1 2013-05-24 00:00:18 <michagogo> Luke-Jr: Yeah, but if I need one of these keys...
2 2013-05-24 00:00:21 <sipa> michagogo: $SIGNER has nothing to do with GPG
3 2013-05-24 00:00:30 <michagogo> sipa: Yeah, I got that
4 2013-05-24 00:00:34 <Luke-Jr> and that's a Ubuntu-specific policy anyway
5 2013-05-24 00:00:38 <michagogo> sipa: You said I also need a GPG key
6 2013-05-24 00:00:42 <sipa> yes
7 2013-05-24 00:00:44 <michagogo> Luke-Jr: Ah, okay.
8 2013-05-24 00:02:03 <sipa> well, i don't sign keys without verifying the claimed identity matches government-issued id
9 2013-05-24 00:02:41 <nsh> (fascist)
10 2013-05-24 00:03:00 <sipa> but that's just because not doing that would be deceiving anyone who signed my key, assuming i would follow the social contract implied when doing so
11 2013-05-24 00:03:22 <Luke-Jr> sipa: how so?
12 2013-05-24 00:03:28 BigBitz has joined
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14 2013-05-24 00:03:43 Ashaman has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
15 2013-05-24 00:04:00 <sipa> well, the social contract in the web of trust is that you verify someone's identity using government-issued id before signing keys
16 2013-05-24 00:04:15 <sipa> not that that is the only possible or meaningful social contract
17 2013-05-24 00:04:19 marketdataguy has joined
18 2013-05-24 00:04:21 <Luke-Jr> sipa: not really
19 2013-05-24 00:04:26 <sipa> but it certainly is the one people used when signing my keys
20 2013-05-24 00:04:48 BigBitz has joined
21 2013-05-24 00:05:13 <sipa> personally i think it would make sense to have gpg identities that do not claiming matching with any government id
22 2013-05-24 00:05:23 <sipa> *claim
23 2013-05-24 00:05:43 <Luke-Jr> PGP doesn't make such a claim
24 2013-05-24 00:05:46 <nsh> "It does not diminish the value of your key or the signatures you made if this key or the associated account turns out to have been compromised. Your signature does not give your condition and boundless endorsement of identity and validity. It just states that you did a verification with what you considered to be a due diligence process and felt sufficiently satisfied by that to sign the key. Trust is between the two individuals interacting at a given
25 2013-05-24 00:05:46 <nsh> moment, it is ethereal. That said, should your due diligence have been long lacking and others encountering many inappropriate signatures made by your key, the value of your signatures will certainly suffer. For example, if you sign keys with out checking fingerprints, or sign keys with out making any attempt at verification."
26 2013-05-24 00:05:49 <Luke-Jr> plenty of people without any government id use PGP
27 2013-05-24 00:05:50 <nsh> http://cryptnet.net/fdp/crypto/keysigning_party/en/keysigning_party.html
28 2013-05-24 00:07:08 <sipa> well, i'm pretty sure nobody ever signed my key without checking my identity
29 2013-05-24 00:07:09 <marketdataguy> web of trust hasn't taken off though
30 2013-05-24 00:07:30 <nsh> government-issued ID is (simply) a convenient way to establishing identity as part of due-diligence, which entail some explicit mutual understanding of the steps taken in diligence
31 2013-05-24 00:07:52 johnsoft1 has quit (Quit: Leaving.)
32 2013-05-24 00:07:58 <Luke-Jr> sipa: admittedly, photo id is a simple way for strangers to sign each others keys
33 2013-05-24 00:09:02 <Luke-Jr> personally, to give the highest level signature to someone here, I'd probably want to watch them writing new code :P
34 2013-05-24 00:09:19 <marketdataguy> not to cut into your discussion, but can i segway from gpg into a gpg-based transaction protocol?
35 2013-05-24 00:09:21 <sipa> Luke-Jr: but for example, if i sign your key, which has the claimed identity "Luke Dashjr", the natural assumption made by anyone who signed my key, will be that that is the name government considers yours
36 2013-05-24 00:09:30 macboz has joined
37 2013-05-24 00:09:45 <Luke-Jr> sipa: that is a flawed assumption IMO
38 2013-05-24 00:10:02 <michagogo> Okay, gpg key created and uploaded
39 2013-05-24 00:10:07 <Luke-Jr> sipa: also, a useless assumption for anyone in the USA
40 2013-05-24 00:10:22 <Luke-Jr> since the USA Constitution grants everyone the right to change their name to whatever at will
41 2013-05-24 00:10:22 <sipa> Luke-Jr: however, if your GPG identity would say "Bitcoin code committer Luke-jr", i wouldn't have any problem signing it
42 2013-05-24 00:10:28 <michagogo> Oh, also apparently the build finished while I was going that
43 2013-05-24 00:10:28 <sipa> Luke-Jr: wut?
44 2013-05-24 00:10:32 <sipa> seriously?
45 2013-05-24 00:10:34 <Luke-Jr> yes
46 2013-05-24 00:10:46 <gwillen> [citation needed]
47 2013-05-24 00:10:46 <michagogo> sipa: in ./bin/gsign --signer $SIGNER --release ${VERSION} --destination ../gitian.sigs/ ../bitcoin/contrib/gitian-descriptors/gitian.yml
48 2013-05-24 00:10:56 <michagogo> What goes in ${VERSION}?
49 2013-05-24 00:10:56 jtimon has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
50 2013-05-24 00:11:02 <sipa> michagogo: the version your built
51 2013-05-24 00:11:13 <michagogo> So "HEAD"?
52 2013-05-24 00:11:14 <sipa> v0.8.2rc2 i assume
53 2013-05-24 00:11:17 <gwillen> sipa: we really need a more formal protocol than free-text "signing policies" for expressing things like id-checks or whatever
54 2013-05-24 00:11:33 <michagogo> sipa: the gbuild command used HEAD
55 2013-05-24 00:11:34 <sipa> michagogo: HEAD is not a really meaningful name
56 2013-05-24 00:11:36 <gwillen> sipa: there's plenty of room in openpgp signature packets for it
57 2013-05-24 00:11:44 <gwillen> sipa: although I think replacing them with something not-terrible might be better
58 2013-05-24 00:11:51 <sipa> michagogo: as it doesn't permanently refer to the same codebase
59 2013-05-24 00:12:07 <michagogo> sipa: That's what was in https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/tree/master/contrib/gitian-descriptors/README
60 2013-05-24 00:12:26 meLon has quit (Quit: bzzzzzzzzzzzz)
61 2013-05-24 00:12:32 <michagogo> sipa: So --release v0.8.2rc2?
62 2013-05-24 00:12:34 <Luke-Jr> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/In_re_McUlta
63 2013-05-24 00:12:36 <sipa> michagogo: if you're just building head, there's no point in signing it
64 2013-05-24 00:12:39 <Luke-Jr> gwillen: ^
65 2013-05-24 00:12:42 <sipa> michagogo: you're not doing a release build
66 2013-05-24 00:12:47 <michagogo> sipa: Oh
67 2013-05-24 00:12:59 <sipa> the signatures is so others can verify your build was deterministic
68 2013-05-24 00:13:00 BigBitz has left ()
69 2013-05-24 00:13:00 <michagogo> So I should redo the build?
70 2013-05-24 00:13:07 <sipa> well what is your purpose?
71 2013-05-24 00:13:28 <michagogo> To me one of the "as many as possible" that do the builds
72 2013-05-24 00:13:31 <michagogo> s/me/be/
73 2013-05-24 00:13:42 <sipa> yes, then you should have used v0.8.2rc2
74 2013-05-24 00:13:48 <michagogo> Ah
75 2013-05-24 00:13:53 <sipa> though you cna probably just rename the dir, and sign now
76 2013-05-24 00:14:00 <sipa> or sign HEAD, and then rename the signature
77 2013-05-24 00:14:02 <michagogo> Oh, okay
78 2013-05-24 00:14:44 <michagogo> Which dir should I rename?
79 2013-05-24 00:14:54 <marketdataguy> since we're talking about key signing parties and gpg anyways, does anyone have the time to listen to a protocol spec idea i've started work on
80 2013-05-24 00:15:09 <marketdataguy> basically a counter-party risk tool
81 2013-05-24 00:15:26 <marketdataguy> to remove or at least reduce counter party risk to a minimum
82 2013-05-24 00:16:33 <marketdataguy> basically ... p2p exchanges (esp anonymous ones) will never take off unless counter-party risk is taken care of. i've talked the protocol spec over with another developer (in person) but i'd like to get opinions from others
83 2013-05-24 00:16:45 roconnor has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
84 2013-05-24 00:17:47 Michail1 is now known as Michail1_
85 2013-05-24 00:18:03 <marketdataguy> perhaps there is a project already started to do this, in which case i'll happily code using that. but nothing i've seen (ripple, gnashX etc) come even close to being totally decentralized and workable
86 2013-05-24 00:18:21 <marketdataguy> is there a project that i've missed?
87 2013-05-24 00:18:48 <warren> marketdataguy: AFAIK it is impossible for a p2p exchange to exist that is truly decentralized
88 2013-05-24 00:18:53 gjj has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
89 2013-05-24 00:19:09 <warren> marketdataguy: as you will always depend on an issuer of fiat to not disappear
90 2013-05-24 00:19:31 <iwilcox> Yeah, there's nowhere to entrust the fiat to.
91 2013-05-24 00:19:49 <sipa> even between unrelated crypto-currencies with unrelated blockchains, i don't think true decentralized trust-free exchange is possible
92 2013-05-24 00:19:55 rdymac has joined
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94 2013-05-24 00:19:55 rdymac has joined
95 2013-05-24 00:19:59 <michagogo> Interesting... CPU4 and CPU7 are pinned
96 2013-05-24 00:20:10 <michagogo> Now it's 5 and 7
97 2013-05-24 00:20:19 <michagogo> The other 6 are mostly idle
98 2013-05-24 00:20:19 <k00shi> Did you guy see this thread? https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=212490.0;all
99 2013-05-24 00:20:25 <gmaxwell> sipa: you can reduce it to a holdup risk at least.
100 2013-05-24 00:20:25 <warren> sipa: are you referring to the risk of robbing the exchange with a reorg + doublespend?
101 2013-05-24 00:20:38 <k00shi> tl;dr - BitMessage + OpenTransactions, somehow the beginnings of a 'distributed' exchange
102 2013-05-24 00:20:57 <iwilcox> I didn't get the conceptual leap that'd been made there. I tried :)
103 2013-05-24 00:21:05 <dugo> marketdataguy: i'll listen
104 2013-05-24 00:21:11 <gmaxwell> k00shi: I believe fellowtraveler believes bitmessage has properties that it doesn't have.
105 2013-05-24 00:21:21 <k00shi> iwilcox: Same here, I was hoping you guys could explain it to me. :)
106 2013-05-24 00:21:31 <marketdataguy> ok i'm just reading up on bitmessage
107 2013-05-24 00:21:35 <k00shi> gmaxwell: Such as?
108 2013-05-24 00:21:45 <iwilcox> k00shi: I suspect almost anyone here but me probably could :)
109 2013-05-24 00:22:10 <gmaxwell> k00shi: some of OT's security properties depend on OT users being able to publish receipts in a way that all OT users will see and that an OT server/attacker can not obstruct.
110 2013-05-24 00:22:10 <k00shi> :)
111 2013-05-24 00:22:15 brwyatt_ is now known as Away!~brwyatt@brwyatt.net|brwyatt_
112 2013-05-24 00:23:00 <gmaxwell> k00shi: bitmessage doesn't do that. It's just a non-reliable broadcast medium that uses hashcash to rate limit it. bitmessage nodes can freely drop messages and the drops are undetectable.
113 2013-05-24 00:23:06 macboz has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
114 2013-05-24 00:23:26 <marketdataguy> ok no bitmessage or anything like that would never work
115 2013-05-24 00:23:45 <gmaxwell> There are protocols for group communication where all messages are delivered or not, even with network attackers... bitmessage isn't one of them. (but I suppose you could run one on top of bitmessage)
116 2013-05-24 00:23:55 <marketdataguy> well not for what i'm trying to write... just a protocol that would enable p2p exchanges (among other things)
117 2013-05-24 00:24:12 <k00shi> hm
118 2013-05-24 00:24:23 <sipa> i don't even know what "p2p exchange" would mean
119 2013-05-24 00:24:37 Neozonz has joined
120 2013-05-24 00:24:49 <k00shi> sipa: Yeah I thought when people said that, they were talking about something in which the order book shared
121 2013-05-24 00:24:56 <k00shi> +was shared
122 2013-05-24 00:25:02 <marketdataguy> i mean decentralised ... and incidentally, my demo implementation would involve p2p
123 2013-05-24 00:25:06 <warren> sipa: it's a kneejerk thought that became popular after mtgox began being attacked
124 2013-05-24 00:25:25 <warren> people have a crazy idea that it's possible to make a decentralized exchange
125 2013-05-24 00:25:25 <michagogo> sipa: BTW, are there any other repos I should fork+clone besides bitcoin/gitian.sigs?
126 2013-05-24 00:25:36 <sipa> yes, i understand people want exchanges, and people like not needing to trust someone
127 2013-05-24 00:25:45 <sipa> but i don't see how those can be combines
128 2013-05-24 00:25:51 <warren> exactly
129 2013-05-24 00:25:53 <k00shi> warren: I hope someone quotes that one day, as a sign of how even the smartest people are sometimes wrong :)
130 2013-05-24 00:26:20 <sipa> michagogo: not afaik
131 2013-05-24 00:26:25 <warren> k00shi: go ahead and publish a paper on how to get rid of the trusted issuer problem
132 2013-05-24 00:26:31 Bohren has joined
133 2013-05-24 00:26:42 <marketdataguy> ok well perhaps it's not purely possible, but it is for some value of no trust
134 2013-05-24 00:26:52 <k00shi> warren: It won't be me, I assure you. :)
135 2013-05-24 00:27:05 <sipa> i know only one value of 'no' :p
136 2013-05-24 00:27:18 <sipa> certainly there are ways to limit the amount of trust necessary
137 2013-05-24 00:27:26 <michagogo> sipa: So is this right:
138 2013-05-24 00:27:26 <michagogo> micha@Micha-Ubuntu-ExtHD:~/BitcoinBuild/gitian-builder$ ./bin/gsign --signer michagogo --release v0.8.2rc2 --destination ../gitian.sigs/ ../bitcoin/contrib/gitian-descriptors/gitian.yml
139 2013-05-24 00:27:36 <sipa> like escrows that cannot steal funds
140 2013-05-24 00:27:52 <marketdataguy> no that's not enough
141 2013-05-24 00:28:15 caedes has quit (Quit: Saliendo)
142 2013-05-24 00:28:21 <knotwork> wow I am *still* on the same block number and *still* getting tons of orphan transactions
143 2013-05-24 00:28:24 <sipa> when exchanging against non-digital things, i don't think you can do better than that
144 2013-05-24 00:28:35 <sipa> knotwork: for how long have you been on the same block?
145 2013-05-24 00:28:47 <sipa> ;;blocks
146 2013-05-24 00:28:47 <gribble> 237599
147 2013-05-24 00:28:52 <michagogo> ;;tslb
148 2013-05-24 00:28:55 <gribble> Time since last block: 4 minutes and 57 seconds
149 2013-05-24 00:29:15 mrkent has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
150 2013-05-24 00:29:27 <knotwork> at 18:59 according to scrollback I posted block number
151 2013-05-24 00:29:36 <knotwork> now time says 21:06
152 2013-05-24 00:29:48 <michagogo> sipa: I thought you said that gsign doesn't have anythung to do with gpg?
153 2013-05-24 00:29:56 <sipa> michagogo: sure it does
154 2013-05-24 00:29:57 <michagogo> It's asking me for the passphrase to the key
155 2013-05-24 00:29:58 <knotwork> "blocks" : 237375,
156 2013-05-24 00:30:03 <sipa> michagogo: but $SIGNER doesn't
157 2013-05-24 00:30:07 <michagogo> sipa: Ah
158 2013-05-24 00:30:20 <michagogo> So you were just talking about the --signer parameter?
159 2013-05-24 00:30:23 <sipa> yes
160 2013-05-24 00:30:58 <marketdataguy> basically it would only work if the buyer is always paying in crypto
161 2013-05-24 00:31:08 <knotwork> hmm a differerent misbehaver too
162 2013-05-24 00:31:17 lolcookie__ has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
163 2013-05-24 00:31:18 <marketdataguy> it doesn't matter what he's buying or how long it takes to transfer or snail mail it to him
164 2013-05-24 00:31:22 <knotwork> maybe its my node that is misbehaving and thus thinks all the others are
165 2013-05-24 00:31:49 t2che has joined
166 2013-05-24 00:32:01 <sipa> knotwork: bitcoind or bitcoin-qt?
167 2013-05-24 00:32:04 tsche has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
168 2013-05-24 00:32:10 <knotwork> bitcoind
169 2013-05-24 00:32:19 <sipa> does getinfo show any error?
170 2013-05-24 00:32:33 <marketdataguy> because if for every transaction the buyer generates a keypair, and gives the public key to the seller, then the seller issues
171 2013-05-24 00:32:55 <michagogo> sipa: Okay, now building the win32 yml
172 2013-05-24 00:33:10 <knotwork> yes same error still possible out of sync
173 2013-05-24 00:33:20 <sipa> which error exactly?
174 2013-05-24 00:33:24 <knotwork> git pull finds lots of new changes since last time I pulled and compiled
175 2013-05-24 00:33:34 <marketdataguy> a message, initiating the transaction. this is added to a transaction chain
176 2013-05-24 00:33:38 <knotwork> "errors" : "Warning: Displayed transactions may not be correct! You may need to upgrade, or other nodes may need to upgrade."
177 2013-05-24 00:33:45 <sipa> knotwork: your database is corrupted
178 2013-05-24 00:33:47 <sipa> reindex
179 2013-05-24 00:33:54 <knotwork> it says that because it is stuck on old block I think
180 2013-05-24 00:34:08 <knotwork> "bitcoind reindex" ?
181 2013-05-24 00:34:09 <michagogo> sipa: How come the Windows build needs to include an Apple cert?
182 2013-05-24 00:34:11 <sipa> it says that because it considers the longest chain that it knows of invalid
183 2013-05-24 00:34:17 <sipa> michagogo: ?
184 2013-05-24 00:34:22 <sipa> knotwork: bitcoind -reindex
185 2013-05-24 00:35:25 <michagogo> sipa: BitcoinFoundation_Apple_Cert.pem
186 2013-05-24 00:35:31 <knotwork> ok
187 2013-05-24 00:35:33 <knotwork> thanks
188 2013-05-24 00:35:35 <michagogo> sipa: That was on the list of files for the win32 build
189 2013-05-24 00:35:54 <sipa> michagogo: it includes the entire source tree
190 2013-05-24 00:36:09 <michagogo> I see.
191 2013-05-24 00:37:14 <michagogo> Oh, wait
192 2013-05-24 00:37:24 <michagogo> I think I may have made a mistake
193 2013-05-24 00:37:27 <dugo> Init I buy 100 euro for 1 crypto 0xDEADBEEF ?
194 2013-05-24 00:37:31 <dugo> then what?
195 2013-05-24 00:38:17 <michagogo> sipa: In the gsign, zip, and mv for the linux build, I think I used v0.8.2rc2 instead of 0.8.2rc2
196 2013-05-24 00:38:47 <michagogo> sipa: Is that bad?
197 2013-05-24 00:38:53 <sipa> no idea
198 2013-05-24 00:40:28 <sipa> i have a script that does all things gitian for me
199 2013-05-24 00:40:35 <michagogo> What are pushd and popd?
200 2013-05-24 00:40:55 <sipa> man bash is your friend
201 2013-05-24 00:41:17 <michagogo> k
202 2013-05-24 00:41:55 <marketdataguy> dugo: right that goes in the chain, then the seller connects to the buyer with a secure connection, and the buyer signs the transaction for the seller
203 2013-05-24 00:42:23 <sipa> what if he doesn't?
204 2013-05-24 00:42:24 <marketdataguy> then the seller puts in the ledger chain SOLD to ADDR
205 2013-05-24 00:42:48 rdymac has quit (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep)
206 2013-05-24 00:43:07 <marketdataguy> as soon as the buyer can see that it is in the public ledger, he sends the crypto (in this case bitcoin)
207 2013-05-24 00:43:28 <sipa> what if he doesn't?
208 2013-05-24 00:45:01 <marketdataguy> well that can be verified can't it
209 2013-05-24 00:45:22 <marketdataguy> the pseudonomous ADDR would be linked to a bitcoin address
210 2013-05-24 00:46:40 <marketdataguy> so it goes:
211 2013-05-24 00:46:41 <marketdataguy> BUYER: I'm buying something worth N bitcoins - here is a public key
212 2013-05-24 00:46:46 <marketdataguy> SELLER: Here is a message signed with that public key
213 2013-05-24 00:46:50 <Michail1_> 1
214 2013-05-24 00:46:51 Michail1_ is now known as Michail1
215 2013-05-24 00:46:52 <marketdataguy> UYER: I have paid the seller - here is the bitcoin transfer
216 2013-05-24 00:47:31 duSn has joined
217 2013-05-24 00:48:04 <dugo> SELLER: oops, can't settle euros
218 2013-05-24 00:48:18 caput has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
219 2013-05-24 00:49:02 <michagogo> sipa: Okay, as far as I can tell, I finished building, signing, zipping, moving the linux and win32 builds
220 2013-05-24 00:49:15 <marketdataguy> well then the final part (where the BUYER adds that the 2nd part of the deal went through) wouldn't be added
221 2013-05-24 00:49:38 wamatt has quit (Quit: wamatt)
222 2013-05-24 00:49:43 <marketdataguy> obviously as a seller you wouldn't want to ahve an address which received a bunch of transactions but never get verified as having been fulfilled
223 2013-05-24 00:50:16 <marketdataguy> dugo: so this gives motivation for the sellers to only list in price matching mechanisms where then can settle
224 2013-05-24 00:50:56 wamatt has joined
225 2013-05-24 00:51:08 <marketdataguy> this doesn't elliminate counter-party risk but it's on the level of ebay scores which works well IRL
226 2013-05-24 00:51:39 wamatt has quit (Client Quit)
227 2013-05-24 00:52:00 <michagogo> sipa: What's next? The next step, repackage gitian builds for release as stand-alone zip/tar/installer exe, looks like part of the actual release
228 2013-05-24 00:52:05 <BCB> i'm trying to test rc2. is this it: v0.8.1.0-g34d62a8-beta
229 2013-05-24 00:52:22 <dugo> no, doesn't work well enough in the real world .. that's why you see banks moving more and more business over to central counterparties
230 2013-05-24 00:52:30 <sipa> michagogo: pullrequest your gitian.sigs change
231 2013-05-24 00:52:49 <michagogo> sipa: So I do the steps under "Commit your signature to gitian.sigs:"?
232 2013-05-24 00:52:53 <marketdataguy> further, if a buyer wants to purchase from a seller that doesn't have very much history yet, the transaction could be insured with some pretty simple protocol language
233 2013-05-24 00:53:33 <sipa> BCB: that's 0.8.1
234 2013-05-24 00:53:37 <sipa> not 0.8.2rc2
235 2013-05-24 00:53:40 <BCB> damn!
236 2013-05-24 00:53:56 <dugo> who is going to assume the cp risk then?
237 2013-05-24 00:54:26 <marketdataguy> dugo: wouldn't you say that a system like that would be good enough for micro-medium payments and small exchange trades. as the web builds it would only become more stable
238 2013-05-24 00:54:36 <michagogo> sipa: Is there a commit message I should use?
239 2013-05-24 00:54:43 <marketdataguy> counter party risk could be assumed by "insurance entities"
240 2013-05-24 00:55:04 <michagogo> sipa: Nvm, I see what others are using
241 2013-05-24 00:56:16 <marketdataguy> an insurance entity might be in a better position to analyse the seller's position, or might have an inside scoop on the seller (i.e. the courier for a trinket maker, knows that he makes trinkets)
242 2013-05-24 00:56:38 <marketdataguy> as such he could set a rate at which he could accept risk
243 2013-05-24 00:56:52 <marketdataguy> i would do so for everyone in my office at 2% for the hassle
244 2013-05-24 00:57:00 <marketdataguy> and my friends etc i would do for 1%
245 2013-05-24 00:57:28 <marketdataguy> so
246 2013-05-24 00:57:29 <marketdataguy> BUYER: I want to buy something for N bitcoins from SELLER, guaranteed by INSURANCE1 (40% of value, 1% fee), INSURANCE2 (60% of value, 2% fee) - [public key A]
247 2013-05-24 00:57:35 <marketdataguy> INSURANCE1: Yeah
248 2013-05-24 00:57:39 <marketdataguy> INSURANCE2: Totally
249 2013-05-24 00:57:43 <marketdataguy> SELLER: Agreed
250 2013-05-24 00:57:48 <marketdataguy> BUYER: I have paid - here is the transaction in the history
251 2013-05-24 00:58:16 <marketdataguy> then 2 outcomes are possible:
252 2013-05-24 00:58:18 <marketdataguy> SELLER: Item sent
253 2013-05-24 00:58:23 <michagogo> sipa: https://github.com/bitcoin/gitian.sigs/pull/4
254 2013-05-24 00:58:27 <marketdataguy> BUYER: Item not received after 2 hours :(
255 2013-05-24 00:58:33 <marketdataguy> INSURANCE1: Settled in favour of BUYER
256 2013-05-24 00:58:39 <marketdataguy> INSURANCE2: Settled in favour of BUYER
257 2013-05-24 00:58:51 <warren> marketdataguy: could you please discuss this elsewhere for now? the devs are busy trying to get 0.8.2 built
258 2013-05-24 00:59:00 <BCB> sipa git checkout v0.8.2rc2
259 2013-05-24 00:59:02 <BCB> correct
260 2013-05-24 00:59:03 arvicco has joined
261 2013-05-24 00:59:09 <marketdataguy> certainly
262 2013-05-24 00:59:26 <sipa> BCB: yes
263 2013-05-24 00:59:33 <BCB> then what??
264 2013-05-24 00:59:34 <michagogo> sipa: Did I do everything right? (I have a strong suspicion I did not)
265 2013-05-24 00:59:56 <marketdataguy> warren: where would be a good place to discuss something like this
266 2013-05-24 01:00:12 <sipa> BCB: build it
267 2013-05-24 01:00:19 <BCB> gmake
268 2013-05-24 01:00:20 toffoo has quit ()
269 2013-05-24 01:00:21 <BCB> make
270 2013-05-24 01:00:22 <BCB> ??
271 2013-05-24 01:00:27 <sipa> BCB: bitcoin-qt or bitcoind?
272 2013-05-24 01:00:30 <BCB> bitdcoind
273 2013-05-24 01:00:33 <BCB> bitcoind
274 2013-05-24 01:00:36 <sipa> michagogo: well, your binary doesn't match with luke's and gavin's
275 2013-05-24 01:00:42 <michagogo> wut
276 2013-05-24 01:00:47 Neozonz has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
277 2013-05-24 01:00:53 <michagogo> Oh, wait a second
278 2013-05-24 01:00:55 <michagogo> I just looked
279 2013-05-24 01:00:57 <sipa> BCB: read doc/build-unix.txt
280 2013-05-24 01:01:02 <michagogo> I know what went wrong, I think
281 2013-05-24 01:01:57 <arvicco> guys, is this the right place to ask for some testnet coins?
282 2013-05-24 01:02:11 <michagogo> arvicco: google bitcoin testnet faucet
283 2013-05-24 01:02:19 <arvicco> cool, thanks!
284 2013-05-24 01:02:27 <michagogo> sipa: I think I somehow ended up with 2 copies of the win32 build
285 2013-05-24 01:02:35 <BCB> "make -f makefile.unix" is returning "/bin/sh ../share/genbuild.sh obj/build.h"
286 2013-05-24 01:02:37 <BCB> ??
287 2013-05-24 01:03:01 <dugo> marketdataguy: see priv. rest: sry for the noise
288 2013-05-24 01:03:28 <sipa> BCB: sounds good
289 2013-05-24 01:03:35 <BCB> so I'm done
290 2013-05-24 01:03:39 <sipa> yes
291 2013-05-24 01:03:45 <michagogo> sipa: rebuilding linux
292 2013-05-24 01:04:37 <BCB> sipa: stil getting Bitcoin version v0.8.1.0-g34d62a8-beta
293 2013-05-24 01:04:43 <BCB> bitcoind --help
294 2013-05-24 01:05:15 <sipa> BCB: use ./bitcoind
295 2013-05-24 01:05:30 <sipa> bitcoind is the system-wide installation, not the one you just built
296 2013-05-24 01:06:11 <BCB> sipa: so how to I confirm the installed version
297 2013-05-24 01:06:24 warren has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
298 2013-05-24 01:06:39 <michagogo> [03:41:53] <sipa> BCB: use ./bitcoind
299 2013-05-24 01:06:40 <sipa> what do you mean with 'installed version' ?
300 2013-05-24 01:06:47 warren has joined
301 2013-05-24 01:07:14 <BCB> sipa: what cmd tells me the version of bitcoind I am running
302 2013-05-24 01:07:15 <BCB> getinfo
303 2013-05-24 01:07:17 <BCB> --help
304 2013-05-24 01:07:19 <BCB> ??
305 2013-05-24 01:07:50 <sipa> getinfo yes
306 2013-05-24 01:08:04 <sipa> but you did not _install_ the version you just built
307 2013-05-24 01:08:07 <sipa> and typically, you don't
308 2013-05-24 01:08:11 <michagogo> BCB: If bitcoind's running, do bitcoind stop
309 2013-05-24 01:08:17 <sipa> you just refer to it explicitly when running it
310 2013-05-24 01:08:18 <michagogo> Then, do ./bitcoind
311 2013-05-24 01:08:36 <BCB> ahh
312 2013-05-24 01:08:44 <BCB> "version" : 80201
313 2013-05-24 01:08:46 <BCB> is that it
314 2013-05-24 01:09:20 <sipa> yes
315 2013-05-24 01:09:24 <BCB> TY!
316 2013-05-24 01:09:26 <sipa> looks good
317 2013-05-24 01:10:01 <michagogo> Okay, linux32 build complete, it's doing linux64 now
318 2013-05-24 01:10:50 caput has joined
319 2013-05-24 01:11:19 <BCB> sipa: so how do I test it
320 2013-05-24 01:11:31 wamatt has joined
321 2013-05-24 01:12:49 <sipa> what do you want to test?
322 2013-05-24 01:13:41 <BCB> sipa: what needs testing
323 2013-05-24 01:13:48 iwilcox has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
324 2013-05-24 01:13:54 <BCB> sipa just use it regularly
325 2013-05-24 01:13:56 <BCB> ??
326 2013-05-24 01:13:56 iwilcox has joined
327 2013-05-24 01:13:56 iwilcox has quit (Changing host)
328 2013-05-24 01:13:56 iwilcox has joined
329 2013-05-24 01:14:09 <sipa> BCB: yes
330 2013-05-24 01:14:24 warren has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
331 2013-05-24 01:14:50 <BCB> ok
332 2013-05-24 01:14:52 <BCB> thx
333 2013-05-24 01:16:01 EvilPete has joined
334 2013-05-24 01:16:20 warren has joined
335 2013-05-24 01:16:20 warren has quit (Changing host)
336 2013-05-24 01:16:20 warren has joined
337 2013-05-24 01:20:29 Neozonz has joined
338 2013-05-24 01:20:45 * nsh frowns
339 2013-05-24 01:21:01 <michagogo> sipa: Are all 3 bitcoin-build.assert files for each platform supposed to be identical?
340 2013-05-24 01:21:09 <michagogo> Because they aren't, as far as I can tell
341 2013-05-24 01:21:35 savetheinternet has quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
342 2013-05-24 01:21:52 <sipa> michagogo: just look at the binaries
343 2013-05-24 01:22:15 <michagogo> Binaries?
344 2013-05-24 01:22:44 <sipa> just at the line referring to the binary in the .assert file
345 2013-05-24 01:22:52 <BCB> nsh: why are you frowning
346 2013-05-24 01:22:55 Neozonz has joined
347 2013-05-24 01:23:22 <michagogo> sipa: Oh, only lines 5-8?
348 2013-05-24 01:24:40 <michagogo> sipa: Those 4 lines in linux match between the 3 of us, as do daemon/bitcoind.exe of win32
349 2013-05-24 01:24:54 <michagogo> But we each have a different bitcoin-qt.exe and bitcoin-0.8.2-win32-setup.exe
350 2013-05-24 01:25:06 <sipa> yeah, talk to them
351 2013-05-24 01:25:40 gjj has joined
352 2013-05-24 01:26:06 nizeguy has quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
353 2013-05-24 01:26:36 Neozonz has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
354 2013-05-24 01:27:52 iwilcox_ has joined
355 2013-05-24 01:27:52 iwilcox_ has quit (Changing host)
356 2013-05-24 01:27:52 iwilcox_ has joined
357 2013-05-24 01:28:04 <michagogo> sipa: Tomorrow maybe. For now I need to go to sleep... It's 4 am.
358 2013-05-24 01:28:09 michagogo has quit (Quit: goodnight)
359 2013-05-24 01:28:30 iwilcox has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
360 2013-05-24 01:28:31 <nsh> BCB, i was frowning at jeff anonymity/ideology/servility reasons
361 2013-05-24 01:28:38 <nsh> not particularly important
362 2013-05-24 01:29:52 <BCB> nsh ahh
363 2013-05-24 01:33:15 gjj has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
364 2013-05-24 01:34:32 bitit has joined
365 2013-05-24 01:36:04 Neozonz has joined
366 2013-05-24 01:39:48 Neozonz has quit (Disc!~Neozonz@unaffiliated/neozonz|Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
367 2013-05-24 01:40:35 <BCB> sipa: "total_amount" : 10650164.89501183 is total coin in circulation (including lost coin)?
368 2013-05-24 01:40:49 <sipa> yes
369 2013-05-24 01:41:23 <nimdAHK> ermh
370 2013-05-24 01:42:01 <nimdAHK> you getting that from your bitcoin build?
371 2013-05-24 01:42:16 <sipa> he is
372 2013-05-24 01:42:24 <sipa> 0.8.2 has a gettxoutsetinfo command that reports this
373 2013-05-24 01:42:44 <nimdAHK> it's got to be excluding something
374 2013-05-24 01:42:49 ralphtheninja has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
375 2013-05-24 01:42:59 <gmaxwell> It's not.
376 2013-05-24 01:43:04 <nimdAHK> ?!
377 2013-05-24 01:43:19 <nimdAHK> how then does it have decimals?
378 2013-05-24 01:43:28 <sipa> some people have been stupid
379 2013-05-24 01:43:42 <gmaxwell> Gavin and midnightmagic to be specific. :P
380 2013-05-24 01:43:47 <sipa> (not claiming all fees they could have)
381 2013-05-24 01:43:49 tg has quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
382 2013-05-24 01:44:00 <nimdAHK> ahh
383 2013-05-24 01:44:03 <nimdAHK> it's like paying a fee
384 2013-05-24 01:44:09 <nimdAHK> but nobody gets it that time
385 2013-05-24 01:44:24 <sipa> yes, and those coins are just gone then
386 2013-05-24 01:44:34 <nimdAHK> can you create a block without outputs?
387 2013-05-24 01:44:40 <nimdAHK> tossing all 25 coins?
388 2013-05-24 01:44:47 <gmaxwell> you can make the output value 0.
389 2013-05-24 01:44:55 <nimdAHK> huh
390 2013-05-24 01:45:02 <sipa> coins can have value 0
391 2013-05-24 01:45:06 <sipa> (unfortunately...)
392 2013-05-24 01:45:08 <gmaxwell> There has to be an output but the value can be zero.
393 2013-05-24 01:45:19 <nimdAHK> intredesting
394 2013-05-24 01:45:31 <sipa> there can even multiple outputs, each 0
395 2013-05-24 01:46:31 <nimdAHK> can those be pruned?
396 2013-05-24 01:46:41 beethoven8201 has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
397 2013-05-24 01:46:42 <nimdAHK> better question
398 2013-05-24 01:46:46 <nimdAHK> can they be spent?
399 2013-05-24 01:47:34 <sipa> they cannot be pruned; they can be spent
400 2013-05-24 01:47:39 <sipa> (non-standard, but valid)
401 2013-05-24 01:48:11 saracen has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
402 2013-05-24 01:49:16 <nimdAHK> hmph
403 2013-05-24 01:49:36 <nimdAHK> disk-space DoS material right there
404 2013-05-24 01:49:47 marketdataguy has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
405 2013-05-24 01:50:08 <nimdAHK> although I suppose SatoshiDICE is doing a fine job of that anyhow
406 2013-05-24 01:50:51 jedunnigan has joined
407 2013-05-24 01:51:26 <warren> why can't you prune a 0 output?
408 2013-05-24 01:51:32 <gmaxwell> Because it can be spent.
409 2013-05-24 01:51:55 <warren> can a future rule change make it unspendable?
410 2013-05-24 01:52:03 <sipa> yes
411 2013-05-24 01:52:05 <warren> ok
412 2013-05-24 01:52:23 <gmaxwell> More important to get them impossible to make.
413 2013-05-24 01:52:37 <gmaxwell> If you can make them then someone might come to depend on them and insist they not be made unspendable.
414 2013-05-24 01:52:50 Diapolis_ has joined
415 2013-05-24 01:53:14 <sipa> being unspendable is observationally the same as not being able to create them
416 2013-05-24 01:53:24 saracen has joined
417 2013-05-24 01:53:25 BTCOxygen has joined
418 2013-05-24 01:53:25 BTCOxygen is now known as Guest64877
419 2013-05-24 01:53:25 Guest64877 has quit (Killed (asimov.freenode.net (Nickname regained by services)))
420 2013-05-24 01:53:25 BTCOxygen is now known as 1!~BTCOxygen@unaffiliated/btcoxygen|BTCOxygen
421 2013-05-24 01:53:40 <sipa> (except for people looking at the UTXO set directly, of course)
422 2013-05-24 01:53:48 <gmaxwell> Rather, I suppose we'd keep provably unspendable ones possible to make... simply because there are some cases where you actually need them.
423 2013-05-24 01:53:53 jedunnigan has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
424 2013-05-24 01:53:59 <BCB> sipa: how can i tell from the cli when my node is synced?
425 2013-05-24 01:54:08 Diapolis has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
426 2013-05-24 01:54:15 <sipa> BCB: a node is never synced
427 2013-05-24 01:54:18 <sipa> :p
428 2013-05-24 01:54:27 <BCB> sipa: hmm
429 2013-05-24 01:54:34 <BCB> sipa: then what am I running
430 2013-05-24 01:54:43 <BCB> or should I say up to date
431 2013-05-24 01:54:46 <BCB> ??
432 2013-05-24 01:54:50 <BCB> help me out here
433 2013-05-24 01:54:59 <gmaxwell> BCB: it's always syncing.
434 2013-05-24 01:55:02 <sipa> BCB: there is no essential difference between syncing and not: it downloads every block it knows of, and it doesn't know whether there are blocks it doesn't know
435 2013-05-24 01:55:26 <gmaxwell> even if it thinks some peers might have more blocks, until it has accepted them it doesn't know it for sure.
436 2013-05-24 01:55:32 Aurigae has left ()
437 2013-05-24 01:55:35 <sipa> there is a heuristic to determine whether it's doing an "initial sync", but that's just a guess
438 2013-05-24 01:55:35 <BCB> hmmm
439 2013-05-24 01:55:46 <BCB> so you are saying a node is never synced
440 2013-05-24 01:55:50 <sipa> yes
441 2013-05-24 01:55:52 <BCB> but always snycing
442 2013-05-24 01:56:01 <sipa> it is always fetching every block it sees
443 2013-05-24 01:56:07 tg has joined
444 2013-05-24 01:56:12 <BCB> then how can I tell if my node is "relatively current"
445 2013-05-24 01:56:43 <gmaxwell> BCB: you might guess based on the most recent blocks having a timestamp close to now... though the timestamps are not terribly accurate and long gaps happen.
446 2013-05-24 01:56:56 <sipa> look at the timestamp of the last block (getinfo, getblockhash, getblock), or try doing a getwork (which will fail if it's far behind its peers)
447 2013-05-24 01:57:32 <BCB> good one sipa: error: {"code":-10,"message":"Bitcoin is downloading blocks..."}
448 2013-05-24 01:58:05 <BCB> do you guy know that sipa has written more lines of new code for the official implimentation the satoshi did??
449 2013-05-24 01:58:21 <BCB> *then
450 2013-05-24 01:58:30 BurtyB has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
451 2013-05-24 01:58:49 <sipa> he didn't
452 2013-05-24 01:58:56 <gmaxwell> BCB: I checked that I thought a month ago and reached the opposite conclusion. You sure about that?
453 2013-05-24 01:59:00 BurtyB has joined
454 2013-05-24 01:59:11 <BCB> gmaxwell: you better ask Gavin about that
455 2013-05-24 01:59:19 <gmaxwell> I don't have to ask gavin about that.
456 2013-05-24 01:59:34 <BCB> Sipa so gavin was lying
457 2013-05-24 01:59:43 <gmaxwell> 0_o
458 2013-05-24 01:59:57 <copumpkin> o_O
459 2013-05-24 02:00:03 <gmaxwell> Uh. There are more options than "lying" and "correct".
460 2013-05-24 02:00:04 <sipa> no, he uses the criterion "count the number of lines last touched by every person", and saw that within the core code, i am #1
461 2013-05-24 02:00:06 beethoven8201 has joined
462 2013-05-24 02:00:20 <sipa> that is however something very different from "having written most lines"
463 2013-05-24 02:00:24 <warren> You can quell this controversy by equating sipa with satoshi.
464 2013-05-24 02:00:30 beethoven8201 is now known as Guest39506
465 2013-05-24 02:00:35 <gonffen> somebody contact ted nelso
466 2013-05-24 02:00:38 <gonffen> nelson*
467 2013-05-24 02:00:42 <sipa> warren: i am unable to write more code than myself
468 2013-05-24 02:00:44 <sipa> *oops*
469 2013-05-24 02:00:54 <warren> mind blown
470 2013-05-24 02:01:11 <gmaxwell> warren: great, now you've gone and turned it into a paradox!
471 2013-05-24 02:01:37 <BCB> gmaxwell: where you at the conference
472 2013-05-24 02:02:12 <gmaxwell> I am not currently at the conference, the conference is over.
473 2013-05-24 02:02:28 <warren> gmaxwell: the bitcoin tabloid needs more material
474 2013-05-24 02:02:38 <warren> no more lawsuits or DHS action to write about
475 2013-05-24 02:02:39 <sipa> just to be clear: many of my "last touched" lines are refactors of other people's code
476 2013-05-24 02:02:46 <sipa> or simple code movement
477 2013-05-24 02:03:18 iwilcox has joined
478 2013-05-24 02:03:54 <warren> sipa: so sipa == satoshi == linus
479 2013-05-24 02:03:56 <gmaxwell> BCB: if you instead meant to ask, "were you at the conference?" â I was.
480 2013-05-24 02:04:19 <BCB> where you at the developer roundtable
481 2013-05-24 02:04:23 <sipa> he wasn't
482 2013-05-24 02:04:26 <BCB> ahh ok
483 2013-05-24 02:04:41 <gmaxwell> I got grabbed by someone in the hall, apparently.
484 2013-05-24 02:04:41 <BCB> that was the only time I got to hang with the cool kids
485 2013-05-24 02:04:59 <BCB> sipa who was that guy doing all the arguing
486 2013-05-24 02:05:04 <BCB> (and way)
487 2013-05-24 02:05:04 <sipa> petertodd
488 2013-05-24 02:05:13 <BCB> it he a dev
489 2013-05-24 02:05:21 <BCB> (and the devil's advocate??)
490 2013-05-24 02:05:26 <sipa> he has written code for the reference client
491 2013-05-24 02:05:34 <BCB> sipa: so what was his point
492 2013-05-24 02:05:54 <sipa> he has many points
493 2013-05-24 02:06:05 <BCB> sipa clearly
494 2013-05-24 02:06:14 iwilcox_ has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
495 2013-05-24 02:06:18 <BCB> so you are not going there?
496 2013-05-24 02:06:54 <sipa> where?
497 2013-05-24 02:07:36 <BCB> sipa: i'm just trying to understand what point petertodd was trying to make andy why vanesses got pissed off
498 2013-05-24 02:08:11 <duSn> BCB what soap you watching
499 2013-05-24 02:08:39 <sipa> he mainly argues in favor of limiting block sizes to ensure the system remains decentralized, and in favor of abolishing the zero-conirmation protection attempt offered by the current network
500 2013-05-24 02:08:49 <sipa> which i guess businesses don't like
501 2013-05-24 02:09:04 <BCB> sipa is that an anominity feature
502 2013-05-24 02:09:08 <sipa> no
503 2013-05-24 02:09:08 toffoo has joined
504 2013-05-24 02:09:09 <BCB> smaller block size
505 2013-05-24 02:09:20 <BCB> that seemed to be what he was worried about
506 2013-05-24 02:09:35 <BCB> it is a security issue
507 2013-05-24 02:09:38 <BCB> is it
508 2013-05-24 02:09:41 <sipa> his argument was that increased block sizes will make it harder for miners to be anonymous
509 2013-05-24 02:09:53 <sipa> which could be a step towards centralization
510 2013-05-24 02:10:03 <BCB> is he a miner
511 2013-05-24 02:10:05 <BCB> ?
512 2013-05-24 02:10:13 <sipa> i don't think so, but that isn't relevant
513 2013-05-24 02:10:26 <BCB> it would if he is trying to hide assest from the govnt
514 2013-05-24 02:10:37 <BCB> which it sounded like what he was talking about
515 2013-05-24 02:10:42 <sipa> yes
516 2013-05-24 02:10:52 <BCB> and in light of all the REGULATION doom and gloom that would be a very BIG concern
517 2013-05-24 02:11:26 <sipa> he wants to avoid the fact that mining becomes such a burden that it becomes impossible to do without becoming inevitably visible to regulators
518 2013-05-24 02:11:38 <BCB> to be honest I felt like part of the conference was Vannesses effort to centralize, comercialize and regulate bitcoin
519 2013-05-24 02:11:39 <nsh> it's an argument to be made.
520 2013-05-24 02:11:57 <BCB> for the sake of more VC money
521 2013-05-24 02:12:08 <BCB> sorry if this is the wrong channel
522 2013-05-24 02:12:18 <nsh> (probably)
523 2013-05-24 02:12:38 <BCB> how do you convert_unix_time_in_linux(unix_time_stamp):
524 2013-05-24 02:13:20 <BCB> wait there is no timestamp in "getinfo"
525 2013-05-24 02:13:32 <BCB> is there?
526 2013-05-24 02:13:43 <sipa> getinfo reports the height, feed that height into getblockhash, feed the obtained hash into getblock
527 2013-05-24 02:13:47 <sipa> there is your timestamp
528 2013-05-24 02:18:01 meLon has joined
529 2013-05-24 02:18:32 <BCB> sipa height on rc2??
530 2013-05-24 02:18:44 savetheinternet has joined
531 2013-05-24 02:18:46 <sipa> ?
532 2013-05-24 02:19:04 <BCB> getinfo does not return height
533 2013-05-24 02:19:07 <BCB> for me..
534 2013-05-24 02:19:07 <sipa> it's called blocks
535 2013-05-24 02:19:14 <BCB> height is call bocks
536 2013-05-24 02:19:16 <BCB> ?
537 2013-05-24 02:19:18 <BCB> blocks
538 2013-05-24 02:19:27 <sipa> getinfo returns "blocks":
539 2013-05-24 02:19:33 <BCB> sipa: right
540 2013-05-24 02:19:37 <BCB> you said height
541 2013-05-24 02:19:45 <sipa> it's actually the height of the last block that's returned there
542 2013-05-24 02:19:59 <sipa> i don't know how every key name of the entire RPC is called by heart!
543 2013-05-24 02:20:12 <BCB> sipa: me neither
544 2013-05-24 02:21:04 <BCB> so how do I convert the unix_time_stamp to a date time?
545 2013-05-24 02:21:55 <sipa> date --date "@11872638715"
546 2013-05-24 02:22:35 <BCB> ty
547 2013-05-24 02:22:53 defunctzombie_zz is now known as defunctzombie
548 2013-05-24 02:23:10 <BCB> then how do I convert the time off set: "timeoffset" : -10,
549 2013-05-24 02:24:46 <BCB> anyone
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557 2013-05-24 02:36:21 px has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
558 2013-05-24 02:38:52 Diapolis_ has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
559 2013-05-24 02:39:55 FredEE has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
560 2013-05-24 02:40:24 savetheinternet has quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
561 2013-05-24 02:41:08 Bohren has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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563 2013-05-24 02:44:12 defunctzombie is now known as defunctzombie_zz
564 2013-05-24 02:44:27 <sipa> BCB: it's in seconds
565 2013-05-24 02:44:50 <sipa> nothing to convert
566 2013-05-24 02:44:50 Bohren has joined
567 2013-05-24 02:45:20 <BCB> sipa what is the "timeoffset" : -10,
568 2013-05-24 02:45:22 <BCB> ??
569 2013-05-24 02:45:44 <sipa> the measured difference between your clock and that of your peers
570 2013-05-24 02:45:47 <sipa> in seconds
571 2013-05-24 02:45:54 tg has joined
572 2013-05-24 02:46:27 yubrew has joined
573 2013-05-24 02:46:43 XtraGas has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
574 2013-05-24 02:47:31 _maniac_ has joined
575 2013-05-24 02:48:25 defunctzombie_zz is now known as defunctzombie
576 2013-05-24 02:49:26 <BCB> sipa is that offset a good or bad thing?
577 2013-05-24 02:49:26 px has joined
578 2013-05-24 02:49:40 <sipa> it likely means your clock is 10s off!
579 2013-05-24 02:50:11 <BCB> how so i correct my clock
580 2013-05-24 02:50:57 malaimo has joined
581 2013-05-24 02:52:56 savetheinternet has joined
582 2013-05-24 02:55:02 beethoven8201 has joined
583 2013-05-24 02:55:26 beethoven8201 is now known as Guest26495
584 2013-05-24 02:56:04 brson has quit (Quit: leaving)
585 2013-05-24 02:57:21 fiesh has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
586 2013-05-24 02:58:44 defunctzombie is now known as defunctzombie_zz
587 2013-05-24 03:00:03 <BTCOxygen> BCB: ntpd start
588 2013-05-24 03:00:19 <BCB> on ubuntu?
589 2013-05-24 03:00:41 <BCB> BTCOxygen: no package
590 2013-05-24 03:01:07 fiesh has joined
591 2013-05-24 03:01:27 <BTCOxygen> ah On ubuntu
592 2013-05-24 03:01:28 <BTCOxygen> ntpdate pool.ntp.org
593 2013-05-24 03:01:49 <BTCOxygen> ntpd start is for CentOS
594 2013-05-24 03:02:07 <BCB> BTCOxygen: I got one of those too =-{
595 2013-05-24 03:02:19 <BTCOxygen> heh
596 2013-05-24 03:02:33 <BCB> =-(
597 2013-05-24 03:02:40 <BCB> why is my time still offset -8.684668 sec
598 2013-05-24 03:02:48 <BTCOxygen> Output : 24 May 02:37:56 ntpdate[21605]: adjust time server 37.34.58.57 offset 0.003814 sec
599 2013-05-24 03:03:14 <BCB> what??
600 2013-05-24 03:03:24 <BCB> and bitcoind is reporting "timeoffset" : -10,
601 2013-05-24 03:03:39 <BTCOxygen> What does ntpdate pool.ntp.org output for you?
602 2013-05-24 03:04:39 <BCB> 24 May 02:41:05 ntpdate[27530]: adjust time server 66.225.61.66 offset 0.008159 sec
603 2013-05-24 03:04:48 <sipa> ok, good
604 2013-05-24 03:04:51 <BTCOxygen> ./bitcoind getinfo
605 2013-05-24 03:04:52 <BTCOxygen> {
606 2013-05-24 03:04:52 <BTCOxygen> "version" : 80100,
607 2013-05-24 03:04:52 <BTCOxygen> "protocolversion" : 70001,
608 2013-05-24 03:04:52 <BTCOxygen> "walletversion" : 60000,
609 2013-05-24 03:04:52 <BTCOxygen> "balance" : ---------,
610 2013-05-24 03:04:52 <BTCOxygen> "blocks" : 237614,
611 2013-05-24 03:04:53 <BTCOxygen> "connections" : 8,
612 2013-05-24 03:04:53 <BTCOxygen> "proxy" : "",
613 2013-05-24 03:04:54 <BTCOxygen> "difficulty" : 11187257.46136079,
614 2013-05-24 03:04:54 <BTCOxygen> "testnet" : false,
615 2013-05-24 03:04:55 <BTCOxygen> "keypoololdest" : 1368038965,
616 2013-05-24 03:05:02 <sipa> BTCOxygen: please use a paste site
617 2013-05-24 03:05:11 <BTCOxygen> sorry.
618 2013-05-24 03:05:13 <BCB> BTC I'm on rc2
619 2013-05-24 03:05:23 <BCB> still reporting "timeoffset" : -10,
620 2013-05-24 03:05:29 <gonffen> win 11
621 2013-05-24 03:05:34 <BCB> do I have to restart bitcoind
622 2013-05-24 03:05:42 <BTCOxygen> BCB: Try that.
623 2013-05-24 03:05:53 <sipa> no, but it will take a long time before your peer data is different
624 2013-05-24 03:06:12 <BCB> sipa so what is the offset reporting
625 2013-05-24 03:06:14 <BCB> ??
626 2013-05-24 03:06:25 <sipa> the measured difference between your peer's timestamps and yours
627 2013-05-24 03:06:36 <sipa> at the time you first connected to them
628 2013-05-24 03:06:51 <BCB> hmmm
629 2013-05-24 03:07:05 <BTCOxygen> <BCB> 24 May 02:41:05 ntpdate[27530]: adjust time server 66.225.61.66 offset 0.008159 sec
630 2013-05-24 03:07:06 <BTCOxygen> ^^^ If bitcoind is still reporting more offset that ^^^ displays something might be wrong with bitcoind R2 :P
631 2013-05-24 03:07:19 <BTCOxygen> than*
632 2013-05-24 03:07:21 <sipa> not at all
633 2013-05-24 03:07:30 <sipa> _at the time you first connected to them_
634 2013-05-24 03:07:39 <sipa> peers rotate very slowly
635 2013-05-24 03:07:43 andytoshi has joined
636 2013-05-24 03:07:56 <sipa> so it takes a long time before you'll get new offset data
637 2013-05-24 03:07:57 <BCB> sipa and why is the time offset relevent
638 2013-05-24 03:08:08 <sipa> because bitcoin is a timestamping protocol
639 2013-05-24 03:08:33 <sipa> (though an offset of even several minutes won't hurt)
640 2013-05-24 03:08:42 <sipa> if you're hours off, there is a problem
641 2013-05-24 03:08:43 <BTCOxygen> I got a few rejected blocks due to having wrong time on my server. :P
642 2013-05-24 03:09:00 <BTCOxygen> And I was only 4 hours off. :P
643 2013-05-24 03:09:03 btcquant has joined
644 2013-05-24 03:09:16 RBecker is now known as rbecker
645 2013-05-24 03:09:45 <BCB> sipa ahh ok. so 10 secs in neglible
646 2013-05-24 03:10:36 <BTCOxygen> sipa: Are you on any other channel ?
647 2013-05-24 03:11:05 <BTCOxygen> I only see you in #bitcoin-dev . :P
648 2013-05-24 03:11:48 FredEE has joined
649 2013-05-24 03:11:50 <BCB> BTCOxygen: sipa ===satoshi
650 2013-05-24 03:11:58 <BTCOxygen> lol
651 2013-05-24 03:13:54 <BCB> sipa: did you take walletnotify out of rc2
652 2013-05-24 03:15:16 <sipa> no
653 2013-05-24 03:19:44 <BCB> sipa I don't see it
654 2013-05-24 03:19:46 <BCB> bitcoind help
655 2013-05-24 03:19:54 <BCB> or ./bitcoind help
656 2013-05-24 03:20:28 Goonie_ has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
657 2013-05-24 03:21:21 <sipa> it's not an rpc command
658 2013-05-24 03:21:27 <sipa> it's a command-line option
659 2013-05-24 03:21:30 sark has quit (!~sark@37-252-106-157.ip.skylogicnet.com|Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
660 2013-05-24 03:21:46 <BCB> and the command would be??
661 2013-05-24 03:21:55 <BCB> (im in the cmd line
662 2013-05-24 03:21:56 <BCB> )
663 2013-05-24 03:22:02 <sipa> -walletnotify=command
664 2013-05-24 03:22:19 <BCB> but where do I list the cmd's
665 2013-05-24 03:22:31 <BCB> like 'in bitcoind help
666 2013-05-24 03:22:38 <BCB> which lists all the RPC cmds
667 2013-05-24 03:22:45 <sipa> you're confusing things
668 2013-05-24 03:22:53 <BCB> is there a similar feature for the cmd line cmds
669 2013-05-24 03:22:56 sark has joined
670 2013-05-24 03:22:57 <sipa> yes
671 2013-05-24 03:23:08 <sipa> bitcoind -help
672 2013-05-24 03:24:36 <BCB> bitcoind -help
673 2013-05-24 03:24:38 <BCB> Error: Cannot obtain a lock on data directory /home/ubuntu/.bitcoin. Bitcoin is probably already running.
674 2013-05-24 03:24:52 Bohren has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
675 2013-05-24 03:25:10 <sipa> that probably means it is
676 2013-05-24 03:27:03 <BTCOxygen> BCB: Try ./bitcoind stop
677 2013-05-24 03:27:10 <BTCOxygen> Then ./bitcoind -help
678 2013-05-24 03:27:24 resinate has joined
679 2013-05-24 03:27:51 <BCB> that just start bitcoind back up
680 2013-05-24 03:27:56 <BCB> starts
681 2013-05-24 03:28:06 savetheinternet has quit (Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com)
682 2013-05-24 03:28:40 <sipa> ah, it's --help
683 2013-05-24 03:28:44 <sipa> apologies
684 2013-05-24 03:29:35 <BCB> sipa only wallet commands are
685 2013-05-24 03:29:40 <BCB> -upgradewallet
686 2013-05-24 03:29:44 <BCB> and --salvagewallet
687 2013-05-24 03:29:55 <BCB> no -verifywallet
688 2013-05-24 03:30:16 ngc0202 has quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
689 2013-05-24 03:30:36 <BCB> no -alertnotify
690 2013-05-24 03:31:02 <BCB> ahhhhhhhhh
691 2013-05-24 03:31:11 <BCB> now I kind of know what ./ means
692 2013-05-24 03:31:21 <BCB> can someone explain
693 2013-05-24 03:31:23 <BCB> please
694 2013-05-24 03:31:27 TheSeven has quit (Disconnected by services)
695 2013-05-24 03:31:28 <BCB> then then I'll leave you alone
696 2013-05-24 03:31:37 [7] has joined
697 2013-05-24 03:35:21 <duSn> it gives a path to the bitcoind ./ means here
698 2013-05-24 03:35:22 Sm3lly has joined
699 2013-05-24 03:35:32 <duSn> this dir
700 2013-05-24 03:35:34 enikanorov_ has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
701 2013-05-24 03:36:01 <duSn> otherwise bash searches in $PATH for the executable named bitcoind
702 2013-05-24 03:36:26 <BCB> so the ubuntu bitcoin package installs the bitcoind in the $PATH
703 2013-05-24 03:36:28 <BCB> ??
704 2013-05-24 03:36:41 <sipa> yes
705 2013-05-24 03:37:09 <BCB> That was my Aha moment for the day
706 2013-05-24 03:37:10 <BCB> thx guys
707 2013-05-24 03:37:28 <BCB> not I'm going to hammer on this rc2 and see if there are any bugs
708 2013-05-24 03:37:42 <BCB> sipa: did gavin release the payment protocol yet
709 2013-05-24 03:37:52 bitit has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
710 2013-05-24 03:37:59 <sipa> BCB: not at all, there's not even a BIP yet
711 2013-05-24 03:38:29 <BCB> sipa: this weekend he talked about pushing something
712 2013-05-24 03:38:30 <BCB> ??
713 2013-05-24 03:38:55 <sipa> i'm not gavin
714 2013-05-24 03:39:09 <sipa> i'm also not satoshi
715 2013-05-24 03:39:11 <sipa> or linus
716 2013-05-24 03:39:12 <sipa> or god
717 2013-05-24 03:39:33 <sipa> (read: i don't know eveything)
718 2013-05-24 03:39:49 <BCB> sipa: he said at the round table!
719 2013-05-24 03:39:51 <BCB> you were there
720 2013-05-24 03:39:57 <BCB> on sunday
721 2013-05-24 03:40:18 <sipa> yes
722 2013-05-24 03:40:38 <sipa> i also don't remember everything anybody ever said when i was near
723 2013-05-24 03:41:13 <BCB> so is there a certificate authentication payment protocol in the works?
724 2013-05-24 03:41:51 <sipa> yes: https://gist.github.com/gavinandresen/4120476
725 2013-05-24 03:42:03 <BCB> ty
726 2013-05-24 03:46:43 molecular has joined
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728 2013-05-24 03:50:55 <arvicco> hmm, I've generated some blocks on testnet, but it seems I'm unable to spend them... bitcoind getbalance shows the amount, but when i try to 'sendfrom', it returns error: 'Insufficient funds'. What gives?
729 2013-05-24 03:52:29 <gonffen> did you wait 150 blocks yet?
730 2013-05-24 03:52:38 <arvicco> nope
731 2013-05-24 03:52:42 <arvicco> should I?
732 2013-05-24 03:52:58 <lianj> yes
733 2013-05-24 03:53:29 <arvicco> I see. another RTFM for me then ;)
734 2013-05-24 03:53:59 btcls has joined
735 2013-05-24 03:54:02 seeingidog__ has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
736 2013-05-24 03:57:34 <sipa> 120 blocks suffices
737 2013-05-24 03:57:52 <sipa> but before those 120 blocks, getbalance should count the payout
738 2013-05-24 03:59:58 AlbertTuring has joined
739 2013-05-24 04:00:12 <btcls> anyone: if i run the official bitcoin client ... and leave it on continuously is that considered mining ?
740 2013-05-24 04:00:18 <sipa> no
741 2013-05-24 04:00:19 Guest26495 is now known as beethoven8201
742 2013-05-24 04:00:23 beethoven8201 has quit (Changing host)
743 2013-05-24 04:00:23 beethoven8201 has joined
744 2013-05-24 04:00:29 <sipa> you need to run a miner to mine
745 2013-05-24 04:00:55 <btcls> sipa: but it helps the network ...just not likely to get a reward for it ...correct ?
746 2013-05-24 04:01:08 <sipa> not just unlikely
747 2013-05-24 04:01:10 <sipa> impossible
748 2013-05-24 04:01:25 <btcls> impossible ...oh ...
749 2013-05-24 04:01:30 dmmftm has joined
750 2013-05-24 04:01:33 <sipa> but yes, it helps the network
751 2013-05-24 04:01:53 <btcls> is there an official mining client from bitcoin.org ?
752 2013-05-24 04:02:04 <sipa> no
753 2013-05-24 04:02:30 <arvicco> sipa: are things like this documented somewhere, or you have to "just know them"?
754 2013-05-24 04:02:42 <sipa> good question
755 2013-05-24 04:02:48 <arvicco> I could not find this in https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Protocol_specification
756 2013-05-24 04:02:49 <sipa> if you read enough, i'm sure you'd learn
757 2013-05-24 04:03:02 <sipa> well implementations and protocols are two different things
758 2013-05-24 04:03:04 <arvicco> or is there a better place to look?
759 2013-05-24 04:03:19 <sipa> wait, you're talking about the 120-block maturity?
760 2013-05-24 04:03:25 <arvicco> yep
761 2013-05-24 04:03:55 <arvicco> i wondered what category:"immature" means, could not find it
762 2013-05-24 04:04:34 <sipa> https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Protocol_rules
763 2013-05-24 04:04:36 <sipa> under tx
764 2013-05-24 04:04:40 <sipa> rule 12
765 2013-05-24 04:04:52 <beethoven8201> is there a max number of outputs to one transaction?
766 2013-05-24 04:04:52 <arvicco> got it, thanks sipa!
767 2013-05-24 04:04:55 <sipa> note that the protocol only requires 100 confirmations
768 2013-05-24 04:05:04 <sipa> but the client enforces 120 for extra safety
769 2013-05-24 04:05:14 <Luke-Jr> btcls: bitcoin is decentralized; that means everything is unofficial, even bitcoin.org
770 2013-05-24 04:05:22 <sipa> (there are some weird edge cases when you are very close to the boundary)
771 2013-05-24 04:05:33 <sipa> though 20 extra is probably way overkill
772 2013-05-24 04:05:35 <btcls> kk ...
773 2013-05-24 04:05:47 <beethoven8201> presumably I can't make a transaction that has 10,000 outputs
774 2013-05-24 04:06:11 <btcls> i dont understand why the bitcoin.org wallet does not "mine" when it helps the network
775 2013-05-24 04:06:14 <sipa> beethoven8201: it would be extremely hard to get that confirmed, but it's certainly possible
776 2013-05-24 04:06:25 <Luke-Jr> btcls: also, note that to mine on a mere computer, you are effectively gambling; you need dedicated mining chips (or at least FPGAs) to make any kind of profit
777 2013-05-24 04:06:26 <sipa> btcls: because it's not economical to do so
778 2013-05-24 04:06:40 <beethoven8201> sipa: really? even if it had a regular fee?
779 2013-05-24 04:07:09 <sipa> beethoven8201: outputs are something like 33 bytes for a pay to a standard address
780 2013-05-24 04:07:19 <sipa> so you'd get a 330 kB transaction at least
781 2013-05-24 04:07:27 <Luke-Jr> btcls: we might add mining support to Bitcoin-Qt (note: no wallet is directly tied with bitcoin.org!), but it will take some UI work before it is acceptable quality
782 2013-05-24 04:07:29 <btcls> sipa/luke: kk got it ... it was the "impossible" that threw me ... it is mining but that chance of success is so astronomically low it is not worth it
783 2013-05-24 04:07:39 <Luke-Jr> btcls: it is not mining
784 2013-05-24 04:07:39 <sipa> btcls: it is NOT mining
785 2013-05-24 04:07:43 <sipa> btcls: if you want to mine, run a miner
786 2013-05-24 04:07:45 <beethoven8201> sipa: how does bitcoin-qt prevent large transactions?
787 2013-05-24 04:07:51 <sipa> beethoven8201: it doesn't
788 2013-05-24 04:08:09 <sipa> actually, maybe there is a limit
789 2013-05-24 04:08:13 <Luke-Jr> btcls: mining was removed from wxBitcoin (Bitcoin-Qt's predecessor) because it was uneconomical
790 2013-05-24 04:08:17 <_maniac_> why miners can't accept such large transaction for a block?
791 2013-05-24 04:08:18 <btcls> kk gotcha both .... i will have to change a few pages on my site
792 2013-05-24 04:08:19 <Luke-Jr> Bitcoin-Qt itself has never supported mining
793 2013-05-24 04:08:41 <Luke-Jr> (technically there is code for it, but you have to use hidden options to enable it and it's slow even for a CPU miner)
794 2013-05-24 04:09:41 <sipa> simply the cost in increased wear on your CPU/system because of mining is likely already more than what you could earn
795 2013-05-24 04:09:43 <Luke-Jr> btcls: if you want to talk about mining on your site, feel free to use my miner (BFGMiner) as an example
796 2013-05-24 04:09:49 <sipa> even ignoring electricity costs
797 2013-05-24 04:10:13 <Luke-Jr> sipa: there's been some discussion about reintroducing it as a lottery, fwiw
798 2013-05-24 04:10:50 <btcls> that brought me a forum ...i book marked it ...
799 2013-05-24 04:10:50 <sipa> meh
800 2013-05-24 04:11:45 <btcls> so how does leaving my bitcoin-qt going actually assist the network ...what am i doing for it ?
801 2013-05-24 04:11:54 <ne0futur> I recommend bfgminer
802 2013-05-24 04:12:01 <Luke-Jr> btcls: relaying transactions (bandwidth)
803 2013-05-24 04:12:03 <sipa> you're validating transactions and blocks, and relaying those
804 2013-05-24 04:12:14 <ne0futur> https://github.com/luke-jr/bfgminer
805 2013-05-24 04:12:19 <sipa> and providing historical blocks to new nodes that start up
806 2013-05-24 04:12:43 <gonffen> would it be possible for someone to remove the link to [[Coinbase]] with regard to coinbase transaction in the description section of this article? https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Block
807 2013-05-24 04:13:02 <Luke-Jr> gonffen: it's a wiki..
808 2013-05-24 04:13:09 <gonffen> I don't have an account
809 2013-05-24 04:13:14 <Luke-Jr> so make one?
810 2013-05-24 04:13:15 <btcls> kk ...the backbone stuff ...but not the mining ...gotcha tks
811 2013-05-24 04:13:20 dmmftm has quit ()
812 2013-05-24 04:13:51 <sipa> i mildly object against using the "coinbase" page to refer (only) to a commercial service, when it's bitcoin core terminology
813 2013-05-24 04:13:59 <Luke-Jr> I agree
814 2013-05-24 04:14:06 <sipa> i vote to rename that to coinbase.com
815 2013-05-24 04:14:08 <_maniac_> yeah, I tried to find info on coinbase transactions on the wiki, and found only page about that service
816 2013-05-24 04:14:10 <gonffen> same, but at the very least that link should be fixed
817 2013-05-24 04:14:10 <Luke-Jr> sipa: I'm about to rename it.. thoughts on (business) vs (service provider)?
818 2013-05-24 04:14:19 <Luke-Jr> I guess .com works tooo
819 2013-05-24 04:14:33 <sipa> i don't mind a link from either to another
820 2013-05-24 04:15:38 <sipa> "For the coinbase.com wallet service, click [coinbase.com]"
821 2013-05-24 04:15:44 <sipa> or something like that
822 2013-05-24 04:15:57 <Luke-Jr> sipa: yeah, did something like that
823 2013-05-24 04:16:19 <sipa> ok
824 2013-05-24 04:18:29 FabianB has joined
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828 2013-05-24 04:20:11 <btcls> thank you ...grrr ...everytime i come here ... you send me away to do more reading ...LOL take care and thank you
829 2013-05-24 04:20:33 btcls has quit (Quit: Page closed)
830 2013-05-24 04:23:12 A has quit (an!~Alan@173.216.132.131|Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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832 2013-05-24 04:34:18 <beethoven8201> hi, is there a deterministic key generator library in Java or C++?
833 2013-05-24 04:36:48 <beethoven8201> Specifically BIP_0032
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854 2013-05-24 05:30:49 <warren> To test that you have built PIE executable, install scanelf, part of paxutils, and use:
855 2013-05-24 05:30:49 <warren> scanelf -e ./bitcoin
856 2013-05-24 05:30:51 <warren> typo in docs?
857 2013-05-24 05:31:10 <sipa> ?
858 2013-05-24 05:31:34 <sipa> ah, bitcoinD ?
859 2013-05-24 05:31:37 iwilcox has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
860 2013-05-24 05:31:52 skeledrew has joined
861 2013-05-24 05:33:07 <warren> yeah
862 2013-05-24 05:33:49 grau has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
863 2013-05-24 05:35:46 btcls has joined
864 2013-05-24 05:36:10 <btcls> okay here is my "newbie" "mining" explanation
865 2013-05-24 05:36:17 <btcls> What is bitcoin mining? To encourage bitcoin users to assist the network by processing transactions the bitcoin protocol (rules) payout a set amount of bitcoin based upon the work a computer does. However, "mining" has become very competitive with banks of computers, and specialized hardware making it unlikely a single home computer would be first to complete a block of work.
866 2013-05-24 05:36:34 <btcls> any thoughts ?
867 2013-05-24 05:37:26 <btcls> basically accurate but not to technical is what i am going for
868 2013-05-24 05:38:08 <sipa> the 'first' is misleading
869 2013-05-24 05:38:25 <sipa> it's not wrong, but it sort of makes it sound like it is a race
870 2013-05-24 05:38:37 <sipa> while it's more like a lottery
871 2013-05-24 05:38:42 arvicco has quit (Quit: arvicco)
872 2013-05-24 05:38:45 <btcls> hmmm ...
873 2013-05-24 05:38:46 <gwillen> wellll
874 2013-05-24 05:38:52 <gwillen> the 'first' is accurate
875 2013-05-24 05:38:56 <gwillen> the 'complete' maybe less so?
876 2013-05-24 05:38:56 <sipa> the chance of winning is proportion to how much you invest
877 2013-05-24 05:39:02 <gwillen> you _are_ trying to be first
878 2013-05-24 05:39:06 <sipa> gwillen: right!
879 2013-05-24 05:39:09 <gwillen> but you're rolling dice, not doing progressive work
880 2013-05-24 05:39:19 <sipa> indeed, it is "complete" that is wrong
881 2013-05-24 05:39:40 Ashaman has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
882 2013-05-24 05:39:54 <btcls> i see your point "first" and do not like the negative connotation of lottery
883 2013-05-24 05:40:18 <sipa> just drop the "complete"
884 2013-05-24 05:40:24 <gwillen> now, mind you, depending on what this is for, the original text might be fine
885 2013-05-24 05:40:28 <gwillen> it's not _that_ misleading
886 2013-05-24 05:40:29 <gmaxwell> gwillen: you might be trying to be first, but if you're not you just continue onto the next block. Someone else getting a block doesn't reduce the amount available for you (except in terms of the long term difficulty and subsidy changes, but those change for everyone)
887 2013-05-24 05:40:38 * gwillen nods
888 2013-05-24 05:40:55 arvicco has joined
889 2013-05-24 05:41:15 <gmaxwell> btcls: people very frequently misunderstand bitcoin mining as a race where the fastest wins all (or at least disproportionally).
890 2013-05-24 05:41:46 <btcls> hmmmm
891 2013-05-24 05:41:55 <btcls> [thinking]
892 2013-05-24 05:42:18 yubrew has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
893 2013-05-24 05:43:08 <gwillen> unfortunately, poisson processes are really nonintuitive
894 2013-05-24 05:43:18 <gwillen> you're going to have trouble explaining it succinctly so that everyone gets it
895 2013-05-24 05:43:26 Luke-Jr has quit (Excess Flood)
896 2013-05-24 05:43:49 <gwillen> without resorting to 'dice' or 'lottery' or some direct comparison like that
897 2013-05-24 05:43:52 Luke-Jr has joined
898 2013-05-24 05:44:25 <btcls> "...making it unlikely a single home computer would experience success." ....there we go i think
899 2013-05-24 05:44:39 <btcls> no ...grrr
900 2013-05-24 05:45:36 <btcls> @gmaxwell: it might be good that wikipedia does not use the term "arms race" in it's despcription of mining
901 2013-05-24 05:46:20 bugg has joined
902 2013-05-24 05:46:23 <btcls> he Luke-Jr pm me or whatever to go private please
903 2013-05-24 05:46:31 <Luke-Jr> why private?
904 2013-05-24 05:46:41 <gmaxwell> I would be really careful looking at wikipedia, it's been edited a bunch by people with basically no technical understanding of Bitcoin.
905 2013-05-24 05:46:47 <btcls> so it does not seem like spam ...lol
906 2013-05-24 05:47:16 <btcls> bro i am going to link to your website / forum posts for mining
907 2013-05-24 05:47:31 <sipa> yownyow
908 2013-05-24 05:47:32 <Luke-Jr> btcls: sure; I prefer to chat publicly, as I easily miss PMs
909 2013-05-24 05:48:16 <btcls> i see you on here often ....just wanted you to know ... could use an article that is not a techy as you are
910 2013-05-24 05:48:26 <btcls> just wait ... i have an advertising budget coming
911 2013-05-24 05:48:39 <btcls> was actually going to bid on the forum you sent me too
912 2013-05-24 05:49:02 <btcls> but i need more work on my site ...
913 2013-05-24 05:49:20 arvicco has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
914 2013-05-24 05:50:28 <btcls> its difficult ... i need to be close to technically correct for ppl like in this room ...but generic enough for my target market
915 2013-05-24 05:52:11 <btcls> anyways ... thanks again ...back to work
916 2013-05-24 05:52:18 btcls has quit (Quit: Page closed)
917 2013-05-24 05:57:05 <gmaxwell> Well the stuff we're pedantanticing you on are things we see people getting confused about and reaching wrong conclusions.
918 2013-05-24 05:57:26 <gmaxwell> so it's not even a matter of being pedantically correct, these are points where if you're not careful you make people stupider instead of smarter.
919 2013-05-24 05:59:27 jeewee has quit (Quit: Leaving.)
920 2013-05-24 06:01:20 Krellan has joined
921 2013-05-24 06:03:31 ThomasV has joined
922 2013-05-24 06:04:12 abrkn has quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
923 2013-05-24 06:06:35 <bugg> morning all..
924 2013-05-24 06:07:18 <duSn> pedantidancing
925 2013-05-24 06:07:43 <bugg> duSn: howzit..
926 2013-05-24 06:07:52 <etotheipi_> sipa: gmaxwell: more and more, I realize that I want the capability, especially via payment protocol, to be able to specify payment addresses in the normal the hash160-to-Base58 form *OR* in the root-public-key-and-multiplier form
927 2013-05-24 06:08:11 <bugg> Aaah. pedantisomething..
928 2013-05-24 06:09:04 <gmaxwell> etotheipi_: how about a form which is a signature + multiplier? and you recover the root public key from the signature
929 2013-05-24 06:09:19 <gmaxwell> (signature of the multiplier, of course)
930 2013-05-24 06:09:22 <etotheipi_> there's a couple reasons... and I'm tempted to extend it myself if it's not part of the protocol
931 2013-05-24 06:09:37 <bugg> Back 2 basics pls.. Can i start putting a pool together with the 0.7.1 code i have on my FreeBSD port pls..
932 2013-05-24 06:10:14 <sipa> bugg: do not mine with <0.8
933 2013-05-24 06:10:32 <gmaxwell> No. And if you're not prepaired to understand and track bitcoin development you probably shouldn't be running a public pool.
934 2013-05-24 06:10:52 <etotheipi_> gmaxwell: but I need to be able to distribute those addresses via watching-only wallet
935 2013-05-24 06:11:17 jeewee has joined
936 2013-05-24 06:11:27 <bugg> sipa: we don't intend to mine at first.. we just want a running pool than & than add mining l8r..
937 2013-05-24 06:12:04 <sipa> "I want to open a cafe. I won't serve anything at first, i just like to have a door that works."
938 2013-05-24 06:12:10 <gmaxwell> etotheipi_: I see.
939 2013-05-24 06:12:15 <duSn> bugg: i think 0.7.1 is the most recent in the ports - probably compile from source
940 2013-05-24 06:12:31 <etotheipi_> gmaxwell: here's my thinking, rip into it
941 2013-05-24 06:12:45 <gmaxwell> what is the sound of pool without mining?
942 2013-05-24 06:13:45 <gmaxwell> etotheipi_: I can guess the idea: You want to have the magical really important identity that proves the pubkey is owned by a particular party offline. So you use that to sign the pubkey... but can still issue out multipliers.
943 2013-05-24 06:14:07 <bugg> duSn: apparently 1 Win developer & the rest linux.. Our daemon crashed so we'd have to work the code anyways..
944 2013-05-24 06:14:18 <etotheipi_> gmaxwell: a few businesses with which I want to integrate, I want to have their public keys essentially hardcoded into the app, so that there's no MITM from user-to-merchant
945 2013-05-24 06:14:19 <duSn> bugg http://www.Freshports.org/net-p2p/bitcoin there is 0.8.1
946 2013-05-24 06:14:20 <etotheipi_> AND
947 2013-05-24 06:14:36 <bugg> shøt..
948 2013-05-24 06:14:50 <etotheipi_> if there's a persistent business relationship, the merchant will be able to verify that a previous customer address matches the same wallet as previous transactions
949 2013-05-24 06:15:36 <etotheipi_> I can't do anything about the MITM on the first transaction, but at least the merchant can confirm money is going to the same wallet as the first time
950 2013-05-24 06:16:40 abrkn has joined
951 2013-05-24 06:17:01 <gmaxwell> etotheipi_: 'OKAY' ... but that has nasty key management problems. It's considered bad practiceâ for good reasonâ to build stuff where a potentially compromised key can't be changed.
952 2013-05-24 06:17:17 <etotheipi_> gmaxwell: for instance, if I integrate an exchange's API, and give the user the ability to move money back and forth securely
953 2013-05-24 06:17:18 sacarlson has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
954 2013-05-24 06:17:22 <etotheipi_> gmaxwell: actually it will be changed
955 2013-05-24 06:17:27 <duSn> bugg: http://people.freebsd.org/~ehaupt/distilator/net-p2p/bitcoin/
956 2013-05-24 06:17:49 <gmaxwell> otherwiseâ I guess I don't understand the application enough to see any problem with it.
957 2013-05-24 06:18:03 <etotheipi_> gmaxwell: actually, I have just shifted the burden to me, not them... just like automatic upgrades, I will have all this stored in a downloadable file that is signed by MY offline key
958 2013-05-24 06:18:44 <etotheipi_> if the key needs to be revoked, I sign new data based on conversing with the merchant and the clients get it on the next interaction
959 2013-05-24 06:19:04 bitit has joined
960 2013-05-24 06:19:20 <etotheipi_> (ignore the part about automatic upgrades, that was a totally detached thought fragment)
961 2013-05-24 06:19:28 <etotheipi_> heh
962 2013-05-24 06:21:38 <Luke-Jr> etotheipi_: would it be okay to make Armory Python3-only? <.<
963 2013-05-24 06:22:24 toffoo has quit ()
964 2013-05-24 06:22:49 <etotheipi_> Luke-Jr: haha... you're welcome to make your own fork
965 2013-05-24 06:23:11 <etotheipi_> although, I've started thinking about translations, and Python3 would be quite a bit more pleasant
966 2013-05-24 06:23:24 <Luke-Jr> etotheipi_: I don't want to fork
967 2013-05-24 06:24:25 <etotheipi_> gmaxwell: my problem is, I can recommend this simple extension of BIP 32 to merchants, but it'd be better if it was already built into the payment protocol
968 2013-05-24 06:25:48 <etotheipi_> or at least a "recognized" operation
969 2013-05-24 06:26:04 <gmaxwell> Unfortunately I don't quite see your application here, so I can't comment on it. I recieve one of these payment protocol requests. What benefit do I get from having the pubkey plus multiplier exposed to me?
970 2013-05-24 06:27:18 <etotheipi_> gmaxwell: it's just an alternative representation of a hash160
971 2013-05-24 06:27:24 <etotheipi_> one that is more descriptive than a hash160
972 2013-05-24 06:27:43 <etotheipi_> and parties can extend their own systems to use that, if they want
973 2013-05-24 06:28:13 <etotheipi_> in my case, as a way to confirm that the cashout they're about to send is going to the same wallet it went to last time
974 2013-05-24 06:29:16 ThomasV has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
975 2013-05-24 06:29:51 <gmaxwell> it sounds like you're trying to second guess the pki already securing the payment request. So lets assume that the pki securing the request is bad. I forge a request saying that the payment request is 1 BTC for ownership of the company. I pick a random multiplier send 1 BTC there and then call the vendor a bunch of scammers because they haven't turned over the company to me yet. :)
976 2013-05-24 06:30:26 <gmaxwell> And at the same timeâ if people do being using it that way, it means the company can't rotate out their pubkey without making a lot of people think something has gone wrong.
977 2013-05-24 06:31:00 <gwillen> can I ask, just to make sure I understand -- when we're talking about 'multipliers', are you actually doing BIP 32 derivation, or another thing?
978 2013-05-24 06:31:08 MobiusL has quit (Quit: Ex-Chat)
979 2013-05-24 06:31:33 <gmaxwell> gwillen: its the value that comes out of the hmac in the BIP32 derivation.
980 2013-05-24 06:31:39 <gwillen> okay
981 2013-05-24 06:31:52 <sipa> I've called it 'tweak' in my presentation
982 2013-05-24 06:32:19 <gmaxwell> The idea is to move that last step to the sender so the sender doesn't just see a random address, they see a consistent prefix as an identity mechenism.
983 2013-05-24 06:32:44 <etotheipi_> gmaxwell: this isn't second guessing the PKI, it's a potential replacement
984 2013-05-24 06:33:02 <gmaxwell> then it should actually replace it for the whole payment request, not just the address. :(
985 2013-05-24 06:33:04 <etotheipi_> for situations where you have a persistent relationship, you don't need third-party verification
986 2013-05-24 06:33:27 <gmaxwell> else you get my example where I sell you my company. :P
987 2013-05-24 06:33:58 saulimus has joined
988 2013-05-24 06:34:09 <gmaxwell> at that point the multiplier should be the hash of the whole payment request (with the multiplier masked) :)
989 2013-05-24 06:34:22 sacarlson has joined
990 2013-05-24 06:34:45 mjsobota has joined
991 2013-05-24 06:36:16 <gmaxwell> (thats still mutable without a signature, but at least there there is no dispute over what the payment was actually for :P )
992 2013-05-24 06:38:01 <etotheipi_> gmaxwell: it is not only *potentially* useful, it's optional
993 2013-05-24 06:38:17 ThomasV has joined
994 2013-05-24 06:38:25 <etotheipi_> if someone wants to reveal that two addresses are linked, they can use the pubkey&multiplier
995 2013-05-24 06:38:30 <etotheipi_> if not, they just give a regular hash160
996 2013-05-24 06:38:48 Guest59601 has joined
997 2013-05-24 06:39:35 <sipa> wait, i thought you were talking about a scheme where the sender determines the actual address, by tweaking a master pubkey
998 2013-05-24 06:39:53 <gmaxwell> He is. As a replacement for the pki in a payment request.
999 2013-05-24 06:40:22 <etotheipi_> gmaxwell: it doesn't even *have* to be for replacement of PKI...
1000 2013-05-24 06:40:32 <etotheipi_> it is simply extra utility added to the payment protocol
1001 2013-05-24 06:40:41 <gmaxwell> And I was saying 'meh it's not really a replacement because it only shows the identity of the key, and using their pubkey as an identity is kinda lame and may encourage bad practices' .. (but I'm pretty indifferent)
1002 2013-05-24 06:40:56 Mobius_ has joined
1003 2013-05-24 06:41:04 <sipa> that last line sounded like the address was still fully controlled by the receiver, only that he can potentially prove addresses are linked
1004 2013-05-24 06:41:14 <sipa> which is immediately possible with bip32 anyway
1005 2013-05-24 06:41:35 Mobius_ is now known as MobiusL
1006 2013-05-24 06:41:44 <gmaxwell> sipa: I was saying that if one wanted to use it as a pki replacement it should make the whole of the payment request non-reputable, but that was my own tangent.
1007 2013-05-24 06:41:47 <etotheipi_> sipa: that's my point... it adds the option to use it if someone wants, and it's a trivial extension of BIP 32
1008 2013-05-24 06:42:00 <gwillen> sipa: I'm sorry to say I actually skipped your presentation to hear about zerocoin
1009 2013-05-24 06:42:08 <sipa> gwillen: good choice
1010 2013-05-24 06:42:09 <gwillen> sipa: but I read the wikipage
1011 2013-05-24 06:42:10 <gwillen> haha
1012 2013-05-24 06:42:26 <sipa> etotheipi_: but which are you talking about? one where the receiver determines the address, or the sender?
1013 2013-05-24 06:42:30 _maniac_ has quit (Quit: /quit)
1014 2013-05-24 06:42:37 <sipa> etotheipi_: i'm seeing ideas from both and they are mutually exclusive
1015 2013-05-24 06:42:47 <etotheipi_> sipa: I'm not that familiar with the payment protocol...so you'll have to excuse my ignorance
1016 2013-05-24 06:42:59 <sipa> etotheipi_: i'm not talking about a payment protocol at all
1017 2013-05-24 06:43:03 <etotheipi_> sipa: okay...
1018 2013-05-24 06:43:13 <sipa> who determines the actual scriptPubKey in the transaction?
1019 2013-05-24 06:43:28 <gmaxwell> unless I understood, etotheipi_ says the sender sets the whole address. And then the reciever validates the identity of the sender public key from it.
1020 2013-05-24 06:43:42 <etotheipi_> all I'm asking is that someone says "Give me an address to pay you", and the recipient can provide one of the two forms of the address to pay
1021 2013-05-24 06:43:43 reneg has joined
1022 2013-05-24 06:43:47 <gmaxwell> er ! I'm confusing sender and reciever potentially there. I mean sender of the payment request.
1023 2013-05-24 06:43:55 <etotheipi_> err. yeah, I just confused myself too
1024 2013-05-24 06:44:33 <etotheipi_> either a 20-byte hash160, or a 65-byte pubkey&mult
1025 2013-05-24 06:44:48 <gmaxwell> etotheipi_: if the user of your scheme here wants to switch to 2 of 3 multisigs ... they have to totally change what they're doing and break the client security model, right? :(
1026 2013-05-24 06:45:01 <sipa> you haven't answered my question; i still have two possible interpretations of what you've said
1027 2013-05-24 06:45:11 <etotheipi_> gmaxwell: that's true.. I ahven't thought about multisig,
1028 2013-05-24 06:45:54 <etotheipi_> though, theoretically you could pass all 3 public keys and multipliers
1029 2013-05-24 06:45:54 <gmaxwell> sipa: define determines?
1030 2013-05-24 06:45:54 <etotheipi_> and let the other person construct it
1031 2013-05-24 06:45:54 <sipa> gmaxwell: "computes"
1032 2013-05-24 06:45:54 <gmaxwell> etotheipi_: indeed, but that requires an encoding that supports it.
1033 2013-05-24 06:46:06 <gmaxwell> sipa: both sides do. The party being paid chooses and computes. The person paying, computes and pays.
1034 2013-05-24 06:46:25 <etotheipi_> gmaxwell: sure... I'm trying to get you guys to think about it, because I think it's a worthy extension (not necessarily the multisig one, I haven't thought much about it), but the multiple forms of "payment addresses"
1035 2013-05-24 06:46:38 <etotheipi_> I think there's utility there
1036 2013-05-24 06:46:41 <sipa> gmaxwell: i actually still don't know
1037 2013-05-24 06:46:45 <gmaxwell> (but if the key doesn't match the expected one, then presumably the paying party doesn't pay, they call you on the phone and tell you that you've been hacked.)
1038 2013-05-24 06:46:53 <etotheipi_> gmaxwell: exactly
1039 2013-05-24 06:47:02 <etotheipi_> or that you requested payout to a different wallet
1040 2013-05-24 06:47:08 <etotheipi_> and they want to confirm
1041 2013-05-24 06:47:49 <gmaxwell> etotheipi_: well, I've wanted to have some kind of public + chaincode serialization for multisig wallets too. Providing a single multiplier could be pretty similar.
1042 2013-05-24 06:48:32 <etotheipi_> uh oh, are you walking into timo's arguments about unlinking chaincode and public keys?
1043 2013-05-24 06:48:40 moroz has joined
1044 2013-05-24 06:49:01 Mobius_ has joined
1045 2013-05-24 06:49:06 <gmaxwell> etotheipi_: no, the point there is so that you could give a template to someone you have a standing relationship with so they can increment your address for you.
1046 2013-05-24 06:49:22 <sipa> yes, just share a public extended key
1047 2013-05-24 06:49:36 <gmaxwell> E.g. bitcointalk could generate virgin donation addresses for users; your mining pool could make their autopayouts have one use addresses, etc.
1048 2013-05-24 06:49:37 <sipa> and you have an infinite number of addresses to do long-standing business transaction with
1049 2013-05-24 06:49:58 <etotheipi_> gmaxwell: that is just create a new wallet for them
1050 2013-05-24 06:50:04 <gmaxwell> Right.
1051 2013-05-24 06:50:08 moroz has quit (Client Quit)
1052 2013-05-24 06:50:12 <gmaxwell> (this is, after all, one of the explicit usecases of bip32)
1053 2013-05-24 06:50:19 <etotheipi_> understood
1054 2013-05-24 06:50:29 talengix has quit (Quit: Leaving)
1055 2013-05-24 06:50:41 <etotheipi_> the nice thing about what I'm suggesting is that you can choose to identify that addresses are linked, or not... but doing so doesn't reveal your entire wallet
1056 2013-05-24 06:50:49 <etotheipi_> it's a pleasant, accidental feature of BIP 32
1057 2013-05-24 06:51:52 MobiusL has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
1058 2013-05-24 06:52:56 <gmaxwell> heh. if you want to take a huge pile of code I can give you proofs that a HASH160 is linked to some other HASH160 via SCIP voodoo. :P
1059 2013-05-24 06:54:52 abrkn has quit ()
1060 2013-05-24 06:55:26 <etotheipi_> well I"m off to bed
1061 2013-05-24 06:55:37 <etotheipi_> not that I have to get up for a job or anything...
1062 2013-05-24 06:55:47 <etotheipi_> but I should try to keep a somewhat normal human schedule
1063 2013-05-24 06:55:52 <gwillen> haha
1064 2013-05-24 06:56:04 <sipa> sure you do; just not one where your schedule is determined by your boss
1065 2013-05-24 06:56:11 <sipa> actually, it is
1066 2013-05-24 06:56:15 <gmaxwell> I was about to say...
1067 2013-05-24 06:56:24 <sipa> s/your boss/someone else/
1068 2013-05-24 06:56:34 <etotheipi_> haha
1069 2013-05-24 06:56:56 Mobius_ is now known as MobiusL
1070 2013-05-24 06:56:57 <etotheipi_> s/your boss/fiancée
1071 2013-05-24 06:57:55 <gmaxwell> though it actually sucks to end up in a rotating schedule, since at least I've found once I let it slip its hard to avoid it uncontrollably rolling and then no one has any idea when you're awake
1072 2013-05-24 06:57:56 <sipa> what has happened to the world, if the easiest way for me to find the time is typing "time california" in to google; above looking at my cell phone, or changing my laptop's timezone, or doing a "-9" arithmetic operation myself
1073 2013-05-24 06:58:28 <etotheipi_> google is skynet
1074 2013-05-24 06:58:37 <gmaxwell> sipa: perhaps google puts something in the water. :P
1075 2013-05-24 06:58:49 <sipa> haha
1076 2013-05-24 06:58:57 <Luke-Jr> this is why I like tonalâ¦.. :P
1077 2013-05-24 06:59:10 <sipa> or that brain implant wasn't *actually* a dummy
1078 2013-05-24 06:59:18 <etotheipi_> sipa: you're working for google now?
1079 2013-05-24 06:59:22 <sipa> etotheipi_: yes
1080 2013-05-24 06:59:38 <etotheipi_> in CA? or you simply decided to stay longer after the conference?
1081 2013-05-24 06:59:57 <sipa> no, in zurich, but i'm now here for 2 weeks
1082 2013-05-24 07:00:18 <etotheipi_> oh you're in zurich? cool place
1083 2013-05-24 07:00:25 MobPhone has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1084 2013-05-24 07:00:35 MobPhone has joined
1085 2013-05-24 07:00:38 <etotheipi_> I was there for an OR conference.... kind of expensive, but a cool place
1086 2013-05-24 07:00:47 <sipa> yes, definitely colder than CA :p
1087 2013-05-24 07:01:07 <sipa> and indeed, very expensive
1088 2013-05-24 07:01:08 <gmaxwell> I wore a jacket to the office today.. brrrr.
1089 2013-05-24 07:01:43 <gmaxwell> low of 50F. :P
1090 2013-05-24 07:01:47 LainZ has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
1091 2013-05-24 07:01:48 <sipa> people at home do get jealous when you say "i have not yet seen a cloud"
1092 2013-05-24 07:01:58 <sipa> ;;calc (50-32)/9*5
1093 2013-05-24 07:01:58 <gribble> 10
1094 2013-05-24 07:02:47 <gmaxwell> It rained a little the night before last actually. Seems to mostly rain at night here.
1095 2013-05-24 07:02:50 <Luke-Jr> wtf http://buttcoin.org/introducing-lolicoin-the-cryptocurrency-for-pedos
1096 2013-05-24 07:03:24 <sipa> gmaxwell: well, at night it is dark, so you'd still not *see* clouds :p
1097 2013-05-24 07:05:01 RazielXYZ has joined
1098 2013-05-24 07:08:32 gruvfunk has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
1099 2013-05-24 07:14:04 <warren> Dumb git question ... git remote add gavin git://github.com/gavinandresen/bitcoin-git.git; git fetch gavin issue2687;
1100 2013-05-24 07:14:12 <warren> how do I pull only his one patch?
1101 2013-05-24 07:14:30 <sipa> git merge gavin/issue2687
1102 2013-05-24 07:14:50 <warren> hmmfatal: gavin/issue2687 - not something we can merge
1103 2013-05-24 07:15:19 <gmaxwell> wget https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/2687.patch
1104 2013-05-24 07:15:24 <gmaxwell> git am -3 2688.patch
1105 2013-05-24 07:15:24 <warren> oooh
1106 2013-05-24 07:15:36 <warren> couldn't find raw patch in github
1107 2013-05-24 07:15:48 <gmaxwell> hidden feature for greybeards
1108 2013-05-24 07:16:01 <warren> =)
1109 2013-05-24 07:16:15 <warren> thanks
1110 2013-05-24 07:16:37 <warren> hm, that URL downloaded a bunch of HTML
1111 2013-05-24 07:16:39 <sipa> github actually exposes an interface where you can see all pullreqs as branches
1112 2013-05-24 07:17:04 <gmaxwell> warren: you have to have the .patch on it
1113 2013-05-24 07:17:25 btcls has joined
1114 2013-05-24 07:17:28 <warren> gmaxwell: I did
1115 2013-05-24 07:18:03 <gmaxwell> curl https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/2688.patch < gives me a patch. No html at all.
1116 2013-05-24 07:18:14 <gmaxwell> I guess you are not greybeard enough. :(
1117 2013-05-24 07:18:32 <Luke-Jr> sipa: it's called git :P
1118 2013-05-24 07:18:38 <warren> 2688.patch gives a patch. 2687 doesn't
1119 2013-05-24 07:19:03 <Luke-Jr> warren: edit .git/config
1120 2013-05-24 07:19:06 <Luke-Jr> [remote "origin-pull"]
1121 2013-05-24 07:19:08 <Luke-Jr> fetch = +refs/pull/*:refs/remotes/origin-pull/*
1122 2013-05-24 07:19:09 <Luke-Jr> url = git://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin.git
1123 2013-05-24 07:19:11 <Luke-Jr> ^ add that
1124 2013-05-24 07:19:14 <sipa> 2687 is not a patch
1125 2013-05-24 07:19:17 <sipa> it's an issue
1126 2013-05-24 07:19:21 <Luke-Jr> git fetch origin-pull
1127 2013-05-24 07:19:23 <gmaxwell> oh. well I didn't check the numbers! :P
1128 2013-05-24 07:19:34 <warren> ooh
1129 2013-05-24 07:19:40 <warren> *bonk*
1130 2013-05-24 07:20:03 <sipa> 2688 is issue2687 is a patch to fix issue 2687
1131 2013-05-24 07:20:38 <warren> Luke-Jr: I don't follow what is the purpose of that?
1132 2013-05-24 07:20:41 <gmaxwell> my shell is smarter than I am.
1133 2013-05-24 07:20:49 <warren> Luke-Jr: I already fetch origin from bitcoin/bitcoin
1134 2013-05-24 07:20:50 <Luke-Jr> warren: every pull request's code is now a local branch
1135 2013-05-24 07:20:55 <btcls> okay so i bought a couple more coins ... and this exchange says ...withdraw btc ...my question is why would i ever let ANY exchange hold my btc when i can do it ... why would i leave btc at someone elses website ?
1136 2013-05-24 07:20:55 <sipa> warren: it gives you all pullreqs as branches
1137 2013-05-24 07:21:00 <warren> oh
1138 2013-05-24 07:21:05 <sipa> warren: without needing to add remotes ofr all authors
1139 2013-05-24 07:21:05 <warren> nice!
1140 2013-05-24 07:21:34 <maaku> http://i.imgur.com/L700HeE.png
1141 2013-05-24 07:21:39 <maaku> sorry wrong channel
1142 2013-05-24 07:22:26 <gmaxwell> maaku: your spline interpolation there is ... odd. the output ... is not a function.
1143 2013-05-24 07:22:33 <warren> sipa: if I use that, should I get rid of my origin?
1144 2013-05-24 07:23:02 <Luke-Jr> btcls: trade them faster
1145 2013-05-24 07:23:03 <gmaxwell> <3 monotone cubic interpolation
1146 2013-05-24 07:23:14 <maaku> gmaxwell: yeah it's the software I use.. not sure I'm happy with whoever coded it
1147 2013-05-24 07:24:35 <btcls> Luke-Jr: but if i dont want to trade it is safer to withdraw and take them into your care ...correct
1148 2013-05-24 07:24:51 <maaku> btcls: yes
1149 2013-05-24 07:24:58 <btcls> kk ...
1150 2013-05-24 07:25:27 <btcls> oh i like this alot ...
1151 2013-05-24 07:25:48 <btcls> and this room deserves a donation ....a bitcoin beer
1152 2013-05-24 07:25:59 <btcls> you guys have helped me soooo much
1153 2013-05-24 07:26:13 <btcls> sipa: can i buy you a beer ?
1154 2013-05-24 07:26:20 <warren> Send a dust output to everyone in the channel.
1155 2013-05-24 07:26:23 <btcls> if not you then Luke
1156 2013-05-24 07:26:57 <btcls> warren: that would be scarey if you could automate that
1157 2013-05-24 07:27:29 * warren wonders whatever happened to the IRC tip bot.
1158 2013-05-24 07:27:29 <gmaxwell> warren is trying to prove that its not possible to be shot over IRC.
1159 2013-05-24 07:27:29 <btcls> Luke or Sipa please post an addy so i can buy you a beer
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1163 2013-05-24 07:28:23 <btcls> okay anyone have current bitcoinfoundation.org addy ?
1164 2013-05-24 07:28:44 <ryan-c> so, i just fed oclvanityminer a pattern file based on every word in the english dictionary
1165 2013-05-24 07:28:58 <gmaxwell> btcls: you can get donation addresses for people by looking at their bitcointalk signatures.
1166 2013-05-24 07:29:24 <gmaxwell> ryan-c: and it caught fire and burned your house down?
1167 2013-05-24 07:29:29 <ryan-c> hah
1168 2013-05-24 07:29:30 <ryan-c> no
1169 2013-05-24 07:29:33 <gmaxwell> aww
1170 2013-05-24 07:29:35 sacredchao has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1171 2013-05-24 07:29:43 <btcls> "talk signatures"
1172 2013-05-24 07:29:44 <ryan-c> first one I got matched 1Puristic
1173 2013-05-24 07:29:45 <gmaxwell> er. I man, thats good.
1174 2013-05-24 07:29:54 sacredchao has joined
1175 2013-05-24 07:30:05 <gmaxwell> s/man/mean/
1176 2013-05-24 07:30:22 <ryan-c> gmaxwell: seriously though, shits not funny. i previously did have a house burn down
1177 2013-05-24 07:31:07 <btcls> @gmaxwell: i click on your name ...is that a "talk" signature ...it has no addy ???
1178 2013-05-24 07:31:40 <btcls> what is a talk signature
1179 2013-05-24 07:31:42 <btcls> ??
1180 2013-05-24 07:32:41 <gmaxwell> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=2786 https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=3318
1181 2013-05-24 07:32:54 Neozonz has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
1182 2013-05-24 07:32:56 <btcls> listen all ... on my website i encourage ppl to donate ...its got to be simple though
1183 2013-05-24 07:33:09 <ryan-c> wtf is a "pumpsman"
1184 2013-05-24 07:33:12 <btcls> kk book marking
1185 2013-05-24 07:33:48 <ryan-c> got 1Deionize
1186 2013-05-24 07:34:04 <btcls> i need one of these ...it seems
1187 2013-05-24 07:34:15 <btcls> ty ...more fn study
1188 2013-05-24 07:34:21 <btcls> brb tomorrow
1189 2013-05-24 07:34:25 <btcls> POOF
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1194 2013-05-24 07:34:58 <gmaxwell> ryan-c: kinda lame to waste all that computation churning out uncompressed addresses. :P
1195 2013-05-24 07:35:45 <warren> vanity lacks compressed?
1196 2013-05-24 07:35:46 <ryan-c> I could probably modify it to generate compressed addresses
1197 2013-05-24 07:36:02 <gmaxwell> warren: yes.
1198 2013-05-24 07:36:04 <warren> I'm seriously going to add a fee penalty to Litecoin for uncompressed addresses one day.
1199 2013-05-24 07:36:11 <ryan-c> I was going to make some other modifications to the code anyway...
1200 2013-05-24 07:36:20 <gmaxwell> ryan-c: you can, I have a patch to make the cpu generation generate compressedâ makes it quite a bit faster in fact.
1201 2013-05-24 07:36:30 <gmaxwell> But I don't have access to ocl hardware these days.
1202 2013-05-24 07:36:31 <ryan-c> gmaxwell: link?
1203 2013-05-24 07:36:53 <gmaxwell> (nor much time/motivation to actually work on a toy like that)
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1205 2013-05-24 07:37:55 <gmaxwell> http://people.xiph.org/~greg/compressed.keys.patch < do note that it's only _very_ lightly tested. I basically just took the first two addresses that came out and checked that they worked.
1206 2013-05-24 07:38:03 <ryan-c> heh
1207 2013-05-24 07:38:45 * ryan-c tries it
1208 2013-05-24 07:39:07 <gmaxwell> ryan-c: if you do OCL for it though I'd be greatly appreciative. As I mentioned, it should actually make the generation faster if it changes it at all.
1209 2013-05-24 07:40:08 cads has joined
1210 2013-05-24 07:40:10 <ryan-c> gmaxwell: Interesting. I don't have any experience with ocl coding but i've been meaning to pick it up. I have access to a decently large VCL cluster to run OCL stuff on.
1211 2013-05-24 07:40:56 <ryan-c> I'm also seriously considering posting a bounty to get some fairly simple features added to oclvanitygen and oclvanityminer
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1213 2013-05-24 07:42:09 <ryan-c> gmaxwell: oh, that is a really simple patch
1214 2013-05-24 07:42:36 <gmaxwell> yea, thats why it exists.
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1216 2013-05-24 07:43:14 <ryan-c> indeed it does speed things up
1217 2013-05-24 07:43:30 johnsoft has joined
1218 2013-05-24 07:43:46 <ryan-c> my cpu went from 1.38Mkey/sec to 1.63Mkey/sec
1219 2013-05-24 07:43:46 <sipa> script_buf[25]
1220 2013-05-24 07:43:50 <sipa> is that right?
1221 2013-05-24 07:44:07 <sipa> i'd guess 37
1222 2013-05-24 07:44:18 <sipa> aka 0x25
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1224 2013-05-24 07:45:20 <gmaxwell> indeed, that doesn't sound right. :)
1225 2013-05-24 07:45:31 <ryan-c> gmaxwell: 18% speedup is quite nice
1226 2013-05-24 07:46:16 <ryan-c> yay buffer overflows?
1227 2013-05-24 07:46:25 <gmaxwell> I didn't test the p2sh generation either, at all. never ran it.
1228 2013-05-24 07:46:33 <gmaxwell> Not sure what I would have been thinking there though.
1229 2013-05-24 07:47:08 yubrew has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
1230 2013-05-24 07:48:22 <gmaxwell> I set the length right, but then got the offsets wrong consistently with the length of the buffer. ::shrugs::
1231 2013-05-24 07:50:18 <ryan-c> 1HaystackXUnpJdhDwRFgzRsJa5zvt5TrF < for some reason this is hilarious
1232 2013-05-24 07:52:37 <ryan-c> and i just destroyed the private key like an idiot
1233 2013-05-24 07:53:01 <ryan-c> :'(
1234 2013-05-24 07:53:37 bitit has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1235 2013-05-24 07:55:09 <gmaxwell> patch updated, and I even figure out how to run it on a p2sh... no clue how to check the result. :P
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1241 2013-05-24 08:08:48 cads has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1242 2013-05-24 08:11:54 * ryan-c tries pulling the private key out of a memory dump
1243 2013-05-24 08:15:33 <bugg> Now this looks promising.. The makefile.unix already breaks..
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1310 2013-05-24 09:34:21 <fishfish> Morning chaps, I remember reading somewhere that bitcoinQT was switching over to SPV in a future release... is that correct? or did i dream it?
1311 2013-05-24 09:36:15 <SomeoneWeird> 0.o
1312 2013-05-24 09:36:18 <SomeoneWeird> doubtful
1313 2013-05-24 09:37:03 <wumpus> the idea is to use SPV before the whole blockchain is downloaded, so the client is immediately useable
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1315 2013-05-24 09:37:49 <BlueMatt> that said, I dont think anyone has even started implementing that in bitcoin-qt...
1316 2013-05-24 09:38:11 <foamz> what server would it use for SPV?
1317 2013-05-24 09:38:13 <wumpus> I'm pretty sure it hasn't
1318 2013-05-24 09:38:14 <BlueMatt> plus given there are far more important priorities, I doubt anyone will any time soon
1319 2013-05-24 09:38:37 <BlueMatt> foamz: what server? itself?
1320 2013-05-24 09:39:22 <wumpus> you never know for sure what's going to be implemented in an open source project anyway, unless you do it yourself... it's just that it fits in the roadmap, so if someone were to implement it, it would be accepted
1321 2013-05-24 09:39:23 grau has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
1322 2013-05-24 09:39:41 <BlueMatt> true
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1325 2013-05-24 09:42:18 * BlueMatt notes that it is implemented in bitcoinj
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1327 2013-05-24 09:43:28 <fishfish> Thanks guys, I must have been dreaming then hahahah :)
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1374 2013-05-24 11:32:12 <quib> im lost
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1376 2013-05-24 11:32:25 <quib> https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Getwork ... https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Block_hashing_algorithm
1377 2013-05-24 11:33:19 <quib> is that example at getwork rly little-endian?
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1380 2013-05-24 11:34:15 <quib> cause in Block_hashing_algorithm it says in the last sentence before the example: The header is built from the six fields described above, concatenated together as little-endian values in hex notation:
1381 2013-05-24 11:34:30 <quib> and the example starts version then with 0100000
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1387 2013-05-24 11:38:42 <robbak> looks like I have to add #include <stdarg.h> to src/util.h in order for it to build. Any ideas what is happening?
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1438 2013-05-24 12:59:33 <robbak> I've got two patches needed to build on FreeBSD - add #include <stdarg> to util.h and add a cast to into in init.cpp
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1447 2013-05-24 13:11:31 michagogo is now known as Prince
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1451 2013-05-24 13:15:40 <gfawkes> be water, my friend.
1452 2013-05-24 13:19:09 saulimus has quit (Quit: saulimus)
1453 2013-05-24 13:19:38 <BlueMatt> robbak: submit a pull req
1454 2013-05-24 13:20:21 bugg has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1455 2013-05-24 13:21:20 RazielZ has joined
1456 2013-05-24 13:22:09 <Prince> BlueMatt: I got the build to work last night :-D
1457 2013-05-24 13:22:30 <robbak> Thanks, BlueMatt. I'll do that. I have a couple of patches for FreeBSD. One is switching to a system build with the system leveldb
1458 2013-05-24 13:22:45 <robbak> I would like to know what everyone else thinks of that.
1459 2013-05-24 13:22:57 <Prince> https://github.com/bitcoin/gitian.sigs/pull/4
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1466 2013-05-24 13:26:15 <BlueMatt> PRab: ehh...see my comment there
1467 2013-05-24 13:26:56 <robbak> While I'm talking, what gcc version would it be best built on?
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1472 2013-05-24 13:31:40 <Prince> BlueMatt: Recently, gavinandresen was saying that you guys wanted as many people as possible to do builds for comparison
1473 2013-05-24 13:31:45 yubrew has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
1474 2013-05-24 13:34:19 Prince is now known as michagogo
1475 2013-05-24 13:35:05 <kinlo> BlueMatt: I've had the request from gavin too, and he accepted my pull request last time.... I'm not in the signer list
1476 2013-05-24 13:35:08 <kinlo> afaik
1477 2013-05-24 13:35:34 <kinlo> and if someone pings me on irc whenever a new release is made, I'd build a gitian build immediatly
1478 2013-05-24 13:36:00 <kinlo> ^ last line for gavinandresen :)
1479 2013-05-24 13:36:10 <michagogo> kinlo: There's an 0.8.2rc2
1480 2013-05-24 13:36:26 <kinlo> michagogo: that I know...
1481 2013-05-24 13:36:29 organofcorti has joined
1482 2013-05-24 13:36:42 * michagogo pings kinlo
1483 2013-05-24 13:37:03 <kinlo> michagogo: ? :)
1484 2013-05-24 13:37:11 <michagogo> [16:12:11] <kinlo> and if someone pings me on irc whenever a new release is made, I'd build a gitian build immediatly
1485 2013-05-24 13:37:29 <kinlo> full release :p
1486 2013-05-24 13:37:31 <michagogo> Ah
1487 2013-05-24 13:37:34 <michagogo> Why not rc?
1488 2013-05-24 13:37:49 <kinlo> if gavinandresen wants me to, I'll do it
1489 2013-05-24 13:38:00 yubrew has joined
1490 2013-05-24 13:42:31 jgarzik has joined
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1492 2013-05-24 13:43:19 saulimus has joined
1493 2013-05-24 13:43:26 <organofcorti> is there a way to get bitcoind to return the coinbase?
1494 2013-05-24 13:44:31 yubrew has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1495 2013-05-24 13:45:06 <shesek> if I'm getting a list of unspent inputs from a source that I don't trust, is there anything I can do to ensure I got the correct amount of coins in those inputs?
1496 2013-05-24 13:45:50 <shesek> if the inputs are incorrect than the transaction would simply be ignored, which is fine. but if they have more coins than I'm being told, I could be tricked into spending much more as fees than I wanted to
1497 2013-05-24 13:46:06 arvicco has joined
1498 2013-05-24 13:46:22 <shesek> the input amounts isn't part of the transaction and isn't being signed, right?
1499 2013-05-24 13:49:21 lodse has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1500 2013-05-24 13:51:17 toffoo has quit ()
1501 2013-05-24 13:52:54 <michagogo> shesek: Yeah, the input amount is simply the sum of all the inputs that went in
1502 2013-05-24 13:53:39 safra has joined
1503 2013-05-24 13:55:47 <jgarzik> organofcorti, what do you mean return?
1504 2013-05-24 13:55:59 <jgarzik> organofcorti, coin base is a regular transaction, available via TX APIs
1505 2013-05-24 13:57:51 <organofcorti> use a bitcoind command to return the coinbase of a given block
1506 2013-05-24 13:58:43 Skav has joined
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1509 2013-05-24 14:06:33 <BlueMatt> michagogo: yes, I suppose that is better, I suppose putting them all in the git repo is fine if the bundles dont get them all
1510 2013-05-24 14:07:00 <BlueMatt> kinlo: ^
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1513 2013-05-24 14:10:54 <robbak> If anyone has a testnet client running, could I bounce a few coin off you? mje4vZzuRbpEHyTo42goiT1NXADsPGaxL5
1514 2013-05-24 14:11:29 <ryan-c> robbak: sup?
1515 2013-05-24 14:11:39 <ryan-c> I have a testnet node and coinds
1516 2013-05-24 14:11:40 sacarlson has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
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1518 2013-05-24 14:12:17 LainZ has joined
1519 2013-05-24 14:12:23 <robbak> I'd just like to test this build of the rc2 client. Could I send some to you, and you to me?
1520 2013-05-24 14:12:55 <ryan-c> sure
1521 2013-05-24 14:13:03 yubrew has joined
1522 2013-05-24 14:13:30 <ryan-c> n2z1ecmyYU6SWyT6z79T5gdMyhresUBGuD
1523 2013-05-24 14:13:35 <ryan-c> how much do you want?
1524 2013-05-24 14:14:22 <robbak> Whatever, as they say. I have no need of more
1525 2013-05-24 14:14:54 gigavps has joined
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1527 2013-05-24 14:14:58 <ryan-c> okay, i just ent you 25
1528 2013-05-24 14:15:12 <robbak> Yup, all received. Did you get my batch?
1529 2013-05-24 14:15:23 <gigavps> so what exactly is 0.8.2 doing that 0.8.1 isn't to keep getblocktemplate calls fast?
1530 2013-05-24 14:15:44 <michagogo> robbak: I also sent some your way
1531 2013-05-24 14:15:50 <gigavps> mempool is up to 1.6k txns and it is still snappy
1532 2013-05-24 14:16:29 <ryan-c> robbak: looks like it
1533 2013-05-24 14:17:09 <robbak> michagogo: Your's hasn't arrived yet.
1534 2013-05-24 14:18:36 <michagogo> robbak: you can sendrawtransaction http://pastebin.com/AiPWd4u6
1535 2013-05-24 14:20:34 <robbak> well, _that_ worked.
1536 2013-05-24 14:21:06 <michagogo> Of course
1537 2013-05-24 14:21:23 <michagogo> robbak: As soon as you sendrawtransaction your client pretends it came from the network
1538 2013-05-24 14:21:44 <michagogo> So by giving you the signed tx you can broadcast it
1539 2013-05-24 14:21:51 <michagogo> Also, it has 1 confirm now
1540 2013-05-24 14:22:07 <robbak> So it does.
1541 2013-05-24 14:22:26 <robbak> I wonder if that was from your end or from mine? I guess it doesn't really matter.
1542 2013-05-24 14:22:34 <michagogo> Right
1543 2013-05-24 14:23:32 <nospinzy> blockchain is slow
1544 2013-05-24 14:24:13 jeewee has quit (Quit: Leaving.)
1545 2013-05-24 14:24:21 RazielXYZ has joined
1546 2013-05-24 14:25:11 <michagogo> nospinzy: For some reason, the transaction didn't (at least not right away) make its way across the network to his node
1547 2013-05-24 14:25:15 wamatt has joined
1548 2013-05-24 14:25:24 <michagogo> So it didn't show up for him as an unconfirmed
1549 2013-05-24 14:25:25 <kinlo> gigavps: it cointaisn a few performance changes...
1550 2013-05-24 14:25:33 <kinlo> gigavps: you probably are having issues?
1551 2013-05-24 14:27:07 sacarlson has joined
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1553 2013-05-24 14:27:47 <gigavps> 0.8.1 was taking up to 14 seconds to respond for a gbt call
1554 2013-05-24 14:27:59 <gigavps> not good
1555 2013-05-24 14:28:09 <gigavps> 0.8.2 is doing much better
1556 2013-05-24 14:28:28 <gigavps> is this only because dust txns are not making it into the mempool?
1557 2013-05-24 14:28:49 <michagogo> That's a significant part, I think
1558 2013-05-24 14:29:24 bugg is now known as dfdf
1559 2013-05-24 14:29:49 <kinlo> gigavps: no
1560 2013-05-24 14:30:22 <gigavps> so there were improvments to gbt also?
1561 2013-05-24 14:30:22 <kinlo> gigavps: with the same transactions in the mempool I have a 10x speedup with just the gbt patches
1562 2013-05-24 14:30:26 <kinlo> yes
1563 2013-05-24 14:30:33 <gigavps> o nice
1564 2013-05-24 14:30:38 <gigavps> good to konw
1565 2013-05-24 14:30:39 <gigavps> know
1566 2013-05-24 14:30:41 <kinlo> all pools are upgraded to 0.8.1 with that patch as far as I know
1567 2013-05-24 14:30:48 <kinlo> well, the well known pools :)
1568 2013-05-24 14:30:59 * gigavps isn't on that mailing list
1569 2013-05-24 14:32:50 <sipa> morning!
1570 2013-05-24 14:33:32 <robbak> (so it is. You didn't need to remind me, sipa. Makes me feel like I should go to bed or something)
1571 2013-05-24 14:34:18 jgarzik has quit (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep)
1572 2013-05-24 14:34:34 <sipa> haha
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1576 2013-05-24 14:40:40 <robbak> I've just made some new branches for pull reqs and pushed them to github. How long before they show up there?
1577 2013-05-24 14:42:09 <BlueMatt> robbak: usually instantly, unless they are having problems
1578 2013-05-24 14:42:12 <BlueMatt> sipa: good morning
1579 2013-05-24 14:42:48 jeewee has joined
1580 2013-05-24 14:43:37 <robbak> Ah, I needed to do --all
1581 2013-05-24 14:43:52 <robbak> git push --all, or course. I'll get used to this stuff eventually.
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1584 2013-05-24 14:53:02 Michail1 is now known as Michail1_
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1590 2013-05-24 14:57:43 <gavinandresen> good morning, sipa. Still in California, I see....
1591 2013-05-24 14:57:43 allban has joined
1592 2013-05-24 14:58:09 <gavinandresen> Luke-Jr: you didn't happen to figure out why the new icons are breaking gitian, did you?
1593 2013-05-24 14:58:46 metabyte_ has joined
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1595 2013-05-24 14:59:35 <michagogo> gavinandresen: I managed to get the build to work
1596 2013-05-24 15:00:07 <gavinandresen> michagogo: great!
1597 2013-05-24 15:00:25 metabyte has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
1598 2013-05-24 15:00:31 <michagogo> gavinandresen: https://github.com/bitcoin/gitian.sigs/pull/4
1599 2013-05-24 15:00:48 <michagogo> (see the comment I made there)
1600 2013-05-24 15:00:49 gst has joined
1601 2013-05-24 15:01:27 <sipa> gavinandresen: indeed :)
1602 2013-05-24 15:02:12 ralphtheninja has joined
1603 2013-05-24 15:03:53 iwilcox_ has joined
1604 2013-05-24 15:04:37 <michagogo> gavinandresen: Hmm, just looked again
1605 2013-05-24 15:05:05 <michagogo> I guess I was tired last night... Seems you and Luke-Jr (and now laanwj) do have the same bitcoin-qt.exe
1606 2013-05-24 15:05:40 <michagogo> gavinandresen: Looks like my bitcoin-qt.exe disagrees with yours
1607 2013-05-24 15:05:41 jgarzik has joined
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1609 2013-05-24 15:05:44 jgarzik has joined
1610 2013-05-24 15:05:53 <michagogo> And the setup.exe we all disagree on, apparently
1611 2013-05-24 15:06:10 <gavinandresen> michagogo: you'll be our hero if you can figure out why your bitcoin-qt.exe disagrees
1612 2013-05-24 15:06:22 iwilcox has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
1613 2013-05-24 15:06:24 <gavinandresen> I'm trying to figure out why the setup.exe is different right now
1614 2013-05-24 15:06:25 nouitfvf has quit ()
1615 2013-05-24 15:07:19 talengix has joined
1616 2013-05-24 15:08:49 <michagogo> gavinandresen: I don't know nearly enough about how everything works to be able to tell you that...
1617 2013-05-24 15:09:21 Diablo-D3 has joined
1618 2013-05-24 15:09:29 Supa has joined
1619 2013-05-24 15:09:45 <Supa> Good Evening Good Sirs and Madams
1620 2013-05-24 15:10:01 <michagogo> gavinandresen: How would I start trying to figure it out?
1621 2013-05-24 15:10:05 <Supa> I regret to inform you that the time has come to release the leaked BTC-e Database
1622 2013-05-24 15:10:23 <gavinandresen> michagogo: run gitian twice, and see if your builds match themselves.
1623 2013-05-24 15:10:45 <Supa> In T-Minus 24 hours I will be releasing the entire BTC-e Database as well as all private keys for all wallets
1624 2013-05-24 15:10:51 <gavinandresen> michagogo: if they don't, then try to figure out what is different by⦠disassembling binaries or dlls, comparing files, etc
1625 2013-05-24 15:10:53 <michagogo> gavinandresen: Oh, one thing that *might* be related is the fact that wgetting libpng and zlib with the commands from https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/blob/master/doc/release-process.md failed
1626 2013-05-24 15:11:00 <Supa> and chat longs for the entire time from of BTC-e's existence
1627 2013-05-24 15:11:12 <SomeoneWeird> Supa, and why would you be doing that?
1628 2013-05-24 15:11:18 <Supa> I would suggest withdrawing all your funds
1629 2013-05-24 15:11:47 <Supa> it has been exactly 1 year since I was able to SQL Inject the site
1630 2013-05-24 15:12:04 <Supa> and because of the anniversary of this occasion I have decided to finally release the database
1631 2013-05-24 15:12:19 <Supa> as well as every chatlog of every user
1632 2013-05-24 15:12:33 <Supa> all bitcoin private keys for every address
1633 2013-05-24 15:12:40 <michagogo> gavinandresen: libpng 1.5.9 and zlib 1.2.6 aren't the latest -- I downloaded from sourceforge those versions
1634 2013-05-24 15:12:54 <Supa> as well as personal informations including credit cards
1635 2013-05-24 15:12:57 <Supa> pin numbers
1636 2013-05-24 15:13:03 <Supa> dwolla accounts
1637 2013-05-24 15:13:04 <Supa> etc
1638 2013-05-24 15:13:11 <michagogo> gavinandresen: Are your builds also done with 1.5.9 and 1.2.6, or did you use the latest versions?
1639 2013-05-24 15:13:16 abrkn has quit ()
1640 2013-05-24 15:13:36 <Supa> I have no use for this information as it was just a test to determine the security of BTC-e which is non existant
1641 2013-05-24 15:14:12 <gavinandresen> michagogo: I built with: 38690375d8d42398ce33b2df726e25cacf096496 zlib-1.2.6.tar.gz
1642 2013-05-24 15:14:12 <gavinandresen> e45384759854e0493051b15f6915c01562c2fc24 libpng-1.5.9.tar.gz
1643 2013-05-24 15:14:16 <SomeoneWeird> ... credit cards?
1644 2013-05-24 15:14:21 <SomeoneWeird> wat u on about
1645 2013-05-24 15:14:27 <yubrew> Supa is btc-e still unsecure?
1646 2013-05-24 15:14:32 <Supa> yes
1647 2013-05-24 15:14:39 <gavinandresen> Supa: off-topic for this channel
1648 2013-05-24 15:14:40 organofcorti has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
1649 2013-05-24 15:14:49 <Supa> I'm currently logged in as root right now
1650 2013-05-24 15:14:56 <Supa> really?
1651 2013-05-24 15:15:05 <Supa> the second biggest exchange being infiltrated
1652 2013-05-24 15:15:10 <Supa> is offtopic?
1653 2013-05-24 15:15:14 <BlueMatt> Supa: yes, not bitcoin-development related, take it to #bitcoin
1654 2013-05-24 15:15:15 <Supa> in a bitcoin-dev channel
1655 2013-05-24 15:15:17 <Supa> seems odd
1656 2013-05-24 15:15:22 <Supa> ok
1657 2013-05-24 15:15:23 <gavinandresen> Security or insecurity of exchanges is not relevant to core development
1658 2013-05-24 15:15:32 <Supa> ya it is
1659 2013-05-24 15:15:33 <Supa> patch it
1660 2013-05-24 15:15:33 <michagogo> gavinandresen: those sha1?
1661 2013-05-24 15:15:39 <gavinandresen> michagogo: yes, sha1
1662 2013-05-24 15:15:57 <yubrew> what's a good newbie contribution i can do to bitcoin/bitcoin?
1663 2013-05-24 15:15:57 <michagogo> gavinandresen: One sec, I'll check
1664 2013-05-24 15:16:03 <Supa> do I have to tell you how to patch a bitcoin protocol when I'm not even a developer
1665 2013-05-24 15:16:04 <Supa> lulz
1666 2013-05-24 15:16:15 <yubrew> i know ruby/rails really well, but not familiar with python
1667 2013-05-24 15:16:28 Supa has joined
1668 2013-05-24 15:16:47 <BlueMatt> yubrew: shit, Ive mentioned like 3 things in the past few days...cant remember them right now though...
1669 2013-05-24 15:17:08 <Supa> blocknodelog=1
1670 2013-05-24 15:17:10 <yubrew> i think going through the issues will be too complicated for me
1671 2013-05-24 15:17:20 <Supa> seta flushnodelist
1672 2013-05-24 15:17:50 <SomeoneWeird> Supa, sshhhhh or someone will ban you
1673 2013-05-24 15:17:59 <Supa> BTC-e is full of active nodes
1674 2013-05-24 15:18:07 <Supa> that are connected to /root
1675 2013-05-24 15:18:19 <jgarzik> ;;kban supa
1676 2013-05-24 15:19:03 <SomeoneWeird> lol
1677 2013-05-24 15:19:20 <SomeoneWeird> bet me to it :P
1678 2013-05-24 15:19:21 <TheLordOfTime> random comment: i'm surprised he hasn't banned in every bitcoin channel :/
1679 2013-05-24 15:19:29 <TheLordOfTime> s/banned/been banned/
1680 2013-05-24 15:19:30 <yubrew> BlueMatt just let me know when you remember :) or maybe i'll ask you again later
1681 2013-05-24 15:19:31 <SomeoneWeird> TheLordOfTime, oh he has, trust me
1682 2013-05-24 15:19:44 <SomeoneWeird> probably 50% of the #bitcoin banlist is him
1683 2013-05-24 15:19:57 <TheLordOfTime> SomeoneWeird: i'm going to guess that a majority of the -otc banlist is him as well
1684 2013-05-24 15:20:04 <SomeoneWeird> yep
1685 2013-05-24 15:20:14 <TheLordOfTime> ... and the three or four people who ended up there as a direct result of me...
1686 2013-05-24 15:20:58 <BlueMatt> yubrew: bitcoin/bitcoin is C++ so unless you know it, you probably need to get that under your belt (well...I suppose I learned C++ on bitcoin/bitcoin...not sure about small projects to figure out C++ though)
1687 2013-05-24 15:22:34 Michail1_ is now known as Michail1
1688 2013-05-24 15:22:36 LainZ has quit ()
1689 2013-05-24 15:23:33 Truncatem has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
1690 2013-05-24 15:24:13 <michagogo> gavinandresen: Ah, compare https://github.com/Michagogo/gitian.sigs/blob/master/0.8.2rc2-win32/michagogo/bitcoin-build.assert#L599 to https://github.com/bitcoin/gitian.sigs/blob/master/0.8.2rc2-win32/gavinandresen/bitcoin-build.assert#L599
1691 2013-05-24 15:24:37 <jgarzik> BlueMatt, gavinandresen: where are the latest child-pays-for-parent experiments, if any? ISTR one of you had a branch somewhere...
1692 2013-05-24 15:24:57 <michagogo> gavinandresen: Looks like out boost and qt don't match
1693 2013-05-24 15:24:58 <jgarzik> BitPay definitely interested in that, if ppl are still pursuing it
1694 2013-05-24 15:25:37 <michagogo> our*
1695 2013-05-24 15:26:09 <gavinandresen> michagogo: if I recall correctly, boost no matching exactly is OK. qt not matching breaks
1696 2013-05-24 15:26:41 <gavinandresen> michagogo: ⦠so either you give up and use my qt-win32-5.8.3-gitian.r1.zip ( http://skypaint.com/bitcoin/ )
1697 2013-05-24 15:26:44 <michagogo> So maybe the problem happened in the `./bin/gbuild ../bitcoin/contrib/gitian-descriptors/qt-win32.yml` step
1698 2013-05-24 15:26:53 <gavinandresen> michagogo: ⦠or you become a hero and figure out why the qt builds don't match
1699 2013-05-24 15:28:06 <michagogo> gavinandresen: I need to go soon, but maybe another time we can try building and signing qt, and comparing build-asserts
1700 2013-05-24 15:28:28 <gavinandresen> michagogo: no need for "we", you can just build it twice yourself and it probably won't match
1701 2013-05-24 15:28:39 <michagogo> Ah, you think?
1702 2013-05-24 15:28:42 <gavinandresen> yup
1703 2013-05-24 15:28:49 <michagogo> What might make it not match?
1704 2013-05-24 15:28:50 ovidiusoft has quit (Quit: leaving)
1705 2013-05-24 15:29:17 <gavinandresen> gcc likes to give methods random names⦠linkers like to put timestamps in files...
1706 2013-05-24 15:29:28 <michagogo> I thought gitian makes that not happen
1707 2013-05-24 15:29:56 <michagogo> [18:03:18] <gavinandresen> michagogo: ⦠so either you give up and use my qt-win32-5.8.3-gitian.r1.zip ( http://skypaint.com/bitcoin/ )
1708 2013-05-24 15:29:56 <michagogo> Wait... 5.8.3?
1709 2013-05-24 15:30:00 <gavinandresen> the gitian input scripts try to workaround those problems, by using libfaketime or passing -random_seed=foo to the compiler
1710 2013-05-24 15:30:01 <michagogo> Was that a typo?
1711 2013-05-24 15:30:10 <michagogo> I used 4.8.3
1712 2013-05-24 15:30:13 <gavinandresen> yup. 4.8.3
1713 2013-05-24 15:30:13 defunctzombie_zz is now known as defunctzombie
1714 2013-05-24 15:30:52 sacarlson has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
1715 2013-05-24 15:30:53 <TheLordOfTime> anyone know who maintains the bitcoin ppa for ubuntu?P
1716 2013-05-24 15:32:15 <TheLordOfTime> wait, i answered that myself with a /whois :P
1717 2013-05-24 15:32:47 rdponticelli has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
1718 2013-05-24 15:32:56 <michagogo> TheLordOfTime: Who'd you whois?
1719 2013-05-24 15:33:02 dlb76 has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
1720 2013-05-24 15:34:31 stalled has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
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1723 2013-05-24 15:37:51 <helo> TheLordOfTime: BlueMatt
1724 2013-05-24 15:38:06 <TheLordOfTime> michagogo: well, modified whois
1725 2013-05-24 15:38:41 <helo> btw, BlueMatt, since i already highlighted you: reminder to enable static builds for rc2
1726 2013-05-24 15:38:53 <TheLordOfTime> michagogo: two parts, look up the maintainer on LP, /whois here
1727 2013-05-24 15:39:11 <TheLordOfTime> BlueMatt: while we're pinging you, you need to deploy a build for Ubuntu Saucy :p
1728 2013-05-24 15:39:48 <TheLordOfTime> ... at least for the stable branch :p
1729 2013-05-24 15:40:06 mab_ has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
1730 2013-05-24 15:40:58 * jgarzik installs an ergonomic PC keyboard on his MacBook Pro. Apple _really_ does not like PC keyboards.
1731 2013-05-24 15:41:47 <HM_> lol
1732 2013-05-24 15:41:52 <TheLordOfTime> lol
1733 2013-05-24 15:42:12 stalled has joined
1734 2013-05-24 15:42:23 * nsh hopes jgarzik mechanically installed it, preferably with ratchet tape
1735 2013-05-24 15:42:40 * jgarzik welded it in place
1736 2013-05-24 15:42:45 <jgarzik> cannot be too secure
1737 2013-05-24 15:43:37 <HM_> super glue is not advised. especially if you are impatient and close the lid
1738 2013-05-24 15:43:41 <nsh> +1
1739 2013-05-24 15:44:56 sacrelege has joined
1740 2013-05-24 15:46:15 sacarlson has joined
1741 2013-05-24 15:48:45 <SomeoneWeird> ha
1742 2013-05-24 15:49:20 defunctzombie is now known as defunctzombie_zz
1743 2013-05-24 15:49:29 qeb has quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
1744 2013-05-24 15:51:30 <runeks> is there an RPC command that will tell me whether bitcoind thinks its block chain is up to date?
1745 2013-05-24 15:52:21 <sipa> getwork will fail if it's certain that it isn't
1746 2013-05-24 15:53:04 zer0def has joined
1747 2013-05-24 15:55:23 <buZz> .info
1748 2013-05-24 15:55:27 <buZz> arf
1749 2013-05-24 15:55:37 btcquant has quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
1750 2013-05-24 15:57:36 sacarlson has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
1751 2013-05-24 15:57:38 jgarzik has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1752 2013-05-24 15:58:13 jgarzik has joined
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1755 2013-05-24 15:59:24 <yubrew> runeks i don't know if there's something that says it's up to date
1756 2013-05-24 15:59:28 <yubrew> but there is a script you can run
1757 2013-05-24 15:59:47 <yubrew> https://gist.github.com/yubrew/5570228
1758 2013-05-24 16:00:04 <runeks> yubrew: Do you know how Bitcoin Qt determines whether it's up-to-date? IIRC, the text in the lower right corner indicates whether it's up-to-date
1759 2013-05-24 16:00:07 <yubrew> basically checks current block on blockchain.info and compares that to your own
1760 2013-05-24 16:00:32 <runeks> yubrew: Thanks. But I'm not crazy about depending on blockchain.info.
1761 2013-05-24 16:00:46 <runeks> I figure there must be a way to tell since Bitcoin Qt informs the user of this in the GUI.
1762 2013-05-24 16:00:53 <yubrew> ah ok, sorry i'm not too familiar
1763 2013-05-24 16:01:05 <runeks> But perhaps that functionality isn't exported to the RPC interface.
1764 2013-05-24 16:01:24 <yubrew> have you looked through the codebase?
1765 2013-05-24 16:01:42 taha_ has quit (Quit: Leaving)
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1774 2013-05-24 16:07:27 <sipa> runeks: there are two ways: check the timestamp of your latent block (safe but inaccurate), or compare with the startinggeight reported by your peers
1775 2013-05-24 16:08:41 <runeks> sipa: Ok. So this means the functionality isn't exported via RPC? I assume Bitcoin Qt does the latter internally, in order to determine whether it has the newest block?
1776 2013-05-24 16:10:16 <sipa> bitcoin-qt uses the first for the gui
1777 2013-05-24 16:10:55 <sipa> and the lattrr for some performance tweaking (don't sync to disk after every block eg)
1778 2013-05-24 16:11:21 <sipa> both are just guesses though
1779 2013-05-24 16:12:03 sacarlson has joined
1780 2013-05-24 16:12:37 <runeks> Right. I figured you couldn't be sure. Maybe that's why it's not a good idea to export via RPC.
1781 2013-05-24 16:12:57 <sipa> as said: you can try grtwork
1782 2013-05-24 16:13:11 <sipa> it fails during ibd
1783 2013-05-24 16:14:01 <donpdonp> runeks: getpeerinfo reports the highest block for each peer, if you're looking for jsonapi info
1784 2013-05-24 16:14:23 <sipa> ... which they can lie about
1785 2013-05-24 16:14:33 Guest21780 has quit (Changing host)
1786 2013-05-24 16:14:33 Guest21780 has joined
1787 2013-05-24 16:14:39 Guest21780 is now known as jgarzik_
1788 2013-05-24 16:14:45 <donpdonp> oh man, this area seems tricky to get right. :)
1789 2013-05-24 16:14:56 <runeks> donpdonp: Nice! That might be useful.
1790 2013-05-24 16:15:04 <sipa> it is fundamentally impossible
1791 2013-05-24 16:15:06 <donpdonp> relying on the local clock has its own risks
1792 2013-05-24 16:15:09 <runeks> Although it's always going to be guesswork.
1793 2013-05-24 16:15:23 <sipa> bitcoind is _always_ syncing
1794 2013-05-24 16:15:46 <sipa> in the sense that it always tries to find new blocks it doesn't know about
1795 2013-05-24 16:15:56 <runeks> Only 8/10 of my peeers has the same block height that I see (237710). One is probably catching up, and another has 237712. Not sure where he got those two extra blocks.
1796 2013-05-24 16:16:13 <sipa> ;;blocks
1797 2013-05-24 16:16:14 <gribble> 237713
1798 2013-05-24 16:16:19 <runeks> Hm...
1799 2013-05-24 16:16:53 <sipa> note that the startingheight is only exchanged at connect time
1800 2013-05-24 16:16:57 iwilcox has joined
1801 2013-05-24 16:16:58 <runeks> Wait, I have 237713 too. My peers are not up to date, apparently.
1802 2013-05-24 16:17:04 <sipa> it's not updated afterwards
1803 2013-05-24 16:17:06 <runeks> Well that explains it
1804 2013-05-24 16:17:29 roconnor has joined
1805 2013-05-24 16:18:43 iwilcox_ has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
1806 2013-05-24 16:19:10 <jgarzik_> did the devs catch up with roconnor
1807 2013-05-24 16:19:11 <jgarzik_> ?
1808 2013-05-24 16:19:20 <sipa> yes!
1809 2013-05-24 16:20:37 altamic has quit (Quit: altamic)
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1813 2013-05-24 16:24:33 * nsh imagines the benny hill theme was involved
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1818 2013-05-24 16:28:01 <sipa> ...?
1819 2013-05-24 16:28:35 <gmaxwell> more like roconnor caught up with the devs. :)
1820 2013-05-24 16:28:58 <nsh> (people chasing after people, yackity sax silly music... never mind.)
1821 2013-05-24 16:28:59 defunctzombie_zz is now known as defunctzombie
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1824 2013-05-24 16:30:26 <sipa> /me only knows benny lava
1825 2013-05-24 16:31:49 <sipa> ah, that benny hill theme is familiar
1826 2013-05-24 16:32:07 CaptainBlaze has joined
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1847 2013-05-24 16:53:43 quib has joined
1848 2013-05-24 16:57:36 <quib> hey, was here earlier but couldnt wait for a reply. according to the bitcoin wiki (https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Getwork) getdata output is little endian, but the version number in first 4 bytes is 2 right? so when the data string starts with 00000002 isnt that big endian?
1849 2013-05-24 16:57:40 nethershaw has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1850 2013-05-24 16:57:43 <quib> s/getdata/getwork
1851 2013-05-24 16:57:46 rdponticelli has joined
1852 2013-05-24 16:58:05 <jgarzik_> quib, see cpuminer source code, which illustrates proper decoding
1853 2013-05-24 16:58:24 <jgarzik_> quib, however, in general, getwork is deprecated in favor of getblocktemplate, and creating work in the miner / mining pools
1854 2013-05-24 16:58:57 rdponticelli_ has joined
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1862 2013-05-24 17:06:33 <quib> not familiar with C so unfortunately I dont understand whats happening. but trying to get some clues. thanks
1863 2013-05-24 17:07:06 defunctzombie is now known as defunctzombie_zz
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1872 2013-05-24 17:17:54 <phantomcircuit> it's interesting that there's a point in the blockchain where processing switches from io to cpu limited
1873 2013-05-24 17:18:46 nouitfvf has joined
1874 2013-05-24 17:19:00 <sipa> you mean the last checkpoint?
1875 2013-05-24 17:19:25 stalled has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
1876 2013-05-24 17:19:35 * nsh suspects that point is more of a spread when you considered the varieties of hardware
1877 2013-05-24 17:19:51 <nsh> and OS settings, etc.
1878 2013-05-24 17:20:40 jgarzik_ has quit (Quit: This computer has gone to sleep)
1879 2013-05-24 17:21:29 jgarzik_ has joined
1880 2013-05-24 17:22:16 <phantomcircuit> sipa, no
1881 2013-05-24 17:22:22 <phantomcircuit> sipa, there's a point after 193k
1882 2013-05-24 17:22:54 jgarzik_ has quit (Changing host)
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1884 2013-05-24 17:22:55 <phantomcircuit> and yeah this is on an ssd with an i3-2100
1885 2013-05-24 17:23:04 <phantomcircuit> so possibly that's a different point than say an atom
1886 2013-05-24 17:24:18 <MC1984> thats when SD stated
1887 2013-05-24 17:24:21 <MC1984> started
1888 2013-05-24 17:24:43 <pjorrit> graaaaaaaaaugh booooost
1889 2013-05-24 17:25:19 <BlueMatt> jgarzik_: I never wrote mine out in code...I have generic description of an algo I was /going/ to implement though
1890 2013-05-24 17:25:43 Diablo-D3 has quit (Quit: do coders dream of sheep()?)
1891 2013-05-24 17:25:49 <jgarzik_> ok
1892 2013-05-24 17:26:24 <BlueMatt> TheLordOfTime/helo send me an email Ill try to get to it tonight
1893 2013-05-24 17:26:37 <TheLordOfTime> BlueMatt: your email wasn't listed publicly on LP for me to sese.
1894 2013-05-24 17:26:38 <TheLordOfTime> see*
1895 2013-05-24 17:26:47 <BlueMatt> bitcoin-list@bluematt.me
1896 2013-05-24 17:26:48 <TheLordOfTime> maybe that's a bug in LP or something, but if you drop me your email in priv i'll send you the email
1897 2013-05-24 17:26:50 Diablo-D3 has joined
1898 2013-05-24 17:26:50 <TheLordOfTime> ok.
1899 2013-05-24 17:26:55 Neozonz has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
1900 2013-05-24 17:27:06 <BlueMatt> jgarzik_: it has a few bugs I need to work out first though...
1901 2013-05-24 17:27:23 stalled has joined
1902 2013-05-24 17:27:30 tgs3 is now known as illutionist
1903 2013-05-24 17:27:31 * BlueMatt -> away
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1907 2013-05-24 17:29:36 <nsh> from #bitcoin: Ham> HI, it's regarding Bitcoin QT, I have some issue about it, with 0.8.1 or previous version, I can't have syn, when check with debug.log, found "socket select error 10038", I take a chance on 0.8.2rc1, it works, anyone have any idea why was that?
1908 2013-05-24 17:30:29 <nsh> "In an interview for the BBC TV programme "The Queens Castle" he gave a tour of the Park, explained his thoughts and actions in making decisions to open the Farm Shop, cut down trees, move various facilities, and to open up the park to deer as well as people!"
1909 2013-05-24 17:30:32 <nsh> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ranger_of_Windsor_Great_Park
1910 2013-05-24 17:30:44 <nsh> that's maybe the strangest exclamation mark i've seen on WP for a while
1911 2013-05-24 17:31:04 <nsh> oooo, can we somehow search for all articles ordered by exclamation mark density?
1912 2013-05-24 17:31:22 iwilcox_ has joined
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1918 2013-05-24 17:36:05 <jgarzik_> refresh my memory
1919 2013-05-24 17:36:11 <jgarzik_> what is a "wkey" in the wallet?
1920 2013-05-24 17:36:16 Neozonz has joined
1921 2013-05-24 17:36:19 <jgarzik_> as distinguished from "key"
1922 2013-05-24 17:36:42 <sipa> jgarzik_: unused since i first touched the code
1923 2013-05-24 17:36:50 <sipa> jgarzik_: it's a wallet key with some metadata attached
1924 2013-05-24 17:36:56 <jgarzik_> hmm, ok
1925 2013-05-24 17:37:02 <jgarzik_> sipa, refreshing the wallet birthday patch
1926 2013-05-24 17:37:12 lolcookie__ has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
1927 2013-05-24 17:37:14 <sipa> jgarzik_: you did see my dumpwallet patch?
1928 2013-05-24 17:37:16 winterblack has joined
1929 2013-05-24 17:37:20 <sipa> (which does birthday inference)
1930 2013-05-24 17:37:24 safra has quit (Quit: Leaving)
1931 2013-05-24 17:37:34 * nsh wonders what birthday inference is
1932 2013-05-24 17:37:48 <wumpus> one creates a CPrivkey, the other creates a CWalletKey
1933 2013-05-24 17:37:51 <sipa> nsh: determining (a lower bound on) when a key was created
1934 2013-05-24 17:37:55 <jgarzik_> looks like a bit of duplicate code, where loading wallet does the same thing for "key" records and "wkey" records
1935 2013-05-24 17:38:04 <nsh> sipa, hmm, interesting
1936 2013-05-24 17:38:16 <sipa> jgarzik_: see my ckey refactor :p
1937 2013-05-24 17:38:21 <sipa> jgarzik_: it deduplicates that part
1938 2013-05-24 17:38:43 <jgarzik_> good
1939 2013-05-24 17:39:36 nethershaw has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1940 2013-05-24 17:39:54 <jgarzik_> wkey has time-created, time-expires and comment
1941 2013-05-24 17:41:05 <jgarzik_> hrm
1942 2013-05-24 17:41:13 <jgarzik_> I cannot find where wkey is written at all
1943 2013-05-24 17:41:45 ColinT has joined
1944 2013-05-24 17:41:59 <jgarzik_> maybe we should start using it
1945 2013-05-24 17:42:23 <sipa> it's not written at all
1946 2013-05-24 17:42:28 * jgarzik_ created a separate CKeyMetadata and associated "keymeta" BDB record, but wkey (CWalletKey) seems to fit the bill too.
1947 2013-05-24 17:42:30 <sipa> it's still in the code for backward compatibility
1948 2013-05-24 17:42:39 <sipa> i'm not sure if it was ever written at all
1949 2013-05-24 17:42:41 <jgarzik_> main question is either remove-wkey, add-keymeta or use-wkey
1950 2013-05-24 17:43:14 <jgarzik_> keymeta has the advantage of being a separate record that may be added later, without impacting existing keys
1951 2013-05-24 17:43:32 <sipa> but keymeta would be loaded into memory?
1952 2013-05-24 17:44:27 <sipa> the question is mainly: where would you read the information in keymeta
1953 2013-05-24 17:44:49 <jgarzik_> sipa, currently no, just used to compute wallet birthday. Could be loaded into memory if desired, but that's not how its used now.
1954 2013-05-24 17:44:51 <sipa> if that correlates strongly with where you'd read key data itself, it makes sense to make it part of it
1955 2013-05-24 17:45:06 <sipa> where/when do you need the wallet birthday?
1956 2013-05-24 17:45:26 <jgarzik_> sipa, https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/1863
1957 2013-05-24 17:46:02 <phantomcircuit> hmm
1958 2013-05-24 17:46:14 <phantomcircuit> getblocks in 0.8.x might be a bit too aggressive
1959 2013-05-24 17:46:24 <sipa> jgarzik_: afaik, you only need it when exporting/importing no?
1960 2013-05-24 17:46:32 <sipa> jgarzik_: sorry, haven't looked at your pull yet
1961 2013-05-24 17:46:38 <sipa> i'll comment later
1962 2013-05-24 17:47:07 <phantomcircuit> i cant imagine that sending getblocks after processing every block to all peers is a good idea
1963 2013-05-24 17:47:59 <phantomcircuit> otoh it's just an inv response so maybe it doesn't matter
1964 2013-05-24 17:49:24 <sipa> phantomcircuit: i hope to do headers-first sync soon, and rip out the entire ugly-and-easily-confused-getblocks/inv/getdata/block-cycle
1965 2013-05-24 17:49:55 <phantomcircuit> sipa, k
1966 2013-05-24 17:51:12 allban has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
1967 2013-05-24 17:51:33 <phantomcircuit> huh
1968 2013-05-24 17:51:45 <phantomcircuit> blockchain.info and gribble are reporting a different block height than i have
1969 2013-05-24 17:52:01 <gmaxwell> "blocks" : 237721,
1970 2013-05-24 17:52:06 <sipa> ;;blocks
1971 2013-05-24 17:52:06 <gribble> 237721
1972 2013-05-24 17:52:08 daybyter has joined
1973 2013-05-24 17:52:11 <phantomcircuit> "blocks" : 237714,
1974 2013-05-24 17:52:16 <gmaxwell> phantomcircuit: gribble gets it from blockchain.info IIRC
1975 2013-05-24 17:52:24 ielo has joined
1976 2013-05-24 17:52:27 <phantomcircuit> 0.8.1 with 8 peers
1977 2013-05-24 17:52:28 <sipa> b.i is often wrong...
1978 2013-05-24 17:52:29 <phantomcircuit> weird
1979 2013-05-24 17:52:38 <sipa> ah, you're behind
1980 2013-05-24 17:53:05 <phantomcircuit> sipa, i dont see how though
1981 2013-05-24 17:53:13 GordonG3kko has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
1982 2013-05-24 17:53:16 <phantomcircuit> there's getblocks -1 to 00 in the logs with no response
1983 2013-05-24 17:53:26 <phantomcircuit> huh it must have been stuck
1984 2013-05-24 17:53:28 <sipa> yes, expected
1985 2013-05-24 17:53:31 <phantomcircuit> restarting fixed it
1986 2013-05-24 17:53:39 <phantomcircuit> ohh i know
1987 2013-05-24 17:53:44 <jgarzik_> sipa, hehe, you looked at the pull a long time ago actually
1988 2013-05-24 17:53:51 <phantomcircuit> since i started there's been 7 blocks
1989 2013-05-24 17:54:14 <phantomcircuit> would have corrected itself when the next block was mined
1990 2013-05-24 17:54:23 daybyter has quit (Client Quit)
1991 2013-05-24 17:54:26 <sipa> ?
1992 2013-05-24 17:54:34 GordonG3kko has joined
1993 2013-05-24 17:54:48 <phantomcircuit> sipa, the blockheight numbers from all the peers were 237714 when they were connected to
1994 2013-05-24 17:55:04 <sipa> ok, so?
1995 2013-05-24 17:55:41 <phantomcircuit> iirc the getblocks stuff only keeps going until it gets to the height reported by peers
1996 2013-05-24 17:55:47 <phantomcircuit> or if there's an orphan
1997 2013-05-24 17:55:53 _maniac_ has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
1998 2013-05-24 17:56:12 <sipa> any new block that is announced should be fetched
1999 2013-05-24 17:56:19 <sipa> getblocks has nothing to do with it
2000 2013-05-24 17:56:38 <phantomcircuit> sipa, right but i was doing a reindex
2001 2013-05-24 17:56:56 <sipa> ah
2002 2013-05-24 17:57:04 <sipa> on 0.8.2?
2003 2013-05-24 17:57:07 Happzz has joined
2004 2013-05-24 17:57:10 <phantomcircuit> 0.8.1
2005 2013-05-24 17:57:13 <sipa> ok
2006 2013-05-24 17:57:18 <phantomcircuit> going to actually be using this
2007 2013-05-24 17:57:23 <sipa> 0.8.2 starts fetching immediately after reindex finishes
2008 2013-05-24 17:57:26 <phantomcircuit> so no rc releases with bugs for now :)
2009 2013-05-24 17:58:14 daybyter has joined
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2012 2013-05-24 18:07:47 <phantomcircuit> sipa, it would be nice if there was a lower latency rpc mechanism than json rpc
2013 2013-05-24 18:08:11 <phantomcircuit> im just trying to enumerage the block hashes by index and im having to wait for it to finish
2014 2013-05-24 18:08:25 <wumpus> phantomcircuit: seen the zeromq pull req?
2015 2013-05-24 18:08:41 <phantomcircuit> no i hadn't
2016 2013-05-24 18:09:01 <sipa> zeromq is not really an RPC mechanism
2017 2013-05-24 18:09:05 <sipa> you can't send requests
2018 2013-05-24 18:09:12 <sipa> (afaik)
2019 2013-05-24 18:09:12 <wumpus> you can send requests
2020 2013-05-24 18:09:21 <sipa> oh!
2021 2013-05-24 18:09:25 <wumpus> but it's still in json, that's true... just comes in through another way
2022 2013-05-24 18:09:38 <sipa> can you send any RPC?
2023 2013-05-24 18:09:42 <wumpus> so it's a rpc mechanism minus the serialization system
2024 2013-05-24 18:09:47 <wumpus> yes
2025 2013-05-24 18:10:02 <sipa> i thought it was just a replacement for blocknotify/walletnotify/...
2026 2013-05-24 18:10:17 <gmaxwell> phantomcircuit: "block hashes by index" < thats slow because there is a linear scan to do that. There is a pull which indexes it IIRC.
2027 2013-05-24 18:10:34 <phantomcircuit> gmaxwell, ah
2028 2013-05-24 18:10:35 <gmaxwell> (I mean, json is slow too... but thats not all of it for doing that)
2029 2013-05-24 18:10:36 <phantomcircuit> ok then
2030 2013-05-24 18:10:38 <sipa> i'm not sure which is the largest bottleneck
2031 2013-05-24 18:10:49 <sipa> RPC overhead, or iterating 100k CBlockIndex entries
2032 2013-05-24 18:11:03 <phantomcircuit> im basically trying to copy the entire blockchain into a psql db over rpc
2033 2013-05-24 18:11:08 <wumpus> I doubt the json is the problem, unless it's building very large structures
2034 2013-05-24 18:11:09 <phantomcircuit> so i dont expect this to be quick
2035 2013-05-24 18:11:15 <phantomcircuit> but i didn't expect that to be slow
2036 2013-05-24 18:11:27 <sipa> wumpus: including connection setup overhead, forking a thread, ...
2037 2013-05-24 18:13:45 RedEmerald has quit (Changing host)
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2039 2013-05-24 18:14:12 <wumpus> sipa: yeah it's not exactly optimized for latency
2040 2013-05-24 18:14:27 <phantomcircuit> gmaxwell, yeah im only at 15k index/hash pairs
2041 2013-05-24 18:14:45 brson has joined
2042 2013-05-24 18:14:58 <sipa> phantomcircuit: feel free to check if #2644 improves it
2043 2013-05-24 18:15:40 daybyter has quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
2044 2013-05-24 18:16:13 Skav has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2045 2013-05-24 18:17:23 Thepok has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2046 2013-05-24 18:17:26 MobPhone has joined
2047 2013-05-24 18:17:59 BTCOxygen has joined
2048 2013-05-24 18:18:36 da2ce7_d has joined
2049 2013-05-24 18:18:58 btcquant has joined
2050 2013-05-24 18:19:31 <gruez> no blocks in 50 minutes
2051 2013-05-24 18:19:32 <gruez> PANIC
2052 2013-05-24 18:19:34 btcquant has quit (Client Quit)
2053 2013-05-24 18:20:09 dvide has joined
2054 2013-05-24 18:21:14 da2ce7 has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
2055 2013-05-24 18:21:27 <phantomcircuit> ;;tslb
2056 2013-05-24 18:21:29 BlackPrapor has joined
2057 2013-05-24 18:21:32 <phantomcircuit> gruez, 1 minute
2058 2013-05-24 18:21:35 suporte85 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2059 2013-05-24 18:22:01 <gribble> Time since last block: 2 minutes and 25 seconds
2060 2013-05-24 18:22:19 <gruez> ;;tslb
2061 2013-05-24 18:22:21 <gribble> Time since last block: 2 minutes and 46 seconds
2062 2013-05-24 18:22:24 <donpdonp> http://blockchain.info/ also shows a 50 minute gap
2063 2013-05-24 18:22:34 <phantomcircuit> it was a joke
2064 2013-05-24 18:22:40 <gruez> it just updated
2065 2013-05-24 18:22:40 <phantomcircuit> as soon as he said it there was a block
2066 2013-05-24 18:22:41 <gruez> :/
2067 2013-05-24 18:23:29 systemParanoid has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
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2069 2013-05-24 18:24:53 <phantomcircuit> sipa, seems to have no effect
2070 2013-05-24 18:25:07 <phantomcircuit> cpu usage is also very low
2071 2013-05-24 18:25:12 <phantomcircuit> so it's almost certainly a latency issue
2072 2013-05-24 18:25:38 <phantomcircuit> i expect it's going to take something like 40 million rpc calls to accomplish what im trying to do
2073 2013-05-24 18:25:52 gruez has quit (Quit: Page closed)
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2076 2013-05-24 18:28:39 <jgm> phantomcircuit: what are you trying to achieve? I have some code that reads out the blockchain and puts it in to postgresql, although it might not have everything that you want in it
2077 2013-05-24 18:29:04 <phantomcircuit> jgm, the goal is to use bitcoind for it
2078 2013-05-24 18:29:41 <phantomcircuit> it's much easier to show that rpc -> db is correctly done than it is to show that verification is done correctly
2079 2013-05-24 18:29:42 <jgm> phantomcircuit: using postgresql as the real-time store instead of leveldb? In that case I can't help you I'm afraid, I'm doing post-processing of the data rather than real-time
2080 2013-05-24 18:30:57 Liquid3xB has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2081 2013-05-24 18:32:18 <jgm> Unless you're saying that you want to use the bitcoind RPC interface rather than parsing the blocks themselves to pull the info, in which case depending on the info you're pulling you might be in for a long wait. Building up the rows individually in postgresql takes a lot of time, especially if you're normalising it. I had to resort to \copy and lots of tricks to make it move at a reasonable speed
2082 2013-05-24 18:35:32 caedes has joined
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2085 2013-05-24 18:35:32 caedes has joined
2086 2013-05-24 18:36:26 <jgm> Or to put it another way: if you think you're having trouble getting the data out of bitcoind, wait until you try to put it in to postgresql
2087 2013-05-24 18:37:49 sydna has joined
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2103 2013-05-24 19:00:47 <phantomcircuit> lots leading up to rpc deadlock
2104 2013-05-24 19:00:47 <phantomcircuit> http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=qiJueMqm
2105 2013-05-24 19:00:49 <phantomcircuit> logs*
2106 2013-05-24 19:01:42 <phantomcircuit> looks like getrawtransaction conflicts with handling a getdata message
2107 2013-05-24 19:02:27 <sipa> everything contends with everything
2108 2013-05-24 19:02:37 <sipa> as pretty much everything uses cs_main
2109 2013-05-24 19:02:58 daybyter has quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
2110 2013-05-24 19:03:08 <phantomcircuit> sipa, right but this doesn't look like contention, the rpc calls never complete
2111 2013-05-24 19:03:24 <sipa> :o
2112 2013-05-24 19:03:32 <phantomcircuit> works fine as long as im not making simultaneous getrawtransaction calls
2113 2013-05-24 19:04:22 <phantomcircuit> hmm maybe it has nothing to do with the getdata handler
2114 2013-05-24 19:04:59 <phantomcircuit> 8 threads requesting getrawtransaction for different transactions appears to have caused a deadlock
2115 2013-05-24 19:05:39 <phantomcircuit> yup additional rpc call is blocked also
2116 2013-05-24 19:06:10 <sipa> 0.8.2 or 0.8.1?
2117 2013-05-24 19:06:13 <gmaxwell> \O/
2118 2013-05-24 19:07:16 <phantomcircuit> sipa, your const branch
2119 2013-05-24 19:08:31 <phantomcircuit> i'll try it again with origin/master
2120 2013-05-24 19:09:57 <sipa> unlikely to make a different
2121 2013-05-24 19:10:03 <sipa> my const brach is quite recent
2122 2013-05-24 19:10:13 <sipa> and i don't think there were changes to the threads stuff since
2123 2013-05-24 19:11:02 sanders_ has quit (Ping timeout: 241 seconds)
2124 2013-05-24 19:11:16 <phantomcircuit> sipa, yeah i think this has always been a problem
2125 2013-05-24 19:11:40 lodse has joined
2126 2013-05-24 19:12:08 <sipa> well, i'm not sure how maintained it is, but yu can try compiling with -DLOCK_CONTENTIOn
2127 2013-05-24 19:12:18 chorao has joined
2128 2013-05-24 19:12:29 <sipa> -DDEBUG_LOCKORDER
2129 2013-05-24 19:12:30 <sipa> sorry
2130 2013-05-24 19:13:33 GordonG3kko has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
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2134 2013-05-24 19:15:30 Ssateneth has joined
2135 2013-05-24 19:15:37 GordonG3kko has joined
2136 2013-05-24 19:15:48 <Ssateneth> will there be a fix for all the micro transaction spam?
2137 2013-05-24 19:16:06 <jouke> a fix
2138 2013-05-24 19:16:47 <Cusipzzz> don't relay them, don't mine them. fixed.
2139 2013-05-24 19:18:15 sanders has joined
2140 2013-05-24 19:18:21 <phantomcircuit> sipa, it's actually both of them apparently
2141 2013-05-24 19:19:02 Benjojo has joined
2142 2013-05-24 19:19:15 <sipa> both what?
2143 2013-05-24 19:19:24 <phantomcircuit> DEBUG_LOCKORDER DEBUG_LOCKCONTENTION
2144 2013-05-24 19:19:41 <sipa> yes, but the first is for debugging deadlocks
2145 2013-05-24 19:19:50 <sipa> the second for performance degradatn
2146 2013-05-24 19:20:51 <Ssateneth> but what to do with the huge unconfirmed transaction buffer? doesnt that cause certain things to get stressed or break?
2147 2013-05-24 19:21:16 <sipa> 0.8.2 has some performance improvements for that as well
2148 2013-05-24 19:21:33 <sipa> and the mempool is reduced by not accepting dust
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2150 2013-05-24 19:23:24 <Ssateneth> when will this update become mandatory?
2151 2013-05-24 19:23:38 <sipa> never
2152 2013-05-24 19:23:44 <Ssateneth> :(
2153 2013-05-24 19:23:45 <sipa> it's a local policy
2154 2013-05-24 19:23:56 <phantomcircuit> sipa, http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=TuRHSF5P
2155 2013-05-24 19:24:00 <Ssateneth> there have been mandatory updates before though
2156 2013-05-24 19:24:07 <Ssateneth> like when the blockchain forked
2157 2013-05-24 19:24:11 <sipa> those were about network validity rules
2158 2013-05-24 19:24:19 <sipa> those are a different class of changes entirely
2159 2013-05-24 19:24:29 savetheinternet has joined
2160 2013-05-24 19:24:30 <sipa> local policy changes can't be enforced and shouldn't
2161 2013-05-24 19:24:38 <sydna> eventually people will be pushed past 0.8.2 though
2162 2013-05-24 19:25:19 <sipa> that doesn't make it mandatory
2163 2013-05-24 19:25:20 <phantomcircuit> sipa, killing the rpc client (ie closing the socket) resolves the deadlock
2164 2013-05-24 19:25:33 <sipa> you can disable the dust filtering
2165 2013-05-24 19:25:42 <sipa> or you can set the dust policy to a very low number
2166 2013-05-24 19:25:50 <sipa> afk
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2170 2013-05-24 19:27:57 <sipa> phantomcircuit: no deadlock
2171 2013-05-24 19:28:18 <gigavps> sipa are there new config settings for dust filtering?
2172 2013-05-24 19:28:38 <sipa> yes
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2174 2013-05-24 19:28:56 <phantomcircuit> sipa, is it just that the main thread is holding cs_main for a long time?
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2180 2013-05-24 19:36:38 <phantomcircuit> sipa, er
2181 2013-05-24 19:37:15 <phantomcircuit> i put printf statements before/after each rpc call is executed in bitcoinrpc.cpp:1030 which should be under a mutex
2182 2013-05-24 19:37:39 <phantomcircuit> but i have back to back lock contention indicators for cs_main without the printf statements
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2189 2013-05-24 19:43:11 <Luke-Jr> gavinandresen: no⦠how icons works in EXEs is a bit outside my expertise, I'm afraid :/
2190 2013-05-24 19:44:13 gst has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
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2198 2013-05-24 19:51:30 <phantomcircuit> Luke-Jr, any idea why i would be seeing what looks like a deadlock without any indication of a deadlock
2199 2013-05-24 19:51:41 <phantomcircuit> infinite loop sentence
2200 2013-05-24 19:51:50 <Luke-Jr> phantomcircuit: nfc what you're talking about
2201 2013-05-24 19:52:09 <phantomcircuit> Luke-Jr, spam rpc with getblock/getrawtransaction calls from multiple sockets
2202 2013-05-24 19:52:33 <phantomcircuit> eventually stops responding until i close the existing connections
2203 2013-05-24 19:53:12 swulf-- has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
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2205 2013-05-24 19:54:46 <jgarzik> phantomcircuit, hrm
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2207 2013-05-24 19:55:39 <gmaxwell> phantomcircuit: tried with lock debugging enabled? may be a lock ordering problem someplace.
2208 2013-05-24 19:55:51 sydna has quit (Quit: sydna)
2209 2013-05-24 19:55:51 <phantomcircuit> yup
2210 2013-05-24 19:55:52 <phantomcircuit> http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=TuRHSF5P
2211 2013-05-24 19:55:55 <phantomcircuit> nothing obvious to me
2212 2013-05-24 19:56:51 <phantomcircuit> i tried adding a printf to CMutexLock::Enter/CMutexLock::~CMutexLock
2213 2013-05-24 19:57:33 <phantomcircuit> but bitcoind just hangs completely
2214 2013-05-24 19:57:42 <phantomcircuit> with literally no output to debug.log
2215 2013-05-24 19:58:50 ThomasV has joined
2216 2013-05-24 19:58:53 <gmaxwell> adding printfs to the locking code is likely to be lol because 'printf' takes a lock.
2217 2013-05-24 19:59:08 <phantomcircuit> oh
2218 2013-05-24 19:59:10 <phantomcircuit> yeah
2219 2013-05-24 19:59:21 <phantomcircuit> what's the real printf function called?
2220 2013-05-24 19:59:38 <jgarzik> OutputDebugStringF or somesuch
2221 2013-05-24 19:59:51 <jgarzik> the real printf function of course never changes its name
2222 2013-05-24 19:59:58 <gmaxwell> Thats what printf turns into. I just use fprintf when I want a libc printf.
2223 2013-05-24 20:00:03 paracyst has joined
2224 2013-05-24 20:00:04 <jgarzik> heh, ditto
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2232 2013-05-24 20:10:47 <phantomcircuit> cs_mapAlerts, cs_main, pwalletMain->cs_wallet
2233 2013-05-24 20:11:17 <phantomcircuit> cs_main, mempool.cs
2234 2013-05-24 20:11:45 <phantomcircuit> it's hard/impossible to figure out which locks are being given up
2235 2013-05-24 20:11:55 GordonG3kko has joined
2236 2013-05-24 20:12:19 <gmaxwell> phantomcircuit: when they go out of scope, for all the scoped ones.
2237 2013-05-24 20:12:50 <phantomcircuit> gmaxwell, right but keeping track of when they go out of scope
2238 2013-05-24 20:13:08 <phantomcircuit> CMutexLock doesn't keep it's name
2239 2013-05-24 20:14:40 <phantomcircuit> cs_mapAlerts, cs_main, pwalletMain->cs_wallet, method called, cs_main, mempool.cs, method returns
2240 2013-05-24 20:15:01 <phantomcircuit> everything except cs_mapAlerts make sense
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2242 2013-05-24 20:18:00 <gavinandresen> cs_mapAlerts protects mapAlertsâ¦
2243 2013-05-24 20:18:14 <MC1984> ooooo bitcoind just crashed on stop
2244 2013-05-24 20:18:20 <MC1984> Committing 2452 changed transactions to coin database...
2245 2013-05-24 20:18:21 <MC1984> Flush(true)
2246 2013-05-24 20:18:21 <MC1984> DBFlush(true) ended 90ms
2247 2013-05-24 20:18:24 <MC1984> is as far as it got
2248 2013-05-24 20:18:34 <gavinandresen> MC1984: running git HEAD ?
2249 2013-05-24 20:18:44 <phantomcircuit> gavinandresen, yeah i kind of figured but why is the getrawtransactions rpc call acquiring that lock
2250 2013-05-24 20:18:44 <MC1984> rc1
2251 2013-05-24 20:19:07 <phantomcircuit> oh safemode check
2252 2013-05-24 20:19:17 <MC1984> running for about 3 days that time
2253 2013-05-24 20:19:30 <gavinandresen> MC1984: if you called getwork or getblocktemplate, then you'll get a crash on exit. I pulled a fix for that earlier today
2254 2013-05-24 20:19:36 Skav has joined
2255 2013-05-24 20:19:40 <gmaxwell> Hm? I didn't think alerts could trigger safemode anymore. Why can't I seem to remember this stuff?
2256 2013-05-24 20:19:41 <MC1984> ah yes i did
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2259 2013-05-24 20:20:25 <MC1984> i ran GBT because others said it was slow, it was. been fixed i gather
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2265 2013-05-24 20:22:22 <phantomcircuit> gmaxwell, it doesn't look like they can but the GetWarnings function acquires the cs_mapAlerts lock anyways
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2275 2013-05-24 20:28:02 <jgarzik> gavinandresen, administrativiaÂ
please approve jgarzik@bitpay.com for the bitcoin-security list
2276 2013-05-24 20:28:23 <gavinandresen> sipa gmaxwell jgarzik wumpus : Ok, two crash-at-shutdown bugs squashed, and new .ico file pulledâ¦. I think that was it for a .rc3, yes ?
2277 2013-05-24 20:28:38 Subo has joined
2278 2013-05-24 20:28:39 <jgarzik> gavinandresen, ack
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2283 2013-05-24 20:30:31 allban2 is now known as allban
2284 2013-05-24 20:30:38 <gavinandresen> mmm.. wait⦠I see a translations pull....
2285 2013-05-24 20:30:50 <gmaxwell> gavinandresen: if you wait much longer we'll find more things that need fixing (like phantomcircuit's deadlocks). so ACK.
2286 2013-05-24 20:30:58 <phantomcircuit> lol
2287 2013-05-24 20:31:19 <phantomcircuit> im starting to think it's something to do with socket handling and not locks
2288 2013-05-24 20:31:46 <edcba> feature request : choose which coins are spent (some coins are more anonymous than others)
2289 2013-05-24 20:31:52 <phantomcircuit> this is using keep-alive which im guessing isn't exactly well tested yet
2290 2013-05-24 20:32:06 <jgarzik> phantomcircuit, probably not
2291 2013-05-24 20:32:19 <gavinandresen> phantomcircuit: try playing with -rpcthreads=1
2292 2013-05-24 20:32:29 <phantomcircuit> jgarzik, probably not the problem or probably not well tested
2293 2013-05-24 20:32:45 <gavinandresen> keep-alive is probably not well tested
2294 2013-05-24 20:33:19 <jgarzik> phantomcircuit, ^
2295 2013-05-24 20:33:24 <phantomcircuit> i should note that since adding fprintf statements to CMutexLock::Enter the problem seems to have disappeared
2296 2013-05-24 20:33:25 <jgarzik> speaking as the merger and partial coder
2297 2013-05-24 20:33:42 <jgarzik> phantomcircuit, sounds like kernel programming
2298 2013-05-24 20:33:49 <phantomcircuit> jgarzik, heh
2299 2013-05-24 20:33:52 <jgarzik> "my device driver fails to crash, when I add magic delays"
2300 2013-05-24 20:33:59 <edcba> removing bugs thanks to fprintf :(
2301 2013-05-24 20:34:02 Ssateneth has left ()
2302 2013-05-24 20:34:15 <jgarzik> You would be surprised how many device driver authors do that, _especially_ ones from the hardware vendor
2303 2013-05-24 20:34:26 resinate has joined
2304 2013-05-24 20:34:33 <phantomcircuit> jgarzik, sadly i probably wouldn't
2305 2013-05-24 20:34:40 <edcba> some may do it intentionnaly (i hope)
2306 2013-05-24 20:35:14 <edcba> jmp $+2 ftw ! :)
2307 2013-05-24 20:35:25 <phantomcircuit> there's a bug with monitor mode and 802.11 devices that causes aircrack to display channel -1 and fail
2308 2013-05-24 20:35:39 <phantomcircuit> it's a 2 line fix that nobody has committed for years
2309 2013-05-24 20:35:52 <edcba> interesting
2310 2013-05-24 20:36:17 <jgarzik> heh, I met the authors of airjack a while ago, back when the wifi hardware vendors were all panicked that airjack existed
2311 2013-05-24 20:37:05 <edcba> didn't know that
2312 2013-05-24 20:37:12 mab_ has joined
2313 2013-05-24 20:37:26 <gavinandresen> * [new tag] v0.8.2rc3 -> v0.8.2rc3
2314 2013-05-24 20:38:31 <phantomcircuit> ok scratch that it's not fixed the other side of my script is stalled
2315 2013-05-24 20:38:56 sacarlson has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
2316 2013-05-24 20:39:06 caedes has joined
2317 2013-05-24 20:39:12 <phantomcircuit> lol this just made it infinitely worse
2318 2013-05-24 20:39:40 <phantomcircuit> 1 rpc thread and keep-alive is not a good combo
2319 2013-05-24 20:39:52 <phantomcircuit> only 1 connection gets served
2320 2013-05-24 20:40:08 andytoshi has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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2323 2013-05-24 20:41:57 Skav has joined
2324 2013-05-24 20:42:01 <gavinandresen> I'm going to gitian-build windows a couple of times myself and make sure I get a self-match before asking others to build, too....
2325 2013-05-24 20:43:23 JZavala has joined
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2330 2013-05-24 20:47:02 <phantomcircuit> i guess i could do something ridiculous like run more than 1 bitcoind and distribute requests across them sequentially
2331 2013-05-24 20:47:44 <jgarzik> phantomcircuit, RPC is thread-per-connection, so certainly it becomes worse limited to just one thread
2332 2013-05-24 20:48:14 <jgarzik> phantomcircuit, it used to be a single-threaded loop, where request B stalled, waiting for request A to complete, however long that took
2333 2013-05-24 20:48:27 <jgarzik> phantomcircuit, and e.g. the remote side of A could stall B
2334 2013-05-24 20:48:33 Skav has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
2335 2013-05-24 20:48:36 <phantomcircuit> jgarzik, it seems like it's largely still that except now with the fun of locking issues
2336 2013-05-24 20:48:39 <phantomcircuit> lol
2337 2013-05-24 20:48:45 <phantomcircuit> im not sure how this is an improvement
2338 2013-05-24 20:49:29 <jgarzik> phantomcircuit, You may now unlock, whereas before you could not
2339 2013-05-24 20:49:37 sacrelege has joined
2340 2013-05-24 20:49:38 <jgarzik> phantomcircuit, the work is now unwinding locks
2341 2013-05-24 20:49:46 <phantomcircuit> ah
2342 2013-05-24 20:49:57 volkl has quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
2343 2013-05-24 20:51:21 <warren> gavinandresen: I'm doing v0.8.3rc3 gitian builds if you want to compare.
2344 2013-05-24 20:51:46 <warren> gavinandresen: I ported the gitian stack to Fedora. should theoretically be the same.
2345 2013-05-24 20:52:28 <gavinandresen> warren: thanks. My first win32 build gets: fe281e8045cdf2040ce9f83237186d5249c254ea6ffd893830b3be6f8213e8ee bitcoin-0.8.2-win32-setup.exe
2346 2013-05-24 20:53:49 <warren> you want to compare the linux builds too?
2347 2013-05-24 20:54:18 savetheinternet has joined
2348 2013-05-24 20:54:44 brwyatt_ is now known as Away!~brwyatt@brwyatt.net|brwyatt_
2349 2013-05-24 20:55:14 <warren> gavinandresen: have you folks figured out deterministic osx yet?
2350 2013-05-24 20:55:31 <gavinandresen> warren: nope
2351 2013-05-24 20:55:33 sacarlson has joined
2352 2013-05-24 20:58:47 <gmaxwell> warren: talk to tor, they apparently just managed to do a gitian build of the browser bundle for OSX.
2353 2013-05-24 20:59:31 <jgarzik> signed or unsigned?
2354 2013-05-24 21:00:22 <gmaxwell> I assume not system-signed yet, but that was far from the only issue.
2355 2013-05-24 21:01:44 <jgarzik> gmaxwell, I meant, I wonder if Tor's OSX binaries are digitally signed in the Official Manner(tm)
2356 2013-05-24 21:03:01 <gavinandresen> My builds match. Luke-Jr kinlo wumpus : can you gitian-build v0.8.2rc3 please ?
2357 2013-05-24 21:03:12 <wumpus> ok
2358 2013-05-24 21:04:04 <jgarzik> Not bad. New laptop builds HEAD in 1 minute, 14 seconds
2359 2013-05-24 21:04:08 <jgarzik> -sj4
2360 2013-05-24 21:04:15 <gmaxwell> jgarzik: I assume their current ones areâ they've _just_ started using gitian, and only got a determinstic OSX binary a few days ago. I would speculate thats without the official signing.
2361 2013-05-24 21:05:37 <wumpus> cross-compiling osx is already a wonder
2362 2013-05-24 21:06:16 free_ has joined
2363 2013-05-24 21:06:30 free_ is now known as WeLovecP
2364 2013-05-24 21:06:31 <warren> gavinandresen: fe281e8045cdf2040ce9f83237186d5249c254ea6ffd893830b3be6f8213e8ee build/out/bitcoin-0.8.2-win32-setup.exe
2365 2013-05-24 21:06:46 QuinnHarris has quit (Quit: Page closed)
2366 2013-05-24 21:06:53 <gavinandresen> warren: yay!
2367 2013-05-24 21:06:57 savetheinternet has quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
2368 2013-05-24 21:07:02 <warren> gavinandresen: want me to do linux?
2369 2013-05-24 21:07:10 <gavinandresen> warren: yes, please
2370 2013-05-24 21:07:18 <wumpus> warren: wow that's fast, I suppose your gitian is really slow or you started earlier :P
2371 2013-05-24 21:07:23 <warren> building
2372 2013-05-24 21:07:27 <wumpus> r/slow/fast
2373 2013-05-24 21:07:52 <gavinandresen> warren has a gitian ASIC
2374 2013-05-24 21:07:55 <wumpus> hehe
2375 2013-05-24 21:08:01 <warren> wumpus: gitian is slow because it is on my laptop.
2376 2013-05-24 21:08:23 <gmaxwell> warren: oh crap it worked? direct me to your patches! :P
2377 2013-05-24 21:08:23 <Luke-Jr> gavinandresen: on it
2378 2013-05-24 21:08:37 <warren> gmaxwell: for what?
2379 2013-05-24 21:08:48 <gmaxwell> warren: I was waiting to hear you'd gotten a matching signature before paying attention to your fedora port of gitian. :P
2380 2013-05-24 21:09:25 <warren> gmaxwell: fedora gitian is almost a 1-to-1 translation of the ubuntu packages. It's the ugliest .spec I've ever written.
2381 2013-05-24 21:09:33 <Luke-Jr> lol
2382 2013-05-24 21:09:48 <warren> gmaxwell: http://wtogami.blogspot.com/2013/05/gitian-for-fedora.html
2383 2013-05-24 21:11:04 <warren> gmaxwell: are you a fedora package reviewer? I need someone (not me) to approve the package reviews so it can go into the repo.
2384 2013-05-24 21:11:25 paracyst has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2385 2013-05-24 21:11:31 <warren> gmaxwell: perhaps jgarzik is...
2386 2013-05-24 21:11:55 jgarzik has quit (Quit: RUN AWAY)
2387 2013-05-24 21:11:56 taha has joined
2388 2013-05-24 21:13:54 btcls has joined
2389 2013-05-24 21:15:08 <btcls> i just read that another copy of bitcoin has their own psuedo domain tld = .bit ....wtf is that about ?
2390 2013-05-24 21:16:02 <btcls> why doesn't the original get that privilege first ?
2391 2013-05-24 21:16:05 <Luke-Jr> btcls: it was using bitcoin technology to decentralize the DNS
2392 2013-05-24 21:16:13 <Luke-Jr> Bitcoin is for currency, not domains
2393 2013-05-24 21:16:15 gst has joined
2394 2013-05-24 21:16:24 <btcls> Luke-Jr: i like you ...been following your posts
2395 2013-05-24 21:16:25 <Luke-Jr> putting domains in the BC blockchain would be abuse
2396 2013-05-24 21:16:52 <btcls> can i buy you a bitcoin beer brother ?
2397 2013-05-24 21:17:07 paracyst has joined
2398 2013-05-24 21:17:08 <btcls> otherwise i just go to your site and donate ...your choice
2399 2013-05-24 21:17:11 <Luke-Jr> I don't drink, but thanks for the thought :P
2400 2013-05-24 21:17:25 <btcls> kk ...doing the donation thing
2401 2013-05-24 21:17:39 <warren> e300286a23b567483cb68140d4dc52dd1fde11009e4f42fe06f3013a42da714e build/out/bin/32/bitcoind
2402 2013-05-24 21:17:39 <warren> 0eb8c7052bac265905cb45ebcd60a3b812dbeb29e9e6f82c0d8dea5439f0dc91 build/out/bin/32/bitcoin-qt
2403 2013-05-24 21:17:41 <btcls> i prefer though u know it came from me
2404 2013-05-24 21:17:54 <btcls> sorry warren
2405 2013-05-24 21:18:09 <btcls> only accept Luke's RECEIVING bitcoin address
2406 2013-05-24 21:18:39 <warren> btcls: these aren't addresses
2407 2013-05-24 21:18:49 <btcls> warren: ??
2408 2013-05-24 21:19:01 Subo has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2409 2013-05-24 21:19:24 <Luke-Jr> lol
2410 2013-05-24 21:19:26 iwilcox_ has joined
2411 2013-05-24 21:19:31 <btcls> warren: aaah ... ofc ....
2412 2013-05-24 21:19:43 <btcls> interesting ...iwilcox is back in the room
2413 2013-05-24 21:19:44 <Luke-Jr> btcls: 132VkyraDDnQiArgZvph8uwBJ7gBqcZUUo
2414 2013-05-24 21:19:52 <btcls> done starting wallet now
2415 2013-05-24 21:20:07 * gavinandresen ponders a brainwallet key that is a release binary sha256 checksum....
2416 2013-05-24 21:20:27 * Luke-Jr sets up a script to sweep that
2417 2013-05-24 21:20:35 <Luke-Jr> :P
2418 2013-05-24 21:20:40 <gavinandresen> I'll add eleven to it.
2419 2013-05-24 21:20:41 <btcls> okay guys the friggen block chain is like 8megs i heard ...fix that
2420 2013-05-24 21:20:45 * nsh twiddles thumbs
2421 2013-05-24 21:20:53 <Luke-Jr> lol 8megs
2422 2013-05-24 21:21:31 <warren> Is gitian supposed to kill its vm's after a build is complete?
2423 2013-05-24 21:21:36 <warren> They seem to live forever.
2424 2013-05-24 21:21:37 <gavinandresen> warren: my build matches yours, pusing my gitian.sigs
2425 2013-05-24 21:21:44 <Luke-Jr> it would take pure genius to compress 4 years of transactions onto a floppy
2426 2013-05-24 21:22:10 <jaakkos> gavinandresen: should bitcoitools statistics.py still read all blocks properly in 0.8?
2427 2013-05-24 21:22:19 iwilcox has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2428 2013-05-24 21:22:19 Subo1978 has joined
2429 2013-05-24 21:22:37 <gavinandresen> jaakkos: I dunno, I've been neglecting bitcointools for a long time now
2430 2013-05-24 21:22:52 <btcls> Luke: you get the beer i just sent you brother ?
2431 2013-05-24 21:23:00 gst has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
2432 2013-05-24 21:23:01 <wumpus> 0eb8c7052bac265905cb45ebcd60a3b812dbeb29e9e6f82c0d8dea5439f0dc91 bin/32/bitcoin-qt
2433 2013-05-24 21:23:01 <wumpus> e300286a23b567483cb68140d4dc52dd1fde11009e4f42fe06f3013a42da714e bin/32/bitcoind
2434 2013-05-24 21:23:01 <wumpus> cb6193bfc573ef6485e08c7eb7613eabbe55a48b7b35ae9726053dd536913b5a bin/64/bitcoin-qt
2435 2013-05-24 21:23:01 <wumpus> ba7ffc9e9b5391688bd4827c1c0e82aa6eea0cebdc3aeeb9fc91f1aaa17d4659 bin/64/bitcoind
2436 2013-05-24 21:23:15 <jaakkos> gavinandresen: yeah, i noticed there's been some time since the last commits :)
2437 2013-05-24 21:23:21 <Luke-Jr> btcls: sure
2438 2013-05-24 21:23:42 gjj has joined
2439 2013-05-24 21:23:44 <btcls> Luke-Jr: i paid the transaction fee ...you should have it like in seconds
2440 2013-05-24 21:23:44 <Luke-Jr> btcls: thanks
2441 2013-05-24 21:23:48 <btcls> kk
2442 2013-05-24 21:23:49 <wumpus> jaakkos: maybe look at pywallet, it's based on gavin's bitcointools but seems a little bit more actively maintained
2443 2013-05-24 21:23:53 gst has joined
2444 2013-05-24 21:24:20 <Luke-Jr> the blockchain format itself has never changed, so I can't imagine why it would break
2445 2013-05-24 21:24:21 <gavinandresen> jaakos : most of bitcointools was broken with the move from bdb to leveldb
2446 2013-05-24 21:24:23 Subo1978 has quit (Quit: Verlassend)
2447 2013-05-24 21:24:37 <wumpus> Luke-Jr: that's true, too
2448 2013-05-24 21:24:46 <btcls> Luke-Jr: I am going to write a review about you
2449 2013-05-24 21:24:52 <warren> ba7ffc9e9b5391688bd4827c1c0e82aa6eea0cebdc3aeeb9fc91f1aaa17d4659 build/out/bin/64/bitcoind
2450 2013-05-24 21:24:53 <warren> cb6193bfc573ef6485e08c7eb7613eabbe55a48b7b35ae9726053dd536913b5a build/out/bin/64/bitcoin-qt
2451 2013-05-24 21:24:53 <Luke-Jr> o.O
2452 2013-05-24 21:24:53 <btcls> its positive
2453 2013-05-24 21:25:06 <wumpus> warren: matches!
2454 2013-05-24 21:25:10 <btcls> yep
2455 2013-05-24 21:25:15 * Luke-Jr lights the matches
2456 2013-05-24 21:25:47 <jaakkos> wumpus, gavinandresen: i actually used bitcointools because it provided easy access to information about transactions, i used to draw some graphs such as http://www.niksula.cs.hut.fi/~jvsalo/unspent_april28.png with it
2457 2013-05-24 21:26:19 <jaakkos> wumpus: according to the first post it looks like pywallet doesn't provide information about the blockchain as a whole so easily
2458 2013-05-24 21:26:25 Subo1978 has joined
2459 2013-05-24 21:26:44 <wumpus> ok, I've only used it for wallets not the blockchain
2460 2013-05-24 21:26:48 savetheinternet has joined
2461 2013-05-24 21:26:48 <jaakkos> is the block chain even stored as a leveldb, or is it only used for utxo?
2462 2013-05-24 21:27:13 <Luke-Jr> blockchain is stored as a raw dump
2463 2013-05-24 21:27:17 Thepok has joined
2464 2013-05-24 21:27:23 <jaakkos> did the format change since 0.7?
2465 2013-05-24 21:27:34 gjj_ has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2466 2013-05-24 21:27:55 <btcls> that sounds like a test question
2467 2013-05-24 21:28:16 <Luke-Jr> jaakkos: the format has never change
2468 2013-05-24 21:28:25 <jaakkos> ok, i think bitcointools should work then
2469 2013-05-24 21:28:35 <jaakkos> -> need to recheck i was doing everything right...
2470 2013-05-24 21:28:38 <wumpus> jaakkos: it's used for the index and utxo
2471 2013-05-24 21:29:09 grau has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
2472 2013-05-24 21:30:07 ThomasV has joined
2473 2013-05-24 21:31:23 <wumpus> win32 matches too, pushed
2474 2013-05-24 21:31:23 <jaakkos> ok
2475 2013-05-24 21:31:54 <Luke-Jr> mine match, pushed
2476 2013-05-24 21:32:32 <Luke-Jr> (that's 3)
2477 2013-05-24 21:32:35 <btcls> we want our own top level domain ....why do they get bit ?
2478 2013-05-24 21:33:05 <Luke-Jr> btcls: .bit is complementary to bitcoin, not competing
2479 2013-05-24 21:33:20 <Luke-Jr> gmaxwell had some good ideas for reinventing it though
2480 2013-05-24 21:33:20 <jaakkos> does 0.8 destroy the old block index when it creates the leveldb?
2481 2013-05-24 21:33:27 <Luke-Jr> maybe midnightmagic and ne0futur will implement ;)
2482 2013-05-24 21:33:36 <Luke-Jr> jaakkos: no
2483 2013-05-24 21:33:47 <jaakkos> it leaves there and never touches it again?
2484 2013-05-24 21:33:51 <wumpus> nope, it keeps them to allow for downgrading
2485 2013-05-24 21:33:51 KingCoin has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2486 2013-05-24 21:33:53 <wumpus> yes
2487 2013-05-24 21:33:53 <Luke-Jr> jaakkos: correct
2488 2013-05-24 21:34:11 <Luke-Jr> jaakkos: there's a script included to clean it up
2489 2013-05-24 21:34:24 <wumpus> btcls: what's the problem with .bit?
2490 2013-05-24 21:34:37 <jaakkos> ok... that explains why bitcointools doesn't work like i expect.
2491 2013-05-24 21:34:43 kjj has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2492 2013-05-24 21:35:05 <gmaxwell> warren: where do I get vmbuilder from?
2493 2013-05-24 21:35:13 theorb has joined
2494 2013-05-24 21:35:19 theorbtwo has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
2495 2013-05-24 21:35:24 tholenst has quit (Quit: Page closed)
2496 2013-05-24 21:35:30 theorb is now known as theorbtwo
2497 2013-05-24 21:35:31 thelames1 has quit (Quit: leaving)
2498 2013-05-24 21:36:23 <warren> gmaxwell: eh? those two packages are all you need
2499 2013-05-24 21:37:48 <gmaxwell> warren: uh. make-base-vm gives up unable to find vmbuilder.
2500 2013-05-24 21:37:51 <warren> hmm, I should probably add deps to python-vm-builder so it pulls in the necessary parts of kvm
2501 2013-05-24 21:38:03 <gmaxwell> oh hm.
2502 2013-05-24 21:38:29 <gmaxwell> somehow failed to install it, ignore me.
2503 2013-05-24 21:38:41 <warren> gmaxwell: pastebin the error please
2504 2013-05-24 21:38:50 <gmaxwell> no, I just fat fingered it.
2505 2013-05-24 21:38:59 <warren> I'm fixing the deps
2506 2013-05-24 21:39:06 <gmaxwell> There is no error.
2507 2013-05-24 21:39:17 <phantomcircuit> okie well this script should have enough information to reliably (and quickly!) check for transfers to a large list of addresses
2508 2013-05-24 21:39:31 <btcls> how is .bit complimentary to the btc system?
2509 2013-05-24 21:39:37 <warren> btcls: it isn't
2510 2013-05-24 21:39:38 <gmaxwell> warren: looks like it works, now I just need enough freespace to run it. :)
2511 2013-05-24 21:39:43 JZavala has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2512 2013-05-24 21:39:54 <warren> gmaxwell: are you an approved packager at fedora?
2513 2013-05-24 21:39:57 <gmaxwell> No.
2514 2013-05-24 21:40:04 <warren> gmaxwell: want to be? =)
2515 2013-05-24 21:40:22 <gmaxwell> I HAZ TOOO MANY HATS.
2516 2013-05-24 21:40:26 <btcls> not that its a bad thing ...just why would you say that ? .bit should be for bitcoin should it not ?
2517 2013-05-24 21:40:40 <phantomcircuit> gmaxwell, you need a hat rack
2518 2013-05-24 21:41:00 <warren> gmaxwell: leaving Fedora would reduce your hat burden
2519 2013-05-24 21:42:08 <btcls> ...and when mtgox ...zeus ...got sued in the usa or whatever that dwalla crap is ... the price did NOT ...DID NOT ...go stupid ...
2520 2013-05-24 21:42:34 <warren> btcls: nothing you have said since joining is on topic for this channel.
2521 2013-05-24 21:42:35 <btcls> and now ....its going strong
2522 2013-05-24 21:43:06 <btcls> warren: no i had a question ...and now i have drifted ...sorry ... leaving
2523 2013-05-24 21:43:19 <btcls> take care all
2524 2013-05-24 21:43:26 <btcls> POOF
2525 2013-05-24 21:43:31 btcls has quit (Quit: Page closed)
2526 2013-05-24 21:44:38 <phantomcircuit> 21k blocks and all their transactions
2527 2013-05-24 21:44:45 <phantomcircuit> this should only take approximately forever
2528 2013-05-24 21:45:13 Subo1978 has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2529 2013-05-24 21:47:06 <sipa> cool, we ave an rc3 it seems
2530 2013-05-24 21:47:09 saulimus has quit (Quit: saulimus)
2531 2013-05-24 21:47:16 thelamest has joined
2532 2013-05-24 21:47:30 <warren> rc3 works great, just don't shut it down.
2533 2013-05-24 21:47:44 <sipa> heh?
2534 2013-05-24 21:47:51 <sipa> why would you do that? :
2535 2013-05-24 21:47:52 <sipa> :p
2536 2013-05-24 21:48:16 <warren> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/2690
2537 2013-05-24 21:48:39 <warren> The separate assertion failure seems to be Fedora 18 boost specific, can't reproduce it on gitian builds.
2538 2013-05-24 21:48:44 <gmaxwell> can't reproduce here. :(
2539 2013-05-24 21:49:15 <sipa> gmaxwell: if only that was a reason to close bugs
2540 2013-05-24 21:49:38 <sipa> http://xkcd.com/583/
2541 2013-05-24 21:50:03 Subo1978 has joined
2542 2013-05-24 21:53:36 Diapolo has joined
2543 2013-05-24 21:54:47 stretchwarren has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2544 2013-05-24 21:57:25 ThomasV has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
2545 2013-05-24 22:01:59 nsillik has joined
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2547 2013-05-24 22:05:39 porquilho has quit ()
2548 2013-05-24 22:06:00 <gavinandresen> rc3 up at: https://sourceforge.net/projects/bitcoin/files/Bitcoin/bitcoin-0.8.2/test/
2549 2013-05-24 22:06:18 <sipa> go go gadget deploy
2550 2013-05-24 22:09:03 <Diapolo> downloading and testing :D
2551 2013-05-24 22:09:51 whiterabbit has joined
2552 2013-05-24 22:10:45 <warren> Diapolo: try bitcoin-qt and exit many times in a row
2553 2013-05-24 22:12:04 <Diapolo> RC3?
2554 2013-05-24 22:12:10 <warren> yes
2555 2013-05-24 22:12:11 <Diapolo> just start and close?
2556 2013-05-24 22:12:14 <warren> yes
2557 2013-05-24 22:12:17 <Diapolo> let me see
2558 2013-05-24 22:12:19 <MC1984> windows build?
2559 2013-05-24 22:12:53 wrabbit has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2560 2013-05-24 22:12:53 whiterabbit is now known as wrabbit
2561 2013-05-24 22:12:55 <warren> I'd like someone else to reproduce the bitcoin-qt shutdown hang to prove I'm not crazy.
2562 2013-05-24 22:14:04 <MC1984> main thing you want tested is just startup and shutdown?
2563 2013-05-24 22:14:16 <Diapolo> 4th time in a row no problem here
2564 2013-05-24 22:14:17 ToryJujube has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
2565 2013-05-24 22:14:49 <Diapolo> Win7 x64 SP1 here
2566 2013-05-24 22:14:50 <MC1984> shall i issue some GBT too?
2567 2013-05-24 22:14:51 <warren> I also have a bitcoind assertion failure at "stop", but that's only Fedora builds, not gitian.
2568 2013-05-24 22:15:06 <warren> do whatever you can to break it
2569 2013-05-24 22:15:33 GordonG3kko has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2570 2013-05-24 22:15:35 <Diapolo> are you using rpc stop or exit via menu?
2571 2013-05-24 22:15:41 <Diapolo> 6 times no error
2572 2013-05-24 22:16:06 <warren> bitcoind rpc stop has an assertion failure for me with Fedora 18 builds. gitian builds seem OK.
2573 2013-05-24 22:16:32 <warren> bitcoin-qt hangs for me maybe 25% of the time during exit via menu with both fedora and gitian builds.
2574 2013-05-24 22:16:33 Subo1978 has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2575 2013-05-24 22:16:33 gruvfunk has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2576 2013-05-24 22:16:33 MobiusL has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2577 2013-05-24 22:17:08 <wumpus> can you attach a debugger and see where it hangs?
2578 2013-05-24 22:17:13 <Diapolo> it doesn't on Windows at least... what is the Github issue #? have you posted a debug.log there?
2579 2013-05-24 22:17:29 <warren> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/2690 here's the hang
2580 2013-05-24 22:17:35 Subo1978 has joined
2581 2013-05-24 22:17:49 MobiusL has joined
2582 2013-05-24 22:18:21 <warren> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/2688#issuecomment-18393462 assertion failure
2583 2013-05-24 22:18:44 <warren> I'll be back in a few hours
2584 2013-05-24 22:18:58 <Diapolo> Perhaps related to an ancient Boost version once more?
2585 2013-05-24 22:19:07 GordonG3kko has joined
2586 2013-05-24 22:19:16 <Diapolo> well no, you mention 1.50 which is not that old
2587 2013-05-24 22:19:35 <warren> what version of boost is in gitian?
2588 2013-05-24 22:20:48 <warren> gavinandresen: Does gitian have a standard way to shell into the VM?
2589 2013-05-24 22:20:56 ielo has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
2590 2013-05-24 22:21:03 <warren> bbl
2591 2013-05-24 22:21:09 <gavinandresen> warren: yes; add the libexec/ directory to your PATH then run on-target
2592 2013-05-24 22:22:55 <MC1984> takes me 10 goddamn minutes just to fire this thing up
2593 2013-05-24 22:23:29 <Diapolo> MC1984: get an SSD ^^
2594 2013-05-24 22:23:49 <MC1984> one day
2595 2013-05-24 22:23:52 <MC1984> one day...
2596 2013-05-24 22:24:54 iwilcox has joined
2597 2013-05-24 22:25:26 intx has joined
2598 2013-05-24 22:27:15 iwilcox_ has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2599 2013-05-24 22:27:36 <nsh> But a valve must finally have stuck in the Bardâs aging and corroding vitals, for as it waited alone in the darkening room through the evening, it could only whisper over and over again, "Somedayâsomedayâsomeday."
2600 2013-05-24 22:28:23 <gmaxwell> <3 asimov
2601 2013-05-24 22:28:29 quib has quit (Quit: Page closed)
2602 2013-05-24 22:28:34 <nsh> indeed :)
2603 2013-05-24 22:28:42 <gmaxwell> and I feel weird for reconizing such an obsecure line.
2604 2013-05-24 22:28:50 <gmaxwell> obscure*
2605 2013-05-24 22:29:17 <nsh> it was quite a striking ending for me
2606 2013-05-24 22:29:39 <nsh> maybe not striking
2607 2013-05-24 22:29:54 <nsh> affective
2608 2013-05-24 22:30:01 <nsh> [sic]
2609 2013-05-24 22:30:38 mrkent has joined
2610 2013-05-24 22:31:58 <MC1984> i finished consider phlebas last week
2611 2013-05-24 22:32:06 <MC1984> bit long at the end but pretty good
2612 2013-05-24 22:33:24 <MC1984> i can get the tablet to read it to me in a welsh accent monotone ^^
2613 2013-05-24 22:35:28 <nsh> as god intended
2614 2013-05-24 22:36:36 <MC1984> actually, even though its very good speech synthesis, its so hard to follow for more than a few pages that the effort puts me to sleep
2615 2013-05-24 22:36:46 <MC1984> which is perfect since i have trouble sleeping at the best of times
2616 2013-05-24 22:36:49 Michail1 is now known as Michail1_
2617 2013-05-24 22:37:13 <MC1984> so now my android very frequently reads me my betime story
2618 2013-05-24 22:37:52 <nsh> yeah, i've noticed there's a point on the whiskey bottle where my brain switches from io limited to cpu limited
2619 2013-05-24 22:38:23 <MC1984> lol
2620 2013-05-24 22:39:02 <MC1984> im still waiting for this node to start...
2621 2013-05-24 22:39:10 <MC1984> is there any way to skip the 288 block check
2622 2013-05-24 22:39:37 <donpdonp> listsinceblock [hash for nov 2012] is showing a mar 2013 transaction with the current synced blocked at jan 2013. i tried adding a second param of '1' to get transactions with one confirmation but im still seeing the mar 2013 transaction
2623 2013-05-24 22:39:58 <donpdonp> am i misunderstanding the listsinceblock call?
2624 2013-05-24 22:40:11 systemParanoid has quit (Quit: Leaving)
2625 2013-05-24 22:40:17 <donpdonp> s/synced blocked/synced block/
2626 2013-05-24 22:40:56 whiterabbit has joined
2627 2013-05-24 22:41:43 wrabbit has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2628 2013-05-24 22:41:48 whiterabbit is now known as wrabbit
2629 2013-05-24 22:46:59 <Diapolo> use -checkblocks=1 (0 will scan all AFAIK)
2630 2013-05-24 22:47:56 <gmaxwell> Diapolo: who are you responding to?
2631 2013-05-24 22:48:58 <gmaxwell> donpdonp: it's supposted to show you transactions .. since.. a particular block ... with at least a given number of confirms.
2632 2013-05-24 22:49:21 <Diapolo> MC1984
2633 2013-05-24 22:49:23 <gmaxwell> donpdonp: the idea is that you run it periodically with the identity of the tip at the last time you ran it.
2634 2013-05-24 22:49:28 <MC1984> the beta warning is gone in the GUI if that matters
2635 2013-05-24 22:49:29 <donpdonp> gmaxwell: riiight :) my thinking is the mar 2013 has no confirms as long as the synced block height is jan 2013
2636 2013-05-24 22:49:37 <gmaxwell> Diapolo: ah, thanks, totally missed that.
2637 2013-05-24 22:49:58 <donpdonp> Diapolo: in the json rpc call, the second param is set to "1"
2638 2013-05-24 22:50:11 <donpdonp> Diapolo: but mar 2013 tx is still being returned, thats my question
2639 2013-05-24 22:50:13 <gmaxwell> donpdonp: oh you've wiped out this history of your node or something ?
2640 2013-05-24 22:50:22 <MC1984> 10 4 Diablo-D3
2641 2013-05-24 22:50:29 <donpdonp> gmaxwell: yes, clean bitcoind install and its still catching up
2642 2013-05-24 22:50:33 <Diapolo> sorry, donpdonp i was talking to MC1984 above
2643 2013-05-24 22:50:43 <donpdonp> Diapolo: ohh ok
2644 2013-05-24 22:51:02 <MC1984> i mean Diapolo
2645 2013-05-24 22:51:21 <donpdonp> sounds like the mar 2013 tx should not show up when "target-confirmations" is 1. is https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Original_Bitcoin_client/API_calls_list still the best reference?
2646 2013-05-24 22:51:27 <BCB> what is the cmd to rebroadcast a transaction
2647 2013-05-24 22:51:43 <sipa> BCB: it happens automatically
2648 2013-05-24 22:51:46 <gmaxwell> donpdonp: you did not answer my question.
2649 2013-05-24 22:52:08 <BCB> sipa: can't find this transaction: 99c9fb5928e540843550c1dfbdc7012c84228b20e1d6141e623e7ca8b945fe3a
2650 2013-05-24 22:52:09 <donpdonp> gmaxwell: not sure what you mean then. it was not wiped out, it is a clean bitcoind install
2651 2013-05-24 22:52:20 <sipa> BCB: defime find
2652 2013-05-24 22:52:29 <sipa> *define
2653 2013-05-24 22:52:40 <BCB> gone from wallet and not in blockchain
2654 2013-05-24 22:52:47 <gmaxwell> donpdonp: if you have a currently sync node. And you listsinceblock <jan block> 1 you would expect it to show a mar transaction because a march transaction is since that block and has at least 1 confirm.
2655 2013-05-24 22:52:49 <Diapolo> MC1984: what is 10 4? ^^
2656 2013-05-24 22:52:57 <sipa> BCB: gone from wallet? wtf
2657 2013-05-24 22:53:06 <gmaxwell> Diapolo: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ten-codehttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ten-code
2658 2013-05-24 22:53:10 <gmaxwell> oops http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ten-code
2659 2013-05-24 22:53:13 <MC1984> sorry, i mean umm ack
2660 2013-05-24 22:53:14 <donpdonp> gmaxwell: right. i do not have a currently synced node.
2661 2013-05-24 22:53:16 <Diapolo> ^^ LOL
2662 2013-05-24 22:53:22 <Diapolo> got it, took a while
2663 2013-05-24 22:53:41 <gmaxwell> donpdonp: thats what I was asking. Okay. well that sounds like a bug. how many confirms does the returned transaction show?
2664 2013-05-24 22:53:46 <MC1984> the spinny catchup thing is failing to spin
2665 2013-05-24 22:54:13 <donpdonp> gmaxwell: ah okay. the json blob for the transaction says "confirmations":0, so I can filter them out that way
2666 2013-05-24 22:54:16 <sipa> BCB: how did it get removed from your wallet?
2667 2013-05-24 22:54:22 <BCB> checking
2668 2013-05-24 22:54:28 <donpdonp> gmaxwell: should i file a github bug?
2669 2013-05-24 22:54:35 <MC1984> oh it spins a little bit for each block, and these blocks are taking >1minute
2670 2013-05-24 22:54:58 <BCB> sipa: they were sent before the client was synced
2671 2013-05-24 22:55:16 <Diapolo> MC1984 it only spins, when it detects a block ^^
2672 2013-05-24 22:55:18 <gmaxwell> donpdonp: please do. Make
2673 2013-05-24 22:55:18 <sipa> BCB: so they never were in your wallet?
2674 2013-05-24 22:55:27 <BCB> hmmm
2675 2013-05-24 22:56:07 whiterabbit has joined
2676 2013-05-24 22:56:20 <MC1984> !blocks
2677 2013-05-24 22:56:20 <gribble> 237756
2678 2013-05-24 22:56:53 <BCB> sipa they were mined coins
2679 2013-05-24 22:57:27 <sipa> then you'll get them when the wallet syncs the relevant part of the chain
2680 2013-05-24 22:58:00 gst_ has joined
2681 2013-05-24 22:58:01 <sipa> oh, from which pool?
2682 2013-05-24 22:58:25 gst has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
2683 2013-05-24 22:58:26 <BCB> client has been synced for two days
2684 2013-05-24 22:58:43 Truncatem has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
2685 2013-05-24 22:59:04 <BCB> sipa don't remember
2686 2013-05-24 22:59:13 wrabbit has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2687 2013-05-24 22:59:13 whiterabbit is now known as wrabbit
2688 2013-05-24 22:59:16 <MC1984> ooo i issued a GBT in the GUI console and it crashed
2689 2013-05-24 23:00:02 <sipa> BCB: but were they direct mining outputs (like p2pool or eligius) or normal payouts?
2690 2013-05-24 23:00:12 <Diapolo> what means GBT?
2691 2013-05-24 23:00:21 <sipa> getblocktemplate
2692 2013-05-24 23:00:38 <MC1984> 2013-05-24 22:35:51 accepted connection 120.151.48.64:58566
2693 2013-05-24 23:00:38 <MC1984> thats the end of my log :/
2694 2013-05-24 23:01:29 <BCB> sipa: Some direct mining from eligius, some not.
2695 2013-05-24 23:01:32 Cusipzzz has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
2696 2013-05-24 23:02:13 <Diapolo> MC1984: you issued it while doing IBD?
2697 2013-05-24 23:02:28 <MC1984> no, synced
2698 2013-05-24 23:02:29 allban has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2699 2013-05-24 23:02:43 rawles has quit (Quit: Leaving)
2700 2013-05-24 23:02:52 allban has joined
2701 2013-05-24 23:03:22 one_zero has joined
2702 2013-05-24 23:03:45 <MC1984> 2013-05-24 22:39:07 Added time data, samples 3, offset -210142 (-3502 minutes)
2703 2013-05-24 23:03:47 nethershaw has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2704 2013-05-24 23:03:49 <MC1984> wut
2705 2013-05-24 23:03:59 nethershaw has joined
2706 2013-05-24 23:04:56 freefox has quit (Quit: freefox)
2707 2013-05-24 23:05:14 <MC1984> PROCESSMESSAGE: INVALID MESSAGESTART
2708 2013-05-24 23:05:29 <MC1984> just posting things i havent seen before....
2709 2013-05-24 23:06:16 Grouver has quit (Quit: HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- It'll be on slashdot one day...)
2710 2013-05-24 23:06:52 <MC1984> crashed on GBT issue again
2711 2013-05-24 23:07:07 nethershaw has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2712 2013-05-24 23:07:11 <MC1984> 2013-05-24 22:43:12 ERROR: CAddrman::Write() : Rename-into-place failed
2713 2013-05-24 23:07:11 <MC1984> 2013-05-24 22:43:12 Flushed 17354 addresses to peers.dat 10996ms
2714 2013-05-24 23:07:27 <MC1984> doesnt seem related
2715 2013-05-24 23:07:52 toffoo has joined
2716 2013-05-24 23:09:40 Sm3lly has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2717 2013-05-24 23:10:09 <MC1984> GBT does not crash and is fast when issued to bitcoind
2718 2013-05-24 23:10:14 <MC1984> so it seems like GUI problem?
2719 2013-05-24 23:10:20 gruez has joined
2720 2013-05-24 23:10:55 nethershaw has joined
2721 2013-05-24 23:10:56 <MC1984> bitcoind does not crash on stop after GBT
2722 2013-05-24 23:11:46 <gruez> Just wondering, how come 0.8.2rc2 and 0.8.2rc3 do not have builds on the forum?
2723 2013-05-24 23:12:13 <MC1984> rc3 is about an hour old
2724 2013-05-24 23:12:30 <MC1984> rc2, i dunno. had some obvious problems so no point?
2725 2013-05-24 23:13:45 <gruez> obvious problems as in?
2726 2013-05-24 23:14:01 <sipa> there were some bugs found immediately after rc2 was tagged
2727 2013-05-24 23:14:04 <sipa> so it wasn't announced
2728 2013-05-24 23:14:08 <sipa> rc3 will be soon, i guess
2729 2013-05-24 23:16:01 <Diapolo> MC1984: GBT doesn't crash here what OS is it?
2730 2013-05-24 23:16:12 <sipa> hmm
2731 2013-05-24 23:16:17 <MC1984> xp32
2732 2013-05-24 23:16:23 jercos has quit (Quit: Lost terminal)
2733 2013-05-24 23:16:51 <sipa> gavinandresen: didn't you have some problem before where you got invalid transaction in your mempool, likely put there by the wallet?
2734 2013-05-24 23:17:46 <MC1984> crash #3 for GBT
2735 2013-05-24 23:18:42 <Diapolo> What is displayed?
2736 2013-05-24 23:19:06 <sipa> MC1984: can you run from a command line, and see what it says?
2737 2013-05-24 23:19:23 <sipa> i have a suspicion it's the same assert fail that gavin noticed before
2738 2013-05-24 23:19:51 <MC1984> issuing GBT to bitcoind via command box is successful
2739 2013-05-24 23:20:18 Cory has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2740 2013-05-24 23:20:26 <MC1984> or do you mean something else
2741 2013-05-24 23:20:43 <Diapolo> MC1984: I can spam the debug-console with getblocktemplate and it wont crash
2742 2013-05-24 23:20:56 <sipa> MC1984: what exactly are you doing to make it crash?
2743 2013-05-24 23:21:11 <MC1984> in bitcoin qt GUI
2744 2013-05-24 23:21:26 <MC1984> i open RPC console
2745 2013-05-24 23:21:36 <MC1984> type getblocktemplate, press enter
2746 2013-05-24 23:21:39 <MC1984> >crash
2747 2013-05-24 23:21:39 <sipa> ok
2748 2013-05-24 23:21:47 <sipa> can you start bitcoin-qt from a command prompt?
2749 2013-05-24 23:23:06 <Diapolo> MC1984: what command-line or bitcoin.conf parameters are active?
2750 2013-05-24 23:23:22 volkl has joined
2751 2013-05-24 23:23:27 <MC1984> ok i did that, but i dont know how its different from clicking the shortcut
2752 2013-05-24 23:23:33 <MC1984> bitcoin-qt.exe -datadir="E:\blockchain" -checkblocks=1
2753 2013-05-24 23:23:57 <sipa> the fact that you see the console
2754 2013-05-24 23:24:03 <sipa> in which assertion failures are print
2755 2013-05-24 23:24:07 <MC1984> logtimestamps=1
2756 2013-05-24 23:24:07 <MC1984> benchmark=1
2757 2013-05-24 23:24:07 <MC1984> dbcache=256
2758 2013-05-24 23:24:07 <MC1984> #debug=1
2759 2013-05-24 23:24:07 <MC1984> nocheckpoints=1
2760 2013-05-24 23:24:07 <MC1984> rpcuser=bitcoinrpc
2761 2013-05-24 23:24:09 <MC1984> rpcpassword=
2762 2013-05-24 23:24:11 <MC1984> is my conf
2763 2013-05-24 23:24:31 volkl has quit (Client Quit)
2764 2013-05-24 23:24:33 <sipa> ok, now trigger the error
2765 2013-05-24 23:24:40 <sipa> while you can see the console
2766 2013-05-24 23:24:56 <sipa> (not the RPC console inside bitcoin-qt, the console from which you started bitcoin-qt i mean)
2767 2013-05-24 23:25:41 <MC1984> oh, ill have to start again, one moment
2768 2013-05-24 23:26:32 savetheinternet has quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.)
2769 2013-05-24 23:26:34 <MC1984> starting QT from the cmd line doesnt attach the cmd box to it mind, it just goes back to directory prompt
2770 2013-05-24 23:26:48 <sipa> oh really?
2771 2013-05-24 23:26:52 <sipa> try with -nodaemon
2772 2013-05-24 23:28:05 <MC1984> bitcoin-qt.exe -datadir="E:\blockchain" -checkblocks=1 -nodaemon this is what im using now, from a normal windows cmd line
2773 2013-05-24 23:28:54 <sipa> ok
2774 2013-05-24 23:29:27 <MC1984> didnt seem to attatch
2775 2013-05-24 23:29:50 <sipa> well, but do you at least get the error when crashing?
2776 2013-05-24 23:30:14 <MC1984> how do i issue GBT to QT from a cmd line when its not attached?
2777 2013-05-24 23:31:03 <MC1984> it just tried to start another instance lol
2778 2013-05-24 23:31:03 <sipa> ?
2779 2013-05-24 23:31:05 <Diapolo> sipa: assertions on Windows should be displayed in a error dialog box not in cmd
2780 2013-05-24 23:31:15 <sipa> Diapolo: oh!
2781 2013-05-24 23:31:17 ShapeShifter499 has quit (Excess Flood)
2782 2013-05-24 23:31:29 <MC1984> sipa!
2783 2013-05-24 23:31:30 <Diapolo> at least the ones I saw did this, which is "normal" behaviour
2784 2013-05-24 23:31:33 kjj has joined
2785 2013-05-24 23:31:42 <sipa> MC1984: either use -server and send it using bitcoind via RPC
2786 2013-05-24 23:31:47 <sipa> MC1984: or use the RPC debug console
2787 2013-05-24 23:32:16 <Diapolo> MC1984: what is displayed when it crashes we need that info
2788 2013-05-24 23:32:23 <MC1984> using the RPC console, the error box is generic windows "bitcoin qt has encountered a problem and needs to close"
2789 2013-05-24 23:33:01 <Diapolo> so no assertion
2790 2013-05-24 23:33:22 <Diapolo> when you click on details or expand, is ther any more information lile which module crashed
2791 2013-05-24 23:33:49 <MC1984> damn i completely missed that, so used am i to hitting ok
2792 2013-05-24 23:33:55 <MC1984> one moment
2793 2013-05-24 23:35:12 <MC1984> there is a large crash dump here
2794 2013-05-24 23:35:32 ShapeShifter499 has joined
2795 2013-05-24 23:35:41 beethoven8201 has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
2796 2013-05-24 23:35:45 <MC1984> with details of a lot of my DLLs and a memdump
2797 2013-05-24 23:36:47 <sipa> can you patse it somewhere?
2798 2013-05-24 23:36:53 <sipa> i doubt it's useful, but who knows
2799 2013-05-24 23:37:20 <MC1984> modname: bitcoin-qt.exe
2800 2013-05-24 23:37:41 <sipa> don't paste here please
2801 2013-05-24 23:37:43 <MC1984> Diapolo will this dump contain any sensitie info?
2802 2013-05-24 23:37:47 <sipa> no
2803 2013-05-24 23:38:46 <Diapolo> it should not contain personal data, but perhaps loaded dlls and stuff
2804 2013-05-24 23:40:46 <MC1984> it wont actually let me copy the text :/
2805 2013-05-24 23:40:55 <sipa> wut?
2806 2013-05-24 23:41:02 <MC1984> >windows
2807 2013-05-24 23:41:16 <sipa> screenshot?
2808 2013-05-24 23:42:03 <MC1984> the box is way too small to display the text, the slider is very long
2809 2013-05-24 23:42:12 <MC1984> scroller, whatever
2810 2013-05-24 23:42:44 <MC1984> this is annoying
2811 2013-05-24 23:42:45 ralphtheninja has quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
2812 2013-05-24 23:44:31 sacrelege has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
2813 2013-05-24 23:45:05 <MC1984> looks like theres a stacktrace (?) here too
2814 2013-05-24 23:45:16 <sipa> yes, need that!!
2815 2013-05-24 23:45:31 <MC1984> it says stack: then lots of hex
2816 2013-05-24 23:45:36 <MC1984> thats a stacktrace yes
2817 2013-05-24 23:45:44 <sipa> ehhh
2818 2013-05-24 23:45:50 <sipa> just some something
2819 2013-05-24 23:45:53 <sipa> maybe it's worthless
2820 2013-05-24 23:46:21 <lianj> you guys noticed that the rpc started to sometimes return -22 code for txs that are already confirmed instead of saying its already in a block?
2821 2013-05-24 23:46:26 lolcookie__ has joined
2822 2013-05-24 23:46:37 <lianj> using sendrawtransaction
2823 2013-05-24 23:46:45 <sipa> lianj: yes, known problem
2824 2013-05-24 23:46:50 <sipa> low priority
2825 2013-05-24 23:47:12 <MC1984> well i dont know what to say, cant screenshot it because its peobably about 50 feet long screenwise
2826 2013-05-24 23:47:12 <lianj> sipa: thanks. but no fix yet?
2827 2013-05-24 23:47:47 taha has quit (Quit: iyi geceler)
2828 2013-05-24 23:47:53 <MC1984> if someone can work out a way to pull microsoft error reports, i can reproduce it at will apparently
2829 2013-05-24 23:47:55 Thepok has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
2830 2013-05-24 23:48:01 <sipa> MC1984: just screenshot something
2831 2013-05-24 23:48:52 <MC1984> its only showing me 15 lines of this trace at a time, in a small box that refuses to be resized
2832 2013-05-24 23:50:20 BlackPrapor has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2833 2013-05-24 23:50:55 sacarlson has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
2834 2013-05-24 23:53:51 <MC1984> actually i think this is a trace of every running process on my machine
2835 2013-05-24 23:54:05 beethoven8201 has joined
2836 2013-05-24 23:54:29 beethoven8201 is now known as Guest45851
2837 2013-05-24 23:54:54 aceat64 has quit (Quit: brb)
2838 2013-05-24 23:55:21 <MC1984> maybe i shouldnt send this into the internets
2839 2013-05-24 23:55:48 Guest45851 is now known as beethoven8201
2840 2013-05-24 23:55:54 beethoven8201 has quit (Changing host)
2841 2013-05-24 23:55:54 beethoven8201 has joined
2842 2013-05-24 23:57:43 <Diapolo> MC1984: is there anything displayed before the crash - is GBT starting to print or does it directly crash?
2843 2013-05-24 23:58:45 <MC1984> the console echoes back getblocktemplate in green font to acknowledge the command
2844 2013-05-24 23:58:45 caedes has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2845 2013-05-24 23:58:51 <MC1984> then crash
2846 2013-05-24 23:59:14 <sipa> MC1984: can you retry with an empty wallet?
2847 2013-05-24 23:59:27 <MC1984> okie dokie
2848 2013-05-24 23:59:53 sacrelege has joined