Need to setup a new VM for it.
1379 2012-03-14 16:37:09 marf_away has joined
1380 2012-03-14 16:41:12 <jm9000> Is there anything in the client that detects if your wallet was updated by a newer client version to protect against a potential corruption?
1381 2012-03-14 16:41:45 MobiusL has quit (Quit: Leaving)
1382 2012-03-14 16:41:45 <BlueMatt> yea, the wallet has a min version flag in it
1383 2012-03-14 16:41:54 <luke-jr> gavinandresen: may be? I thought it was intentionally prevented now
1384 2012-03-14 16:43:18 * luke-jr wonders if it makes sense to backport compressed pubkeys in read-only mode for 0.4 and 0.5.
1385 2012-03-14 16:44:16 JRWR has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
1386 2012-03-14 16:44:24 <BlueMatt> it doesnt
1387 2012-03-14 16:46:10 merde has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
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1389 2012-03-14 16:46:53 Sedra- has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1390 2012-03-14 16:47:54 <jm9000> Have automatic daily backups of the wallet been considered as a feature for inclusion in the client?
1391 2012-03-14 16:48:17 <BlueMatt> yes
1392 2012-03-14 16:48:29 <BlueMatt> its on the universally-mentally-held todo list
1393 2012-03-14 16:48:48 <jm9000> Ah, I see.
1394 2012-03-14 16:48:55 <Graet> i have a backup of that list
1395 2012-03-14 16:49:08 <BlueMatt> that defeats the purpose...
1396 2012-03-14 16:49:24 <Graet> sigh...wrong again
1397 2012-03-14 16:49:33 * Graet curs up in the corner and weeps
1398 2012-03-14 16:49:39 <Graet> curls*
1399 2012-03-14 16:49:40 <BlueMatt> ;)
1400 2012-03-14 16:49:44 <Graet> ;)
1401 2012-03-14 16:49:50 <BlueMatt> curl, now thats a fun library
1402 2012-03-14 16:50:24 <BlueMatt> though the url "up in the corner and weeps" doesnt make much sense...
1403 2012-03-14 16:50:32 archo47 has joined
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1406 2012-03-14 16:52:25 <luke-jr> jm9000: pretty sure permanent backups will be done sooner tho
1407 2012-03-14 16:52:45 archo47 has quit (Client Quit)
1408 2012-03-14 16:52:45 <luke-jr> jm9000: that is, you backup once and it's good for life
1409 2012-03-14 16:53:18 <jm9000> Snapshots?
1410 2012-03-14 16:53:45 <luke-jr> jm9000: ?
1411 2012-03-14 16:54:11 <jm9000> I don't get what you mean by "permanent backup".
1412 2012-03-14 16:54:36 Nicksasa has quit (Read error: No route to host)
1413 2012-03-14 16:55:29 <luke-jr> jm9000: a backup that doesn't get stale
1414 2012-03-14 16:55:37 MobiusL has joined
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1416 2012-03-14 16:56:51 <jm9000> So everytime a wallet change is recorded, it will update the backup copy as well?
1417 2012-03-14 16:57:14 <luke-jr> ⦠no
1418 2012-03-14 16:57:19 <luke-jr> the wallet simply won't need to change.
1419 2012-03-14 16:58:26 t7 has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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1422 2012-03-14 17:02:46 <jm9000> Totally don't get it. I thought the wallet had to change every time you generated a new address. You must be talking about something way over my head.
1423 2012-03-14 17:03:09 <luke-jr> jm9000: right now it does.
1424 2012-03-14 17:03:25 <luke-jr> jm9000: but with deterministic wallets, you can calculate all the new keys from a single master key
1425 2012-03-14 17:05:25 merde has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
1426 2012-03-14 17:07:17 ForceMajeure_ is now known as ForceMajeure
1427 2012-03-14 17:08:00 <jm9000> I found gmaxwell's forum post on it. Interesting idea.
1428 2012-03-14 17:08:32 marf_away has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
1429 2012-03-14 17:08:52 <jm9000> That wouldn't account for imported keys, but I realize that would likely be a tiny minority of users.
1430 2012-03-14 17:09:47 <BlueMatt> sipa has it implemented in bitcoin-qt, and armory does it too
1431 2012-03-14 17:09:59 merde has joined
1432 2012-03-14 17:10:55 JRWR has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
1433 2012-03-14 17:11:09 <jm9000> That's pretty awesome.
1434 2012-03-14 17:11:53 <jm9000> Is there any plan/timeline for the mainline client to eventually rely on libcoin?
1435 2012-03-14 17:13:31 cande has quit (Quit: Lämnar)
1436 2012-03-14 17:15:16 <BlueMatt> Ive never seen the libcoin author look to get merged
1437 2012-03-14 17:15:21 <BlueMatt> seems like he wants to keep it a fork
1438 2012-03-14 17:17:45 <jrmithdobbs> he obviously does
1439 2012-03-14 17:17:48 <jrmithdobbs> or it wouldn't be gpl3
1440 2012-03-14 17:17:51 <jrmithdobbs> fuck that guy
1441 2012-03-14 17:17:59 <BlueMatt> oh, libcoin is gpl3???
1442 2012-03-14 17:18:00 <BlueMatt> damn
1443 2012-03-14 17:18:05 <jrmithdobbs> ya
1444 2012-03-14 17:18:18 <jrmithdobbs> i sent him a nasty email when he kept spamming the list every other day with release updates
1445 2012-03-14 17:18:31 <jrmithdobbs> to keep his dirtied jailed code to his damned self (was actually nicer, w/e)
1446 2012-03-14 17:18:33 denisx has quit (Quit: denisx)
1447 2012-03-14 17:19:18 <jrmithdobbs> jm9000: so in short: thanks to the guy who forked it being an asshole it will never get merged for legal reasons
1448 2012-03-14 17:19:35 <jm9000> It seems like a move to libcoin would be beneficial in the long run for developers who want to utilize libcoin. Assuming libcoin was proven to be reliable, of course.
1449 2012-03-14 17:19:43 <jm9000> jrmithdobbs: Well, that sucks.
1450 2012-03-14 17:19:44 <jrmithdobbs> sure
1451 2012-03-14 17:19:44 <BlueMatt> if he wants to, he can relicense you know...
1452 2012-03-14 17:19:48 <jrmithdobbs> but we can't use that libcoin
1453 2012-03-14 17:19:58 <BlueMatt> jm9000: meh, bitcoin will slowly get cleaned up
1454 2012-03-14 17:20:10 <jrmithdobbs> BlueMatt: he could, but he didn't even respond to me so I think he has zero interest in playing ball
1455 2012-03-14 17:20:22 gavinandresen has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1456 2012-03-14 17:20:22 <BlueMatt> or he doesnt respond to nasty emails ;)
1457 2012-03-14 17:20:29 <jrmithdobbs> it wasn't really that nasty
1458 2012-03-14 17:20:33 <jrmithdobbs> exageration
1459 2012-03-14 17:20:51 <luke-jr> GPL3 is more permissive than libbitcoin's AGPL3
1460 2012-03-14 17:21:01 <jrmithdobbs> oh that's right, it's agpl3 so like 5x worse
1461 2012-03-14 17:21:05 <luke-jr> but I agree there should remain a MIT licensed impl
1462 2012-03-14 17:21:05 <BlueMatt> libbitcoin is agpl3???
1463 2012-03-14 17:21:11 <jrmithdobbs> yes
1464 2012-03-14 17:21:25 <jrmithdobbs> it's completely worthless code that you cannot read without polluting your IP pool and opening yourself up to lawsuits
1465 2012-03-14 17:21:43 <jrmithdobbs> related: someone tell sipa to stop admitting to reading it ;p
1466 2012-03-14 17:21:45 <luke-jr> jrmithdobbs: maybe if you're a proprietary developer
1467 2012-03-14 17:22:16 <jrmithdobbs> luke-jr: that whole area is fuzzy with normal gpl2/3, it's a completely unknown gray area with agpl*
1468 2012-03-14 17:22:31 <luke-jr> only reason to avoid GPL IMO is to let MIT software link to it
1469 2012-03-14 17:22:53 <jrmithdobbs> technically anything similar after being exposed to the agpl3 code is a "derivitive work" (or could be argued to be, I'm not saying they would win, I'm saying it could cause legal hassle)
1470 2012-03-14 17:22:57 <luke-jr> jrmithdobbs: not completely, no.
1471 2012-03-14 17:22:59 <BlueMatt> arg, now valgind is segfaulting...wtf???
1472 2012-03-14 17:23:24 <luke-jr> jrmithdobbs: genjix had a fairly long discussion with FSF about AGPL and how it could work for libbitcoin
1473 2012-03-14 17:23:54 <jrmithdobbs> BlueMatt: this was the "nasty" email, btw
1474 2012-03-14 17:23:57 <jrmithdobbs> Could you please take this to your own list or limit your posts to sporadic meaningful updates please?
1475 2012-03-14 17:24:00 <jrmithdobbs> Discussion of your forked and gpl3'ed code isn't really on topic.
1476 2012-03-14 17:24:13 <jrmithdobbs> BlueMatt: in response to his natpmp announcement
1477 2012-03-14 17:24:30 <jrmithdobbs> (grammar mistakes retained)
1478 2012-03-14 17:24:37 <luke-jr> jrmithdobbs: I disagree.
1479 2012-03-14 17:24:44 <luke-jr> jrmithdobbs: the list is for bitcoin development, not a single client
1480 2012-03-14 17:24:46 <jrmithdobbs> luke-jr: at the time he was posting like every other day
1481 2012-03-14 17:25:04 <jrmithdobbs> luke-jr: I don't mind bitcoinj/etc announcements that TD does because he actually just does meaningful announcements
1482 2012-03-14 17:25:11 <jrmithdobbs> the guy was sending an email on like every commit it seemed
1483 2012-03-14 17:25:12 <jrmithdobbs> haha
1484 2012-03-14 17:25:15 <luke-jr> >_<
1485 2012-03-14 17:25:25 <luke-jr> he needs to setup CIA
1486 2012-03-14 17:25:39 <jrmithdobbs> the guy has zero interest in actually participating
1487 2012-03-14 17:25:39 <luke-jr> #bitcoin-commits works well for every-commit announcemnets :P
1488 2012-03-14 17:25:47 <jrmithdobbs> afaict
1489 2012-03-14 17:26:00 <luke-jr> hmm
1490 2012-03-14 17:26:08 <luke-jr> should have asked gavin to upload 0.5.3 while he was in here
1491 2012-03-14 17:26:24 <jrmithdobbs> anyways, i don't think anything gpl3 especially anything agpl3 belongs on the bitcoin-dev list since most other bitcoin projects will not be able to use it
1492 2012-03-14 17:26:39 <luke-jr> jrmithdobbs: no reason they can't use it.
1493 2012-03-14 17:26:39 <jrmithdobbs> so it's pretty much just spam
1494 2012-03-14 17:26:53 <jrmithdobbs> luke-jr: can't link against it?
1495 2012-03-14 17:26:59 <luke-jr> jrmithdobbs: sure they can
1496 2012-03-14 17:27:04 <luke-jr> just have to stick to GPL terms
1497 2012-03-14 17:27:25 <jrmithdobbs> right, they have to effectively make their project gpl (I know there are semantics that make that not entirely true, but c'mon)
1498 2012-03-14 17:27:31 <luke-jr> which is fine.
1499 2012-03-14 17:27:36 <jrmithdobbs> disagree
1500 2012-03-14 17:27:48 <jrmithdobbs> and I guess we'll just have to agree to on that point
1501 2012-03-14 17:28:10 <luke-jr> jrmithdobbs: not everyone disagrees, so it's still on-topic.
1502 2012-03-14 17:28:20 <luke-jr> just because you choose not to use it, doesn't mean people *can't*
1503 2012-03-14 17:29:11 <jrmithdobbs> maybe "can't" was strong and "can't without relicensing their code" is more accurate
1504 2012-03-14 17:29:16 <jm9000> So on that 0.6.0rc3 assert crash, it looks like it *might* be related to a corrupted block chain. Interestingly, 0.5.2 is not crashing.
1505 2012-03-14 17:30:42 <luke-jr> jrmithdobbs: unless their code is already GPL-compatible
1506 2012-03-14 17:30:50 <luke-jr> jm9000: 0.5.3?
1507 2012-03-14 17:30:51 <jrmithdobbs> luke-jr: which most bitcoin-related code isn't
1508 2012-03-14 17:30:56 <jrmithdobbs> which was my point
1509 2012-03-14 17:31:02 <luke-jr> jrmithdobbs: I disagree.
1510 2012-03-14 17:31:13 <luke-jr> most bitcoin-related code is at least GPL
1511 2012-03-14 17:31:20 <jrmithdobbs> luke-jr: example?
1512 2012-03-14 17:31:24 <luke-jr> jm9000: http://luke.dashjr.org/programs/bitcoin/files/bitcoind-0.5.3/
1513 2012-03-14 17:31:30 <luke-jr> jrmithdobbs: virtually all poolservers
1514 2012-03-14 17:31:39 <jrmithdobbs> luke-jr: what else
1515 2012-03-14 17:31:44 <luke-jr> shrug
1516 2012-03-14 17:31:46 <BlueMatt> can we not have religious debates on here?
1517 2012-03-14 17:32:07 * jrmithdobbs supresses the snarky comment re: banning luke then
1518 2012-03-14 17:32:12 * jrmithdobbs runs
1519 2012-03-14 17:32:45 <Habbie> jrmithdobbs, you do know that the MIT License is GPL-compatible?
1520 2012-03-14 17:32:58 <luke-jr> jrmithdobbs: I think bitcoind is the *only* MIT-licensed project in Bitcoin
1521 2012-03-14 17:33:05 <jrmithdobbs> Habbie: it is not gpl3 compatible
1522 2012-03-14 17:33:13 <jrmithdobbs> Habbie: and is most definitely agpl3 compatible
1523 2012-03-14 17:33:15 <luke-jr> jrmithdobbs: yes it is
1524 2012-03-14 17:33:17 <Habbie> ah
1525 2012-03-14 17:33:20 <jrmithdobbs> err not
1526 2012-03-14 17:33:36 <luke-jr> Android MtGox widget is Apache-2
1527 2012-03-14 17:33:43 <jrmithdobbs> luke-jr: it's not inherently because MIT says nothing about patent rights
1528 2012-03-14 17:33:46 <luke-jr> ABE is AGPL-3
1529 2012-03-14 17:34:03 JRWR has joined
1530 2012-03-14 17:34:10 <jrmithdobbs> so there can be MIT code subject to patents (that the author is or isn't aware of) which make makes it defacto incompatible
1531 2012-03-14 17:34:50 <luke-jr> bitcointools and bitcoind are the only MIT-licensed projects I'm aware of
1532 2012-03-14 17:34:55 <luke-jr> everything else is mostly GPL/AGPL
1533 2012-03-14 17:35:58 t7 has joined
1534 2012-03-14 17:37:29 <jrmithdobbs> luke-jr: ok so pushpool and abe are gpl, every python/ruby/etc lib i can find is MIT, bitcoinj is apache2 (which is one-way compat just like mit)
1535 2012-03-14 17:38:01 <luke-jr> jrmithdobbs: I only looked at *active* projects
1536 2012-03-14 17:38:07 <jrmithdobbs> i did too
1537 2012-03-14 17:38:08 <luke-jr> ie, with commits in the past 2 months
1538 2012-03-14 17:38:11 <jm9000> BlueMatt: I tried out 0.5.3 and it also did not crash.
1539 2012-03-14 17:38:26 <jrmithdobbs> luke-jr: eg, ruby lib i'm looking at: authored 7 days ago
1540 2012-03-14 17:38:28 <jrmithdobbs> was last commit
1541 2012-03-14 17:38:47 <jm9000> How would I verify if my blockchain is corrupted?
1542 2012-03-14 17:39:06 <jrmithdobbs> luke-jr: it is a higher percentage than I thought, but it isn't a majority
1543 2012-03-14 17:39:26 <luke-jr> jrmithdobbs: Ruby sucks anyhow
1544 2012-03-14 17:39:40 <luke-jr> jm9000: I'm inclined to doubt it, if 0.5.3 works
1545 2012-03-14 17:42:08 <BlueMatt> jm9000: run with -checkblocks maybe
1546 2012-03-14 17:42:20 <BlueMatt> wont check everything, but may identify some issues
1547 2012-03-14 17:42:48 splatster has joined
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1549 2012-03-14 17:44:00 <jm9000> That in both the daemon and qt?
1550 2012-03-14 17:44:58 <BlueMatt> should be
1551 2012-03-14 17:45:59 <jm9000> The QT usage popup exceeds my screen height. Couldn't see if it did or not.
1552 2012-03-14 17:45:59 <BlueMatt> if the first node you connect to has out of date blocks, and then subsequent nodes have the latest chain, you may not start downloading...
1553 2012-03-14 17:45:59 Clipse has joined
1554 2012-03-14 17:46:04 <BlueMatt> what did debug.log say?
1555 2012-03-14 17:46:32 <jrmithdobbs> looks like general p2p network health has finally stabilized since people started upgrading
1556 2012-03-14 17:46:56 <jrmithdobbs> my node's maxing between 40ish to 60ish connections instead of the old 400-500 ;p
1557 2012-03-14 17:48:00 <BlueMatt> that doesnt really mean anything
1558 2012-03-14 17:49:59 barmstrong has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1559 2012-03-14 17:51:53 booo has quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
1560 2012-03-14 17:51:54 <BlueMatt> arg, now I cant even reproduce the damn rpc crash...wtf????
1561 2012-03-14 17:54:49 <jm9000> BlueMatt: This is from 0.5.3 debug.log: Loading block index... LoadBlockIndex(): hashBestChain=00000000000003dbba54 height=135648 block index 31918ms
1562 2012-03-14 17:54:57 <jm9000> Is that what I'm looking for?
1563 2012-03-14 17:55:07 <jm9000> did bitcoind.exe -debug -checkblocks
1564 2012-03-14 17:55:14 <BlueMatt> one sec...
1565 2012-03-14 17:56:55 <BlueMatt> wtf? checkblocks doesnt do much of anything anymore...I could have sworn it did something useful...Im so confused...
1566 2012-03-14 17:57:02 <BlueMatt> what does the bitcointools equivalent show you
1567 2012-03-14 17:57:08 <BlueMatt> I know there is one of those...
1568 2012-03-14 17:57:29 <sipa> BlueMatt: it checks everything
1569 2012-03-14 17:57:43 <BlueMatt> grep -r -n checkblocks src shows one line
1570 2012-03-14 17:57:45 <sipa> in the main chain
1571 2012-03-14 17:57:50 <BlueMatt> oh, yea it does...
1572 2012-03-14 17:57:59 ThomasV_ has joined
1573 2012-03-14 17:58:00 <BlueMatt> ok, well still if you loaded the chain fine...
1574 2012-03-14 17:58:12 <jm9000> I did 0.6.0 -debug -checkblocks also. It said about the same thing in debug.log, then crashed.
1575 2012-03-14 17:59:04 <BlueMatt> well, still what does bitcointools show you when you do its checkblock thinggy
1576 2012-03-14 18:03:00 barmstrong has joined
1577 2012-03-14 18:04:21 peter345978 has joined
1578 2012-03-14 18:04:41 <BlueMatt> after that, anyway you can git bisect?
1579 2012-03-14 18:07:19 <jm9000> I'm working on getting bitcointools running. I don't think I'll be able to bisect. I haven't gotten it to compile on Windows yet.
1580 2012-03-14 18:07:28 <peter345978> Now open for visitors: www.BTCLook.com a block, transaction viewer with the whole block chain in a redis database. Interactive network graphs, HTML5, AJAX goodness.
1581 2012-03-14 18:08:35 <jm9000> I have an isolated "bad" blockchain though. When I use a known good chain, the error doesn't occur.
1582 2012-03-14 18:09:16 andytoshi has joined
1583 2012-03-14 18:09:21 <jm9000> The "bad" chain hasn't crashed 0.5.3 yet.
1584 2012-03-14 18:11:05 superman2016 has joined
1585 2012-03-14 18:14:40 TD has joined
1586 2012-03-14 18:16:19 <Joric> is block size limited?
1587 2012-03-14 18:16:25 TD_ has joined
1588 2012-03-14 18:16:32 <BlueMatt> yes
1589 2012-03-14 18:17:04 <Joric> to what extent
1590 2012-03-14 18:17:14 Diablo-D3 has joined
1591 2012-03-14 18:17:16 <BlueMatt> 10MB limit iirc
1592 2012-03-14 18:17:40 <Joric> thanks
1593 2012-03-14 18:19:44 <Joric> i'm writting blockchain parser thought maybe it would be faster to preload blocks so they won't need extra seekg for calculating hashes
1594 2012-03-14 18:20:17 <jm9000> BlueMatt: What command in bitcointools do I need to use? I'm not seeing much in readme.txt.
1595 2012-03-14 18:20:19 <BlueMatt> that limit may eventually change...
1596 2012-03-14 18:20:20 TD has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
1597 2012-03-14 18:20:20 TD_ is now known as TD
1598 2012-03-14 18:20:43 andytoshi has quit (Quit: WeeChat 0.3.5)
1599 2012-03-14 18:20:47 <BlueMatt> dbdump.py --check-block-chain
1600 2012-03-14 18:20:50 <Diablo-D3> Joric: preloading would help I think
1601 2012-03-14 18:21:23 <Diablo-D3> btw, question
1602 2012-03-14 18:21:27 <Diablo-D3> does anyone know if bdb use mmap?
1603 2012-03-14 18:21:51 <Joric> etotheipi_ loads blockchain completely into the ram i'm trying std:map ) for me it takes ~2 minutes load a file and reindex blocks/transactions/addresses in memory
1604 2012-03-14 18:22:53 <mod6> this may help Diablo-D3? http://www.mathematik.uni-ulm.de/help/BerkeleyDB/ref/env/region.html
1605 2012-03-14 18:23:53 <Diablo-D3> hrm
1606 2012-03-14 18:23:56 <Diablo-D3> if Im reading this right
1607 2012-03-14 18:23:59 <Diablo-D3> I asked the wrong question
1608 2012-03-14 18:24:01 <mod6> this is better I think: https://forums.oracle.com/forums/thread.jspa?threadID=526826
1609 2012-03-14 18:24:09 <Diablo-D3> the question I think is
1610 2012-03-14 18:24:20 <Diablo-D3> is bitcoin using bdb correctly
1611 2012-03-14 18:24:43 <Diablo-D3> because mmap is basically always the fastest way to read large files if you're linearly streaming them
1612 2012-03-14 18:25:01 iocor has quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
1613 2012-03-14 18:25:05 pickett has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
1614 2012-03-14 18:25:27 <jm9000> BlueMatt: Getting this for the "bad" blockchain "ERROR:root:Couldn't open blkindex.dat/main. Try quitting any running Bitcoin apps."
1615 2012-03-14 18:25:32 <jm9000> No Bitcoin running.
1616 2012-03-14 18:26:00 <BlueMatt> :(
1617 2012-03-14 18:26:14 <BlueMatt> can you upload a tar.xz of the chain somewhere so I can bisect later?
1618 2012-03-14 18:26:16 agricocb has quit (Quit: Leaving.)
1619 2012-03-14 18:26:28 <jm9000> Yeah, I'll do that.
1620 2012-03-14 18:27:04 vigilyn has joined
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1626 2012-03-14 18:31:01 <jm9000> BlueMatt: After 0.6.0 crashed I think the DB didn't close properly or something. I opened and closed 0.5.3, then ran dbdump again, and it gave the genesis block message.
1627 2012-03-14 18:31:25 FACEFOX has joined
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1629 2012-03-14 18:31:44 FACEFOX has joined
1630 2012-03-14 18:31:44 <jm9000> 0.6.0 still crashes, I think. Verifying that now.
1631 2012-03-14 18:31:44 FACEFOX has quit (Excess Flood)
1632 2012-03-14 18:32:37 d4de has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1633 2012-03-14 18:32:41 FACEFOX has joined
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1640 2012-03-14 18:42:51 <BlueMatt> yay dr.memory (win32 equiv of valgrind) gives me >10k errors :)
1641 2012-03-14 18:44:44 <luke-jr> sigh
1642 2012-03-14 18:45:54 <jm9000> BlueMatt: I'm uploading the blockchain for you now. I recommend that you revert to this blockchain before each test. When a client does successfully load, it seems like it can "fix" it so 0.6.0 doesn't crash anymore. Do you want a GitHub issue logged as well?
1643 2012-03-14 18:46:15 <BlueMatt> na, Ill look into it
1644 2012-03-14 18:46:19 <BlueMatt> we dont have an issue yet ;)
1645 2012-03-14 18:46:22 <Joric> check out transactions visualization at http://www.btclook.com
1646 2012-03-14 18:46:26 <BlueMatt> (might not be till tomorrow though)
1647 2012-03-14 18:46:58 <forsetifox> They are neat and fun to drag around. =3
1648 2012-03-14 18:47:20 denisx has joined
1649 2012-03-14 18:47:31 <Joric> i want this for all addresses!
1650 2012-03-14 18:48:46 archo47 has joined
1651 2012-03-14 18:49:08 tobtc has joined
1652 2012-03-14 18:50:23 <Joric> it's grouped by transactions for now it would be cool to have an interactive propagation network grouped by addresses
1653 2012-03-14 18:50:46 <peter345978> Joric: yes, we're working on that.
1654 2012-03-14 18:51:12 <peter345978> That's mode would be truly useful for tracking things down, as it were.
1655 2012-03-14 18:52:02 rodrigorcm-afk is now known as rodrigorcm
1656 2012-03-14 18:52:06 <tobtc> btc
1657 2012-03-14 18:52:26 larsivi has joined
1658 2012-03-14 18:53:11 <Joric> first historical transaction ) http://www.btclook.com/#/txn/4a5e1e4baab89f3a32518a88c31bc87f618f76673e2cc77ab2127b7afdeda33b
1659 2012-03-14 18:53:12 peter345978 has left ()
1660 2012-03-14 18:53:12 <luke-jr> peter345978: why ฿ instead of B⦠?
1661 2012-03-14 18:53:19 peter345978 has joined
1662 2012-03-14 18:53:34 pusle has joined
1663 2012-03-14 18:53:36 <BlueMatt> why is it either?
1664 2012-03-14 18:53:46 <BlueMatt> why steal what is it Bhat?
1665 2012-03-14 18:54:04 <Joric> oh it's canvas, i thought it's flash for some reason
1666 2012-03-14 18:54:15 <Joric> even svg
1667 2012-03-14 18:54:20 <peter345978> It's SVG. Generated by d3.js
1668 2012-03-14 18:54:33 userihh has joined
1669 2012-03-14 18:54:37 <luke-jr> B⦠is the standard Bitcoin symbol
1670 2012-03-14 18:54:43 forsetifox_ has joined
1671 2012-03-14 18:55:00 <peter345978> I didn't know it had been settled.
1672 2012-03-14 18:55:11 <iz> what if i want to refer to 1024 bytes?
1673 2012-03-14 18:55:14 chao has joined
1674 2012-03-14 18:55:21 <iz> and i don't want to type bytes
1675 2012-03-14 18:55:23 <luke-jr> peter345978: I didn't know it was really disputed :P
1676 2012-03-14 18:55:30 forsetifox has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
1677 2012-03-14 18:55:32 <luke-jr> iz: then use a normal letter B?
1678 2012-03-14 18:55:41 <peter345978> Been months, but on the wiki there was like a big table and all
1679 2012-03-14 18:55:53 luke-jr has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1680 2012-03-14 18:56:11 luke-jr has joined
1681 2012-03-14 18:56:11 <peter345978> https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Bitcoin_symbol
1682 2012-03-14 18:56:30 <Joric> hm never though about that i could try 3d interactivity using SVG ) only tried layers so far http://pastehtml.com/view/brceavpyv.html
1683 2012-03-14 18:56:43 <iz> lol, this page
1684 2012-03-14 18:56:44 <luke-jr> B⦠has been part of all the mainline graphics since Satoshi afaik
1685 2012-03-14 18:57:12 <userihh> tcatm: you there?
1686 2012-03-14 18:57:22 <Joric> free arrows / antialiasing )
1687 2012-03-14 18:57:43 <tcatm> userihh: yes
1688 2012-03-14 18:57:48 manifold has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1689 2012-03-14 18:58:29 <userihh> tcatm: i think i like more the other mockup samuel did
1690 2012-03-14 18:58:42 <tcatm> Which mockup?
1691 2012-03-14 18:58:57 <userihh> tcatm: will find it
1692 2012-03-14 18:59:51 <userihh> tcatm: cl.ly/3r3r0Y1x1u2U2G0P470G
1693 2012-03-14 18:59:54 TD_ has joined
1694 2012-03-14 19:00:22 <userihh> tcatm: if he works on it, add whie background
1695 2012-03-14 19:00:39 <userihh> tcatm: the icons...
1696 2012-03-14 19:01:37 <tcatm> Care to write some code to make it real? :)
1697 2012-03-14 19:01:38 Joric has quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
1698 2012-03-14 19:02:10 datagutt has quit (Quit: kthxbai)
1699 2012-03-14 19:02:27 <userihh> tcatm: i don't know codind. is it very hard make something çike that real
1700 2012-03-14 19:02:32 <userihh> ?
1701 2012-03-14 19:02:39 <userihh> like
1702 2012-03-14 19:03:52 <tcatm> Well, it takes time. Reading documentation, writing code, testing it, fixing bugs.
1703 2012-03-14 19:04:05 TD has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
1704 2012-03-14 19:04:05 TD_ is now known as TD
1705 2012-03-14 19:04:11 <jm9000> BlueMatt: http://jmack.s3.amazonaws.com/Bitcoin.7z
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1707 2012-03-14 19:04:46 <userihh> tcatm: understand
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1709 2012-03-14 19:05:27 <BlueMatt> jm9000: thanks, Ill grab it later and take a look sometime this week
1710 2012-03-14 19:05:51 tobtc has left ()
1711 2012-03-14 19:06:24 <tcatm> userihh: I like the colors better, though.
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1714 2012-03-14 19:07:55 <userihh> tcatm: on the mockup we were working, i don't like the "blue" sidebar. i don't think combine with for example the b orange icon
1715 2012-03-14 19:08:29 peter345978 has left ()
1716 2012-03-14 19:08:48 <userihh> tcatm: i don't think combine green that we will have on overview tab
1717 2012-03-14 19:09:40 <userihh> tcatm: i think this new mockup from samuel, with white background. will be good
1718 2012-03-14 19:10:31 <userihh> tcatm: white color combine with any element
1719 2012-03-14 19:11:13 <userihh> tcatm: and the top image with total of btc the B icon is amazing
1720 2012-03-14 19:11:22 <userihh> just my opinion
1721 2012-03-14 19:13:04 <tcatm> That's a neat idea, indeed.
1722 2012-03-14 19:14:26 BlueMatt has quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
1723 2012-03-14 19:14:43 <userihh> tcatm: if you like it and have time to code it. please tell samuel to work on this his new mockup
1724 2012-03-14 19:18:26 booo has joined
1725 2012-03-14 19:24:33 <andytoshi> eahntuea
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1732 2012-03-14 19:38:51 <userihh> tcatm: what is your opinion?
1733 2012-03-14 19:39:45 <userihh> tcatm: better work on this new mockup?
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1742 2012-03-14 20:16:31 <Raccoon> You like Bitcoin? You should know about Cryptography. Take the (absolutely) FREE Stanford University Online Cryptography Class and learn a thing or two. Lectures started yesturday. Sign up and watch them. https://www.coursera.org/crypto/auth/welcome (They even discuss digital currencies)
1743 2012-03-14 20:20:01 Ahimoth has quit (Excess Flood)
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1747 2012-03-14 20:25:47 <upb> hmmmm _
1748 2012-03-14 20:25:50 <upb> are you sure ?
1749 2012-03-14 20:35:22 knotwork has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1750 2012-03-14 20:38:12 vigilyn has left ("Leaving")
1751 2012-03-14 20:45:59 <luke-jr> Raccoon: quit spamming
1752 2012-03-14 20:46:13 <Raccoon> it's not spam if it's not spam.
1753 2012-03-14 20:46:36 molecular has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
1754 2012-03-14 20:46:53 <Eliel> It's spam if it's spam :P
1755 2012-03-14 20:47:10 <Raccoon> fortunately i don't spam. :)
1756 2012-03-14 20:47:19 <gwillen> I like the class, but that seemed very spammy to me
1757 2012-03-14 20:47:42 <Raccoon> gwillen: seemed informative distribution of information.
1758 2012-03-14 20:47:49 <Raccoon> in a very topic oriented channel
1759 2012-03-14 20:48:35 <gwillen> you should be aware that messages containing the capitalized word FREE generally feel spammy
1760 2012-03-14 20:48:37 <Raccoon> if you're going to dev for anything bitcoin related, you need to understand how to use crypto functions properly
1761 2012-03-14 20:48:44 <gwillen> so you should probably not do that in the future
1762 2012-03-14 20:48:53 <gwillen> if indeed you are just trying to spread the joy of cryptography, and not advertising anything
1763 2012-03-14 20:48:58 <Raccoon> gwillen: i cannot control how others abuse the english language.
1764 2012-03-14 20:49:18 <luke-jr> Raccoon: are you offering us free admission to the class?
1765 2012-03-14 20:49:18 <Eliel> yes, the language style just reeks of advertisement.
1766 2012-03-14 20:49:24 <Raccoon> luke-jr: no.
1767 2012-03-14 20:49:34 <luke-jr> ok, so it's commercial spam
1768 2012-03-14 20:49:38 <gwillen> luke-jr: I mean, the class is actually free
1769 2012-03-14 20:49:41 <gwillen> luke-jr: I'm taking it
1770 2012-03-14 20:49:41 <Raccoon> it's non-commercial
1771 2012-03-14 20:49:44 <gwillen> it's very real
1772 2012-03-14 20:49:54 <luke-jr> â¦
1773 2012-03-14 20:50:00 <gwillen> Raccoon is not offering it; it is in fact offered by coursera
1774 2012-03-14 20:50:03 <gwillen> which is an offshoot of stanford
1775 2012-03-14 20:50:08 <gwillen> although I don't think it's affiliated anymore
1776 2012-03-14 20:50:13 <luke-jr> so is the class actually free?
1777 2012-03-14 20:50:16 <gwillen> yes
1778 2012-03-14 20:50:18 <iz> yeah
1779 2012-03-14 20:50:25 <luke-jr> so no flash crap?
1780 2012-03-14 20:50:25 <iz> they are legit, i'm in a few other ones
1781 2012-03-14 20:50:27 <Raccoon> if I said it, it's going to be true.
1782 2012-03-14 20:50:32 <gwillen> oh, apparently the crypto course really is a stanford course
1783 2012-03-14 20:50:37 <gwillen> but coursera itself is not stanford affiliated
1784 2012-03-14 20:50:48 <gwillen> luke-jr: I don't know about flash crap; the player is probably flash
1785 2012-03-14 20:50:51 <gwillen> I haven't watched the lectures yet
1786 2012-03-14 20:50:55 <luke-jr> Flash is non-free
1787 2012-03-14 20:50:58 <gwillen> oh fuck off
1788 2012-03-14 20:50:58 <Raccoon> the player is MP4
1789 2012-03-14 20:51:05 <Raccoon> you can download the files direct
1790 2012-03-14 20:51:43 <Raccoon> i just alt-click all of the download links
1791 2012-03-14 20:52:03 <Raccoon> and i just checked, they use html5 video tags
1792 2012-03-14 20:52:11 <upb> but is it kosher?
1793 2012-03-14 20:52:19 <upb> because nonkosher is nonfree
1794 2012-03-14 20:52:21 <Raccoon> no. i still have my foreskin
1795 2012-03-14 20:52:28 <upb> :D
1796 2012-03-14 20:52:41 <gwillen> ladies and gentlemen, #bitcoin-dev.
1797 2012-03-14 20:52:45 <gwillen> ;-)
1798 2012-03-14 20:55:40 <Raccoon> Check out the Stanford Crypto Class lectures at https://www.coursera.org/crypto/auth/welcome ... they discuss modern uses of crptography including digital currencies like Bitcoin. Well worth the watch. (is that better?)
1799 2012-03-14 20:55:55 <gwillen> I don't understand why you talk like an advertisement
1800 2012-03-14 20:56:14 <gwillen> but the removal of FREE is an improvement ;-)
1801 2012-03-14 20:56:39 <Raccoon> You mean because I put it all into 1 line of text?
1802 2012-03-14 20:56:49 <Raccoon> OMG LOL!
1803 2012-03-14 20:56:50 <Raccoon> ps://www.coursera.org/crypto/auth/welcome
1804 2012-03-14 20:56:57 <Raccoon> That's awesome yo
1805 2012-03-14 20:58:37 molecular has joined
1806 2012-03-14 20:59:14 <upb> Hello dear Sir. I am Colonel Rac Oon from Bombai, husband of late World Bank, Bombai Office, Regional Director. As you may have read on the news, my wife died of a Crypto Class accident. We are offering you are Business Opportunity with Profit Sharing Agreement that needs utmost confidentiality.
1807 2012-03-14 20:59:33 JRWR has quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
1808 2012-03-14 20:59:54 <Raccoon> lol
1809 2012-03-14 21:00:17 <phantomcircuit> Raccoon, dude i get it but stop posting that fucking link
1810 2012-03-14 21:00:19 <phantomcircuit> lol
1811 2012-03-14 21:00:34 <Raccoon> i should be more cryptic!
1812 2012-03-14 21:04:21 userihh is now known as Yeame
1813 2012-03-14 21:04:26 <BlueMatt> phantomcircuit: which link? this one: https://www.coursera.org/crypto/auth/welcome ?
1814 2012-03-14 21:05:42 <phantomcircuit> yes
1815 2012-03-14 21:05:43 <phantomcircuit> it's nice
1816 2012-03-14 21:05:47 <phantomcircuit> but lol too much
1817 2012-03-14 21:07:12 <Raccoon> yeah. doesn't need /auth/welcome
1818 2012-03-14 21:07:22 <Raccoon> https://www.coursera.org/crypto !!!11-oen
1819 2012-03-14 21:13:50 rodrigorcm is now known as rodrigorcm-af
1820 2012-03-14 21:13:52 rodrigorcm-af is now known as rodrigorcm-afk
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1824 2012-03-14 21:36:10 <denisx> http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/btcmp-view/id504682258?mt=8
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1828 2012-03-14 21:38:42 <denisx> ups, that was not for this channel
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1840 2012-03-14 21:48:17 Samuel has joined
1841 2012-03-14 21:49:08 <Yeame> hi samuel
1842 2012-03-14 21:49:32 <Samuel> Hello. I have half a dozen new adjustment ideas to the sidebar: http://cl.ly/2A0Z0T031x3W0c3R3b1V
1843 2012-03-14 21:49:49 <Yeame> samuel: i think this is the way to go cl.ly/3r3r0Y1x1u2U2G0P470G/o
1844 2012-03-14 21:51:31 <Yeame> samuel: i really like the new concept of the screenshot i send you
1845 2012-03-14 21:51:45 <Yeame> without icons on sidebar
1846 2012-03-14 21:51:49 <Samuel> Yeah, I like that one too but we have already done a lot of work on the current one... maybe we should bring it up to more people. If people think we should change then maybe we can do it!
1847 2012-03-14 21:52:05 <Samuel> Yeame: Thanks
1848 2012-03-14 21:52:24 <Yeame> samuel: i chatted with tcatm about it
1849 2012-03-14 21:52:31 <Samuel> Yeame: I did that one too, if you didn't know.
1850 2012-03-14 21:52:38 <Samuel> What did he say?
1851 2012-03-14 21:52:41 JRWR has joined
1852 2012-03-14 21:52:49 <Yeame> he liked
1853 2012-03-14 21:53:00 <Samuel> I like it too
1854 2012-03-14 21:53:16 <Samuel> Its my favorite of all the concepts I've made so far
1855 2012-03-14 21:53:20 <Yeame> samuel: the orange icon on top is great
1856 2012-03-14 21:53:32 <Yeame> with big wallet number
1857 2012-03-14 21:53:34 <Samuel> Thanks, I like it too
1858 2012-03-14 21:53:51 <Yeame> i have few ideas to improve that mockup
1859 2012-03-14 21:53:55 <Samuel> Yeame: Yeah after all, thats what its all about, your balance!
1860 2012-03-14 21:54:03 <Yeame> yes
1861 2012-03-14 21:54:11 dub is now known as version
1862 2012-03-14 21:54:19 <Samuel> Yeame: What are your thoughts to improve it?
1863 2012-03-14 21:54:20 version is now known as dub
1864 2012-03-14 21:54:50 <Samuel> Yeame: We you "userubj" or something yesterday?
1865 2012-03-14 21:54:54 <Yeame> samuel: i really don't like gray color
1866 2012-03-14 21:54:57 <Yeame> yes
1867 2012-03-14 21:55:11 <Samuel> Ok, good that you got a better username
1868 2012-03-14 21:55:30 <Samuel> What concept are you speaking of?
1869 2012-03-14 21:55:43 <Yeame> if you can change to white background to me see how will stay
1870 2012-03-14 21:55:53 <Yeame> the new
1871 2012-03-14 21:56:14 <Yeame> http://cl.ly/2A0Z0T031x3W0c3R3b1V
1872 2012-03-14 21:56:38 <Yeame> change all background to white
1873 2012-03-14 21:56:44 <Samuel> Yeah, maybe that can be changed to white.
1874 2012-03-14 21:57:18 <Yeame> let me find a link to show something
1875 2012-03-14 21:57:20 <sipa> luke-jr: i just downloaded all lessons for the first part in mp4
1876 2012-03-14 21:57:54 <Yeame> samuel: did you already used blockchain.info site?
1877 2012-03-14 21:58:03 <sipa> luke-jr: and the exercises are just html afaik
1878 2012-03-14 21:58:25 denisx has quit (Quit: denisx)
1879 2012-03-14 21:58:26 booo has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
1880 2012-03-14 21:58:27 <Samuel> Yeame: Use it for what?
1881 2012-03-14 21:59:26 <Yeame> samuel:just to you see how i think the select menu could be
1882 2012-03-14 22:00:11 <Yeame> samuel: if you can go to blockchain.info/wallet
1883 2012-03-14 22:00:30 <Yeame> create an user
1884 2012-03-14 22:01:06 <Yeame> samuel: no need to create user
1885 2012-03-14 22:01:11 <Yeame> try demo
1886 2012-03-14 22:01:21 <Samuel> Yeame: oh just did.. lol
1887 2012-03-14 22:01:25 <Yeame> demo account
1888 2012-03-14 22:02:11 <Samuel> Ok
1889 2012-03-14 22:02:35 <Yeame> samuel: when you click send money or any other meenu
1890 2012-03-14 22:02:44 terry has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1891 2012-03-14 22:02:56 <Yeame> to you see the blue border
1892 2012-03-14 22:03:05 RazielZ has joined
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1894 2012-03-14 22:03:26 <Samuel> The blue rounded rectangle?
1895 2012-03-14 22:04:05 <Yeame> samuel: on your new mockup i think you shoud do something like thst, but gray color
1896 2012-03-14 22:04:17 <Yeame> yes
1897 2012-03-14 22:04:26 <Samuel> Hmm
1898 2012-03-14 22:04:50 <Yeame> samuel: don't you like?
1899 2012-03-14 22:05:23 <Samuel> I don't think it will look good
1900 2012-03-14 22:05:40 <Yeame> but the sidebar will be white
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1902 2012-03-14 22:05:50 <Yeame> or near white
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1908 2012-03-14 22:06:52 <Samuel> Yeame: Not sure.
1909 2012-03-14 22:07:46 <Yeame> samuel: see the background color of box on this site: bitcoinmedia.com/
1910 2012-03-14 22:08:13 <Yeame> samuel: i like that color for sidebar
1911 2012-03-14 22:08:32 <Yeame> and main window in white
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1913 2012-03-14 22:08:54 <Samuel> Which part of the site?
1914 2012-03-14 22:09:13 <Yeame> right
1915 2012-03-14 22:09:19 <Yeame> the box
1916 2012-03-14 22:09:25 <Samuel> The boxes with stripes?
1917 2012-03-14 22:09:45 <Yeame> with text featires artcles
1918 2012-03-14 22:09:55 <Yeame> features articles
1919 2012-03-14 22:10:38 paraipan has joined
1920 2012-03-14 22:10:49 <Samuel> Yes, ok. The light blue could be changed to that possibly if the gray on the app is changed to white
1921 2012-03-14 22:10:54 <Samuel> Maybe, don't know
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1924 2012-03-14 22:11:50 <Yeame> samuel: i really like that mockup, but with white background. i like something like a webpage
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1926 2012-03-14 22:12:42 <Yeame> samuel: if you could add info on overview tab. we could see how will stay
1927 2012-03-14 22:13:36 <sipa> I likew
1928 2012-03-14 22:13:39 <Samuel> Yeah if its going to stay i t needs more
1929 2012-03-14 22:13:45 <Samuel> *it
1930 2012-03-14 22:13:58 <sipa> I like the GUI being discussed; means we probably did a good job switching to bitcoin-qt :)
1931 2012-03-14 22:14:39 <Samuel> I guess! I'm not familiar with Qt but it seems to be working out for tcatm
1932 2012-03-14 22:15:47 <Yeame> samuel: do you have time to add some info on overview tab now
1933 2012-03-14 22:16:11 <Yeame> so we could see how will stay
1934 2012-03-14 22:16:44 <Samuel> Yeame: I only do the mockups, I'm not actually coding the app. But I welcome more suggestions! What were you thinking?
1935 2012-03-14 22:17:38 <tcatm> http://188.138.99.157/stuff/qtvert15.png
1936 2012-03-14 22:17:56 <Diablo-D3> whats with the ugly
1937 2012-03-14 22:18:11 <Samuel> tcatm: woah, lots of things changed.
1938 2012-03-14 22:18:16 <Yeame> samuel: add the same info on overview tab. but will not be inside boxes. will be separeted by lines
1939 2012-03-14 22:18:21 <tcatm> It's just an idea.
1940 2012-03-14 22:18:32 <Diablo-D3> tcatm: it was okay when it sorta looked like osx theming
1941 2012-03-14 22:18:39 <Diablo-D3> but now you just went nutty
1942 2012-03-14 22:18:46 <sipa> tcatm: nitpick, but i don't like the balance being inverted like the selected menu item
1943 2012-03-14 22:18:48 <Yeame> samuel: with white background
1944 2012-03-14 22:18:59 <Samuel> tcatm: did you see this? http://cl.ly/2A0Z0T031x3W0c3R3b1V
1945 2012-03-14 22:19:12 tobtc has left ()
1946 2012-03-14 22:19:41 <sipa> ;;bc,nethash
1947 2012-03-14 22:19:42 <gribble> 11371.239493911598
1948 2012-03-14 22:19:43 <Yeame> tcatm: didn't like
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1952 2012-03-14 22:20:42 <Samuel> tcatm: Honestly, I don't like any of the changes on that snapshot you just posted.
1953 2012-03-14 22:20:42 <Yeame> I really think we shouldn't have icons for send, transactions...
1954 2012-03-14 22:20:52 <Yeame> like samuel mockup
1955 2012-03-14 22:21:46 <Samuel> Yeame: To be consistant, we should have icons for each tab
1956 2012-03-14 22:22:01 <Samuel> Or did you mean for all of them?
1957 2012-03-14 22:22:17 <Yeame> on the sidebar
1958 2012-03-14 22:22:56 <Samuel> Oh, hmm.
1959 2012-03-14 22:23:02 <jm9000> Wtf 44k BTC god damn
1960 2012-03-14 22:23:12 <sipa> I don't mind having icons in the sidebar.
1961 2012-03-14 22:23:15 <Yeame> like your mockup, samuel
1962 2012-03-14 22:23:29 <sipa> jm9000: ?
1963 2012-03-14 22:23:38 <Samuel> I think the icons are fine
1964 2012-03-14 22:23:51 <jm9000> [15:17] <tcatm> http://188.138.99.157/stuff/qtvert15.png
1965 2012-03-14 22:24:03 <Samuel> jm9000 its a mockup
1966 2012-03-14 22:24:12 <sipa> No, it's testnet.
1967 2012-03-14 22:24:40 <sipa> The fifth transaction shown on that page is real and mine ;)
1968 2012-03-14 22:25:34 <Yeame> samuel: could you add info on overview tab, not in boxes, separated by lines, and with white background? i really would like to see
1969 2012-03-14 22:25:34 <Samuel> oh, cool
1970 2012-03-14 22:26:16 <Samuel> WHat addition information would we add because right now we think their is no use for it
1971 2012-03-14 22:27:25 <Yeame> samuel: statistcs one
1972 2012-03-14 22:27:57 <Yeame> the same we have now, plus: total of addrees on address book
1973 2012-03-14 22:28:29 <Yeame> I think is good have an overview tab
1974 2012-03-14 22:29:18 <Samuel> That information would just clutter, if someone wanted to see how many transactions they have made or amount of names in their address book they could go to that specific tab where it would be said
1975 2012-03-14 22:29:33 <tcatm> What about assuming the sidebar is finished and start creating mockups for all tabs?
1976 2012-03-14 22:30:05 <Samuel> tcatm: Including my most recent ideas for the sidebar, it done
1977 2012-03-14 22:30:13 <Samuel> *its
1978 2012-03-14 22:30:20 tower has joined
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1980 2012-03-14 22:31:15 <Yeame> samuel: ok, tcatm. i thought you could make some work to clone this mockup: cl.ly/3r3r0Y1x1u2U2G0P470G/o
1981 2012-03-14 22:32:09 TD has quit (Quit: TD)
1982 2012-03-14 22:32:26 <tcatm> That's only sidebar work.
1983 2012-03-14 22:32:28 <Yeame> tcatm: if is not that hard
1984 2012-03-14 22:32:53 <tcatm> I'd like to have a cleaner send coins dialog first.
1985 2012-03-14 22:33:11 ThomasV_ has quit (Quit: Quitte)
1986 2012-03-14 22:33:46 <Samuel> Ok, but did we agree to these changes: http://cl.ly/2A0Z0T031x3W0c3R3b1V (I'd be happy to ove on to the tabs themselves but just want to make sure.)
1987 2012-03-14 22:33:47 mcorlett has joined
1988 2012-03-14 22:35:21 <tcatm> I like the idea of moving the icons back to bottom left. The other changes are just minor stuff.
1989 2012-03-14 22:35:32 <Samuel> So yes?
1990 2012-03-14 22:35:48 mrsy has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1991 2012-03-14 22:36:11 <tcatm> No :) At least not now.
1992 2012-03-14 22:36:32 mrsy has joined
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1994 2012-03-14 22:36:42 <Samuel> Why?
1995 2012-03-14 22:37:41 <tcatm> I did get a lot of positive feedback on http://188.138.99.157/stuff/qtvert14.png so it's good enough for now. We should really focus on the main parts of the GUI.
1996 2012-03-14 22:37:57 <Yeame> tcatm: please add the top like this one: cl.ly/3r3r0Y1x1u2U2G0P470G/o
1997 2012-03-14 22:38:08 <Diablo-D3> tcatm: that one looks good
1998 2012-03-14 22:38:14 <Diablo-D3> but is this supposed to be on osx or what?
1999 2012-03-14 22:38:17 <Samuel> Well if you don't want to do anymore sidebar work we can do those changes later. Lets start on those tabs! :D
2000 2012-03-14 22:38:25 <Diablo-D3> because thats inappropriate for any other OS
2001 2012-03-14 22:38:57 <tcatm> Yeame: Write code to do just that :)
2002 2012-03-14 22:39:28 <Yeame> tcatm: ok, sorry
2003 2012-03-14 22:39:31 <tcatm> Really, it's easy. It just takes maybe 4..6 days to get a feeling of how Qt works and then it's pretty simple do to.
2004 2012-03-14 22:43:10 <Samuel> Well, now talking about the send tab, I don't think anything could be changed except for some small things like the weird borders around everything
2005 2012-03-14 22:43:39 tower has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
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2008 2012-03-14 22:45:49 <tcatm> Oh, there's a lot that can be changed. E.g. swap amount/label fields
2009 2012-03-14 22:47:22 <Samuel> Well nothing that big, I mean its still a basic form.
2010 2012-03-14 22:49:05 <Samuel> The balance wouldn't need to be shown at the bottom because its always in the sidebar, obviously
2011 2012-03-14 22:49:06 <tcatm> And it's the most important form of the whole application!
2012 2012-03-14 22:49:30 <Samuel> Yep!
2013 2012-03-14 22:50:18 <Samuel> Is the export function just going to under the File menu?
2014 2012-03-14 22:50:24 <tcatm> It's not even clear to the end user that it's possible to drop bitcoin links on it to initiate a transaction.
2015 2012-03-14 22:51:00 <Samuel> I don't even think I know what you mean...
2016 2012-03-14 22:51:00 <tcatm> We could add it to the buttons below the the datatables
2017 2012-03-14 22:51:30 <Samuel> (Sorry still kinda Bitcoin noob
2018 2012-03-14 22:51:57 <tcatm> E.g. on addressbook page: New address, Copy to clipboard, ... , export
2019 2012-03-14 22:52:08 occulta has quit (Quit: KVIrc 4.1.1 Equilibrium http://www.kvirc.net/)
2020 2012-03-14 22:53:14 <Samuel> ok...
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2025 2012-03-14 22:56:15 <forsetifox> Anyone use deepbit in here?
2026 2012-03-14 22:57:40 <Samuel> Got to go, I'll probably be back later today. See ya later guys
2027 2012-03-14 22:58:04 <Yeame> samuel: bye, thanks
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2030 2012-03-14 22:59:31 <tcatm> http://188.138.99.157/stuff/qtvert16.png
2031 2012-03-14 23:08:25 <jm9000> Those icons feel more natural in the bottom right corner. That's where status bar icons always go. Bottom left is ok also, I guess.
2032 2012-03-14 23:08:38 <jm9000> Seems kinda stuffed in up at the top left.
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2038 2012-03-14 23:11:54 <jm9000> How about keep the lock by wallet, then the other two go by "Synchronizing"?
2039 2012-03-14 23:12:26 <tcatm> Synchronizing disappears once it is synchronized
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2046 2012-03-14 23:25:03 <sipa> t minus 36 minutes
2047 2012-03-14 23:25:33 <tcatm> ?
2048 2012-03-14 23:25:48 <sipa> bip30 switchover
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2052 2012-03-14 23:26:39 <BlueMatt> tcatm: cant say I like the highlighting of the balance...
2053 2012-03-14 23:27:37 <tcatm> qtvert15.png?
2054 2012-03-14 23:27:42 <BlueMatt> yea
2055 2012-03-14 23:28:03 <tcatm> Yeah, I already did a git reset --hard in that tree :)
2056 2012-03-14 23:28:07 <sipa> i said the same
2057 2012-03-14 23:28:42 <BlueMatt> well then Im just behind
2058 2012-03-14 23:28:52 <BlueMatt> tcatm: did you get a copy of the icons used in this one: http://cl.ly/13043y0U3J3F0E201G3d
2059 2012-03-14 23:28:56 <BlueMatt> the recent tx icons
2060 2012-03-14 23:29:16 <tcatm> Nope.
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2062 2012-03-14 23:29:29 <tcatm> I'd like them to be much smaller.
2063 2012-03-14 23:29:39 <BlueMatt> I think everyone has said that at one point or another ;)
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2067 2012-03-14 23:30:05 <tcatm> Yeah, but nobody published patches yet... :)
2068 2012-03-14 23:31:06 <tcatm> I wonder if we should switch from a form to table like entry box when using sendmany.
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