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199 2013-12-10 02:02:07 <amiller> okay so...
200 2013-12-10 02:02:24 <amiller> what happens when you add a new key to a wallet managed by an spv bloom filtering node
201 2013-12-10 02:02:59 <amiller> you tell your peers to update their bloom filter, so that means you are going to hear about any new transactions/blocks
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203 2013-12-10 02:03:42 <amiller> if you generated the key from scratch, then you can rely on it not being present in any old blocks
204 2013-12-10 02:03:51 <amiller> what happens when you import a key? does that trigger a rescan?
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206 2013-12-10 02:04:15 <gmaxwell> amiller: you can import a key with a date, and it rescans from there.
207 2013-12-10 02:04:28 <amiller> do keys normally come with dates?
208 2013-12-10 02:04:34 <gmaxwell> if you don't have a date with itâ its rescanning from day 1.
209 2013-12-10 02:04:52 <amiller> so a filtering node will start asking its peers for every block forever?
210 2013-12-10 02:04:56 <gmaxwell> amiller: the multibit wallet format does, WIF private keys often do not, mostly because we didn't think about it in the initial serialization.
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212 2013-12-10 02:05:26 <gmaxwell> amiller: it'll ask it for every past block, w/ filtering, once at import time and then its caught up for that key.
213 2013-12-10 02:05:27 <amiller> that seems like a lot of burden on the peers...they have to scan through the whole blockchain including applying new filters.. if i understand that right
214 2013-12-10 02:05:33 <amiller> okay.
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217 2013-12-10 02:06:18 <gmaxwell> In _general_ importing a key shouldn't be a normal case, as it totally busts the durability of backups in a way which may be surprising to users. (especially for clients with wallets which are normally determinstic)
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349 2013-12-10 03:45:30 <Blaster> hello... if I show a bitcoin address on my web app, how can I make the app aware when that address receives payment? Do I use the JSON-RPC?
350 2013-12-10 03:46:15 <weex> Blaster: yes, I'd use listtransactions
351 2013-12-10 03:46:54 <Blaster> I want it to generate a new address when a user clicks a link, and then when they pay that address, I want to display a popup window
352 2013-12-10 03:47:00 <weex> but be sure to use both transaction id and address to uniquely identify a payment
353 2013-12-10 03:47:27 <Blaster> weex: why transaction id?
354 2013-12-10 03:47:31 yubrew has joined
355 2013-12-10 03:48:08 <weex> well in the past i only used txid but then some people made multioutput transactions
356 2013-12-10 03:48:18 <kjj> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=269886.0
357 2013-12-10 03:48:34 <kjj> should be in the FAQ or something
358 2013-12-10 03:48:55 <Blaster> walletnotify?
359 2013-12-10 03:49:03 <Blaster> is that an event that gets fired?
360 2013-12-10 03:49:31 johnsoft has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
361 2013-12-10 03:49:33 <kjj> it runs a process on the local (to bitcoind) machine
362 2013-12-10 03:49:50 Sleepnbum has joined
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364 2013-12-10 03:49:57 <Blaster> How quickly can I verify payment has been received after it gets sent? I don't want to make my customers wait several minutes for a confirmation
365 2013-12-10 03:50:14 Sleepnbum is now known as Guest30281
366 2013-12-10 03:50:24 <kjj> as soon as your node sees the transaction come in over the network
367 2013-12-10 03:50:45 johnsoft has joined
368 2013-12-10 03:50:49 <kjj> but be aware that you may get notified more than once for a transaction. read that whole thread
369 2013-12-10 03:50:55 <Blaster> ok
370 2013-12-10 03:51:54 yubrew has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
371 2013-12-10 03:52:21 <Blaster> it says to check the confirmation count of the transactions, not the balance of the account, but if you do that how can you verify the correct amount was sent?
372 2013-12-10 03:52:30 sserrano44 has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
373 2013-12-10 03:52:49 <kjj> decode the transaction
374 2013-12-10 03:53:10 <kjj> you should probably get accounts right out of your head now if you are working on a web service.
375 2013-12-10 03:53:31 sserrano44 has joined
376 2013-12-10 03:53:51 <Blaster> doesn't it mean wallet ID by account?
377 2013-12-10 03:54:21 <kjj> I'm not sure what you mean by wallet ID
378 2013-12-10 03:54:22 ItSANgo has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
379 2013-12-10 03:54:33 <kjj> but I can tell you that accounts do not do what you expect, and they will not help you at all
380 2013-12-10 03:54:50 ItSANgo has joined
381 2013-12-10 03:55:05 <weex> accounts are no good
382 2013-12-10 03:55:15 <Blaster> isn't the wallet ID what someone would send a payment to? I think I mean address.
383 2013-12-10 03:55:15 <weex> better to call them crazy labels
384 2013-12-10 03:55:51 <kjj> ok, when you are presenting a payment page, you generate a new address and tuck it into your database
385 2013-12-10 03:56:07 <Blaster> ok
386 2013-12-10 03:56:21 <kjj> then, when walletnotify triggers, you decode it, check the outputs. compare the addresses to your database, along with the amounts
387 2013-12-10 03:56:41 <andytoshi> Blaster: http://download.wpsoftware.net/bitcoin/bitcoin-faq.pdf might help untangle addresses and accounts for you
388 2013-12-10 03:56:46 <Blaster> I read that you should pipe wallet notify to a file so it doesn't cause any hang ups
389 2013-12-10 03:57:24 <kjj> that thread describes a client/server model
390 2013-12-10 03:57:35 Guest30281 has left ()
391 2013-12-10 03:57:50 <kjj> if you are SURE that your site won't get a lot of traffic, you can get away with some sketchy shit
392 2013-12-10 03:57:52 <Blaster> so is what I am trying to do though, isn't it?
393 2013-12-10 03:58:11 <Blaster> well my site will be getting a lot of traffic so I do want to do at least a decent job
394 2013-12-10 03:58:23 <Blaster> define: a lot of traffic
395 2013-12-10 03:58:39 <kjj> it varies.
396 2013-12-10 03:59:06 <Blaster> let's say < 5000 tx per month
397 2013-12-10 03:59:18 <kjj> basically, walletnotify triggers at least once per transaction involving your wallet. a big chunk of the bitcoind node will pause until that process ends
398 2013-12-10 03:59:27 <Blaster> I consider that a lot, but it's probably a small amount if you're an exchange or something
399 2013-12-10 04:00:04 <Blaster> oh yeah, well I think piping to a file is probably a good idea
400 2013-12-10 04:00:04 <kjj> if that process does something slow, it can get backed up and crash your box, or at least your node
401 2013-12-10 04:00:11 <Blaster> then ending immediately
402 2013-12-10 04:00:23 <kjj> so, you want a very light, very fast process that does the bare minimum, then ends.
403 2013-12-10 04:00:45 <Blaster> yeah
404 2013-12-10 04:00:47 <kjj> then you have either a long running process or a cron job that does the slower processing in an orderly fashion
405 2013-12-10 04:00:52 jaekwon has joined
406 2013-12-10 04:01:14 <Blaster> does it make sense to store all the TX from walletnofify in the DB?
407 2013-12-10 04:01:44 <kjj> again, depends on what you'll need
408 2013-12-10 04:01:56 <andytoshi> hey devs, i am doing a manual coinjoin, /msg me or email apoelstra@wpsoftware dot net to get in on it
409 2013-12-10 04:02:14 <kjj> some TXs can get huge, so you may want to include only the address of yours that is getting paid, and the amount
410 2013-12-10 04:02:30 <gmaxwell> andytoshi: you might want to mention that the optimal txout side for your txn is 1 BTC.
411 2013-12-10 04:02:47 <Blaster> I want to display a modal immediately when payment is received, so I think my javascript will be sending an AJAX request every few seconds to check if the payment has been received, the script that the AJAX requests will probably be either parsing that file with the notifywallet output, or checking the DB
412 2013-12-10 04:02:56 <kjj> I'll go in for 1 BTC
413 2013-12-10 04:03:36 <andytoshi> cool kjj
414 2013-12-10 04:03:44 <andytoshi> i don't understand "you may want to include only the address of yours that is getting paid, and the amount"
415 2013-12-10 04:03:44 samson_ has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
416 2013-12-10 04:03:50 <kjj> how manual?
417 2013-12-10 04:04:06 <andytoshi> well, i am asking people to msg me utxo's, then i'm createrawtransacting them together
418 2013-12-10 04:04:07 licnep_ has joined
419 2013-12-10 04:04:16 <kjj> andytoshi: that was to blaster
420 2013-12-10 04:04:28 W0rmDr1nk has joined
421 2013-12-10 04:04:32 <kjj> like in vi? or do you have a script?
422 2013-12-10 04:04:34 <Blaster> kjj: what do you mean by how manual?
423 2013-12-10 04:04:44 <kjj> Blaster: that was to andy
424 2013-12-10 04:04:50 <Blaster> Which was to me?
425 2013-12-10 04:04:51 samson_ has joined
426 2013-12-10 04:04:55 <andytoshi> kjj: createrawtransaction just needs txid's
427 2013-12-10 04:05:15 <andytoshi> then the resultant hash, i send to all you guys and you each sign
428 2013-12-10 04:05:20 <andytoshi> not hash
429 2013-12-10 04:05:22 <Blaster> kjj: 1 BTC?
430 2013-12-10 04:05:27 <andytoshi> resultant hex-encoded transaction
431 2013-12-10 04:06:02 <kjj> Blaster: "some TXs can get huge..." was to you
432 2013-12-10 04:06:28 <Blaster> oh ok
433 2013-12-10 04:06:36 <Blaster> so does the process above sound the right way?
434 2013-12-10 04:06:49 <Blaster> what would be better in that scenario, parsing the text file, or selecting from the DB?
435 2013-12-10 04:07:36 BenderCoin__ has quit (Quit: Leaving)
436 2013-12-10 04:07:57 <kjj> Blaster: if you have a DB, hit that. the DB will at least pretend to try to be ACID
437 2013-12-10 04:08:06 BenderCoin has joined
438 2013-12-10 04:08:26 <andytoshi> gmaxwell: do you know roughly how many inputs will force us to add a fee
439 2013-12-10 04:08:32 <andytoshi> one player wants to add over a dozen..
440 2013-12-10 04:10:28 n0n0 has joined
441 2013-12-10 04:10:36 ValicekB has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
442 2013-12-10 04:10:58 <gmaxwell> andytoshi: 10kb will need a fee. just assume everyone is using uncompressed keys and estimate the size.
443 2013-12-10 04:11:01 duckxx has joined
444 2013-12-10 04:11:07 <andytoshi> kk thx
445 2013-12-10 04:12:06 <gmaxwell> and the fee should be at least 0.0001 btc/kb once there is a fee.. unless you go get wizkid or luke to play and they can prioritize. :)
446 2013-12-10 04:12:17 <gmaxwell> might be an optimal strategy. :)
447 2013-12-10 04:12:24 jtimon has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
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450 2013-12-10 04:12:51 <kjj> should I be worried that I now know the syntax of createrawtransaction by muscle memory?
451 2013-12-10 04:12:55 BenderCoin has quit (Client Quit)
452 2013-12-10 04:13:08 BenderCoin has joined
453 2013-12-10 04:13:10 <andytoshi> kjj: oh yes, your bashisms will be more destructive than ever
454 2013-12-10 04:13:28 <andytoshi> rm . * is peanuts :)
455 2013-12-10 04:13:38 duckxx has joined
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457 2013-12-10 04:14:03 <kjj> DWIM: corrected "rm . *" to "rm /*"
458 2013-12-10 04:14:26 duckxx has joined
459 2013-12-10 04:15:18 prophetx has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
460 2013-12-10 04:15:43 <andytoshi> oh, i meant to say * .o
461 2013-12-10 04:16:18 <gmaxwell> kjj: only worry when you can hexedit txn to change nlocktime and ad op_return txn without thinking about it.
462 2013-12-10 04:16:30 <gmaxwell> ... and not get tripped out by byteorder on longer values. :P
463 2013-12-10 04:17:12 ValicekB has joined
464 2013-12-10 04:17:43 <Blaster> how many GB is the block chain currently?
465 2013-12-10 04:18:14 <kjj> 11.7 for blocks
466 2013-12-10 04:18:29 <kjj> wait, that's not right
467 2013-12-10 04:19:00 <kjj> 12.9
468 2013-12-10 04:19:06 <Blaster> I don't think I have the HDD space to store it on my development VM. Damn SSD's.
469 2013-12-10 04:19:33 <kjj> didn't I hear that TB SSDs were coming out soon?
470 2013-12-10 04:20:41 <Blaster> probably, but only affordable for a trillionaire
471 2013-12-10 04:21:19 <kjj> if it makes you feel any better, my main p2pool node is running the blockchain in a RAMdisk
472 2013-12-10 04:22:00 <Blaster> cool, how much ram?
473 2013-12-10 04:22:18 <Blaster> price and capacity
474 2013-12-10 04:22:23 amiller_ has left ()
475 2013-12-10 04:22:32 amiller has joined
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477 2013-12-10 04:22:39 <amiller> it's weird to me the trust model with bloom filtering
478 2013-12-10 04:23:01 <kjj> the box has 32 gigs. 4 sticks of 8, probably like $160 total when I bought them
479 2013-12-10 04:23:25 <amiller> if you have to trust the node and it has to provide you some services, why stop at just the bloom filter on new tx and getblocks
480 2013-12-10 04:23:28 <andytoshi> hi amiller, do you want to get in on a big coinjoin?
481 2013-12-10 04:23:37 <andytoshi> msg me a txid/vout
482 2013-12-10 04:23:48 <amiller> what coin size
483 2013-12-10 04:23:52 <andytoshi> 1btc
484 2013-12-10 04:23:58 <amiller> pff
485 2013-12-10 04:24:10 [\\\] has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
486 2013-12-10 04:24:10 <Blaster> what's a coinjoin?
487 2013-12-10 04:24:12 <andytoshi> well, you are welcome to give me several txids
488 2013-12-10 04:24:15 <andytoshi> :}
489 2013-12-10 04:24:26 brson has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
490 2013-12-10 04:24:43 <andytoshi> Blaster: when you spend bitcoins, you sign a transaction which passes your coins to another person
491 2013-12-10 04:25:00 <andytoshi> what we are doing is, we are combining all our transactions into one, then we each sign the big transaction
492 2013-12-10 04:25:04 gaantr2 has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
493 2013-12-10 04:25:17 <Blaster> andytoshi: what's the benefit of doing that?
494 2013-12-10 04:25:36 <andytoshi> Blaster: normally when you have multiple coins in the same transaction, it is because the same person owns all the coins
495 2013-12-10 04:25:54 <andytoshi> so people trying to track movement of money can use that to discover identities
496 2013-12-10 04:25:57 xiangfu has joined
497 2013-12-10 04:25:59 <kjj> this way, when the feds come knocking on my door, I can tell them that Greg did it
498 2013-12-10 04:26:12 <andytoshi> and greg will blame me, and i'll blame kjj
499 2013-12-10 04:26:15 <Blaster> why would the feds come knocking on your door for a BTC tx?
500 2013-12-10 04:26:32 <kjj> feds get bored
501 2013-12-10 04:26:54 duckx has joined
502 2013-12-10 04:26:58 beachandbytes has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
503 2013-12-10 04:27:22 <kjj> anyone else have a namecoin node get stuck on block 150021 ?
504 2013-12-10 04:27:50 <amiller> if i could easily express the logic of what to do when new data comes in, then one good thing to do would be to have filtered "sweeps"
505 2013-12-10 04:28:44 <amiller> in other words if i don't mind waiting and orderness problems, it would be efficient to have your trusty peer node do scans every so often and notify you if it collects any changes
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530 2013-12-10 04:51:51 <kjj> one problem that I see with coinjoin is the output size thing.
531 2013-12-10 04:52:30 lifeofcray2 has joined
532 2013-12-10 04:53:11 <kjj> to do things other than just mixing back into our own wallets, we'd need a pile of them at multiples of 2
533 2013-12-10 04:53:12 Lifeofcray has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
534 2013-12-10 04:53:53 sserrano44 has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
535 2013-12-10 04:53:57 <kjj> and winding into and out of a stack of joins to get the error under the limit that you care about could take all day
536 2013-12-10 04:53:59 <andytoshi> yeah
537 2013-12-10 04:54:13 <andytoshi> a few people have already wrecked the size-1 rule
538 2013-12-10 04:54:30 <andytoshi> so if you wanna split yours up you are welcome to
539 2013-12-10 04:54:35 <kjj> I intend someday to script this and automate it, but still...
540 2013-12-10 04:54:48 <kjj> 1 BTC is fine by me. I'm just in it for the notoriety
541 2013-12-10 04:54:51 <amiller> i like how it begins with a txoutput.
542 2013-12-10 04:55:02 <amiller> i'm working on a script to do iddo's lottery game.
543 2013-12-10 04:55:09 <amiller> i'm not relaly sure how it should go though
544 2013-12-10 04:55:24 <amiller> the main tricky thing is that commitments have to be secure ahead of time
545 2013-12-10 04:55:43 <kjj> I have a decent outline of a coinjoiner service, but every time I start writing it, real life pulls me away
546 2013-12-10 04:56:22 <andytoshi> i still haven't checked out iddo's lottery game
547 2013-12-10 04:56:30 lifeofcray2 has left ()
548 2013-12-10 04:56:37 <andytoshi> it'd be cool to have a coinjoin service..i'd have to think about how well we could keep people anonymous
549 2013-12-10 04:56:49 <andytoshi> i suppose the first few people to sign pretty-much have to reveal their hand
550 2013-12-10 04:56:52 <kjj> don't bother, at first
551 2013-12-10 04:56:57 <amiller> andytoshi, did you see the eprint technical paper that commemorates it with formal drawing and such
552 2013-12-10 04:57:08 <andytoshi> no, i didn't
553 2013-12-10 04:57:21 <kjj> accept that the service can break your privacy. use layering
554 2013-12-10 04:57:39 <kjj> and later on, get into advanced stuff like chaum tokens to blind everything
555 2013-12-10 04:57:43 <amiller> andytoshi, http://eprint.iacr.org/2013/784 <- really great paper about lottery protocol in bitcoin
556 2013-12-10 04:58:01 <andytoshi> oh, thx amiller, i do have that one
557 2013-12-10 04:58:06 <andytoshi> but it'll be a while before i can read it
558 2013-12-10 04:58:12 <amiller> k
559 2013-12-10 04:58:27 <amiller> well, anyway, there are about three steps to the lottery protocol
560 2013-12-10 04:58:45 <amiller> first you have to make some security deposits with someone's public key attached.
561 2013-12-10 04:58:51 duckxxx has joined
562 2013-12-10 04:58:58 <amiller> if you know who you're going to want to play with, you can totally pre-compute all of these
563 2013-12-10 04:59:14 BTC_Bear is now known as BTC_Bear|hbrntng
564 2013-12-10 04:59:45 <amiller> to play the game, you propose and agree on a wager with the one or two other people you're playing against
565 2013-12-10 05:00:21 <amiller> then everyone exchanges timelock transactions that show that either you release your committed value by time T, or else the timelock transactions let everyone take the security deposits from you
566 2013-12-10 05:00:42 duckx has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
567 2013-12-10 05:01:16 <amiller> then you sign the wager, wait for everyone to reveal their value and take their security deposits back, and one person also gets to take the pot
568 2013-12-10 05:01:22 nOgAnOo has joined
569 2013-12-10 05:01:43 <andytoshi> cool
570 2013-12-10 05:01:57 <amiller> so i need to make a gambling wallet
571 2013-12-10 05:01:58 <andytoshi> it's definitely not clear how this can be ordered safely
572 2013-12-10 05:02:06 <andytoshi> but i think if i study it i'll see
573 2013-12-10 05:02:53 duckx has joined
574 2013-12-10 05:04:30 duckxx has joined
575 2013-12-10 05:04:35 <andytoshi> it'd be cool if we bet this coinjoin :P
576 2013-12-10 05:06:16 duckxxx has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
577 2013-12-10 05:06:51 wei__ has joined
578 2013-12-10 05:07:02 <amiller> one problem is that this is a lottery you can only play on eligius :p
579 2013-12-10 05:07:05 <amiller> it uses non-standard transactions
580 2013-12-10 05:07:14 duckx has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
581 2013-12-10 05:07:20 <amiller> but... my gambling wallet can still make use of spv bloom filters and stuff to find them easily.
582 2013-12-10 05:08:50 duckx has joined
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584 2013-12-10 05:11:54 duckxxx has joined
585 2013-12-10 05:13:25 <andytoshi> ok, thx everyone for participating in the coinjoin -- i'll start collecting signatures tomorrow afternoon/evening
586 2013-12-10 05:13:36 <andytoshi> until then, anyone who wants to join is welcome to
587 2013-12-10 05:13:43 <andytoshi> for now i'm going to bed
588 2013-12-10 05:14:16 <lechuga> coinjoin?
589 2013-12-10 05:14:40 duckx has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
590 2013-12-10 05:14:43 <lechuga> nm ic
591 2013-12-10 05:17:31 <lechuga> is this like tor for the blockchain
592 2013-12-10 05:18:02 <amiller> pretty close.
593 2013-12-10 05:18:20 <amiller> though it's a little more like the old mixmailers
594 2013-12-10 05:18:28 <amiller> it's a little slower and less automated as tor.
595 2013-12-10 05:19:10 <gmaxwell> 20:53 < andytoshi> i suppose the first few people to sign pretty-much have to reveal their hand
596 2013-12-10 05:20:23 <gmaxwell> thats why I talked about chaum tokens. There is no reason the service needs to be able to break people's privacy. Esp it's easy to achieve security in the "honest but curious" model, where the server might snoop if it was easy, but wouldn't outright behave maliciously
597 2013-12-10 05:20:47 <amiller> yeah, also there are flat-out straightforward to use implementation of chaum tokens
598 2013-12-10 05:20:51 <amiller> like Lucre
599 2013-12-10 05:20:55 <amiller> by ben laurie
600 2013-12-10 05:21:07 <gmaxwell> maaku implemented chaum blinding. it's trivial
601 2013-12-10 05:21:33 <kjj> what's the short version of implementing chaums for coinjoin?
602 2013-12-10 05:22:54 <gmaxwell> You take your output address and blind it. You give me an input you want to spend and your blinded output address. I sign the blinded output address and return it. You unblind.. and come back later from a new tor connection and give me the address with my signature on it.
603 2013-12-10 05:23:01 <lechuga> hmm chaum tokens
604 2013-12-10 05:23:32 <gmaxwell> if there is more than one output token I need to use one public key per value, these could be well known so I couldn't substitute easily to deanonymize people
605 2013-12-10 05:23:42 <kjj> what does blinding look like, and what kind of signature survives the inverse operation?
606 2013-12-10 05:24:21 Subo1977_ has joined
607 2013-12-10 05:24:42 darkee has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
608 2013-12-10 05:25:20 <gmaxwell> kjj: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blind_signature#Blind_RSA_signatures.5B2.5D:235
609 2013-12-10 05:26:54 <gmaxwell> the attack that exists in this system is either when the server can watermark via changing the keys... or if it makes you meet up with nothing but sybils.
610 2013-12-10 05:27:23 <gmaxwell> the former you can design out easily enough, the latter is probably harder to design out.
611 2013-12-10 05:27:42 Subo1977 has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
612 2013-12-10 05:27:48 <gmaxwell> but the blind signature thing is so simple to do, it kinda seems silly to not do it in a complete system.
613 2013-12-10 05:27:51 <kjj> ok, so the signature passes ordinary verification?
614 2013-12-10 05:27:58 <gmaxwell> kjj: yes.
615 2013-12-10 05:28:55 <kjj> can the signer publish a large list of pubkeys in advance and let each participant pick ones at random to use?
616 2013-12-10 05:29:51 darkee has joined
617 2013-12-10 05:30:16 <kjj> and when you say you need multiple pubkeys for multiple outputs, do you mean per batch, or ever?
618 2013-12-10 05:30:50 <gmaxwell> yes, but what if each participant picks a different one? one possiblity would be for some cryptosystems (e.g. blind signing with ec-schnorr) to just derrive the pubkey with server_root+H(value)
619 2013-12-10 05:31:47 <gmaxwell> kjj: you want the server not to be able to tell two otherwise equal outputs apart. If those two outputs use two different keys, the server can.
620 2013-12-10 05:32:27 <gmaxwell> what you also don't want is someone giving you a 1 BTC input and then trying to give you a 5 btc output so there must be some binding on the values.
621 2013-12-10 05:33:12 <kjj> gmaxwell: the way I'm designing my system, all outputs will be equal, and all inputs must be at least that amount
622 2013-12-10 05:33:31 <gmaxwell> then you only need one key.
623 2013-12-10 05:33:35 <maaku> kjj: there's really no reason to mandate equal size outputs
624 2013-12-10 05:33:53 <gmaxwell> but yea, seems like a needless constrant, even if its preferred.
625 2013-12-10 05:34:16 <kjj> it makes it easier to assemble transactions
626 2013-12-10 05:34:19 <maaku> my protocol has a setup phase where someone suggests batches of output sizes (based on constraints provided by the participants)
627 2013-12-10 05:34:33 <maaku> the joiner then generates a unique key per batch
628 2013-12-10 05:35:21 <kjj> ok, so your join would have (n outputs of 1 BTC, m outputs of 0.5 BTC, o outputs of .25 BTC, etc?
629 2013-12-10 05:35:52 yubrew has joined
630 2013-12-10 05:36:19 <kjj> and then people could pick the output(s) they need and provide at least that much input?
631 2013-12-10 05:37:01 agnostic98 has joined
632 2013-12-10 05:37:13 <kjj> yeah, that can work.
633 2013-12-10 05:38:19 patcon has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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635 2013-12-10 05:39:40 <kjj> is there a EC version of blind signing?
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639 2013-12-10 05:41:52 <gmaxwell> kjj: sure, but not for ecdsa (except obnoxiously)
640 2013-12-10 05:42:21 cfhi has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
641 2013-12-10 05:42:38 <gmaxwell> schnorr is trivial to blind.
642 2013-12-10 05:43:12 sustrik has joined
643 2013-12-10 05:43:13 <warren> gmaxwell: saw someone posted a patch to adjust bitcoin to use fedora's openssl?
644 2013-12-10 05:43:20 <gmaxwell> which might result in a tidy thing where you just sign with pubkey+H(amount) and then the person gives you the unblinded value w/ amount.
645 2013-12-10 05:43:33 <kjj> are there common command line tools for this?
646 2013-12-10 05:43:34 <gmaxwell> warren: yea, by copying the parts of openssl fedora has off into bitcoin. lol
647 2013-12-10 05:43:37 patcon has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
648 2013-12-10 05:43:40 <gmaxwell> kjj: nope.
649 2013-12-10 05:44:00 <kjj> hmm
650 2013-12-10 05:44:08 <gmaxwell> could be pretty easily. (just some minor modification to ed25519 code)
651 2013-12-10 05:44:39 <kjj> this ends up being a client/server thing. the client needs to be able to do the blinding
652 2013-12-10 05:45:29 <warren> gmaxwell: so in other words, they have dumb reasons for not shipping the relevant parts of EC
653 2013-12-10 05:45:35 <gmaxwell> IIRC you don't have to change the validation process to do ed25519... just add a blinding function, and a signing function that injests a blinded value.
654 2013-12-10 05:45:53 profreid has joined
655 2013-12-10 05:46:36 <kjj> ok, well, I'm going to stick to unblinded for my first run
656 2013-12-10 05:46:44 diki has joined
657 2013-12-10 05:46:54 <kjj> mostly so that people won't need to install anything special to use it
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661 2013-12-10 05:47:43 <kjj> well, other than some scripts to convert the BIP10 request into something that bitcoind can sign, and then back into BIP10 submission form
662 2013-12-10 05:48:28 <gmaxwell> ed25519 in javscript has lots of hits. But sure, I don't think there is anything wrong in doing something first thats simple.
663 2013-12-10 05:48:59 <gmaxwell> I think a complete tool should do the blinding because its just some code... one time cost.
664 2013-12-10 05:49:47 <kjj> asking people to install strange new crap on their boxes seem like a bit much for a proof of concept
665 2013-12-10 05:50:53 <kjj> when there are dozens of coinjoiner nodes running, or when ever bitcoin node is one by default, we can put that stuff in the client so that it can churn your coins while you sleep
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668 2013-12-10 06:00:21 <kjj> ooh. "Legacy banking system". just the right level of condescension
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673 2013-12-10 06:10:04 <grau> gmaxwell: did the test case I sent you made sense? Could you please tell me what shatoshi dislikes or what digest it uses?
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703 2013-12-10 06:42:58 <maaku> kjj: somewhere on my todo list is figuring out how to wrangle ed25519 into doing schnorr blind sigs as gmaxwell describes, for the purpose of coinjoin
704 2013-12-10 06:43:06 <maaku> in the mean time rsa works fine
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707 2013-12-10 06:43:56 <maaku> and rsa you "don't have to install anything special"
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727 2013-12-10 07:02:51 <gmaxwell> grau: So I get hash 11646b8f1ef3e60daa4e85a177e6d95c4f2d99d1e88cd15ad5c03c25cdd65ae1 on both your bad transaction and the one generated by bitcoind that passes.
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729 2013-12-10 07:03:04 <gmaxwell> I can verify that the ECDSA validation is actually failing.
730 2013-12-10 07:03:33 toffoo has joined
731 2013-12-10 07:03:59 <grau> gmaxwell: thanks a lot that is some new pointer. I check the hash.
732 2013-12-10 07:06:26 <Blaster> when using bitcoin-qt on ubuntu how do I find out where my wallet and blockchain data is stored?
733 2013-12-10 07:06:43 <Blaster> I want to use the torrent version of the blockchain so I don't have to wait a long time to get caught up
734 2013-12-10 07:07:29 Plarkplark_ has joined
735 2013-12-10 07:07:51 <Blaster> actually I think I may have found it, inside ~/.bitcoin
736 2013-12-10 07:07:53 <Plarkplark_> Hello. I am having consistent problems with bitcoind on Debian stable.
737 2013-12-10 07:08:00 <Plarkplark_> getinfo displays: Warning: Displayed transactions may not be correct! You may need to upgrade, or other nodes may need to upgrade.
738 2013-12-10 07:08:04 <Plarkplark_> "version" : 80500,
739 2013-12-10 07:08:22 <Plarkplark_> is the node functional? Or do I need to take action?
740 2013-12-10 07:08:42 jaitaiwan has joined
741 2013-12-10 07:09:25 <gmaxwell> Plarkplark_: grep nvalid ~/.bitcoin/debug.log
742 2013-12-10 07:09:53 <Plarkplark_> a lot of these
743 2013-12-10 07:09:54 <Plarkplark_> InvalidChainFound: current best=0000000000001e5aedcfabd7acfadc75fcd8fd38142cce66f60416b2ed56d19b height=128969 log2_work=63.481279 date=2011-06-06 07:49:05
744 2013-12-10 07:09:57 <Plarkplark_> InvalidChainFound: Warning: Displayed transactions may not be correct! You may need to upgrade, or other nodes may need to upgrade.
745 2013-12-10 07:10:19 <Plarkplark_> mostly 2011/2012 dated.
746 2013-12-10 07:10:34 [\\\] has joined
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748 2013-12-10 07:11:25 <gmaxwell> Plarkplark_: you are in a severly corrupted state. knowing the first error before it started producing those might be interesting.
749 2013-12-10 07:11:45 <Plarkplark_> ouch. I just took 24 hours to get synced.
750 2013-12-10 07:12:05 <Plarkplark_> it did bug out at one time because of memory issues, increased mem for it.
751 2013-12-10 07:12:10 <Plarkplark_> any way to rebuild?
752 2013-12-10 07:13:08 <gmaxwell> Plarkplark_: -reindex but something is screwy ... you also haven't made it very var in the validation at all.
753 2013-12-10 07:13:52 <Plarkplark_> its runnig
754 2013-12-10 07:13:57 <Plarkplark_> ProcessBlock: ACCEPTED
755 2013-12-10 07:13:57 <Plarkplark_> SetBestChain: new best=00000000712bcf48c796bd4fb485910002e165614a93e48bfb7608953f5c8c37 height=13175 log2_work=45.685647 tx=13288 date=2009-05-03 21:59:54 progress=0.000221
756 2013-12-10 07:14:04 <grau> gmaxwell: yes, I have a different hash as expected.
757 2013-12-10 07:14:07 <Plarkplark_> So maybe interesting where it goes wrong.
758 2013-12-10 07:14:34 <grau> gmaxwell: could you do one more favor and also dump what is hashed (in hex) by satoshi?
759 2013-12-10 07:14:39 <gmaxwell> grau: okay so now explain how you don't fail the txn signed by bitcoind? :P
760 2013-12-10 07:14:43 <benten> gmaxwell: whats the max number of blocks that can be reversed at a given time?
761 2013-12-10 07:15:14 <gmaxwell> benten: all of them? .. its not clear to me what you're asking.
762 2013-12-10 07:15:15 <grau> gmaxwell: I know it is more than strange, but we are probably one step from solving the puzzle.
763 2013-12-10 07:16:28 <gmaxwell> I will grab.
764 2013-12-10 07:16:57 <gmaxwell> the only difference I saw was your signature (I think?) was one byte shorter in one of the signatures.
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766 2013-12-10 07:17:31 <benten> gmaxwell: could you go 100 blocks backwards, reproduce all the work and then push them all at once as a new block chain if you could outpace the current network?
767 2013-12-10 07:18:42 <benten> In short I'm just asking if there is a limit on the amount of work you could do in the past in regards to how reversing blocks works.
768 2013-12-10 07:18:57 <Plarkplark_> gmaxwell: getting hundreds of thse now
769 2013-12-10 07:18:58 <Plarkplark_> ProcessBlock: ORPHAN BLOCK, prev=000000000000043c19be2e9c55f83dcdb3fd966a70df2dc34785a71e54792cc8
770 2013-12-10 07:19:12 <benten> hm
771 2013-12-10 07:19:23 <gmaxwell> benten: absolutely, if you could enormously outpace the network.
772 2013-12-10 07:19:46 <gmaxwell> benten: any prohibition on that creates network destroying forever inconsistency risk.
773 2013-12-10 07:20:14 madfish has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
774 2013-12-10 07:20:37 <benten> gmaxwell: thanks, that answers my curiosity about transaction reversale
775 2013-12-10 07:21:49 VinceSamios has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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777 2013-12-10 07:21:51 <Plarkplark_> gmaxwell: up to a few thousand of those ORPHAN blocks now.
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779 2013-12-10 07:23:05 <benten> gmax, thats why you need about 25 confirmations before a transaction is considered to be 'fairly secure' from being reversed, right?
780 2013-12-10 07:23:52 rethaw has joined
781 2013-12-10 07:24:28 <gmaxwell> it depends on the value in question... most people are looking for 6 confirmst most of the time.
782 2013-12-10 07:24:32 yubrew has joined
783 2013-12-10 07:24:51 <gmaxwell> there is a formula in the bitcoin whitepaper, where you can plug in attacker hashpower and get back successrates.
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788 2013-12-10 07:26:29 <Plarkplark_> benten, it's a balance of hashing power, value, trust
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790 2013-12-10 07:26:46 <Plarkplark_> if you make million dollars worth transaction, wait 6 or maybe 10-ish confirms
791 2013-12-10 07:27:04 <Plarkplark_> if you pay 100 bucks, I would wait 1 confirm if I did not trust the person
792 2013-12-10 07:27:16 <Plarkplark_> if you pay for beer, 0 confirm would be considered "fine".
793 2013-12-10 07:29:20 <gmaxwell> Plarkplark_: 1 confirm is not terribly secure, hashpowerless attackers can reverse 1 confirm with fair chance just by multiannouncing and hoping for a natural fork.
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796 2013-12-10 07:31:04 <benten> this is weird. ive been mining on 50btc for the last month and their pool fees appear to be 100%
797 2013-12-10 07:31:41 <phantomcircuit> benten, go to sleep fool
798 2013-12-10 07:31:55 <benten> okâ¦. :)
799 2013-12-10 07:32:15 benten has quit (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzzâ¦)
800 2013-12-10 07:32:41 <Plarkplark_> yeah but for 100 bucks?
801 2013-12-10 07:33:38 <phantomcircuit> lol
802 2013-12-10 07:33:48 <grau> gmaxwell: NO the hashes are identical, you just printed in reverse order!
803 2013-12-10 07:33:49 <gmaxwell> benten: https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Comparison_of_mining_pools < as you can see, their fees are indeed 100%
804 2013-12-10 07:37:11 <grau> gmaxwell: this must be some difference in the signature itself
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806 2013-12-10 07:38:39 <Plarkplark_> gmaxwell: sigh. Im just going to redown the blockchain again
807 2013-12-10 07:38:44 <gmaxwell> grau: hm ... any chance you're just truncating a byte off it or something.
808 2013-12-10 07:38:55 <gmaxwell> Plarkplark_: it won't help you.
809 2013-12-10 07:39:02 <gmaxwell> Plarkplark_: there is something wrong with your setup.
810 2013-12-10 07:39:09 <gmaxwell> Plarkplark_: where did your bitcoin come from?
811 2013-12-10 07:39:27 <Plarkplark_> http://sourceforge.net/projects/bitcoin/files/Bitcoin/
812 2013-12-10 07:40:11 <gmaxwell> Plarkplark_: are you running the binary from there or did you compile it?
813 2013-12-10 07:40:20 <Plarkplark_> binary. copied to /usr/bin
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815 2013-12-10 07:41:00 <gmaxwell> Were you able to go through the debug.log and find the first Invalid instance? if you've since tried reindexing it's probably been blown out of the log.
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818 2013-12-10 07:42:07 <Plarkplark_> Yes. Therefore i'm trying again. Will p ost back with results.
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820 2013-12-10 07:42:27 <Plarkplark_> I have a lot of CPU power and memory at my disposal wanted to help btc network by running a few big nodes.
821 2013-12-10 07:43:29 <Plarkplark_> downloading the bootstrap.dat this time. -loadblock=./bootstrap.dat ?
822 2013-12-10 07:44:07 <gmaxwell> no. just put it in the directory, you don't need to loadblock it
823 2013-12-10 07:44:31 <Plarkplark_> it auto detects it? put in .bitcoin/ directly?
824 2013-12-10 07:44:43 <gmaxwell> though its likely you have hardware problems, I wanted to see the initial error to get an idea of memory or disk / disk bus were more likely the problem.
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826 2013-12-10 07:44:47 <gmaxwell> Plarkplark_: yes.
827 2013-12-10 07:45:01 <Plarkplark_> i think it bugged out when the mem was only 512mb ;)
828 2013-12-10 07:45:07 <Plarkplark_> 4GB now
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831 2013-12-10 07:47:54 <grau> gmaxwell: This drives me mad. You said one of the sigs would be shorter. I do not see that. It looks like that on brainwallet.org but it is only because the proportional font it uses.
832 2013-12-10 07:48:29 <gmaxwell> you can see it directly in the serialization
833 2013-12-10 07:48:32 <gmaxwell> 48 vs 47
834 2013-12-10 07:48:41 <gmaxwell> (hex)
835 2013-12-10 07:49:50 <grau> you are right the tx serialization is longer.
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871 2013-12-10 08:45:44 <Krellan> Hmm - fresh compile of 0.8.6 failed for me, the old boost chrono unresolved reference problem
872 2013-12-10 08:45:49 <Krellan> but 0.8.5 and latest Git worked.
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878 2013-12-10 08:55:12 <grau> gmaxwell: actually one of the satoshi signatures is shorter. BOP has two of same size.
879 2013-12-10 08:55:47 Gabralkhan has joined
880 2013-12-10 08:55:47 <grau> gmaxwell: I reparsed both transactions manually and evaluated both sets of signatures. They are all valid on the same hash.
881 2013-12-10 08:56:57 <grau> curramba: I am tired mixed up.
882 2013-12-10 08:57:10 <grau> gmaxwell: hold on I have to recheck what I did.
883 2013-12-10 09:01:33 <Krellan> Got it, was able to fix the boost chrono problem.
884 2013-12-10 09:02:29 <Krellan> Needed to add to makefile.unix, under the LIBS += block, -l boost_chrono$(BOOST_LIB_SUFFIX) and -l rt
885 2013-12-10 09:02:38 <Krellan> That worked.
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893 2013-12-10 09:07:44 <Krellan> Same for the bitcoin-qt: had to add -lboost_chrono -lrt to the end of the big LIBS line in Makefile. That worked. Also did qmake BDB_INCLUDE_PATH=/usr/include/db4.8 otherwise it didn't find it.
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897 2013-12-10 09:13:29 <Stephen> I'm looking to do some work similar in tech to what http://www.prrofofextistence.com. Anyone have a small task I could complete for them to earn 0.00005 BTC?
898 2013-12-10 09:15:01 <Stephen> Or, if you can spare more, I'll happily develop something comparable to the fee
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902 2013-12-10 09:19:48 <Stephen> Note: 0.00005 BTC = $0.05 USD
903 2013-12-10 09:20:35 <wumpus> Krellan: yes, the crappyness of the build system is well-known, that's why 0.9.x switched to autotools which should auto-detect more
904 2013-12-10 09:20:55 <Stephen> Or, if anyone can direct me to something similar to Amazon Turk which pays in BTC, I'll gladly work it through
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906 2013-12-10 09:24:06 <grau> gmaxwell: I rechecked. My previous parse is correct. One of the satoshi signatures is shorter.
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908 2013-12-10 09:27:11 <grau> sipa: is there a guide of what canonical checks are in place? I am fighting with signature not accepted by satoshi.
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920 2013-12-10 09:38:26 <deanclkclk> 1 BTC stored as 100,000,000 (one-hundred-million of the smallest possible bitcoin unit)
921 2013-12-10 09:38:38 <deanclkclk> folks question....I reading the wiki on bitcoin money handling and i"m not sure of this:
922 2013-12-10 09:38:48 rdymac has joined
923 2013-12-10 09:38:49 <deanclkclk> " 1 BTC stored as 100,000,000 (one-hundred-million of the smallest possible bitcoin unit)"
924 2013-12-10 09:38:55 <deanclkclk> can someone explain?
925 2013-12-10 09:40:12 reneg has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
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930 2013-12-10 09:44:26 <shesek> the smallest unit of bitcoins is 0.00000001. there are 100,000,000 of those in 1 BTC
931 2013-12-10 09:44:53 <sipa> Blaster: use getreceivedbyaddress when walletnotify fires
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941 2013-12-10 09:53:52 <sipa> grau: i mailed it to the mailinglist once, and there is a reference in the source code
942 2013-12-10 09:53:55 <sipa> let me find it
943 2013-12-10 09:54:17 <grau> could it be that checks are stricter for P2SH?
944 2013-12-10 09:54:33 Stephen_g has joined
945 2013-12-10 09:54:38 <grau> I do not seem to run into any problem or difference but only for P2SH redemption.
946 2013-12-10 09:55:08 <Plarkplark_> gmaxwell: using the bootstrap did the trick. I think the blockchain got corrupted deu to low memory at initial sync over p2p
947 2013-12-10 09:55:09 <sipa> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/blob/master/src/script.cpp#L256
948 2013-12-10 09:56:08 <grau> I see, but strange is that my signatures were always accepted until I tried to use P2SH
949 2013-12-10 09:56:33 <grau> I wen through with gmawell that digest calculation for my signatures is correct
950 2013-12-10 09:56:42 <grau> also in P2SH case.
951 2013-12-10 09:57:01 Stephen has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
952 2013-12-10 09:58:15 cfhi has joined
953 2013-12-10 09:59:26 <ThomasZ> Is it possible to make my bitcoin-qt flush old blocks? To lower the memory footprint.
954 2013-12-10 09:59:37 <ThomasZ> or, actually, on-disk footprint
955 2013-12-10 09:59:45 bartfataitamas has joined
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960 2013-12-10 10:00:50 <ThomasZ> Stephen: want to earn money? Come to my place and do some vacuum cleaning ;)
961 2013-12-10 10:01:36 <Stephen> ThomasZ: LOL, If I could earn a few fractions of BTC in the DFW area vacuuming, I'd do so.
962 2013-12-10 10:01:53 <ThomasZ> :D
963 2013-12-10 10:02:41 t7 has joined
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966 2013-12-10 10:02:54 <v3ry3l33te> ThomasZ, impossible as of now
967 2013-12-10 10:03:22 <ThomasZ> v3ry3l33te: ok, thanks for the answer.
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977 2013-12-10 10:09:29 <deanclkclk> so folks...to run the bitcoin client as a server...I download the bitcoin-qt client?
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981 2013-12-10 10:10:55 <e-dard> deanclkclk: If you mean run it on a server as a daemon, there is a headless version
982 2013-12-10 10:11:10 <deanclkclk> what's the url?
983 2013-12-10 10:11:14 <deanclkclk> yes e-dard
984 2013-12-10 10:11:43 <e-dard> It's on github with the QT client I believe
985 2013-12-10 10:12:09 yubrew has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
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990 2013-12-10 10:15:19 <mrkent> does paytxfee=0.00 mean no fees paid on all transactions?
991 2013-12-10 10:20:33 Stephen_i has joined
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1000 2013-12-10 10:33:50 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|mrkent: it means no fees paid on transactions that meet the rules for free transactions
1001 2013-12-10 10:34:08 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|See ,,(bc,wiki transaction fees)
1002 2013-12-10 10:34:09 <gribble> https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Transaction_fees | Nov 19, 2013 ... Transaction fees may be included with any transfer of bitcoins from one address to another. At the moment, many transactions are typically ...
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1004 2013-12-10 10:36:42 <mrkent> michagogo|cloud, okay thanks
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1012 2013-12-10 10:40:59 <Plarkplark_> Hello
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1014 2013-12-10 10:41:16 <Plarkplark_> What are the bandwith stats for a full bitcoin node? Are we talking 10's 100s or 1000s of GB per month?
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1018 2013-12-10 10:43:11 <Stephen> Wow, the sheer bombardment...
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1020 2013-12-10 10:43:27 <Plarkplark_> ?
1021 2013-12-10 10:44:48 <Stephen> Sorry, offhand comment
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1023 2013-12-10 10:45:30 <ThomasZ> Plarkplark_: the full database of all blocks since the beginning of time is 15Gb.
1024 2013-12-10 10:45:47 <ThomasZ> Plarkplark_: you can extrapolate from there ;)
1025 2013-12-10 10:46:23 <Plarkplark_> ThomasZ: Yes, but once I have a node running with tweaked max_connections (to help network) and having 1Gb uplink to the internet, what can I expect?
1026 2013-12-10 10:46:47 <ThomasZ> Plarkplark_: that it runs just fine ?
1027 2013-12-10 10:46:47 <Plarkplark_> 100 or 1000GB is not a problem (a month) but multiple TB a month would make this costly.
1028 2013-12-10 10:47:30 <ThomasZ> you only download the full blocks once in your lifetime. So I doubt you'll have to worry
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1031 2013-12-10 10:48:07 <Plarkplark_> yes, but the node would be uploading a lot..
1032 2013-12-10 10:49:44 <ThomasZ> it would? Seems you know already :)
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1037 2013-12-10 10:52:08 <tablecoder> let's say i create a bali transaction (offline without sending it, such as like this: http://brainwallet.org/#tx)
1038 2013-12-10 10:52:25 <grau> sipa: I implemented and went though all isCanonical checks and the BOP signatures are ok with them. I just can not figure why satoshi rejects the transaction.
1039 2013-12-10 10:53:15 <tablecoder> how do i a) get the transaction ID from it, and b) can i create another offline transaction using the outputs from my previous offline transaction as inputs to a new transaction, and c) if i send the first transaction, then the second immediately after, will both transactions successfully go through?
1040 2013-12-10 10:53:36 <grau> sipa: These transactions are needed for the BTC1K party ticket sale...
1041 2013-12-10 10:54:11 <Plarkplark_> ThomasZ: Im asking the question :( - how much uploading does a node do?
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1045 2013-12-10 10:55:19 <grau> Any chance someone could figure why the transaction http://pastebin.com/ANeJEtS7 is rejected by satoshi?
1046 2013-12-10 10:56:09 hnz has joined
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1048 2013-12-10 10:56:19 <grau> I wen through checking inputs digests signed canonical signature. Everything I could come up with. Signatures appear to be valid with Bouncy castle but somehow rejected by satoshi client.
1049 2013-12-10 10:57:31 <grau> The BTC 1000$ ticket sale is pending on resolution of this issue. Please help.
1050 2013-12-10 10:57:34 <ThomasZ> Plarkplark_: As said, I don't know. I expect it to be trivial amounts compared to your limits.
1051 2013-12-10 10:58:59 <Plarkplark_> ok thanks
1052 2013-12-10 10:59:22 <Plarkplark_> One more question: Opening ICMP, 8333 is enough?
1053 2013-12-10 11:00:46 taha has joined
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1055 2013-12-10 11:03:43 <ThomasZ> Plarkplark_: Not ICMP, just UDP. Other than that, yes.
1056 2013-12-10 11:04:08 <ThomasZ> Plarkplark_: actually its 8882 here...
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1059 2013-12-10 11:06:44 <Plarkplark_> ok. And udp what ports?
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1065 2013-12-10 11:15:46 <dansmith_btc> HI, I'm struggling to setup gitian following https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/tree/master/contrib/gitian-descriptors. I'm on Ubuntu 12.10 and I get weird errors when running "bin/make-base-vm --arch amd64". Could someone confirm that gitian instructions worked for him?
1066 2013-12-10 11:16:09 jtimon has joined
1067 2013-12-10 11:18:27 <dansmith_btc> Or alternatively, I should probably launch a virtualbox 12.04 stock iso ubuntu and setup gitian that way.
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1071 2013-12-10 11:22:52 <stonecoldpat> grau: Are you signing a simplified version of the transaction?
1072 2013-12-10 11:23:17 <grau> stonecoldpat: I do not know what you mean with simplified
1073 2013-12-10 11:23:44 <grau> I am signing the same digest satoshi does.
1074 2013-12-10 11:24:19 <stonecoldpat> they talk about it here https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=244314.0
1075 2013-12-10 11:24:20 <grau> I have a version of the same transaction signed by satoshi and can validate both set of signatures with the same transaction digest
1076 2013-12-10 11:24:26 <stonecoldpat> but if its the same digest then it should be ok
1077 2013-12-10 11:24:49 <stonecoldpat> well actually, what do you mean by digest
1078 2013-12-10 11:24:51 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|dansmith_btc: I assume you cloned github:devrandom/gitian-builder?
1079 2013-12-10 11:25:18 <dansmith_btc> michagogo|cloud, I did acc. to bitcoin github page
1080 2013-12-10 11:25:18 <grau> The signatures are a function of a transaction digest (hash)
1081 2013-12-10 11:25:35 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|dansmith_btc: follow the readme of that repo
1082 2013-12-10 11:25:39 <lianj> grau: you mean the signature hash?
1083 2013-12-10 11:25:44 <grau> It is not the transaction hash in common sense as transaction is modified before signature
1084 2013-12-10 11:25:54 <grau> yes I mean signature hash
1085 2013-12-10 11:26:29 <lianj> ok and you checked that you generate the same signature hash as bitcoind does for you testing/example tx?
1086 2013-12-10 11:26:32 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|I've done it in precise and raring -- haven't tried it in quantal, but I may be able to help out
1087 2013-12-10 11:27:24 <dansmith_btc> michagogo|cloud, I will setup a pristine 12.04 vbox VM and then try afresh
1088 2013-12-10 11:27:24 <grau> Here the two sets of signatures: http://pastebin.com/inr9d3G1
1089 2013-12-10 11:27:44 <lianj> for the resulting signature, did you put a signature hash_type on it when adding it as input finally
1090 2013-12-10 11:27:51 <grau> sure
1091 2013-12-10 11:28:05 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|dansmith_btc: note that if you're running in a VM, you won't be able to use qemu-kvm
1092 2013-12-10 11:28:13 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|You need to use lxc
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1094 2013-12-10 11:28:33 <grau> wait...
1095 2013-12-10 11:28:53 <grau> the signature hashType is added before computing the signature hash
1096 2013-12-10 11:29:02 <grau> that is what you mean?
1097 2013-12-10 11:29:48 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|dansmith_btc: what machine are you trying to run gitian on with quantal?
1098 2013-12-10 11:29:51 <lianj> no afterwards, it doesn't matter because the signaturehash doesn't/can't include your input script (with your signrature and that hash_type) aynway
1099 2013-12-10 11:30:21 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|And does the CPU have hardware virtualization support?
1100 2013-12-10 11:30:38 <dansmith_btc> michagogo|cloud, yes VT support is there
1101 2013-12-10 11:31:05 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|What error(s) are you getting?
1102 2013-12-10 11:31:35 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|;;google --lucky inurl:devrandom gitian site:github.com
1103 2013-12-10 11:31:36 <gribble> https://github.com/devrandom/gitian-builder
1104 2013-12-10 11:32:35 <grau> yes, hasType is also appended to signature and it is SIGHASH_ALL in all cases
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1106 2013-12-10 11:34:09 <dansmith_btc> michagogo|cloud, the errorlog: http://pastie.org/8541793
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1108 2013-12-10 11:34:19 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|dansmith_btc: what errors are you getting? (And, I assume you installed all the prereqs from https://github.com/devrandom/gitian-builder/blob/master/README.md?)
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1112 2013-12-10 11:35:42 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|Hmm
1113 2013-12-10 11:35:45 <lianj> grau: you are saying http://pastebin.com/inr9d3G1 the --BOP parts are invalid?
1114 2013-12-10 11:35:56 <dansmith_btc> michagogo|cloud, yes dependencies are exact same ones in both readmes
1115 2013-12-10 11:36:12 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|dansmith_btc: --suite quantal is one thing I've never seen used/tried
1116 2013-12-10 11:36:23 <grau> lianj: yes they are rejected by satoshi
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1118 2013-12-10 11:36:50 <grau> they are from the transaction http://pastebin.com/ANeJEtS7
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1120 2013-12-10 11:37:07 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|dansmith_btc: try it with lucid or precise
1121 2013-12-10 11:37:18 <dansmith_btc> michagogo|cloud, I can rerun wit lucid but it will take a while
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1124 2013-12-10 11:37:53 <lianj> grau: you have a different error though. the signatures look fine: http://paste.mhanne.net/raw/f9c7dd533b3db9df50b18c1bb3e9436ebce5b3b5
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1127 2013-12-10 11:38:20 <grau> That is the puzzle
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1129 2013-12-10 11:38:37 <grau> If you try to send the raw transaction to satoshi it rejects it
1130 2013-12-10 11:38:43 <lianj> yes but the signatures aren't wrong. something else is
1131 2013-12-10 11:38:48 <grau> although here is the transaction parse:
1132 2013-12-10 11:39:02 <lianj> so http://pastebin.com/ANeJEtS7 is what you want to send and generated on your own?
1133 2013-12-10 11:39:42 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|dansmith_btc: what are you looking to gbuild?
1134 2013-12-10 11:39:50 <grau> yes
1135 2013-12-10 11:40:02 <grau> This is the same manually reparsed http://pastebin.com/EDhKkpg0
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1139 2013-12-10 11:40:57 <lianj> that looks like a redeeming p2sh tx
1140 2013-12-10 11:41:02 <grau> exactluy
1141 2013-12-10 11:41:23 <grau> I never had a problem with my transaction sign/verify until I tried to send P2SH
1142 2013-12-10 11:41:51 <grau> But since I sign the same hash as satoshi and sigs are valid I am puzzled
1143 2013-12-10 11:42:11 ValicekB has joined
1144 2013-12-10 11:42:36 <lianj> i doubt that you sign the same hash. the p2sh case is special for signature hash
1145 2013-12-10 11:43:01 <grau> ERROR: CScriptCheck() : 3d7b6899c8519535f5418cb82e7caed661b613187912af18a98d996a3f4ef680 VerifySignature failed
1146 2013-12-10 11:43:06 <grau> I do sign the same hash
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1148 2013-12-10 11:43:48 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|dansmith_btc: what do you plan to build in gitian?
1149 2013-12-10 11:44:44 <grau> I know how p2sh is special and I am able to verify them if created by satoshi. The verification fails if I forge sigs
1150 2013-12-10 11:44:46 <dansmith_btc> michagogo|cloud, bitcoin first, then my own code
1151 2013-12-10 11:45:28 <grau> Please if you can debug satoshi
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1161 2013-12-10 11:46:18 <grau> run http://pastebin.com/H63Wd6fG
1162 2013-12-10 11:46:29 <grau> and tell me why exactly it rejects
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1164 2013-12-10 11:47:50 <grau> you can confirm by the way that the correct hash to sign is e15ad6cd253cc0d55ad18ce8d1992d4f5cd9e677a1854eaa0de6f31e8f6b6411 (not that this is straight not reverse order as for blocks)
1165 2013-12-10 11:50:16 <lianj> yes e15ad6cd253cc0d55ad18ce8d1992d4f5cd9e677a1854eaa0de6f31e8f6b6411
1166 2013-12-10 11:50:29 <lianj> but the tx looks ok from my viewpoint.
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1168 2013-12-10 11:51:00 <grau> everithing looks ok except it is not accepted :(
1169 2013-12-10 11:51:17 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|dansmith_btc: For current bitcoin (0.8.x and earlier) you do need lucid VMs
1170 2013-12-10 11:51:31 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|One each i386 and amd64
1171 2013-12-10 11:51:32 <lianj> grau: which bitcoind and which error message?
1172 2013-12-10 11:52:22 <dansmith_btc> michagogo|cloud, why 2 architectures, I'm on 64, do i still need a 32 bit vm ?
1173 2013-12-10 11:52:33 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|For bitcoin, yes
1174 2013-12-10 11:52:39 <grau> Bitcoin version v0.8.5-beta (2013-09-12 13:35:18 +1000)
1175 2013-12-10 11:52:56 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|The Linux build is actually 2 builds, one for each architecture
1176 2013-12-10 11:53:09 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|I think current git head (and therefore 0.9) might have upgraded to precise, by the way
1177 2013-12-10 11:53:26 <grau> ERROR: CScriptCheck() : 3d7b6899c8519535f5418cb82e7caed661b613187912af18a98d996a3f4ef680 VerifySignature failed
1178 2013-12-10 11:53:29 <grau> is in the log
1179 2013-12-10 11:53:38 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|(I'd check and tell you for sure, but I'm on my phone atm)
1180 2013-12-10 11:53:40 <grau> this is an other similar tx
1181 2013-12-10 11:54:01 gigavps has joined
1182 2013-12-10 11:54:52 <lianj> ERROR: CScriptCheck() : c36efe11c9f2d854c1111f01fc4ba644935e4dbc7fec7748921e64d0fdc18d73 VerifySignature failed
1183 2013-12-10 11:54:57 <lianj> yes hm
1184 2013-12-10 11:55:08 <grau> thanks for confirming
1185 2013-12-10 11:55:24 yubrew has joined
1186 2013-12-10 11:55:51 <grau> It is really a show stopper for me. I plan to start ticket sales for the BTC1K party in Frankfurt with a P2SH vault and this breaks the schedule....
1187 2013-12-10 11:56:13 non has quit (Quit: Leaving)
1188 2013-12-10 11:56:52 <grau> I should have started yesterday actually ... https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=285771.0;topicseen
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1190 2013-12-10 11:57:35 pankaj_ has joined
1191 2013-12-10 11:57:44 <lianj> grau: pm'd you
1192 2013-12-10 11:58:24 <grau> lianj: where?
1193 2013-12-10 11:59:17 <lianj> dunno, somewhere in your client another window/tab should have pop up or blinking
1194 2013-12-10 11:59:32 yubrew has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
1195 2013-12-10 11:59:41 <grau> nope.
1196 2013-12-10 12:00:05 pr3mm has quit (Quit: Leaving)
1197 2013-12-10 12:00:14 <lianj> then pm me
1198 2013-12-10 12:00:19 sserrano44 has joined
1199 2013-12-10 12:01:00 <grau> pm'd you
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1206 2013-12-10 12:05:41 <Blaster> When I run bitcoin-qt from the terminal on Ubuntu and then go do something else, it gets killed
1207 2013-12-10 12:05:55 CheckDavid has joined
1208 2013-12-10 12:05:55 <Blaster> $ bitcoin-qtKilled
1209 2013-12-10 12:06:13 <Blaster> what the heck!
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1224 2013-12-10 12:20:16 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|dansmith_btc: wb
1225 2013-12-10 12:20:23 MrBigglesworth has joined
1226 2013-12-10 12:20:35 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|dansmith_btc: Just checked, and git head does indeed use precise
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1229 2013-12-10 12:23:05 <Blaster> it bitcoin runs out of ram does it just crash?
1230 2013-12-10 12:23:06 <Blaster> if*
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1238 2013-12-10 12:37:59 <dansmith_btc> michagogo|cloud, I'm getting ssh: connect to host localhost port 2223: Connection refused
1239 2013-12-10 12:37:59 <dansmith_btc> ./bin/gbuild:21:in `system!': failed to run on-target true (RuntimeError)
1240 2013-12-10 12:37:59 <dansmith_btc> from ./bin/gbuild:73:in `build_one_configuration'
1241 2013-12-10 12:38:07 <dansmith_btc> do you know what is wrong?
1242 2013-12-10 12:39:29 sserrano44 has joined
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1244 2013-12-10 12:41:18 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|Doing what?
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1246 2013-12-10 12:46:05 <dansmith_btc> michagogo|cloud, running, ./bin/gbuild --commit bitcoin=HEAD ../bitcoin/contrib/gitian-descriptors/gitian.yml
1247 2013-12-10 12:46:49 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|Can you pastebin the terminal scrollback?
1248 2013-12-10 12:46:59 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|And perhaps a ls -a?
1249 2013-12-10 12:47:58 <dansmith_btc> michagogo|cloud, http://pastie.org/8541964 and http://pastie.org/8541965
1250 2013-12-10 12:48:36 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|What do you have checked out in ../bitcoin?
1251 2013-12-10 12:48:38 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|master?
1252 2013-12-10 12:49:23 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|Go to ../bitcoin, `git checkout v0.8.6`
1253 2013-12-10 12:49:24 <dansmith_btc> michagogo|cloud, yes git branch says master
1254 2013-12-10 12:49:28 yubrew has joined
1255 2013-12-10 12:49:30 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|then go back to gitian-builder
1256 2013-12-10 12:49:46 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|`./bin/gbuild --commit bitcoin=v0.8.6 ../bitcoin/contrib/gitian-descriptors/gitian.yml`
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1258 2013-12-10 12:50:23 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|Building current git HEAD is done in a precise VM
1259 2013-12-10 12:50:27 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|not lucid
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1262 2013-12-10 12:51:35 <dansmith_btc> michagogo|cloud, running as you suggested still gives ssh: connect to host localhost port 2223: Connection refused
1263 2013-12-10 12:51:40 serialbandicoot has joined
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1265 2013-12-10 12:55:16 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|Hmm
1266 2013-12-10 12:55:36 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|I'm not that familiar with gitian's internals
1267 2013-12-10 12:55:39 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|;;seen devrandom
1268 2013-12-10 12:55:40 <gribble> devrandom was last seen in #bitcoin-dev 5 days, 14 hours, 21 minutes, and 50 seconds ago: <devrandom> at least for now
1269 2013-12-10 12:55:56 copumpkin has quit (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzzâ¦)
1270 2013-12-10 12:56:11 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|Hmm, whois says 23 hours idle
1271 2013-12-10 12:56:47 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|dansmith_btc: I'd join #bitcoin-build, mention what you're doing and what's failing over there
1272 2013-12-10 12:57:12 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|And wait a while -- eventually someone will see and help you out
1273 2013-12-10 12:57:32 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|In the meantime, you could try in raring or precise
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1277 2013-12-10 13:08:42 <MoALTz> i have at least 31 orphan blocks in my blk*n.dat files. tempted to write a script to zap them (backing up the original blk files first of course)
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1279 2013-12-10 13:10:33 <Blaster> I copied the blockchain from one computer to another. Then I ran bitcoin-qt -rescan, and it's been doing that for about 30 mins. How long should it take?
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1286 2013-12-10 13:15:11 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|Blaster: Did you include blocks/index/ and chainstate/?
1287 2013-12-10 13:15:35 <Blaster> only blocks/index, not chainstate
1288 2013-12-10 13:15:51 <Blaster> should I copy that over and restart the rescanning? or can it work through it?
1289 2013-12-10 13:15:52 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|So it's more than a rescan
1290 2013-12-10 13:15:54 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|It's a reindex
1291 2013-12-10 13:16:15 <Blaster> oh
1292 2013-12-10 13:16:25 wei__ has joined
1293 2013-12-10 13:16:43 <Blaster> will killing it and copying chainstate make it quicker?
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1297 2013-12-10 13:17:08 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|probably
1298 2013-12-10 13:17:24 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|(but copy over blocks/ again as well)
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1307 2013-12-10 13:22:23 <Blaster> do I need bitcoind for notifywallet?
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1309 2013-12-10 13:23:11 <Blaster> walletnotify I mean
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1335 2013-12-10 13:50:30 <wumpus> Blaster: in contrast to what? -walletnotify should work with the GUI as well AFAIK (never tested though)
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1394 2013-12-10 14:21:31 <Plarkplark_> ;;info
1395 2013-12-10 14:21:31 <gribble> Error: The command "info" is available in the Factoids, GPG, MessageParser, and RSS plugins. Please specify the plugin whose command you wish to call by using its name as a command before "info".
1396 2013-12-10 14:21:34 <Plarkplark_> ;;blocks
1397 2013-12-10 14:21:34 <gribble> 274177
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1413 2013-12-10 14:31:49 <Plarkplark_> ;;blocks
1414 2013-12-10 14:31:50 <gribble> 274177
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1426 2013-12-10 14:40:08 <Plarkplark_> http://miki.it/articles/papers/#bitiodine
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1479 2013-12-10 15:57:57 <freeroute> hi, according to this, how long (approximately) will it take for the blocksize to reach 1TB? - https://blockchain.info/charts/blocks-size?showDataPoints=false&show_header=true&daysAverageString=1×pan=all&scale=1&address=
1480 2013-12-10 15:58:27 <freeroute> *blockchain size
1481 2013-12-10 15:58:32 <freeroute> hehe
1482 2013-12-10 15:58:43 beethoven8201 has joined
1483 2013-12-10 15:59:11 <sipa> at least 19 years
1484 2013-12-10 16:00:10 <freeroute> right, this assuming the disregarding of the technologies which compress the size
1485 2013-12-10 16:00:41 <sipa> (19 years because block sizes - for now - are limited to 1 MB)
1486 2013-12-10 16:00:43 blackmatter has joined
1487 2013-12-10 16:00:48 <sipa> so you need 1000000 blocks
1488 2013-12-10 16:01:45 blackmatter has left ()
1489 2013-12-10 16:02:37 <freeroute> so according to the Moore's law (but of storage) in 19 years we will have disks(?) of what size for the equivalent for the price of 1TB today?
1490 2013-12-10 16:03:18 teravps is now known as gigavps
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1492 2013-12-10 16:03:47 <andytoshi> doubling every 18 months? 12 doublings, 4096Tb
1493 2013-12-10 16:03:54 <andytoshi> we'll see :)
1494 2013-12-10 16:04:25 blackmatter has joined
1495 2013-12-10 16:05:16 dataangel has joined
1496 2013-12-10 16:05:19 <freeroute> awesome, I'm refuting someone's arguments of "blockchain size is the biggest flaw of Bitcoin"
1497 2013-12-10 16:05:32 <grau> sipa: the transaction problem I had is solved. I'd like to explain you in pm
1498 2013-12-10 16:05:51 t7 has quit (Quit: home)
1499 2013-12-10 16:05:51 <sipa> grau: gmaxwell told me already :)
1500 2013-12-10 16:05:54 <freeroute> also, in one of my counter-arguments I've included this proposition - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=277389.0
1501 2013-12-10 16:05:55 <kjj> anyone ever work with BIP10?
1502 2013-12-10 16:06:08 <grau> sipa: ok, then please consider what it means.
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1506 2013-12-10 16:06:59 <kjj> I'm trying to implement it, but I can't get the same DPID used for the example
1507 2013-12-10 16:07:06 <sipa> grau: ?
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1512 2013-12-10 16:13:09 Neozonz has joined
1513 2013-12-10 16:13:27 <Neozonz> anyone have a recommended timeout for bitcoind to reply via an xmlrpc call
1514 2013-12-10 16:13:49 <Neozonz> currently using the bitcoin php class ( https://github.com/TheSerapher/php-mpos/blob/next/public/include/xmlrpc.inc.php#L1140 )
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1526 2013-12-10 16:30:11 <blackmatter> hi everyone
1527 2013-12-10 16:31:00 <blackmatter> anyone developing miners for tpm chips?
1528 2013-12-10 16:31:30 edulix has joined
1529 2013-12-10 16:32:08 <Luke-Jr> â¦
1530 2013-12-10 16:32:32 slush has joined
1531 2013-12-10 16:32:33 <Luke-Jr> Neozonz: bitcoind does not support XML-RPC
1532 2013-12-10 16:33:04 agnostic98 has joined
1533 2013-12-10 16:33:11 <Luke-Jr> blackmatter: what makes you think that's a good idea?
1534 2013-12-10 16:33:29 <blackmatter> hardcoded sha256 :)
1535 2013-12-10 16:33:43 <blackmatter> smd memory and atm access
1536 2013-12-10 16:34:00 <Belxjander> blackmatter: any way to order those chips as something to wire-wrap ?
1537 2013-12-10 16:34:16 <sipa> blackmatter: and, ridiculoudly slow?
1538 2013-12-10 16:34:19 <Belxjander> blackmatter: my computer here would be able to take a string or two of them
1539 2013-12-10 16:34:49 taha has quit (Quit: Leaving)
1540 2013-12-10 16:36:14 <blackmatter> i saw at devcon reverse engineering of those chips they come on the motherboard n have something between 1 to 2.5 ghz they also have hardcoded sha2/sha1/sha256/sha512 + md5 + aes
1541 2013-12-10 16:37:16 daybyter has quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
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1543 2013-12-10 16:37:24 <sipa> hmm, i may be mistaken then
1544 2013-12-10 16:37:51 <sipa> still, i doubt they can compete with chips that are custom designed for the purpose
1545 2013-12-10 16:38:02 <Luke-Jr> I think there is not a chance
1546 2013-12-10 16:38:12 <sipa> i was trying to be polite :)
1547 2013-12-10 16:38:19 <Luke-Jr> otherwise Intel wouldn't have bothered adding SHA-2 to their newest CPU design
1548 2013-12-10 16:38:54 <kjj> until very recently, commercial chips that could do fast hashing did so in a way that was not useful to bitcoin
1549 2013-12-10 16:38:56 <blackmatter> eyup well... in my work we have like 800 computers with those chips.. a miniminer for every PC will have impact :)
1550 2013-12-10 16:39:12 <sipa> define "impact" ?
1551 2013-12-10 16:39:14 <kjj> I see no reason to believe that TPM chips would implement their hashing the way we need it
1552 2013-12-10 16:39:24 Loman2 has joined
1553 2013-12-10 16:39:31 diki has joined
1554 2013-12-10 16:39:36 <blackmatter> i c.. tnx
1555 2013-12-10 16:39:46 <Luke-Jr> sipa: power bill goes up $10 :D
1556 2013-12-10 16:39:51 <Belxjander> blackmatter: so basically botnetting all the TPM chips ?
1557 2013-12-10 16:39:56 greatauk has quit (Quit: greatauk)
1558 2013-12-10 16:40:06 <blackmatter> yes ?:) u got me
1559 2013-12-10 16:40:51 <Luke-Jr> nobody here wants to be an accessory to your crimes, I think
1560 2013-12-10 16:41:08 * sipa will assume he was joking
1561 2013-12-10 16:41:10 topace has quit (Quit: KVIrc 4.1.3 Equilibrium http://www.kvirc.net/)
1562 2013-12-10 16:41:17 <kjj> ugh. can we switch bitcoin-development to invite-only?
1563 2013-12-10 16:41:23 nsh has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
1564 2013-12-10 16:41:26 <kjj> not the channel, the mailing list
1565 2013-12-10 16:41:26 <Luke-Jr> lol
1566 2013-12-10 16:41:48 <kjj> the Keynesian kooks have discovered it
1567 2013-12-10 16:41:49 <blackmatter> lol i have a writen statment that allows me to mine :)
1568 2013-12-10 16:41:55 <wumpus> kjj: heh
1569 2013-12-10 16:42:12 <grau> The isStandard check currently disallows "placeholder" signatures (say OP_0). Having them would simplify client development since it would be visible without signature verification which keys signed and where the own signature should be inserted.
1570 2013-12-10 16:42:32 <grau> I mean multisig ^
1571 2013-12-10 16:42:36 <Luke-Jr> kjj: I can imagine the mass trolling that will bring on
1572 2013-12-10 16:42:46 <sipa> grau: i have no objection to that
1573 2013-12-10 16:43:09 <sipa> though you can easily use a dummy push instead
1574 2013-12-10 16:43:36 <grau> that'd be great. It is a big hurdle currently if sigs are donw with differet clients in random order
1575 2013-12-10 16:43:38 <kjj> why does an incompletely signed transaction need to pass isStandard() ?
1576 2013-12-10 16:43:51 <Luke-Jr> it doesn't. :x
1577 2013-12-10 16:43:59 <blackmatter> it doesnt
1578 2013-12-10 16:44:12 <Luke-Jr> nor should alternate clients implement the same IsStandard I think..
1579 2013-12-10 16:44:16 <sipa> hmm, good question!
1580 2013-12-10 16:44:16 <grau> it does not allow placeholder
1581 2013-12-10 16:44:18 Eiii has joined
1582 2013-12-10 16:44:24 <Luke-Jr> grau: so?
1583 2013-12-10 16:44:26 <kjj> using the network as a means of passing semi-signed TXs will make it spam central
1584 2013-12-10 16:44:42 <sipa> no, but why are you passing not-entirely signed transactions to bitcoind?
1585 2013-12-10 16:44:50 <sipa> they can't be valid, even if they are standard
1586 2013-12-10 16:45:15 <kjj> but letting the network spread them would make so many projects so damn easy...
1587 2013-12-10 16:46:14 greatauk has joined
1588 2013-12-10 16:46:17 <grau> it helps to have placeholder while incomplete, now one has to strip placeholder even if finished, so it passes isStandard
1589 2013-12-10 16:46:49 <Luke-Jr> â¦
1590 2013-12-10 16:47:01 <sipa> is stripping placeholders that hard?
1591 2013-12-10 16:47:06 <grau> no
1592 2013-12-10 16:47:26 <sipa> it still means making verification of those transactions more expensive
1593 2013-12-10 16:47:35 <sipa> so i think you should strip them
1594 2013-12-10 16:47:52 <sipa> regardless, i have no problem with IsStandard() regarding OP_0 as a data push
1595 2013-12-10 16:48:11 <grau> would propagating partially signed tx be a problem?
1596 2013-12-10 16:48:18 <Luke-Jr> it's probably a bug if it isn't anyway
1597 2013-12-10 16:48:27 <blackmatter> net load
1598 2013-12-10 16:48:41 <sipa> a partially signed transaction isn't valid, so it certainly doesn't belong on the P2P network
1599 2013-12-10 16:48:43 <Luke-Jr> grau: it nullifies the spam protection fees provide
1600 2013-12-10 16:48:50 <sipa> there's nothing the network can do with it
1601 2013-12-10 16:48:53 <Luke-Jr> sipa: it makes sense for coinjoin
1602 2013-12-10 16:49:00 <grau> it only accepts one OP_0 for the first (bug) position
1603 2013-12-10 16:49:21 <grau> Luke-Jr : you are right
1604 2013-12-10 16:49:40 <sipa> but coinjoin is between two parties, not on the P2P network
1605 2013-12-10 16:49:59 <sipa> you could have a protocol extension for negotiating a coinjoin transaction using the P2P protocol
1606 2013-12-10 16:50:09 <Luke-Jr> sipa: coinjoin is between N parties, ideally everyone sending a transaction in a given minute
1607 2013-12-10 16:50:12 <Luke-Jr> or few seconds
1608 2013-12-10 16:50:31 <sipa> right, sure, my point is just that it won't be a broadcast-to-all
1609 2013-12-10 16:50:43 <Luke-Jr> it could (should?) be
1610 2013-12-10 16:50:50 <sipa> that makes no sense at all
1611 2013-12-10 16:51:08 <sipa> if you're going to tell the entire world about your partial coinjoin transaction, you lose the privacy advantages
1612 2013-12-10 16:51:26 <Luke-Jr> well, otherwise you need to identify the other peers involved and do a multicast-to-many over the p2p protocol
1613 2013-12-10 16:51:40 <sipa> who says you need to use the p2p protocol?
1614 2013-12-10 16:51:52 <grau> coinjoin is an other use case. I rather thought of joint ownership of funds.
1615 2013-12-10 16:52:06 <Luke-Jr> sipa: you might not get the full privacy advantage, but it's still an improvement
1616 2013-12-10 16:52:09 <sipa> you could have some extension to it for locally negotiating a coinjoin transaction, or find interested peers
1617 2013-12-10 16:52:22 <sipa> but it doesn't have to be
1618 2013-12-10 16:52:32 <sipa> Luke-Jr: i disagree
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1620 2013-12-10 16:52:50 <Luke-Jr> anyone who doesn't store your partial info long-term, won't be able to get it later
1621 2013-12-10 16:53:01 <sipa> if you have to spam the entire world with something that is not yet valid, in order to get a privacy advantage in recorded history...
1622 2013-12-10 16:53:15 <sipa> yes, finding peers is a hard problem
1623 2013-12-10 16:53:27 <sipa> but broadcasting to the world is just ridiculous
1624 2013-12-10 16:53:36 duckx has joined
1625 2013-12-10 16:53:46 <wumpus> indeed
1626 2013-12-10 16:54:05 imton has quit (Quit: imton)
1627 2013-12-10 16:54:11 <sipa> (not that any peer has a rational reason why they would forward it - it's not something that helps in any way, except using the P2P network as a really expensive communication mechanism)
1628 2013-12-10 16:55:36 Eiii has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
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1630 2013-12-10 16:56:32 <kjj> a network that was willing to carry them would be very useful, but hard to prevent spam
1631 2013-12-10 16:56:36 <Luke-Jr> I suppose a better way might be to include a service bit for nodes willing to be the coinjoin server, and have a deterministic algo to decide which one is used during the current hour
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1637 2013-12-10 16:59:57 <wumpus> I don't think the coinjoin negotiation should be on the P2P network at all, just leave it to its current function, don't add all the non-P2P crap on top
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1639 2013-12-10 17:04:06 <wumpus> there are lots of possible ways to negotiate peers for coinjoin, people can experiment with them completely independent of the P2P network
1640 2013-12-10 17:04:52 <Apocalyptic> "don't add all the non-P2P crap on top" // agreed
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1645 2013-12-10 17:07:54 <gesell> does the new code for calculating transaction fee use velocity of coin (a window of N transactions and their volume) rather than exchange data?
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1649 2013-12-10 17:11:05 <kjj> ok, so it looks like BIP10 isn't really suited for coinjoin type stuff, at least not without some changes
1650 2013-12-10 17:11:16 <Luke-Jr> wumpus: what ways can you think of, that would be acceptable to merge into Bitcoin-Qt?
1651 2013-12-10 17:12:44 <wumpus> Luke-Jr: I think the simplest implementation that would work is to let the user specify a tor hidden service that acts as rendezvous server
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1655 2013-12-10 17:12:56 <Luke-Jr> wumpus: I don't want to use Tor
1656 2013-12-10 17:13:28 <wumpus> Luke-Jr: I guess any non-tor server would work as well, but then the server can see your ip and link it to the transaction
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1658 2013-12-10 17:14:40 <blackmatter> u can use the usenet backbone :)
1659 2013-12-10 17:14:42 <Apocalyptic> Luke-Jr, not merging at all ?
1660 2013-12-10 17:15:13 deanclkclk_ has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
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1664 2013-12-10 17:17:30 <wumpus> Luke-Jr: I haven't really looked into the blinding-based approaches, but they look a lot more complicated, but maybe they could accomplish a similar thing without tor
1665 2013-12-10 17:18:02 <wumpus> Luke-Jr: well, the server would still know the IPs of the participants, but not who contributes what
1666 2013-12-10 17:19:05 <kjj> does tor do anycast?
1667 2013-12-10 17:19:43 <wumpus> kjj: no, it only supports one-to-one connections
1668 2013-12-10 17:20:12 <kjj> but if two services pop up with the same key, will you get one at random, or does the network disallow that somehow?
1669 2013-12-10 17:20:27 Musk has joined
1670 2013-12-10 17:20:46 <wumpus> you get one of them, but it's not random
1671 2013-12-10 17:21:00 DougieBot5000 has joined
1672 2013-12-10 17:21:09 <wumpus> you usually get the last one that registered IIRC
1673 2013-12-10 17:21:42 <kjj> lame
1674 2013-12-10 17:21:50 phantomcircuit_ is now known as phantomcircuit
1675 2013-12-10 17:22:28 <wumpus> yes, it doesn't really provide oppertunity for load balancing
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1678 2013-12-10 17:24:15 <wumpus> blackmatter: hardly anyone has usenet access anymore these days
1679 2013-12-10 17:30:07 <blackmatter> srry wasnt here...
1680 2013-12-10 17:30:24 lclc has joined
1681 2013-12-10 17:30:37 <blackmatter> true wumpus but the backbone is still free.. the network itself..
1682 2013-12-10 17:30:58 <blackmatter> can intergrate it with the client... dll..
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1690 2013-12-10 17:35:58 <wumpus> I also don't really see how usenet would be particularly useful for rendez-vous of coinjoins
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1692 2013-12-10 17:37:44 <wumpus> in any case I'm not against integrating coinjoin functionality in bitcoin-qt, I just don't think it belongs on the P2P network
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1699 2013-12-10 17:41:36 <kjj> I wouldn't object to using a bit in the addr message to indicate that a node is willing to accept connections on some other port for coinjoining purposes
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1711 2013-12-10 17:51:22 <helo> having access to a massive number of ~randomly selected coinjoin services doesn't sound very optimal
1712 2013-12-10 17:52:35 <helo> given that you actually want access to just one that is popular and reliable
1713 2013-12-10 17:54:23 <helo> i guess addcoinjoinnode
1714 2013-12-10 17:54:52 Marcel has joined
1715 2013-12-10 18:02:21 <Luke-Jr> helo: hence a deterministic algorithm for choosing one to use at any given time
1716 2013-12-10 18:02:57 <kjj> think syndication and replication
1717 2013-12-10 18:03:44 brson has joined
1718 2013-12-10 18:04:00 <kjj> but I might have a solution to the disruptive non-signer problem when it comes around to blinded time
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1726 2013-12-10 18:11:29 <helo> do miners have incentive to identify reliable coinjoin peers and include them in coinbases?
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1728 2013-12-10 18:12:29 <helo> a deterministic selection algo would be good only if everyone had the same list of coinjoin peers
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1730 2013-12-10 18:12:54 <helo> err, by peers i mean servers
1731 2013-12-10 18:13:20 <blackmatter> take a look on block 27203... the output was 50BTC is that correct??!
1732 2013-12-10 18:13:32 rdymac has joined
1733 2013-12-10 18:14:00 <helo> yeah... all blocks for the first ~4 years were like that
1734 2013-12-10 18:14:20 <helo> blackmatter: all blocks before 210000
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1738 2013-12-10 18:16:41 <blackmatter> cheers helo didnt know
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1742 2013-12-10 18:24:26 <deego> https://blockchain.info/tx/4ec93a51b8af35ce6733def18ac2160589dd35eb0b7a11f04cdeb6c72d1e913c - If you look at this transaction, how does blockchain.info arrive at the "estimated btc transacted" portion? Of all the outputs there, why did it choose 0.01xx as the transacted output?
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1745 2013-12-10 18:25:04 <kjj> helo: I don't think he means for mining. just everyone with that bit set is willing to be a server, and everyone in the network uses the same algorithm for selecting one from that list to use for, say, a 10 minute increment before it moves on
1746 2013-12-10 18:25:12 eristisk has joined
1747 2013-12-10 18:25:50 <helo> kjj: wouldn't everyone have a different list, given that everyone has different peers?
1748 2013-12-10 18:26:17 <kjj> well, sorta. you know the addresses and bits of way more than just your immediate peers
1749 2013-12-10 18:26:34 Zarutian has joined
1750 2013-12-10 18:26:47 <kjj> so, most of the network would know most of the list. and if the algorithm doesn't depend on having the whole list, most people will end up on the same server most of the time
1751 2013-12-10 18:30:32 <tommygunner> did jpmorgan just patent bitcoin?
1752 2013-12-10 18:30:32 <grau> deego: must be some heuristics, there is intentionally nothing in the transaction that could tell which output is spend and which is change.
1753 2013-12-10 18:30:34 <tommygunner> what
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1755 2013-12-10 18:31:14 <deego> grau: ah, thanks
1756 2013-12-10 18:31:34 <tommygunner> http://www.ft.com/intl/cms/s/0/e230307a-61c4-11e3-aa02-00144feabdc0.html
1757 2013-12-10 18:32:05 <kjj> yeah, the stuff on blockchain.info is just a guess
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1761 2013-12-10 18:34:58 <blackmatter> gunner plz send it without registration tnx
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1774 2013-12-10 18:50:07 <MoALTz> tommygunner: paywalled
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1834 2013-12-10 19:49:41 <damethos> Hey guys
1835 2013-12-10 19:50:05 TD has quit (Quit: TD)
1836 2013-12-10 19:50:08 <damethos> just wanted to let you know that we launched an initial version of testnet blockexplorer. You can find it here: https://www.biteasy.com/testnet/blocks
1837 2013-12-10 19:50:18 <damethos> input and output scripts will be added tomorrow
1838 2013-12-10 19:50:35 <damethos> and still working some bugs etc but we'll get there
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1847 2013-12-10 19:56:53 <grau> damethos: nice work. P2SH addresses would be nice
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1855 2013-12-10 19:59:47 <damethos> grau, we are working on that. It will be added in the next couple of days
1856 2013-12-10 20:00:06 <grau> great! it would be good to have a choice
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1858 2013-12-10 20:04:36 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|MoALTz: just paste the headline into google
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1872 2013-12-10 20:21:00 <MoALTz> michagogo|cloud: that then gives the option of answering 2 questions or signing up. the first question is "Have you ever played a game by Blizzard Entertainment, such as World of Warcraft, Diablo, StarCraft, or Hearthstone?"
1873 2013-12-10 20:21:04 drayah has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
1874 2013-12-10 20:21:08 <cfields> sipa: ping
1875 2013-12-10 20:21:14 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|huh?
1876 2013-12-10 20:21:18 <MoALTz> oh it lied about there only be 2 questions
1877 2013-12-10 20:21:30 <MoALTz> should have pressed "No"
1878 2013-12-10 20:21:42 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|When I searched Google for the headline and clicked the first link, it took me right to the article
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1881 2013-12-10 20:22:04 <cfields> sipa: looks like you were the last one in this, so i figured i'd start with you. leveldb just pushed out v1.5 which is supposed to address our corruption issues
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1886 2013-12-10 20:25:01 <Marcel> HSD!~user@router2.hsdev.com|cfields: s/1.5/1.15/ ?
1887 2013-12-10 20:25:09 <cfields> Marcel|HSD: yep, sorry
1888 2013-12-10 20:25:31 <MoALTz> i disagree with the article. it's more likely that they're trying to suppress any new altcoins that look like they're heading for success
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1890 2013-12-10 20:26:03 <blackmatter> what article?
1891 2013-12-10 20:26:15 <MoALTz> (a more conspiracy-theoretic (i.e. useless) view is that they were asked to do this from higher powers)
1892 2013-12-10 20:26:29 <MoALTz> <tommygunner> http://www.ft.com/intl/cms/s/0/e230307a-61c4-11e3-aa02-00144feabdc0.html
1893 2013-12-10 20:26:32 <sipa> cfields: interesting, i'll have a look
1894 2013-12-10 20:26:44 <blackmatter> ill take a look
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1896 2013-12-10 20:27:33 <cfields> sipa: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/3385
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1909 2013-12-10 20:32:00 <blackmatter> http://appft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO2&Sect2=HITOFF&p=1&u=%2Fnetahtml%2FPTO%2Fsearch-bool.html&r=1&f=G&l=50&co1=AND&d=PG01&s1=20130317984&OS=20130317984&RS=20130317984
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1911 2013-12-10 20:37:08 <blackmatter> i hope they will die!
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1935 2013-12-10 20:58:06 <deego> <tommygunner> did jpmorgan just patent bitcoin? <<=== yeah :)
1936 2013-12-10 20:58:31 <deego> How unscrupulous of Satoshi to copy it near-verbatim, go back 4 yrs in time, and call it "bitcoin."
1937 2013-12-10 20:58:54 <blackmatter> check that one
1938 2013-12-10 20:58:54 <blackmatter> [22:35] <blackmatter> The payee's Wallet 315 verifies the VPL number specified by the user and provides an authorization to make the payment. In step 3F, the payee's Wallet 315 confirms that the information is correct and transmits to the user (payor) a payment message with the following data: Payee BIN; Payee Account #; Transaction ID; the dollar amount of the payment; and an optional description.
1939 2013-12-10 20:58:55 <blackmatter> In step 3G, upon rece
1940 2013-12-10 20:58:55 <blackmatter> [22:35] <blackmatter> ipt of the payment message, the user reviews the message and selects "OK to Pay". Step 3D through 3G are an optional process since the PPP 227 can unilaterally initiate the push of an EFT credit message without ever having contacted the receiver of the credit. In such a blind push of a credit it is recommended that the PPP 227 consult an online directory 325 to verify the accu
1941 2013-12-10 20:58:55 <blackmatter> racy of the address to
1942 2013-12-10 20:58:55 <blackmatter> [22:35] <blackmatter> which the EFT credit message is to be sent.
1943 2013-12-10 20:59:11 <blackmatter> exploitable :) blind EFT push
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1946 2013-12-10 21:01:48 <dustjn> What's the significance of "v" in vin and vout?
1947 2013-12-10 21:02:04 <TD> vector
1948 2013-12-10 21:02:12 <TD> it's satoshis hungarian notation
1949 2013-12-10 21:03:22 <dustjn> ah, those are std::vectors in the reference client?
1950 2013-12-10 21:03:49 <blackmatter> vector4? 2?
1951 2013-12-10 21:04:33 <dustjn> blackmatter: ?
1952 2013-12-10 21:04:53 <blackmatter> vectors on the gpu?
1953 2013-12-10 21:05:05 <dustjn> no, the C++ vector data structure.
1954 2013-12-10 21:05:06 <sipa> std::vector
1955 2013-12-10 21:05:13 <blackmatter> roger tnx
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1990 2013-12-10 21:44:47 <FabianB_> anyone knows how to turn on debug logging for coinpunk?
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2002 2013-12-10 21:55:30 <andytoshi> how is the txid computed?
2003 2013-12-10 21:56:13 <andytoshi> i have put a trace on everything going into SHA256_Update in bitcoind, and what goes in hashes to XYZ, which matches my code but not bitcoind output
2004 2013-12-10 21:56:22 <andytoshi> so am at a loss as to where this value is coming from
2005 2013-12-10 21:56:35 <sipa> txid = SHA256^2(serialized_transaction)
2006 2013-12-10 21:56:53 <andytoshi> oh, if that's all it is then i'm the happiest man in the world
2007 2013-12-10 21:57:39 <andytoshi> it works !
2008 2013-12-10 21:59:05 <andytoshi> i have a working transaction decoder in rust now, which hashes correctly
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2011 2013-12-10 22:00:50 <sipa> what did you miss?
2012 2013-12-10 22:00:52 <sipa> double hash?
2013 2013-12-10 22:00:58 <andytoshi> yup :P
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2023 2013-12-10 22:12:14 <gavinandresen> grau: your implementation of OP_CHECKMULTISIG is very broken if it allows "placeholder signatures"
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2026 2013-12-10 22:13:08 <grau> gavinandresen: it was trying all sigs against all keys. Replaced now.
2027 2013-12-10 22:13:48 <gavinandresen> grau: ok, good. A pull request for the script_valid.json tests for that would be spiffy.
2028 2013-12-10 22:14:14 <sipa> (and, even better, one for script_invalid.json)
2029 2013-12-10 22:14:28 <grau> yes, the later is telling
2030 2013-12-10 22:14:35 <gavinandresen> mmmmâ¦. except I think script_valid doesn't know how to setup a keystore so can't do CHECKSIG tests....
2031 2013-12-10 22:14:52 <sipa> ...?
2032 2013-12-10 22:14:55 <sipa> a keystore is wallet stuff
2033 2013-12-10 22:15:07 <sipa> script validity is a node stuff
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2035 2013-12-10 22:15:17 <gavinandresen> right, but CHECKSIG needs previous transaction ids/etc
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2037 2013-12-10 22:15:35 <sipa> oh right
2038 2013-12-10 22:15:42 <FabianB_> anyone an idea what the following error means?: bitcoind error: unrecognized: {"code":"ENOTFOUND","errno":"ENOTFOUND","syscall":"getaddrinfo"}
2039 2013-12-10 22:18:24 <grau> yeah, not even tx_valid/invalid is sufficient to test for this
2040 2013-12-10 22:19:14 <damethos> !seen Goonie
2041 2013-12-10 22:19:15 <gribble> Goonie was last seen in #bitcoin-dev 3 days, 5 hours, 5 minutes, and 15 seconds ago: <Goonie> But I think SSL and ECDSA are not exclusive. Isn't SSL (and StartTLS in particular) just a protocol?
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2045 2013-12-10 22:22:12 <grau> nope tx_invalid.json could be the right place.
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2052 2013-12-10 22:27:57 <berndj> i've been seeing that "micropayment stream" thing online and off a lot lately, one thing puzzles me: in the initial 2-of-2 deposit + refund transaction exchange, how does the refund tx depend on the deposit tx if neither gets relayed - how is the txid known?
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2071 2013-12-10 22:43:29 <warren> they're talking about mastercoin funding at the conference
2072 2013-12-10 22:43:35 <warren> as a success....
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2074 2013-12-10 22:43:45 <Apocalyptic> :/
2075 2013-12-10 22:44:01 patcon has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2076 2013-12-10 22:44:19 <warren> "wild early success"
2077 2013-12-10 22:44:38 RoboTeddy has joined
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2079 2013-12-10 22:44:54 <Apocalyptic> I guess Jarred bs was not enough
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2082 2013-12-10 22:47:27 <warren> The entire talk is a mastercoin advertisement.
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2086 2013-12-10 22:49:41 <clan> is time lock enabled in testnet?
2087 2013-12-10 22:49:48 <damethos> warren, what conference?
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2090 2013-12-10 22:52:05 <Luke-Jr> damethos: I presume the bitcoin conferenceâ¦â¦â¦.
2091 2013-12-10 22:52:22 <damethos> oh sorry i wasnt aware that it was going down right now
2092 2013-12-10 22:52:23 <damethos> :)
2093 2013-12-10 22:53:18 <damethos> warren, are u there right now?
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2112 2013-12-10 23:13:33 <grau> gavinandresen: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/3387 <- the multi sig order checks correct and incorrect
2113 2013-12-10 23:15:35 <lianj> grau: nice, i fixed it in my lib too
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2116 2013-12-10 23:16:38 <grau> lianj: thanks for the confirm and help
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