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  69 2013-11-22 01:18:04 <robbak> How do I get the configure script to recognise system ssl on FreeBSD?
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  80 2013-11-22 01:25:21 <andytoshi> robbak: is SSL in a weird path?
  81 2013-11-22 01:25:35 <andytoshi> you can do, for example
  82 2013-11-22 01:25:38 <andytoshi> ./configure --with-openssl=/usr/local/ssl/
  83 2013-11-22 01:25:42 <andytoshi> which is what i had to do for fedora..
  84 2013-11-22 01:26:10 Application has joined
  85 2013-11-22 01:26:21 <andytoshi> if that doesn't work, check out config.log to see how it's failing
  86 2013-11-22 01:27:21 <robbak> No, only in /usr/lib/libssl.a. It's just that the script uses pkg-config, and ssl is not a added package, it's part of the system.
  87 2013-11-22 01:27:45 <robbak> I'l try --with-openssl, though.
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  96 2013-11-22 01:38:02 <robbak> andytoshi: hmm. --with-openssl is just rejected as an 'unrecognized option'. No change.
  97 2013-11-22 01:39:57 <andytoshi> really?
  98 2013-11-22 01:40:03 <andytoshi> one sec..
  99 2013-11-22 01:40:28 <robbak> This is with current git, by the way.
 100 2013-11-22 01:40:32 <andytoshi> i'll be damned, i must've been thinking of a different project..
 101 2013-11-22 01:40:37 <andytoshi> sorry,
 102 2013-11-22 01:40:53 <robbak> No worries. Thanks anyway.
 103 2013-11-22 01:40:54 <andytoshi> you might try LIBS=/usr/lib ./configure
 104 2013-11-22 01:41:00 <andytoshi> but /usr/lib is a standard directory
 105 2013-11-22 01:41:06 <andytoshi> so i think this is not a paths problem
 106 2013-11-22 01:41:21 <robbak> It's trying to find it using pkg-config. That doesn't work, because it's not a package.
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 108 2013-11-22 01:41:24 <andytoshi> oh, i see, i missed that
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 111 2013-11-22 01:42:15 <andytoshi> SSL_LIBS="-lssl -lcrypto" ./configure maybe
 112 2013-11-22 01:42:44 <andytoshi> four variables to set are, SSL_CFLAGS SSL_LIBS CRYPTO_CFLAGS CRYPTO_LIBS
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 114 2013-11-22 01:43:09 <robbak> OK. I'll try that.
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 132 2013-11-22 01:54:44 <lachesis> is there a bug for improving bitcoin's history download to use multiple peers?
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 134 2013-11-22 01:56:32 <gmaxwell> lachesis: thats the headers first pull. it's planned for 0.9.
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 136 2013-11-22 01:57:11 <lachesis> gmaxwell, ty
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 138 2013-11-22 01:57:37 <lachesis> gmaxwell, https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/2964?source=cc ?
 139 2013-11-22 01:58:18 <gmaxwell> lachesis: yea.
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 154 2013-11-22 02:11:32 <robbak> andytoshi; found it. I need to set
 155 2013-11-22 02:11:33 <robbak> CRYPTO_LIBS
 156 2013-11-22 02:11:35 <robbak> CRYPTO_CFLAGS
 157 2013-11-22 02:11:36 <robbak> SSL_LIBS
 158 2013-11-22 02:11:38 <robbak> SSL_CFLAGS
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 160 2013-11-22 02:12:31 <robbak> I'll have to work out what to set those CFLAGS to.
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 163 2013-11-22 02:12:57 <mappum> how long is the longest blockchain fork so far?
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 165 2013-11-22 02:13:37 <Luke-Jr> 100 or so?
 166 2013-11-22 02:14:11 <mappum> oh, was that the one caused by compatibility issues in a btcoin-qt version?
 167 2013-11-22 02:14:57 <andytoshi> robbak: cool, probably just -I/usr/include/ssl
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 169 2013-11-22 02:16:10 <Luke-Jr> mappum: that was before bitcoin-qt
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 198 2013-11-22 02:43:14 <gmaxwell> BlueMatt: WTF! https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/3301 :P
 199 2013-11-22 02:43:17 <gmaxwell> why did that pass?
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 201 2013-11-22 02:44:57 <BlueMatt> hah, nice
 202 2013-11-22 02:45:15 <gmaxwell> I'm bummed, it would have been great if the bot rejected it.
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 204 2013-11-22 02:45:23 <BlueMatt> because pull-tester sucks?
 205 2013-11-22 02:46:10 <BlueMatt> yea, I have to admit, Im kinda surprised that test-case isnt in there
 206 2013-11-22 02:46:26 <BlueMatt> but, hell, we've always known pull-tester sucks, just more proof :p
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 211 2013-11-22 02:50:00 <Luke-Jr> gmaxwell: because it's essentially a no-op
 212 2013-11-22 02:50:10 <Luke-Jr> gmaxwell: MAX_MONEY is only used for some stupid light value checking
 213 2013-11-22 02:50:14 <Luke-Jr> not for anything important
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 336 2013-11-22 05:37:06 <BlueMattBot> Project Bitcoin build #471: FAILURE in 44 min: http://jenkins.bluematt.me/job/Bitcoin/471/
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 357 2013-11-22 06:04:34 <dexX7> hey, is "[datajunk] OP_DROP" for some reason not allowed? my tx are decoded properly, also signed, but rejected when i try to push them..
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 370 2013-11-22 06:18:30 <dexX7> also an output with only OP_TRUE..
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 427 2013-11-22 07:42:20 <pZombie> test
 428 2013-11-22 07:42:30 <pZombie> Anyone there?
 429 2013-11-22 07:45:33 <tgs3> pZombie: no, just you and 443 zombie
 430 2013-11-22 07:45:49 <tgs3> including 2 zombieops
 431 2013-11-22 07:45:56 <pZombie> :>
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 433 2013-11-22 07:48:07 <bitspill> gribble isn't going to answer any questiosn though
 434 2013-11-22 07:48:21 <bitspill> unless you know how to talk right to it
 435 2013-11-22 07:48:35 <bitspill> ;;gribble
 436 2013-11-22 07:48:35 <gribble> yes I am gribble. why do you keep bothering me?
 437 2013-11-22 07:48:48 rdymac has joined
 438 2013-11-22 07:48:56 <pZombie> ;;8ball are there more than 2 people alive in this chat?
 439 2013-11-22 07:48:57 <gribble> Of course.
 440 2013-11-22 07:49:50 <pZombie> Anyway, just wanted to ask if there is a thinkable method to split the work on a single block between miners, in a way that would allow to decentralize the network by allowing everyone to solo mine
 441 2013-11-22 07:50:32 <pZombie> without compromising security
 442 2013-11-22 07:50:56 <bitspill> pZombie, only think I could think of is: reduce difficulty and reduce the block reward similarly
 443 2013-11-22 07:51:14 <bitspill> pZombie, then more blocks would be found but coins would dispense at the same rate
 444 2013-11-22 07:51:15 <pZombie> no, that would lower security i think
 445 2013-11-22 07:52:02 <pZombie> yes, i already thought about your method, but i was not sure if that would lower security
 446 2013-11-22 07:52:21 <pZombie> are you saying that with lower difficulty the bitcoin would remain just as secure?
 447 2013-11-22 07:52:45 <bitspill> dunno, but that is basically the entire discussion over altcoins with a fast block time
 448 2013-11-22 07:52:50 <pZombie> if so, a dynamically adjusting block reward, rather than difficulty adjusting, would make more sense to me
 449 2013-11-22 07:53:06 <gavinandresen> pZombie: you're about to reinvent p2pool, I think
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 451 2013-11-22 07:54:20 <bitspill> hey, the 8ball didn't lie to us ;)
 452 2013-11-22 07:54:21 <pZombie> damn, i think you are right
 453 2013-11-22 07:54:40 <pZombie> except, p2pool is on it's "own" network
 454 2013-11-22 07:56:40 <wumpus> yes, p2pool is great, it should be used more
 455 2013-11-22 07:57:03 <iwilcox> With CPUs though?  I think that's where pZombie is going with this.
 456 2013-11-22 07:58:35 <pZombie> i think the reason why p2pool is not used more, is because it's not so easy for people to set it up properly
 457 2013-11-22 07:59:21 <pZombie> also, the client could possibly build several p2pool networks automatically, and merge enough miners together that are close to each other
 458 2013-11-22 07:59:24 <JyZyXEL> wumpus: sadly, centralized services are still what most of people use because they feel more familiar
 459 2013-11-22 08:00:22 Thepok has joined
 460 2013-11-22 08:00:31 <wumpus> JyZyXEL: sure, that's why I said 'should', at least to make the network more decentralized, but yes it appears people are ok with a more centralized network 
 461 2013-11-22 08:01:19 <pZombie> you have to force people to decentralize it. Not everyone is in for the good of bitcoin, but many are in just for the quick buck
 462 2013-11-22 08:01:23 <JyZyXEL> it's the traditional way of doing things that we've all gotten so used to, decentralization is still not well understood by the masses
 463 2013-11-22 08:01:25 <wumpus> the only way I see it changing is if big mining pools start to misbehave
 464 2013-11-22 08:01:46 <Luke-Jr> better if the big pools adopt decentralised mining
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 466 2013-11-22 08:02:31 <wumpus> pZombie: I don't think the point is to force people to do anything :)
 467 2013-11-22 08:02:39 <pZombie> yes it is
 468 2013-11-22 08:03:04 <pZombie> if your currency relies on the goodwill of people and people not being greedy, you are dreaming
 469 2013-11-22 08:03:22 <pZombie> you might as well ditch it from the beginning
 470 2013-11-22 08:03:24 <wumpus> it's too big anyhow to be forced anything by anyone
 471 2013-11-22 08:03:42 <Luke-Jr> pZombie: you can't force it
 472 2013-11-22 08:03:59 <Luke-Jr> if you break centralised pools, people will just go all cex.io
 473 2013-11-22 08:06:23 CodeShark has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
 474 2013-11-22 08:06:57 <pZombie> yes, i guess it's just too convenient for people just to fire up cgminer with name being the payout address and start mining instantly, without having to care about setting up a node that connects to p2pool, downloading the whole chain and whatnot
 475 2013-11-22 08:07:19 <JyZyXEL> i wonder if satoshi realized we would be building centralized mining on top of his nice decentralized system
 476 2013-11-22 08:08:43 <pZombie> so if you really want people to join decentralized mining, it would have to be a one button push
 477 2013-11-22 08:08:48 <pZombie> not sure if that is doable
 478 2013-11-22 08:11:04 <pZombie> and not sure if it is doable for the client to match up the various nodes into many little p2pool networks, refusing to let in nodes with too high hashrate, adjusting dynamically as new better ASICs come out
 479 2013-11-22 08:11:47 yubrew_ has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 480 2013-11-22 08:12:18 <pZombie> like checking for the hashrate first, then match various IPs that are relatively close to each other in a p2pool with about 10-50 TH each
 481 2013-11-22 08:12:55 <pZombie> if someone comes in with a single IP having over 5 TH, he won't be allowed in, until tech advances
 482 2013-11-22 08:13:43 <petertodd> pZombie: in summary it appears that it is possible to create *a* crypto-currency system where all activities can be "sharded" such that only a relatively-bandwidth connection is required for any one node, but research is ongoing...
 483 2013-11-22 08:14:14 <Luke-Jr> pZombie: it's doable, so long as they have a full node
 484 2013-11-22 08:14:23 djcoin has joined
 485 2013-11-22 08:14:58 <petertodd> pZombie: here's an very simple example: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=88208.msg2445569#msg2445569
 486 2013-11-22 08:15:09 <Luke-Jr> pZombie: when I finally get the time, I'm going to make BFGMiner implement GBT completely, so it gets transactions etc from local bitcoind, and still coordinates with a pool server
 487 2013-11-22 08:15:23 <Luke-Jr> which is as decentralised as p2pool as far as bitcoin is concerned
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 490 2013-11-22 08:19:32 <pZombie> good to know you guys are working on such stuff
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 493 2013-11-22 08:20:20 <pZombie> and there are actually some nice people in the bitcoin community still, being honorable
 494 2013-11-22 08:20:43 <petertodd> pZombie: thanks, though it's going to take a long time to turn it into something concrete - even the analysis of the current system is still very immature
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 503 2013-11-22 08:26:58 <petertodd> Luke-Jr: does eligius have logs with timestamps for when work was pushed to specific hashers?
 504 2013-11-22 08:27:13 <Luke-Jr> petertodd: not long-term
 505 2013-11-22 08:27:37 <Luke-Jr> that'd get *way* too big :/
 506 2013-11-22 08:28:09 <Luke-Jr> even with stratum, that's every 55 seconds
 507 2013-11-22 08:28:16 <petertodd> Luke-Jr: ah, but you do have them for a short period of time? might be interesting to figure out the distribution, especially the minimums, of the delta t between when work is pushed out, and you get a new share from a miner
 508 2013-11-22 08:28:29 <Luke-Jr> petertodd: maybe
 509 2013-11-22 08:28:45 <Luke-Jr> minimums are 0 of course
 510 2013-11-22 08:29:00 <Luke-Jr> + network latency
 511 2013-11-22 08:29:15 <petertodd> Luke-Jr: + miner hardware and software latency
 512 2013-11-22 08:29:29 <Luke-Jr> which is often insignificant
 513 2013-11-22 08:30:14 <petertodd> Luke-Jr: I'm not so sure it is actually...
 514 2013-11-22 08:30:26 <petertodd> Luke-Jr: but anyway, good to know you have it
 515 2013-11-22 08:30:40 <Luke-Jr> we couldn't expire old work without it :p
 516 2013-11-22 08:30:51 <petertodd> Luke-Jr: ah, good point
 517 2013-11-22 08:32:06 asa1024 has joined
 518 2013-11-22 08:33:55 <petertodd> Luke-Jr: the thing is it's a consideration in the analysis I was doing of expected return for blocks - my analysis is really missing states and a second latency constant because of it, although it might actually make the model more simple rather than less
 519 2013-11-22 08:34:40 bitspill has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
 520 2013-11-22 08:35:31 <Luke-Jr> petertodd: BFL and Bitfury chips can't stop work
 521 2013-11-22 08:35:54 <petertodd> Luke-Jr: so that gives them, what, 1s latency minimum or something?
 522 2013-11-22 08:36:00 <Luke-Jr> older KnC images had some delay changing work too
 523 2013-11-22 08:36:03 <Luke-Jr> depends on hashrate
 524 2013-11-22 08:36:08 <Luke-Jr> those are the only major dissidents from changing work quickly, I think
 525 2013-11-22 08:36:27 <petertodd> Luke-Jr: I thought even the ASIC BFL's were internally comprised of a bunch of chips that individually can't stop work
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 528 2013-11-22 08:36:50 <Luke-Jr> petertodd: this is true, but BFL-based devices always split work across them
 529 2013-11-22 08:37:03 <Luke-Jr> also true of bitfury
 530 2013-11-22 08:37:19 <petertodd> Luke-Jr: oh! so they give the chips different parts of the nonce-range?
 531 2013-11-22 08:37:22 <Luke-Jr> yes
 532 2013-11-22 08:37:34 <Luke-Jr> Chili (BFL-based) splits it across 8 chips
 533 2013-11-22 08:38:52 eristisk has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
 534 2013-11-22 08:38:54 <Polyatomic> have you got some of those luke . Is it true they mine really efficiently on p2pool
 535 2013-11-22 08:39:38 <petertodd> Luke-Jr: see, in section 3.2 of https://people.xiph.org/~greg/peter_todd_mining_ev.pdf state 2 is the miner finds another block prior to full propagation, but if t_miner ~= t_prop that can't happen
 536 2013-11-22 08:39:51 yubrew_ has joined
 537 2013-11-22 08:40:38 <Luke-Jr> Polyatomic: I would imagine so
 538 2013-11-22 08:40:39 <petertodd> Luke-Jr: however, state 3, particularly 3.1, still can happen
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 541 2013-11-22 08:55:34 <Luke-Jr> my whole USB subsystem died :<
 542 2013-11-22 08:55:40 * Luke-Jr stabs Linux for not being more stable
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 546 2013-11-22 08:56:42 <tgs3> Luke-Jr: does unplugging eth cable fix it?
 547 2013-11-22 08:56:57 <Luke-Jr> tgs3: eth? why would it?
 548 2013-11-22 08:57:05 <tgs3> I seen such a bug
 549 2013-11-22 08:57:09 <Luke-Jr> O.o
 550 2013-11-22 08:57:25 <tgs3> so, does it?
 551 2013-11-22 08:57:33 <Luke-Jr> no
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 579 2013-11-22 09:41:07 <sipa> dexX7: that's a non standard script, which is valid in a block but won't be relayed on its own or accepted into memory pools
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 583 2013-11-22 09:42:39 <sipa> dexX7: there is a more modern mechanism (using an op_return output) that you can use, but really: ask yourself whether it's really necessary to store data
 584 2013-11-22 09:43:07 <dexX7> ah thanks. i was just playing around to get a better understanding. :)
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 590 2013-11-22 09:45:31 <dexX7> it appears that eligius broadcasted one of the tx with OP_DROP
 591 2013-11-22 09:48:03 n0g4n0o has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
 592 2013-11-22 09:48:35 <dexX7> i'm unable to sign a tx that tries to redeem the output with signrawtransaction though ... tx: https://blockchain.info/tx/48e7694b3de213e2ab36cfcfaaa3013a22e1a5dc28168772cb01be99f91a12fa
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 605 2013-11-22 10:00:17 <stonecoldpat> guys to run stuff like autogen.sh on mac (to start building bitcoin) - what package did you install?
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 610 2013-11-22 10:03:56 <TD> stonecoldpat: autotools
 611 2013-11-22 10:06:23 <robbak> It's parts, or all, or the autotools package.
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 638 2013-11-22 10:33:23 tommygunner has joined
 639 2013-11-22 10:36:25 <tommygunner> can i make the client tell me the transaction size instead of suggesting i pay X fee?
 640 2013-11-22 10:37:51 Nesetalis has joined
 641 2013-11-22 10:38:06 <warren> tommygunner: use Bitcoin 0.8.5 OMG3 (with Coin Control that tells you the tx size before sending)
 642 2013-11-22 10:38:29 <tommygunner> hm. weird clients
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 644 2013-11-22 10:38:45 <wumpus> indeed, with coin control (will also be in 0.9) you can
 645 2013-11-22 10:39:27 <tommygunner> i guess thats what i need to use then
 646 2013-11-22 10:39:58 <tommygunner> i hope that client can just use the blockchain files of original Qt?
 647 2013-11-22 10:41:02 <wumpus> yes
 648 2013-11-22 10:41:33 <wumpus> it is the original bitcoin-qt with a few extra patches
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 650 2013-11-22 10:42:16 <tommygunner> doing a little bit of consolidation
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 652 2013-11-22 10:42:44 <tommygunner> so i guess the OMG client works with the free transaction relay policy?
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 657 2013-11-22 10:51:41 <tommygunner> except if Luke-Jr banned that client :P
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 724 2013-11-22 12:31:39 <acidhacker> Hi bitcoin hackers! I'm building on OSX with homebrew and my configure step fails with 'no working boost sleep implementation found'.
 725 2013-11-22 12:31:55 <acidhacker> This seems to happen because boost include dirs are not set when calling AC_TRY_LINK (in configure.ac)
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 727 2013-11-22 12:32:30 <acidhacker> adding the BOOST_INCLUDES to the CPPFLAGS solves the problem
 728 2013-11-22 12:32:32 <acidhacker> CPPFLAGS="$CPPFLAGS $BOOST_CPPFLAGS"
 729 2013-11-22 12:33:29 <acidhacker> is it a good idea to do this in configure.ac ?
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 732 2013-11-22 12:36:08 <wumpus> acidhacker: see https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/3003
 733 2013-11-22 12:36:21 <Luke-Jr> acidhacker: added to https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/3242
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 735 2013-11-22 12:37:05 <acidhacker> yes, that is it
 736 2013-11-22 12:38:20 <Luke-Jr> guess there's a bit of overlap >_<
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 743 2013-11-22 12:44:58 <acidhacker> Luke, your solution fixes ./configure, but then make fails:
 744 2013-11-22 12:45:04 <acidhacker> ./allocators.h:13:10: fatal error: 'boost/thread/mutex.hpp' file not found
 745 2013-11-22 12:45:04 <acidhacker> #include <boost/thread/mutex.hpp>
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 747 2013-11-22 12:45:51 <acidhacker> I guess boost include paths are not added anywhere else.
 748 2013-11-22 12:46:02 <acidhacker> (and they're not in my system path)
 749 2013-11-22 12:46:04 <Luke-Jr> acidhacker: did you try the actual branch, or just that one change?
 750 2013-11-22 12:46:12 <acidhacker> just that one change
 751 2013-11-22 12:46:50 <acidhacker> let me try the branch
 752 2013-11-22 12:47:45 <Luke-Jr> acidhacker: I just pushed an update to it - try that
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 755 2013-11-22 12:50:28 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|Interesting -- I accidentally left my node running overnight (forgot my laptop was on)
 756 2013-11-22 12:50:48 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|I've got 50 connections, of which 19 are tor (127.0.0.1)
 757 2013-11-22 12:54:29 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|31 peers on 0.8.5, 5 each on 0.8.1 and 0.8.3, 2 each on 0.8.2.2 (?) and "" (?!?), and one each of the relay peer, 0.8.99, 0.7.2, 0.8.0, and 0.8.4
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 764 2013-11-22 13:01:36 <acidhacker> Luke-Jr: branch autoconf_pt3 builds fine.
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 767 2013-11-22 13:01:45 <damethos> can someone tell me what is the max transaction size in testnet?
 768 2013-11-22 13:01:46 <acidhacker> thanks !
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 770 2013-11-22 13:02:01 <Luke-Jr> acidhacker: please leave a comment saying so
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 775 2013-11-22 13:04:32 <acidhacker> ok done
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 779 2013-11-22 13:05:42 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|damethos: Same as mainnet
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 781 2013-11-22 13:06:08 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|damethos: Testnet is like mainnet, except with IsStandard disabled and the 20-minute rule
 782 2013-11-22 13:06:30 <damethos> ah i see
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 790 2013-11-22 13:20:25 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|(well, and parameters like genesis block and netmagic)
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 792 2013-11-22 13:21:59 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|Oh, is cfields theuni?
 793 2013-11-22 13:22:24 <Luke-Jr> yes
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 808 2013-11-22 13:31:01 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|Okay, that's another one for the list
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 811 2013-11-22 13:31:31 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|(it took me a very, very long time to realize that wumpus == laanwj)
 812 2013-11-22 13:32:11 <wumpus> :D
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 838 2013-11-22 13:59:42 <Subo1977> michagogo|cloud: where did you see the Clientversion of your connections?
 839 2013-11-22 13:59:54 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|subver field of getpeerinfo
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 842 2013-11-22 14:01:54 <Subo1977> michagogo|cloud: thx
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 845 2013-11-22 14:03:01 <Subo1977>  "subver" : "/Satoshi:0.8.99/Gangnam Style:2.1/", whats this?
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 852 2013-11-22 14:08:51 <damethos> lol thats funny
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 858 2013-11-22 14:13:26 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|Subo1977: read the mailing list
 859 2013-11-22 14:13:41 <Subo1977> ok
 860 2013-11-22 14:15:15 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|;;google lucky --snippet bitcoin development mailing list archives
 861 2013-11-22 14:15:16 <gribble> http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_name=bitcoin-development | Mailing Lists ... Email Archive: bitcoin-development (read-only) ... Re: [Bitcoin- development] Even simpler minimum fee calculation formula: f > bounty*fork_rate / ...
 862 2013-11-22 14:15:22 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|Subo1977: ^
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 898 2013-11-22 14:59:28 <damethos> just found a tx in testnet with a 0.95MB output
 899 2013-11-22 14:59:29 <damethos> fun
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 910 2013-11-22 15:08:31 <helo> on HEAD startup, getting ERROR: CDB() : error Invalid argument (22) opening database environment
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 923 2013-11-22 15:16:08 <helo> Error initializing wallet database environment /home/helo/.bitcoin!
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 931 2013-11-22 15:23:13 <tommygunner> gogogo BIP 0038
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 934 2013-11-22 15:31:26 <helo> fails even when starting with a totally empty (aside from rpcuser/pw in conf)
 935 2013-11-22 15:31:43 <tommygunner> do you have write access
 936 2013-11-22 15:31:47 <tommygunner> disk space
 937 2013-11-22 15:32:10 <helo> apparently db5.1 is totally broken, rather than just breaking backward compat
 938 2013-11-22 15:32:15 <helo> yeah
 939 2013-11-22 15:33:11 <sipa> the database files are backward compatible
 940 2013-11-22 15:33:20 <sipa> the database environment is totally non-compatible
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 944 2013-11-22 15:33:34 <sipa> so after a clean shutdown you can change versions, but not otherwise
 945 2013-11-22 15:33:39 <bitnumus> hi, what is 'time_offset' ?
 946 2013-11-22 15:34:05 <bitnumus>  "timeoffset" : -73,
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 948 2013-11-22 15:34:12 <Happzz> lag?
 949 2013-11-22 15:34:24 <Happzz> tslb?
 950 2013-11-22 15:34:36 <sipa> your measured average clock difference with your peers
 951 2013-11-22 15:34:51 <bitnumus> sipa ah thought it would be something like that
 952 2013-11-22 15:34:53 <bitnumus> :)
 953 2013-11-22 15:34:54 <bitnumus> ta
 954 2013-11-22 15:35:02 <Ry4an> in seconds or millis?
 955 2013-11-22 15:35:06 <sipa> seconds
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 957 2013-11-22 15:36:00 <Subo1977> helo: i run db6.0 on ubuntu without probs
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 959 2013-11-22 15:36:07 <helo> hmm... HEAD?
 960 2013-11-22 15:36:40 <sipa> helo: check db.log
 961 2013-11-22 15:36:53 <sipa> it may tell you why it couldn't initialize the wallet env
 962 2013-11-22 15:37:10 <helo> ahh, "illegal flag combination specified to DB_ENV->open"
 963 2013-11-22 15:37:18 <sipa> huh
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 965 2013-11-22 15:37:24 <sipa> sure you're using 5.1?
 966 2013-11-22 15:38:11 <helo> odd... i had to specify --with-incompatible-bdb, but it is linked to a db4.8 sitting happily in /usr/lib/
 967 2013-11-22 15:38:49 <helo> must have conflicting installs
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 973 2013-11-22 15:40:38 <helo> oh, the ppa is pulling in its own db4.8
 974 2013-11-22 15:40:52 <helo> i thought it was statically compiled
 975 2013-11-22 15:41:08 <helo> *linked
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 981 2013-11-22 15:47:05 <gulli> Trying to wrap my head around HD wallets and how they work
 982 2013-11-22 15:47:07 <gulli> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=19137.0
 983 2013-11-22 15:47:13 <gulli> is the seed some random string?
 984 2013-11-22 15:47:51 <sipa> ideally
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 987 2013-11-22 15:48:38 <sipa> it's the real secret
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 992 2013-11-22 15:49:34 <tommygunner> the 12 words that electrum wants you to print for example
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 994 2013-11-22 15:50:20 <sipa> in that case you'll want to preprocess it first into a secret, using some key strengthening
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 998 2013-11-22 15:51:53 <gulli> I was just thinking about gerenating a random private key and using that as the seed, backing it up on paper ofcourse
 999 2013-11-22 15:52:16 <sipa> you can
1000 2013-11-22 15:52:27 <sipa> though it's not really a private key - it has no corresponding public key
1001 2013-11-22 15:52:34 <sipa> it's just a seed from which keys are generated
1002 2013-11-22 15:52:50 <tommygunner> gulli: BIP 0038
1003 2013-11-22 15:53:07 <sipa> please don't use that for wallets
1004 2013-11-22 15:53:13 <sipa> as it relies on a single-key model
1005 2013-11-22 15:53:15 <gulli> sipa, yeah I know, just mean use the same algorithm :)
1006 2013-11-22 15:53:29 <sipa> it's fine for transferring single-use keys, like physical coins
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1015 2013-11-22 16:00:04 <gmaxwell> BIP 0038 has a messy history and is likely to be replaced soon.
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1018 2013-11-22 16:01:45 <tommygunner> oh
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1020 2013-11-22 16:02:14 <tommygunner> what is your suggestion as to how i store a non trivial amount of bitcoin?
1021 2013-11-22 16:02:36 <stonecoldpat>  guys, where is the code for stuff like 'getblockcount()?'
1022 2013-11-22 16:03:03 <stonecoldpat> tommygunner: write it on a sticky note, and bury it under the ground
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1024 2013-11-22 16:03:41 <stonecoldpat> its ok ive found it in rpcblockchain
1025 2013-11-22 16:03:46 <tommygunner> i thought about xoring the private key
1026 2013-11-22 16:04:11 <tommygunner> but then i realized thats what BIP 0038 kind of is about
1027 2013-11-22 16:04:18 <tommygunner> and thought about using it instead
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1031 2013-11-22 16:07:36 <cfields> ping devrandom
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1060 2013-11-22 16:26:44 <K1773R> why does bitcoin use /dev/urandom and not /dev/random?
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1063 2013-11-22 16:29:15 <BlueMatt> why would you use /dev/random?
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1065 2013-11-22 16:29:52 <stonecoldpat>  does /dev/urandom not use /dev/random anyway?
1066 2013-11-22 16:30:29 <K1773R> BlueMatt: in case you have a HWRNG
1067 2013-11-22 16:30:50 <BlueMatt> if you have a HWRNG, it should be piping its randomness into the urandom seed
1068 2013-11-22 16:30:54 <BlueMatt> and then its just as good...
1069 2013-11-22 16:30:59 <K1773R> stonecoldpat: well kinda, /dev/urandom is seeded with a PRNG algo from /dev/random
1070 2013-11-22 16:31:08 <K1773R> hmm, right!
1071 2013-11-22 16:31:20 <K1773R> totally forgot tha
1072 2013-11-22 16:31:25 <kjj> if you trust your HW more than you trust the kernel, you should use it directly.
1073 2013-11-22 16:31:42 <kjj> but, you should carefully consider whether you really trust your HW more, and why
1074 2013-11-22 16:31:44 <stonecoldpat> and i was gonna ask - as i am a noob with c++, i'm trying to use cout << in the main bitcoind program to print out some words, but the only way i can get printing to screen is to return a 'Value' using one of the rpc methods (i created my own method that looks like getbitcoincount and gave it a silly name)
1075 2013-11-22 16:31:52 <jgarzik_> if you have a HWRNG, you should be using rngd
1076 2013-11-22 16:32:12 <gmaxwell> K1773R: it's constantly reseeded with the same random sources. The distinction is primarly just that one blocks based on an estimator, which if correct (it's not) means the output has information theoretic security.
1077 2013-11-22 16:32:14 <K1773R> kjj: i dont trust my HW than my linux kernel.
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1079 2013-11-22 16:32:29 <kjj> as far as I can tell, there are no cheap HW devices available in the US
1080 2013-11-22 16:32:44 <gmaxwell> Entropykey ... but I think they've imploded or something.
1081 2013-11-22 16:32:52 <K1773R> jgarzik_: i do use rngd :)
1082 2013-11-22 16:33:10 <kjj> gmaxwell: in the UK.  I think they'll ship to the US, but I'm not going to get a google wallet to find out
1083 2013-11-22 16:33:12 <K1773R> gmaxwell: i ordered some entropykeys half a year back, i never got something...
1084 2013-11-22 16:33:35 <gmaxwell> kjj: as K1773R just mentioned, they're not shipping anything now.
1085 2013-11-22 16:33:37 <kjj> and in this era, how can you really trust it?
1086 2013-11-22 16:33:56 <K1773R> gmaxwell: u know why? got some references?
1087 2013-11-22 16:34:20 <K1773R> gmaxwell: all i saw is "will ahve huge delays" or similiar on their order page recently (but not back when i ordered)
1088 2013-11-22 16:34:35 <gmaxwell> K1773R: I'd seen some commentary from someone who heard from them, it sounded like someone died or something.
1089 2013-11-22 16:34:58 <K1773R> uh, crap
1090 2013-11-22 16:35:15 <damethos> hey BlueMatt
1091 2013-11-22 16:35:24 <damethos> :D
1092 2013-11-22 16:35:29 <BlueMatt> hi
1093 2013-11-22 16:37:53 <damethos> made bitcoinj explode earlier with a 0.95MB output
1094 2013-11-22 16:38:15 <damethos> well, more like java not bitcoinj
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1098 2013-11-22 16:42:32 <BlueMatt> hah, nice
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1101 2013-11-22 16:43:22 <damethos> BlueMatt, wrapping up testnet support and will publish it soon
1102 2013-11-22 16:43:41 <damethos> blockexplorer.com got f00ked so this will probably be the only one around for now :p
1103 2013-11-22 16:43:49 <BlueMatt> nice
1104 2013-11-22 16:43:52 wiretapped has joined
1105 2013-11-22 16:43:52 <BlueMatt> (finally)
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1110 2013-11-22 16:45:44 <damethos> the output was in testnet btw
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1142 2013-11-22 17:11:21 <diki> blockexplorer.com has expired
1143 2013-11-22 17:11:39 <diki> I do suppose no one was interested in it.
1144 2013-11-22 17:11:54 <diki> but will it be back?
1145 2013-11-22 17:12:38 tholenst has joined
1146 2013-11-22 17:14:19 <damethos> it wasnt working that well anyway
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1207 2013-11-22 18:07:15 <diki> Who was it that presumably mined block 30-40k?
1208 2013-11-22 18:07:39 <diki> I see a lot of coins that originate from blocks that old being the inputs of outputs
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1219 2013-11-22 18:14:56 <devrandom> cfields: hi
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1230 2013-11-22 18:27:14 <deantrade> Hello all
1231 2013-11-22 18:27:50 <deantrade> So I've developed my own bitcoin coin verification software...  and I've been thinking about the transaction lookup/spend data structure
1232 2013-11-22 18:28:37 <deantrade> Here's my idea on how it could be improved:  1st, don't store as 1x table.  Instead store as many tables
1233 2013-11-22 18:29:09 <deantrade> The general process would be that first you'd use one table for the current block, and for the previous block
1234 2013-11-22 18:29:36 <deantrade> but once you have 3x blocks of transactions, the 1st and 2nd would be merged into one table, while the latest block would still stay in its own table
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1236 2013-11-22 18:31:11 <deantrade> The tables would grow like this: 1, 1 1, 2 1, 2 1 1, 2 2 1, 2 2 1 1, 4 2 1, 4 2 1 1, 4 2 2 1, 4 2 2 1 1, 4 4 2 1, ...
1237 2013-11-22 18:31:54 <deantrade> Basically you don't allow more than 2x tables to contain the same number of blocks
1238 2013-11-22 18:32:37 <deantrade> This could potentially result in excellent improvement in locality and insert performance.
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1243 2013-11-22 18:33:46 <deantrade> crickets... I guess you guys are all busy watching the bitcoin price?
1244 2013-11-22 18:35:05 <tommygunner> give them some time
1245 2013-11-22 18:35:24 <tommygunner> or, -> github
1246 2013-11-22 18:36:31 <deantrade> I think this data structure would be awsome also because it doesn't require in-memory indexes for old transaction lookup.  You'd be able to do a binary search directly on the disk for older tables/block's transactions.  O(ln2(N))
1247 2013-11-22 18:36:35 <Eliel> deantrade: There's probably not too many people who understand the code you're talking about enough to be able to comment. It's likely going to take a while until one of them is active.
1248 2013-11-22 18:37:50 <deantrade> So you'd not have to sit around while the database indexes initialize into memory, very small DRAM requirements while still maintainnig fast O(ln2(N)) lookup
1249 2013-11-22 18:38:42 <deantrade> So that would be better for people like me who stop and start their bitcoin database process frequently
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1251 2013-11-22 18:39:01 <deantrade> Is there a place on github or somewhere where I can post this suggestion?
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1255 2013-11-22 18:39:47 <Eliel> What I can say is that this is a complex enough topic that you'll likely need to be able to demonstrate the effect for people to get excited. That means implementing it and showing through benchmarks that it actually speeds things up.
1256 2013-11-22 18:40:32 <Eliel> there's the bug / feature request tracker at least.
1257 2013-11-22 18:41:35 <deantrade> Fair enough.  I guess I'll post the idea as a feature request on github, and then also test it on my own bitcoin transaction verifier client when I get the time
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1259 2013-11-22 18:42:49 <deantrade> Eliel: I implemented multithreading in my client for transaction signature verification...  does the official client do that?
1260 2013-11-22 18:43:02 <gmaxwell> deantrade: uhh. we don't use in-memory indexes for transaction lookups.
1261 2013-11-22 18:43:34 <gmaxwell> Yes, it does.
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1265 2013-11-22 18:44:11 <deantrade> gmaxwell: ohyea I guess you are right, the official bitcoin client does load up pretty fast.
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1267 2013-11-22 18:44:26 <gmaxwell> in fact, we don't index most transactions at all.
1268 2013-11-22 18:44:57 <deantrade> Its been a year or so since I've looked at the official bitcoin code
1269 2013-11-22 18:45:09 <gmaxwell> deantrade: 99% of the startup time is sanity tests that we do on starup. E.g. we rewind the last 288 blocks and play them forward again and make sure that the resulting states agree.
1270 2013-11-22 18:45:40 <deantrade> Does it still store DiskTransactions in a single KVP table: transactionHash->DiskTransaction?
1271 2013-11-22 18:46:11 <gmaxwell> No. It doesn't have any way to look up most transactions at all, as I just mentioned.
1272 2013-11-22 18:46:44 <gmaxwell> all validation is now done against a (currently) ~256 mbyte data structure.
1273 2013-11-22 18:47:11 <deantrade> So you just pretty much keep the unspent transactions indexed?
1274 2013-11-22 18:47:29 <gmaxwell> Unspent transaction outputs, not the whole transactions.
1275 2013-11-22 18:48:09 <gmaxwell> This is most of the reason why 0.8 was roughly 40x faster than prior versions.
1276 2013-11-22 18:48:14 otoburb has quit (Quit: leaving)
1277 2013-11-22 18:48:44 <deantrade> Sounds good.  So this is a major performance improvement for most use cases of the block chain
1278 2013-11-22 18:49:04 <deantrade> But if  you want to look up a particular transaction by its hash... then that sucks really bad O(N)
1279 2013-11-22 18:49:19 <deantrade> Right?
1280 2013-11-22 18:49:53 <gmaxwell> You can optionally turn on an index for historical transactions, but it's not used by normal network operation. It's mostly useful to people using the raw transactions api to build block explorer like things.
1281 2013-11-22 18:49:55 johnsoft has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
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1283 2013-11-22 18:50:22 <gmaxwell> That index adds about 1gb of additional storage.
1284 2013-11-22 18:50:37 <diki> Do you guys have any idea who it might be that moved around 200k coins?
1285 2013-11-22 18:51:00 johnsoft has joined
1286 2013-11-22 18:51:22 <deantrade> diki, I donno who, but with the bitcoin price going up, I think now more than ever people are starting to worry about tracability
1287 2013-11-22 18:51:52 <diki> deantrade:My tracing skills are not very good but I think it might be that pizza guy lazslo
1288 2013-11-22 18:52:11 porquilho has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
1289 2013-11-22 18:52:16 <deantrade> gmaxwell: thanks for your input.  I'll have to consider doing a similar thing for my client.
1290 2013-11-22 18:52:25 nvk1 has quit (Quit: Leaving... |||||||||| SIGN-UP for Coinkite with the promo https://coinkite.com/promo/btcirc)
1291 2013-11-22 18:52:42 nvk_ has joined
1292 2013-11-22 18:53:23 * gmaxwell continues to be sad that people are spending time reinventing the wheel instead of advancing things forward
1293 2013-11-22 18:54:00 <warren> "FYI, I waited a few days and opened the OMG3-beta client again and it healed itself. Verified the database just fine."
1294 2013-11-22 18:54:07 <deantrade> gmaxwell: hey, another question... so when you drop a transactions outputs from the unspent table, you then lose O(ln2(N)) access of where a transaction output is spent?
1295 2013-11-22 18:54:40 <gmaxwell> deantrade: sure. Its not needed.
1296 2013-11-22 18:54:52 <gmaxwell> (the old txindex methods didn't have that in any case)
1297 2013-11-22 18:55:16 nvk_ has quit (Client Quit)
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1300 2013-11-22 18:56:16 <deantrade> gmaxwell: have you seen the mini-blockchain w/ account hash tree idea?
1301 2013-11-22 18:56:42 <gmaxwell> deantrade: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=21995.0
1302 2013-11-22 18:56:55 johnsoft has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
1303 2013-11-22 18:57:00 <petertodd> gmaxwell: heh, you beat me too it
1304 2013-11-22 18:57:42 johnsoft has joined
1305 2013-11-22 18:57:46 <deantrade> k, I'll read into your response
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1313 2013-11-22 19:03:08 <deantrade> gmaxwell: I agree with your criticisms, although I do not think they are critical issues that would prevent the system from being a useful and efficient money system.
1314 2013-11-22 19:03:32 mE\Ta has joined
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1321 2013-11-22 19:05:16 <deantrade> Say for example if such a system could be made w/ O(1) transaction verification and was less complex computationally and required less data storage then bitcion, then potentially transaction fees could be lower and more clients could do ledger verifcation
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1328 2013-11-22 19:07:27 <gulli> I'm checking out bitcoinj's HD classes and tests
1329 2013-11-22 19:07:36 jurov is now known as jurov`
1330 2013-11-22 19:08:18 <gulli> in one test the string (which will be used as a seed code I think) a method Hex.decode is used
1331 2013-11-22 19:08:35 <gulli> on the string itself, which is aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
1332 2013-11-22 19:08:51 <gulli> Like this: byte[] priv  = Hex.decode(ckdTestVectors[3 * i]);
1333 2013-11-22 19:09:10 <gulli> where the ckdTestVectors[0] is the string
1334 2013-11-22 19:09:10 wallet43 has joined
1335 2013-11-22 19:09:23 <gulli> why use Hex.decode, anyone know?
1336 2013-11-22 19:10:13 <gulli> seems you could just use .getBytes() on the string itself
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1344 2013-11-22 19:17:20 <sipa> because getBytes doesn't do hex decoding, afaik?
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1350 2013-11-22 19:18:43 <sipa> or you mean writing the string as "\x12\x34..." ?
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1354 2013-11-22 19:19:09 <sipa> the bip32 test vectors are specified in hex, so it's probably easier to just copy them
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1357 2013-11-22 19:20:23 <cfields> devrandom: still around?
1358 2013-11-22 19:20:56 bbrian has joined
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1360 2013-11-22 19:22:22 <gulli> sipa ahh ok thanks
1361 2013-11-22 19:22:34 brson_ has quit (Quit: leaving)
1362 2013-11-22 19:22:51 brson has joined
1363 2013-11-22 19:23:43 <gulli> but I dont have to worry about this though if Im not using the test vectors
1364 2013-11-22 19:23:46 <gulli> right
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1366 2013-11-22 19:26:58 ext0 is now known as ext0|
1367 2013-11-22 19:27:23 <sipa> you should...
1368 2013-11-22 19:27:34 PiZZaMaN2K is now known as PiZZaMaN2K|away
1369 2013-11-22 19:27:40 <sipa> (if you're reimplementing bip32)
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1376 2013-11-22 19:37:22 <jgarzik_> grrr
1377 2013-11-22 19:37:26 Anduck has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
1378 2013-11-22 19:37:30 <jgarzik_> configure shits itself on latest ubuntu
1379 2013-11-22 19:37:32 [\\\] has joined
1380 2013-11-22 19:37:41 <jgarzik_> conftest.cpp: In function 'int main()':
1381 2013-11-22 19:37:42 <jgarzik_> conftest.cpp:35:3: warning: statement is a reference, not call, to function 'boost::system::system_category' [-Waddress]
1382 2013-11-22 19:37:42 <jgarzik_>    ;
1383 2013-11-22 19:37:42 <jgarzik_>    ^
1384 2013-11-22 19:37:42 <jgarzik_> conftest.cpp:35:3: warning: statement has no effect [-Wunused-value]
1385 2013-11-22 19:37:43 <jgarzik_> configure:10512: $? = 0
1386 2013-11-22 19:37:46 <jgarzik_> configure:10527: result: yes
1387 2013-11-22 19:37:47 <jgarzik_> configure:10686: error: Could not find a version of the library!
1388 2013-11-22 19:37:59 <diki> #joke perhaps it's time to rewrite configure lol #endjoke
1389 2013-11-22 19:38:14 <sipa> jgarzik_: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/3219
1390 2013-11-22 19:38:36 <sipa> is it that?
1391 2013-11-22 19:38:54 brson has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
1392 2013-11-22 19:40:17 patcon has joined
1393 2013-11-22 19:40:32 <jgarzik_> sipa, looks like it
1394 2013-11-22 19:41:12 <jgarzik_> apt-get install libboost1.54-all-dev
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1405 2013-11-22 19:52:33 <jgarzik_> wumpus, bitcoin-cli needs some work?
1406 2013-11-22 19:52:44 <cfields> you can thank boost for not using pkg-config
1407 2013-11-22 19:52:47 <jgarzik_> jgarzik@pum:~/repo/bitcoin/src$ ./bitcoin-cli -testnet stop
1408 2013-11-22 19:52:47 <jgarzik_> error: couldn't connect to server
1409 2013-11-22 19:52:47 <jgarzik_> jgarzik@pum:~/repo/bitcoin/src$ ./bitcoin-cli stop
1410 2013-11-22 19:52:47 <jgarzik_> error: couldn't connect to server
1411 2013-11-22 19:52:47 <jgarzik_> jgarzik@pum:~/repo/bitcoin/src$ ./bitcoind -testnet stop
1412 2013-11-22 19:52:48 <jgarzik_> Bitcoin server stopping
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1428 2013-11-22 20:15:50 <anddam> hi
1429 2013-11-22 20:16:00 Burritoh has joined
1430 2013-11-22 20:16:22 <anddam> what's gonna happen to wallet.dat and were will keys be stored? cf. Luke-Jr "1) wallet.dat is going away anyway" https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/2545
1431 2013-11-22 20:19:34 <jgarzik_> intersting
1432 2013-11-22 20:19:49 <jgarzik_> the Misbehaving() check looks at addr.IsLocal() not IsLocal()
1433 2013-11-22 20:19:58 <jgarzik_> which is a static check, not a check of mapLocalHost[]
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1446 2013-11-22 20:27:19 <edcba> anddam: +1
1447 2013-11-22 20:28:33 <anddam> edcba: like you're curious as well?
1448 2013-11-22 20:28:34 FluffyBunny has joined
1449 2013-11-22 20:29:05 Application has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
1450 2013-11-22 20:29:16 mynameis has joined
1451 2013-11-22 20:29:31 <anddam> also I'm experiencing a weird issue on OS X build 0.8.5, tx fee setting is lost when closing the application
1452 2013-11-22 20:30:18 <anddam> there's mention of a different issue where the setting won't accept any setting, in my case the program accepts settings and those are kept as long as the program run
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1456 2013-11-22 20:38:39 <jgarzik_> anddam, edcba: perhaps luke-jr was referring to plans to drop Berkeley DB, which implies wallet.dat -- as it is known now -- would change to a new format, possibly new name.
1457 2013-11-22 20:38:51 drayah has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
1458 2013-11-22 20:39:07 <anddam> I see
1459 2013-11-22 20:40:52 <anddam> also an user on #bitcoin couldn't reproduce the setting issue, I'll test a new user on my system to see if I can reproduce there
1460 2013-11-22 20:41:08 <anddam> thanks
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1464 2013-11-22 20:44:34 <warren> 2013-11-22 19:30:18 receive version message: /BTC-ETHZ:0.8.99/: version 70001, blocks=270978, us=X.Y.Z.123:54958, them=129.132.230.72:8333, peer=129.132.230.72:8333
1465 2013-11-22 20:44:43 <warren> has anyone figured out what that client is?
1466 2013-11-22 20:45:19 bizzle has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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1470 2013-11-22 20:47:28 Alan-1 has joined
1471 2013-11-22 20:47:37 <gmaxwell> warren: I have that whole /24 banned on my nodes after seeing weird behavior coming out of it.
1472 2013-11-22 20:48:33 denisx has quit (Quit: denisx)
1473 2013-11-22 20:48:37 <warren> gmaxwell: perhaps someone should make a centralized DNSBL ... =)
1474 2013-11-22 20:48:56 wizkid057 has joined
1475 2013-11-22 20:49:58 <gmaxwell> Should we banscore 100 for these:
1476 2013-11-22 20:49:59 <gmaxwell> http://0bin.net/paste/X1YiqdMeQuGwO-45#0Ws+7BekfyQww6uHUBNJ4BSzn8JGNxWZn7Q5IMN9OMA=
1477 2013-11-22 20:50:20 bizzle has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
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1479 2013-11-22 20:51:48 Ui has joined
1480 2013-11-22 20:51:58 <Ui> :)
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1483 2013-11-22 20:56:17 super3 has joined
1484 2013-11-22 20:56:20 <super3> hello
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1535 2013-11-22 21:55:25 <Kireji> does anyone have a recommendation for the best software for an offline wallet?
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1546 2013-11-22 22:04:04 <Polyatomic> Bitcoin-QT 0.8.5 , OS Windows 7 Question : If I have set transaction fee with Bitcoin-QT , will the fee be applied if I use the sendtoaddress from a command prompt with bitcoind ?. ?.
1547 2013-11-22 22:04:05 roconnor has quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
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1549 2013-11-22 22:07:02 <gmaxwell> Polyatomic: yes.
1550 2013-11-22 22:07:17 <Polyatomic> cheers boss
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1554 2013-11-22 22:11:55 <tommygunner> the transaction fee in the settings menu is an optional fee
1555 2013-11-22 22:12:05 <tommygunner> the minimum fee is hardcoded
1556 2013-11-22 22:12:19 <sipa> there is no hardcoded minimum fee
1557 2013-11-22 22:12:36 <sipa> there is a hardcoded rule not to create transactions that your node itself would consider spam
1558 2013-11-22 22:12:48 <tommygunner> what he said, obviously
1559 2013-11-22 22:12:50 sevenqueue has joined
1560 2013-11-22 22:13:01 <sipa> and you can tweak what price per kilobyte it accepts
1561 2013-11-22 22:13:08 <tommygunner> my wording gets poor and i have to go to bed
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1566 2013-11-22 22:23:11 <tholenst> ethz is a university in swizterland, and 192.132.230.72 is an IP from there
1567 2013-11-22 22:24:06 <tholenst> warren: that was in reply to you, from quite a while ago
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1570 2013-11-22 22:26:04 <sipa> eth zurich, i know a few people there
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1572 2013-11-22 22:27:00 <tholenst> might be these guys: http://www.disco.ethz.ch/members/cdecker.html
1573 2013-11-22 22:27:13 reizuki has joined
1574 2013-11-22 22:27:22 <sipa> yes
1575 2013-11-22 22:27:33 <sipa> cdecker is even in this channep sometimes
1576 2013-11-22 22:27:36 <sipa> channel
1577 2013-11-22 22:28:28 banghouse has joined
1578 2013-11-22 22:28:29 <sipa> (he told me two days ago irl, i never noticed he was here)
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1599 2013-11-22 22:53:05 <skinnkavaj> Tonight FUD headline
1600 2013-11-22 22:53:08 <skinnkavaj> "Is bitcoin going to go away?? Is the internet crashing?? "
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1606 2013-11-22 23:06:16 <owowo> "The government" will shut down the Internet because Bitcoin is a danger to the economy!
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1612 2013-11-22 23:16:35 <Casimir1904> mesh :-)
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1625 2013-11-22 23:42:42 <happyface> yo
1626 2013-11-22 23:43:17 <happyface> how can I use bitcoind or the raw block chain to estimate transaction volume?
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1628 2013-11-22 23:45:44 <gmaxwell> happyface: the actual transaction volume is unknowable because you cannot observer transactions happening purely inside other systems.
1629 2013-11-22 23:46:05 <gmaxwell> You also can't tell when a transaction on the blockchain is a real transaction or just someone consolidating funds.
1630 2013-11-22 23:46:49 <happyface> gmaxwell: right. I see that blockchain.info estimates it somehow though
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1632 2013-11-22 23:47:34 <gmaxwell> happyface: bc.i publishes a bunch of random numbers. :P some are more random than others, it usually doesn't tell you _what_ it's actually measuring.
1633 2013-11-22 23:48:28 <happyface> gmaxwell: ok cool, good to know :P
1634 2013-11-22 23:48:34 <happyface> thanks
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