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 138 2014-05-15 02:48:02 <dcousens> does a 0 of N multisig scriptpubkey validate with no signatures?
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 140 2014-05-15 02:48:22 <dcousens> (assuming we ignore the OP_0 bug)
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 149 2014-05-15 02:56:20 <Luke-Jr> dcousens: what OP_0 bug?
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 151 2014-05-15 02:56:35 <dcousens> Luke-Jr: OP_0 SIG SIG
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 154 2014-05-15 02:56:45 <Luke-Jr> I don't see what that bug is relevant for
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 162 2014-05-15 02:58:51 <dcousens> Luke-Jr: well, if I had no data on the stack, 0 2 OP_CHECKMULTISIG   would fail I assume, but    if I had    0 0 2 OP_CHECKMULTISIG,   does it validate?
 163 2014-05-15 02:59:06 <Luke-Jr> you need pubkeys..
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 165 2014-05-15 02:59:55 <dcousens> Fine.   Would 0 0 {Pubkey1} {Pubkey2} 2 OP_CHECKMULTSIG     validate
 166 2014-05-15 03:01:12 <Luke-Jr> I believe so.
 167 2014-05-15 03:01:28 <Luke-Jr> … why?
 168 2014-05-15 03:01:44 <dcousens> Curiousity?
 169 2014-05-15 03:01:59 <dcousens> Also, would (OP_1 -1) be used or OP_0 in that case
 170 2014-05-15 03:02:21 <dcousens> (for M)
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 175 2014-05-15 03:04:19 <Luke-Jr> not sure what that question is
 176 2014-05-15 03:04:37 <Luke-Jr> but in the meantime, I think I may have stumbled upon a fix for malleability
 177 2014-05-15 03:05:02 <Luke-Jr> any experts on right now, who can confirm for me that there is no security risk to an idea?
 178 2014-05-15 03:05:59 <phantomcircuit> Luke-Jr, dont ask to ask, just ask
 179 2014-05-15 03:06:03 * phantomcircuit flees the scene
 180 2014-05-15 03:06:33 <Luke-Jr> phantomcircuit: you'd exploit it! :P
 181 2014-05-15 03:06:43 Aido has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
 182 2014-05-15 03:06:43 <phantomcircuit> who meeee? never
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 188 2014-05-15 03:11:19 <dcousens> Luke-Jr: it would appear you use OP_0, as it does a pre-parse in EvalScript...
 189 2014-05-15 03:12:20 <Luke-Jr> dcousens: it's an optional preparse
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 191 2014-05-15 03:13:02 ajweiss has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
 192 2014-05-15 03:13:52 <dcousens> Luke-Jr: not sure what you mean by that
 193 2014-05-15 03:14:10 <Luke-Jr> dcousens: preparse failure just means it counts as 20 sigops
 194 2014-05-15 03:14:12 ajweiss has joined
 195 2014-05-15 03:14:16 <Luke-Jr> it doesn't make it invalid
 196 2014-05-15 03:14:54 <justanotheruser> Is m of 21 invalid or nonstandard?
 197 2014-05-15 03:15:21 <dcousens> Luke-Jr: nKeysCount > 20 : return false
 198 2014-05-15 03:15:50 <Luke-Jr> justanotheruser: invalid
 199 2014-05-15 03:16:38 <justanotheruser> If I hypothetically had a reason to use 21 keys, is there a way around that?
 200 2014-05-15 03:17:24 <Luke-Jr> justanotheruser: in short, no. but you could use multiple OP_CHECKMULTISIG ;)
 201 2014-05-15 03:17:44 <Luke-Jr> or low-sigop multisig..
 202 2014-05-15 03:18:03 <Luke-Jr> https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/blob/master/bip-0019.mediawiki
 203 2014-05-15 03:18:05 <dcousens> aren't we limited to 15 pubkeys anyway due to the byte limit?
 204 2014-05-15 03:18:22 <Luke-Jr> dcousens: only for P2SH
 205 2014-05-15 03:18:29 <justanotheruser> Or a bunch of opchecksigs and a bunch of opadds then an opgreaterthan?
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 212 2014-05-15 03:19:38 <Luke-Jr> justanotheruser: that's (mostly) BIP 19
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 275 2014-05-15 04:24:10 <is_a_cat> hey
 276 2014-05-15 04:24:21 beachandbytes has joined
 277 2014-05-15 04:24:57 <is_a_cat> i made something that i think is cool. anyone interested in giving constructive criticism?
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 283 2014-05-15 04:30:56 <is_a_cat> http://jsfiddle.net/is_a_cat/UPtVA/2/embedded/result/
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 288 2014-05-15 04:36:20 <flound1129> is there a way to make listtransactions only return generate transactions?
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 294 2014-05-15 04:41:40 <nanotube> flound1129: just grep for "category" : "generate"
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 297 2014-05-15 04:43:28 <nanotube> (i guess also category immature, to catch non-matured gen transactions)
 298 2014-05-15 04:44:39 <flound1129> yes I know
 299 2014-05-15 04:44:48 <flound1129> what I'm asking is if there's a way to only have it return immature or generate
 300 2014-05-15 04:44:53 <flound1129> rather than having to parse the whole thing
 301 2014-05-15 04:45:24 <flound1129> seems like the answer is no
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 502 2014-05-15 07:39:45 <robonerd> when putting out a new web site, do you use "www." subdomain still?
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 628 2014-05-15 09:13:43 <warren> michagogo|cloud: ping
 629 2014-05-15 09:14:06 <warren> anyone else available to do gitian builds?
 630 2014-05-15 09:14:15 <warren> important for 0.9.2
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 639 2014-05-15 09:23:47 <aschildbach> petertodd: ping
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 643 2014-05-15 09:26:02 <tjopper> I saw pertertodd last night presenting on a dutch meet-up i guess thay are preparing for bitcoin2014 atm
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 645 2014-05-15 09:29:16 <aschildbach> Thanks. I think I'll mail him. His DNS seed is down.
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 668 2014-05-15 09:49:30 <Pan0ram1x> tjopper: is there any video of that presentation?
 669 2014-05-15 09:49:59 diabl0z has joined
 670 2014-05-15 09:50:01 <diabl0z> hello
 671 2014-05-15 09:51:19 <diabl0z>  anyone know how to get the balance of a P2SH address from bitcoind after adding it with addmultisig ... ?
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 683 2014-05-15 10:02:32 <diabl0z> sa sa
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 685 2014-05-15 10:04:04 <diabl0z>  anyone know how to get the balance of an account with a P2SH address from bitcoind after adding it with addmultisig ... ?
 686 2014-05-15 10:04:09 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|wumpus: pong
 687 2014-05-15 10:04:19 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|erm
 688 2014-05-15 10:04:22 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|warren*
 689 2014-05-15 10:04:22 <diabl0z> ping
 690 2014-05-15 10:05:13 <warren> michagogo|cloud: https://github.com/wtogami/bitcoin/tree/gitianwithqt521
 691 2014-05-15 10:06:24 <warren> michagogo|cloud: could you please build gitian-osx-qt.yml   and send me your var/build.log?
 692 2014-05-15 10:06:45 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|warren: I'm not at my computer atm
 693 2014-05-15 10:06:48 <diabl0z> ?
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 698 2014-05-15 10:08:39 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|warren: so that's coryfields's branch, but with the change to 5.2.1?
 699 2014-05-15 10:09:07 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|if we're going to 5.2.1, we should go back down to r1
 700 2014-05-15 10:09:23 <tjopper> Pan0ram1x normally there is, but didn spot it online yet
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 706 2014-05-15 10:16:56 <warren> anyone with mac can test a binary?
 707 2014-05-15 10:17:05 <warren> michagogo|cloud: his branch broke
 708 2014-05-15 10:17:13 <warren> michagogo|cloud: he references 5.2.0 in one place and 5.2.1 in another
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 710 2014-05-15 10:17:31 <warren> and the binary is behaving weird
 711 2014-05-15 10:17:31 <warren> http://193.28.235.60/~warren/temp/bitcoin-gitian-osx-weird-character.png
 712 2014-05-15 10:17:58 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|warren: that's with 5.2.0? or .1?
 713 2014-05-15 10:18:09 <warren> that's 5.2.0
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 715 2014-05-15 10:18:43 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|When I get to my computer (may or may not be today...) I'll fetch your branch and rebuild qt
 716 2014-05-15 10:18:54 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|And the BC
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 718 2014-05-15 10:19:05 <warren> there's a bunch of errors during the qt build
 719 2014-05-15 10:19:09 <warren> that doesn't kill the build
 720 2014-05-15 10:19:15 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|Do you want the build.log from the qt 5.2.0 too? I think I still have it
 721 2014-05-15 10:19:36 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|(it was the last build I did last night before going to bed)
 722 2014-05-15 10:19:41 <warren> actually his earlier version was 5.2.1
 723 2014-05-15 10:19:51 <warren> he backed it down to 5.2.0 then left for Amsterdam
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 725 2014-05-15 10:19:55 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|warren: Eh?
 726 2014-05-15 10:20:04 <warren> but it broke
 727 2014-05-15 10:20:09 <warren> don't know if he tested hte commit
 728 2014-05-15 10:20:16 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|I guess when I looked he'd already taken it down to 5.2.0
 729 2014-05-15 10:20:35 <warren> his current PR doesn't build
 730 2014-05-15 10:21:03 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|:-/
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 733 2014-05-15 10:24:13 <warren> the PR yesterday built but was non-deterministic
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 754 2014-05-15 10:38:48 <warren> michagogo|cloud: the qt-5.2.1 binary fixed that weird character glitch
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 758 2014-05-15 10:41:05 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|Did you test 5.2.1-win?
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 760 2014-05-15 10:42:58 <warren> yes
 761 2014-05-15 10:43:10 <warren> I'm posting all hashes when I post this as a PR
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 777 2014-05-15 11:01:06 <warren> michagogo|cloud: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/4189
 778 2014-05-15 11:01:18 <warren> It turns out the errors during qt build are normal, it's testing for features before build.
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 802 2014-05-15 11:15:06 <warren> michagogo|cloud: crap, it seems the windows build isn't determinstic
 803 2014-05-15 11:15:13 <warren> mac is though
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 838 2014-05-15 11:52:49 <warren> michagogo|cloud: nevermind, i was looking at the wrong build, it seems good
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 855 2014-05-15 12:09:58 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|warren: so where do we stand now?
 856 2014-05-15 12:10:35 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|So, https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/4189 is the same as Cory
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 858 2014-05-15 12:10:44 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|So, https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/4189 is the same as Cory's but with 5.2.1 on win and mac?
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 860 2014-05-15 12:11:07 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|Also, what are the hashes you posted?
 861 2014-05-15 12:11:18 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|(what did you give gbuild in --commit?)
 862 2014-05-15 12:11:56 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|And why didn't you reset the qt deps to r1?
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 864 2014-05-15 12:12:43 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|(and if you're taking over the PR: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/4185#issuecomment-43119798 )
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 883 2014-05-15 12:23:59 <jmintuck> Hello room
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1069 2014-05-15 14:50:26 <Guest84351> Hello. What is the difference between 'getnewaddress' and 'getrawchangeaddress' in the client API?  Thanks.
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1146 2014-05-15 16:09:21 <Guest23231> Hello. How does 'getrawchangeaddress' differ from 'getnewaddress'. Thanks
1147 2014-05-15 16:11:47 <gmaxwell> The keys it returns are treated as change addresses by the software.
1148 2014-05-15 16:12:03 <gmaxwell> (e.g. payments to them are hidden in the transaction list)
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1150 2014-05-15 16:12:36 <Guest23231> Makes sense. thanks
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1174 2014-05-15 16:32:37 <Skirmant> hi
1175 2014-05-15 16:32:38 <Skirmant> is this the right place to ask about compiling the android wallet?
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1177 2014-05-15 16:34:11 <pigeons> hmm try #bitcoinj maybe
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1190 2014-05-15 16:42:24 <loove> my bitcoind is crashing anyone can help me
1191 2014-05-15 16:42:34 <loove> I tried to copy all the bitcoindata folder in my new machine
1192 2014-05-15 16:42:40 <loove> and now I get an error
1193 2014-05-15 16:43:44 <dhill> what error
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1195 2014-05-15 16:44:09 <loove> [Error: Failed to read block : Failed to connect best block
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1203 2014-05-15 16:47:49 <loove> why nobody helps me :@
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1237 2014-05-15 17:11:32 <Ry4an> loove: because you're impatient.  Just wait.  IRC is an asynchronous medium.
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1253 2014-05-15 17:20:49 <softwaremechanic> What do folks think about builda hardware wallet interface, which would allow hardware wallet vendors to develop a plugin for their product.
1254 2014-05-15 17:21:00 <softwaremechanic> This way client's don't have to support each one individually
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1259 2014-05-15 17:24:11 <Ry4an> http://xkcd.com/927/ ;)
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1263 2014-05-15 17:28:04 <softwaremechanic> lol
1264 2014-05-15 17:28:58 <softwaremechanic> I'd like to make a hardware wallet, but who's gonna support it?
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1268 2014-05-15 17:31:36 <Ry4an> yeah, it's a chicken and egg thing for sure.  Unfortunately the coordination costs of both the wallet and the device building to a compromise standard are greater than supporting any one or two wallets, so it's (totally my opinion) not somthing you're going to be able to get people on board w/ unless there's alreadys a lot of competing hardware wallets -- enough that the software side says "ugh, agree on a standard!"
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1270 2014-05-15 17:32:14 <softwaremechanic> ya, that's probably true
1271 2014-05-15 17:32:14 <Ry4an> if possible co-opting the trezor interface is probably your quickest route to software interop.
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1273 2014-05-15 17:33:01 <softwaremechanic> that was my thought as well.
1274 2014-05-15 17:33:26 <softwaremechanic> Still, the software designer aspect of my brain reels at the concept
1275 2014-05-15 17:33:33 <robonerd> trezor?
1276 2014-05-15 17:34:01 <softwaremechanic> The main issue really is the lgpl for that.
1277 2014-05-15 17:35:21 <Ry4an> robonerd: google it
1278 2014-05-15 17:35:29 <softwaremechanic> Which is fine for most projects, but does limit it's adoption
1279 2014-05-15 17:35:55 <robonerd> yea i'll pass on your wild goose chase, 'thanks'
1280 2014-05-15 17:36:10 <softwaremechanic> trezor is a wild goose chase?
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1286 2014-05-15 17:41:25 <Ry4an> trezor: http://bit.ly/1valz0u
1287 2014-05-15 17:41:50 <softwaremechanic> for realz
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1292 2014-05-15 17:43:11 <CoinHeavy> Does anyone have a good forumla for bitcoin issuance?  (given a block number, a forumla to calculate the current coins in existence)  I can’t seem to find one on the wiki.
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1294 2014-05-15 17:45:07 <dexX7> Ry4an: can you post the link unshorted please?
1295 2014-05-15 17:46:02 <Ry4an> naw, google it yourself if you don't trust my shortned URL
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1297 2014-05-15 17:47:00 <robonerd> that's why i didn't click the link. Ry4an seems like a jerk
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1303 2014-05-15 17:51:19 <mappum_> CoinHeavy: reward per block would be 50 * 0.5^floor(blocks / 2.1e5)
1304 2014-05-15 17:52:19 <CoinHeavy> mappum_: Thank you — could you please help me understand what you mean by floor?
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1308 2014-05-15 17:53:02 <mappum_> basically, just drop the fractional part. floor(5.5) = 5, floor(1) = 1
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1310 2014-05-15 17:54:40 <CoinHeavy> oh sorry, I see
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1312 2014-05-15 17:55:00 <CoinHeavy> I understand that the reward halves ever 210,000 blocks and that it started at 50
1313 2014-05-15 17:55:06 <CoinHeavy> but given a certain block height
1314 2014-05-15 17:55:21 <CoinHeavy> what does the forumla to calculate current coins in existence look like?
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1318 2014-05-15 17:56:45 <gmaxwell> CoinHeavy: he gave you the formula.
1319 2014-05-15 17:57:19 <mappum_> that's for the reward per block, idk how to give the total in one expression, i'll just write it in code
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1321 2014-05-15 17:57:32 <hammond> hi does bitcoin core use SSL or encryptation when proxying so it doesn't leak or whatever?
1322 2014-05-15 17:58:00 <pigeons> what do you mean by when proxying? and leak what?
1323 2014-05-15 17:58:18 <justanotheruser> pigeons: I think he's concerned about MiTM
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1325 2014-05-15 17:58:43 <justanotheruser> Leak is just a bad description
1326 2014-05-15 17:58:57 <hammond> well when using software like TOR, can somone sniff there while you are using bitcoin. when using the core, does it have SSL layer?
1327 2014-05-15 17:59:08 <pigeons> no
1328 2014-05-15 17:59:58 <hammond> hmm so for example somone can sniff which address I'm sending to. for example?
1329 2014-05-15 18:00:19 <gmaxwell> hammond: If you're using tor then _tor_ provides the transport security.
1330 2014-05-15 18:00:20 <pigeons> yes the idea is to broadcast to everyone what address you are sending to
1331 2014-05-15 18:00:53 <gmaxwell> there is no need to also use SSL nor any advantage.
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1333 2014-05-15 18:02:20 <justanotheruser> Wasn't there some research paper on finding out what IP broadcasted a tx?
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1335 2014-05-15 18:03:33 <kjj> the only way to be sure that transaction X originated with node Y is to control all connections to Y
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1341 2014-05-15 18:04:46 <justanotheruser> kjj: but can you make a pretty good guess based on timing?
1342 2014-05-15 18:05:34 <kjj> timing of what?
1343 2014-05-15 18:06:02 <pigeons> i guess you could ask other nodes if they got it yet, and with bloom filter see they didnt so if you have it it might be you
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1347 2014-05-15 18:07:18 <kjj> one thing that I find appalling about most of the academic "research" into bitcoin is their inability to limit their own knowledge to that of the node they are looking at
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1349 2014-05-15 18:07:43 <justanotheruser> kjj: timing of when their node sent it and when other nodes tried to send it to you
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1352 2014-05-15 18:08:39 <gmaxwell> justanotheruser: thus why using tor is advisable, you'll know that the user asked about using tor.
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1354 2014-05-15 18:09:08 <kjj> hang on, I thought we were talking about finding "the origin node", not "some random node in that origin's direction"
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1356 2014-05-15 18:09:22 <justanotheruser> What do you mean the user asked about using Tor?
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1358 2014-05-15 18:09:54 <gmaxwell> < pigeons> what do you mean by when proxying? < hammond> well when using software like TOR, can somone sniff
1359 2014-05-15 18:10:40 <justanotheruser> gmaxwell: oh, I was just going on a tangent and asking if there was any legitimacy to that paper.
1360 2014-05-15 18:11:06 <justanotheruser> Or if someone knew of the paper I was referring to because I can't find it
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1377 2014-05-15 18:22:30 <CoinHeavy> mappum_: thanks for pointing me in the right direction.  Here is example code in ruby for: Forumla -- Total Extant Bitcoins at a Given Block https://gist.github.com/dlio/69238ba37cae489a3650
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1379 2014-05-15 18:23:29 <mappum_> i think there's a way to do it in one mathematical expression
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1382 2014-05-15 18:24:39 <Ry4an> discrete step functions make that hard, but it'd be cool to see
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1385 2014-05-15 18:25:44 <mappum_> well is there a way to do 0.5^0 + 0.5^1 + ... + 0.5^n ?
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1389 2014-05-15 18:28:49 <mappum_> it would be 50 * ((0.5^0 + ... + 0.5^(n-1)) * 2.1e5 * (n-1) + blocks % 2.1e5 * 0.5^n)
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1391 2014-05-15 18:29:04 <mappum_> i think that can be reduced a bit
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1397 2014-05-15 18:31:33 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|If you want another overly complex way, you can do this: if blockcount <= 210000; total = blockcount * 50; else; total = 0.0; blockcount/210000.times do; |n| total += 210000.0*50/n; end; total += 50/blockcount/210000*(blockcount%210000); end
1398 2014-05-15 18:32:20 <michagogo> cloud!uid14316@wikia/Michagogo|(I *think* that's valid in Ruby, but I'm on my phone atm)
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1410 2014-05-15 18:42:03 <Guest23231> Curiosity: is anyone using locktime in transactions?
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1413 2014-05-15 18:42:26 <mappum_> Guest23231: yes, in things like micropayment channels
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1415 2014-05-15 18:42:45 <Guest23231> how large can it be? days?
1416 2014-05-15 18:43:08 <dzan> hi, seems like bitcoin depends on berkeley db 5.1, anyone knows how to get that version in debian sid? sid has 5.3 and 6.0 but then I can't compile ( configure fails )
1417 2014-05-15 18:43:12 <mappum_> i don't think there is a limit, just any number of blocks
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1422 2014-05-15 18:45:14 <arubi> dzan, use : `./configure --with-incompatible-bdb`
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1424 2014-05-15 18:45:37 <arubi> also use --enable-hardening while you're at it I guess
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1427 2014-05-15 18:48:02 <dzan> arubi: so its not an issue to have 'incompatible db's'?
1428 2014-05-15 18:49:05 <dzan> hmm cool, why would one harden the binary? protection against runtime patching?
1429 2014-05-15 18:49:08 <arubi> I've never had any issues
1430 2014-05-15 18:50:03 <arubi> dzan, I woun't wanna provide a bad answer to that question, so I'd prefer to say I'm not sure :)
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1432 2014-05-15 18:50:27 <arubi> s/woun't/wouldn't
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1434 2014-05-15 18:51:27 <dzan> arubi: ok :)
1435 2014-05-15 18:52:08 <dzan> normally you'd harden binaries which have copy protection or drm stuff, so probably it's for live patching in order to sent btc or something
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1438 2014-05-15 18:55:27 <arubi> build-unix.md describes pretty well what hardening does to the bitcoin binary. in the Security section
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1461 2014-05-15 19:08:47 <helo> dzan: using a newer libdb will work, but it might break backwards-compatibility with your wallets, if you were to try to load them in a bitcoin with an older libdb
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1463 2014-05-15 19:09:25 <helo> it should be possible to downgrade the wallet file to work with older libdb if the need arose
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1471 2014-05-15 19:14:36 <dzan> helo: ok thanks i'll just try
1472 2014-05-15 19:14:50 <dzan> hmm linker acts up
1473 2014-05-15 19:14:59 <dzan> /usr/bin/ld: ../src/leveldb/libleveldb.a(db_impl.o): relocation R_X86_64_32S against `_ZTVN7leveldb2DBE' can not be used when making a shared object; recompile with -fPIC
1474 2014-05-15 19:15:02 <dzan> ../src/leveldb/libleveldb.a: error adding symbols: Bad value
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1476 2014-05-15 19:15:42 <dzan> seems like that has something to do with the hardening
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1481 2014-05-15 19:17:36 <helo> i know nothing of hardening
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1483 2014-05-15 19:18:05 <helo> i am surprised it isn't enabled by default if it is a good idea
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1485 2014-05-15 19:18:16 <dzan> helo: the doc's say it is
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1487 2014-05-15 19:18:34 <helo> so that's without --enable-hardening?
1488 2014-05-15 19:18:35 <dzan> helo: and you'd be surprised on (security wise) how poorly most unix binaries are compiled
1489 2014-05-15 19:18:45 <dzan> helo: yes, i'm now trying with --disable-hardening
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1491 2014-05-15 19:18:58 <gmaxwell> dzan: you need to make clean when disabling the configuration. The depsolving isn't perfect.
1492 2014-05-15 19:19:16 <helo> well, a little more scrutiny and consideration has gone into bitcoind's build system than most, at least i like to hope
1493 2014-05-15 19:20:17 <hammond> gmaxwell, I have talked to the TOR people and they said there is no SSL from the exit nodes to your PC, the only encryptation is within the network. so from my PC to the exit nodepeople can see, and if that can be avoided, it's better. Even sniffing the addresses that you are sending to can lead to troubles no?
1494 2014-05-15 19:20:41 <gmaxwell> hammond: They managed to confuse you.
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1497 2014-05-15 19:20:49 <realazthat> he is right but it doesn't matter
1498 2014-05-15 19:20:57 <realazthat> all the data you send to the node is stored in the chain ...
1499 2014-05-15 19:21:02 <realazthat> so it is public information
1500 2014-05-15 19:21:10 <hammond> gmaxwell, no.
1501 2014-05-15 19:21:23 * helo popcorns
1502 2014-05-15 19:21:26 <realazthat> Tor encrypts everything until the exit node
1503 2014-05-15 19:21:27 <gmaxwell> the traffic between you (the tor user) and the exit node is encrypted. The traffic between the exit node and the outside world is not. But thats not connected to you (if tor worked).
1504 2014-05-15 19:21:40 <gmaxwell> (Bitcoin also uses tor hidden services, which are encrypted end to end in any case)
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1506 2014-05-15 19:22:02 <gmaxwell> This is also offtopic for this channel.
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1508 2014-05-15 19:22:25 <dzan> helo: yes it has :) it's one of the few compiled with -pie enabled
1509 2014-05-15 19:22:42 <dzan> gmaxwell: thx i'll clean to make sure than
1510 2014-05-15 19:23:13 <gmaxwell> Not that the executable hardening makes a huge difference, sadly- but its a cheap improvement.
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1512 2014-05-15 19:23:30 <hammond> gmaxwell, and I wasn't going to pull this up but I am, and because  you are averridding an important part in the anonimity "World" here, is that last time you said MTGOX had coins, and now MTGox is no more, so ofcourse you can brush the SSL part of bitcoin-core to the side, but yeah well, you don't know what you are talking about regarding bitcoin, since you said MTGOX was fine.
1513 2014-05-15 19:23:42 <dzan> gmaxwell: yes but it's a step forward
1514 2014-05-15 19:24:07 <dzan> lol
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1516 2014-05-15 19:24:42 <dzan> gmaxwell: so the hardening is in there to try prevent live patching of the binary right?
1517 2014-05-15 19:24:48 <gmaxwell> (and I never said any such thing; I assume thats some fucked up troll, but figuring out what flavor fucked up troll that is not on topic here— and I already warned him)
1518 2014-05-15 19:25:20 <gmaxwell> dzan: if there were a remote code execution vulnerability it may make it more difficult to exploit.
1519 2014-05-15 19:26:13 <dzan> yes that's wath I meant :)
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1521 2014-05-15 19:27:01 <dzan> heh I work on this link time rewriter that does obfuscation and such, good idea to pull bitcoin through before deploying it :-)
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1540 2014-05-15 19:35:22 <reipr> couple quick questions. 1. When spending back to a change address, if the change amount is very small will that incur a fee?
1541 2014-05-15 19:35:52 <reipr> well, I guess only 1 question :)
1542 2014-05-15 19:36:03 <Buyer> reipr
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1546 2014-05-15 19:38:10 <gmaxwell> reipr: It's not entirely clear to me what you're asking.
1547 2014-05-15 19:38:29 <helo> reipr: more of a #bitcoin question, but the answer is that the change sending is a part of the transaction.
1548 2014-05-15 19:38:39 <gmaxwell> reipr: The transaction itself pays the fee. The return of the change isn't seperate.
1549 2014-05-15 19:39:03 <reipr> ok thats what I thought.
1550 2014-05-15 19:39:05 <reipr> thanks
1551 2014-05-15 19:39:39 <MaxSan> does anyone know where i can find an example of what a coloured coin transaction looks like on the blockchain?
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1558 2014-05-15 19:46:51 <pigeons> MaxSan: try #bitcoinx it depends on the specific "colored coin" implementation, search the bitcoinx google group archive and some people post examples they have done on testnet and mainnet, also see https://github.com/bitcoinx/colored-coin-tools/wiki/colored_coins_intro
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1628 2014-05-15 20:44:03 <Guest23231> gmaxwell: nice boat!
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1767 2014-05-15 22:17:42 <loove> PROBLEM with BITCOIND, I am not sure why but at port 8333 nothing is there
1768 2014-05-15 22:18:03 <loove> does bitcoind have to finish updating in order to see anything
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1770 2014-05-15 22:18:49 <helo> no
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1777 2014-05-15 22:23:10 <sipa> define "port 8333 does nothing" ?
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1873 2014-05-15 23:37:33 <xabbix> Does anyone have a working example of how to execute a raw transaction via bitcoind that will allow me to send coins without moving the rest of the balance to a change address?
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1877 2014-05-15 23:39:18 <arubi> you can't spend just a part of a transaction
1878 2014-05-15 23:39:33 <arubi> any non used amounts will be considered as change
1879 2014-05-15 23:40:24 <arubi> sorry, fee
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1884 2014-05-15 23:45:00 <Luke-Jr> xabbix: addresses don't have balances, so you can't.
1885 2014-05-15 23:45:25 <Luke-Jr> xabbix: raw transactions are a low-level thing. when you work with them, stop thinking about balances and addresses, because they don't exist at that level.
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