1 2013-10-27 00:00:17 McKay has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
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3 2013-10-27 00:01:05 <gmaxwell> MrDaneelOlivaw: By first one do you mean the truncated one?
4 2013-10-27 00:01:26 <MrDaneelOlivaw> no that was just truncated, i pasted two links
5 2013-10-27 00:01:33 <MrDaneelOlivaw> after that
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7 2013-10-27 00:02:05 <MrDaneelOlivaw> https://dpaste.de/QC8y this is without boost dev
8 2013-10-27 00:02:14 <skinnkavaj> Any good designers here? Offering competitive payment based on experience.'
9 2013-10-27 00:02:23 <MrDaneelOlivaw> this is the full https://dpaste.de/Yqdu with boost dev installed
10 2013-10-27 00:02:51 <Apocalyptic> skinnkavaj, wrong channel
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20 2013-10-27 00:08:58 <gmaxwell> MrDaneelOlivaw: It will build with --disable-tests I expect.
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22 2013-10-27 00:10:01 <gmaxwell> MrDaneelOlivaw: can you try that?
23 2013-10-27 00:10:17 <Luke-Jr> skinnkavaj: designers and developers are usually two not-very-intersecting groups
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26 2013-10-27 00:13:06 <gmaxwell> MrDaneelOlivaw: I'm taking a WAG that it's actually the next test failing and some dangling variable is causing it to print the wrong cause.
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28 2013-10-27 00:15:30 <MrDaneelOlivaw> gmaxwell: trying
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30 2013-10-27 00:16:02 <MrDaneelOlivaw> I may have copied the libs dependencies from the package in the repo which probably was built that way
31 2013-10-27 00:17:20 <gmaxwell> MrDaneelOlivaw: you should have, as the fine manual states, done an apt-get install libboost-all-dev
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35 2013-10-27 00:27:08 <MrDaneelOlivaw> gmaxwell: somehow libboost-all-dev didn't fix it but installing the -dev as well as .0 package of test fixed it (likewise --disable-test worked) thanks a lot
36 2013-10-27 00:28:48 <MrDaneelOlivaw> gmaxwell: I'm interested in using the regtest functionality, I understand testnet in a box is not used much anymore
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40 2013-10-27 00:36:14 <MrDaneelOlivaw> not sure if it's funny, need to finish it, but it is something (no woman, no drive) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aZMbTFNp4wI
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44 2013-10-27 00:40:46 <MrDaneelOlivaw> gmaxwell: actually WARNING: unrecognized options: --disable-test, but test package fixed it
45 2013-10-27 00:41:18 <MrDaneelOlivaw> ouch, typo, sorry.
46 2013-10-27 00:42:48 <warren> are there any existing tools to read peers.dat?
47 2013-10-27 00:44:02 sipa has quit (Changing host)
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49 2013-10-27 00:44:07 <sipa> gmaxwell: http://bitcoin.stackexchange.com/a/14092/208
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51 2013-10-27 00:44:13 <sipa> warren: not that i know
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54 2013-10-27 00:45:10 <sipa> hmm, -debug is painful:
55 2013-10-27 00:45:10 super3 has quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
56 2013-10-27 00:45:12 <sipa> $ ls -lh ~/.bitcoin/debug.log
57 2013-10-27 00:45:12 <sipa> -rw------- 1 pw pw 20G Oct 27 02:42 /home/pw/.bitcoin/debug.log
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59 2013-10-27 00:47:34 <warren> :q
60 2013-10-27 00:47:37 <warren> oops
61 2013-10-27 00:48:54 <gmaxwell> sipa: yea... that reddit thread is full of people linking to tools that report "entropy" of hundreds of bits for stupid phrases that have been cracked as brainwallets.
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63 2013-10-27 00:49:34 <sipa> warren: i should write a python tool for it
64 2013-10-27 00:49:54 <sipa> warren: if i have time somewhere the next 5 years :)
65 2013-10-27 00:52:41 <gmaxwell> MrDaneelOlivaw: ".0 package of test" which package is this?
66 2013-10-27 00:54:30 <MrDaneelOlivaw> gmaxwell: libboost-{system,filesystem,chrono,program-options,thread,test}1.54{-dev,.0}
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69 2013-10-27 00:55:05 <sipa> the dev packages don't depend on their corresponding non-dev packages?
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71 2013-10-27 00:55:17 <MrDaneelOlivaw> sipa: yeah but a different version
72 2013-10-27 00:55:23 <sipa> eww
73 2013-10-27 00:55:27 <MrDaneelOlivaw> 1.53
74 2013-10-27 00:55:39 <sipa> that's asking for trouble
75 2013-10-27 00:55:57 <MrDaneelOlivaw> no sorry i thought you were talking about the generic -dev version
76 2013-10-27 00:56:08 <sipa> no, what i mean
77 2013-10-27 00:56:21 <sipa> i infer that you already had some -dev package installed
78 2013-10-27 00:56:27 <MrDaneelOlivaw> i guess it does, maybe i've been too explicit
79 2013-10-27 00:56:40 <sipa> but only when you also installed the corresponding .o package, the problem was fixed?
80 2013-10-27 00:56:44 <sipa> .0
81 2013-10-27 00:56:46 <MrDaneelOlivaw> no
82 2013-10-27 00:56:49 <MrDaneelOlivaw> i needed test
83 2013-10-27 00:57:12 <MrDaneelOlivaw> just saying that the libboost-all-dev didn't do it for me
84 2013-10-27 00:57:22 <sipa> you didn't have libboost-test-dev?
85 2013-10-27 00:57:28 <MrDaneelOlivaw> i did
86 2013-10-27 00:57:31 <sipa> even with libboost-all-dev?
87 2013-10-27 00:57:32 <MrDaneelOlivaw> and it didn't work
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89 2013-10-27 00:57:52 <sipa> oh, you didn't have libboost-test?
90 2013-10-27 00:59:15 <MrDaneelOlivaw> when i first started no, i just checked what bitcoin dependencies where on the bitcoin ubuntu package and installed the dev parts assuming dependencies had not changed too much, which is what worked for me on 0.8.5
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92 2013-10-27 00:59:31 <sipa> ah, i see
93 2013-10-27 00:59:40 <sipa> but libboost-dev-all should have fixed it then?
94 2013-10-27 00:59:48 <sipa> or does -all not depend on -test?
95 2013-10-27 01:00:42 <MrDaneelOlivaw> I don't know, when i tried the above and it worked i was happier as it was an even later version anyway
96 2013-10-27 01:01:23 <gmaxwell> Matters to us because our instructions say to install -all.
97 2013-10-27 01:01:34 <gmaxwell> If that doesn't work we will need to fix them.
98 2013-10-27 01:01:35 <MrDaneelOlivaw> I can try again
99 2013-10-27 01:01:39 <MrDaneelOlivaw> one sec
100 2013-10-27 01:01:46 <MrDaneelOlivaw> just a small change in my docker file
101 2013-10-27 01:01:46 <gmaxwell> Might also be good to figure out how to make the error more informative.
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103 2013-10-27 01:02:10 <MrDaneelOlivaw> disabled test or not =
104 2013-10-27 01:02:13 <gmaxwell> I was going on "well, the reported error cannot be true, so maybe its the _next_ thing that failed."
105 2013-10-27 01:02:24 <gmaxwell> MrDaneelOlivaw: don't disable.
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117 2013-10-27 01:10:42 <MrDaneelOlivaw> gmaxwell: yes it fails, let me upload the file for you
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127 2013-10-27 01:19:43 <MrDaneelOlivaw> gmaxwell: http://dpaste.de/Qjhh
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134 2013-10-27 01:21:49 <MrDaneelOlivaw> libboost-all-dev is already the newest version.
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146 2013-10-27 01:26:02 <gmaxwell> MrDaneelOlivaw: what message did that fail with on stdout?
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148 2013-10-27 01:26:22 <midnightmagic> I have a /window goto 16
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152 2013-10-27 01:28:18 <MrDaneelOlivaw> gmaxwell: configure: error: Could not find a version of the library!
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154 2013-10-27 01:28:45 <gmaxwell> can you post the config that sets up your vm? (e.g. with the apt-get lines?)
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159 2013-10-27 01:34:05 <MrDaneelOlivaw> gmaxwell: https://dpaste.de/7KyN
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168 2013-10-27 01:49:54 <MrDaneelOlivaw> is there a lot of people thinking bitcoin was created by a group of conspirator with tremendous insight as opposed to one guy called Satoshi ? I was reading an article from schneider and I wonder if the weakness is technical or simply by design (mining)
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172 2013-10-27 01:56:26 <Luke-Jr> MrDaneelOlivaw: what weakness?
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180 2013-10-27 02:02:30 <MrDaneelOlivaw> Luke-Jr: eventually mining could be come even more centralized but we wouldn't even be able to know for sure and it is quite unaccountable
181 2013-10-27 02:02:55 <Luke-Jr> MrDaneelOlivaw: there isn't really a better alternative
182 2013-10-27 02:03:03 <Luke-Jr> thankfully, things aren't playing out that way
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184 2013-10-27 02:05:08 <MrDaneelOlivaw> Luke-Jr: alternatively there could be some weakness in crypto which we are not aware off, just like DES and differential cryptoanalysis
185 2013-10-27 02:05:22 <MrDaneelOlivaw> Luke-Jr: I agree we don't have a better alternative
186 2013-10-27 02:06:05 neep3r has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
187 2013-10-27 02:06:31 <MrDaneelOlivaw> I've been following your work for a while Luke-Jr, yours and a few others. I feel i should congratulate with you
188 2013-10-27 02:07:10 <Luke-Jr> thanks
189 2013-10-27 02:08:10 <MrDaneelOlivaw> Luke-Jr: what are you working on these days if I may ask ?
190 2013-10-27 02:08:27 <Luke-Jr> MrDaneelOlivaw: BFGMiner's been keeping me busy lately; lots of new devices coming out still
191 2013-10-27 02:08:39 <Luke-Jr> and plenty of room to improve the basic program
192 2013-10-27 02:08:51 super3 has joined
193 2013-10-27 02:10:28 <MrDaneelOlivaw> I've stopped mining a month back, sold my devices and moved on. It's not my thing, moves too fast. I feel it will be less and less accessible and margins smaller and smaller (which is just natural)
194 2013-10-27 02:11:04 <MrDaneelOlivaw> more interested in the recent protocol changes like p2sh and this payment protocol, although i still have to study the CA side of things
195 2013-10-27 02:11:35 <MrDaneelOlivaw> Is there a roadmap as far as you know ?
196 2013-10-27 02:11:47 <Luke-Jr> in various peoples' heads âº
197 2013-10-27 02:12:04 <MrDaneelOlivaw> isn't it always :P
198 2013-10-27 02:12:27 <MrDaneelOlivaw> do you have a view on btcd ? tried it ?
199 2013-10-27 02:12:48 dlidstrom has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
200 2013-10-27 02:12:49 <MrDaneelOlivaw> and thoughts on electrum
201 2013-10-27 02:12:57 <MrDaneelOlivaw> I'm talking about the design-performance-etc
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207 2013-10-27 02:14:55 <Luke-Jr> MrDaneelOlivaw: I haven't tried btcd yet. Electrum is still (last I checked) old Python2, but I hear it's a SPV client now.
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209 2013-10-27 02:15:32 <Ascendion> grrrr
210 2013-10-27 02:16:15 <MrDaneelOlivaw> Luke-Jr: yeah i read that too but what do you mean by 'old' python2, python2 is still used far more than 3.x
211 2013-10-27 02:16:27 <Luke-Jr> MrDaneelOlivaw: it's still old/outdated ;)
212 2013-10-27 02:16:30 <MrDaneelOlivaw> Ascendion: writing an electrum competitr ?
213 2013-10-27 02:16:41 <Luke-Jr> Python 3.x has been around a while now, and I use it almost exclusively.
214 2013-10-27 02:16:45 <Luke-Jr> (well, for Python)
215 2013-10-27 02:16:58 <MrDaneelOlivaw> Luke-Jr: I need to check if everything is available
216 2013-10-27 02:17:12 <Luke-Jr> ?
217 2013-10-27 02:17:21 <MrDaneelOlivaw> for 3.x of what i use in python 2.x
218 2013-10-27 02:17:29 <MrDaneelOlivaw> anyhow, it'd be interesting to see pypy move to 3.x
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220 2013-10-27 02:18:07 <Ascendion> R.Daneel -- dunno since I dunno what electrum is :)
221 2013-10-27 02:18:28 <Luke-Jr> heh, I didn't even notice his nick XD
222 2013-10-27 02:18:34 dgolds has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
223 2013-10-27 02:18:40 <Ascendion> LOL :)
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225 2013-10-27 02:19:05 <MrDaneelOlivaw> I can never hide
226 2013-10-27 02:20:18 <MrDaneelOlivaw> I tried reporter Chetter Hummin but that didn't work out, so I tried MrDaneelOlivaw the russian programmer but ..
227 2013-10-27 02:21:02 <Ascendion> what I'm working on right now is scraping bitcoind via json-rpc to import the blockchain and all transactions into an sql database, then keep that database in sync in realtime as long as the "import" app is running
228 2013-10-27 02:21:39 <Ascendion> then I plan to do the same for litecoin and a few others
229 2013-10-27 02:22:56 <Ascendion> Daneel -- I prolly would have caught almost any name from that series considering I reread the entire series just a few months back :)
230 2013-10-27 02:25:10 <MrDaneelOlivaw> Ascendion: I've done so in a couple of languages at least 3 times, a great story full of details
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232 2013-10-27 02:26:02 <MrDaneelOlivaw> Ascendion: have you implemented pruning ?
233 2013-10-27 02:26:14 <Ascendion> ok damn it -- why all of a sudden can I not get the raw transaction data for the genesis transaction
234 2013-10-27 02:26:34 <Ascendion> pruning as in detecting forks/reorgs ?? yes
235 2013-10-27 02:27:10 <Ascendion> I only keep what my local bitcoind considers to be the current best chain in the database -- I dont store orphans
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239 2013-10-27 02:27:54 <MrDaneelOlivaw> Ascendion: no, pruning as in not keeping addresses without spendable outputs
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241 2013-10-27 02:28:39 <Ascendion> I dont particularly store addresses separate from the transaction outputs where they are referenced so no -- I dont prune them
242 2013-10-27 02:30:04 <MrDaneelOlivaw> Ascendion: eta to sync?
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244 2013-10-27 02:30:43 <Ascendion> 10k years if I dont figure out why I cannot fetch the transaction in the genesis block like I was able to do about an hour ago
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246 2013-10-27 02:40:40 <Ascendion> it keeps coming back with an internal server error response code
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248 2013-10-27 02:47:46 <Ascendion> hmmm it was able to get the transaction from the 2nd block
249 2013-10-27 02:49:58 <Ascendion> "no information available about transaction" -- HUH ??? this is the transaction in the genesis block -- I've got the right transaction id, validated it on blockchain.info -- why can I not fetch it from bitcoind ??????????
250 2013-10-27 02:53:37 <gmaxwell> Ascendion: didn't I strongly advise you before to not test with the genesis block?
251 2013-10-27 02:53:47 <gmaxwell> Ascendion: is there a reason you didn't take my advice? :P
252 2013-10-27 02:54:38 <gmaxwell> Maybe I didn't. Don't test with the genesis block, it's special.
253 2013-10-27 02:54:54 <gmaxwell> The coinbase transaction in the genesis block doesn't exist as far as the system is concerned.
254 2013-10-27 02:55:01 <gmaxwell> Though coins are forever unspendable.
255 2013-10-27 02:55:53 <Luke-Jr> Those*
256 2013-10-27 02:57:39 <Ascendion> then why return a transaction id at all in the block, why does blockchain.info show data for that transaction ?? I HATE SPECIAL CASES !!!
257 2013-10-27 02:59:52 <gmaxwell> Ascendion: because there is a transaction in the block, but that transaction was never inserted into the database by the bitcoin system, because the code that hardcodes the genesis block didn't do so.
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261 2013-10-27 03:01:50 <Ascendion> personally I call a block with a transaction listed that cannot be accessed a BUG :) no matter if its the genesis block or not :) just breaks the rules that every other block follows
262 2013-10-27 03:04:04 <gmaxwell> Ascendion: The transaction was never introduced to the network. It's a hard forking requirement of the blockchain protocol now.
263 2013-10-27 03:04:39 <gmaxwell> It could be returned by the rpc anyways, e.g. by internally special casing it, but that would be inaccurate.. e.g. it would make you think that coin could be spent when it couldn't.
264 2013-10-27 03:04:42 <Ascendion> doesnt have to be on the network... just add the transaction to the db hardcode :)
265 2013-10-27 03:05:49 <Ascendion> thats no different than any other "lost my wallet/keys/coins" ... probably plenty of unspendable outputs in the database for just that reason
266 2013-10-27 03:06:59 <gmaxwell> Ascendion: but then you'll fetch it and add up the coins that could be possibly spent and get a wrong answer.
267 2013-10-27 03:07:08 <Ascendion> doesnt make a difference to my system -- someone has to provide the address and a signed message by that address before I will credit their "wallet" with those coins
268 2013-10-27 03:07:20 <gmaxwell> unless, again, you special case it. And if you're going to special case, you might as well just pretend the genesis block doesn't exist.
269 2013-10-27 03:07:40 <gmaxwell> uh. ... I probably don't want to know what you're doing.
270 2013-10-27 03:08:04 <Ascendion> I fetch the genesis block for no other reason than to validate that the next block points back to it :)
271 2013-10-27 03:08:44 <gmaxwell> Ascendion: so? stop at 1 and just consider it the first block.
272 2013-10-27 03:08:51 <Ascendion> importing the entire blockchain/transaction data into a SQL database, then maintaining it in realtime as blocks arrive and reorgs happen
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274 2013-10-27 03:09:20 <Ascendion> I already special cased the code -- it ignores the transactions for height = 0
275 2013-10-27 03:10:54 <Ascendion> adding code to track transactions processed and time elapsed so I can see how fast its importing
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277 2013-10-27 03:13:42 <Ascendion> and blowing my brains out on pain meds cause there is a tstorm moving through thats setting off my joint pain :)
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348 2013-10-27 05:36:37 <gmaxwell> http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1p3zoz/gavin_andresen_core_development_update_5/ccyk7qe I appreciate the enthusiasm, but it would be helpful if he wasn't misinforming people that they will have to "rewrite their code".
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373 2013-10-27 06:34:46 <BlueMatt> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/3164 boom
374 2013-10-27 06:34:59 <BlueMatt> gavinandresen: ^ :)
375 2013-10-27 06:35:32 <gmaxwell> BlueMatt: thanks!
376 2013-10-27 06:35:52 <gmaxwell> BlueMatt: hey, if you're working on it right now can you add a test for OP_RETURN reorgs? :P
377 2013-10-27 06:36:31 <gmaxwell> Basically we need a block with a transaction that has a single OP_RETURN output, and that block needs to get reorged out of the chain. I believe this will fail on current master.
378 2013-10-27 06:36:54 <gmaxwell> (it would be nice to have some additional txn in the block: two OP_return, and one OP_RETURN one regular output, but less essential.)
379 2013-10-27 06:37:19 <BlueMatt> hmm...ok, lets see if I can break master then
380 2013-10-27 06:37:46 * BlueMatt needs to buy a new disk for this new workstation...Ive gotten spoiled by my laptop's ssd and now everything is sooooo sloooowwww
381 2013-10-27 06:38:41 <gmaxwell> Sipa also has a pull which should fix that bug.
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411 2013-10-27 07:48:29 <BlueMatt> gmaxwell: <gmaxwell> (it would be nice to have some additional txn in the block: two OP_return, and one OP_RETURN one regular output, but less essential.) <-- E_NOPARSE
412 2013-10-27 07:49:22 <gmaxwell> BlueMatt: a transaction with a single output that is nothing but the opcode OP_RETURN (0x6a I think?)
413 2013-10-27 07:49:40 <gmaxwell> another transaction with two outputs, each an OP_RETURN
414 2013-10-27 07:50:00 <gmaxwell> another transaction with a regular pay to address output, and a OP_RETURN
415 2013-10-27 07:50:07 <BlueMatt> in separate blocks, or the same?
416 2013-10-27 07:50:13 flound1129 has joined
417 2013-10-27 07:50:21 <gmaxwell> same block is fine. The block then needs to get reorged out of the chain.
418 2013-10-27 07:50:22 <flound1129> any devs around?
419 2013-10-27 07:50:43 <gmaxwell> Bounus points if you double up that last transaction to have both orders of outputs. OP_RETURN first and last.
420 2013-10-27 07:50:48 <flound1129> I'm trying to find out why a block my pool found didn't get into the chain
421 2013-10-27 07:51:15 <flound1129> it should have been block 226249, but that block was found by bitminter 10 minute slater
422 2013-10-27 07:51:19 <gmaxwell> flound1129: some roughly 1% of all blocks are orphaned naturally by chance. Do you have an reason to think it was anything else?
423 2013-10-27 07:51:27 <flound1129> http://pastebin.com/EiaRJaH6
424 2013-10-27 07:51:30 <BlueMatt> gmaxwell: should be easy enough...let me see if I can whip it up
425 2013-10-27 07:51:31 <gmaxwell> hm. 10 minutes, how are you judging that?
426 2013-10-27 07:51:46 <flound1129> timestamp in the db
427 2013-10-27 07:51:50 <flound1129> when the share was submitted
428 2013-10-27 07:52:05 <gmaxwell> flound1129: what is the hash of your block?
429 2013-10-27 07:52:20 <gmaxwell> can you email me your full debug log?
430 2013-10-27 07:53:04 <flound1129> yes
431 2013-10-27 07:53:08 <flound1129> hash is 00000000000000054dcf9fbb3263ca4abcc3cc5b1dd03a19169481bd24dd56aa
432 2013-10-27 07:53:15 <gmaxwell> gmaxwell@gmail.com works.
433 2013-10-27 07:54:00 <gmaxwell> neither of my nodes have seen that block.
434 2013-10-27 07:55:13 <feddy3> blockchain.info doesn't have it either
435 2013-10-27 07:55:24 sustrik has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
436 2013-10-27 07:55:34 <gmaxwell> feddy3: yea thats not super informative. :P
437 2013-10-27 07:55:49 <feddy3> my node doesn't have it either ;)
438 2013-10-27 07:56:35 sipa has quit (Changing host)
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440 2013-10-27 07:56:42 <flound1129> just sent you mail
441 2013-10-27 07:56:59 <sipa> well then it sounds like the pool software never sent it out?
442 2013-10-27 07:57:12 <gmaxwell> thats why I wanted the debug log, downloading it as we speak.
443 2013-10-27 07:57:44 <flound1129> ThreadRPCServer method=submitblock
444 2013-10-27 07:57:44 <flound1129> ProcessBlock: ACCEPTED
445 2013-10-27 07:57:45 <gmaxwell> absolutely no mention of thash hash in your debug log.
446 2013-10-27 07:58:54 <sipa> check for the mined block's parent hash
447 2013-10-27 07:59:18 <sipa> this looks like it was processed as a (true) orphan
448 2013-10-27 07:59:32 <gmaxwell> flound1129: for the future you may want to run with logtimestamps=1
449 2013-10-27 07:59:37 <flound1129> ok will do
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451 2013-10-27 08:00:11 <gmaxwell> ThreadRPCServer method=submitblock
452 2013-10-27 08:00:11 <gmaxwell> ProcessBlock: ACCEPTED
453 2013-10-27 08:00:32 <gmaxwell> ... and many lines later:
454 2013-10-27 08:00:36 <gmaxwell> received block 0000000000000009e45551733bf49e4f2517a0e907337e5e05c326a04f6b3d3e
455 2013-10-27 08:00:41 <gmaxwell> SetBestChain: new best=0000000000000009e45551733bf49e4f2517a0e907337e5e05c326a04f6b3d3e height=266249 log2_work=73.208971 tx=26064781 date=2013-10-26 22:25:11 progress=0.999998
456 2013-10-27 08:00:54 <flound1129> yeah that's the bitminter block
457 2013-10-27 08:00:55 <gmaxwell> flound1129: do you have an actual copy of this block?
458 2013-10-27 08:01:06 <flound1129> there's nothing in the wallet
459 2013-10-27 08:01:07 <flound1129> no transactions
460 2013-10-27 08:01:34 <gmaxwell> seems like your node didn't do anything with it at all, like it didn't think it was the best at the time it recieved it.
461 2013-10-27 08:01:47 <gmaxwell> flound1129: what bitcoin version is your node?
462 2013-10-27 08:02:12 <gmaxwell> Oh nevermind Bitcoin version v0.8.3-dirty-beta (2013-06-25 10:27:24 -0400)
463 2013-10-27 08:02:33 <flound1129> yeah I'm compiling 0.8.5 now
464 2013-10-27 08:03:29 <gmaxwell> wow, really slow host. is this running on an ec2 instance or something?
465 2013-10-27 08:03:32 <gmaxwell> Flushed 14916 addresses to peers.dat 7676ms
466 2013-10-27 08:03:44 <flound1129> hmmmm
467 2013-10-27 08:03:56 <gmaxwell> though I don't see how that could be a problem here.
468 2013-10-27 08:03:56 <flound1129> no, but my VPS was having issues last night
469 2013-10-27 08:04:23 <flound1129> disk issues on that physical host
470 2013-10-27 08:04:48 <flound1129> another VPS was using all the I/O bandwidth
471 2013-10-27 08:04:55 <flound1129> could that have factored into this?
472 2013-10-27 08:04:57 <gmaxwell> logs indicate really surprisingly slow IO, I'd look into that though I don't think it's the cause of your orphaning.
473 2013-10-27 08:05:13 <gmaxwell> though I'd like to get a copy of the actual block
474 2013-10-27 08:05:23 <flound1129> how can I get that?
475 2013-10-27 08:05:35 <gmaxwell> I take it your pool software doesn't log it?
476 2013-10-27 08:05:46 <flound1129> it logged the same hash
477 2013-10-27 08:05:58 <gmaxwell> yea, but I don't want the hash, I want the block.
478 2013-10-27 08:06:24 <gmaxwell> one possiblity is that you were lagged out when your pool last fetched work and this was actually a solution one block behind.
479 2013-10-27 08:06:35 <gmaxwell> that would explain your node not moving up to it.
480 2013-10-27 08:06:37 <flound1129> the bitcoind was lagged out you mean?
481 2013-10-27 08:06:54 <flound1129> hmm
482 2013-10-27 08:07:01 <flound1129> wouldn't it be rejected though
483 2013-10-27 08:07:29 <gmaxwell> flound1129: or your pool software. No, it just wouldn't be best so it wouldn't move to it. I don't /think/ we log anything special in that case.
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486 2013-10-27 08:07:47 <flound1129> ok
487 2013-10-27 08:07:49 <gmaxwell> it would pass the initial sanity checks and then just not be attractive unless some other block extended it and made it the longer chain.
488 2013-10-27 08:08:05 <flound1129> make sense
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492 2013-10-27 08:10:17 <BlueMatt> gmaxwell: yep, definitely is broken on master
493 2013-10-27 08:10:36 <BlueMatt> gmaxwell: remind me to push the latest version to pull-tester when the pull that fixes it is merged
494 2013-10-27 08:10:45 <gmaxwell> BlueMatt: yep. thought so. Can you test sipa's fix?
495 2013-10-27 08:10:52 <BlueMatt> branchname?
496 2013-10-27 08:10:58 <gmaxwell> BlueMatt: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/3163
497 2013-10-27 08:11:07 <BlueMatt> lazy
498 2013-10-27 08:11:08 neep3r has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
499 2013-10-27 08:11:18 <gmaxwell> (I was holding off acking it because I didn't have a reorg reproduction, only the startup time test reproduction)
500 2013-10-27 08:11:34 <gmaxwell> sipa:allunspendable
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502 2013-10-27 08:11:44 <BlueMatt> yea, building now
503 2013-10-27 08:12:59 <gmaxwell> sipa: congrats, your anal startup tests found a forking bug.
504 2013-10-27 08:13:45 <sipa> gmaxwell: ... which I introduced
505 2013-10-27 08:14:01 <gmaxwell> pft. and everyone else acked. :P
506 2013-10-27 08:14:46 <sipa> true
507 2013-10-27 08:15:16 <gmaxwell> sipa: I tested by reindexing the chain... as I knew the chain already had a number of these things.
508 2013-10-27 08:15:35 <sipa> same
509 2013-10-27 08:15:49 <sipa> well, it seemed my laptop's node hadn't run im two weeks
510 2013-10-27 08:15:50 <gmaxwell> we don't currently really have a way to do the disconnect test to the whole chain, due to the memory limit.
511 2013-10-27 08:16:23 <sipa> so i just rannit until i crossed the all-unspent case you hot, and restarted
512 2013-10-27 08:16:33 <sipa> you GOT
513 2013-10-27 08:17:04 <BlueMatt> sipa: it didnt get released, so who cares, right? :)
514 2013-10-27 08:17:15 <sipa> sure
515 2013-10-27 08:17:17 <gmaxwell> ah, thats how you got a reproduction? :P that works. you could have used your blacklist patch to trigger a reorg to once above, no? I think I commented on that pull basically saying we could use it to try to disconnect the whole chain.
516 2013-10-27 08:17:34 <gmaxwell> BlueMatt: it did almost get missed, so I think its worth thinking about how we need to improve the process.
517 2013-10-27 08:17:37 <sipa> hmm, i missed thar
518 2013-10-27 08:18:31 <sipa> gmaxwell: for testing purposes a unblacklist woukd be useful too
519 2013-10-27 08:18:35 <gmaxwell> BlueMatt: basically I shut down my node at just the right time while moving between rooms at linuxcon and got "chainstate corruption", sipa's startup test failing at start, which I then bit into and didn't release until we figured out what it was.
520 2013-10-27 08:18:42 <BlueMatt> gmaxwell: everyone should be required to write a shitton of bitcoindcomparisontool tests :)
521 2013-10-27 08:19:05 <sipa> that would be extremely helpful
522 2013-10-27 08:19:07 <gmaxwell> BlueMatt: Yea, I need to figure out how to run that locally and build it.
523 2013-10-27 08:19:20 <sipa> if only for forcing us to understand the code
524 2013-10-27 08:19:21 <BlueMatt> gmaxwell: intellij -> import bitcoinj -> run :)
525 2013-10-27 08:19:29 <gmaxwell> I think we should have required an opreturn test for the comparison tool.
526 2013-10-27 08:19:40 <BlueMatt> (just dont try to build the jar in intellij..)
527 2013-10-27 08:19:53 <gmaxwell> We slacked because these things were already in the chain, if there were none in the chain I think it's likely I would have demanded a test.
528 2013-10-27 08:20:08 <sipa> i haven't built any java in years i think
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531 2013-10-27 08:20:38 <gmaxwell> sipa: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/2839#issuecomment-21302247
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533 2013-10-27 08:21:41 <gmaxwell> BlueMatt: anyways when you confirm its fixed please comment on that pull that you confirmed the bug is forking and that the patch fixes it.
534 2013-10-27 08:22:38 <sipa> oh there, right
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536 2013-10-27 08:23:21 <gmaxwell> (well, some consolation that at least a kind of test that would have caught it had been mentioned.)
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538 2013-10-27 08:23:41 <gmaxwell> sipa: unblacklist would be neat, you could thrash the heck out of a node blacklisting block 1 and unblacklisting it. :P
539 2013-10-27 08:24:32 <sipa> haha
540 2013-10-27 08:24:43 <BlueMatt> ok, reorg off+on a block with: {outputs: {OP_RETURN, OP_TRUEx4}}, {outputs: {OP_RETURNx2}, inputs: {tx1_1}}, {outputs: {OP_RETURN, OP_TRUE}, inputs: {tx1_2}}, {outputs: {OP_TRUE, OP_RETURN}, inputs: {tx1_3}}, {outputs: {OP_RETURN}, inputs: {tx1_4}}
541 2013-10-27 08:24:47 <BlueMatt> success with sipa's patch
542 2013-10-27 08:25:03 <sipa> \o/
543 2013-10-27 08:25:10 <BlueMatt> gmaxwell: how's that for bonus points?
544 2013-10-27 08:25:36 * sipa does the BitcoindComparisonTool.jardance
545 2013-10-27 08:26:02 <gmaxwell> BlueMatt: sweet. Thats good!
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547 2013-10-27 08:28:20 <BlueMatt> sipa: https://github.com/TheBlueMatt/test-scripts (and yes, you now need all the jars in the folder...blame intellij and my unwillingness to crapify my new workstation with 30 java ides)
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549 2013-10-27 08:28:35 <BlueMatt> that will fail on master, Ill throw it on the pull-tester when sipa's fix gets merged
550 2013-10-27 08:29:37 <sipa> can't you just unzip + rezip them together?
551 2013-10-27 08:29:51 <BlueMatt> gmaxwell: and if you want to see how easy that test was to create, look at https://code.google.com/r/bluemattme-bitcoinj/source/detail?r=cb616b6f4ec9430551f0ae7767944aa46d2f606e&name=blocktester
552 2013-10-27 08:30:16 <BlueMatt> sipa: nfc, but you cant just throw them all in the jar normally 'cause some of the deps are signed classes
553 2013-10-27 08:30:25 <BlueMatt> I think there is magic that makes it work (eclipse knows how)
554 2013-10-27 08:30:32 <BlueMatt> but I dunno it, and Im lazy
555 2013-10-27 08:30:49 <BlueMatt> gmaxwell: its literally all copy/paste/change-1-char
556 2013-10-27 08:31:42 <sipa> where is b86 (in the comment) ?
557 2013-10-27 08:32:01 <BlueMatt> I forgot to write it :)
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559 2013-10-27 08:33:27 <gmaxwell> BlueMatt: yea, I believe it's easy, but installing a java ide ... yuck. :P
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563 2013-10-27 08:39:58 <BlueMatt> gmaxwell: generally, I might agree, but intellij is surprisingly nice
564 2013-10-27 08:40:04 <BlueMatt> for an ide, ofc
565 2013-10-27 08:41:08 tst1488 has joined
566 2013-10-27 08:41:19 <sipa> why am i awake?
567 2013-10-27 08:41:31 <BlueMatt> sipa: I was just asking myself that very question...
568 2013-10-27 08:41:37 <BlueMatt> why is gmaxwell awake?
569 2013-10-27 08:41:38 <sipa> it's before 10am on a sunday
570 2013-10-27 08:42:40 Guest16233 has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
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572 2013-10-27 08:44:59 <MC1984> we starting a nite owls club?
573 2013-10-27 08:45:17 * BlueMatt 's been in that one forever
574 2013-10-27 08:45:47 <BlueMatt> 3rd night in a row up >4am working on things that should've been done months ago...
575 2013-10-27 08:46:05 <MC1984> you dont know who youre dealing with
576 2013-10-27 08:46:19 * BlueMatt was up till 7 on thursday...
577 2013-10-27 08:46:37 <BlueMatt> (and a wee bit drunk on irc, sorry 'bout that one y'all)
578 2013-10-27 08:46:52 <BlueMatt> GOD pull-tester is slow as fuck now
579 2013-10-27 08:46:53 <MC1984> but drunk irc is best irc
580 2013-10-27 08:46:56 <BlueMatt> need more tmpfs
581 2013-10-27 08:49:32 <sipa> BlueMatt: tmpfs on the devserver?
582 2013-10-27 08:49:41 <sipa> or at least the pulltester vm
583 2013-10-27 08:49:41 <BlueMatt> yea
584 2013-10-27 08:49:45 <BlueMatt> pulltester vm
585 2013-10-27 08:49:53 <sipa> why did that change?
586 2013-10-27 08:50:03 <BlueMatt> I think it used to have one
587 2013-10-27 08:50:11 <sipa> or does it just need more memory now
588 2013-10-27 08:50:12 <BlueMatt> but now it needs to be in a different place
589 2013-10-27 08:50:16 <sipa> ic
590 2013-10-27 08:50:24 <BlueMatt> the tester now needs disk for its db since it does huge-reorg-tests
591 2013-10-27 08:50:39 <BlueMatt> so it needs tmpfs for that to run reasonably on huge reorgs for every pull
592 2013-10-27 08:50:53 <BlueMatt> not sure if that version ever got pushed or if autotools came first and broke it
593 2013-10-27 08:51:41 <BlueMatt> sipa: ok, you got your b89
594 2013-10-27 08:51:44 <BlueMatt> now Im off to bed
595 2013-10-27 08:52:18 <sipa> ... 86
596 2013-10-27 08:52:34 <sipa> nite!
597 2013-10-27 08:59:19 <sipa> i'm not sure i understand the current state
598 2013-10-27 08:59:33 <sipa> is the comparison tool active in pulltester?
599 2013-10-27 09:02:45 jtimon has joined
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602 2013-10-27 09:08:02 <warren> wow. bitcoin-qt.exe works in wine.
603 2013-10-27 09:09:29 <sipa> doesn't surprise me that qt works well on wine
604 2013-10-27 09:10:46 <warren> I'm playing with bitcoin-qt.exe and litecoin-qt.exe built with the new mingw
605 2013-10-27 09:12:33 <Ascendion> hmmmm taking forever to verify last 288 blocks on startup of bitcoind
606 2013-10-27 09:13:18 <Ascendion> finally :)
607 2013-10-27 09:13:35 _ingsoc has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
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610 2013-10-27 09:17:11 <Ascendion> OUCH
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614 2013-10-27 09:21:07 <Ascendion> getting the db schema right is giving me one heck of a headache :)
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620 2013-10-27 09:26:47 <warren> hmm... litecoin-qt.exe is using less RAM than the gitian linux build
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663 2013-10-27 10:25:43 <feddy3> On the standard scriptSig with 2 pushdatas, what are the size requirements of each of the pushes (so that the tx is standard) ?
664 2013-10-27 10:25:51 <feddy3> Is the 2nd push always 33 bytes?
665 2013-10-27 10:26:08 <feddy3> i.e., a compressed pubkey? or can it be uncompressed?
666 2013-10-27 10:26:46 <sipa> for standardness, there are no limitations
667 2013-10-27 10:26:55 <sipa> the scriptSig just has to be push-only
668 2013-10-27 10:27:09 <sipa> if you don't give a valid public key though, the transaction won't be valid
669 2013-10-27 10:27:13 Dyaheon has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
670 2013-10-27 10:27:19 <feddy3> sure
671 2013-10-27 10:27:40 <sipa> in general, you cannot know what the meaning of the data in the pushes is
672 2013-10-27 10:27:52 <feddy3> of course
673 2013-10-27 10:27:55 <sipa> though i guess you could do something like "this looks like a public key, show it as one"
674 2013-10-27 10:28:03 <sipa> or "this looks like a signature, show it as one"
675 2013-10-27 10:28:23 <feddy3> I want to do something simpler than that: just give a basic interpretation of the script
676 2013-10-27 10:28:28 <feddy3> "This is a standard spend"
677 2013-10-27 10:28:43 <sipa> unless you also look at the output being consumed, you can't do that (in general)
678 2013-10-27 10:28:56 murkmans has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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680 2013-10-27 10:29:03 <feddy3> So giving an interpretation of scriptSig isn't useful?
681 2013-10-27 10:29:03 murkmans has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
682 2013-10-27 10:29:17 <feddy3> by itself
683 2013-10-27 10:29:37 <sipa> in general, no
684 2013-10-27 10:29:41 <sipa> in practice, probably yes
685 2013-10-27 10:30:01 <sipa> brb, i'll explain
686 2013-10-27 10:30:17 <feddy3> what approach would you think is best? If all(opcode == pushdata) then interpretation = "standard spend" ?
687 2013-10-27 10:30:19 <feddy3> ok
688 2013-10-27 10:31:42 askmike has joined
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691 2013-10-27 10:34:25 neep3r has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
692 2013-10-27 10:35:22 <sipa> feddy3: i don't think you need to worry about standardness or not
693 2013-10-27 10:35:33 murkmans has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
694 2013-10-27 10:35:44 <sipa> feddy3: in particular, i think such a transaction disassembler is exactly most useful for non-standard spends
695 2013-10-27 10:35:52 <feddy3> sure
696 2013-10-27 10:36:30 <sipa> feddy3: but it may make sense to just decode the script operations, and when you see something that looks like a pubkey, show it as a pubkey and the corresponding address for example
697 2013-10-27 10:36:31 murkmans has joined
698 2013-10-27 10:36:40 <feddy3> I'm interested in providing an "interpretation" of standard scripts, not necessarily qualifying validity
699 2013-10-27 10:37:23 <feddy3> for instance, standard pay to pubkeyhash can show the destination address, right?
700 2013-10-27 10:37:23 RazielZ has joined
701 2013-10-27 10:37:44 <sipa> that's outputs; that's different
702 2013-10-27 10:37:54 <feddy3> yup
703 2013-10-27 10:38:02 <sipa> there you can definitely perform pattern matching to see if it fits an address template
704 2013-10-27 10:38:07 <feddy3> right
705 2013-10-27 10:38:08 <sipa> and then show the corresponding address
706 2013-10-27 10:38:20 <feddy3> and I have implemented basic matching already
707 2013-10-27 10:38:34 <feddy3> I'm just curious what a decent way of interpreting input scripts should be, or not at all
708 2013-10-27 10:38:38 <sipa> you only really need pay-to-pubkeyhash and pay-to-scripthash
709 2013-10-27 10:38:44 <sipa> and probably pay-to-pubkey too
710 2013-10-27 10:38:46 <feddy3> and multisig
711 2013-10-27 10:39:23 <sipa> but for example, in the case of a P2SH input, it would be really nice to disassemble the subscript
712 2013-10-27 10:39:40 <sipa> (though detecting one is certainly harder)
713 2013-10-27 10:39:45 <feddy3> yeah
714 2013-10-27 10:39:56 <sipa> for inputs, i
715 2013-10-27 10:40:06 <sipa> for inputs, i'd just try to give meaning to the individual pushes, if any
716 2013-10-27 10:40:16 <feddy3> you have to know that the referenced output was a p2sh to begin with..
717 2013-10-27 10:40:32 <feddy3> ah, interesting
718 2013-10-27 10:40:54 <sipa> well, you can try decoding it as a script, and if it succeeds, and contains an OP_CHECKSIG or any of a few other very common ones, assume it is a subscript
719 2013-10-27 10:41:13 <sipa> as at least public keys and signatures are very recognizable
720 2013-10-27 10:41:15 Raziel has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
721 2013-10-27 10:41:29 <feddy3> ahh, yeah
722 2013-10-27 10:41:41 <feddy3> for every pushdata, decode it as a script and see if it matches a regular pattern?
723 2013-10-27 10:41:47 <feddy3> hmm
724 2013-10-27 10:41:54 <sipa> i'd just do pubkey and signatures first
725 2013-10-27 10:42:00 <feddy3> yeah
726 2013-10-27 10:42:34 <sipa> for a pubkey you can say: whether it's compressed or not, whether it's valid or not (but that requires some ec crypto), what the corresponding address is
727 2013-10-27 10:43:28 <sipa> for a signature you can say whether it's canonical or not
728 2013-10-27 10:43:28 <gmaxwell> [OT] the sha1 bounty ( 37k7toV1Nv4DfmQbmZ8KuZDQCYK9x5KpzP ) is up to 2.47 btc now.
729 2013-10-27 10:43:32 wbill has quit (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzzâ¦)
730 2013-10-27 10:43:56 <sipa> (though detecting non-canonical signatures again becomes more fuzzy)
731 2013-10-27 10:44:03 <Anduck> the tx still isn't relayed.....
732 2013-10-27 10:44:06 <Anduck> 3 days now
733 2013-10-27 10:44:12 <sipa> Anduck: it has a fee of 0.00001
734 2013-10-27 10:44:20 <sipa> i don't think any node will relay that
735 2013-10-27 10:44:22 <Anduck> well even 0-fee's get relayed to other nodes
736 2013-10-27 10:44:29 <sipa> if they are high priority
737 2013-10-27 10:44:32 <sipa> yours isn't
738 2013-10-27 10:44:54 <Anduck> well bitcoind made it...
739 2013-10-27 10:44:59 <sipa> that worries me
740 2013-10-27 10:45:04 <sipa> 0.8.5, you say?
741 2013-10-27 10:45:06 <Anduck> yes
742 2013-10-27 10:45:08 <gmaxwell> hm.
743 2013-10-27 10:45:14 <gmaxwell> Anduck: with the raw transaction interface?
744 2013-10-27 10:45:16 <Anduck> 0.8.5 is what i am using
745 2013-10-27 10:45:18 <Anduck> no, sendmany
746 2013-10-27 10:45:40 sustrik has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
747 2013-10-27 10:45:43 <feddy3> sipa: Ok, thanks.
748 2013-10-27 10:45:50 <gmaxwell> Anduck: can you pastebin the raw transaction to me?
749 2013-10-27 10:45:53 <Anduck> sure
750 2013-10-27 10:48:01 <sipa> feddy3: how do i paste a raw transaction?
751 2013-10-27 10:48:14 <feddy3> sipa: I've updated fetchtx.info again with some error handling.. it'd be very cool if you had feedback on the site
752 2013-10-27 10:48:29 <sipa> well, i pasted a raw transaction and get an empty page
753 2013-10-27 10:48:35 wbill has joined
754 2013-10-27 10:48:50 <feddy3> really? can I get the tx?
755 2013-10-27 10:49:04 <gmaxwell> Anduck: I handed it manually to eligius and it appears to have accepted it.
756 2013-10-27 10:49:19 asuk is now known as asuk|afk
757 2013-10-27 10:49:21 <feddy3> sipa: hit random tx, then click 'Show' and overwrite the tx in there
758 2013-10-27 10:49:24 <gmaxwell> it's not yet in their blocktemplates, however.
759 2013-10-27 10:49:39 <Anduck> thx
760 2013-10-27 10:50:02 <gmaxwell> (presumably because its at the bottom of the priority list)
761 2013-10-27 10:50:24 <Anduck> but are 0-fees higher than my tx?
762 2013-10-27 10:50:46 <sipa> Anduck: anything below 0.0001 (iirc) is considered as 0-fee
763 2013-10-27 10:51:12 <Anduck> btw i am not 100% sure the tx is made with 0.8.5 because i did change client vers there couple times
764 2013-10-27 10:51:28 <Anduck> but i am pretty confident it's 0.8.5 because i didnt send txs from the other vers...
765 2013-10-27 10:51:41 <sipa> is it possible you created it with a recent git head?
766 2013-10-27 10:51:49 <Anduck> yes
767 2013-10-27 10:52:09 <Anduck> it's the version i used for a while but i am pretty sure i didn't use it for the sendmany tx
768 2013-10-27 10:52:16 <Anduck> but it's possible.......
769 2013-10-27 10:52:42 <gmaxwell> well that would certantly explain itâ¦
770 2013-10-27 10:53:36 <sipa> gmaxwell: how so?
771 2013-10-27 10:53:55 <sipa> ooh!
772 2013-10-27 10:53:58 <gmaxwell> right.
773 2013-10-27 10:54:22 <sipa> removing the subcent rule caused his node to create a transaction with 0 fee
774 2013-10-27 10:54:30 <sipa> and the change was below dust, so was moved to fee
775 2013-10-27 10:56:09 sustrik has joined
776 2013-10-27 10:56:12 <gmaxwell> I'm kinda wondering if maybe we shouldn't ship 0.9 with the fee defaulted to 0.0001 BTC/kb to avoid that gotcha.
777 2013-10-27 10:56:51 <gmaxwell> probably not worth the political noise.
778 2013-10-27 10:57:03 viperhr has joined
779 2013-10-27 10:57:05 <gmaxwell> I say we abandon bitcoin-qt and create a new project bitcoin2-qt. :P
780 2013-10-27 10:57:13 _Neil has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
781 2013-10-27 10:57:22 <sipa> how about ditching the toolkit
782 2013-10-27 10:57:30 <gmaxwell> And then we can change all the defaults without anyone feeling like we killed their dog.
783 2013-10-27 10:57:31 <sipa> i hear a lot of good things about wx
784 2013-10-27 10:57:47 <gmaxwell> I vote for ncurses.
785 2013-10-27 10:57:51 <sipa> +1 !
786 2013-10-27 10:57:55 <swulf--> In the long run, separating the projects entirely would be a good move, no?
787 2013-10-27 10:58:08 darkee has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
788 2013-10-27 10:58:11 <sipa> first step: separating the processes
789 2013-10-27 10:58:18 <sipa> second step: separating the binaries
790 2013-10-27 10:58:23 <sipa> third step: separating the codebase
791 2013-10-27 10:58:29 <sipa> fourth step: separating the projects
792 2013-10-27 10:58:44 ircuser-6 has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
793 2013-10-27 10:58:48 <swulf--> yeah
794 2013-10-27 10:58:49 Neil has joined
795 2013-10-27 10:58:51 <gmaxwell> fifth step: gavin and the log splitter.
796 2013-10-27 10:59:14 neep3r has joined
797 2013-10-27 10:59:20 <sipa> running java code always makes me somehow feel... infected
798 2013-10-27 10:59:29 <gmaxwell> "What do you mean that binary fission doesn't work on developers??"
799 2013-10-27 10:59:36 <CodeShark> gmaxwell: https://github.com/CodeShark/BitShell
800 2013-10-27 10:59:54 <gmaxwell> "I thought you said they didn't have sex?" "No! I said they don't get laid!"
801 2013-10-27 11:00:39 <gmaxwell> CodeShark: interesting!
802 2013-10-27 11:00:40 <sipa> gmaxwell: now you los me
803 2013-10-27 11:00:45 <sipa> *lost
804 2013-10-27 11:02:06 <gmaxwell> sipa: a log splitter is a mechnical device that splits logs (the wooden kind) in half. Binary fission is the process bacteria use to reproduce, as opposed to sexual reproduction.
805 2013-10-27 11:02:14 <HM2> damn CodeShark
806 2013-10-27 11:02:18 <HM2> this is something i've though about
807 2013-10-27 11:02:38 <sipa> gmaxwell: oh, i wasn't familiar with that biological term
808 2013-10-27 11:02:44 sustrik has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
809 2013-10-27 11:05:54 <feddy3> Is it possible to get a bypass of the newbies-only limitation on bitcointalk here?
810 2013-10-27 11:05:58 dust-otc has quit (Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com)
811 2013-10-27 11:07:32 <sipa> hmm, it seems that matt's pullreq enables both the comparisontool, and fixes an issue with it
812 2013-10-27 11:07:56 <gmaxwell> feddy3: whats your username?
813 2013-10-27 11:08:04 <feddy3> gmaxwell: fetchtx
814 2013-10-27 11:08:57 asuk is now known as afk!~asuk@31.129.27.89|asuk
815 2013-10-27 11:09:13 <gmaxwell> feddy3: if you go spamming around a bunch of places I'll personally kill you. You're whitelisted now. :)
816 2013-10-27 11:09:29 patcon has joined
817 2013-10-27 11:09:32 <HM2> lol
818 2013-10-27 11:09:32 <feddy3> gmaxwell: hah, thanks ;) I just want to start a single thread for my site
819 2013-10-27 11:09:48 <sipa> I heard that gmaxwell executions are especially slow and painful.
820 2013-10-27 11:10:14 <sipa> involving opious amounts of capitalization
821 2013-10-27 11:10:18 rdymac has quit (Excess Flood)
822 2013-10-27 11:10:20 <sipa> *copious
823 2013-10-27 11:10:27 <wumpus> hehe
824 2013-10-27 11:11:02 rdymac has joined
825 2013-10-27 11:11:16 <sipa> here is a nice example: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=311000.msg3345309#msg3345309
826 2013-10-27 11:12:55 <feddy3> ah yes, I read that earlier
827 2013-10-27 11:13:37 <feddy3> I'd like to see him expand on the "it's not hard to memorize 128 bits" part, so that people who want to use brainwallets can do it right
828 2013-10-27 11:13:47 neep3r has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
829 2013-10-27 11:13:56 <gmaxwell> feddy3: what electrum does, for example.
830 2013-10-27 11:14:31 <gmaxwell> It has a bijection between 128 bit uniform numbers and sets of 12 not-uncommon english words.
831 2013-10-27 11:14:43 <feddy3> Ah, interesting
832 2013-10-27 11:14:59 <feddy3> Is it the same recovery "peom" system that blockchain.info wallets have?
833 2013-10-27 11:15:18 patcon has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
834 2013-10-27 11:16:24 <gmaxwell> Now. _memorizing_ that and making that your only storage mechnism is totally possible, but its risky... because memory is a bit brittle. E.g. you can remember something fine for years.. and the one day, some magic cell dies, or you run a fever and poof. can't remember it... so I still don't recommend it, but its way better than letting the human come up with the key.
835 2013-10-27 11:16:34 <sipa> feddy3: two nits: left-align the txid input box, and allowing pasting a raw transaction in hex there
836 2013-10-27 11:16:48 <gmaxwell> feddy3: No idea what bc.i has.
837 2013-10-27 11:16:55 jtimon has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
838 2013-10-27 11:17:21 <gmaxwell> So for an electrum wallet, by all means, memorize it, but also write it down. If you're worried about people finding your written copy, split it in half or whatever.
839 2013-10-27 11:18:20 <feddy3> sipa: the txid input box on the main page? the one on the txview page is left aligned.
840 2013-10-27 11:19:00 a_meteor has joined
841 2013-10-27 11:19:22 <feddy3> hmm, I need to do some magic to allow pasting the the raw tx on the main page
842 2013-10-27 11:20:18 <CodeShark> embed the even bits into a youtube video, write the odd bits down and lock them in a safe
843 2013-10-27 11:20:20 <CodeShark> :p
844 2013-10-27 11:20:57 <HM2> write it on every sheet of toilet paper in the house, then reroll it
845 2013-10-27 11:20:59 <HM2> you'll never forget
846 2013-10-27 11:21:30 <CodeShark> or embed the key into several youtube videos such that the xor of all the vids combined produces the key
847 2013-10-27 11:21:41 <CodeShark> and then store the list of vids in a safe :)
848 2013-10-27 11:21:54 <feddy3> and then youtube closes down
849 2013-10-27 11:22:06 <feddy3> better to use the blockchain itself as your xor source
850 2013-10-27 11:22:09 <gmaxwell> THIS VIDEO IS UNAVAILABLE IN YOUR COUNTRY (on one of them)
851 2013-10-27 11:22:12 <CodeShark> lol
852 2013-10-27 11:22:13 <HM2> I heard the NSA has backdoor deals with safe manufacturers
853 2013-10-27 11:22:37 <gmaxwell> obviously you should first apply forward error correction.
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857 2013-10-27 11:23:22 <gmaxwell> so then you only need a simple majority of the steganographic cat pictures to recover your coins.
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860 2013-10-27 11:24:00 <CodeShark> u haz bitcoin?
861 2013-10-27 11:24:08 <gmaxwell> but really, "the attacker is finding bits of paper in my home/office" isn't a primary threat model.
862 2013-10-27 11:24:16 <gmaxwell> at least not for most people.
863 2013-10-27 11:24:35 <gmaxwell> and not relative to "oops, I forgot my crazy hiding scheme"
864 2013-10-27 11:30:28 <HM2> steganography is a cool concept but kind of useless generally
865 2013-10-27 11:30:59 <CodeShark> I've found a number of practical applications for it
866 2013-10-27 11:31:06 <sipa> well, it IS security through obscurity in a way
867 2013-10-27 11:31:10 <HM2> if you want to hide something at home you're better off burying it in your neighbours garden. if you want to smuggle digital content over a border you can just push it over the net
868 2013-10-27 11:31:20 <sipa> as the actual secret becomes the location
869 2013-10-27 11:31:29 <sipa> or even just the knowledge that the data exists
870 2013-10-27 11:31:42 <CodeShark> the point of steganography is not simply to hide information - but to not arouse suspicion you're hiding it in the first place
871 2013-10-27 11:31:51 <sipa> right
872 2013-10-27 11:32:28 <HM2> except all the steganography software on C: and google searches for "how to hide bitcoin wallets in jpegs"
873 2013-10-27 11:33:47 <sipa> it took me a while to realize you were talking about a filesystem and not a programming language :D
874 2013-10-27 11:34:00 <HM2> that's a good sign
875 2013-10-27 11:34:08 <HM2> (I don't have a C: drive either)
876 2013-10-27 11:34:10 <CodeShark> steganography can be as simple as "if we're meeting, post a picture of a puppy on your blog. otherwise, post a picture of a kitten"
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881 2013-10-27 11:38:37 <melvster> when i see "Branch main" on coinbase block header ... does this mean it's derived from the standard genesis block, or something else?
882 2013-10-27 11:39:04 <sipa> 'coinbase block header' makes no sense
883 2013-10-27 11:39:18 <sipa> the coinbase is the first transaction in a block
884 2013-10-27 11:39:47 <melvster> sorry i meant coinbase.com
885 2013-10-27 11:39:56 <melvster> https://coinbase.com/network/blocks/0000000006d10c918748d91be4b27b1b2d31edbcfbc29dd40ce056ec297f8a6d
886 2013-10-27 11:40:14 <melvster> it has a block chain viewer
887 2013-10-27 11:40:18 <sipa> heh do they also have a b
888 2013-10-27 11:40:22 <sipa> lock explorer
889 2013-10-27 11:40:26 Perlboy has quit (Excess Flood)
890 2013-10-27 11:40:31 <melvster> but that field doesnt appear in other explorers
891 2013-10-27 11:40:41 <melvster> Branch main
892 2013-10-27 11:40:48 <sipa> my guess in that case that it means that block is part of the active/main/best chain
893 2013-10-27 11:40:53 Perlboy has joined
894 2013-10-27 11:41:07 <sipa> and not an orphan/inactive/extinguished/reorganized/stale one
895 2013-10-27 11:41:15 <melvster> got it, thanks ... so branch "Testnet" may be another?
896 2013-10-27 11:41:20 <sipa> no
897 2013-10-27 11:41:21 <melvster> ohhh
898 2013-10-27 11:41:23 <melvster> i see
899 2013-10-27 11:41:27 <sipa> that is something else entirely
900 2013-10-27 11:41:29 <melvster> so the longest winning chain
901 2013-10-27 11:41:41 <sipa> longest valid chain, indeed
902 2013-10-27 11:41:46 <HM2> that's a lot of adjectives
903 2013-10-27 11:41:56 <melvster> got it, thanks sipa
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906 2013-10-27 11:43:00 <melvster> im also working on a block explorer now
907 2013-10-27 11:43:14 <melvster> but i realized there's different nets, the main net, and the test net etc.
908 2013-10-27 11:43:22 <melvster> so i was thinking of marking which is which
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910 2013-10-27 11:43:42 <melvster> but was unsure of the terminology ... I guess I could put in the genesis block, that should work
911 2013-10-27 11:43:53 <melvster> because main net and test net have different genesis
912 2013-10-27 11:44:19 <sipa> different networks
913 2013-10-27 11:44:46 <melvster> also yes
914 2013-10-27 11:44:57 <sipa> no, i mean, that is the terminology
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916 2013-10-27 11:45:19 <melvster> oic thanks
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918 2013-10-27 11:46:04 <melvster> i see yes, that's consistent with the white paper
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922 2013-10-27 11:48:12 <melvster> ill put the genesis block in there too, as there's only ever going to be one of those ...
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924 2013-10-27 11:48:29 <melvster> then i can do an explorer for both test and main
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964 2013-10-27 13:06:35 MrDaneelOlivaw has joined
965 2013-10-27 13:06:59 <MrDaneelOlivaw> hello folks
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968 2013-10-27 13:08:32 <MrDaneelOlivaw> does anyone know if electrum server supports the regtest regression test mode ?
969 2013-10-27 13:09:12 <MrDaneelOlivaw> also, seems like the electrum patch is not needed for latest bitcoin
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973 2013-10-27 13:12:53 <sipa> regtest mode is pretty new
974 2013-10-27 13:13:36 <sipa> no idea about any patches
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977 2013-10-27 13:14:42 <MrDaneelOlivaw> yeah i noticed, i'm a bit confused by it, is testnet returns no, i understand it is done for dev/testing so prod net rules, isolated, with minimal difficulty ?
978 2013-10-27 13:16:22 <sipa> testnet has special rule to keep its difficulty low, but it still has difficulty checks
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980 2013-10-27 13:16:56 <MrDaneelOlivaw> ok so far i tried : prod, testnet and testnet in a box. Next I'm trying regtest and want to understand how it differs from the last.
981 2013-10-27 13:19:03 <MrDaneelOlivaw> i also confirm that building tip of bitcoin on latest ubuntu (saucy) is broken with libboost-dev-all (1.53 all packgs), i had to install manually the 1.54 dev packages (test, system, program_option, thread, chrono) to get it to build.
982 2013-10-27 13:19:15 <sipa> ok, different network magic (fabfb5da), subsidy halving every 150 blocks, initial difficulty = .0000000002328 (any block is good), and the genesis block is different
983 2013-10-27 13:20:12 <sipa> so creating blocks for regtest is trivial
984 2013-10-27 13:20:20 <sipa> and you get to see the effects of subsidy halving very quickly
985 2013-10-27 13:20:59 <sipa> MrDaneelOlivaw: good to know about saucy
986 2013-10-27 13:21:29 <MrDaneelOlivaw> fabfb5da is testnet and F9BEB4D9 is prod, so there are only these two in bitcoind without patching right ?
987 2013-10-27 13:22:12 <sipa> testnet is 0b110907
988 2013-10-27 13:22:27 <MrDaneelOlivaw> aha', i got confused by https://github.com/bitcoin/netspec/blob/master/protocol_specification.txt
989 2013-10-27 13:22:29 <sipa> mainnet is f9beb4d9
990 2013-10-27 13:23:12 <sipa> oh wow
991 2013-10-27 13:23:17 <sipa> i haven't seen that document in years :S
992 2013-10-27 13:23:29 <sipa> that may have been the magic of testnet1 or testnet2
993 2013-10-27 13:23:34 <MrDaneelOlivaw> lol bitcoin just has a few years
994 2013-10-27 13:23:52 <sipa> i've been aroun for a while
995 2013-10-27 13:24:05 <MrDaneelOlivaw> the more i read comments around git hub the more i notice ;P
996 2013-10-27 13:24:15 <sipa> ?
997 2013-10-27 13:24:22 <MrDaneelOlivaw> i've been around for a couple of years but mostly in the shadow
998 2013-10-27 13:24:26 <sipa> ic
999 2013-10-27 13:26:33 CircusPeanut has joined
1000 2013-10-27 13:27:23 <MrDaneelOlivaw> there's a lot to lurk .. and apparently the changes in getblock to add the verbose flag means that electrum can work without patching bitcoin
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1003 2013-10-27 13:35:19 <MrDaneelOlivaw> I'm really surprised the btcd channel is empty
1004 2013-10-27 13:36:29 <Belxjander> btcd?
1005 2013-10-27 13:37:07 <swulf--> That's the go implementation, correct?
1006 2013-10-27 13:37:21 <sipa> one of them
1007 2013-10-27 13:37:30 <swulf--> there's more than one?:)
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1010 2013-10-27 13:38:31 <MrDaneelOlivaw> yeah the go one, as far as I know is the only complete one ? is bitcoinj just something that goes in front of bitcoin ?
1011 2013-10-27 13:39:26 <sipa> bitcoinj is a completely separate implementation, mostly intended for implementing SPV clients
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1013 2013-10-27 13:39:28 <MrDaneelOlivaw> Well it is a client only by default but it does have an experimental full client mode
1014 2013-10-27 13:39:35 <sipa> though it has an incomplete full validation mode
1015 2013-10-27 13:39:48 <MrDaneelOlivaw> SPV clients means that electrum server are not necessary ?
1016 2013-10-27 13:39:57 <sipa> the model is different
1017 2013-10-27 13:40:19 <sipa> SPV clients participate directly in the P2P network, and validate PoW but don't validate transactions
1018 2013-10-27 13:40:37 <MrDaneelOlivaw> and don't store the full blockchain, just headers right ?
1019 2013-10-27 13:40:40 <sipa> indeed
1020 2013-10-27 13:40:46 <sipa> not even all headers, just recent ones
1021 2013-10-27 13:40:55 <sipa> electrum relies on a central server to index transactions clients are interested in
1022 2013-10-27 13:41:09 <MrDaneelOlivaw> yes i know i've been playing with it
1023 2013-10-27 13:41:16 <sipa> they do use the same crypto to prove that the transactions are actually part of the block chain
1024 2013-10-27 13:41:23 <sipa> but electrum clients don't connect to the p2p network
1025 2013-10-27 13:41:51 <MrDaneelOlivaw> is it commonly foreseen that SPV will take over electrum style client server ?
1026 2013-10-27 13:42:01 <sipa> no idea
1027 2013-10-27 13:42:21 <MrDaneelOlivaw> i'm trying to understand, what's the point of electrum old model when we have SPV
1028 2013-10-27 13:42:40 <sipa> SPV has been around for much longer, it's even described in satoshi's whitepaper
1029 2013-10-27 13:42:42 <MrDaneelOlivaw> much more reliable, the only thing I wonder is how long it takes for an SPV client to sync
1030 2013-10-27 13:42:51 <sipa> for a new wallet? seconds
1031 2013-10-27 13:43:02 <sipa> resyncing from scratch takes longer (minutes)
1032 2013-10-27 13:43:09 <MrDaneelOlivaw> even old addresses ?
1033 2013-10-27 13:43:10 <MrDaneelOlivaw> right
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1035 2013-10-27 13:43:14 <sipa> no, not old addresses
1036 2013-10-27 13:43:23 <sipa> if you import things, you have to request history
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1038 2013-10-27 13:43:35 <MrDaneelOlivaw> this is the difference, electrum server caches each address with spendable outputs
1039 2013-10-27 13:43:44 <sipa> yes, it relies on an index
1040 2013-10-27 13:43:46 <sipa> SPV doesn't
1041 2013-10-27 13:44:34 <MrDaneelOlivaw> I guess there could be an altorithm on top of SPV which caches the information close to where it is requested to improve speed sync
1042 2013-10-27 13:44:36 <sipa> there is a difference in privacy too: iirc the electrum server knows exactly which addresses are yours
1043 2013-10-27 13:44:43 <sipa> with SPV you can hide it
1044 2013-10-27 13:44:47 <sipa> at least to an extent
1045 2013-10-27 13:44:55 <MrDaneelOlivaw> sipa: the electrum server knows only when I spend which addresses are mine
1046 2013-10-27 13:45:06 <sipa> MrDaneelOlivaw: your client asks for the balance of its addresses
1047 2013-10-27 13:45:16 <MrDaneelOlivaw> i can ask for any address sipa
1048 2013-10-27 13:45:20 <MrDaneelOlivaw> doesn't mean its mine
1049 2013-10-27 13:45:25 <sipa> well, sure
1050 2013-10-27 13:45:25 <MrDaneelOlivaw> until i sign something
1051 2013-10-27 13:45:32 <sipa> but it can see which ones you are interested in
1052 2013-10-27 13:45:38 <sipa> that is a (mild) privacy leak
1053 2013-10-27 13:45:41 <MrDaneelOlivaw> but then again the SPV peers will see this too
1054 2013-10-27 13:45:43 <sipa> no
1055 2013-10-27 13:45:52 <sipa> you don't give your addresses, you give a filter
1056 2013-10-27 13:46:00 <sipa> and the filter has false positives
1057 2013-10-27 13:46:08 <MrDaneelOlivaw> no but at some point i need to send out my transaction
1058 2013-10-27 13:46:16 <MrDaneelOlivaw> i guess it could be just relying
1059 2013-10-27 13:46:31 <MrDaneelOlivaw> i.e. a bit like tor/freenet
1060 2013-10-27 13:46:32 <sipa> but SPV doesn't connect to a single server
1061 2013-10-27 13:46:36 <MrDaneelOlivaw> no, to N
1062 2013-10-27 13:46:39 <sipa> it just broadcasts transactions on the network
1063 2013-10-27 13:46:42 <sipa> just like everyone else
1064 2013-10-27 13:46:51 <sipa> yes, that also allows for some analysis, indeed
1065 2013-10-27 13:46:54 <sipa> but it's a lot weaker
1066 2013-10-27 13:47:00 <MrDaneelOlivaw> right, so credible deniability
1067 2013-10-27 13:47:12 <sipa> at least in theory
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1069 2013-10-27 13:47:24 <sipa> because of a node identifies itself as BitcoinJ, you know it won't be relaying any transactions
1070 2013-10-27 13:47:33 <sipa> so anything it broadcasts can be assumed to be its own
1071 2013-10-27 13:47:42 <MrDaneelOlivaw> makes sense
1072 2013-10-27 13:47:54 <sipa> then again, you can switch peers all the time
1073 2013-10-27 13:48:20 <sipa> anyway, currently the SPV model does put rather high load on the nodes it requests transactions from
1074 2013-10-27 13:49:15 <MrDaneelOlivaw> i can imagine but then so does a full client synching
1075 2013-10-27 13:49:41 <sipa> yes, but a bit differently
1076 2013-10-27 13:53:04 <MrDaneelOlivaw> less cpu intensive and more network intensive perhaps
1077 2013-10-27 13:53:09 <MrDaneelOlivaw> or IO in general
1078 2013-10-27 13:53:26 <MrDaneelOlivaw> I guess the blockchain doesn't compress well at all
1079 2013-10-27 13:53:29 <sipa> indeed, disk/cpu vs network is different
1080 2013-10-27 13:53:42 <MrDaneelOlivaw> being full of entropy
1081 2013-10-27 13:53:57 <sipa> no attempt is even made to compress it
1082 2013-10-27 13:54:04 <sipa> you could get 20-40% off
1083 2013-10-27 13:54:41 <MrDaneelOlivaw> not too bad but depends on at what cost of cpu/time and what algorithm
1084 2013-10-27 14:00:53 <sipa> gzip -9 removes some 25%
1085 2013-10-27 14:00:58 <sipa> xz -9 removes 40%
1086 2013-10-27 14:01:31 <sipa> (and that's on a bunch of blocks together, as you still need to access them individually, you can only compress them individually, with likely worse compression)
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1098 2013-10-27 14:25:58 <sipa> BlueMatt, gmaxwell: just ran comparison tool on #3163 + #3164... it took hours and resulted in:
1099 2013-10-27 14:26:01 <sipa> Blocks which were not handled the same between bitcoind/bitcoinj: 361
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1202 2013-10-27 17:04:16 <sipa> wth testnet difficulty is 18800? :o
1203 2013-10-27 17:04:39 <sipa> even with a bunch of asics that requires hours to mine...
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1206 2013-10-27 17:07:55 <MrDaneelOlivaw> sipa: I hope people won't starting selling them again
1207 2013-10-27 17:10:13 <sipa> MrDaneelOlivaw: we can always reset it again
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1210 2013-10-27 17:11:32 <phantomcircuit> sipa, that's probably my fault
1211 2013-10-27 17:11:33 <phantomcircuit> sorry
1212 2013-10-27 17:11:42 <MrDaneelOlivaw> sipa: sure but the difficulty adjusts more often on testnet so if it is so hard is because people are furious on it so even if you reset won't take much at all before things are back ?
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1214 2013-10-27 17:12:34 <sipa> MrDaneelOlivaw: no, it adjusts just as frequently
1215 2013-10-27 17:12:52 <sipa> ;;genrate 10200
1216 2013-10-27 17:12:53 <gribble> The expected generation output, at 10200.0 Mhps, given difficulty of 390928787.638, is 0.0131216902664 BTC per day and 0.000546737094432 BTC per hour.
1217 2013-10-27 17:12:58 <sipa> ;;genrate 10200 18800
1218 2013-10-27 17:12:58 <gribble> The expected generation output, at 10200.0 Mhps, given difficulty of 18800.0, is 272.85353551 BTC per day and 11.3688973129 BTC per hour.
1219 2013-10-27 17:13:28 <MrDaneelOlivaw> sipa: oh, for some reason i thought otherwise. maybe just on test net in a box or maybe i must have been looking at some patches
1220 2013-10-27 17:13:59 <sipa> MrDaneelOlivaw: testnet in a box is just testnet on a separate chain
1221 2013-10-27 17:14:03 <sipa> it has all the same rules
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1223 2013-10-27 17:14:36 <sipa> this is crazy... testnet difficulty is higher than it was on mainnet when i first mined :p
1224 2013-10-27 17:14:38 <MrDaneelOlivaw> fair enough
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1256 2013-10-27 18:01:12 <dobry-den> sipa: I don't know how personal this question is, but I like how I see the big bitcoin contributors like you in here all time. Is this something you do as a full-time hobby or do you do it alongside $dayjob?
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1264 2013-10-27 18:10:46 <BlueMatt> sipa: seems like there is an issue when running with the "expensive tests"
1265 2013-10-27 18:10:50 <BlueMatt> sipa: if you set that flag to 0 it works
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1278 2013-10-27 18:19:52 <melvster> anyone know if there's any PHP code than can verify any of block headers / merkle trees / tx sigs / scripts ?
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1280 2013-10-27 18:20:37 <BlueMatt> melvster: if it does exist, its yet another weekend reimplementation in $MY_FAVORITE_LANGUAGE
1281 2013-10-27 18:20:46 <BlueMatt> melvster: which I would recommend against using for anything more than parsing
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1283 2013-10-27 18:21:05 <melvster> BlueMatt: so I should dive into the C++ code in the reference client?
1284 2013-10-27 18:21:31 <BlueMatt> there are a few libraries that get decent support
1285 2013-10-27 18:21:35 <jakov> scrypt is slow, even slower in pure python..
1286 2013-10-27 18:21:36 <BlueMatt> bitcoinj does, ummm...
1287 2013-10-27 18:21:39 <BlueMatt> well, I think there's others
1288 2013-10-27 18:21:46 <melvster> ah thanks
1289 2013-10-27 18:21:48 <BlueMatt> or the reference client, which is always best
1290 2013-10-27 18:22:24 <melvster> BlueMatt: so you'd recommend looking at reference client rather than bitcoinj ... for me modularity would be an advantage, so that I could run without dependencies ...
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1293 2013-10-27 18:22:43 <BlueMatt> depends on what you're trying to do
1294 2013-10-27 18:22:46 <sipa> BlueMatt: where do i set that flag?
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1296 2013-10-27 18:22:55 <BlueMatt> if you're gonna go reimplement, thats probably a bad idea
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1298 2013-10-27 18:23:11 <melvster> BlueMatt: im just trying to take some input data and verify that's it's a proper block
1299 2013-10-27 18:23:14 <BlueMatt> sipa: if you're running with make check, find the $(JAVA) lines in Makefile.am and replace the single 1 with a 0
1300 2013-10-27 18:23:18 <BlueMatt> should be like 3rd arg
1301 2013-10-27 18:23:37 <BlueMatt> melvster: best bet: network <-> bitcoind <-> your app
1302 2013-10-27 18:23:46 <BlueMatt> melvster: then let your app call bitcoind for all verification you need
1303 2013-10-27 18:24:08 <melvster> oh that works ... tho id like to be able to translate the code into javascript too ...
1304 2013-10-27 18:24:12 <sipa> heh ok
1305 2013-10-27 18:24:35 <melvster> BlueMatt: thx I'll take a look at both code bases ...
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1307 2013-10-27 18:24:45 * melvster swore id never look at java again! =)
1308 2013-10-27 18:26:09 <melvster> 'The project aims to be easier to understand than the C++ implementation'
1309 2013-10-27 18:26:13 <melvster> nice!
1310 2013-10-27 18:28:03 <BlueMatt> melvster: if you're trying to reimplement things, best to look at the C++ source
1311 2013-10-27 18:28:26 <melvster> BlueMatt: seems so yes, I just wanted an overview ... wow 142 classes in the java!
1312 2013-10-27 18:28:43 <BlueMatt> but really, best to not reimplement things unless you think you can get good uptake and test coverage and lots of eyes
1313 2013-10-27 18:29:24 <BlueMatt> there does exist an implementation in node.js, it could maybe be adapted to regular js
1314 2013-10-27 18:29:36 <melvster> BlueMatt: oh wow ... do you have a pointer to that?
1315 2013-10-27 18:30:21 <BlueMatt> https://github.com/bitcoinjs looks like it hasnt been touched in 6+ months though :(
1316 2013-10-27 18:30:39 <melvster> thank you!
1317 2013-10-27 18:30:43 <BlueMatt> but thats really far too common with bitcoin projects like this
1318 2013-10-27 18:30:54 <BlueMatt> make nice library, little/no use, go away
1319 2013-10-27 18:31:16 <melvster> BlueMatt: yeah I know ... been following crypto currencies for 15 years :)
1320 2013-10-27 18:31:22 <BlueMatt> often with lots of fun bugs hiding
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1322 2013-10-27 18:32:27 <MrDaneelOlivaw> melvster: what's the most complicated valid transaction script you have ever seen ?
1323 2013-10-27 18:32:31 <melvster> oh wait .... that's justmoon ... isnt he working on ripple now?
1324 2013-10-27 18:32:45 <BlueMatt> yes, I believe so
1325 2013-10-27 18:32:53 <melvster> maybe that's why
1326 2013-10-27 18:32:54 <MrDaneelOlivaw> do ripple and mastercoin have *aything* in commong ?
1327 2013-10-27 18:32:55 <melvster> MrDaneelOlivaw: just basic scripts
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1332 2013-10-27 18:43:08 <phantomcircuit> MrDaneelOlivaw, yeah they're both stupid
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1335 2013-10-27 18:46:49 <MrDaneelOlivaw> phantomcircuit: not sure stupid but I don't like them both for some reason
1336 2013-10-27 18:47:07 <MrDaneelOlivaw> it feels to me as an attempt to make money in a dirty way
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1343 2013-10-27 19:04:03 <BlueMatt> sipa: try latest jar
1344 2013-10-27 19:04:05 <BlueMatt> should work now
1345 2013-10-27 19:04:14 <BlueMatt> (revert HEAD on test-script if you want the OP_RETURN test too)
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1352 2013-10-27 19:09:20 <BlueMatt> sipa: also, yea, h2 sucks for bitcoin block db tracking, it works reasonably if you throw it on a tmpfs, otherwise its hella slow
1353 2013-10-27 19:11:10 <phantomcircuit> BlueMatt, h2?
1354 2013-10-27 19:11:30 <BlueMatt> yes, it sucks http://www.h2database.com/html/main.html
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1356 2013-10-27 19:11:38 <BlueMatt> well, ok, it sucks for bitcoin workloads
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1358 2013-10-27 19:13:07 <phantomcircuit> BlueMatt, is that basically an sqlite replacement in java
1359 2013-10-27 19:13:16 <BlueMatt> kinda
1360 2013-10-27 19:13:26 <BlueMatt> native java though
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1363 2013-10-27 19:17:14 <phantomcircuit> BlueMatt, yeah using sql anything to store bitcoin db is a significant performance hit
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1384 2013-10-27 20:00:08 <BlueMatt> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=694863 gnome-calculator returning incorrect results? youre using it wrong
1385 2013-10-27 20:00:15 <BlueMatt> or should I say you're holding it wrong?
1386 2013-10-27 20:00:31 <BlueMatt> and it goes unfixed since february...
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1405 2013-10-27 20:32:24 <HoboCarl> apologies if this is the wrong channel: I'm attempting to compile bitcoin on ubuntu using the guide in the docs: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/blob/master/doc/build-unix.md
1406 2013-10-27 20:33:34 <HoboCarl> I'm at the final "make" command, and getting: *** No fule ot make target 'libmemenv.a'. Stop. For the life of me I can't figure out where this is supposed to come from. I've installed everything listed and more.
1407 2013-10-27 20:33:39 <HoboCarl> file to*
1408 2013-10-27 20:34:38 <BlueMatt> your trying to build master checked out from git?
1409 2013-10-27 20:34:50 <HoboCarl> yep
1410 2013-10-27 20:35:29 <HoboCarl> one caveat: I couldn't get the installation to use libdb4.8.XX, so I used 5.X (said i won't have portable wallet).
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1414 2013-10-27 20:38:41 <sipa> heh, that is strange
1415 2013-10-27 20:38:53 <sipa> HoboCarl: have you built bitcoin before in that directory?
1416 2013-10-27 20:38:59 <sipa> older version, oerhaps?
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1418 2013-10-27 20:39:16 <BlueMatt> if you have no files in that dir that arent in git that you care about, try a git clean -f -x -d and run again
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1420 2013-10-27 20:39:46 <HoboCarl> sipa: first time building
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1422 2013-10-27 20:40:44 <sipa> HoboCarl: try this: cd src/leveldb; make libleveldb.a libmemenv.a; cd ../..
1423 2013-10-27 20:41:21 <sipa> and tell me what happens
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1425 2013-10-27 20:42:23 <HoboCarl> no rule to make target
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1433 2013-10-27 20:45:43 <HoboCarl> im sure it's a dumb-ass thing. I haven't done C++ programming in a long time
1434 2013-10-27 20:46:34 <BlueMatt> yea, there's really no reason there should be anything you can do to break that
1435 2013-10-27 20:48:45 <HoboCarl> this is a fresh install of ubuntu on a virtual machine too
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1439 2013-10-27 20:50:43 <sipa> that really makes no sense
1440 2013-10-27 20:50:53 <sipa> if you type 'git describe', what do you get?
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1442 2013-10-27 20:52:21 <HoboCarl> fatal: No names found, cannot describe anything.
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1444 2013-10-27 20:52:52 <sipa> where did you clone from?
1445 2013-10-27 20:52:58 <HoboCarl> from my fork in github
1446 2013-10-27 20:53:30 <sipa> url?
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1448 2013-10-27 20:54:09 <HoboCarl> https://github.com/HoboCarl/bitcoin-master
1449 2013-10-27 20:54:30 <HoboCarl> 2 commits were nothing, just added and removed something checking if git was working
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1451 2013-10-27 20:55:05 <HoboCarl> should i just nuke the entire thing and re-clone
1452 2013-10-27 20:55:34 <BlueMatt> best bet is to use an actual git clone, ie fork the repo on github if you want a local copy
1453 2013-10-27 20:55:36 <sipa> you didn't fork the bitcoin repository?
1454 2013-10-27 20:55:43 <BlueMatt> or git clone directly from bitcoin/bitcoin and then do stuff with that
1455 2013-10-27 20:55:44 <sipa> you just copied everything?
1456 2013-10-27 20:55:54 <sipa> you're missing the makefile in the leveldb subdir
1457 2013-10-27 20:56:14 <sipa> i suppose because of some gitignore rule
1458 2013-10-27 20:56:39 agnostic98 has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
1459 2013-10-27 20:56:41 <HoboCarl> interesting, ill try and re-clone
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1461 2013-10-27 20:56:48 Application has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
1462 2013-10-27 20:56:55 <sipa> first fork, then close
1463 2013-10-27 20:56:56 rdponticelli_ has quit (Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.)
1464 2013-10-27 20:56:58 <sipa> *clone
1465 2013-10-27 20:58:10 <HoboCarl> oih i see
1466 2013-10-27 20:58:16 <HoboCarl> the fork effed up somehow...
1467 2013-10-27 20:58:26 <sipa> well it's not a fork :)
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1469 2013-10-27 20:58:51 <HoboCarl> what did i do then? for future reference
1470 2013-10-27 20:58:58 <sipa> you just made a copy of bitcoin's tree in the initial commit
1471 2013-10-27 20:59:07 <sipa> forking will preserve history
1472 2013-10-27 20:59:38 <HoboCarl> guess my memory is poort
1473 2013-10-27 20:59:51 <sipa> just delete the github repository, and click "fork this project" or something on bitcoin/bitcoin
1474 2013-10-27 21:00:05 <sipa> it's just "Fork" these days, it seems
1475 2013-10-27 21:01:36 Application has joined
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1477 2013-10-27 21:02:09 <HoboCarl> yeah that's what i thought i did, now doing that, cloning onto machine
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1480 2013-10-27 21:03:57 <sipa> you didn't change anything
1481 2013-10-27 21:04:05 <sipa> oh, sorry
1482 2013-10-27 21:04:15 <sipa> with name 'bitcoin' this time; ok
1483 2013-10-27 21:04:31 <HoboCarl> yeah i should have sanity checked to make sure directories looked the same
1484 2013-10-27 21:06:31 BCBot has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1485 2013-10-27 21:07:13 <HoboCarl> things are actually compiling, i think im in the clear
1486 2013-10-27 21:07:18 <HoboCarl> thanks alot
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1519 2013-10-27 21:42:15 <Ascendion> for the person or persons who asked yesterday -- right now I'm syncing about 15 blocks and all the transactions for those blocks per second
1520 2013-10-27 21:42:40 <Ascendion> estimated time to sync -- 2 weeks -- thats single threaded -- not pulling transactions in parallel
1521 2013-10-27 21:42:47 <sipa> and at which block are you?
1522 2013-10-27 21:43:13 <Ascendion> I just started it a few minutes ago -- about 5k
1523 2013-10-27 21:43:28 <sipa> ok
1524 2013-10-27 21:44:29 coingenuity has joined
1525 2013-10-27 21:44:34 <Ascendion> database writes are taking all most nothing.... reads of the bitcoind db are pushing that drive to near 100%
1526 2013-10-27 21:47:16 dlidstrom has joined
1527 2013-10-27 21:47:38 <Ascendion> with it already disk read bound, I'm wondering if its even work threading up to process transactions in parallel
1528 2013-10-27 21:47:53 <Ascendion> work=worth the work
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1531 2013-10-27 21:50:50 <Ascendion> hmmmm after the 1st 10k blocks, disk read load dropped off signifigantly.... might still be some headroom for performance gains if I fetch transactions in parallel
1532 2013-10-27 21:51:15 agnostic98 has joined
1533 2013-10-27 21:51:33 <Ascendion> blocks/sec is climbing slowly since it got past that initial hump :)
1534 2013-10-27 21:53:17 <Ascendion> not even pushing 50% cpu on 4 cores -- so call it cpu bound on 2 threads since both discs are running under 20%
1535 2013-10-27 21:53:43 <warren> I have a working backport of disablewallet to Bitcoin 0.8.5 now.
1536 2013-10-27 21:53:47 <warren> I need a tester.
1537 2013-10-27 21:53:48 <Luke-Jr> Ascendion: it'd be a few minutes if you just parsed it :P
1538 2013-10-27 21:54:13 <Ascendion> parsed it from what with what library ??
1539 2013-10-27 21:54:36 asuk is now known as asuk|afk
1540 2013-10-27 21:54:57 <Luke-Jr> blk*.dat, with fopen and fread
1541 2013-10-27 21:55:38 asuk is now known as afk!~asuk@31.129.27.89|asuk
1542 2013-10-27 21:55:58 <Ascendion> looking at blk00002.dat now -- binary mishmash -- link spec ??
1543 2013-10-27 21:56:24 <sipa> it's just a concatenation of blocks in network format
1544 2013-10-27 21:56:25 <Ascendion> I thought those were levelDB files ??
1545 2013-10-27 21:56:29 <Luke-Jr> https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Protocol_specification
1546 2013-10-27 21:56:31 <sipa> no
1547 2013-10-27 21:56:40 <sipa> it's just the blocks, not a database
1548 2013-10-27 21:56:48 <sipa> blocks/index contains a database
1549 2013-10-27 21:56:53 <sipa> and chainstate contains a database
1550 2013-10-27 21:57:56 <debiantoruser> Greetings, Where is such site, you can browse transaction, like a bubbles ---> Hop other Two bubbles --> Hop another three bubbles. I can't remember URL, could somebody HELP ME!?
1551 2013-10-27 21:58:16 <Luke-Jr> http://codepad.org/qA0gVabi <-- old, but does basically what linearize does faster
1552 2013-10-27 21:58:48 <Luke-Jr> debiantoruser: blockchain.info has something like that
1553 2013-10-27 22:00:28 <Ascendion> that code would do just for blocks though it doesnt fully extract all the info in the block, just gets the bytes.. doesnt do a thing for the transactions
1554 2013-10-27 22:00:52 <Luke-Jr> you could add that
1555 2013-10-27 22:01:20 <Ascendion> and doesnt do a thing for handling realtime updates once the current best chain is synced
1556 2013-10-27 22:01:33 <sipa> you really want a p2p client
1557 2013-10-27 22:01:37 <Luke-Jr> same thing works on the network
1558 2013-10-27 22:02:04 <sipa> but if all you have is the rpc interface, it's going to be hugely inefficient
1559 2013-10-27 22:02:07 <sipa> but possible
1560 2013-10-27 22:02:20 <Ascendion> yup -- up to almost 20 blocks/sec now
1561 2013-10-27 22:02:28 <Luke-Jr> Ascendion: https://gitorious.org/bitcoin/luke-jrs-supybot-btcmonitor/
1562 2013-10-27 22:02:34 <Ascendion> (average since start -- its still climbing)
1563 2013-10-27 22:04:05 debiantoruser has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
1564 2013-10-27 22:05:16 <Ascendion> hell I could prolly speed it up a lot just disabling the debug outputs
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1568 2013-10-27 22:06:40 <debiantoruser> Luke-Jr, could you provide me with full url, I have already browse the whole site, I can't remember place where I have meet this visualisation bubbles.
1569 2013-10-27 22:06:48 <debiantoruser> I have trouble with connection
1570 2013-10-27 22:06:50 <debiantoruser> sorry
1571 2013-10-27 22:06:52 <Luke-Jr> debiantoruser: no.
1572 2013-10-27 22:07:20 <debiantoruser> So, i'm looking for site like Luke-Jr
1573 2013-10-27 22:07:27 <sipa> Luke-Jr is not a site
1574 2013-10-27 22:07:29 <debiantoruser> like https://blockchain.info/
1575 2013-10-27 22:07:30 <Luke-Jr> LOL
1576 2013-10-27 22:07:50 <debiantoruser> copy&past lag
1577 2013-10-27 22:07:55 <sipa> :)
1578 2013-10-27 22:09:13 <debiantoruser> Such bubble in the left center, you click on it and all of transaction apper in the center like another bubbles with cypher, click on any other bubble and next bubbles appear in right side ... etc
1579 2013-10-27 22:09:37 <phantomcircuit> sipa, im looking at adding the hash to key entries in the wallet, is there anything i need to lookout for in doing that?
1580 2013-10-27 22:09:39 <debiantoruser> Nobody meet such site? It was really great i lost the url ):
1581 2013-10-27 22:10:30 <Ascendion> just pulling 2 debug statements pushed the initial rate up over 35 blocks/sec
1582 2013-10-27 22:11:03 <phantomcircuit> Ascendion, the debugging stuff is hilariously expensive now
1583 2013-10-27 22:11:47 <SomeoneWeird> such bubble
1584 2013-10-27 22:12:07 <phantomcircuit> SomeoneWeird, #bitcoin-nonsense
1585 2013-10-27 22:12:08 <phantomcircuit> kthx
1586 2013-10-27 22:12:22 <SomeoneWeird> <debiantoruser> Such bubble in the left center
1587 2013-10-27 22:12:26 <Ascendion> yup -- I could probably save a ton more pushing the trace data that gets logged to the console to my service bus and run up an app that watches the bus for trace data -- decouple it into 2 threads :)
1588 2013-10-27 22:12:27 * SomeoneWeird slaps phantomcircuit
1589 2013-10-27 22:12:33 * phantomcircuit slaps SomeoneWeird
1590 2013-10-27 22:12:39 <phantomcircuit> oh god what have i done
1591 2013-10-27 22:12:42 * phantomcircuit waits for the cops
1592 2013-10-27 22:12:47 <SomeoneWeird> fkin assult
1593 2013-10-27 22:12:52 <SomeoneWeird> assault i cant even spell right
1594 2013-10-27 22:13:03 * Luke-Jr sics his cat on phantomcircuit
1595 2013-10-27 22:13:08 <phantomcircuit> Luke-Jr, wat
1596 2013-10-27 22:13:44 <sipa> is it a cat5?
1597 2013-10-27 22:13:47 <debiantoruser> SomeoneWeird, bubble in the left center
1598 2013-10-27 22:13:56 <phantomcircuit> Ascendion, ideal there would be a lock free queue passing printf messages to another thread that sends them to the debug file
1599 2013-10-27 22:13:57 <SomeoneWeird> ur a bubble
1600 2013-10-27 22:14:08 <phantomcircuit> but that's so much effort
1601 2013-10-27 22:14:11 <Ascendion> Luke-Jr -- what kinda cat ?? fully mature bengal tiger ?? :)
1602 2013-10-27 22:14:12 <debiantoruser> click on this buble and you get all of transaction in anotehr bubbles in the middle
1603 2013-10-27 22:15:11 HoboCarl has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
1604 2013-10-27 22:15:20 <SomeoneWeird> cool
1605 2013-10-27 22:15:23 <sipa> phantomcircuit: my first reaction is "meh, we should change the key storage altogether"
1606 2013-10-27 22:15:23 <SomeoneWeird> story
1607 2013-10-27 22:15:29 <Luke-Jr> Ascendion: 2 month old tabby
1608 2013-10-27 22:15:38 <Luke-Jr> cat6
1609 2013-10-27 22:15:52 <Ascendion> better get more cats and throw all of them at phantomcircuit :)
1610 2013-10-27 22:15:52 <sipa> phantomcircuit: so metadata, keypoolinfo and key data are all in the same entry
1611 2013-10-27 22:15:57 <SomeoneWeird> catabby2
1612 2013-10-27 22:16:08 <sipa> how is babby formed?
1613 2013-10-27 22:16:28 <SomeoneWeird> from a moose
1614 2013-10-27 22:16:47 * sipa should probably not participate in nonsense here while also talking about actual development
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1616 2013-10-27 22:17:11 <phantomcircuit> sipa, i know but that's been a thing we should do for a while now
1617 2013-10-27 22:17:19 <SomeoneWeird> and it never happens
1618 2013-10-27 22:17:21 <phantomcircuit> this is a relatively easy evolutionary change
1619 2013-10-27 22:17:48 <Luke-Jr> how long until we see the first bot that works for its own bitcoin and pays for its own hosting and maintenance?
1620 2013-10-27 22:17:49 <SomeoneWeird> lol evolution
1621 2013-10-27 22:17:51 * SomeoneWeird runs
1622 2013-10-27 22:18:01 <SomeoneWeird> Luke-Jr, skynet
1623 2013-10-27 22:18:05 * SomeoneWeird goes back to actual work
1624 2013-10-27 22:18:22 <BlueMatt> Luke-Jr: when jgarzik decides its legal and has tons of free time to buidl it
1625 2013-10-27 22:18:34 <Luke-Jr> lol, is there a legal concern?
1626 2013-10-27 22:18:40 btcbtc has joined
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1628 2013-10-27 22:18:47 <Luke-Jr> bootstrapping it would probably actually be pretty easy
1629 2013-10-27 22:18:47 <BlueMatt> to jgarzik there is
1630 2013-10-27 22:19:02 btcbtc has joined
1631 2013-10-27 22:19:03 <BlueMatt> and realistically the bootstrapper is on the hook for what it does
1632 2013-10-27 22:19:11 <BlueMatt> so you could get fucked
1633 2013-10-27 22:19:18 <Luke-Jr> it just needs to have code to solicit/bug for funds, and explain to others what it wants to pay them to do
1634 2013-10-27 22:19:31 <Luke-Jr> which in a bootstrap would be "improve my code"
1635 2013-10-27 22:19:54 <Luke-Jr> BlueMatt: think sO?
1636 2013-10-27 22:20:42 neep3r has joined
1637 2013-10-27 22:21:15 <Luke-Jr> I suppose improvements would need to be paid off of funds raised by the modified version; and let the inferior/failure versions die of starvation
1638 2013-10-27 22:22:20 <phantomcircuit> Luke-Jr, there's so much potential for scamming the bot though
1639 2013-10-27 22:22:40 <Luke-Jr> phantomcircuit: maybe
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1647 2013-10-27 22:28:16 <Ascendion> ohh come on -- if its earning coins and you do the AI code scalable packaged in a docker it shouldnt be hard to have the bot deploy itself to amazon and azure virtual machines so its brain power grows according to its income
1648 2013-10-27 22:30:06 <debiantoruser> SomeoneWeird, something like that https://github.com/thallium205/BitcoinVisualizer
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1651 2013-10-27 22:31:08 <Ascendion> ok -- time to look at multithreading this -- its peaking at 32 blocks/sec and barely touching the disk
1652 2013-10-27 22:33:31 patcon has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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1654 2013-10-27 22:34:25 <debiantoruser> Thank you
1655 2013-10-27 22:34:34 <debiantoruser> Luke-Jr, you are right, there is https://blockchain.info/ru/tree/92380527
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1660 2013-10-27 22:43:37 <Luke-Jr> BlueMatt: "industrial accident"
1661 2013-10-27 22:43:42 rdymac_ has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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1665 2013-10-27 22:48:01 <BlueMatt> Luke-Jr: judges have common sense...
1666 2013-10-27 22:49:15 <phantomcircuit> Ascendion, how are you going to pay amazon or azure?
1667 2013-10-27 22:49:22 <phantomcircuit> you need someone accepting bitcoins obviously
1668 2013-10-27 22:52:40 murkmans has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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1670 2013-10-27 22:58:10 <Luke-Jr> BlueMatt: common sense doesn't say to blame a man for the actions of an independently acting program
1671 2013-10-27 22:59:08 <BlueMatt> Luke-Jr: common sense says if you build something, you're responsible for what it does...that includes taking appropriate steps to fix it if its doing something illegal...
1672 2013-10-27 22:59:27 <Luke-Jr> BlueMatt: you can't fix an autonomous AI
1673 2013-10-27 22:59:59 <Luke-Jr> and no, common sense does not say you are responsible for the actions of things you build
1674 2013-10-27 23:00:02 <BlueMatt> if you can convince a judge to see it that way, Ill pay tou 100 BTC
1675 2013-10-27 23:00:04 <Luke-Jr> that's like blaming guns for murder
1676 2013-10-27 23:00:15 <Luke-Jr> and trying to lock of the guys who made it
1677 2013-10-27 23:00:26 <gmaxwell> #bitcoin-{not dev}
1678 2013-10-27 23:00:52 rdymac_ has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1679 2013-10-27 23:01:01 <gmaxwell> (wizards would be good for autonoymous agents)
1680 2013-10-27 23:01:42 bitRipperX has joined
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1682 2013-10-27 23:02:25 <HM2> Luke-Jr, what is Supybot?
1683 2013-10-27 23:02:50 <Luke-Jr> â¦
1684 2013-10-27 23:03:37 <HM2> :S
1685 2013-10-27 23:03:54 saulimus has quit (Quit: saulimus)
1686 2013-10-27 23:04:33 <HM2> oh an IRC bot
1687 2013-10-27 23:05:31 <HM2> i should have googled that independently of btcmonitor
1688 2013-10-27 23:06:35 <Zarutian> Luke-Jr: interesting take on that philosophical question.
1689 2013-10-27 23:07:15 <warren> https://github.com/wtogami/bitcoin/commits/btc-0.8.5-disablewallet Disable Wallet for Bitcoin 0.8.5
1690 2013-10-27 23:08:13 <warren> yes, it includes lots of unnecessary stuff, partly to minimize the diff from 0.9's disablewallet, partly because I am adding more features to that branch
1691 2013-10-27 23:08:17 asuk has quit ()
1692 2013-10-27 23:12:06 <Luke-Jr> interesting, apparently electric companies can profile miners based on the power drop on new blocks
1693 2013-10-27 23:12:11 <Luke-Jr> (brief)
1694 2013-10-27 23:12:35 neep3r has joined
1695 2013-10-27 23:13:04 <warren> profile?
1696 2013-10-27 23:13:28 <Apocalyptic> identify
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1698 2013-10-27 23:13:37 <HM2> if they're trying hard enough you can do it from the street and watch the lights flicker
1699 2013-10-27 23:14:02 <warren> Luke-Jr: you mean because miners pause to switch work instead of hash worthlessly?
1700 2013-10-27 23:14:13 <warren> (that property causes my GPU's to crash...)
1701 2013-10-27 23:14:38 <Luke-Jr> yes
1702 2013-10-27 23:14:40 <warren> conman refuses to add fake work when work is not yet available, which causes some GPU's to crash
1703 2013-10-27 23:15:12 <warren> I haven't tried bfgminer for a while to see if it's any better.
1704 2013-10-27 23:15:23 <Luke-Jr> unlikely, I don't actively maintain the scrypt stuff
1705 2013-10-27 23:15:32 <Luke-Jr> maybe you can convince someone you know to
1706 2013-10-27 23:15:52 <warren> it seems scrypt is moving into FPGA and ASIC's soon
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1728 2013-10-27 23:45:40 <sipa> BlueMatt: maybe change your pulltester-enable pullreq to disable those expensive tests?
1729 2013-10-27 23:46:18 <BlueMatt> sipa: no, it needs them, just need a tmpfs and then it wont timeout and should pass
1730 2013-10-27 23:46:26 <BlueMatt> well, ok, it could skip them
1731 2013-10-27 23:46:28 <BlueMatt> but...yuck
1732 2013-10-27 23:47:03 <sipa> the qa directory needs to be a tmpfs, or where does it store stuff?
1733 2013-10-27 23:47:24 reneg has joined
1734 2013-10-27 23:47:46 <BlueMatt> qa/tmp
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1737 2013-10-27 23:51:31 Centaure has left ()
1738 2013-10-27 23:54:15 <sipa> BlueMatt: can i be lazy and ask what "post-b1001 repeated transaction generator N/100" completed processing" means?
1739 2013-10-27 23:54:25 <sipa> what kind of blocks/transactions it's constructing?
1740 2013-10-27 23:55:29 <sipa> on a tmpfs it does seem to work indeed
1741 2013-10-27 23:55:58 <BlueMatt> sipa: its creating blocks with lots of txn to trigger that bdb-lock bug thinggy
1742 2013-10-27 23:56:03 <BlueMatt> the exact types I dont remember
1743 2013-10-27 23:56:10 <sipa> ic
1744 2013-10-27 23:56:24 <BlueMatt> or...something
1745 2013-10-27 23:56:56 dgolds has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1746 2013-10-27 23:59:09 CircusPeanut has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
1747 2013-10-27 23:59:30 dgolds has joined