1 2014-09-14 00:00:53 DoctorBTC is now known as DoctorBTC`
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   6 2014-09-14 00:01:57 <Luke-Jr> anyone available to bounce some TNBTC off?
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  13 2014-09-14 00:04:10 <Luke-Jr> is it intentional that we changed the min free tx size from 10k to 1k? O.o
  14 2014-09-14 00:04:20 <Luke-Jr> max*
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  20 2014-09-14 00:07:53 <Luke-Jr> I guess so
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  24 2014-09-14 00:09:07 <Luke-Jr> ironic it added a comment stating reasoning for NOT doing so, but oh well
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  56 2014-09-14 00:35:02 sqlhelp has joined
  57 2014-09-14 00:35:07 <sqlhelp> hi all
  58 2014-09-14 00:35:30 <sqlhelp> im looking for someone skilled in sql
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  60 2014-09-14 00:37:40 <sipa> not here
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  69 2014-09-14 00:42:03 <sqlhelp> Anyone help me found a vuln link ?
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 125 2014-09-14 01:53:21 <jgarzik_> GAit, http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/2gc4g5/where_is_the_bitcoin_version_of_lwnnet/
 126 2014-09-14 01:53:25 jgarzik_ is now known as jgarzik
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 128 2014-09-14 01:57:41 <Luke-Jr> jgarzik: can I send you some testnet to send back plz?
 129 2014-09-14 01:59:49 <jgarzik> Luke-Jr, sure, if you can wait 5 min or so for me to sync up
 130 2014-09-14 02:00:04 zoroastre has joined
 131 2014-09-14 02:00:44 <Luke-Jr> jgarzik: np
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 139 2014-09-14 02:16:23 <nullbyte> on tnet as well
 140 2014-09-14 02:16:49 <nullbyte> i think if the developer with the right motivations came along, a btc ver of lwn would thrive
 141 2014-09-14 02:17:10 <nullbyte> otherwise i see those bitcoin-focused news sites devolve linearly into ad-soup
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 150 2014-09-14 02:24:30 <Luke-Jr> jgarzik: sync'd? ;)
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 159 2014-09-14 02:35:48 <jgarzik> Luke-Jr, sync'd
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 161 2014-09-14 02:35:56 <jgarzik> Luke-Jr, sorry!  baby alarm went off.
 162 2014-09-14 02:36:29 <Luke-Jr> jgarzik: that's life ☺  address?
 163 2014-09-14 02:36:32 <jgarzik> Luke-Jr, mtHxLYfRL5VEZ53XcqTbbL1UNoNqnz9FFb is a fresh testnet address for me
 164 2014-09-14 02:37:01 <jgarzik> Luke-Jr, do you want me to return the exact same coins back to you, or just send you any old coins?
 165 2014-09-14 02:37:19 <Luke-Jr> jgarzik: doesn't matter
 166 2014-09-14 02:37:25 ak_ has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
 167 2014-09-14 02:38:00 unkn-error has joined
 168 2014-09-14 02:38:21 <jgarzik> Luke-Jr, address for you?  any special requirements of your test, such as waiting for confirmations before sending coins to you?
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 178 2014-09-14 02:40:49 <Luke-Jr> jgarzik: nah, really just doing some basic testing of my 0.9.3 fork before I use it with my real wallets
 179 2014-09-14 02:41:19 WeCluster has quit (Quit: WeCluster)
 180 2014-09-14 02:43:31 <Luke-Jr> jgarzik: mnwhfuDpqUZ1N1uxkkHhcVqZQFJpDefHp2
 181 2014-09-14 02:43:31 <nullbyte> why didn't you just send coins to a wallet opened by 0.9.2?
 182 2014-09-14 02:43:41 ghtdak has joined
 183 2014-09-14 02:44:47 <Luke-Jr> nullbyte: I'm not sure what you're trying to ask there.
 184 2014-09-14 02:45:21 earlz_ is now known as earlz
 185 2014-09-14 02:45:33 <jgarzik> Luke-Jr, See incoming a0ee4cf6090691953ea5ee6eaaa0a1f513ada4e7fb7a80e3374ff27f1f64fa5c.  Sent outgoing 6765b4525756cd2073c26192ced9d02f82e85ab6402bf180bea1d2dbc618976b.
 186 2014-09-14 02:46:32 <nullbyte> well you apparently waited hours for that test, what's your fork contain that couldn't have been tested using stable/master?
 187 2014-09-14 02:46:32 <Luke-Jr> jgarzik: thanks
 188 2014-09-14 02:47:01 weilu has joined
 189 2014-09-14 02:47:07 <nullbyte> maybe its not clear, i suppose it seems simpler to just start another testnet node than wait
 190 2014-09-14 02:47:11 <Luke-Jr> nullbyte: testing stable or master would not be testing my fork, and would still have taken hours
 191 2014-09-14 02:47:24 <Luke-Jr> no, it's simpler to wait - just takes patience :P
 192 2014-09-14 02:47:38 <nullbyte> heh, if you say so :)
 193 2014-09-14 02:48:05 * Luke-Jr ponders if there's any simple way to send to an arbitrary script in BCCore yet
 194 2014-09-14 02:48:36 <jgarzik> Luke-Jr, huh?  P2SH...
 195 2014-09-14 02:48:40 <nullbyte> define arbitrary? nonstandard?
 196 2014-09-14 02:48:52 <nullbyte> arbitrary: *nonstandard
 197 2014-09-14 02:49:06 <jgarzik> Luke-Jr, you can build a raw transaction sending to any hash, even one for a script that uses non-existent opcodes
 198 2014-09-14 02:49:28 <sipa> that wouldn't be an arbitrary script
 199 2014-09-14 02:49:37 <sipa> just a p2sh script with arbitrary redeemscript
 200 2014-09-14 02:49:56 <Luke-Jr> right
 201 2014-09-14 02:50:00 <nullbyte> hm
 202 2014-09-14 02:50:19 <nullbyte> whats the point? i guess
 203 2014-09-14 02:50:26 <jgarzik> <shrug>  use bitcoin-tx
 204 2014-09-14 02:50:27 one_zero has joined
 205 2014-09-14 02:50:31 <jgarzik> to build a raw transaction
 206 2014-09-14 02:50:38 <Luke-Jr> to test my "automatically spend anything redeemable with OP_1" code :p
 207 2014-09-14 02:50:48 YoY has joined
 208 2014-09-14 02:50:54 <nullbyte> haha
 209 2014-09-14 02:50:57 <jgarzik> If you meant putting an arbitrary script directly in the output... use bitcoin-tx
 210 2014-09-14 02:51:20 <jgarzik> it will encode any sequence of opcodes and bytes
 211 2014-09-14 02:51:29 weilu has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
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 214 2014-09-14 02:52:37 <nullbyte> well, jgarzik, that wouldn't be simple ;)
 215 2014-09-14 02:52:49 <nullbyte> 'simple'
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 219 2014-09-14 02:57:43 <jgarzik> Luke-Jr, ./bitcoin-tx -create in=6765b4525756cd2073c26192ced9d02f82e85ab6402bf180bea1d2dbc618976b:0 outscript=0.9995:1
 220 2014-09-14 02:58:14 <jgarzik> "outscript" command takes a 'VALUE:SCRIPT' argument
 221 2014-09-14 02:58:35 <jgarzik> the SCRIPT is the same as the test suite script parser.  Input opcodes, sans OP_ prefix.
 222 2014-09-14 02:58:49 <jgarzik> or hex for a raw push
 223 2014-09-14 02:59:32 <Luke-Jr> jgarzik: space-delimited?
 224 2014-09-14 03:01:26 viic has joined
 225 2014-09-14 03:01:35 <sipa> yes 'in=' and 'outscript=' are dd-style commands
 226 2014-09-14 03:02:37 <jgarzik> Luke-Jr, yes, for both script and command line
 227 2014-09-14 03:02:45 <jgarzik> Luke-Jr, see src/test/data/script*.json for examples
 228 2014-09-14 03:03:10 <nullbyte> is bitcoin-tx new? i'm running 0.9.2
 229 2014-09-14 03:03:49 <jgarzik> ./bitcoin-tx -create in=6765b4525756cd2073c26192ced9d02f82e85ab6402bf180bea1d2dbc618976b:0 "outscript=0.9995:HASH160 0x14 0xda1745e9b549bd0bfa1a569971c77eba30cd5a4b EQUAL"
 230 2014-09-14 03:04:12 <jgarzik> nullbyte, yes
 231 2014-09-14 03:04:29 <jgarzik> Luke-Jr, ^ example of a more familiar script"
 232 2014-09-14 03:05:14 <nullbyte> hm, i guess i'll peek at the makefiles next time i pull tip
 233 2014-09-14 03:05:29 <nullbyte> i'll have to*
 234 2014-09-14 03:05:30 <sipa> nullbyte: will be in 0.10.0
 235 2014-09-14 03:05:38 <nullbyte> damn
 236 2014-09-14 03:05:46 <sipa> and it's in master
 237 2014-09-14 03:06:12 <nullbyte> i must have missed the bump...
 238 2014-09-14 03:06:27 <sipa> well 0.10 is not released
 239 2014-09-14 03:06:39 <sipa> but master will become 0.10 at some point
 240 2014-09-14 03:07:03 <nullbyte> ah right
 241 2014-09-14 03:07:25 <nullbyte> makes sense
 242 2014-09-14 03:08:34 <nullbyte> i suppose that's part of moving things out of bitcoind (?)
 243 2014-09-14 03:08:38 random_cat_ has joined
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 245 2014-09-14 03:08:56 <jgarzik> bitcoind and bitcoin-cli don't need to provide pure-function APIs for manipulating raw transactions
 246 2014-09-14 03:09:12 <jgarzik> I want to move those to libraries with thin CLI wrappers
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 250 2014-09-14 03:09:57 <jgarzik> It was always silly to me that a client<->server round trip was required to createrawtransaction
 251 2014-09-14 03:10:07 <sipa> +1
 252 2014-09-14 03:10:47 Subo1977 has joined
 253 2014-09-14 03:11:17 Informerop has joined
 254 2014-09-14 03:11:59 <nullbyte> or you could just let userspace develop its own tools and slim core code
 255 2014-09-14 03:12:05 weilu has joined
 256 2014-09-14 03:12:19 <nullbyte> perhaps the start of an off-topic discussion, if so, disregard
 257 2014-09-14 03:12:40 devrandom has joined
 258 2014-09-14 03:12:56 <jgarzik> Certainly true, and some other projects already have some CLI tools (notably genjix's toolkit)
 259 2014-09-14 03:13:23 <sipa> well core code needs a way to sign transactions anyway
 260 2014-09-14 03:13:42 <jgarzik> The general long term direction for our code is a library.  You can build bitcoind and CLI tools from the same library.
 261 2014-09-14 03:13:51 <jgarzik> well, many libraries.
 262 2014-09-14 03:13:55 <sipa> reusing the same codebase to implement a lightweight external tool for stuff that needs no blockchain state
 263 2014-09-14 03:14:25 <nullbyte> yeah well /src is going to look pretty bloated if you take everything in `bitcoind help` and turn it into its own tool
 264 2014-09-14 03:14:37 Lexa has joined
 265 2014-09-14 03:14:43 <sipa> things will get to move to subdirs too
 266 2014-09-14 03:15:09 <nullbyte> now thats what i call direction... ;)
 267 2014-09-14 03:15:17 <jgarzik> nullbyte, nobody plans "everything"
 268 2014-09-14 03:15:32 <sipa> for example, in master, most of the script code was moved to script/
 269 2014-09-14 03:15:35 <jgarzik> as sipa said, some things do not require external chain state, and are useful on the command line
 270 2014-09-14 03:15:42 <nullbyte> kidding, if we had more developers in this space, maybe thats feasible, but yea i agree, providing that is probably a good idea
 271 2014-09-14 03:15:43 <jgarzik> Thus, we exercise... taste and judgement
 272 2014-09-14 03:15:44 <jgarzik> ;p
 273 2014-09-14 03:15:49 <nullbyte> hehe
 274 2014-09-14 03:16:06 <nullbyte> +1 libbitcoin/obelisk
 275 2014-09-14 03:16:25 <jgarzik> bitcoin-key and bitcoin-script are the only other tools I plan to work on
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 277 2014-09-14 03:16:53 <sipa> and bitcoin-rule-the-world
 278 2014-09-14 03:16:57 weilu has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
 279 2014-09-14 03:17:05 <jgarzik> bitcoin-DWIM
 280 2014-09-14 03:17:58 TheSeven has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
 281 2014-09-14 03:18:47 <nullbyte> bitcoin-key?
 282 2014-09-14 03:19:17 <nullbyte> and here i thought docs would have been key...
 283 2014-09-14 03:19:17 TheSeven has joined
 284 2014-09-14 03:20:02 <jgarzik> HD derivations, generating the odd key on the command line, other misc stuff related to keys
 285 2014-09-14 03:20:02 <nullbyte> i shouldn't pun probably
 286 2014-09-14 03:20:22 <nullbyte> right, very good
 287 2014-09-14 03:23:16 WeCluster has joined
 288 2014-09-14 03:24:56 <Luke-Jr> jgarzik: so bitcoin-key will be a C++ rewrite of pycoin?
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 292 2014-09-14 03:28:37 <jgarzik> Luke-Jr, no
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 296 2014-09-14 03:32:44 <nullbyte> its strange to keep usertools in the same repository as the core node logic
 297 2014-09-14 03:32:45 <moa> bitcoin-key bitcoin-script ... good idea
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 299 2014-09-14 03:33:44 <Luke-Jr> jgarzik: in what way different?
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 302 2014-09-14 03:33:56 <Luke-Jr> nullbyte: indeed, I think it ought to be moved out :p
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 304 2014-09-14 03:34:20 <nullbyte> simply since node operators probably dont care about them heh
 305 2014-09-14 03:35:21 sqlinj has joined
 306 2014-09-14 03:35:56 <nullbyte> there's the added benefit of lowering the barriers to entry for a starting point to working with bitcoin concepts too
 307 2014-09-14 03:36:08 <nullbyte> er, concepts being
 308 2014-09-14 03:36:12 <sqlinj> Hi all, im look for an experient with sql inject Pm me for more info. donating btc.
 309 2014-09-14 03:36:14 <nullbyte> keys, scripts etc
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 312 2014-09-14 03:36:59 Gibson is now known as thrasher`
 313 2014-09-14 03:37:44 <nullbyte> actually it would be really useful for arsepipes who like to pump data onto the blockchain
 314 2014-09-14 03:38:33 <nullbyte> good thing i dont associate with arsepipes
 315 2014-09-14 03:39:27 guruvan has joined
 316 2014-09-14 03:39:38 <jgarzik> python tools to do that are already embedded within the blockchain :/
 317 2014-09-14 03:40:38 <nullbyte> lol, kidding? that must have been expensive
 318 2014-09-14 03:45:31 melvster has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 319 2014-09-14 03:45:48 <jgarzik> python scripts are tiny compared to embedding wikileaks cables in the chain using said tools
 320 2014-09-14 03:45:52 <nullbyte> it would only be a convenience, you're correct in stating its almost trivial to conjure up some tools using existng libs
 321 2014-09-14 03:46:34 <nullbyte> i see why embedding data gets a bad rap...
 322 2014-09-14 03:46:49 melvster has joined
 323 2014-09-14 03:46:52 <jgarzik> some idiot wrote a filesystem using the blockchain as a backend
 324 2014-09-14 03:46:58 <jgarzik> thankfully they got yelled at
 325 2014-09-14 03:47:01 <nullbyte> that is really stupid
 326 2014-09-14 03:47:42 WeCluster has joined
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 328 2014-09-14 03:49:03 <nullbyte> people shouldnt abuse the blockchain
 329 2014-09-14 03:49:10 zoroastre has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 330 2014-09-14 03:50:15 <nullbyte> did that other guy ever innovate a decentralized filesystem
 331 2014-09-14 03:50:33 ClarusCogitatio has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
 332 2014-09-14 03:50:41 rdponticelli has joined
 333 2014-09-14 03:51:16 <nullbyte> i dont know
 334 2014-09-14 03:51:23 <nullbyte> bitcoin is getting bigger, not smaller
 335 2014-09-14 03:51:32 <nullbyte> more 'idiots' will try other crazy shit
 336 2014-09-14 03:51:40 <nullbyte> kind of exciting to deal with it
 337 2014-09-14 03:52:00 ClarusCogitatio has joined
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 344 2014-09-14 04:10:07 <Luke-Jr> odd
 345 2014-09-14 04:10:26 <Luke-Jr> I've verified bitcoin-tx gave me a correct script, but signrawtransaction doesn't seem to want to sign it
 346 2014-09-14 04:10:40 <Luke-Jr> just passing the hex as the only argument should be sufficient, right? :/
 347 2014-09-14 04:12:58 weilu has joined
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 349 2014-09-14 04:17:37 weilu has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
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 351 2014-09-14 04:22:32 <nullbyte> usually it spits an err
 352 2014-09-14 04:22:33 ClarusCogitatio has joined
 353 2014-09-14 04:24:03 ak_ has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
 354 2014-09-14 04:24:18 <Luke-Jr> seems it's not finding the hash in mapKeys :|
 355 2014-09-14 04:24:55 <nullbyte> nice
 356 2014-09-14 04:25:03 ak_ has joined
 357 2014-09-14 04:25:13 <gmaxwell> Luke-Jr: are the inputs known, is the private key in the wallet, is it not multisig?
 358 2014-09-14 04:26:23 banghouse has joined
 359 2014-09-14 04:27:04 <nullbyte> maybe just -rescan
 360 2014-09-14 04:27:38 <Luke-Jr> aha, I was using the wrong inpoint index
 361 2014-09-14 04:28:56 rdponticelli has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
 362 2014-09-14 04:29:51 <gmaxwell> nullbyte: rescan should never fix anything. If it does something is seriously broken.
 363 2014-09-14 04:30:23 elite1 has joined
 364 2014-09-14 04:32:19 <nullbyte> i think it depends, i cp'ed a wallet the other day and forgot to rescan, so all of my txs were failing to sign; there were no usable inputs
 365 2014-09-14 04:33:04 <sipa> if it's a pretty old wallet file it is possible
 366 2014-09-14 04:33:40 <Luke-Jr> jgarzik: bitcoin-tx errors "error: TX output missing separator" if I try to send to a null script :p
 367 2014-09-14 04:34:17 <gmaxwell> nullbyte: bitcoin stores in the wallet the height that it was scanned upto, and auto rescans the missed portions.
 368 2014-09-14 04:34:51 <gmaxwell> (plus a bit more to handle reorgs)
 369 2014-09-14 04:35:20 <gmaxwell> though right, really old wallet formats didn't have the data.
 370 2014-09-14 04:35:40 aliasaila_ has joined
 371 2014-09-14 04:36:30 jMyles has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
 372 2014-09-14 04:38:59 <Luke-Jr> I thought wallets lacking that data were rescanned entirely?
 373 2014-09-14 04:39:02 <nullbyte> the wallet came from one fully-synced node and was dropped into another; my guess is the new node rescanned a few blocks and didn't find new inputs because AddToWallet hadn't been called for prior txs
 374 2014-09-14 04:39:02 aliasaila has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
 375 2014-09-14 04:39:16 <sipa> that would be a major bug
 376 2014-09-14 04:39:39 <nullbyte> in a roundabout way i guess i'm saying, the wallet tx data wasnt shared between the copies of the blockchain
 377 2014-09-14 04:39:55 <gmaxwell> nullbyte: nothing about the blockchain is wallet specific.
 378 2014-09-14 04:40:00 <sipa> the blockchain data is _completely_ independent of the wallet
 379 2014-09-14 04:40:01 <nullbyte> i dont think i'm explaining it right
 380 2014-09-14 04:40:07 <nullbyte> right
 381 2014-09-14 04:40:27 <nullbyte> arent the inputs stored locally outside of the wallet file?
 382 2014-09-14 04:40:29 <gmaxwell> All the transaction data that might be found is stored in the wallet.
 383 2014-09-14 04:40:31 <gmaxwell> No.
 384 2014-09-14 04:40:34 <nullbyte> wow well
 385 2014-09-14 04:40:46 <nullbyte> i can try to reproduce it later
 386 2014-09-14 04:40:53 <nullbyte> i think i remember what i was up to
 387 2014-09-14 04:43:44 <gmaxwell> I'd be thankful. (This kind of thing has occasionally been claimed, though always also someone with an incorrect mental model of how it worked... and I've never been able to reproduce.  It's possible that there is a bug, but I know sometimes people rescan because they didn't wait for it to sync at start, or the like... if there really is a problem we'd like to fix it and a reproduction seems necessary)
 388 2014-09-14 04:46:16 ClarusCogitatio has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
 389 2014-09-14 04:47:50 <nullbyte> it seems like a tricky bug, i was in testnet, and fwiw i think it was generated in 0.9.x, and then loaded into tip as of a week ago
 390 2014-09-14 04:48:28 <nullbyte> it meaning the wallet, i still have the file so if i can reproduce it i'll send it
 391 2014-09-14 04:48:55 <nullbyte> sec
 392 2014-09-14 04:49:03 ClarusCogitatio has joined
 393 2014-09-14 04:49:29 <jgarzik> Luke-Jr, hum
 394 2014-09-14 04:49:42 <jgarzik> Luke-Jr, I would be happy to support that... do we need null script support?
 395 2014-09-14 04:50:23 <jgarzik> Luke-Jr, If you have a use case, file an issue and I'll fix it.
 396 2014-09-14 04:52:36 <Luke-Jr> jgarzik: I don't have a real use case, just a cheap "anyone can spend"
 397 2014-09-14 04:52:54 <Luke-Jr> so my only argument would be "It's valid!"
 398 2014-09-14 04:53:06 Application has joined
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 400 2014-09-14 04:57:22 Application has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
 401 2014-09-14 04:57:55 <sipa> seems a valid enough reason to me
 402 2014-09-14 04:57:56 <phantomcircuit> gmaxwell, i didn't notice that crypted keys generate the pubkey as a checksum before
 403 2014-09-14 04:57:59 Application has joined
 404 2014-09-14 04:58:22 <phantomcircuit> that should have a hash just like "key" does
 405 2014-09-14 04:59:25 ionstorm has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
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 410 2014-09-14 05:04:10 rdbell has joined
 411 2014-09-14 05:04:46 jMyles has joined
 412 2014-09-14 05:05:14 <nullbyte> having daemon issues
 413 2014-09-14 05:05:26 <nullbyte> few secs*
 414 2014-09-14 05:08:26 rdbell has quit (Client Quit)
 415 2014-09-14 05:08:32 devrando1 has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
 416 2014-09-14 05:11:18 <nullbyte> hm, i don't think i can reproduce it anymore, seeing utxos + able to generate proper inputs
 417 2014-09-14 05:11:35 jMyles has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
 418 2014-09-14 05:12:19 <nullbyte> apologies guys, now ive certainly lost my sanity
 419 2014-09-14 05:12:35 ebfull has quit (Quit: cya)
 420 2014-09-14 05:12:50 <nullbyte> ill dig more though, see if i can turn something up
 421 2014-09-14 05:13:12 dgenr8 has quit (Quit: Leaving)
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 425 2014-09-14 05:15:58 bedeho has joined
 426 2014-09-14 05:17:17 <nullbyte> it'll take a few days, i clearly don't remember the steps taken
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 440 2014-09-14 05:32:45 <nullbyte> attempting a blowaway of testnet but not looking too promising, did anyone else mention any steps they took?
 441 2014-09-14 05:37:45 <earlz> So, is it impossible to build a mac wallet without owning a mac?
 442 2014-09-14 05:37:59 <Luke-Jr> earlz: no, master has gitian descriptors for it
 443 2014-09-14 05:38:11 <earlz> I see that..
 444 2014-09-14 05:38:22 <earlz> Register and download the Apple SDK: (see OSX Readme for details)
 445 2014-09-14 05:38:22 <earlz> https://developer.apple.com/downloads/download.action?path=Developer_Tools/xcode_4.6.3/xcode4630916281a.dmg
 446 2014-09-14 05:38:26 <earlz> Using a Mac, create a tarball for the 10.7 SDK and copy it to the inputs directory:
 447 2014-09-14 05:38:30 <Luke-Jr> oh, that step
 448 2014-09-14 05:38:32 <earlz> I don't have a mac :/
 449 2014-09-14 05:38:43 <Luke-Jr> that's a somewhat-recent regression
 450 2014-09-14 05:38:58 <Luke-Jr> Apple made their DMG not work with non-Apple extractors :/
 451 2014-09-14 05:39:09 <earlz> fuck apple ugh
 452 2014-09-14 05:39:19 <earlz> so, 7-zip or some such won't work?
 453 2014-09-14 05:39:45 devrandom has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
 454 2014-09-14 05:39:46 <Luke-Jr> and despite earlier Mac-gitian stuff working with redistributable files only, for some reason cfields thinks that's not possible anymore (I forget why)
 455 2014-09-14 05:40:06 <cfields> hmm?
 456 2014-09-14 05:40:12 <earlz> ugh
 457 2014-09-14 05:40:23 <Luke-Jr> cfields: I forget why we need non-redistributable stuff
 458 2014-09-14 05:40:36 <cfields> Luke-Jr: the osx sdk isn't redistributable
 459 2014-09-14 05:40:41 <cfields> no way around that, unfortunately
 460 2014-09-14 05:40:42 <Luke-Jr> cfields: the original work you did worked with redistributable portions of it
 461 2014-09-14 05:40:44 phoenix52 has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 462 2014-09-14 05:40:56 <cfields> no, there are none. it's all behind a eula
 463 2014-09-14 05:40:59 <Luke-Jr> which was inside a DMG that Linux could extract
 464 2014-09-14 05:41:16 <cfields> 10.6 could be extracted deterministicly
 465 2014-09-14 05:41:26 <earlz> ugh that's fugly
 466 2014-09-14 05:41:32 <cfields> after that, they moved everything into xcode rather than a separate download
 467 2014-09-14 05:41:42 <cfields> so you have to extract from there, and it's not deterministic
 468 2014-09-14 05:41:43 <Luke-Jr> cfields: the bigger problem right now is that we can't extract it *at all*
 469 2014-09-14 05:41:56 <Luke-Jr> (without having a Mac)
 470 2014-09-14 05:42:06 <cfields> Luke-Jr: understood. the problem is that the tools can't cope with it (afaik)
 471 2014-09-14 05:42:09 <earlz> ugh. I guess I'll skip mac for now then
 472 2014-09-14 05:42:15 <Luke-Jr> Rright
 473 2014-09-14 05:42:29 <cfields> it'd be great to fix those tools, but it hasn't been a priority for me yet
 474 2014-09-14 05:42:35 <Luke-Jr> earlz: does 7zip normally do DMG? I don't know if I tried that
 475 2014-09-14 05:42:39 <cfields> it's very possible that there's an existing too that i've missed, though
 476 2014-09-14 05:42:49 <cfields> Luke-Jr: yes, i tried that. it doesn't work
 477 2014-09-14 05:42:53 <Luke-Jr> :<
 478 2014-09-14 05:42:58 <earlz> 7-zip is my go to extractor for everything on windows. I'm not aware of anything similar on linux though
 479 2014-09-14 05:43:11 <earlz> when it's done downloading I'll see if it works
 480 2014-09-14 05:43:23 <cfields> as well as self-bulds of cpio+xar. on linux, they're not compat
 481 2014-09-14 05:43:31 <cfields> but i'd love to be proven wrong, that'd be great.
 482 2014-09-14 05:43:53 <Luke-Jr> cfields: this is just for libs to link against, right?
 483 2014-09-14 05:43:58 <cfields> Luke-Jr: i found a build of their cmdline-only toolchain that works and can be extracted
 484 2014-09-14 05:44:11 <cfields> unfortunately, it doesn't include their libc
 485 2014-09-14 05:44:31 <cfields> Luke-Jr: it's their frameworks. osx frameworks are a different beast
 486 2014-09-14 05:44:44 <Luke-Jr> frameworks aren't just libs + pkg-config-equivalent? :|
 487 2014-09-14 05:44:49 <cfields> they're like libs and headers rolled into one
 488 2014-09-14 05:44:53 <Luke-Jr> bleh
 489 2014-09-14 05:45:06 <Luke-Jr> actually
 490 2014-09-14 05:45:11 <Luke-Jr> any reason we can't use the older frameworks?
 491 2014-09-14 05:45:13 <cfields> it makes a ton of sense from an OS standpoint. just not really friendly towards existing tools
 492 2014-09-14 05:45:26 <cfields> frameworks and toolchain are linked
 493 2014-09-14 05:45:35 <Luke-Jr> :|
 494 2014-09-14 05:45:51 <cfields> osx has a really weird notion of sdks
 495 2014-09-14 05:46:05 <cfields> they're completely portable.. as long as you're using the version you're supposed to be
 496 2014-09-14 05:46:13 <cfields> (translation: not at all portable)
 497 2014-09-14 05:47:01 <cfields> which is why so many projects require a minimum version for building, regardless of the target
 498 2014-09-14 05:47:21 <cfields> i have a branch that i've been working on that lifts those restrictions, we'll be able to target any version with any sdk...
 499 2014-09-14 05:47:33 <cfields> but you'll still have to extract the sdk from osx :\
 500 2014-09-14 05:47:42 devrandom has joined
 501 2014-09-14 05:48:04 <cfields> but again, that's just a tooling problem. the incompat problems can be fixed in 7zip/xar, and that won't be an issue anymore
 502 2014-09-14 05:49:06 <cfields> sorry for the wall of text, but i think that sums up the full story :)
 503 2014-09-14 05:49:18 <Luke-Jr> earlz: depending on your goals, you could perhaps borrow a Mac or get an illicit copy from someone else who did it
 504 2014-09-14 05:50:39 cbit has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
 505 2014-09-14 05:51:24 <cfields> i heard a rumor there's there's a 10.7 sdk at github...
 506 2014-09-14 05:51:39 <Luke-Jr> me too
 507 2014-09-14 05:51:45 phoenix52 has joined
 508 2014-09-14 05:51:49 <Luke-Jr> who knows how long, or how trustworthy it is, though
 509 2014-09-14 05:51:53 <earlz> lol
 510 2014-09-14 05:52:05 <Luke-Jr> I even noticed there was a bitcointroll post linking it
 511 2014-09-14 05:54:14 <cfields> well since it doesn't actually link to it, worst you'll get is busted symbols at load-time
 512 2014-09-14 05:54:49 <Luke-Jr> cfields: unless the headers are dirty
 513 2014-09-14 05:54:50 DougieBot5000 has quit (Quit: Leaving)
 514 2014-09-14 05:55:13 <cfields> Luke-Jr: a bunch of malicious inlines, i suppose
 515 2014-09-14 05:56:10 <Luke-Jr> __attribute__((constructor)) is nasty too
 516 2014-09-14 05:57:39 <Luke-Jr> cfields: travis is b0rked? :\
 517 2014-09-14 05:58:10 zeiris has quit (Quit: segfault)
 518 2014-09-14 05:58:15 <Luke-Jr> jgarzik: where do bitcoin-tx tests live?
 519 2014-09-14 05:58:22 zeiris has joined
 520 2014-09-14 06:00:09 devrandom has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
 521 2014-09-14 06:02:11 <Luke-Jr> nm found them
 522 2014-09-14 06:04:16 Guest37774 has quit (Changing host)
 523 2014-09-14 06:04:16 Guest37774 has joined
 524 2014-09-14 06:04:24 Guest37774 is now known as SomeoneWeird
 525 2014-09-14 06:05:59 <cfields> Luke-Jr: it is?
 526 2014-09-14 06:06:15 <Luke-Jr> cfields: yes, it just failed my obviously-not-breaking-it PR
 527 2014-09-14 06:06:38 <cfields> Luke-Jr: yea, see the log...
 528 2014-09-14 06:06:51 <cfields> that's the same random false-negative we get on pull-tester now and then
 529 2014-09-14 06:07:04 <Luke-Jr> I thought Travis was going to fix that <.<
 530 2014-09-14 06:07:14 <cfields> i think we've pretty much decided to just ignore it since headers-first will require new tests
 531 2014-09-14 06:07:22 <Luke-Jr> i c
 532 2014-09-14 06:07:32 <Luke-Jr> at least it doesn't spam my emails every time :D
 533 2014-09-14 06:07:35 <cfields> sec for link..
 534 2014-09-14 06:07:49 <cfields> Luke-Jr: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/4837
 535 2014-09-14 06:08:46 <cfields> basically it's an issue with the comparison tool that isn't worth fixing
 536 2014-09-14 06:09:00 <cfields> rather, isn't worth trying to find the cause-of
 537 2014-09-14 06:09:42 <Luke-Jr> oh, *BitcoinJ* headers-first..?
 538 2014-09-14 06:09:56 <Luke-Jr> cfields: would it be difficult to do 1 or 2 retries on failures?
 539 2014-09-14 06:10:18 <cfields> dunno what BlueMatt has up his sleeve, he's been working on something
 540 2014-09-14 06:10:28 <cfields> Luke-Jr: hmm, now that's a decent hackish idea...
 541 2014-09-14 06:10:41 ak_ has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
 542 2014-09-14 06:10:42 <sipa> Luke-Jr, cfields: don't confuse pulltester with comparison tool
 543 2014-09-14 06:11:01 <sipa> the random failures are in comparison tool, which is run both by pulltester and travis
 544 2014-09-14 06:11:05 mpmcsweeney has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
 545 2014-09-14 06:11:15 <cfields> right
 546 2014-09-14 06:11:20 <sipa> and headersfirst will be the current comparison tool unusable
 547 2014-09-14 06:11:21 ClarusCogitatio has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
 548 2014-09-14 06:11:24 <sipa> *make
 549 2014-09-14 06:11:43 ak_ has joined
 550 2014-09-14 06:12:25 <cfields> Luke-Jr: it's a total non-fix....
 551 2014-09-14 06:12:26 <cfields> http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=2J4ZyzMg
 552 2014-09-14 06:12:32 <cfields> but that may be worth doing for now
 553 2014-09-14 06:12:57 <Luke-Jr> heh, that's simple enough
 554 2014-09-14 06:13:06 <Luke-Jr> assuming travis-retry fails at some point
 555 2014-09-14 06:13:16 <cfields> yea, i think it tries 3x
 556 2014-09-14 06:14:21 ClarusCogitatio has joined
 557 2014-09-14 06:14:23 weilu has joined
 558 2014-09-14 06:14:30 <cfields> it's meant for trying network stuff which may fail once, we use it for apt-get, for ex
 559 2014-09-14 06:14:30 <BlueMatt> cfields: well the comparison tools have diverged in bitcoinj/the one used, so I'm merging them/supporting headers first on that
 560 2014-09-14 06:14:38 <BlueMatt> cfields: its nothing special, but should make things work better
 561 2014-09-14 06:14:44 <BlueMatt> also, no, you shouldnt retry
 562 2014-09-14 06:14:58 <cfields> ?
 563 2014-09-14 06:15:00 <Luke-Jr> O.o
 564 2014-09-14 06:15:09 <BlueMatt> some of the tests are random and may fail based on the size of the key which is randomly on a border within a few bytes
 565 2014-09-14 06:15:13 omefire has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
 566 2014-09-14 06:15:19 <BlueMatt> so sometimes retrying may hide an error
 567 2014-09-14 06:15:32 <cfields> erm, why do tests use random data?
 568 2014-09-14 06:15:39 <cfields> that's really nasty behavior for exactly this reason
 569 2014-09-14 06:15:40 <BlueMatt> they generate keys...
 570 2014-09-14 06:15:49 <Luke-Jr> BlueMatt: if the error is randomly not-detected, there is a bug in the tester
 571 2014-09-14 06:16:01 <BlueMatt> its detected like 1/3 times or so, so....meh
 572 2014-09-14 06:16:12 <BlueMatt> anyway, I'm too lazy to pregenerate keys and make sure they're on the border properly
 573 2014-09-14 06:16:27 <Luke-Jr> x.x
 574 2014-09-14 06:16:34 <BlueMatt> if y'all want to, I agree it would be better
 575 2014-09-14 06:17:36 jMyles has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
 576 2014-09-14 06:17:45 <cfields> tests need to pass/fail in a deterministic way, anything random is bad news
 577 2014-09-14 06:18:06 <cfields> that means that random broken-ness can also pass
 578 2014-09-14 06:18:13 <BlueMatt> random tests can certainly be useful in many cases, this is not neccessarily one of them
 579 2014-09-14 06:18:37 <BlueMatt> in any case, I'm not /that/ concerned as such cases would be caught rather quickly
 580 2014-09-14 06:18:46 weilu has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
 581 2014-09-14 06:19:07 kdomanski_ has joined
 582 2014-09-14 06:19:38 <BlueMatt> also, if someone breaks one of those tests, hopefully the tests have been run on that branch 100 times before it gets merged...I mean who is gonna break pubkey parsing stuff without lots of review/testing?
 583 2014-09-14 06:20:04 <Luke-Jr> anyhow, IMO, the testers are entirely useless if they always report a failure even when things are good; so missing a bug because of the tester being buggy is preferable over getting false-failures all the time
 584 2014-09-14 06:20:30 <BlueMatt> probably
 585 2014-09-14 06:20:43 <BlueMatt> as long as its caught soon before release
 586 2014-09-14 06:22:30 <cfields> i'm not sure how generating a random key could ever be preferable
 587 2014-09-14 06:22:41 kdomanski has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
 588 2014-09-14 06:22:44 <cfields> if a random key is generated that breaks the tests, add that to the list that's tested
 589 2014-09-14 06:22:59 <BlueMatt> its not, feel free to fix it...patches welcome ;)
 590 2014-09-14 06:23:41 <cfields> fair enough, but i was shot down when trying to update to mainline code suitable for patching against ;)
 591 2014-09-14 06:24:51 <BlueMatt> hmm?
 592 2014-09-14 06:25:07 <cfields> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/4837
 593 2014-09-14 06:25:24 drawingthesun has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
 594 2014-09-14 06:25:49 <BlueMatt> I barely looked at that pull, you just updated the jar to bitcoinj's latest, no?
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 596 2014-09-14 06:26:11 <BlueMatt> bitcoinj latest appears to have quite a few tests missing that were never merged because I overlooked them
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 598 2014-09-14 06:26:35 <BlueMatt> plus headers-first needs to happen so I'm gonna pull those all in at once, or try to...having a time-constraint problem atm
 599 2014-09-14 06:26:40 <cfields> i'm not sure how i can be helping here, then
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 601 2014-09-14 06:27:34 <BlueMatt> its my fault, sorry...I'm trying to get out from under some technical debt plus things dealing with work cropping up
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 603 2014-09-14 06:30:28 <cfields> not trying to assign blame, only to help. if it's a time constraint that's fine
 604 2014-09-14 06:31:17 <cfields> but if there are short-term improvements that could be made until the real fixes go in, please let me know and i'll do what i can
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 606 2014-09-14 06:31:35 <BlueMatt> I mean do as required to make it work
 607 2014-09-14 06:31:50 <BlueMatt> if #4837 is gonna remove the false negatives until I can get something in, go ahead and merge it
 608 2014-09-14 06:31:52 <BlueMatt> I have no idea
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 610 2014-09-14 06:32:59 <cfields> well i don't either, ofc, it was only meant to bring us up to a point where we could beging debugging. sounds like there's till randomness involved, so it would likely still fail sometimes
 611 2014-09-14 06:33:21 <cfields> though.. it'd be worth logging what makes it fail, so that case can be isolated
 612 2014-09-14 06:33:22 <BlueMatt> I dont think the key generation stuff could be the cause of thsoe failures
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 614 2014-09-14 06:33:45 <BlueMatt> I dunno, that would certainly be duplicated effort if you're gonna start debugging from scratch
 615 2014-09-14 06:34:19 <jgarzik> Luke-Jr, Thanks for the test.  Just need to update Makefile.test.include EXTRA_DIST to fix pull tester, I think.
 616 2014-09-14 06:34:29 <BlueMatt> if its a huge deal I can try to get it fixed sooner but not sure when I can get it finished up
 617 2014-09-14 06:34:30 <BlueMatt> :(
 618 2014-09-14 06:35:11 <Luke-Jr> jgarzik: pushed
 619 2014-09-14 06:36:11 <cfields> BlueMatt: your call. I'm fairly ignorant on the subject, but i get the pings when builds fail. for now, i'll just continue to explain that false-negatives will happen from time-to-time
 620 2014-09-14 06:36:25 <BlueMatt> yea, ok :(
 621 2014-09-14 06:36:30 * Luke-Jr votes travis-retry
 622 2014-09-14 06:36:32 <cfields> BlueMatt: that wasn't me being passive-aggressive, just couldn't say it any other way :)
 623 2014-09-14 06:36:59 <BlueMatt> cfields: didnt take it that way, I'm just pissed I havent been able to deal with all the technical debt Ive built up quickly enough
 624 2014-09-14 06:37:02 <cfields> Luke-Jr: yea, i do too.
 625 2014-09-14 06:37:06 * Luke-Jr wonders if Travis's timer is in CPU time or real time.
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 627 2014-09-14 06:37:32 <cfields> BlueMatt: could you agree to that? if it's going to pass sometimes and not others, surely it's better for the pull-tester to retry if it fails the first time?
 628 2014-09-14 06:38:09 <cfields> Luke-Jr: some crazy fantasy-world time
 629 2014-09-14 06:38:17 <cfields> that's been my observation so far, anyway
 630 2014-09-14 06:38:28 <Luke-Jr> cfields: not CPU time?
 631 2014-09-14 06:38:37 <cfields> time seems to recalculate between steps
 632 2014-09-14 06:38:45 <Luke-Jr> O.o
 633 2014-09-14 06:39:00 <Luke-Jr> could be CPU time then.. that would seem idea
 634 2014-09-14 06:39:01 <Luke-Jr> ideal*
 635 2014-09-14 06:39:11 <cfields> for ex, build time may take 10 min. but if it was queued for 5 min before it started, the total build time was 15 min
 636 2014-09-14 06:39:24 <cfields> then suddenly after build, it'll drop back down to 10 min again
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 638 2014-09-14 06:40:45 <cfields> i need to head to bed...
 639 2014-09-14 06:40:55 <BlueMatt> cfields: hmm, I suppose for the time being its a reasonable bandaid
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 641 2014-09-14 06:41:10 <cfields> i think retrying is the most sane option for now, i'll pr it and see if BlueMatt disagrees too loudly
 642 2014-09-14 06:41:14 <cfields> ok great
 643 2014-09-14 06:41:26 <cfields> agreed it's nothing more than a hack, but seems the proper one for the moment
 644 2014-09-14 06:42:06 <cfields> nnite
 645 2014-09-14 06:42:13 <Luke-Jr> woo, Travis is happy
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 650 2014-09-14 06:44:34 <jgarzik> Luke-Jr, yep, looks good
 651 2014-09-14 06:45:45 <jgarzik> Luke-Jr, BTW, if you were so inclined... more tests are welcome.  Run "./bitcoin-tx" to get a list of all commands supported.  The test suite is incomplete, and could always use additional "it works" tests, if nothing else.
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 829 2014-09-14 12:04:16 <dabura667> Hello all: If someone with a good understanding of BIP37 and how Bitcoinj and Breadwallet, for instance, use it to query the p2p network directly could help me out I would greatly appreciate it. I need to give an explanation of various developments in Bitcoin wallets from a technical perspective, but BIP37 confuses me...
 830 2014-09-14 12:04:17 nsh has joined
 831 2014-09-14 12:04:42 <dabura667> 1. How does it find peers?
 832 2014-09-14 12:05:29 <dabura667> 2. What is the format of the query it sends to the peer? (I read the BIP, but I couldn't quite understand how that translated into data being sent)
 833 2014-09-14 12:05:54 rdymac has joined
 834 2014-09-14 12:06:16 <dabura667> 3. What exactly does the peer send back to the client? (again, I read the format specs on the BIP, but didn't quite understand exactly what's being sent in laymans terms)
 835 2014-09-14 12:06:32 weilu has joined
 836 2014-09-14 12:06:50 <dabura667> Also, 4. What was the version number of QT that was first compatible with BIP 37?
 837 2014-09-14 12:06:54 fabianfabian has quit (Quit: what)
 838 2014-09-14 12:07:02 <dabura667> Again, thanks to anyone who can clear things up for me.
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 887 2014-09-14 13:30:01 <sipa> dabura667: do you understrand bloom filters? if not, first read the wikipedia article on it
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 890 2014-09-14 13:31:32 <sipa> dabura667: onna high level, the clients tells the servet "i'm really only interested in transactions that credit addresses X, Y, Z
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 892 2014-09-14 13:32:11 <sipa> dabura667: and then instead of asking for full transactions and blocks, the clients gets filtered transactions and blocks
 893 2014-09-14 13:33:16 <dabura667> sipa: I read and understand the basic concept, but the implementation gets me confused in regards to bitcoinj and breadwallet...
 894 2014-09-14 13:33:55 <sipa> can you be more specific?
 895 2014-09-14 13:34:20 <sipa> i'm fine with answerimg specific questions, but the whole concept is a bit too complex to explain over irc
 896 2014-09-14 13:35:09 <dabura667> Starting with #1 I am not sure how bitcoinj finds peers... does it just use the same method core does? Or does it implement some other method? And if so, what does that method entail on a high level?
 897 2014-09-14 13:35:29 <dabura667> does it just find one random full node?
 898 2014-09-14 13:35:33 <sipa> it uses the same method
 899 2014-09-14 13:35:41 <sipa> it connects to a bunch of nodes
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 902 2014-09-14 13:36:30 <dabura667> Ok, then does it divie up the queries to each node or send the same query to each node.
 903 2014-09-14 13:36:50 <sipa> bitcoin is a gossip network
 904 2014-09-14 13:37:09 <sipa> that means each peer that kearns about something announcew that to all its peers
 905 2014-09-14 13:37:29 <sipa> then they query the actual data from one (typically the first) that announced it
 906 2014-09-14 13:37:36 <sipa> bip37 does not change that
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 909 2014-09-14 13:38:14 <sipa> except the server knows nkt to inform them about each and every transaction... they filter it and only announce what they believe we are ijnterested in
 910 2014-09-14 13:39:52 <dabura667> ok. So the full nodes that support bloom filters receive a bloom filter query from the client and register the client while the client is connected... ie. ip address xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx (our client) only wants to know about things that meet the requirements of bloom filter xyz.
 911 2014-09-14 13:40:06 <dabura667> Then upon disconnect the node forgets that bloom filter?
 912 2014-09-14 13:40:11 <sipa> yes
 913 2014-09-14 13:40:20 <dabura667> oh ok that makes much more sense.
 914 2014-09-14 13:40:38 <dabura667> what about, for instance... past transaction lookup.
 915 2014-09-14 13:41:01 <sipa> so there is a difference between transactions and blocks
 916 2014-09-14 13:41:07 <dabura667> for instance, if I input a used BIP39 seed in breadwallet, and it has received txes from over 2 months ago... how does that work
 917 2014-09-14 13:41:26 <sipa> it basically needs to start over
 918 2014-09-14 13:41:32 <sipa> and fetch blocks again
 919 2014-09-14 13:41:45 <dabura667> ok, that explains the long sync time
 920 2014-09-14 13:41:54 <dabura667> is it just fetching headers?
 921 2014-09-14 13:41:57 <dabura667> or whole blocks?
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 923 2014-09-14 13:42:02 <sipa> filtereed blocks
 924 2014-09-14 13:42:17 <sipa> more than headers, but only the transactions in it thatnmatter
 925 2014-09-14 13:42:22 <dabura667> ahhh i see... so are these blocks pruned of unrelated txes before being sent out?
 926 2014-09-14 13:42:27 <sipa> yes
 927 2014-09-14 13:42:51 <sipa> and replaced by merkle branches to prove that the ovcerall hash of the transactions is valid
 928 2014-09-14 13:43:10 <dabura667> ok makes sense
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 931 2014-09-14 13:45:52 <dabura667> sipa: ok, I think I'm getting it now... so client side the only thing I really need to worry about is setting up the filter and broadcasting it to the peers I can find, and those peers will give me info as it comes in... ok
 932 2014-09-14 13:46:05 <dabura667> What would be a use case for filteradd?
 933 2014-09-14 13:46:30 <dabura667> adding new addresses to the wallet?
 934 2014-09-14 13:47:59 <sipa> in something like a bip32/44 wallet, you probably have some lookahead number of addresses
 935 2014-09-14 13:48:21 <sipa> if they get used quickly, you'll want to add new addresses on the fly
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 937 2014-09-14 13:48:34 <sipa> but this is really tricky actually
 938 2014-09-14 13:48:44 <sipa> i'm not sure whether anyone uses it
 939 2014-09-14 13:49:21 <dabura667> hmm, I see... adding addresses on the fly sounds tricky...
 940 2014-09-14 13:49:48 <sipa> well you certainly want to add new addresses during sync
 941 2014-09-14 13:50:00 <dabura667> Ok, so if I filterload the bloom filter on to the peers, will they just start sending me old blocks with related transactions? or do I need to query them?
 942 2014-09-14 13:50:03 <sipa> but typically i guess that just happens by occasionally sending a new filter
 943 2014-09-14 13:50:18 <sipa> peers never just send you blocks
 944 2014-09-14 13:50:32 <sipa> they announce blocks, and you query them
 945 2014-09-14 13:51:04 <dabura667> ok, so what command would I use to query the blocks related to a bloom filter x?
 946 2014-09-14 13:51:13 <sipa> that's in the bip
 947 2014-09-14 13:51:50 <sipa> iirc it's a getdata with invtype 3 instead of 1 or 2
 948 2014-09-14 13:53:38 <dabura667> ok, thanks.
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 950 2014-09-14 13:54:37 <sipa> the bip does not cover everything about "how to write a light client"; it explains how, if you already have a client, make it light
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 953 2014-09-14 13:55:40 <dabura667> I gathered that it was written with a lot of prerequisite knowledge in mind, and without any code examples... so I was having a hard time. Thanks for the help.
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 995 2014-09-14 14:57:42 <jgarzik> hum
 996 2014-09-14 14:57:48 <jgarzik> what is that script-as-lib pull req#?
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1014 2014-09-14 15:23:57 <sipa> jgarzik: it was closed temporarily
1015 2014-09-14 15:24:14 <sipa> 4692
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1055 2014-09-14 15:37:01 <sipa> jgarzik: there have been some refactors since to make libbitcoinscript cleaner (including splitting up util, splitting up script, and making the sigcache optional)
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1117 2014-09-14 16:52:19 <chichov> are the transaction fees calculated per 1000 or 1024 bytes?
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1139 2014-09-14 17:12:31 <sipa> chichov: 1000
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1142 2014-09-14 17:14:47 <chichov> sipa: thank you
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1328 2014-09-14 21:22:17 <nullbyte> .
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1388 2014-09-14 22:50:56 <zwischenzug> say we have a script that reads the following:
1389 2014-09-14 22:51:16 <zwischenzug> sig pk 1 1 OP_EQUALVERIFY OP_CHECKSIG
1390 2014-09-14 22:51:52 <zwischenzug> when OP_EQUALVERIFY gets popped on the stack and evaluated, it returns true
1391 2014-09-14 22:52:28 <zwischenzug> then is takes the stack, and runs OP_VERIFY
1392 2014-09-14 22:52:48 <zwischenzug> so, sig pk OP_VERIFY
1393 2014-09-14 22:53:20 Shlomogolddoge is now known as Dr-G
1394 2014-09-14 22:53:22 <sipa> ?
1395 2014-09-14 22:53:23 <zwischenzug> when in this process does the OP_CHECKSIG instruction get pushed on the stack?
1396 2014-09-14 22:53:38 <sipa> instructions do not get pushed on the stack
1397 2014-09-14 22:53:45 <sipa> they are just executed sequentially
1398 2014-09-14 22:53:59 <zwischenzug> ok
1399 2014-09-14 22:54:16 <zwischenzug> so, stack is [sig pk]
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1401 2014-09-14 22:54:32 <zwischenzug> instructions are [OP_VERIFY, OP_CHECKSIG]
1402 2014-09-14 22:54:48 <nullbyte> its alarming because i've seen execution of opcodes been described as a stack almost everywhere i've read about bitcoin
1403 2014-09-14 22:55:41 <zwischenzug> yea, that's kinda confusing
1404 2014-09-14 22:55:51 <zwischenzug> but this makes way more sense though
1405 2014-09-14 22:56:32 spinza has joined
1406 2014-09-14 22:56:40 <zwischenzug> what exactly does OP_VERIFY do? is executes the rest of the intstructions sequentially, and if they return true txn is marked as valid?
1407 2014-09-14 22:57:36 <zwischenzug> is OP_VERIFY implicitly called everytime a script is executed, to determine whether the script returns true or false?
1408 2014-09-14 22:58:03 Vinnie_win has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
1409 2014-09-14 22:58:46 <zwischenzug> suppose scriptSig = [1 1], and scriptPubKey = [OP_EQUAL]
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1411 2014-09-14 22:59:27 <zwischenzug> will OP_VERIFY ever need to be explicitly called from within the script instruction in order to mark the transaction as valid?
1412 2014-09-14 22:59:50 <sipa> sure
1413 2014-09-14 23:00:05 <sipa> if you want to do two chrcksigs with an and or an or in between
1414 2014-09-14 23:00:18 <sipa> and then do verify
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1417 2014-09-14 23:03:19 <zwischenzug> would the following 2 scripts execute identically?
1418 2014-09-14 23:03:25 <zwischenzug> sig pk 1 1 OP_EQUALVERIFY OP_CHECKSIG
1419 2014-09-14 23:03:29 <zwischenzug> sig pk OP_CHECKSIG 1 1 OP_EQUAL OP_EQUAL
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