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3 2014-12-15 00:02:27 <tdlfbx> Following this suggestion: http://www.verters.com/blockcheck I checked bitcoin's nonces. Can anyone explain this distribution? http://pbrd.co/1wxc1wN
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13 2014-12-15 00:26:45 <Luke-Jr> tdlfbx: you have the wrong channel, this is #bitcoin-dev
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15 2014-12-15 00:27:11 <Luke-Jr> oh, missed the second part
16 2014-12-15 00:27:26 * tdlfbx deletes snarky response.
17 2014-12-15 00:27:37 <Luke-Jr> tdlfbx: I speculate you will see similar results if you do % 0x10000 as well
18 2014-12-15 00:27:57 <Luke-Jr> tdlfbx: that is, you're looking at it in the opposite endian the miner is, and they're counting upward
19 2014-12-15 00:28:14 <Luke-Jr> (and restarting at 0 when there's a new block or whatever)
20 2014-12-15 00:29:21 <tdlfbx> here's the same thing, by bit: http://pbrd.co/1wxg3VO
21 2014-12-15 00:29:41 <sipa> tdlfbx: which block range?
22 2014-12-15 00:29:47 <tdlfbx> all of them.
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24 2014-12-15 00:30:08 <tdlfbx> height 334337
25 2014-12-15 00:30:10 <sipa> ignore the first 100k and see if you get the same result
26 2014-12-15 00:30:41 <tdlfbx> sipa yes basically same result
27 2014-12-15 00:30:45 <sipa> very early on, the nonce ranges were rarely explored entirely before starting over
28 2014-12-15 00:30:49 <sipa> ok
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30 2014-12-15 00:30:56 <Luke-Jr> sipa: even today, there are patterns
31 2014-12-15 00:31:04 <Luke-Jr> for example, bitfury chips only scan 768/1024 of the nonces
32 2014-12-15 00:31:14 <tdlfbx> This isn't nearly as bad as what's going on with scrypt. But it has me slightly concerned.
33 2014-12-15 00:31:28 <Luke-Jr> tdlfbx: it's patterns in the searching, not biases in the result
34 2014-12-15 00:31:33 <Luke-Jr> for Bitcoin, at least
35 2014-12-15 00:32:15 <tdlfbx> Luke-Jr: That was my first thought
36 2014-12-15 00:32:39 <tdlfbx> Is this a BitFury hardware bug?
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38 2014-12-15 00:33:20 <Luke-Jr> tdlfbx: it's not a bug, it's just how it's designed
39 2014-12-15 00:33:32 <Luke-Jr> tdlfbx: there's 768 cores, so they split the work up by bits
40 2014-12-15 00:34:14 <Luke-Jr> some newer revisions have a few more cores IIRC
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42 2014-12-15 00:34:23 <tdlfbx> If anyone wants to see the same plots for scrypt, join #dogecoin-dev.
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44 2014-12-15 00:34:50 <tdlfbx> But no one is awake over there. ;-)
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48 2014-12-15 00:36:43 <Luke-Jr> 864/1024 in gen 2 bitfury chips
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56 2014-12-15 00:56:58 <proserpine-> tdlfbx: 90% of the blocks found in scrypt/x11 have (nonce mod 256) = 0 .... miner implementation?
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58 2014-12-15 00:58:07 <tdlfbx> Can't possibly be. asics are way behind. It was designed as a CPU/GPU. Also it's present in Doge from the very beginning.
59 2014-12-15 00:58:35 <tdlfbx> @prosperpine- ---> #dogecoin-dev
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164 2014-12-15 04:59:52 <proserpine-> in the bitcoin core, given a COutPoint, how to get the corresponding CTxOut if it is spent? currently calling GetTransaction with the hash to get the whole tx and then extract the CTxOut but it is slooow and probably not the correct way to do
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167 2014-12-15 05:05:39 <Luke-Jr> proserpine-: don't think that's possible.. GetTransaction may fail too, if all the outpoints are spent
168 2014-12-15 05:06:50 <Luke-Jr> proserpine-: heck, the data may not even be on disk at all
169 2014-12-15 05:07:32 <proserpine-> i'm trying to get the corresponding scriptpubkey from an input
170 2014-12-15 05:08:24 <Luke-Jr> once the outpoint is spent, it's effectively gone
171 2014-12-15 05:09:17 <proserpine-> yea i figured that..
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175 2014-12-15 05:14:28 <proserpine-> well thanks anyway, parsing the scriptsig will give me what i need but its bit extra work
176 2014-12-15 05:14:48 <Luke-Jr> what are you trying to do?
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178 2014-12-15 05:18:05 <proserpine-> get the btc address from the input, i have to check the tx type etc..
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180 2014-12-15 05:19:41 <Luke-Jr> proserpine-: I mean what is the end goal.. inputs don't have addresses
181 2014-12-15 05:20:02 <Luke-Jr> the address associated with the previous output is irrelevant to the tx using that outpoint as an input.
182 2014-12-15 05:20:43 <proserpine-> i know i know, its pointless but im still learning how it all works
183 2014-12-15 05:21:21 <Luke-Jr> things that have no value to do, are not generally made efficient to do :P
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261 2014-12-15 07:11:41 <Belxjander> Would getting core built on both ARM and PowerPC Processors (working or not) be helpful in trying to sort out and find any endianness issues ?
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263 2014-12-15 07:12:00 * Belxjander is only after getting blockchain recording and wallet functionality running...
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265 2014-12-15 07:12:14 <Belxjander> I have no current interest in trying to use any of the core code for mining
266 2014-12-15 07:12:23 <Belxjander> that can be left to dedicated devices
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297 2014-12-15 07:54:10 <wumpus> Belxjander: I've been working on big-endian support; at the moment there is none though (see issue https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/888), so testing won't help us. FYI bitcoin core does compile and work for armel and mipsel.
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301 2014-12-15 08:00:12 <wumpus> it compiles for aarch64 (also el), though I have no devices to test on and qemu refuses my toolchain's executables so I don't know if it runs or whether the tests even pass
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304 2014-12-15 08:02:55 <Belxjander> wumpus well I can look at the code and work with you for building and testing until it works
305 2014-12-15 08:03:35 <Belxjander> the ARM is an RPi
306 2014-12-15 08:04:25 <Belxjander> and my PPC is an AMCC440EP embedded processor, the PPC is non-posix so will need me to look at syscall usage and libraries as well
307 2014-12-15 08:04:38 <wumpus> RPI works fine, it is a tad slow and may lack memory, but it is little endian so running the code gives no problems
308 2014-12-15 08:04:47 <Belxjander> the ARM is ArchLinux prepped
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499 2014-12-15 13:33:55 <jaromil> ack on PR #5171 by jtimon. it really makes code more readable, sort of trivial modification, hope you merge it
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636 2014-12-15 15:49:10 <jonasschnelli> paveljanik: regarding #5477 (10.9 VM is up and running, build output comes soon)
637 2014-12-15 15:49:24 <jonasschnelli> -()
638 2014-12-15 15:49:27 <paveljanik> jonasschnelli, thanks!
639 2014-12-15 15:49:47 <paveljanik> I plan to create a few test PRs to see what travis knows.
640 2014-12-15 15:49:51 <paveljanik> This is very strange...
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642 2014-12-15 15:50:15 <jonasschnelli> it looks like that the macro MAC_OS_X_VERSION_MIN_REQUIRED is faulty
643 2014-12-15 15:50:54 <jonasschnelli> it should be available on cross build linux machines also because of https://opensource.apple.com/source/CarbonHeaders/CarbonHeaders-18.1/AvailabilityMacros.h
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645 2014-12-15 15:51:26 <jonasschnelli> i assume building on 10.9 will go error-free
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648 2014-12-15 15:53:03 <jonasschnelli> paveljanik: guitool.o built successfully without warning on my 10.9 VM
649 2014-12-15 15:53:58 <paveljanik> The AvailabilityMacros.h say explicitly, that if the user doesn't define it, it is MAC_OS_X_VERSION_10_4 on Interl...
650 2014-12-15 15:54:08 <paveljanik> what is travis, BTW? ;-)
651 2014-12-15 15:54:19 <paveljanik> is it some form of cross platform build?
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654 2014-12-15 15:54:57 <paveljanik> how it builds for OS X?
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657 2014-12-15 15:55:29 <sipa> paveljanik: you can build for OSX without anything special; the depends system has instructions
658 2014-12-15 15:55:33 <sipa> paveljanik: from linux
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660 2014-12-15 15:55:42 <sipa> paveljanik: you need the 10.7 OSX SDK from apple, though
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664 2014-12-15 16:01:02 <paveljanik> sipa, I prefer to build the binary for my native OS on my native OS 8)
665 2014-12-15 16:01:15 <sipa> sure
666 2014-12-15 16:01:35 <paveljanik> but this is interesting, I was not aware of this possibility.
667 2014-12-15 16:01:39 <jonasschnelli> paveljanik you might need to find another way/MACRO to determine the OSX version
668 2014-12-15 16:02:14 <paveljanik> we can simply try ifdef both macros around this and fallback to old
669 2014-12-15 16:02:15 <jonasschnelli> no worries. We'll figure it out. I like the pull because the warning is somehow annoying...
670 2014-12-15 16:02:25 <paveljanik> yup
671 2014-12-15 16:02:31 <jonasschnelli> paveljanik yes. something like that was also in my mind.
672 2014-12-15 16:02:58 <paveljanik> this is where release engineers step in and solve the problem ;-)
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674 2014-12-15 16:03:33 <sipa> what is the problem?
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676 2014-12-15 16:05:29 <wumpus> you could do an autotools check for LSSharedFileListItemCopyResolvedURL, which makes the build use that if available
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678 2014-12-15 16:07:04 <jonasschnelli> i think the problem is a missing MACRO because of a outdates apple open-source implementation...
679 2014-12-15 16:07:10 <jonasschnelli> file https://opensource.apple.com/source/CarbonHeaders/CarbonHeaders-18.1/AvailabilityMacros.h is not up to 10.9 and 10.10
680 2014-12-15 16:07:21 <jonasschnelli> which make the used marco = 0
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682 2014-12-15 16:07:58 <jonasschnelli> paveljanik, you might switch the if so the default would use the 'old' (10.0 till 10.9) method.
683 2014-12-15 16:08:08 <jonasschnelli> (a bit a hack)
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687 2014-12-15 16:13:43 <paveljanik> jonasschnelli, what about this then? #if ((MAC_OS_X_VERSION_MIN_REQUIRED == 0) || (MAC_OS_X_VERSION_10_10 == 0)) || (MAC_OS_X_VERSION_MIN_REQUIRED < MAC_OS_X_VERSION_10_10)
688 2014-12-15 16:14:28 <paveljanik> with a description that this STRANGE looking code is there because of Travis build?
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691 2014-12-15 16:16:59 <paveljanik> hmm, but the code will look best when I revert the if and else branches and the condition.
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693 2014-12-15 16:19:21 <paveljanik> wumpus, I'd prefer to use OS X native stuff to solve this (and workaround Travis). In this case I'm all for reversing the condition...
694 2014-12-15 16:19:39 jb55 has joined
695 2014-12-15 16:21:00 <paveljanik> If no objections, I'll do it this way
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697 2014-12-15 16:28:58 <jonasschnelli> paveljanik: looks to complicated for me. Just switch the if (from < to >=) so that the default runs the old code.
698 2014-12-15 16:29:15 <paveljanik> can I use = there?
699 2014-12-15 16:29:29 <paveljanik> what is the value of both macros in the Travis build? ;-)
700 2014-12-15 16:29:49 <jonasschnelli> Good question: probably 0
701 2014-12-15 16:31:39 makomk_ is now known as makomk
702 2014-12-15 16:32:09 <paveljanik> #if (MAC_OS_X_VERSION_MIN_REQUIRED == 0) || (MAC_OS_X_VERSION_10_10 == 0) || (MAC_OS_X_VERSION_MIN_REQUIRED < MAC_OS_X_VERSION_10_10)
703 2014-12-15 16:32:51 grau has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
704 2014-12-15 16:32:54 <paveljanik> it will be a lot of laugh when some Mac programmer reads this line :-(
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713 2014-12-15 16:41:36 <paveljanik> jonasschnelli, pushed the change. We will see. I have to move now. See you later.
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747 2014-12-15 17:18:16 <xabbix> Can a thin client be considered a full node? Or do I have to keep the blockchain data to be a full node?
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750 2014-12-15 17:19:14 <StephenM347> I noticed that chainActive is used in rpcrawtransaction.cpp->TxToJSON without having a lock on cs_main. Is this safe because it's read only?
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758 2014-12-15 17:23:35 <wumpus> xabbix: full node means that you verify blocks and transactions; in principle this does not imply storing the block chain, just the running state (UTXO set)
759 2014-12-15 17:24:23 <wumpus> StephenM347: are you sure? most of the RPC methods are called with cs_main held
760 2014-12-15 17:24:24 ValicekB has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
761 2014-12-15 17:25:28 <xabbix> wumpus, and with regards to helping the bitcoin network, if I deploy a 1000 thin, full nodes. It will basically help verify transactions/blocks but might have some impact on syncing new bitcoind clients, right?
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764 2014-12-15 17:27:01 <wumpus> xabbix: those nodes will not help syncing new bitcoind clients, they'll just verify the consensus, so they're useful to the network but not as useful as full archival nodes
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767 2014-12-15 17:27:44 <xabbix> wumpus, Thanks for the quick answers.
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771 2014-12-15 17:32:45 <StephenM347> @wumpus, you are right, it does have a lock already. Thanks!
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794 2014-12-15 17:57:41 <xabbix> bitcoind used to have a performance issue when creating hundreds/thousands of transactions and addresses. Is this still the case?
795 2014-12-15 17:58:05 <wumpus> yes
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798 2014-12-15 17:59:10 <wumpus> bitcoin core's wallet is a reference wallet, it is not suitable for large-scale operations (although it *can* handle a lot, it will just degrade performance)
799 2014-12-15 17:59:34 <xabbix> I'm looking for a service that can provide me with an API where I can generate new wallet addresses (in the hundreds) and check their balances every X seconds/minutes or even have a webhook when money goes into an address in my wallet. Any options other than BC.i?
800 2014-12-15 18:02:38 <wumpus> hundreds of addresses is no problem
801 2014-12-15 18:03:19 <xabbix> Does the performance issue comes to play when there are many addresses created or many transactions?
802 2014-12-15 18:03:44 <sipa> transactions
803 2014-12-15 18:03:57 <xabbix> Cool, thanks!
804 2014-12-15 18:04:19 <sipa> xabbix: bitcoin (neither the implementation nor the protocol, nor the suggested way or dealing with it) really care about addresses or their balance
805 2014-12-15 18:04:29 ryanxcharles has joined
806 2014-12-15 18:04:45 <sipa> issue an address for every payment you expect, and check for transactions credititng to know when the payment is fullfilled
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810 2014-12-15 18:06:23 <xabbix> sipa, ok, thank you.
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819 2014-12-15 18:18:34 <gmaxwell> wumpus: I don't like that "not suitable" trope, we actually perform much better under scale than many other things that have been advertised for those applications. :)
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833 2014-12-15 18:35:05 <wumpus> gmaxwell: ok, I should say "is not a goal of development", but I'm just a bit tired of people complaining that things are slow so I l tone their expectations down
834 2014-12-15 18:35:27 wallet42 has joined
835 2014-12-15 18:35:54 <syskall> If I understand correctly, peers only relay a subset of all possible scriptPubkey formats right?
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840 2014-12-15 18:39:15 <stonecoldpat> peers should relay all valid scriptPubKey formats, from what I can remember
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842 2014-12-15 18:42:07 <syskall> I was under the impression that "non-standard" scripts were not relayed. Unless that's what you meant by "valid"
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844 2014-12-15 18:42:57 <stonecoldpat> oh okay, yes it will only send standard scripts, so a transaction with two OP_RETURNS will not be relayed
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846 2014-12-15 18:43:34 <wumpus> syskall: only standard output scripts are relayed, see bool IsStandard(const CScript& scriptPubKey, txnouttype& whichType)
847 2014-12-15 18:44:19 <ajweiss> won't somebody please think of the wallet?!
848 2014-12-15 18:44:27 <sipa> ajweiss: ?
849 2014-12-15 18:44:30 cbeams_ has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
850 2014-12-15 18:45:03 <ajweiss> it's a bad joke, nvm
851 2014-12-15 18:45:06 syskall_ has joined
852 2014-12-15 18:45:19 <sipa> k
853 2014-12-15 18:46:15 <syskall_> wumpus: ok thanks, is there a wiki / bip that defines standard output scripts? also does bitcoind checks for standard scriptSig as well? otherwise it seems scripts could be done indirectly by using pay-to-script-hash?
854 2014-12-15 18:46:30 syskall has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
855 2014-12-15 18:48:39 <Luke-Jr> syskall_: there are multiple wiki pages and BIPs definiting standards for output scripts
856 2014-12-15 18:49:32 <Luke-Jr> side note: IsStandard overlaps with "standard output scripts", but neither are a superset of the other
857 2014-12-15 18:50:04 nessence has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
858 2014-12-15 18:50:25 <sipa> transactions are also verified with stronger validation flags than strictly necessary to be accepted into blocks
859 2014-12-15 18:50:31 <Luke-Jr> eg, IsStandard will accept some OP_RETURN outputs (which are non-standard), but won't accept bare 4-of-4 multisig (which are standard)
860 2014-12-15 18:50:43 nessence has joined
861 2014-12-15 18:51:10 <syskall_> ok I see
862 2014-12-15 18:51:33 <Luke-Jr> also, IsStandard is not the same node-to-node
863 2014-12-15 18:51:41 <syskall_> what about the last part of my comment. can non standard scripts be relayed by putting them in the scriptSig and using pay-to-script-hash scheme?
864 2014-12-15 18:51:52 <lechuga_> yes
865 2014-12-15 18:51:54 <Luke-Jr> syskall_: some nodes may relay those, yes
866 2014-12-15 18:52:06 <syskall_> ok
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869 2014-12-15 18:52:58 <Luke-Jr> in the end, it's up to each node to decide what they will relay
870 2014-12-15 18:53:01 <syskall_> what is the purpose of the IsStandard check actually?
871 2014-12-15 18:53:14 <sipa> syskall_: originally, feat about untested code paths
872 2014-12-15 18:53:15 <Luke-Jr> syskall_: avoiding bugs due to untested code
873 2014-12-15 18:53:19 <syskall_> yes, I was asking about a vanilla bitcoind build
874 2014-12-15 18:53:26 <syskall_> ok
875 2014-12-15 18:53:34 <sipa> these days, it's also used to prevent difficulties with potential future upgrades
876 2014-12-15 18:53:39 <sipa> it also provides some dos protection
877 2014-12-15 18:54:24 <Luke-Jr> syskall_: consider, for instance, CVE-2013-2292, which is "unfixable"
878 2014-12-15 18:54:46 <syskall_> makes sense
879 2014-12-15 18:54:57 nessence has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
880 2014-12-15 18:55:13 <syskall_> I'm surprised that there is no IsStandard check on scriptSig though.. don't the same concerns apply there as well?
881 2014-12-15 18:55:30 <Luke-Jr> syskall_: versions prior to 0.10 only allow IsStandard scriptSigs
882 2014-12-15 18:56:48 Emcy has joined
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884 2014-12-15 18:58:57 <syskall_> ok thanks
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892 2014-12-15 19:07:33 <ajweiss> speaking of which, do you guys have any thoughts on #5463 steady state timeouts?
893 2014-12-15 19:08:20 grau has joined
894 2014-12-15 19:09:00 <sipa> ajweiss: i'll have a look, but i haven't had too much time lately
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896 2014-12-15 19:10:57 <ajweiss> cool... if there anything particularly helpful i could do to help with 0.10? testing pulls or whatnot?
897 2014-12-15 19:11:47 neozaru has joined
898 2014-12-15 19:13:40 <paveljanik> jonasschnelli, thanks for testing!
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904 2014-12-15 19:17:20 <wumpus> ajweiss: you can help test the 0.10 branch https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/tree/0.10
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906 2014-12-15 19:17:46 <wumpus> ajweiss: testing and reviewing pulls helps development a lot, but 0.10 is more or less closed
907 2014-12-15 19:18:32 <wumpus> ajweiss: e.g. what can help is to try building what is there w/ gitian and run the resulting executables on different platforms
908 2014-12-15 19:18:49 WeCluster has joined
909 2014-12-15 19:18:51 <ajweiss> ok i can do that
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920 2014-12-15 19:29:39 <wumpus> Wheeee I got the tests to pass on mipsbe32. Running 132 test cases... *** No errors detected ... <3
921 2014-12-15 19:30:11 <sipa> awesome
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923 2014-12-15 19:31:08 <paveljanik> great!
924 2014-12-15 19:31:35 <Luke-Jr> wumpus: wow, nice
925 2014-12-15 19:31:42 jtimon has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
926 2014-12-15 19:32:29 <wumpus> let's see if it can sync the chain
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928 2014-12-15 19:33:36 <Luke-Jr> I'd sync testnet first
929 2014-12-15 19:33:42 <Luke-Jr> more likely to trigger issues, and quicker ;)
930 2014-12-15 19:34:04 <wumpus> good point
931 2014-12-15 19:35:49 <paveljanik> I'd start with bootstrap.dat 8)
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939 2014-12-15 19:47:54 <Luke-Jr> btw, is CLTV somehow on the 0.10 radar still? or did it miss the merge window entirely?
940 2014-12-15 19:48:04 zwischenzug has joined
941 2014-12-15 19:49:33 <sipa> nope, bip62 and cltv are off
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949 2014-12-15 19:59:22 <lechuga_> some bip62 stuff is already merged isnt it?
950 2014-12-15 19:59:46 cbeams has quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
951 2014-12-15 20:00:11 <Luke-Jr> lechuga_: not as consensus code though
952 2014-12-15 20:02:20 <lechuga_> ic
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955 2014-12-15 20:06:12 <akaiiro> hi guys
956 2014-12-15 20:07:31 <akaiiro> does somebody know the size range for a transaction hash?
957 2014-12-15 20:07:54 wallet42 has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
958 2014-12-15 20:08:02 gdm85 has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
959 2014-12-15 20:08:19 <lechuga_> its 32 bytes
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962 2014-12-15 20:08:38 <lechuga_> 64 characters when encoded in hex
963 2014-12-15 20:09:38 Application has joined
964 2014-12-15 20:09:51 <akaiiro> oh, I see. thanks. I was a little confused thinking these followed similar specs than addresses
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1099 2014-12-15 21:57:24 <btcdrak> I managed to build using gitian successfully using the offline download method.
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1105 2014-12-15 22:10:48 <wumpus> btcdrak: great!
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1110 2014-12-15 22:14:14 <btcdrak> wumpus: I dont think there are blockers, but I think there are some download edge cases that probably need to be solved. 1) sf sees fit to return HTTP 200 for failed downloads, so the make download fails the checksum, the solution might be to try failover on checksum fail. 2) the CA certificate bundle needs to be updated else it refuses to download from
1111 2014-12-15 22:14:14 <btcdrak> bitcoincore .org but tbh, I dont think SSL is that important because we're checking the checksums of the downloads. It might be OK to skip SSL.
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1113 2014-12-15 22:16:02 <wumpus> yes, an option on depends to skip the certificate check on download would be enough
1114 2014-12-15 22:16:19 <wumpus> WUT, sf returns 200 on error? how broken can it be
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1117 2014-12-15 22:19:02 <btcdrak> wumpus so when sf goes into maintenance mode, which is often it seems, it requires JS to be enabled in the browser to download files. If JS is not enabled you get a <noscript> page with a 200 status header instead of 503 or something appropriate.
1118 2014-12-15 22:19:29 <btcdrak> if you have JS, the download works while in maintenance mode. Most weird.
1119 2014-12-15 22:19:58 <btcdrak> anyway the better way to handle would be just fail over to bitcoincore.org if there is a checksum fail.
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1122 2014-12-15 22:21:27 <wumpus> yes
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1154 2014-12-15 23:13:28 <cfields> btcdrak: that's the way it currently works
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1157 2014-12-15 23:13:44 <cfields> btcdrak: i've reported that to sourceforge, sounds like it's still unfixed
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1164 2014-12-15 23:15:12 <cfields> thanks for building, btw
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1167 2014-12-15 23:16:45 <btcdrak> cfields: cool. just finished with the osx builds as well, so tested win/lin/osx.
1168 2014-12-15 23:17:21 <cfields> great. glad to see it's finally all working
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