1 2014-10-22 00:01:48 banghouse has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
   2 2014-10-22 00:03:45 <flavien_> petertodd: yes because now it only works with P2PKH
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  10 2014-10-22 00:08:26 <coryfields_> sipa: i've fixed up the libsecp256k1 in bitcoin (testing it in libbitcoinconsensus), and it's having trouble with a particular test. Known issue for "P2PK with high S" ?
  11 2014-10-22 00:08:43 <sipa> coryfields_: that sounds very expected
  12 2014-10-22 00:08:54 <coryfields_> ok, will just skip over it
  13 2014-10-22 00:09:31 <sipa> it needs a change in secp256k1's api, i'm afraid
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  15 2014-10-22 00:09:52 <sipa> as you can't tell it to not use low-S
  16 2014-10-22 00:09:56 <coryfields_> figured as much, specifying high/low S i suppose
  17 2014-10-22 00:09:58 <coryfields_> ?
  18 2014-10-22 00:10:00 <coryfields_> right
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  21 2014-10-22 00:10:50 <sipa> yup
  22 2014-10-22 00:10:54 <coryfields_> want me to take a crack at it? or is it waiting on something?
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  24 2014-10-22 00:11:06 <sipa> it's trivial to do, you can if you want to
  25 2014-10-22 00:11:17 <sipa> busy with other things currently
  26 2014-10-22 00:11:58 <coryfields_> ok
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 166 2014-10-22 02:45:03 <coryfields_> gmaxwell: around?
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 169 2014-10-22 02:48:31 <gmaxwell> coryfields_: shockingly, yes.
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 172 2014-10-22 02:50:05 <coryfields_> gmaxwell: bah, i just pasted backlog to that PR.
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 174 2014-10-22 02:50:18 <coryfields_> refresh there or scroll up a few lines :)
 175 2014-10-22 02:50:42 <gmaxwell> yea, responded. OK.
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 184 2014-10-22 03:08:37 <deego> RE topi: what does bc.i mean?
 185 2014-10-22 03:09:10 <lechuga_> blockchain.info
 186 2014-10-22 03:09:21 <deego> ah, thanks lechuga_
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 350 2014-10-22 08:15:52 <anton000> opinions on what cirve allows for type-2 without the problems when done with secp256k?
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 355 2014-10-22 08:20:34 <CodeShark> wumpus: ping
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 362 2014-10-22 08:22:37 <CodeShark> is the sync.h thing a decent temporary solution, you think?
 363 2014-10-22 08:23:02 <wumpus> I think so
 364 2014-10-22 08:23:39 <sipa> anton000: which problems?
 365 2014-10-22 08:23:40 <wumpus> it's RAII and it just pushes the locks down one level, so easier to review than having changes to the RPC method's logic
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 367 2014-10-22 08:24:42 <CodeShark> exactly - the objective is to get this merged so that developers can optimize concurrency without touching rpcserver
 368 2014-10-22 08:24:57 <CodeShark> with the least risk of breaking anything :)
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 372 2014-10-22 08:26:13 <wumpus> right
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 374 2014-10-22 08:26:48 <CodeShark> I'm far more interested in the abstract dispatching mechanism than in the optimization of individual calls :)
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 378 2014-10-22 08:28:37 <CodeShark> so once we merge this, I can continue to work on removing the table from rpcserver.cpp
 379 2014-10-22 08:29:05 <CodeShark> we can create an abstract callable base clase
 380 2014-10-22 08:29:08 <CodeShark> *class
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 382 2014-10-22 08:30:35 <wumpus> right
 383 2014-10-22 08:30:37 <CodeShark> then we can add the registration methods to the different units - and call them when initializing the rpc server
 384 2014-10-22 08:32:41 <CodeShark> then the RPC server interface becomes a matter of a specific function prototype - which we can easily wrap, making it simple to improve or replace the rpc server independently from everything else
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 394 2014-10-22 08:38:16 <CodeShark> it will also make it much simpler to add compiletime or runtime switches as to which APIs are loaded
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 397 2014-10-22 08:39:39 <CodeShark> and in principle we could ultimately support dynamic loading of new APIs without having to stop the daemon
 398 2014-10-22 08:40:32 <CodeShark> but first things first :p
 399 2014-10-22 08:40:38 <wumpus> I doubt we're going in that direction, though, but sure it could be possible :)
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 402 2014-10-22 08:42:00 <wumpus> I mean as for loading third party APIs at runtime; but modularization within the current code is very good
 403 2014-10-22 08:42:13 <CodeShark> yeah, I was getting a little carried away :)
 404 2014-10-22 08:42:30 <CodeShark> in truth, I'd actually see bitcoind have LESS core functionality rather than MORE
 405 2014-10-22 08:42:30 <wumpus> ideally if you make the RPC server general it could also move to its own directory within src
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 407 2014-10-22 08:42:39 <wumpus> me too!
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 409 2014-10-22 08:43:18 <ThomasV> gmaxwell: some days ago you mentioned adding a "maximum date" to seeds. what was your idea on that?
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 411 2014-10-22 08:43:28 <CodeShark> ideally the RPC server should be built as an independent library :)
 412 2014-10-22 08:43:35 <wumpus> and other use-cases would be better solved by embedding bitcoin core as a library than having bitcoin core load your code ...
 413 2014-10-22 08:43:43 <CodeShark> right
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 415 2014-10-22 08:44:43 <anton000> sipa: type2 bip0032 wallets.. where  private keys under a public derivation can be exposed if you have any of the private key
 416 2014-10-22 08:44:54 <sipa> anton000: EC crypto cannot avoid this
 417 2014-10-22 08:45:01 <anton000> i see
 418 2014-10-22 08:45:06 <sipa> i believe there's a proof for that, actually
 419 2014-10-22 08:45:45 <CodeShark> sipa, didn't we prove the other day that it can be avoided…but at the cost of linear increase in derived key lengths? :)
 420 2014-10-22 08:46:08 <sipa> CodeShark: then you don't need a derivation anymore
 421 2014-10-22 08:46:21 <sipa> just use a master public key that is a concatenation of all child public keys
 422 2014-10-22 08:46:46 <sipa> so yes, trivial solution is trivial
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 424 2014-10-22 08:48:08 <CodeShark> I think by the same logic we can perhaps show that it is the optimal solution…which then gives the impossibility result we're after
 425 2014-10-22 08:48:53 <CodeShark> any more optimal solution ends up with insufficient unknowns
 426 2014-10-22 08:49:00 <CodeShark> which allows us to solve algebraically
 427 2014-10-22 08:49:22 <sipa> i believe Dan Boneh has a proof already
 428 2014-10-22 08:49:28 <sipa> though he never actually sent it to me :)
 429 2014-10-22 08:49:45 <CodeShark> it wouldn't fit in the margin of the page? :)
 430 2014-10-22 08:50:31 <gmaxwell> sipa: it can be done with bilinear cryptography (which is EC).
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 433 2014-10-22 08:51:21 <sipa> hmm
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 435 2014-10-22 08:53:21 <CodeShark> gmaxwell: you wouldn't happen to have any links to publications on that result, would you?
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 439 2014-10-22 08:55:49 <gmaxwell> What, doing something like BIP32 without the leak? it's a trivial application of IBE.
 440 2014-10-22 08:56:41 <CodeShark> IBE = ?
 441 2014-10-22 08:57:10 <gmaxwell> Id based encryption,  http://www.larc.usp.br/~pbarreto/pblounge.html  see the first group under signatures. One of the papers there.
 442 2014-10-22 08:57:37 <CodeShark> ah - well, anything's trivial once you're up on it - I haven't read much on this topic
 443 2014-10-22 08:57:41 <CodeShark> so to me it's not quite trivial yet :p
 444 2014-10-22 08:57:48 <gmaxwell> The idea is there is a master pubkey  and some function that takes an ID and a pubkey and yields a new pubkey whos private key can only be computed by knowing the master private key.
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 448 2014-10-22 08:59:50 <gmaxwell> http://eprint.iacr.org/2002/018 is reasonable.
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 450 2014-10-22 09:02:19 <CodeShark> cool - thanks
 451 2014-10-22 09:03:44 <phantomcircuit> gmaxwell, isn't that kind of what the stealth addresses are doing?
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 454 2014-10-22 09:05:37 <gmaxwell> they also have the property that leaking the private key leaks them all.  IBE does not. Which is very important for IBE because in IBE each 'identity' is normally a different user.
 455 2014-10-22 09:08:21 <phantomcircuit> oh right the difference being you have a new private key for each pubkey
 456 2014-10-22 09:08:22 <phantomcircuit> hmm
 457 2014-10-22 09:10:23 <anton000> nice thanks for the link gmax
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 459 2014-10-22 09:16:19 <gmaxwell> (note, using paring crypto usually means a 100x slowdown vs ecdsa; and new cryptographic assumptions. ... which is why I didn't just immediately propose that when I saw the need for the public derrivation... :))
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 461 2014-10-22 09:16:40 <sipa> also, bitcoin doesn't have an OP_IBE operator :)
 462 2014-10-22 09:16:54 <CodeShark> slowdown in key generation, signing, verification, or all of the above?
 463 2014-10-22 09:17:01 <sipa> verification
 464 2014-10-22 09:17:08 <CodeShark> ok, so then it is a problem
 465 2014-10-22 09:17:09 <sipa> that's the only thing that matter in bitcoin :)
 466 2014-10-22 09:17:16 <sipa> (though the question was about a different curve, so i guess this is a relevant answer)
 467 2014-10-22 09:18:00 <gmaxwell> when you see a e() operation in a paper on pairing crypto think 1ms. Though batch verification can be done which can help sometimes.
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 524 2014-10-22 10:52:56 <kyuupichan> What's the record for block size?  326447 is 999489 bytes
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 526 2014-10-22 10:53:56 <SomeoneWeird> #bitcoin pls
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 731 2014-10-22 15:32:10 <coryfields_> sipa: global secp256k1_start as opposed to a returned context is proving to be a real problem when working with libbitcoinconsensus
 732 2014-10-22 15:32:32 <coryfields_> the static RAII class races with other static initializers
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 734 2014-10-22 15:32:59 <sipa> we can change that
 735 2014-10-22 15:33:07 <sipa> but how are static initializers a problem?
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 737 2014-10-22 15:35:01 <coryfields_> sipa: i haven't tracked down the culprit yet, but something is managing to call into the lib before _start is run. I assume somewhere there's a static CKey that's being created and initialized to something first
 738 2014-10-22 15:35:16 <sipa> ah
 739 2014-10-22 15:35:17 <coryfields_> backtrace shows the crash in the static init. i can grab you one if you're interested
 740 2014-10-22 15:35:52 <wumpus> stupid static initializers :)
 741 2014-10-22 15:35:59 <coryfields_> sipa: problem is that when we're running tests from the lib interface, bitcoind, a standalone test prog using the lib, etc.. they all need calls to start in different places
 742 2014-10-22 15:38:13 <coryfields_> crash: http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=qL3NPNB6
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 744 2014-10-22 15:40:16 <coryfields_> it's "fixed" by running secp256k1_start in CKey's ctor
 745 2014-10-22 15:41:11 <wumpus> so we must be having a CKey global somewhere... :/
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 750 2014-10-22 15:44:09 <coryfields_> it's odd that gdb doesn't specify. i'm sure there's some way i can smack it so that it'll be more specific?
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 753 2014-10-22 15:45:05 <wumpus> -g3 -ggdb  -gdwarf-4 ? :)
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 756 2014-10-22 15:45:20 <coryfields_> btw, it's very possible that i caused this with my changes. but imo the problem is at the libsecp level
 757 2014-10-22 15:45:26 <wumpus> -O0 
 758 2014-10-22 15:45:37 <coryfields_> heh, will give it a try
 759 2014-10-22 15:45:45 <wumpus> getting details out of gdb when debugging C++ code can be tricky
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 762 2014-10-22 15:48:33 <gavinandresen> clang doesn’t like current git HEAD: script.h:197:19: error: no matching conversion for functional-style cast from 'const char [57]' to 'scriptnum_error'
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 765 2014-10-22 15:49:33 <wumpus> weird- doesn't travis osx build with clang as well?
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 768 2014-10-22 15:50:02 <coryfields_> yes
 769 2014-10-22 15:50:12 <gavinandresen> maybe… I’m running Apple LLVM version 6.0 (clang-600.0.51) (based on LLVM 3.5svn)
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 772 2014-10-22 15:51:05 <coryfields_> gavinandresen: weird. if it refuses to cast a const char* to a string, it'll be a problem all over the place, no?
 773 2014-10-22 15:51:44 <gavinandresen> coryfields_: dunno, haven’t debugged further. switching to a branch from a day or three ago all is well.
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 775 2014-10-22 15:52:08 <coryfields_> ah, it was made explicit
 776 2014-10-22 15:52:08 <wumpus> scriptnum_error isn't a string
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 778 2014-10-22 15:52:50 <coryfields_> nm, already was explicit
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 780 2014-10-22 15:53:14 <gavinandresen> coryfields_: full error, if helpful:  https://gist.github.com/gavinandresen/3dc1733bee6488706a36
 781 2014-10-22 15:53:14 <wumpus> huh indeed weird
 782 2014-10-22 15:53:16 <coryfields_> so yea, that's indeed an error i'd think
 783 2014-10-22 15:53:32 <wumpus> well it uses the constructor, so explicit shouldn't matter?
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 785 2014-10-22 15:54:15 <coryfields_> wumpus: explicit should mean that it can't implicitly cast to string, though
 786 2014-10-22 15:54:24 <wumpus> explicit only avoids things being fed to scriptnum_error() accidentally, but I see no case of that on that line throw scriptnum_error("CScriptNum(const std::vector<unsigned char>&) : overflow");
 787 2014-10-22 15:54:48 <coryfields_> throw scriptnum_error(std::string("CScriptNum(const std::vector<unsigned char>&) : overflow"));
 788 2014-10-22 15:54:57 <wumpus> coryfields_: huh! I thought the explicit only applied directly
 789 2014-10-22 15:55:40 <wumpus> so it means that a std::string can't be passed as argument to something that takes a scriptnum_error... I didn't know it also nested 'deeper' into the arguments of the constructor
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 791 2014-10-22 15:56:12 <wumpus> why does it call it a "functional-style cast"  if it is a constructor call
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 793 2014-10-22 15:56:17 <wumpus> I think it's a scope issue
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 795 2014-10-22 15:57:39 <coryfields_> scope?
 796 2014-10-22 15:57:48 <wumpus> it doesn't recognize the constructor
 797 2014-10-22 15:58:30 <wumpus> ok no the expanded error shows it does find it
 798 2014-10-22 15:59:20 <gavinandresen> mmm.  I’m not a language lawyer enough to know the exact definition of what explicit does, but it seems to me we want another scriptnum_error constructor that takes a const char*
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 802 2014-10-22 15:59:58 <wumpus> yeah, I suppose that's the cost of using explicit then
 803 2014-10-22 16:00:15 <wumpus> although it's strange that it doesn't come up in other compilers
 804 2014-10-22 16:00:19 <coryfields_> wumpus: afaik this is exactly why explicit is usually used in this cases. Otherwise, NULL is a valid "const char*", and can be used to create a std::string implicitly, which will throw an error
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 806 2014-10-22 16:01:06 <wumpus> coryfields_: why would anyone pass NULL to it?
 807 2014-10-22 16:01:23 <gavinandresen> Hmm: http://en.cppreference.com/w/cpp/error/runtime_error
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 812 2014-10-22 16:02:26 <coryfields_> wumpus: just in general. say you have 2 ctors, one is a const char*, the other is a std::string. You may use the "const char*" ctor with NULL to mean "I don't want a value here"
 813 2014-10-22 16:02:41 <coryfields_> but you could be surprised to see it falling into the std::string implicitly instead
 814 2014-10-22 16:02:47 <coryfields_> sec, i'll find a better description
 815 2014-10-22 16:02:51 <wumpus> right, I get it
 816 2014-10-22 16:03:58 <wumpus> I just didn't know that explicit applied to the arguments of the constructor, I just thought it applied to use of the constructor itself for automatic type conversion
 817 2014-10-22 16:04:07 <wumpus> but that's clear now
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 819 2014-10-22 16:07:56 <coryfields_> wumpus: i think the "constructor itself" case is a side-effect of the copy ctor being unable to use the explicit ctor for implicit conversion
 820 2014-10-22 16:08:25 <wumpus> ok
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 822 2014-10-22 16:09:15 <wumpus> though that still doesn't explain why it seems to be different in other compilers
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 824 2014-10-22 16:10:48 <gavinandresen> I’ll bisect and see which commit it started breaking at….
 825 2014-10-22 16:11:10 <wumpus> very likely something in pull #4981
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 827 2014-10-22 16:13:08 <wumpus> coryfields_: for example, this http://www.hastebin.com/enagafijez.cpp  compiles ... making the Test2 constructor explicit doesn't prevent the argument from being automatically converted from int to Test
 828 2014-10-22 16:13:21 <wumpus> coryfields_: it does avoid doing Test2 x = 10;
 829 2014-10-22 16:17:08 <coryfields_> hmm
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 831 2014-10-22 16:20:43 <wumpus> if explicit applied to the *arguments*, you could use explicit also with constructors with multiple arguments; IIRC it's only used for constructors that take one
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 837 2014-10-22 16:25:44 <coryfields_> haha, wait
 838 2014-10-22 16:26:02 <coryfields_> gavinandresen: #include <string> :)
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 841 2014-10-22 16:26:49 <coryfields_> ah damn, nm. it's there in your paste
 842 2014-10-22 16:27:23 <coryfields_> i just repro'd the same error locally with the string include missing. error looked the same, but obviously there was another before it
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 845 2014-10-22 16:28:25 <gavinandresen> 85c579e3a63cf505d6cedc454755265572e97d3e is the first bad commit
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 848 2014-10-22 16:36:12 <coryfields_> ok, repro'd with libc++. string include fixes.
 849 2014-10-22 16:36:55 <coryfields_> wumpus: looks like i need to read up on explicit.
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 852 2014-10-22 16:38:36 <coryfields_> not sure where my understanding broke down, afaik it's always worked as i intended. that's a bit scary now :)
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 987 2014-10-22 19:27:07 <hearn> cool! http://shuoyangdesign.com/2014/10/05/realtime-bitcoin-transaction-map/
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 989 2014-10-22 19:29:31 <gwillen> of course, they appear to be using bc.i's "first relayed IP" for location, which is dubious as an actual location
 990 2014-10-22 19:29:34 <gwillen> but still neat
 991 2014-10-22 19:30:31 <hearn> right
 992 2014-10-22 19:30:36 <hearn> it's the best you can do i think
 993 2014-10-22 19:30:44 <hearn> maybe we should have that somewhere on bitcoin.org
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1078 2014-10-22 20:53:06 <CodeShark> anyone seen saivann?
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1083 2014-10-22 20:55:58 <Luke-Jr> CodeShark: he's not often on IRC
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1088 2014-10-22 21:03:14 <saivann> I am usually around in case my immediate help with bitcoin.org is required.
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1108 2014-10-22 21:23:35 <Luke-Jr> ah, you're just quiet :D
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1177 2014-10-22 22:39:59 <Luke-Jr> can anyone recommend a decent IMAP mail client? KMail is totally broken, and Trojita isn't cutting it :/
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1179 2014-10-22 22:42:54 <justanotheruser> Luke-Jr: tried iceweasel?
1180 2014-10-22 22:43:12 <justanotheruser> also lol @ K<program function>
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1188 2014-10-22 22:52:55 <Luke-Jr> justanotheruser: not since it was called Mozilla
1189 2014-10-22 22:53:22 <justanotheruser> Luke-Jr: mozilla?
1190 2014-10-22 22:53:48 <justanotheruser> oh, also I meant icedove, not ice weasel
1191 2014-10-22 22:54:09 <justanotheruser> and last I checked it isn't called mozilla
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1195 2014-10-22 22:56:18 <Luke-Jr> justanotheruser: is icedove just another name for thunderbird?
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1202 2014-10-22 23:03:45 <arubi> Luke-Jr, icedove is to thunderbird as iceweasel is for firefox (afaik, i may be wront)
1203 2014-10-22 23:04:11 <arubi> wrong*
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