1 2013-01-16 00:00:19 <BlueMatt> anyone else been seeing lots of unicorns on github lately?
   2 2013-01-16 00:00:32 <sipa> what are you smoking?
   3 2013-01-16 00:01:02 <BlueMatt> thats the fail-whale equivalent that indicates "Page took too long to load"
   4 2013-01-16 00:01:56 <sipa> i know :p
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  10 2013-01-16 00:12:24 <swappermall> I installed armory on my Ubuntu Precise virtual machine, but it hangs after trying to digest blk0001.dat ... any thoughts on this?
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  16 2013-01-16 00:53:39 <sipa> etotheipi_: ^
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  20 2013-01-16 01:07:26 <etotheipi_> hi swappermall
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  22 2013-01-16 01:08:03 <etotheipi_> swappermall: #bitcoin-armory
  23 2013-01-16 01:08:30 <swappermall> hey etotheipi
  24 2013-01-16 01:08:47 <swappermall> I'll check out bitcoin-armory
  25 2013-01-16 01:08:55 <swappermall> thanx muchly!
  26 2013-01-16 01:09:10 <swappermall> right now I'm having dinner
  27 2013-01-16 01:09:31 <swappermall> I don't know your time zone, but will you be around later?
  28 2013-01-16 01:09:39 <etotheipi_> yeah, I'll be around for a bit
  29 2013-01-16 01:11:09 <swappermall> great
  30 2013-01-16 01:11:29 <swappermall> I need to talk some shop later
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  41 2013-01-16 02:02:04 <muhoo> by unicorn, you mean http://unicorn.bogomips.org/ ?
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  45 2013-01-16 02:38:14 <BlueMatt> sipa: sorry, though now that i think it through (and implement it) I have to revert your ideal multiplier thinggy for the hash function in bloom filters
  46 2013-01-16 02:38:23 <BlueMatt> (in some cases it results in worse privacy)
  47 2013-01-16 02:38:50 <BlueMatt> ideally - use some set of numbers which, whenever you change the hash count, results in never using a number twice
  48 2013-01-16 02:39:45 <gmaxwell> BlueMatt: why? just have everyone choose a random one on connect.
  49 2013-01-16 02:42:25 <BlueMatt> well the idea is if you have to recreate the filter, you will probably change the number of elements, so you will change the hash count (often).  if you were to change the filter to be larger, using the same seeds for each given hash number (ie 0 - hash count), you may be able to gain some information on what those hashes actually are, not just what they are % filter size, which is not a good thing
  50 2013-01-16 02:42:53 <BlueMatt> if you use a different seed per hash number when the hash count changes, you cant, really
  51 2013-01-16 02:43:03 <BlueMatt> however, you should still use the same tweak
  52 2013-01-16 02:43:15 <BlueMatt> (Im stating this to make sure Im not dreaming, which is always quite possible)
  53 2013-01-16 02:44:42 <BlueMatt> ie your goal is always to not divulge any additional info from a filter refresh (obviously) and i think those form a  somewhat ideal strategy
  54 2013-01-16 02:45:21 <BlueMatt> (for reference, the ballooning issue still appears, though much, much less significantly after the p2pubkey only flags)
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  60 2013-01-16 03:22:02 <BlueMatt> sipa: because Im lazy, Id appreciate the stuff you wrote to calculate that number...
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  72 2013-01-16 04:16:24 <gmaxwell> kjj: Aren't you happier with your memory all corrected?
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 589 2013-01-16 14:07:45 <ThomasV> is there an example of bip32 generated keys?
 590 2013-01-16 14:08:13 <ThomasV> (the wiki has an empty Test Vectors section)
 591 2013-01-16 14:08:27 <ThomasV> sipa, etotheipi_ ^^
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 595 2013-01-16 14:10:13 <sipa> ThomasV: i sent some to eto some time ago (with the disclaimer they aren't final)
 596 2013-01-16 14:10:48 <ThomasV> yes, I understand they aren't. can you send them to me too?
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 599 2013-01-16 14:13:02 <ThomasV> sipa: ^
 600 2013-01-16 14:13:10 * abracadabra sets mode: +b mughat3
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 606 2013-01-16 14:18:52 <sipa> ThomasV: i don't have them available right now
 607 2013-01-16 14:19:02 <ThomasV> ok
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 623 2013-01-16 14:36:44 <ThomasV> sipa: " Split I into two 32-byte sequences, Il and Ir. " (from the wiki) <-- is this performed on each level?
 624 2013-01-16 14:37:18 <sipa> how do you mean?
 625 2013-01-16 14:37:50 <ThomasV> well, all the info I have is the wiki page..
 626 2013-01-16 14:37:56 mughat3 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
 627 2013-01-16 14:38:06 <sipa> what do you mean, "level"?
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 629 2013-01-16 14:38:15 <ThomasV> in CDK there is x_pubkey, which I guess is the pubkeyu derived from I_l
 630 2013-01-16 14:38:53 <ThomasV> re level: I mean depth
 631 2013-01-16 14:39:15 <sipa> the CDK doesn't know anything about depth in the wallet structure
 632 2013-01-16 14:39:18 <sipa> that's a layer on top
 633 2013-01-16 14:39:46 <sipa> it's just a function that takes either an extended pubkey or extended private key, and a number, and produces a new extended public key or private key
 634 2013-01-16 14:40:19 <sipa> CKD, i mean
 635 2013-01-16 14:40:40 <ThomasV> yes, CKD
 636 2013-01-16 14:40:47 mughat3 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
 637 2013-01-16 14:40:55 <sipa> so, i guess the answer is yes to your function
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 639 2013-01-16 14:41:09 <sipa> the CKD function is the same in every level of the wallet tree
 640 2013-01-16 14:42:05 <ThomasV> sipa: to put it differently, CKD involves x_chain and x_pubkey ; are they derived from what is denoted with I_l and I_r in the text?
 641 2013-01-16 14:42:51 <ThomasV> so, at each level, I use I_l to create a private key, and x_pubkey is the corresponding public key?
 642 2013-01-16 14:43:05 <sipa> i'm not sure where you read that
 643 2013-01-16 14:43:25 <ThomasV> well, that's what I'm inferring
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 645 2013-01-16 14:43:43 <ThomasV> there is x_pubkey in the definition of CKD
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 647 2013-01-16 14:43:52 <ThomasV> where does x_pubkey come from?
 648 2013-01-16 14:43:56 <sipa> CKD takes k_par, c_par and n as input, and produces k_n and c_n
 649 2013-01-16 14:44:21 <sipa> CKD((k_par,c_par), n) -> (k_n,c_n)
 650 2013-01-16 14:44:53 <sipa> with (k_par,c_par) the extended parent private key, and (k_n,c_n) the n'th derived extended public key
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 652 2013-01-16 14:45:26 <mbub> anyone help me
 653 2013-01-16 14:45:31 <ThomasV> hmm
 654 2013-01-16 14:45:37 <ThomasV> do I need to read something more than the wiki page, or is it self sufficient?
 655 2013-01-16 14:45:45 <sipa> it should be self sufficient
 656 2013-01-16 14:46:05 <sipa> define (kn,cn) = CKD((kpar,cpar),n):
 657 2013-01-16 14:46:05 <sipa> call I = HMAC-SHA512(Key=cpar, Data=kpar*G || n), where kpar*G is the public key corresponding to kpar, || is concatenation, and n is encoded as a 32 bits unsigned integer, most significant byte first.
 658 2013-01-16 14:46:09 <sipa> Split I into two 32-byte sequences, IL and IR.
 659 2013-01-16 14:46:12 <sipa> kn is equal to IL*kpar.
 660 2013-01-16 14:46:14 <sipa> cn is equal to IR.
 661 2013-01-16 14:46:22 <mbub> can i buy btc with moneybookers
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 663 2013-01-16 14:46:25 <sipa> so it tells you how to go from kpar, cpar and n to kn and cn
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 665 2013-01-16 14:46:40 <ThomasV> sipa: thanks. that's better :)
 666 2013-01-16 14:46:54 <sipa> ThomasV: ... i just copy pasted the wiki section?
 667 2013-01-16 14:47:26 * ThomasV hides
 668 2013-01-16 14:47:31 <mbub> ANYONE HELP ME?
 669 2013-01-16 14:47:41 <ThomasV> sorry, I failed to see that section :P
 670 2013-01-16 14:48:32 <ThomasV> mbub: go to #bitcoin
 671 2013-01-16 14:48:41 <Jouke_> mbub: wrong channel, go to #bitcoin or #bitcoin-otc
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 674 2013-01-16 14:50:17 <sipa> ThomasV: did you just miss it?
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 678 2013-01-16 14:51:41 <ThomasV> sipa: sorry. I read the text of bip 32 weeks ago, and it was clear at that time. but I kept the impression that everything was in the picture, and that's how I forgot to check the text again this time
 679 2013-01-16 14:51:59 * ThomasV is ashamed
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 681 2013-01-16 14:52:02 <sipa> haha
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 683 2013-01-16 14:52:18 <sipa> maybe the picture is a bit confusing, as it doesn't actually define what CKD is
 684 2013-01-16 14:52:28 <sipa> it just gives a part :)
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 698 2013-01-16 15:04:26 <Luke-Jr> hmm
 699 2013-01-16 15:04:33 <Luke-Jr> someone is trying to DoS me? <.<
 700 2013-01-16 15:04:48 <Luke-Jr> slow flood of microtransactions hitting my wallet
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 709 2013-01-16 15:12:12 <abracadabra> ffs
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 715 2013-01-16 15:17:10 <BlueMatt> sipa: ping
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 721 2013-01-16 15:21:39 <sipa> BlueMatt: yes?
 722 2013-01-16 15:22:00 <sipa> BlueMatt: if you're not willing to lose privacy, just use a random tweak every time?
 723 2013-01-16 15:23:01 <sipa> doing the calculation over for separate sets for different counts would make it 25 times slower... not sure i'm willing to wait that long :)
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 732 2013-01-16 15:28:33 <BlueMatt> sipa: using a different tweak every time loses more privacy as you can intersect the filters to remove fps previously sent
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 734 2013-01-16 15:28:56 <sipa> and if you change the number of hashes, you can do that anyway?
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 736 2013-01-16 15:29:28 <BlueMatt> if Im thinking this through correctly, no
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 738 2013-01-16 15:29:50 <BlueMatt> as it is now, definately not (though you can potentially figure out to some extent the actual hash values, instead of hash % filter size)
 739 2013-01-16 15:30:05 <BlueMatt> if you change the hash num seed, I dont think so either
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 741 2013-01-16 15:30:45 <sipa> BlueMatt: what is the exact use case, which would currently result in a loss of privacy you consider avoidable?
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 744 2013-01-16 15:32:44 <BlueMatt> "client" gets a new key/p2pubkey txn added to wallet, has to create a new filter...
 745 2013-01-16 15:33:20 <BlueMatt> maybe added 1000 new keys or something, so the filter definately needs new parameters (different size/hash count)
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 749 2013-01-16 15:34:50 <sipa> BlueMatt: ok, and how will another initialization help?
 750 2013-01-16 15:35:23 <BlueMatt> as the client, I dont want to give up any information which allows the "server" to intersect my filters and determine which of my previous fps were actually fp
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 752 2013-01-16 15:35:41 <BlueMatt> sipa: so that you keep a reasonable fp rate?
 753 2013-01-16 15:36:28 <sipa> ok, so give me a function to initialize the hash which doesn't allow that?
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 755 2013-01-16 15:37:14 <BlueMatt> hmm...no Im wrong, let me think this through when Im not falling asleep
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 757 2013-01-16 15:37:21 <BlueMatt> there is definitely one
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 759 2013-01-16 15:37:30 <sipa> BlueMatt: i think not taking the number of hashes into account actually helps
 760 2013-01-16 15:37:39 <sipa> as it means you'll be using the same hash results in the new filter
 761 2013-01-16 15:37:41 <BlueMatt> yes
 762 2013-01-16 15:37:47 <sipa> (and add some, but that's unavoidable)
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 782 2013-01-16 15:51:09 <TD_> BlueMatt: what perf do you see?
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 785 2013-01-16 15:51:43 <BlueMatt> TD_: havent explicitly tested that yet, but its reasonably good (< 10 minutes for full sync, no high cpu usage on either side)
 786 2013-01-16 15:51:51 <TD_> hm
 787 2013-01-16 15:51:53 <TD_> ok
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 794 2013-01-16 15:58:35 <Diablo-D3> gmaxwell: you know what would be awesome?
 795 2013-01-16 15:58:42 <Diablo-D3> opting out of bootstrapping new clients
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 797 2013-01-16 15:59:11 <sipa> Diablo-D3: you mean -nolisten ?
 798 2013-01-16 15:59:24 <sipa> (not *technically* the same, but in practice...)
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 803 2013-01-16 16:02:44 <gmaxwell> sipa: it's quite close since a node won't advertise itself until it's mostly bootstrapped... so yo should not end up connect to a _new_ one, though you might get an old one that got wiped.
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 806 2013-01-16 16:04:58 <sipa> gmaxwell: it won't? :o
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 809 2013-01-16 16:06:47 <gmaxwell> sipa: yea, the announcement requires the node to be past its highest checkpoint.
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 822 2013-01-16 16:17:12 <waibeth> i would like to send gmaxwell a big "fuck you". thanks
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 849 2013-01-16 16:38:20 <etotheipi_> ThomasV: https://github.com/etotheipi/BitcoinArmory/blob/newwallet/cppForSwig/EncryptionUtils.cpp#L1098
 850 2013-01-16 16:39:16 <etotheipi_> Sipa's test vectors in my own code:  https://github.com/etotheipi/BitcoinArmory/blob/newwallet/cppForSwig/EncryptionUtils.cpp#L1098
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 853 2013-01-16 16:40:28 <ThomasV> etotheipi_: thanks, but I don't see test vectors there?
 854 2013-01-16 16:40:51 <etotheipi_> ThomasV: that is the see
 855 2013-01-16 16:40:53 <etotheipi_> *seed
 856 2013-01-16 16:40:59 <etotheipi_> and then 15 or so levels deep
 857 2013-01-16 16:41:09 <etotheipi_> computedPrivEK = HDWalletCrypto().ChildKeyDeriv(computedPrivEK, pow(2,i)-1);
 858 2013-01-16 16:41:12 <sipa> ThomasV: http://pastebin.com/dxzWuDLj
 859 2013-01-16 16:41:22 <sipa> found them in IRC chatlog :)
 860 2013-01-16 16:41:29 <etotheipi_> oh, that's clearer
 861 2013-01-16 16:41:34 <ThomasV> sipa: thanks :)
 862 2013-01-16 16:41:46 <etotheipi_> wait
 863 2013-01-16 16:41:57 <etotheipi_> that's the old one using only 0-index children
 864 2013-01-16 16:42:13 <sipa> http://pastebin.com/Tswx5N8Q
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 866 2013-01-16 16:42:57 <ThomasV> ok
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 868 2013-01-16 16:44:43 <sipa> ThomasV: also, the base58 output in those tests is sort of hastily-written code, which may have bugs by itself
 869 2013-01-16 16:44:53 <ThomasV> lol
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 874 2013-01-16 16:46:34 <sipa> ThomasV: afaik, etotheipi_ did verify the hex stuff though
 875 2013-01-16 16:46:56 <sipa> so having two independent implementations that have the same result sort of gives it credibility :)
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 877 2013-01-16 16:47:16 <etotheipi_> http://pastebin.com/UJxxa3as
 878 2013-01-16 16:47:26 <etotheipi_> that was my output, that matches sipa's (without the base58)
 879 2013-01-16 16:47:59 <ThomasV> ok, great
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 889 2013-01-16 16:57:28 <TD_> wtf
 890 2013-01-16 16:57:30 <TD_> this is weir
 891 2013-01-16 16:57:31 <TD_> wierd
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 895 2013-01-16 16:57:53 <TD> suddenly bitcoinj can't send messages to my local testnet3 node anymore. it can't even find the message start bytes.
 896 2013-01-16 16:58:40 <BitcoinTurkiye> Hello, I have translated the subtitles of "what is bitcoin?" youtube video to Turkish.
 897 2013-01-16 16:58:40 <TD> as usual, i'm an idiot and realize the mistake 2 seconds after moaning about it publicly but 30 minutes after i actually start investigating
 898 2013-01-16 16:59:07 <BitcoinTurkiye> Do you know anybody that I should contact so that he can add it to the offical video
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 915 2013-01-16 17:12:37 <BlueMatt> TD: if you had done it any other way you wouldn't have been a coder :)
 916 2013-01-16 17:13:20 <BlueMatt> whois petertodd?
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 939 2013-01-16 17:30:32 <TD> BlueMatt: retep
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 942 2013-01-16 17:31:09 <BlueMatt> wat?
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 946 2013-01-16 17:34:52 <TD> BlueMatt: peter todd is retep on the forums
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 950 2013-01-16 17:36:32 <BlueMatt> ahh ok
 951 2013-01-16 17:36:39 * BlueMatt hasnt been to the forum in...months?
 952 2013-01-16 17:36:51 <sipa> BlueMatt: lucky you
 953 2013-01-16 17:37:00 <BlueMatt> heh
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 976 2013-01-16 17:59:39 <TD> hearn-macbookpro:src hearn$ ./bitcoind -testnet sendmany "" '{"mfju7uYVdprQ5q2TeDnhMiR3fj3jLDgu4s":0.1}' 0
 977 2013-01-16 17:59:39 <TD> error: {"code":-6,"message":"Insufficient funds"}
 978 2013-01-16 17:59:40 <TD> hearn-macbookpro:src hearn$ ./bitcoind -testnet listaccounts 0
 979 2013-01-16 17:59:40 <TD> {
 980 2013-01-16 17:59:40 <TD>     "" : 0.10000000
 981 2013-01-16 17:59:40 <TD> }
 982 2013-01-16 17:59:43 <TD> does anyone know what i'm doing wrong here?
 983 2013-01-16 18:00:04 <sipa> TD: perhaps it needs a fee?
 984 2013-01-16 18:00:06 <TD> i want to make a transaction that spends an unconfirmed transaction
 985 2013-01-16 18:00:10 <TD> ah
 986 2013-01-16 18:00:11 <TD> hmm
 987 2013-01-16 18:00:12 <TD> good point
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 989 2013-01-16 18:00:26 <sipa> and you can only spend unconfirmed outputs of they're your own
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 991 2013-01-16 18:00:34 <TD> i tried reducing the amount but it still didn't send
 992 2013-01-16 18:00:38 <sipa> *if
 993 2013-01-16 18:00:53 <TD> how do you mean? obviously it has the right signing key
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 995 2013-01-16 18:01:05 <TD> oh, you mean the tx itself has to be originally from this node?
 996 2013-01-16 18:01:07 <sipa> protection against long unconfirming chains
 997 2013-01-16 18:01:20 <TD> that'd be why then
 998 2013-01-16 18:01:38 <sipa> not node - it has to have an input that is from a key you own
 999 2013-01-16 18:01:43 <sipa> iirc
1000 2013-01-16 18:01:51 <TD> ok
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1002 2013-01-16 18:01:58 <TD> same reason
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1004 2013-01-16 18:02:15 <TD> i'm trying to make a chain of unconfirmed transactions deliberately so i can test my recursive download code
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1006 2013-01-16 18:03:09 <TD> oh well. i'll do it late.
1007 2013-01-16 18:03:10 <TD> later
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1039 2013-01-16 18:29:05 <gavinandresen> TD: you'd have to modify CWallet::SelectCoins to spend an unconfirmed not-from-you
1040 2013-01-16 18:29:29 <gavinandresen> TD: it'd be trivial, though, just change the last SelectCoinsMinConf() to be nTargetValue, 0, 0 .....
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1057 2013-01-16 18:43:58 <Acciaio> Hi all, good afternoon, I can not send bitcoin with the original client via php json rpc client
1058 2013-01-16 18:45:10 <Acciaio> I always get only this error http://www.bitbin.it/ZGIE9gZa that don't tell me nothing
1059 2013-01-16 18:45:57 zooko has joined
1060 2013-01-16 18:46:07 <mbub> ANYONE GOT MONEYBOOKERS
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1166 2013-01-16 20:27:16 <phantomcircuit> there's definitely some sort of race condition in the initial block download algorithm
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1168 2013-01-16 20:27:38 <sipa> phantomcircuit: how so?
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1170 2013-01-16 20:27:45 <phantomcircuit> i have 0.7.2 on a momentovps vm and i have to keep restarting it
1171 2013-01-16 20:27:57 <sipa> it's just broken
1172 2013-01-16 20:27:59 <phantomcircuit> sipa, the logs are full of orphaned blocks
1173 2013-01-16 20:28:09 <sipa> oh, that's normal
1174 2013-01-16 20:28:19 <phantomcircuit> yeah but it gets stuck
1175 2013-01-16 20:28:22 <sipa> yes
1176 2013-01-16 20:28:25 <sipa> i know
1177 2013-01-16 20:28:29 <phantomcircuit> ok then
1178 2013-01-16 20:28:51 <sipa> if a new block is produced while you're IBDing from another node, it gets confused
1179 2013-01-16 20:29:01 <sipa> and often gets stuck until a new block is announced
1180 2013-01-16 20:30:20 <mbub> phantomcircuit
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1182 2013-01-16 20:30:27 <mbub> wud u no were i can get btc with moneybookers
1183 2013-01-16 20:30:33 mughat3 has joined
1184 2013-01-16 20:30:50 <sipa> mbub: #bitcoin or #bitcoin-otc, not here
1185 2013-01-16 20:30:59 <phantomcircuit> mbub, i would be surprised if you could it's trivially charged back
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1202 2013-01-16 20:42:13 <crabapples1> Looking for information on adding/removing coins from a testnet server I am running to figure out the API... is there a good dev FAQ around someone can point me to?
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1219 2013-01-16 20:57:44 <crabapples1> how can I add bitcoins to an account on my test server ?
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1228 2013-01-16 21:04:40 <Luke-Jr> crabapples1: you mean bitcoind accounting?
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1357 2013-01-16 23:21:09 <Acciaio> how can I log rpc errors with bitcoin client?
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1360 2013-01-16 23:24:18 tormenta has joined
1361 2013-01-16 23:24:23 <stealth222> uhm, dump them into a text file? :)
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1367 2013-01-16 23:24:53 <stealth222> not sure what you're asking
1368 2013-01-16 23:25:30 <tormenta> major news - greece just proclaimed bitcoin as nation main currency!
1369 2013-01-16 23:25:32 <Luke-Jr> he probably wants debug.log to keep a record of every time an error happens
1370 2013-01-16 23:25:37 <Luke-Jr> tormenta: orly?
1371 2013-01-16 23:25:38 <tormenta> not really ...
1372 2013-01-16 23:25:44 <Luke-Jr> figured
1373 2013-01-16 23:25:53 <tormenta> hi luke
1374 2013-01-16 23:26:25 <stealth222> Luke-Jr: if you specifically want to log errors, it's probably better to do it to a separate file
1375 2013-01-16 23:26:57 <Luke-Jr> hi
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1378 2013-01-16 23:28:05 <tormenta> off from here, stay well and keep up the great job!
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